believe others but thou hath been so busie abroad in quareling and contending about words and names and empty shews without substance and life that thy mind is all over grown with thorns and briers scrawling and scratching and entangling thy self and others so that that which should savour the things of God is over grown in these and it s buried and to them that are like heaths in a desart knows not when good comes neither doth know what they enjoy that dwell in the fat Vallies and the Pharisees had such unbelieving hearts though Christ was the express Image of God and did the works that never man did yet being without faith and without reason they said he was a Blasphemer and all his works was done by Belzebub and would never be convinced that any thing he did was of God and that spirit is near thee which would represent the fruits of the Spirit to be delusion and them that bring them forth like them in Bedlam and what though Turks Jews Pagans Mahomet and the false Christians do pretend to the spirit and guidance by it and yet bring forth the fruits of the flesh doth this make the spirit of God void or the certainty of it to them that believe or do make their fruits of none effect God forbid thy ignorance is manifest but here thou ceases not thy tongue being thy own and thou being at liberty and speaks thy own words which in the end shall become thy burden Thou vapours and vaunts over them to wit all the Nonconformists and saith what can you say for your selves any of you which these Enthusiasts who have gone before you to maintain their errors but the rule and judge and then thou concludes that which God hath appointed to be rule and judge to all the world and capable of being known and heard by all and cannot contradict it self nor must be contradicted by any under pain of damnation if you cannot shew it to have been your rule you ought to lay aside your folly as destructive to humane society and them that hath pretended the spirit the strongest party and sword upon the vote will prove it self the most convincing spirit and force the weaker spirits to submit or cry for thou concludes the Nonconformists have no other Testimony to try your contradicting spirits in matters of greatest moment but force and success if you have I pray you inform me what it is Ans. If the wind had not turned into another door divers Nonconformists believes we should have had another song from thee if time had but favoured thee so far as to have granted thee the privilege of thy Troop to be Captain which name thou holds up yet i' th pride of thy heart though thou have lost thy force success and pay which was the greatest plea when time was with thee and not long since too which makes thee measure every Man's foot by thy Last and thou might have received information before thou had made a conclusion had been the part of a wise man before thou had set thy self as Judge over all thy former fellowships which thou fainedly pretends so great love to and before thou had discovered their nakedness if it be nakedness to all the world in such a publick insulting bravado as this like Goliah of Gath and as for what some Nonconformists both to the Church of Rome and to the Church of England too which thou creeping and sneakingly flatters and saith its established and therefore thou will not meddle thou might have said dare not for thy spirit is well enough seen by them only to have the spirit of a slave and not a free member of the true Church of God and it s no part of vertue nor honour for thee to insult and glory over them who are in suffering and adversity when as thou dare not meddle with them who are as contrary to thee as the former this is but the spirit of a Coward and is ignoble and base and ever so to be accounted by all the Children of Light who dare put all to venture which they do enjoy on this side of Immortality and to suffer the loss of all visible things for their Testimony and the truth which they believe and for bearing witness against that which is contrary unto their faith as did the valiant Primitive Christians of old and that which some Nonconformists can say is more then thou can believe although demonstrated in the evidence of the spirit of God with sound reason and evident example from the Scriptures of truth and though thou and thy former fellowships then and thy new fellowships now have made this vapour which for ought I know might lay your hands upon your mouths all considering what contradictory Doctrines and fruits hath been brought forth since the night of Apostacy entered in and all the World wondered after the Beast some hath this to say he that pretends to the Spirit and the thing cometh not to pass that they speak or prophesie let him be accounted a false Prophet again they that pretend guidance of the spirit as some formerly have done and yet bring forth the fruits of the flesh as variance hatred emulation strife contention heresie false Doctrine persecution force and violence let them he counted as truly they are deceivers and deluders which have gone out into the world and deceived a great part of Mankind of which Rome hath not had the least share clear it when thou can Moreover he that pretends to have the spirit of God and layes down another foundation to build upon in matter of Faith in matter of Rule in matter of Judgment in matter of Doctrine then that which the Lord of Life and Glory hath laid down he is a Deceiver and an Antichrist but R. E. hath laid down another rule another way another Judge another foundation for Faith and let himself make the Conclusion if he once dare joyne to true Judgment other Foundation can none lay then that which is already laid to wit Christ Jesus the Foundation of the Prophets and Apostles and of the Church of God by which they were all builded up as a holy Habitation for God to dwell in through the spirit Again the Apostle saith All Judgment is committed to the Son both in Heaven and Earth and again he saith himself I am the Way the Truth and the Life and none can come to the Father but by me and again the Spirit of Truth shall lead and direct his Disciples into all truth and sealeth unto them their Justification Redemption and Salvation And this R. E. would lay all wast and void and why because many hath pretended to it and hath fallen short therefore all the aforesaid things must be laid aside as uncertain and not to be trusted unto and a certain sort of Men called the Apostles Successors who have sought their gain and worldly Interest and to enlarge their Dominions and to make themselves Lords over Mens faith and over Mens
from the Spirit of Christ as some Churches did which were as truly Christian and might lay claim unto Christs promise of preservation out of error as ever Rome could do and yet fix of the Seven Churches of Asia were reproved by the Spirit of Christ some of them for holding gross error and some for suffering it but where was the fault did not Christ perform his promise to his Church or to these and other particular Churches as Corinth and Galatia yes but there was an erring from the spirit but all that R. E. goes about is to prove which he will never be able to do that Christ is bound by promise to make it good to them that he hath once promised unto though they perform nothing of their part in taking heed to his direction and thus would limit the Lord and let men go free without obedience to his commands and he cites Mat. 28. 2â— how the promise of Christ was and lo I am always with you even to the end of the World but he hath done as the Devil did when he brought it is written to Christ left out half the words so R. E. hath left out the Conditions on the Disciples part and that which was their duty teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I command you then loe I am with you c. But R. E. likes not obedience it seems unto Christs commands and yet he will needs be a sharer in the promise and of the Power that was given and bind God unto that and he and his Church to be loose to do and to teach what they will but as to all the Scriptures he hath brought and minced them and cut them in peece meale and all the Inferences he makes this we acknowledge without multiplicity of words that whatsoever was promised to the Church of Christ and the Disciples of Christ As the Church of Christ and Disciples of Christ the same promise of Christ doth belong to the Church of Christ and Disciples of Christ in every age and stands upon the same condition viz. obedience unto his will and that they still do teach and no other thing but what he commands them then he is with them according to his promise but let not R. E. nor his Roman Catholicks look if they teach things repugnant to his mind and contrary to his will and press upon others to believe that which Christ hath never taught that then the promise of God will be so intailed to them as that they cannot err and here the deceit of thine and your hearts hath led you aside and this is one of the cuning sleights of men and craftiness whereby you lay in wait to deceive and by this you have deceived many because God hath made such large promises unto his Church how that they should be led into all truth and preserved out of error and you are their successors and must needs inherit this promise by way of intail and you cannot err you cannot be deceived because the Apostles was infallible therefore you must needs be infallible though you err and go aside never so much from the infallible spirit the true guide and judge of and in the Church of God as though you had been born to infallibility and the spirit of truth had comed by succession but the inward Light which thou scoffes at and the spirit of truth which thou calls a private spirit often hath discovered you and your spirit though thou boast of fifteen ages that your Doctrine hath been held by the Pastours and Teachers in your visible Church as in the 57. page of thy Epistle suppose I should grant the fifteen hundred years which I neither can nor will but I will lead thee to the sixteen hundred years and try thee and your Doctrine that you have held this fifteen hundred year if it be so as thou saith but this thou likes not but seeing thou pleads antiquity let us come on and joyne issue prove us Transubstantiation in the first hundred year nay I will give thee five hundred more and if I gave thee five more thou would hardly prove it before the Council of Trent prove us the Doctrine of Purgatory in the first hundred year and if thou take two it shall not offend me prove us the forbiding of Ministers to marry in the first hundred year and abstenance from Meats as though they were unclean which are created by God for the use of Believers prove us that Man hath a twofold right to the Kingdom of Heaven as your great Bellarmine saith the one by Christ the other by a Man 's own works prove us Invocation of Angels and prayer and Sacrifice for the Dead the first hundred year after Christ prove us their selling of Pardons in Christs and the Apostles days for Money prove us seting up of Images as to put Men in mind of the Saints deceased and of their Works prove us Baptism of Infants with Cream and Spittle and signing with the Cross and Godfathers and Godmothers and let us have some example beyond bare report for we dare not relie upon your infallible spirit in these things therefore convince us for we are gain-sayers and upon good ground and we do look upon all these Doctrines and many more not to be of such a great age as thou tells on neither to have any affinity or congruaty with the Church of Christ in his or the Apostles time nor sundry years after but rather look upon them as Doctrines of Devils and a very novelty a further Scripture R. E. urges 1 Tim. 3. 15. the Church of the living God the pillar and ground of truth and may we not relie of that pillar that God hath erected for us saith he and he that hears you hears me and go teach all Nations and lo I am with you always and yet if after all these promises if the Church may not be believed except she teacheth according to the Scriptures and be only infallible but when she doth her duty then the Church hath no more privilege then the Devil hath for so long as he teaches conformable to the Scripture he may be believed and so long as he teaches truth he may be believed saith R. E. in page the 58 59. Answ. The Church is in God 1 Thes. 1. and is the pillar and ground of truth she is in the world though not of the world and though the members thereof be visible in the world yet the world that lies in wickedness never owned them as such neither saw the glory of this Church but always persecuted it and was so far from owning it as rule and judge as it altogether gainsayed its direction but they that did believe in the word of life and were separated from the world and hated by it were willing to hear the Councel and to receive the instruction of the Church of God and the Church only medled with their own Members as in matter of Judgment and not of the
in himself that his reasons or arguments should be of that weight to convince or convert any seeing he hath rendered himself and they that knows him can testifie he hath always been a changable man and unstablt in all his ways tossed up and down like the Waves of the Sea and now at last fallen into the black gulf of darkness but it seems by his own writing in his Epistle that it hath been his former method being filled with a scribling humour in the days of his ignorance as he saith when the vail of pride and folly hung between his eyes which appears to hang there yet for any thing I can see having condemned himself and also repented as he saith for being in the head of a Troop of the rebellious Army a Captain and yet after Conversion and illumination and repentance as he saith subscribes himself Captain Robert Everard argues both pride and folly and gives but a small shew of repentance but rather argues fanedness and flattery and him to be a time-server and a man-pleaser And whether he intend by his Epistle to all the Non-conformists to the Church of England or all the Non-conformists to the Church of Rome is doubtfull for then the Church of England hath to conform in part as well as others though I believe the Church of Rome will claim a good part of her Discipline to be theirs only it wants the formality of Language something might largely be spoken as in return of answer to the things contained in the said Book but that it may be supposed some of those people with whom he hath formerly conversed which he now calumnates with notorious error will not receive his Epistle as an infallible and Heavenly Oracle but rather will return him some publick answer for the vindicating of their own Principles and also shewing him his weakness how soon he was turned aside with and for a thing of nought and also that he should be so bold as to turn in a moment their Instructer and Teacher when he hath but newly learned within a year or two the Principles of his own Religion which he saith he adores God in and so is but a novis and unskilfull in the word of righteousness though his web be very long of Linsie Woolsie and his words be many which will pass away as wind and have small effect I hope of gaining many Proselites to be Members of that visible Church which hath ruled over Nations Kindred and Tongues which are the Waters upon which the great Whore sits I take my self little concerned or that people with whom I am joyned in the fellowship of the Gospel of Christ Jesus who are Non-conformsts to the World and ever resolves to be according to the Apostles Doctrine and to all Hypocrites and Time-servers and them that serve not our Lord Jesus Christ but their own bellies of which this Generation is full who will transgress fon a morsell of Bread and conform to any thing and every thing for the smiles of the World ease and liberty in the flesh but the followers of Christ-hath not so learned Christ for who so will raign with him must suffer with him Neither should I have said much if the quarrel had been personal or about some circumstantial matters which a Man may be with and without and they neither add to nor diminish from his goodness and vertue but seeing it is a quarrel not only against us that are alive but against the faithful sufferers who laid down their lives in flames of Fire and the very Foundation of God which is the most sure thing is struck at and the spirit of God turned out of doores in regard of its office of certainty and infallibility and the Scriptures of truth laid aside as an insufficient thing except the Interpretations of Men be added to it for its authority and the constitutions of fallible and erring Men set up for rules and Men as Men set up as Law-givers and Judges over Mens Conscientes and Lords over Faith and to be the most certain thing for any Christian Man to rely upon and to believe as the old phrase is as the Church believes to pin ones faith upon others sleeves and to hang ones hope of anothers shoulders to put ones eye out that God hath given them to see with and then see by anothers may be led into any hole or ditch and this to be published with such confidence as the only infallible guide to which all Christians are to submit world make a Man half dumb to speak and stammer forth some thing as a testimony against such palpable error and manifest darkness put off with such confidence and usher'd in among Christians in such an age as this when Light and life is broken forth as a morning without Cloudes in Goshen where Israel the true Seed Inhabits I could not but say something in vindication of that certain sure everlasting truth which the Devil is out of by which the Saints are made free indeed in their inward man from sin and Non-conformists to the World its error wayes and worship and also to shew the mistakes of the Author and how easily he hath been drawn aside to lean upon a broken Read all his particulars which are of any weight or moment shall be considered and weighed in the righteous Ballance of equity and answered in their due place for the confirmation of them that do believe and for removing the stumbling blocks out of the way of them that doubt or stagger least they fall in such dark Pits as these viz. as to deny the spirit of God to be a sufficient guide and take away its infallibility and place it in Men that have erred do erre and may erre and call them the only sure infallible guide for all Christian men to follow But to speak something to the seeming weighty matter which weighed down R. E. his Judgment and cast the Scales so far as that all his hope faith foundation religion was weighed down at one draught and by such feeble things as put him to silence which he heard from his Laycatholick as he cals him argues a very weak a poor foundation a sandy which was so soon driven away but one thing is to be minded because he hath minded it himself of his Conversion as to matter of time this Conversion hath happened to fall out since the happy Restauration of our Gracious Soveraign to his Crown and Dignity as he saith this to some will render his Conversion somewhat suspicious whether he name this time as only accidental or the Restauration of the King the cause somewhat of his Conversion I shall not determine but however he having been behind before in Conformity resolved to make a good step to before the next time to avoid suffering loss and reproach But to speak a little as to the Discourse which R. E. hath published as the weighty matter whereby he was convinced their Judgments now it seems becoming
with the like confidence to prove they were in the truth and Christianity a delusion and thy instructer said what would you reply to them We have more to reply in such Cases then time will permit now or the state of the case require seeing it is but a supposition and we take no thought what to answer the gain-sayers of truth withall but relyes upon the promise of the Father and of his Son Jesus Christ who said to his Disciples take no thought for it shall be given you what to answer in that day which promise all that are true Disciples shall find true to the end of the World but somewhat more we have to say it may be then thou said when thou suffered thy self to be made blind and carried captive with another Mans Judgment and neglected the measure of Gods spirit in thy self at home through which alone the secret things of God is revealed and in which true certainty and infallibility is witnessed and not in Men who is fallible and changable If an Arian Jew or Turk should urge their own interpretation of Scriptures which is of no private interpretation contrary to the mind of him that gave it forth I would say he perverted the words of the Scripture which is in harmony and unity one with another as to the states and conditions they were spoken to and are plain and are only read by that spirit that gave them forth except it be in some Historicall or Chronology or Genealogy of Names and Generations which might he some gathered from other hands and different hands taking notice of them as to record them there might be some variation yet the substance of the report is true but what is Calculation of yeares or dayes or reckoning up of Genealogies as to the matter of Salvation and what if we had never had them no more then we have other Histories and things that fell out among the Jewes but if there be any contradiction for ought I know we may blame the Church of Rome the most of any who will needs affirm they received all or most of the things from the Apostles and if the translations differ or be somewhat uncertain what have they been doing this fifteen hundred yeares with their infallible spirit that they could not have rectified them according to their first original and if any of the foresaid Sects should pretend the certainty of the spirit and yet not have it I should answer the spirit is known by its fruits and the fruits of the spirit are manifest and they that pretend to it and bring forth contrary fruites are manifest to be deceivers and deceived but their states are different and therefore requires different answers which time will not now permit to insist upon but over and beside all other arguments to perswade any man to or from any thing the witness of God in the party unto whom he speaketh is to be reached and that is beyond the understanding of man and greater then it and more convincing then any arguments that can be used without and he that cannot speak to this is not skilful in the word of righteousness That Christ was an infallible guide who is the way the truth and the life is granted by all Christians and that the Apostles received the promise of the Father and the infallible spirit of God which led them into all truth and this infallible assurance the Christians had that lived in the Apostles time this is granted and the Apostles were infallible guides not as Men meerly but as Men full of the holy Ghost and as Men who were filled with the spirit of God and therefore the Apostles said be followers of us as we are followers of Christ and if any controversie did arise as some there did and doutes among the then Christians the Apostles and Elders meeting together in the power of the holy Ghost did write their mindes and Letters to the Christians to pacify all and good reason that they that had believed through their word should submit unto the Holy Ghost and unto them by whom they were begotten unto God by the word of Life for the ending of strife about wordes and shadowes and outward things and they whose mindes were outward then in ages since and now ran into contention about outward things and such for the most part do erre from the spirit of God in themselves but I would have thee to take notice of this and all you Catholick Members so called the Apostles of Christ only did exhort and did not force their Decrees by penal Statutes and to be observed under the penalty of loosing life or limbes as since their pretended successors have done who have erred from the spirit and have got the Saints words and turned against the life and power but the Decrees as you call them are not many nor burdensome which the Apostles wrote at Jerusalem as the many Counsels since have made they are so endless and numberless and burdensome and so contradictory one to another in divers things who will but look into the Decrees of the Counsels since the Apostles dayes that we can find little certainty in any of their Decrees but rather as thy Instructer saith the Sword of the flesh and not the spirit hath been the rule and law to Christianity but the Masters of great wit and power and Interest have framed and made parties unto themselves and hath not Warres been raised among your selves about deciding your controversies hath not the Pope Warred against the Emperour and the Emperour against the Pope was not Wars raised about the Decrees when Pope Eujenius was deposed as a Heretick by the Counsel of Bazill and one while the Pope must be infallible as Peter's Successor and above all Counsels and Churches another while the Counsell is above the Pope excommunicates him as a Heretick and excludes his Infallibility and now where is the certainty and whether should one go or appeal for true judgment so though the Church of Rome boast of unity yet how hath one Nation made War against another and yet professing the same faith at divers times and in sundry ages And to tell thee plainly and to speak the naked truth according to the Apostles prophesie after their departure there was a great Apostacy and a great falling away from the faith and a giving heed to lying seducing spirits and doctrine of Devils and many were subverted from the faith by them that spake lies in hypocrisie and took up the Priests office for filthy lucre and they went out into the world and the world wondered after them and they had the form and the sheeps cloathing and the Saints words but were enemies to the Cross of Christ and to the power of Godliness and the Kings of the Earth were bewitched with their Sorceries and then forced all and compelled all to receive and believe such Decrees and such Articles as was then set forth by a pack of those Hirelings who minded their
that confesses that Christ is come in the flesh only in word and because others hath said so and doth not witness sin condemned in the flesh and turned from and to have power over it the same is a false witness and is an Antichrist also and also we have other things to try spirits by we know a proud angry hasty perverse spirit is not the spirit of God a persecuting Lording Spirit is not the spirit of God and again they that teach a contrary Doctrine to the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles they have the spirit of error again they whose practice and conversation is not suitable to the practice and conversations of Christ and the Apostles and Primitive Christians that they are in the spirit of error again they that would force a faith by any humane constitution or law which is repugnant to the Law of God or by force of the sword or any carnal weapons they have the spirit of error for the weapons of the Lamb and his Followers are not carnal weapons but spiritual and yet mighty through God to the beating down of the strong holds of wickedness and to prevail over the Powers of darkness again the Testimony of God in every mans Conscience which is an unerring Testimony this savours the things of God and by this the things that be not of God are discerned and this will put a perfect difference between the spirit of truth and the spirit of error but what can be said to a man in unbelief that hath closed his eyes The next thing which R. E. saith he consider'd was that the Natural reason of every man could not possibly be rule and judge that I sought for for saith he if reason were to be rule and judge then it would follow contrary to Scripture that it is not impossible to please God without faith and it would likewise follow that every Religion would be truth consequently contradictions would be true consequently there would be many Religions and no faith at all for reason excludes faith as in the 26. page of his Book Thy tongue is thy own and thou art at liberty and goes whether thou wilt speaks what seems good in thy own eyes hath never yet known another to gird thee and lead thee whether thou would not I stand not to vindicate every mans Judgment neither to prove other mens conceptions but seeing thou hath taken in hand to lay all Mountains wast afore thee that stands in thy ways thou hast raised up some in thy discourse for others to stumble at and hath spoken many false things without distinguishing and puting a difference between Light and darkness between Natural reason and Spiritual reason I could not chuse but say somewhat Although it is no part of my belief that the Natural reason of any man or every man is able to be rule judge and guide to any man in the things of God yet faith is not in opposition unto pure reason neither is pure and spiritual reason in opposition to true faith but in harmony with it and one with another as they are the gifts of God but the Natural reason of all the fallen sons of Adam is corrupted and is too short and too narrow too cross and too perverse as to be rule and judge in the things of God for the Natural man by all his endowments in the transgression perceives not the things of God for they are spiritually discerned and the things of God that are spiritual and eternal are above the reach of Natural reason and yet thy consequence is false for faith doth not exclude pure reason and faith doth not make blind the understanding but enlightens it and though it is impossible to please God without faith yet it is impossible that that faith should be without reason the Apostle desired to be delivered from unreasonable men that had not faith so it is manifest they that have faith have reason and them that have no faith are unreasonable and where thou hath borrowed this rule I know not that a man must believe that which he doth not understand seeing the Apostle saith to the Romans even of the Gentiles who had not the Law nor the Scriptures that that which may be known of God was manifest in them for by that it is manifest they understood the mind of God and knew him for Paul saith further when they knew God they glorified him not as God but were unthankful c. and again he that believes must know that God is for none can believe in that which is not for to perswade any to believe in uncertainties which is not manifest in the understanding doth rather beget unbelief and doubting then true faith but thy paths are so full of darkness I shall not traduce them and thy consequences is false for pure reason teaches not contradictions neither doth teach that there is no faith at all neither is faith excluded by pure reason as thou ignorantly saith in the 26. page and is it not reason that I should believe in him whom I know is the Creator and Governour of all the World and pure Religion is so far from excluding faith that they that have true faith have reason and stands not in opposition to faith but this I conclude that the reason of fallen men is corrupted and is an uncertain thing to relie upon and so not a competent Judge in matters of so high concernment as touching everlasting Salvation The third thing which thou treats upon is against them who have pleaded that the sole Scriptures are sufficient of themselves to teach true faith from time to time to direct rule and govern us and to be rule and judge and to supply the place of Christ and the Apostles As I said it is not my intention to vindicate other mens quarels which is no part of my faith notwithstanding I should be sorry but that every thing had its true weight and measure and shall not in the least detract from the price value and true worth of the words of truth to wit the Scriptures of truth which were spoken forth by the spirit of truth and by the holy Ghost as it gave utterance but as men erring in their Judgments runs sometimes to the right hand and sometimes to the left hand and walks not in a straight path some men are seting them up above that which they were intended for and placing them in the stead of God Christ and the Spirit and others are too much debasing them and disesteeming them as that they would set up the Judgment of variable and changable men who hold and teach things in contradiction to the Scriptures and repugnant to the mind of the spirit in them that spoke them forth But first of all I say not against thee in this thing that the sole or whole Scriptures are not sufficient of themselves to teach true faith and give the knowledge of God without the spirit for many have got the words and yet
hath not received the spirit nor the power which the Scriptures declare of such wrangles and contends with the words and opposes the life and the power the Jews had the Scriptures and knew by them where Christ should be born and knew by them what his works should be when he was manifest and yet rejected him unto whom all the Prophets bore witness from Moses to Samuel and from him to John and they were never intended by God as to be set up as Judge and Guide to wit the words without the power and Spirit of God yet notwithstanding though I cannot set them up in the place of God and Christ and the Spirit nor contend ignorantly as some have done that they are the author of true faith and that they are the eternal word of God which the world was made by that they are the light and the way the truth and the life and that they are the desider of all Controversies and sole and absolute and only Judge of all matters of faith and of all matters that ever hath been or ever shall be in controversie to the end of the World without the spirit of God neither am I of that ignorant mind as some are that the Letter and the Spirit is unseparable as that whosoever hath the Scripture must needs have the Spirit or whosoever hath the Scripture must needs be infallible without the Spirit all that are of the aforesaid Judgment are but wranglers for the most part about words and contenders against the power of God and godliness and brings the words to oppose the life and them that have the spirit and walk in it for a Natural man may read the Scriptures and yet not perceive the things of God neither perceive the mind of the spirit but wrest to their own destruction as Peter saith because they are unlearned untaught by the spirits teaching though otherwise learned enough in Languages Tongues and Speeches Secondly Yet I cannot detract from them neither undervalue them or disesteem them as uncertain or of no use or of little use but what ever themselves declare themselves to be that I own them to be to wit the Words of God the words of Christ the words of the holy Prophets and Patriarkes and Apostles who were endued with the Holy Ghost and spake forth the Scripture as they were moved thereby in several ages of several things and unto several states and conditions as they were led thereunto by the holy Spirit and they are a certain declaration of things that were done and believed and practised by the Jewes under the first Covenant and by the Apostles and Primitive Christians in the New Covenant and contain many precious and holy precepts and commands doctrines examples exhortations admonisions reproofs and instructions and are as lively examples and holy patterns for all the Saints in light to follow by which we are given to understand what Faith what Hope what Patience what Love what mercy what long sufferings what consolation and what vertue and what inheritance the Saints in light were made pertakers of through faith in Christ Jesus Likewise what Doctrines were held forth and what practice they used in the Primitive times when they walked in the order of the Gospel and had fellowship with God the Father and the Son and one with another in the light of the Gospel which is the power of God through which they witnessed Salvation and remission of sins and published it unto others that they might believe Thirdly The Scriptures testifies of Christ and were written that they might be believed and received and read that there by every one that believed might be made wise to Salvation through faith in Christ Jesus 2 Tim. 3. and instructed in Righteousness that the Man of God may be perfect throughly furnished with all good works and whosoever doth teach any Doctrines contrary unto the holy Men of God who spake as they were moved by the spirit of God which dwelt in them the Scriptures are witnesses against such that they have not the Spirit of God but are led by another spirit which brings forth contrary Doctrine and another faith then once was delivered among the Saints and whosoever brings in sets up other precepts constitutions orders and practices in point of Worships in opposition and contrary unto those practices which were held forth in the Primitive times and would set up other Traditions then the Apostles delivered either by word or writing such are manifest to have the spirit of error and are innovaters and bringers in of other things as necessary in point of Worship among Christians which the Apostles and Ministers of Christ did not see necessary then and yet they wanted no part of the Councel of God for Paul said he had declared the whole Councel of God and further more they said we have the mind of Christ and Christs mind is not variable Fourthly Though divers of the Writings of the Prophets and Apostles be lost doubtless as is evident by divers places of Scripture yet blessed be God that there are those preserved which do bear witness of the one thing absolutely necessary unto Salvation and of the Ministrations that were appointed of the Lord for the Church of God to observe both in the first and second Covenants so that Christians of this last age are not left without example and president which all ought to have an eye unto and a diligent regard and though there be divers Coppies of that which is called the Original Tongues and divers Translations yet he unto whom the Spirit of God is given and waiteth in the measure of Christs Light shall receive it doth see and shall see the mind and will of God in every age and the mind and intent of the spirit in them that spoke forth the Scripture and can receive the matter therein contained as though they had heard them speak that spoke it at the first and though the Translaters were Men yet I have such an honourable esteem of their labour that I believe they have not varied wittingly and willingly from the best Coppies that was extant in their age neither that they were altogether void of the Spirit of God in such a good work which conduced to the benefit of Mankind but were assisted by it for so good a work and there be many figures and trophes improprieties of speech mysteries and difficulties yet all these comes to be made easie and plain to them that are witnesses of the same spirit that gave them forth and though there be deversity of judgments and professions of Religion one clashing again another and thwarting another and contradicting another and all will seem to bring the Scripture for their proofe which yet canuot maintain and prove every thing good especially when their Doctrines contradict one another This is granted it is only their private interpretation and not the Scripture and for want of that Spirit that gave it forth for that alone gives the true
it Where R. E. hath read of a visible Church with two heads I know not and to take it for infallible I intend not and where is Peter called a visible Rock and the chief Pastor among the Apostles doth not this contradict Scripture doth not Christ say the Gentiles exercise Dominion one over another but it shall not be so amongest you he that will be greatest among you let him be your servant and he that will be chief let him be your Minister and as for thy visible and militant Church we read no such words in the Scriptures of truth we read of a Church of God and of the first born whereof Christ was the Rock and the foundation and another foundation can no man lay then that which is laid which is Jesus Christ 1 Cor. 3. 11. and Paul saith in the 10. ver as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation I hope R. E. will not be so impudent as to say he had laid Peter or that he had preached up Peter to believe in for the remission of sins nor for the foundation of faith for that had been contrary to the Apostles commission and their Doctrine for saith the Apostle We have not preached our selves but Christ the Lord and our selves your servants for his sake And I may say to thee R. E. as Paul said to the Corinthians when they were striving about Men 1 Cor. 3. 21. therefore let no man glory in men for all things are yours or as he saith in the 1 chap. 13. ver was Paul crucified for you or were you baptised in the name of Paul were they not carnal that so gloried was Peter crucified for us or were we baptised in the name of Peter is not your visible Church carnal who thus judges that Christ intended Peter to be the foundation of his Church for what was he or the rest of the Apostles but Ministers by which many believed and if thou had been present it is very like would have instructed Christ what to have said and bidden him have spoken after the Grammer Rule and Construction upon that Rock I will build my Church for Peters faith in Christ is to mediate it seems and his confession too remote and anticedent to be the Rock meant in the 16. of Mat. 18. and therefore Peter must be imediate and the Rock upon which Christ hath doth and will build his Church but as imediate as he was and a sure a Rock as he was when he began to rebuke Christ he turned him about ver 23. and said unto Peter Get the behind me Satan thou art an offence unto me for thou savours not the things of God and so say I to R. E. and his Catholicks they savour not the things of God but it is thy private spirit and your own Interpretations and not the mind of Christ and how far anticedent is Peter's Confession of Christ the Son of the Living God is it not in the 16. ver and wherein was Peter blessed but in this that it was revealed to him that Christ was the Son of the Living God the Rock of Ages and the foundation of his Church and as for thy visible Church with its two heads indipendent head and dependent head which sure must have two bodies where they can be found but that I shall leave to R. E. and I hope from the grounds that thou hast here laid which did appear so clear to thee that none will be afraid not judge that such a visible Church with two heads is to be rule and guide to all to whom all is to submit under pain of Damnation which is to have Peter for its Rock which if he had been living he would have denyed you all as seters up of Men and â—leighters of Jesus Christ the Rock of Ages the Foundation of the Church the Head of the Body the Rule of Life the Judge of quick and the dead the Law-giver directer instructer and preserver of his Church for ever but R. E. goes on and saith it only remains that we consider which among all these congregations now on Earth which pretend themselves to be this Church of Christ for having once found her and knowing that she is so assisted with the Holy Ghost that she cannot teach us an error we shall no more dispute the verity of her Doctrines then we would have questioned the Articles of Faith taught by the holy Apostles or the words of Christ himself wherefore if this Church this infallible guide shall teach us that Infants ought to be Baptised and that it is as lawful to desire the Saints departed to pray for us as to desire the Prayers of them that are alive and that the body of Christ our Saviour is really and truly present in the Sacrament of the Alter or any other article of Faith we shall no more doubt it then the first Christians did the verity of what the Apostles taught them Among all those Congregations on Earth that looks upon themselves to be this Church and spouse of Christ there is one if thy eye could behold or if thou could discern it but before thou can there is an eye in thee must be put out and there is a wisdom in thee that must be confounded and turned into foolishness before thou can discern it in its glory as it is but however that is it undoubtedly which is begotten into the faith through the publication of the immortal word of Life who are translated from death unto life who have received the power and spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ and meets in his name and power and doth witness his presence among them and have received a measure of that infallible Spirit of truth which leadeth into all truth and out of the pollutions of the World and are dead unto the World and baptised into the sufferings of Christ and are crucified with him who keep unviolated his Statutes and commands without adding to or diminishing from who walk in the order of the Gospel and are not conformable to the world nor to that which fallen men sets up but to the power of God which worketh in the hearts of all that believe to the framing of them a meet habitation for God to dwel in and abideth in the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles and are sayers and doers speakes the truth and doth the truth and holds the truth in Righteousness and the faith once delivered to the Saints in a pure heart and a pure Conscience who prayes in the spirit and with understanding who publisheth the truth and declares it in the spirit reaching to the Consciences and to the witness of God in all that hears who rejoyce only in Christ Jesus the great power of God and the wisdom of God and hath no confidence in the flesh nor fleshly performances whose faith stands not in words but in the mighty power of God which she hath received according unto the promise of God this Congregation or Congregations
largly of by other hands and pens so that I need not say much But Miracles be not evermore undoubted proofes of a true Doctrine nor such absolute signes of a true Church nor such infallible arguments as from Heaven as R. E. saith his is and so I shall conclude with that which Austin said unto Faustus the Manicha Ye work no Miracles and yet if ye wrought any at your hands we would take heed of them and Jer. 23. saith the false Prophets have deceived my people by their lies and by their lightness and by their dreams and Miracles And so hath this false fained pretended Catholick Church done deceived The Nations and bewitched them with such lying fabulous stories and false and ridiculous miracles and sorceries and inchantments as is above mentioned and many more of the like nature might be mentioned but that I would not be tedious to the Reader which if they were summed up all would hardly make up a Heavenly argument and proof as R. E. saith it doth that their Church is the only true Church and fit to be the rule and judge of all matters of faith and now Reader view over their Miracles before mentioned and see if thou can receive them because the Church of Rome saith they are true and must not be questioned for if thou do thou art like to come under a hard censure by the verdict of R. E. and his Catholick Church first to be reckoned as an unbeliever secondly to be a hater of God and thirdly in not believing these Miracles or whatsoever else shall be declared unto thee by the said Church or else thou comes under no les penalty then eternal damnation as R. E. saith in the 80. page of his Epistle but it is a small thing to be judged by man and especially such a man who hath gaded abroad and changed his way so osft so that he hath forgotten the true path of Righteousness to walk in or else never knew it and hath turned and wheeled about and now at last doth as the poor Indian doth with his Deer skin hangs it upon one shoulder and so upon the other shoulder to shelter him from the wind and tempest that comes of that side But the day is dawned and mens spirits are discovered beyond their words and all the turnings and wheelings of things upside down is but as the Potters Clay for God measures every man not by his words but by his heart and spirit and works and will judge every one in Righteousness according to their deeds And R. E. goes on as confident that his arguments and reasons laid down hath prevailed and almost takes it for granted that it must needs be evident to all that the Roman Church is the true Church and saith he knows but one single point between the Catholicks and them that stand devided from them and that is saith he that we follow a several rule to guide and judge in the great affaires of faith for all sides are bound to believe all truths sufficiently propounded to them to be revealed of God and therefore if the presence of Christ in the Sacrament Purgatory worshipping of Images Invocation of Saints and prayer to the Dead and for the Dead if these or any other point of faith be sufficiently propounded by denying them Gods varassaty is denyed and God thereby made a lyer The difference stands betwixt you and them that are devided from you in more particulars then thou art aware of or ever will be able sufficiently to propound them to be revealed of God though it is true some are but devided from you in Circumstantials and Ceremonies and some others in some points of Faith and Worship yet some deny you in the very ground though 't is true the different rule by which each party are directed is a great and a main thing thou saith this Church Catholick is the rule but I say and am not alone that Christ is the way to the Father and the way to the Kingdom and the rule and means by which his Church is governed and he is the Lawgiver and the judge and all Judgment is committed to the Son and it is he alone that propounds truth sufficiently and they that are in him are new Creatures and that which is the new Creatures rule guide and judge is the rule guide and judge of the Church of God and Christ is the author of faith and it is nothing that availes any thing with God but the new Creature and as many as walk according to this rule peace is to them Gal. 3. 16. and Christ hath not left his people without guide for he said lo I am with you to the end of the world So as to commit the guidance thereof to fallible men who may assume authority without his power and to fasten those things upon God as to be revealed from him when the Lord hath spoken nothing and we are so far from looking that the main grounds that thou lays down to prove your Church to be this rule and guide and the many Doctrines propounded by you are not sufficiently propounded to be revealed of God but rather they are the imaginations of your own brain and things packt up since the Apostles days by different Popes and different mutations and alterations in your Church for filthy Lucres sake and so to deny them is not to deny Gods varassaty neither to make God a lyer as thou falsly saith but thou and you are the lyers as to propound those things to be revealed from God and to be received by all under pain of damnation when God hath revealed no such thing but the contrary and so thy own words at last shall turn to be thy burden because thou saith the Lord saith and hath revealed and sufficiently preposed the real presence of Christ in your Sacrament of the Alter as a devine Revelation worshipping of Images Prayer to the Dead and for the Dead and all the foolish imagination which you have brought in and intruded and thrust upon people by force and these are sufficiently propounded as thou saith as devine Revelations and the Father Son and Holy Ghost or the Incarnation of Christ silence deceit and for shame blush so to say the Prophets who spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost and prophesied of things to come they declared of the Father Son and Holy Ghost all and prophesied long before that a Virgin should bring forth a Son whose name should be called Emanuel God with us and the Government should be upon his shoulders this the Pope hath usurped and you put it upon his Shoulders but your invented Doctrines aforesaid are meerly the imaginations of your own brain which neither the Prophets nor Apostles bore witness unto but against and therefore it is thy and your great presumption to make God Christ and Apostles the foundation of all this rubbish straw and stuble which thou would put off as devine revelation and as sufficiently preposed as the
Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles was nay blush for shame they brought in the Prophets for the peoples sake to prove that they had testified of the same before and had declared the coming of the just one besides they commended themselves to the witness of God in every mans conscience and upon waiting upon the Lord and in the measure of his spirit they found the things even so and by searching the Scripture as the Bareans did and found the things even so as had been declared of but upon due consideration we find not these foresaid Doctrines so propounded as to have the Testimony of the Prophets and Apostles neither doth your Doctrine and worship answer the Witness of God in every Man's Conscience and so to deny you is not to make God a lyer but God true the Prophets and Apostles and the witness of God true and you lyers who contradicts them and their Testimony and the power of God and would assume it to your selves though you be erred from the spirit and would put all under the name of infallibility and by such heavenly arguments as R. E. calls them to wit the Miracles aforesaid by which you have deceived the Nations and blinded the eyes of the people but the time is come and Light and Life is broken forth that the skirts of the Whore must be discovered and her nakedness must appear and her fornications and adulteries shall be manifest unto all so that you shall not proceed much further And I hope by this time in E's words it will appear evident to all whose eyes God in any measure hath opened that this Catholick Church so called is manifest in what hath been said to R. E. not to be the Church of Christ neither their Doctrines and practice devinely propounded neither she taken from henceforth as the only infallible judge rule and directer in all matters of faith which all are to receive upon pain of damnation as R. E. saith though she sit as a Queen and hath known no sorrow but on the contrary she to be a blind guide that hath bewitched the Kings of the Earth and the Nations which are waters which is the universality R.E. boasts of with her inchantments and sorceries which from henceforth shall not be taken as infallible but fallible and as that Church that hath not conveyed the true faith which was once delivered to the Saints but rather hath spread abroad error and false Doctrine and the traditions and inventions of Men instead of the Doctrine of Christ and would put off all this under the name of Authority and power from God and sufficiently propounded and infallibility and under the penalty of the highest curse upon not receiving it but the Sun is risen which hath discovered all your deceit lay down your carnal weapons Cain's weapons and your humane power by which you have prevailed more by force and cruelty upon the Nations then by found Doctrine or that plea of being Peters successors I say come forth with your spiritual weapons which the Church of God had in the Primitive times and prevail as far as you can but oh you want these and therefore you are necessitated to take up force and violence the Dragons power to compell all to come to your Church Further R. E. in his Postscript hath been confident of what he hath declared that it is of such force what he hath said for the Roman Catholick Church so called that he believes what he hath said cannot be answered and he saith his confidence doth not misbecome him and that it is improbable to be answered and that he hath not yet done his All neither in his first nor second Edition but hath somewhat more yet of great moment to speak as to prove the Church of Rome this only and infallible guide Unto whom I say it had been good not to have boasted when he put on his armor but when he puts it off and methinks having been so unstable and unsetled as he hath been formerly he should not have been so confident in opposition to Wisdom as to give such a challenge and make such a vapour of as that it is improbable to be answered and it is more then any of you or all of you can answer as his own words are page the 89. these words are not becoming a man indeed who saith he hath learned meekness and humility of heart and hath such great bowels of Charity as he professeth he hath page the 86. The substance of what he hath said or written which he reckons so profound and unanswerable and to be more then any or all the Nonconformists can answer they have been answered over and over again before R. E. was born by many Learned sufficient and good Men whose Reasons and weighty Arguments about the Premisses have not been made void unto this day but hath prevailed with many not only to the convincing but also to the turning of many from that usurped Authority of the Roman Church and hath discovered the errors false Doctrine and evil practices notwithstanding their pretended infallibility which R. E. will not be able to answer if particulars should be descended unto and though R. E. may reckon the reasons that he hath laid down which he hath the most what taken at the gainest and reckon them as impregnable yet I hope they will not appear so to an understanding eye which is enlightened by the spirit of the Lord nor to them who are of a sound Judgment what others have done to answer his bold Challenge I know not because I am shut up in a corner for the Testimony of Jesus and for the word of God but methinks them that are concerned should not let such boasts go unreproved neither such false Doctrine nor false suggestions as R. E. hath made to villifie and debase and set at nought all things and every thing that seems contrary unto the judgment of this pretended Catholick Church and seeing that he shuts out all Nonconformists as to be Members of the Church of God and to be without all Rule all Order all Government and to come under the great penalty of damnation by not submitting unto whatsoever this pretended Catholick Church doth impose how repugnant soever it be unto the Doctrine of Christ and how contrary soever it be unto the Spirit of God yet all must be received without question though it be that which the Spirit of God sometimes called the Doctrine of Devils but now it must become holy and of divine authority and sufficiently propounded and so received because as R. E. saith this Church cannot err I say unto him and unto all men and to the witness of God in every man either the Church in the Apostles days did err and teach false Doctrine or this pretended Catholick Church because they teach contrary one to the other and do walk by a contrary rule and as R. E. saith infallibility cannot contradict it self and he hath granted that the Apostles and Primitive Christians had an infallible spirit and did not err then let R. E. and all take a view of the Roman Doctrine and compare it with theirs and they shall find it as far wide one from the other as the Heavens is from Earth or light from darkness so that for the truths sake and for the Doctrine and faith sake that was once delivered among the Saints and for the Nonconformists sake who cannot bow their knee to Baal neither snbmit to the injunctions of changable men instead of the Doctrines of Christ. I could not do less then give Answer unto the substance of R. E. his Epistle which he boasted of to be more then any could answer and to reprove his false Doctrine and error which he would perswade all unto and not to question because the Church of Rome hath propounded it as infallible most of all those Doctrines are denyed and I cannot but give my Testimony against them as to be false and that which leads people into error and let R. E. when he brings forth his all prove to us that Infallibility as intailed to the Pope by succession and Prayer for the Dead worshipping of Angels worshipping Relicts worshipping Images Transubstantiation Purgatory sprinkling of Infants prove to us from the Scripture in thy next that these were Apostolical and Infallible Doctrines delivered and taught by the Church of Christ in the Apostles time or in the first hundred years after Christ and thou will not only gain me but many more to receive and imbrace the Catholick Church of Rome for an absolute rule and guide unto which all on earth ought to be subject unto which if thou do not we will take it for granted thou dare not least thou ingage thy self in such a Controversie as thou never ingaged in yet by which thy and your folly will more and more appear unto all I shall not trouble neither my self nor the Reader any further in traducing R. E. in his multiplicity of words although the main and weighty Arguments and reasons as R. E. looks upon them is answered which I commend unto thee and to the witness of God in every Man's Conscience to try and search out where the difference and weight lies and the truth and as the measure of Gods Spirit in every Man's Conscience doth close with or against if it can what I have said about R. E. his Epistle for unto that I dare stand to the judgment of and in it as every one believes and walks I bid my Reader Farewell F. H. Westmerland this 18. of the Fifth Moneth 1665. THE END Faults that have escaped the Press through the negligence of the Printer the Friendly Reader is desired to pass by or correct Some of which are these PAge first line 28 29. for Nonformists read Nonconformists p. 2. l. 3. for and read as l. 7. the point or stop should be after over p 3. l. 16. the point should be after the word Director and not after unto l. 37. for fanedness read fainedness p. 6. l. 34. for Christian read Christians p. 19. l. 24 for minds read mind p. 31 l. 35. for legable read legible p. 44. l. 35. for habitants read habitations p. 57. l. 28. for 9th read nine