Selected quad for the lemma: truth_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
truth_n	absurd_a	apostle_n	great_a	16	3	2.0729	3	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A19857	A suruey of certaine dialogical discourses: vvritten by Iohn Deacon, and Iohn Walker, concerning the doctrine of the possession and dispossession of diuels VVherein is manifested the palpable ignorance and dangerous errors of the discoursers, and what according to proportion of God his truth, every christian is to hold in these poyntes. Published by Iohn Darrell minister of the gospell.	Darrel, John, b. ca. 1562.	1602 (1602)	STC 6285; ESTC S109295	85,966	179

feare of death were all their life time subiect to bondage where also it is plaine how Sathan was throwne out and that the fruit redownds to al that were oppressed with feare of death which nomber is infinite besides Demoniacks VVhere it is to be obserued how these Discoursers alleadginge this text euer when they come to the fiftenth verse which they s●e doth vtterly ouerthrow them shrinck back againe not daring to touch it as if some scorpyon lay vnder this stone which makes me thinke they doe not so much ignorantly as of purpose peruert the scripture But let vs by the way see how they doe vrge this Scripture to their purpose This word destruction say you cannot fitly be applyed to Sathan his power of obsession pag 185. but must necessarily be appropriated to his power of possessiō which was not only much maymed but vtterly destroyed by the death of our Sauiour so as non can be possest now in these daies of the gospel If this here said of the diuel is to be appropriated to the power of possessiō thē hath Christ destroyed the diuel onely for Demoniacks By this your interpretation also of the word destroy none can now doe the workes of the diuel none can at this day lye slaunder commit murther whoredome c. For 1. Ioh. 3.8 it is said that Christ hath appeared to destroy the workes of the diuel and thus you your selues translate the worde Breifly none of the regenerate can sinne pag 186. Rom 6 6 sith it is said the olde man of such is crucified with Christ that the body of sinne might be destroyed But to returne thither whence I haue digressed Lastly from the interpretation which you doe giue of Ioh. 12.31 it must necessarily follow which you also boldly deliuer for truth that by Christ the power of possession was finally determined vtterly annihillated that an ende was made of this busines And againe that our Sauiour Christ put a finall end to the possession of diuels by his death and resurrection Now how can this possibly be true Ans. pag 66 sith after Christ his death and resurrection many were possessed with diuels as is plaine by the Actes of the Apostles Beesides after our Lord was risen he foretels that some beleeuers should in his name cast out diuels Heerevnto you answering Mark 16 17. page 197 graunt that there were indeed possessions dispossessions a time that is a little time after Christ his death resurrection for confirmation of his glorious gospel but none at all for the declaration of Christ his Deitie But how is it proued why M. Deacon and M. Walker say it That we may plainly see that this is an absurd shift we must remember that the miracles wrought by the Apostles or others as well after as before Christs death serued for confirmation of Christ his Deitie First in that Christ is the subiect or matter of the gospell That therefore which maketh for the confirmation of the truth of the gospel which the miracles wrought by the Apostles after Christs death did by their owne confession must nedes make for confirmation of this Christ that he is the true Messiah and Sauiour of the world And if of Christ then both of his Deity and humanity For Christ is a person consisting of these two natures Againe the gospel teacheth the Deitie of Christ whatsoeuer miracles then confirme the gospel the same confirme Christs Deity Moreouer the miracles namely the dispossessions of the Apostles or of any other wrought after Christs resurrection were wrought in the name of Christ a●d therefore confirmed Christ his Deity Mark 16.17 In my name saith Christ they shall cast out diuels And this they should doe after his resurrection I commaund thee saith Paul in the name of Iesus Christ Acts 16 18 that thou come out of her he came out Tell me now ye Discours●rs whether this dispossession of S. Paul and such like dispossessions Actes 8.7 19.23 performed after Christ his resurrection whereof we reade in the Act●s made not for the confirmation of Christ his deity Behoulde the palpable darknesse that hath couered you which notwithstanding you ●eele not nor in respect thereo● keepe your selues still and quiet without stirring in your places as the Egiptians did but you strout it out and wa●k b●l●lie as in the clearest sunn shine by so much more miserable then the ●giptians were But if you will be so hardy you must thanke your selues if you breake your shinnes for you can hardly breake your faces and it may be this doth make you so venterous pag 182 You prosecute your absurd interpretation of I●hn 12. further by conference of some scriptures which either you doe not or will not vnderstand by a Resolution making little to the purpose and lastly by the testimonies of diuers wherein you haue a notable grace to abuse mens names and wordes contrary to their meanings Bring one approued author i● you can that restrayneth the castinge out of the Prince of the worlde to the deliuerance of demoniackes and to the ending or finall determination of possessiō which if you cannot what a shame is it or rather a wickednes not to be borne to foyst in the names of good Authors and some scattered patches of sentences sounding contrary to their iudgments to deceaue the simple and to draw them into error Are you men appointed to be leaders of the blinde and doe you willingly digge pitts for them The Lord deliuer his people from such pastors which stop theire mouthes with grauel instead of bread and kill them with the poyson of their owne erronious conceipts instead of feeding them with the wholesome foode of God his truth My purpose is not to enter any particuler examination of your allegations For euen as one when he was inioyned to carry away a dunghill after he considered how huge and foule it was neuer put to his shoulders but opened a passage to a riuer not far of by the flowing wherof he swept it away So I when I perceaue how wearisome and vnprofitable it would be to ransack to the bottome this heape of trumpery thinke it better rather then to remoue all this baggage in●tead of water to put her to it which happely might make some speedy riddance or such stuff●●nd thus much for this Dialogue A Suruey of the Seauenth Dialogue In this Dialogue of common experience Whether Actuall Possession of Spirits may b● or no I expected some proo●e that the possessions mentioned by Tertullian Cyprian Chrysostome and so till our owne times were all but counterfeyt and therefore no reason to thinke any other of Som●ers at Nottingham But as Apothecaryes boxes carry titles of A●●oes Styrax Benjoin and within haue nothing but black leade copporas Ockar and such trash so heere we haue a title of common experienc● without any experience at all not any one approued example once sifted and conuicted Yet to examine such as you

A SVRVEY OF CERTAINE DIALOGICAL DISCOVRSES VVRITTEN BY IOHN DEACON AND IOHN WALKER concerning the doctrine of Possession and Dispossession of Diuels VVHEREIN IS MANIFESTED THE PALPABLE IGNORANCE AND DANGEROVS errors of the Discoursers and what according to proportion of God his truth every christian is to hold in these poyntes Published by Iohn Darrell minister of the gospell Titus 1.10.11 There are many disobedient and vaine talkers and deceiuers of mindes teaching thinges which they ought not for filthy lucres sake whose mouthes must be stopped IMPRINTED 1602. TO THE READER VVITH ANSVVERE to the Discoursers two epistles It greiues me christian reader I assure thee still perforce to be thus troublesome not onely to my selfe but also to thee It must needes be enough and more then enough for thee to haue pervsed so many simple treatises already all harpinge on one string And as for my selfe how can I after so great vexation by the B. of London so long imprisonment such publicke producemēt into open courts lastly my paynes to cleare the truth frō M. Harsnets slaunders but like a tired weather beaten bird wish sōe quyer corner to rest my selfe in to dry my feathers in the warme sūne But it is not my lot I thīke to breath me no not a litle For behold two new chāpions that haue been bucklinge on their harnesse these two or three yeares with a proud swelling volume like a Spanish Armada challenge me afresh to a new encounter Wherin yet this comforts me that this new on set 〈◊〉 an open declaration to the world that in these mens Iudgments at the least the Bishop with his home forces hath bene to weake Neither this onely but even the B. himselfe by entertaininge this fresh ayde doth as it were plainly confesse his victory to be as yet vnperfect Otherwise it were idle eyther for them to offer or him to imbrace a needles supply if they perceaved not their former platforms by that poore battery which my cōtēned writīgs haue made to be tottering falling Blessed be God which though he suffer his truth to be shrewdly pressed yet not to be altogether oppressed to be shrewdly thrust at yet not vtterly cast downe to be laden indeed with heavie burdens yet to grow vnder them like a prevailyng palme Great i● the power I see of a iust cause how simple so ever her taile be But what shall the matter now be put out of all doubt Must it needes in these Dialogues be convinced by Logike and perswaded by Rhetorike that all this brute of Possession and Dispossession is but a mere deceit O foolish and vnadvised men which thinke to overthrow that by fond Sophisticall words which by sad wordes and deedes hath not hetherto beene vanquished No doubt men of iudgment will heerein deeme the Bishop to haue failed in a great poynt of circumspection in committing the brunt execution of a battayle to these the weakest and cowardliest companies he hath For if himselfe could not be satisfied to haue wounded the cause to his power with the sword of his authority but that he must needes race the memory of it with consuminge fyre he should not for performance thereof have sent vs this Ignis fatuus as every one may easily discerne this to be I pray thee Christian Reader haue patience with me I will spare thy paynes and myne owne as much as I can My purpose is not to man out an other Galeasse like this Discoursers gallant but to set vpon it with my poore fisher boate yet I hope by God his assistāce to make her lay her top sayle in the broth Neither thinke thou I endevour hereby a defence more for my selfe then for thee I could haue contemned their frivelous reproches had it not bene thou wert greatly endangered by the manifold grose errors wherewith they would poyson thee And therfore intending thy good more then myne owne credit I will take a breife view of their Dialogicall Discourses before I come to them which properly concerne me These Discourses be fronted with a double epistle one to the Right H. the L. Keeper and cheife Iudges of the land to which we will answer anone the other to the Reader wherin omitting their earnest care to find out the truth in this doctrine proceeding even to dissention betwene thee two otherwise sworne brethren in matters of fact first we haue a large rehearsall of sundry reasons for the edition of this treatise both wherfore it hath beene hitherto suppressed and also for what causes now at last it is published For suppresing the regard of your owne imperfectiōs were not to be misliked if you had not repented of this humilitie so soone But I can hardly beleeue you conceaued so meanely of your owne facultie as to feare the censure of any for scholasticall forme your whole discourse is so Analyticall your Phisiologus Othodoxus such ripe pregnāt concluders besides your continuall vpbrayding me with my Hotchpotch and vs all which haue dealt in this cause with our intricate riddles Neither can I thinke you distrust your eloquence as you pretend wherein you braue it so every where Whether it be Ciceronian vernish or no I cannot tell my skill is not great In my poore iudgment to giue you your right the sentences are well stuffed with good ratling wordes able to still the babes crying replenisht eftsoones with many Timely epithites sweetly buzzing in every corner like a swarme of flies I graunt you that therebe many buysy controlers of other mens labours But why should you feare a quippe for a poynt of learnyng which haue inured your faces not to blush at greater matters No doubt your compassion and care of me was great least by publishing this worke you shoud increase my afliction such is the charitable regard you carry towards me in this you haue published in every page imbracinge me no lesse tenderly then the Ape her young ones Lastly you hoped Authoritie might haue caused silence for which purpose you remember the obeydience of the prophet to Amaziah his commaund after he had done his message though not so fully as he would yet sufficiētly such is your great skile or at least your fidelitie in reasoninge that by your rule the hungry man must patiently fast because he doth so which hath his belly full Withall you would faine charge our stirringe in this cause with want of respect to her Maiesties Princely prerogatiue but in answere to your Queres this imputation shall appeare to be no lesse absurde then malitious and your selues rather pernitious Sycophants then wee in the smallest allegyance vndutifull And thus haue wee these worthy reasons for suppressing as forcible to this end as if one should suppresse water with a ●iue Now what great motiues thrusted forward the publishing forsooth for that some Ma●● contents vndermined the authoritie of the high commis●ion when as only the bad dealing of some in the commission was iustly reproued the Commission

onely say you is that which we entertaine very confidently hould for a truth Namely that the gracelesse boy did gracelesly counterfeyt knavishly beare the world in hand he was really possessed of Sathan when there was no such matter at all But as concerning your selfe we doe vndoubtedly thinke that the same was simply your errour in iudgment but no purposed errour in your practise at all This is your testimony Seeing therefore you are so perswaded of me in your consciences how cōes it to passe that through your whole discourses you haue traduced me as a deceauer And namely in your Answer pag 39. 40. where speaking of Somers his supernaturall knowledg you shift that of by ascribing his predictions c to some cunning confederacyes with me Why should we wonder at all say you that two cunning companyons consederate togither before should conclude such a course betwene thēselues as the one by the helpe of the other should prognosticate such strange incredible euents c. Haue you there striuen against conscience Or hath the truth heere preuayled against your willes Surely it is wonderfull that men seeking fauour by soothing and hoping for some great aduantage by iustifying other mens indirect courses should notwithstanding the B. his violent dealing whether by imprisonment or by pretence of law whatsoeuer notwithstanding also M. Harsnets authenticall booke written for confirmation of the sayd proceedings yea notwithstanding their owne endes and long tedious paynes to compasse them should I say notwithstanding all these after many discourses cleare me altogether of the pretended crīe and thereby withall shew that the Bishop hath dealt vniustly M. Harsnet falsly 1 Cor. 3 19. and they themselues wickedly in ioyning hands to oppresse the guiltlesse It is the Lord which catcheth the wise in their owne craftynesse Neither doe I onely in this your confession behold the victory of truth ouer your selues but am forced to prayse the Lord for his great goodnesse which hath made the BISHOPE himselfe the greatest Aduersary to this cause to subscribe to my vprightnesse in it Your booke comes forth by his priuiledge No doubt it was perused perused againe It lay a long time in his handes And who can tell whether this testimony be not his owne wordes set downe vnder your names It may be the Lord hath touched his heart for that he did against me And howbeit publique cōfession were requisite in publique wrongs yet it is some ease to sōe mens consciences to make confession couertly whatsoeuer therfore other men may thinke That he would be farre from such acknowledgment yet I wlll hope the best as knowing there is nothing vnpossible vnto the Lord. Neyther skills it greatly whether he writt these very wordes or no considering he hath allowed approued them at least in giuing them publique passage and priuiledg to thē And therefore though S. Paul when the Serieants were sent vnto him refused to depart secretly out of prison but as by publique authority he was cast in so by the same authority he would be brought forth yet I being beyond comparison inferior to him will rest my selfe content in hauing my open iniuries satisfied though but in this secret manner How good and gratious is the Lord which bringeth forth the righteousnesse of his seruants as the light their iudgment as the noone day As he dealt with our heade Christ in causing Pilat to pronounce him a iust man so he dealeth with his poore members accordinge to their seuerall degrees Hee made Saul acknowledg Dauid more righteous then him selfe Agrippa Festus to say of Paule He had done nothing worthy of bonds To this therefore onely wise gratious Mighty Lord God the father the Sonne the holy spirit be all honor praise for euer euer Amen FINIS