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A17036 An ansvvere to Master Cartvvright his letter for ioyning with the English Churches: whereunto the true copie of his sayde letter is annexed. Browne, Robert, ca. 1550-1633.; Cartwright, Thomas, 1535-1603.; Harrison, Robert, d. 1585?, attributed name. 1585 (1585) STC 3909; ESTC S109433 77,571 102

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baptised of him yea among the Pharisces there were those that touching the righteousnesse which is in the lawe were vnrebukeable They were as it appeareth most of them Leuites openly called and authorised to preach by the Elders aud people in the Synagognes And surely that it is but a vaine exception which Master Cartwright maketh of the high Priest That he was made a yeerely officer and came in by Simonie into his office For Eleazar was made high priest while Aaron the high Priest yet liued And Zadok was made high Priest and Abiathar and his sonnes put from the priesthoode when as yet the couenant of the priesthoode pertained by the lawe vnto Abiathar and his house But necessities and iust occasions did oftentimes make change of the ceremoniall lawes and yet no corruption nor abuse came thereby Wherefore for aunswere I say that the priesthoode was not made a yeerely office but that by course euery yeere two priestes did execute the office And this seemed to be tollerable by the Lawe seeing that if one priest shoulde be sicke or letted by some greater occafions the other might be in his steade As wee shewed before that Eeleazar was chosen high Priest while Aaron yet liued and Zadok in Abiathars steade and yet were there not two high Priestes in the office at once but onely one at once was to execute the office Also there seemed to be much doubt and controuersie to which of the p●iestes the priesthoode did belong as also we may reade in Iosephus And therefore two chiefely standing for it there were two chosen to it And because the lawe of God did not suffer two at once to bee in the office they did succeede one another in the execution of the office Againe seeing they were of the sonnes of Aaron and called after the order of Aaron no doubt their calling was lawfull and good Otherwise if any at that time had bene lawfull high Priestes and yet not lawfully called as was Aaron then the Apostle woulde not haue set downe this for a generall trueth That no man taketh this honour vnto him selfe but he that is called of God as was Aaron Neither let him here shift off our answere by his fonde distinction of the essence of a priest and of a lawfull priest which before is refuted As for Symonie wherewith he chargeth the high Priestes hee can not prooue it against them For if the Romanes ouerruling them did grieuously exact their tributes and paiments both of Christ himselfe as we may reade in Matth and of the high priestes it was no more Symonie in the priestes then it was in Christ to pay them their exactions For the priesthoode was their right seeing it pertained vnto them being the sonnes of Aaron yet can not Master Cartwright prooue that they payed any monie when they tooke their right or if they did that they thereby bought their right and not rather payed an exaction which the Romanes demanded when they tooke their right But suppose that secretly they gaue bribes to the Romanes delt by Symonie yet that being hidden and not manifest to the people they were to be taken of men as lawfully called to that office For if the Lawe and common tribute exacted monie of them they might pay it as well as Christ. If the officers did exact any besides lawe they did it secretely lest they them selues should be condemned by lawe and so it is manifest that no symonie could be laid to their charge And therefore no maruaile though Christ bad the man shewe him selfe to the high Priest For before the high priestes became open persecuters there was a lawfull communion to be had with them But this communion was afterward broken and made vnlawfull through their open wickednesse Also it is false which Master Cartwright saith that Christ did reuerence the high Priest and gaue him accountes of his doctrine For he gaue him no accountes and answered him so roundly that one of the officers whiche stoode by smote him with a rodde Also his aunswere is false cōcerning that place in Hoshea that the Lord would refuse the priestes for being any more his priestes seeing they were without knowledge of which wordes he sayeth that the prophet rather giueth a rule to be followed in their election or deposition then howe farre they may be vsed Nay the Prophet there speaketh nothing of electing them or deposing them by men but rather of the plague or destruction that shoulde come vpon them yea hee sheweth that through the ignorance of the priestes all wickednesse and idolatrie reigned and therefore he saith that there shal be like people like Priest meaning that they shall haue a like destruction Now Master Cartwright dare not say that all abominable wickednes and Idolatrie reigning and the priests them selues being wicked idolaters I say he dare not affirme that they helde the couenant or were the people or church of God For before he hath said the contrary And howe then dare he say that such priestes were yet priestes vnto God and were not deposed from their priesthoode when as their owne wickednes and idolatrie did depose them For that whole chapter of Hoshea is altogether against their wickednesse and idolatrie And let M. C. knowe that our open grosse sinnes abuses being not curable by the discipline of the Church are as euill as Idolatrie as Samuel the Prophet doeth witnes saying that rebellion is as the sinne of witchcraft and transgression he meaneth trāsgression which is stoode in and wil not be mended is wickednes idolatry But this matter is made manifest before Now followeth the last part of his letter the last matter in controuersie as whether by communicating with a reading minister we do communicate with their impietie establish their ministerie M. C. herein doth more shamefully erre then if he should with the bishops altogether iustifie such reading ministers For he might better say they were lawfull ministers and that their ministerie were lawfull then that he should confesse them to be vnlawfull ministers yet iustifie that we may receiue them as hauing the essence and substance of ministers and partake in their wicked ministerie without impietie or establishing their But he may playnly see except his eies of vnderstanding be vtterly darkened that if any do vsurpe as traitors against her maiesty then they also that come vnder their vsurped rule and gouernment being once free from it are also trayters together with them So likewise those men vsurping a ministery which Christ neuer gaue them neyther sanctified to be in his Church both they doe wickedly and they also that wil come vnder theyr ministery doe establish theyr wicked ministery and partake with them in theyr impiety If a man of the winde sayth the prophet and false fellowe doe he saying I will prophecie vnto you of wine and of strong drinke he shall euen be the prophet of this people Yea why not
An ansvvere to MaSTER CARTVVRIGHT HIS LETTER FOR IOYNING with the English Churches whereunto the true copie of his sayde letter is annexed Ye are deceiued not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God Matth. 22. 29. Search the Scriptures for in them ye thinke to haue eternall life and they are they which testifie of me Iohn 5. 39. Let euery one that calleth on the Name of Christ depart from iniquitie 2 Tim. 2. 19. And these things that I say vnto you I say vnto all men watch Marke 13. 37. Imprinted at LONDON TO THE CHRISTIAN READER GRACE AND PEACE from God the Father and from the Lord Iesus Christ c. DEARELY beloued in the truth you haue in this booke an answere to an answere written vnto Master Harrison at Middleborough by Master Cartwright vpon occasion of controuersie betweene them concerning the true spouse of Christ or his ordinarie visible Churches in Englande And it is thought good to put this aunswere before the saide aunswere of Master Cartwright And although the godlywise and such as haue onely the glorie of God before their eyes and his pure Religion and seruice together with the saluation of their brethren will easily perceiue the reasons and causes yet least anye might take offence in this offence in this behalfe it is though meete to shewe some The first reason therefore is this Our corrupt nature is more prone and readie to imbrace the errour of man then the trueth of God Another cause was for that our vntowardenesse is so great that if an vntrueth be once receiued it worketh such a preiudice in the heades and mindes of men that they will heare neither God his worde neither reason or argument to the contrary be it neuer so good and effectuall A thirde cause mooued to place this answere first for that it shoulde bee an occasion vnto the Reader to vse more diligent conferring of this aunswere with the other for the better discerning and finding out of the trueth in this controuersie It is not necessarie that any man interpose his iudgement at this tyme but to attende by prayer the good euent which God will giue for the further manifestation of his trueth and abolishing of the contrary Nowe these fewe lynes are thought in this matter sufficient least it might seeme to foreiudge any trueth in either of these answeres or else by accepting of persons to foster corruption or a lye in any thing set foorth in the Name of the Lorde It is expedient therefore that the scriptures be faithfull searched by the godly Reader to see whether these thinges be euen so or not For no man that feareth God is ignorant of the doctrine of our Sauiour christ that whosoeuer breaketh the least of the commaundements of God and teacheth men so is least in the kingdom of heauen Neither ye● of this generall vniuersal doctrine of god his word true repentance vnfeined faith with amendment of life to be necessarie vnto saluation But it is said before these fewe things suffice Therefore the faithfull Reader is to be commended to the grace of God for his further direction in this behalfe farewell deare brother in the Lord. AN ANSVVERE TO MASTER CARTWRIGHT HIS LETTER FOR ioyning with the English Churches Whereunto the true Copie of his saide Letter is annexed AS there be alwayes both friendes and enemies to the Church of God so some doe giue their handes vnto it as friendes and some being enemies will giue it their left hande of friendshihpe to turne it cleane out of the way Howe friendly Master Cartwright is to it let vs examine by this his Letter and by the grace of God let vs trie out the trueth betwixt him and vs his letter is in many mens handes and was seene abroade vnsealed and open as if he cared not who shoulde reade it wherefore I may the more boldely answere it and the rather because the matter thereof is publike and pertaining to the Church of God It came but lately to my handes and was written as they tell me more then fiue or sixe weekes agoe wherein if he and others that prouoke him sought not to take vs tardie in the trueth and to worke vs trouble we would the les●e haue regarded his letters but seeing he will needes make vs enemies to the common and ordinarie good lawes of the Realme to the Church of god in the Realme and to the peace and welfare of the common wealth Let vs answere his cauilles and for so much as we haue so small respite of time let vs shortly gather vp his vntrueths and errours and hurle them out by manifest knowen markes least any man doe beleeue them as trueth Master Cartwright doeth mooue the first question thus That the outwarde profession made by the lawes of the lande and the assemblyes of the Church helde accordingly are condened as vnlawfull this is the short saith he of M. Harrisons lōger discourse if he vse to make such shorts he is not meete to deale with short or with long Let him lappe vp his shortes in his budget and not sende them abroade in steade of our lengths or larger syse For at the first brunt he would set against vs all these enemies 1. The lawes of the lande 2. The outwarde profession by the lawes 3. The apparant Churches of Christ 4 and the lawfull assemblyes thereof First for the lawes he knewe well ynough what Lawes we meane namely certaine Popish Cannon lawes which though the Magistrates doe tollerate for a time yet the common good lawes of the lande are wholy against them Wherefore let him not deale doubly with vs as hauing our true meaning in his heart to fumble out of his mouth or to shuffle vp in his letter a contrary meaning we know that the lawes doe punish all outward grosse wickednesse or suffer it to be punished as namely Idolatrie forswearing vsurping of Lordshippe rebellion murther fleshly filthinesse theft oppression raylings grieuous slanders drunkennes c. and if there be any vice not punishable by the lawe yet the lawes doe suffer either the Church or euery housholder or gouernour to correct so it be not against lawe such as are vnder their charge So then the lawes are a wall to the Church rounde about they stande vp for it as an armed man that it may shewe it selfe openly without shame or feare For when they put downe all outwarde grosse wickednesse and will not suffer it they doe as it were scatter and driue awaye darkenesse from the Church that men may see it visible and cleare as the Sunne Likewise for the outwarde profession by the lawes Master Cartwright woulde playe at handie dandie with vs and yet not giue vs that hand which we doe choose for there is an outwarde profession after the olde Popish traditions and orders let him holde this profession in his left hande and there is a profession more syncerely by some after some better Lawes and Orders this he shoulde houlde in his