necessitated to approue of all the acts conclusions they make but may dislike them if I see they are not as they ought to be The Corinthians for ought I can see resorted unto the Feasts of idols upon the same ground that the Treat layes downe for hearing They went not of superstition for they were to well instructed and Paul in their person brings forth an excuse for them * 1. Cor. â— 4. We know that an idol is nothing As if they should say we regard not what they have devised their publicke false-state concernes us not for we have left it We are in no Church-communion with their Officers our meaning is not to worship as they doe they intend one thing we another But did this satisfie the Apostle Not in the least For he knew their private differing intention was but a strong fruit of the flesh monstrous presumpt on and a meere delusion For their eating was not to be looked upon and judged after their secret meaning But according to that publicke state where they were And here I desire the Reader to note the difference betweene Paul and the Treat Paul makes the sinne of the Corinthians to be their resorting to an idol-state Not simply their eating for thaâ— they might have done else-where but because it was in by or from an institution of the Devil The Treat layes us downe a contrarie Doctrine and tels us a false Church-state is nothing And Antichristian Officer nothing And that we may lawfully worship God in the one and heare his Word preached by the other provided we be not in Church-communion with the Officer c. Truely the difference here is great For the Treat cleares the Corinthians of the thing for which the Apostle condemnes them But I will not presse this further now Only what Augustine * said of the learned Fathers I may speake of the Treatis in stead of him or rather above him Paul the Apostle commeth to my mind to him I runne to him I appeale from all sorts of writers that thinke otherwise For conclusion if the false state of a Church and Ministerie defile only the members thereof And as for other present worshippers they are blameles Jf this I say be a true saying theÌ„ hath he vainely confind himselfe to the Ministerie of the Church of England For his Position will serve as well to justifie hearing among Papists Arrians Sorcinians Iewes Turkes c. Yea further and to be present at any service or worship they doe For what should hinder but according to this ground a man may lawfully goe to the Temples of the Saracens and he are their Preists considering they doe deliver many materiall truths As that God is true and righteous in all his wayes a â— In Alcho ran Azoara 1. The Creator of all things b The giver of every good gyft c Azoar 14. Ad that Iesus Christ is the Sonne of Mary d Azoar 11. the Messenger of God and a true Prophet e Azoar 7. If any object but they utter many lies and blasphemies I answer the hearing simply of errours corrupts not the Hearer For so he consents not to them in judgement not practice but testifieth against them he delivers his owne soule SECT 5. THE Treatiser layes downe our next OBJECTION thus By this then it seemes a man may be present at any act of Idolatrie and doe as others doe that practice Idolatry yet not approue of it And so the three Nobles in Danial needed not to have put themselves upon such pikes of daunger as they did for not falling downe as others did in the place To this he answereth Treat 1. In preaching of the truths of the Gospell no idolatrous act is performed Answ I perceive it is an easie thing to conquest if begging may procure one that But wee are no such children as to give the cause so away 1. Therefore J say in preaching of the truths of the Gospell viz by a false Minister about which is our dispute an idolatrous act is performed And that the Reader may understand this thing the better He is to consider that divine worship is not to be determined by a particular thing howbeit in it selfe good but as all the essentiall parts belonging thereto whether they are persons or things are kept and observed The Church of Rome in Baptisme useth water and in the Sacrament of the Lords Supper gives bread and otherwhile wine too doth this cleare their administrations of idolatry So runns the Treat reasoning But wee cannot receive it for the Lord never spake so by him J thinke all men doe thinke that Vzziah a 2 Chro. 26. 16. committed an idolatrous act when he invaded the Priests Office But what made it so Tooke he unlawfull incense No. Used he strange fire No. Offered he prohibited sacrifice or upon a wrong Altar No. Where then lay the fault The Scripture tels us it pertained not to him to burne incense unto the Lord but to the Sonnes of Aaron b Ver. 18. To apply this if his act were idolatrous because he wanted a calling howbeit observed many truths of the Law By the same reason the church-Church-acts of Antichristian Ministers are idolatrous Yea as for the truths which they preach this clears their acts no more from idolatry then Vzziahs true incense and Altar quitted him from transgression It is truely said of one c Lavaret in Josh 22. Hom 61. pag 7. We ought not to conclude of an action that it is good because it hath in it some thing which in it selfe is so And this is true as in divine things so in humane too For it is a knowne Tenent of Philosophers d Omne totum suis partibus ordinatur mensuretur determinatur the vvhole is composed measured and determined of all the parts Vnto the constitution of the whole according to Aristotlec is required 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 2. As Iob f Iob. 24.4 saith vvho can bring a cleane thing out of an uncleane Not one The false Office by our Oppositâ—es is acknowledged to be uncleane Now to deny that their Ministeriall acts are not from thence is against common sence And this further may be amplyfied by that passage in the Prophet g Hag. 2. 12 13. See Iunius on the place where it is shewed that holy things are polluted by touching things uncleane e Arist 12. Met. 3 Lib. de Poet. cap. 7. 3. If in preaching the truth according to the point in question no idolatrous act is performed Then it will follow that a man may remaine a Minister of a false Church all his life time Provided he only teach * Note that such whom they call Lecturers in some places only preach and doe nothing else As I my selfe for some yeares stood soÌ„ the truths of the Gospell Our reason is for in this if he doe no idolatrous act then he sinneth not so Consequently no just cause of
28. P. Piâ—s the second u Abbaâ— Vespersâ—nâ—is p. 443. and Others In conclusion then seeing the hearing of vnlawfull Ministers is flat against scripture articles as we haâ—e partly manifested and God willing more will doe we â— must 〈◊〉 as Ierome x in Mat. 23 speakes it though it should in the meane time be iustified and practised by many Churches and people The second thing which he desires may be noted is that this hearing was not in the iudgement of the Church esteemed as a thinge that might not be borne with all Answ 1 The doctrine of the Nicolaitans which was a Trenan l. 1 27. Epiphanc 1. Tom. 1. Eâ—â—â—â— 3. 29. that adulterie and fornication were no sinnes and that men might communicate with the sacrifices of Idolaters in their idol temples was not in the iudgment of the Churches at Pergamos and Thyatira esteemed as a thing that might not be borne withall was the same therfore good indeed such a conclusion we must either here gather from his wordes or conclude he knew not well what he wrote 2. To the iudgement of that Church when they wrote to London I may oppose their former and better iudgment ffor with reverence to the Phrase from the beginning this was not soe ffor in their constitution and many yeares after they held * Remember therfore from vvhâ—nce thou art fallen and repent and doe the first vvorkes Reu. 2. 5. hearing of vnlawfull Ministers a very vnlawful practise And so much appeares in sundry passages Published to the world by the Pastor himselfe And for the Readers better satisfaction I thinke it not amisse to sert downe their Owne words Those b Munumission to a manuduction pag. 5. who partake in the worke of Preaching of one sent by the Bp DOE PARTAKE IN WHAT LYETH JN THEM IN THE AVTHORITY OF THE SENDER Againe The authorite of Ministers in their Parishionall Churches c Page 4. may not be by Gods people partaken with no not in actions otherwise Lawfull vnder the paines of Babilons Plagues Againe in another booke d Religious Communion pag. 20. thus they write Let all them that feare God consider that when they come to worship in the Parish Assemblyes they joyne themselues where God hath not joyned them and doe acknowledge that societie for the Church of God and communion of saints which he hath not sanctifyed for that purpose and in saying ourfather with them they acknowledge them for the children of God who in the perswation of their consciences are of their father the divel And in the same booke a little after e pag. 32. Their very administrations by vnlawfull calling are the sinnes and so to PARTAKE WITH THEM IN THEIR ADMINISTRATIONS IS TO PARTAKE WITH THEM IN THEIR SINNES contrary to Timot. 5. 22. Reu. 14. 4. In their answere to Maister Barnerds booke thus they write largesie of this point f Justification of Separat pag. 78. 79. 80. â—e also page 17. 162. 276. 433. Some of which is as followeth But the thing which most grieves Mr. B and at which he hath greatest indignation Pap. 62. is that we will not heare his sermons though he preach nothing but the true word of God And so he desires to heare of vs where the hearing of the true word of God onely preached is sinn and forbidden by Christ or the Prophets or Apostles For answer hereof I would know first whether Mr. B. speaking here and in many other places of the true Word of God do means that God hath a true word and a false word or rather bewray not an accusing conscience that they in England have not the true word truely taught that is in a true office of Ministery Now for the demaund referring the reader for more full satisfaction to that which hath bene published at large by others I do answer that as it was vnlawfull to * Nâ—mb 16. 2. Câ— 26. 1 King 12. communicate with Corah or with vzziah though they offered true sacrifices so IS IT VNLAWFVL TO COMMVNICATE WITH ADEVISED MINSTERY WHAT TRVTH SOEVER IS TAVGHT IN IT Secondly the Lord hath promised no blessing to his word but in his owe ordinance though by his superaboundand mercy he oft tymes vouchsafe that which no man can chalendg by any ordinary promise Thirdly * no man may partake in other mens sinns â—â—m 5. 12. but euery Ministery eyther devised or vsurped is the sinn of him which exerciseth it Rev. 18. 4. And as no good subject would assist or communicate with any person in the administration of civil Justice to the Kings subjects no not though he administred the same never so equally and indifferrently except the same person had commission from the King so to do so neyther ought the subjects of the kingdome of Christ to partake with any person whomsoever in the dispensation of any spirituall thing though in it self never so holy withot sufficient warrant and commission from the most absolute and sovereigne King of his Church Christ Iesus And where Mr. B. speaks of hearing the true word of God only preached he intimates therin that if we would heare him preach it would satisfy him well and so teacheth vs with himselfe and others to make a schisme in the Church in vsing one ordinance and not an other It is all one whether a man communicate with the minister in his pulpit or with the Chauncelor in his consistory both of them minister by the same power of the Bishop The Chauncelor may iudge justly who knowes whither or no the Minister will teach truely And if he doe not but speak the vision of his owne heart what remedy hath the Church or what can they that hear him do May they rebuke him openly according to his sin and so bring him to repentance or must they not beare his errors yea his heresyes also during the pleasure of the Bishops even their Lord his And would you Mr. B. be content your people should heare a masse-Priest or Jesuite though he professed as loud as you do that he would teach the true word of God And think not scorne of the match for you haue the selfe same office with a masse Preist though refyned If he be ordayned by a Bishop though it be the Bishop of Rome he may minister in any Church of England by vertue of that ordination Andbesides masse-Preists preach some and those the mayne truthes and the Ministers in England neither do nor dare preach all no nor some which it may be the others do Is it not better then for the servants of the L. Iesus to exercise and aedify themselves according to the model of grace receaved though in weaker measure then to be so simple as to come to your feasts though you cry never so loud vnto them thinking that because your stoln waters are sweet and your hidden bread pleasant that they have no power to passe by but must needs become your guests And here
indiget explicationibus ambagibus sed iniusta causa cum per se sit morbida necessario indiget astutis pharmacis Euripid. The truth is simple and plaine and needeth is not variety of windlaces and feâ—chings of matter about the bush But an evill cause in that it is sick and deseased hath need to have a cunning plaster set unto it Another r Aristo of them hath these words That phrase and forme of speaking hath truth in it which is common and used of all having in it nothing craftily devised neither cloking some other thing then is professed Contrariwise when Satan speaketh by his instruments he speaketh so ambiguously and clokedly as fitly that of Apollos Oracle may be applied to it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 * Quod ambiguis ambagibus respoÌ„sa consulentibus daret For one knowes not how to take it nor which way to apply it Pertinently to this purpose writes Sibelius s Desacrific Abra. p. 56 57. Humaine Doctrines are various and ambiguous wrapped and foalded with abstruse labrynths of opinions whereby peoples minds are so troubled and tyred that they cannot plainly open themselves neither have any quietnes or come to their desired end But the Doctrine of God is right that is plaine and perspicuous not wrapped with un-even and crooked suttleries and delusions of Sophistrie neither leads us into by-pathes and errours but bringeth peace to the conscience ad removeth à ll scruples and doubts So he Sadeel t Opera Theol Pref. de Meth. Theol. disput Error 3. p. 8. writing of deceivers the sundry wayes they use to beguile the simple Notes them to be men affecting darke sayings and seeking by mists and fogges of strange unfamiliar arguments to blind their spirituall eyes and puzzle their understandings And this is no late devise For Augustine in his Booke of Heresies maketh mention of the Hereticks Marcitae so named of one Marcus And touching them thus I find it written v Obscurissime quibusdaÌ„ verborum tanquam misteriorum in volueris utentes loquebantur de Deo ut stupereÌ„t audientes homines potius quaÌ„ intelligerent They did speake darkly and used such a wrapping kind of words that the hearers were rather astonied with the strangnes of the words then edified with any understanding they had of the meaning thereof The thing being thus the Reader hence as by a light may gready helpe himselfe to discerne on whose side the truth is in the difference between us Our dispute is about Church-hearing We say that Christians are bound to performe this service unto God in true constituted Churches There we say must men heare the whole Counsell of God taught unto them either by lawfull Ministers or by Brethren out of office For confirmation hereof we can produce many divine precepts Also the Example and practice of our forefathers from the first age of the word hitherto Besides this is a Position so certaine and cleare as it is holden in all Schooles written continually in Bookes preached every day in Sermons taught in all Churches So that haec Momo ipsi satisfaciant no body can speake against it Danaeus in August haer Our Opposites howbeit they grant us this yet affirme that in false Churches Antichristian Ministers may be heard also * Pag. 3. And this is not only they say lawfull but in some cases necessary for all of all Sects and sorts of Christians having opportunity and occasion of so doing This indeed they say But how prove they it to be true Not by any law of God taken out of the old or new Testament For that they cannot doe Not by any holy mans Example for they know there is none extant Not by any sound consequence rightly drawne from the Scripture for quid si Caelum ruat x Teren. in Heautont that is impossible VVhat doe they then as Ieremy y Ier. 2 13. sayth they forsake the fountaine of living waters and hew them out cesternes broken cèsternes that can hold no waters They devise certaine obstruse darke and ambiguous phrases and distinctions As of naturall hearing in a Church and of a hearing wherein there is Communion Of some Churches false in respect of order Others in respect of fayth and order of hearing false Ministers not quatenus as they are false Ministers or their Ministers but as men gyfeed and the Bishops Ministers of certaine effects which followes mens teaching c. Thus their proofes are only their bare and bould affirmation For leaving the Scriptures they use Paralogismes fond cavils and false arguments The which course not only shewes an il case but also manifesteth that the embracers thereof are either ignorant people who cannot judge of things that differ or some that have some mens persons in admiration Or such as are unwilling to suffer affliction with the people of God I could here mention some other devises in this kind as an implicit Church-covenant A true outward calling which some have to the Ministery from their Congregation but secret and unknowne either to the Minister or the people But I will at this time abstaine from such by-controversies and the rather because I shall have a firt occasion to speake hereafter of it Namely when the Vndertakers have finished their answer to my former Booke and Mr. Davenport published his many things that he hath to say against it For so much he insinuateth in his Treatise betweene him and Mr. Pagit * Pag. 282 283. 2. Observe againe to what grosse absurdities his argument leadeth For unles it be only wind and vanitie these sweet collections must needs follow 1. No Minister comming newly to his place is to be heard 2. Before any are inquirie must be made whether they ordinarily begit men to the faith 3. If after triall it be found that they doe not so then they must not be heard what true Doctrines soever they teach Is not this workman-like done say Reader hath not the Pist omne tulit punctum made the way cleare now for the hearing of false Ministers Truely I thinke except a man be partiall in the point And of his mind who said z Non persuade bis eâ—i imsi persuaseris Though you doe convince me yet I will not be convinced He must acknowledge that he hath made it doubt fuller then ever it was and such as were not well satisfied formerly in the thing have enought here from his owne pen to put them quite and wholy off SECTION 5. THe Pist having done with his Logick comes in the next place to charge his Opposites with contradiction absurdity and speaking little better then Blasphemy A great fault if true But how doth he prove it They say it is not the Word of God as it is preached in Antichristian Assemblies Answ The Publish had done well if he had published out assertion de manu in manum truely and faithfully But seeing he hath not done so I will here lay it downe
hence learne and settle in our hearts with what severitie the Lord challengeth and defendeth his authoritie in laying downe the way and manner of his worship not leaâ—ing it to any creature to meddle with but according to praescription and appointment from him Content he is that men shall make Lawes for humaine matters c. But for his divine worship he will prascribe it himselfe and what he appointeth that must be done and that only or else Nadah and Abihu their punishment exspected that is Gods wrath exspected in such manner as he shall please And this he learned of Calvin g Alium ignom sacris adhiberi vetuit Deus ut adventities omnes ritus excluderet ac doceret se detestari quic quid aliuÌ„de profectum erat discamus ergo sic attendere ad Dei mandatum ne eius cultum ullis extraneis Commentin vitiemus who upon the Place saith God forbad other Fyre c. to be used that he might exclude all inventious rites and teach that he detested whatsoever was come from else-where Let us therefore learne so to attend to the Commaundement of God that we defile not his worship with any far fetched devises Iunius h Peccatum in eo fuisse qâ—od in ratione divini cultus non attenderint ad mandatum Dei c. Anal in loc mentioning their sinne sayth It was in that they kept not Gods Commaundement in the matter of his worship And a little after They should not have added of their owne any thing thereto Piscator i Cultum Dei extenâ—â—um praecise ex Dei praescriptum exercendum esse itaque non habet hic locum bena hominum intentio from the place rayseth this observation The outward worship of God must be strictly done according to his Commaundement A good intention therefore hath here no place Mr. Attorsall also in his Commentarie upon Numb 3. 4. doth largely declare out of this Example how God disliketh and disclameth mens devises in his service as trash trumpery and meere dotage So Beda Bruno Brentius Pelargus Chytraeus Sarcerius Sâ—rigelius Aretius Borrhaeus and other interpret the place And whereas he applyeth it to false Doctrine taught by one that hath his outward calling true He may say in the words of that boasting City k I am and there is none besides me For this is his owne devise and it must live and die with them The place beeing thus understood Let us now see if the same may not be ab uno de grammate fithe applyed against this practice of Hearing From the place then I doe thus reason All will worship and superstition is sinne To heare Antichristian Ministers in their unlawfull assemblies is superstition and will-worship Therefore it is sinne to doe it The first Proposition is grounded upon the fore-mentioned example Levit. 10. 1. 2. and the same is without exception The second Proposition is thus proved 1. Lib. 1. vit ex cult oppose Col. 501. 502. From the nature of superstition which is as Zanchy describes it a taking into the worship of God more then he requires in his worship Hence superstition as some derive the word is that which is done supra statutum And in this respect the hearing in question is superstition as beeing used in Gods worship upon no other ground but mans devise 2. According to the Schoolemen m Vel cui non debet vel non eâ— modo quo debet that is Superstition when divine worship is not exhibited either to the person it should be or not in the way and manner as it ought And this is held to be a sound truth by all Orthodoxal Writers Now Aquin. 2. 20. q. 92. Art 1. howsoever the Hearers of False Ministers doe exhibit worship to God yet it is not in the manner and way that they should worship him And this is cleare by the Treatisers owne confession For he confesseth that the hearing which he pleads for n Pag. 37 is no particular ordinance left by Christ. Againe he saith It were to be wished that no Church Ministerie were to be found which is not approveable by the Word of God notwithstanding any good act performed by them that posses it If I am not deceived in these words he destroyes what he built before Is this hearing no ordinance left us by Christ Is the controverted Ministerie so evil a thing as that every good Christian is to pray for its rooting up How then can it be both lawfull and in cases necessary for all Sects and sorts of people to pertake with it If this be not ex diametro crosse worke and grosse contradiction I know not what is 3. This hearing cannot be free of superstition in regard men are present at false worship The which presence as the Learned write o Praesentia est communicatio quaedam in cultu Slater Epist 1. ad Corinth c. 10. is a certaine communion therewith 4. It is great superstition to approve countenance or give honour to any of the wayes of Antichrist They that are sincere Christians saith p in Censura cap. 9. fol. 471. Bucer cannot abide any thing that is his The least shew saith Vigandus q Syneps Antichrist to please either him or his followers is will worship Of this judgement were Iunius r Jn Hos 2. 16. Musculus s Loc. com de â—radit p. 421. 422. Beza t Tract theol vol. 3. pa. 210. Mollerus u In Ps 16 Zepperus x de Polit. p. 72. Sadeel y Contr. Monachos p. 70. and others Now me thinkes there should not be a man so voyd of reason as to say that a Minister of Antichrist as he is preaching by vertue of his Masters commission and under his seale and authority may even then be heard and yet no honour no approbation no countenance nor any shew thereof be given unto Antichrist therein 5. It is vitious and superstitious to simbolize with idolaters The Scriptures * Levit. 18 3. Deu. 12. 30. Exo. 23. 24. 2 Chro. 13 9. Levit. 19. 27. 28 forbidd it And the Saints in all ages have carefully shund it as we shall shew in another place But this Hearing is no other For idolaters in this are imitated in sundry acts of their idolatrie In so much as Papists and Atheists too may well twitt our balters in the words of the Samaritane woman how is it that thou beeing a Christian joynest thy selfe to us Antichristians Is it not strange that thou who professest our Church to be false our Ministerie unlawfull our Church-government Popish shouldest yet come to us and pertake in our administrations Surely this argueth that either thou understandest not the practice which thy grounds lead thee too or else for some by respect refusest to walke accordingly to them 6. Superstition is committed when more estimation is had of a thing more dignitie and excellency placed in it and more regard had to it then God alloweth
well that doe it For if the Temple made with hands defiled through idolatrie was odious unto God how much more will he loth our Spirituall Temples not made with hands if we suffer them to be polluted with filthy superstition But so absolutely we shall doe if we doe the thing which the Treat here contends for A good man saith Ambrose m Lib 5. Epist 30. will be earnest and Zealous against idolatry Another saith n Bradshavv on 2 Thes 2 p. 130. The better a man is the more carefull will he be to withdraw himselfe from it These witnesses are true Fourthly there are some to be found so sowred with modines and discontentment Treat as they become unsociable If they see nothing lamentable they are ready to lament If they reade any Bookes they are onely invectives specially against publicke Saâ—es and Governours Ansvv 1. As to be unsociable is inhumaine and brutish so to be carelesse with whome we joyne in communion is sinfull and vicious A traviler were better goe alone then have one in his company that should rob him and cut his throat 2. This is not an age which wants cause of just lamentation considering not onely the evils without but what perverse things are brought into the Churches of God whereby poore people are dayly deceived 3. That we should looke into publicke States and Governours there is reason for it and specially if the same be Ecclesiasticall for else how can we walke as men of knowledge and hold fast onely that which is good Lastly Treat some thinke to cover their owne both grosser and more proper and personall corruptions under a furious march not onely against the faylings but the persons also failing of infirmity in matter of Church-order and Ordinances Ansvv I suppose by Church-ordinances and Order he meanes the Ministerie Worship and Government under Antichrist Now that some of ignorance submit to these things there is nothing more certaine notwithstanding this gives not allowance to others others knowing better to doe so too If there failing be of infirmity there is the more hope of their reformation I meane when they shall heare the truth taught and see the Teachers walke closely in it In conclusion the Treat pleas the Rhetorician and makes a shew as if he could say more but he will spare his opposites Ansvv As for his minsing figure of extenuation to let much passe I like it not For he doth here no otherwise then if a Theese when he hath stript a man out of all that he hath would faine yet be counted mercifull in that he doth not murder him or bind him as some others have done Let any indifferent man read his writing and he will say the Treat hath not spared his opposites but short at them arrowes of bitter words and made them as odious and vile as a man can doe But blessed is he that is not offended at the truth for such things SECT 2. THE Objections undertaken to be answered by the Treatiser are as he layes them downe of two sorts Some of them are framed upon supposition that the Ministers in that Church are in themselves Lawfull and of God But yet not to be heard by reason of the abuses evils to be found in their administrations Others with-draw herein and those the more upon the contrarie supposition to wit that the very order and constitution of that Church and Ministery is papall and unlawfull Ansvv For the first I have nothing to say to it It beeing a point beside our present dispute Againe for my part I am of his minde in the thing that is to use his owne expression Supposing a Church and the Ministerie thereof essentially lawfull it cannot but be lawfull for the members of other Churches in generall union and association with it to communicate therewith in things lawfull and lawfully done seeing the end of union is communion God hath in vaine united persons and states together But he who would have us receave the weake in faith whom God hath receaved would not have us refuse the fallowship of Churches in that which is good for any weaknes in them of one sort or other And this we have so plainly and plentifully commended unto us both by the Prophets yea by Christ himselfe in the Iewish Church and Apostles and Apostolicall men in the first Christian Churches In which many errours and evils of all kindes were more then manifest and the same ofttimes both so farre spread and deeply rooted as the reforming of them was rather to be wished then hoped for as that no place is left for doubting in that case by any who desire to follow their holy steps in faith towards God and charitie towards men and effectuall desire of their owne edification What he here writes is surely true for the Scriptures approve not of rending away from true Churches for any corruption I use the word any because so long as we acknowledge the Church to be true whatsoever her sinnes are a separation from all communion with it is utterly unlawfull Our godly Predicessours had in them the zeale of God and love of his truth * Two things I would know of these meÌ„ 1. Whether they thinke not that the primitive Christians were as zealous and sincere as themselves 2. Whether they thinke not that the Churches from vvhome they separate have as fevv if not fevver corruptions then such Churches had in vvhich the Apostles and other godly people dayly communicated But how shewed they it Not by forsaking their Brethren for offences but in witnessing against them and seeking their reformation But now ah that I could not say it some men know not how their zeale like Iehues may be seene of men unlesse they make publick Schismes in Churches and this many times not for any sinne that they can justly prove the Church to be in but upon discontentment and because they cannot have their way and will But of this no more now For I purpose if God spare my life to set forth a Treatise touching this very point The Treatiser in pag. 23 Treat would have us consider distinctly of Religious actions according to the severall Rankes in which they may rightly orderly be sett And how we should conceive of them a little after he tels us thus Some such actions are Religious only as they are performed by Religious persons And of this sort is Hearing and so Reading of Gods Word The Scriptures teach and all confesse that Hearing of the Word of God goes before Faith for Faith comes by Hearing as by an outward meanes Hearing then beeing before Faith and Faith before all other acts of Religion inward or outward it must needs follow that Hearing is not simply or of it selfe a worke of Religion and so not of Religious Communion Answ That the Reader may the better perceive how greatly the Treat was deceived in this matter of Hearing as to thinke it not to be of Religious Communion
have proved before that howsoever a man stand not in spirituall and politicall church communion with a Church and ministery thereof yet he is there a participant or communicant in and with the ordinances as with the doctrines taught so with the state of the Teacher For the better clearing of this Let vs in few words consider a Church state Ministery and administrations make vp as I may so say the body of divine worship Now it is a knowne Maxime quidquid est pars partis est etiam pars tâ—tius The hand is a part of the body the finger a part of the hand he therefore that holds either my hand or finger toucheth my body So in iust proportion hee that toucheth any part or member of the spiritual politicall body hee toucheth the body or state bee the same true or false if true his communion is lawfull if false he toucheth an uncheane thing and â—oâ— sinneth against that precept in 1. Cor. 6. 17. To end this Section howsoever hearing of the word of God lies in common for all for the good of all Yet hath God appointed away and order vnto all how to heare it Food and rayment lies in common to all for the good of all What of this shall wee hence conclude it is noe matter by what meanes or course men have it indeed so he reasoneth or else Oleum et operam perdidit he speaketh neither for himselfe nor against vs. Mr. Baines f Diocesen triall p. 7. writes well no people can worship God in repairing to any Church or ministery without warrant of his word Let the reader note it SECT 3. THe Treatiser for this opposities hath framed 16 objections the which as himselfe saith * Pag. 13. he hath either heard from others or could conceiue of himselfe ooulerably against the practice by him propounded The first is laid downe thus No man may submit his conscience to be wrought vpon Object 1. by an unlawfull and antichristian ministery neither hath God promised or doth afford †These vvords in a different letter are the Treat ovvne and vve disclaime them any blessing upon it neither can any have the sanctified vse thereof His answere hereto is this The office of the ministery workes not vpon the conscience of the hearer properly the office gives onely power and charge to the Teacher to teach in such aplace it resides in the person of the officer alone the communion lawful or unlawfull which any hath with it is in regard of the lawfull or unlawfull relation and vnion foregoing between the persons and not in any working of the office vpon the conscience of any God may and doth blesse the truths taught fauls ministers Answ It was Heiroms k Paulum quotiescunque lego videor mihi non verba audire sed tonitrua cont Iovinian censure of Pauls Epistles that when hee read them He thought he heard not words but Thunder This cannot be well applied to his reply here For should I speake my conscience it is a meere Phrasiologie words without weight of reason 1. He denies our first assertion But how cleares he it to the contrarie As is his ground so are his proofes Only bare saying Sit pro ratione voluntas That the Office of the Minister workes upon the Hearers conscience It is certaine and not to be denyed without losse of credit both to the person and cause of the denyer in the eye of all reasonable men l Exo. 28. For this is evident by the Scriptures whether we respect an Office true or false Ephes 4 11. 2 Thes 2 Rev. 9. Againe if it be considered what we meane by the Office working upon the conscience Common reason will prove it too Our meaning is that the state or povver by which he administers is herein submitted too As Magistrates are obeyed in civill Justice because of their calling and were it not for it men could not for conscience sake receive their administrations So the conscience of a Hearer is brought in subjection to the ordinance of Hearing even for the Office sake of him that teacheth We intend here Ministeriall teaching It is most certaine saith one m Mr. Peitry of the Ministery of the Church of England Pag. 37. 38. Satan ruleth in the consciences of men not only by false doctrine but also by his false power and ordinances His Kingdome of darknes not only consisteth in the lies and false doctrine and worship which he hath coyned but also in the false and Antichristian Ordinances which he hath invented for the ruling of his Idolatrous denne And therefore the Children and Saints of God ought to avoyd both the one and the other So hee 2. It is not true that the Office only gives power and charge to the Teacher to teach in such or such a Church-state For properly it respects not that at all but rather the Office of the person gives him power to preach pray administer the Sacraments c. according to their Order and Canons He that that hath not a Church-state to preach in yet beeing ordained Preist hath power by his Office to doe the worke of a Preist any where And so much the Treat n Manumis to a Manuduct p. 70. in another Booke acknowledgeth The Office is the very state and function conferred upon a man by his calling from which Office ariseth immediate * Note this power and charge to administer and to performe the works of that Office In the performance of which workes the Office is executed power used And whereas he mentioneth here the truths they teach J grant these are from God but the Office which gives them power and charge to speake them is from Antichrist And a speciall Character or Marke as the Learned o Mr. Symon on the Rev. pag. 120. write of the Beast Thus said Iohn Chaydon p Acts and Monuments Edict 5. pag. 588. a Martyr of Christ The Bishops license to preach the Word of God is the true Character of the Beast that is of Antichrist The like Mr. Bale q On Revel chap. 14. 9. and others 3. Whereas he saith the false Office resides in the person of the Officer alone Here I might take that exception of the Law r In testimon dig de testibus against him They who wander against the credis of their owne Testimonies are not to be heard Against this we have his owne testimony For thus he saith s Manumiss to a manuduct pag. 5. those that pertake in the worke of preaching of one sent by the Bishops doe pertake in what lyeth in them in the authority of the sender And this is so indeed The sinfull Office of the Teacher becomes his sinne who practiseth will-worship with him For hereby hee enwraps himselfe into the guilt of the Office And this thing by another is so clearely proved t Treatise of the Ministery of the church of EnglaÌ„d by Fran Iohnson Pag. 5 6 7
c. as no man can deny it that hath any light of reason or Religion shining in him 4. What can be vainer said our enimies themselves beeing Iudges then to say God may and doth blesse the truths taught by false Ministers A posse ad esse nâ—n valet consequentia To reason thus is both against Logick and Divinitie To dispute saith King Iames u A speech in Parliament anno 1609. what God may doe is blasphemy but quid vult Deus that divines may Lawfully and doe ordinarily dispute and discourse It never came into our hearts to thinke that God may not blesse the Truths taught by false Ministers But this we hold he hath not in his Word promised any blessing unto it And in this Luther is with us God blesseth not saith he x CoÌ„ment in Galat. cap. 1. pag. 42. meaning by any ordinary promise their labour who are not lawfully called to the Ministery The injunction y Injunction 3. of Q. Elizabeth set forth by publick authority is much to this purpose Workes devised by mans fancie so is every unlawfull Ministerie and condemned as Cartwright z Christ Cateâ—h of Râ—lig chap. 16. Pag. 98 saith in the second commandement have not only no promise of reward for doing of them but contrariwise great threatnings maledictions of God The Treatiser a Iustificat of Separ pag. 79. was of this opinion too when he said The Lord hath promised no blessing to his Word but in his owne Ordinance though by his super abundant merey he oft-times vouchsafe that which no man can chalenge by any ordinarie promise And because the Treat is here so breife a touch and away As if our Objection had no weaght I will therefore lay the argument downe in this manner Such Churches unto whome God hath made no promise in his Word to blesse the things there done ought not by Gods people to be resorted to But God in his Word hath made no promise to blesse the things done in a false Church Therefore Gods people are not to goe unto false Churches The Proposition cannot be excepted against For 1. The Scriptures prove it clearely * Ier. 23 21 22. Againe there is no duty charged upon us Ex. 20 24 but there is a blessing promised Psa 134 3 147 13. unto the due performance of it The assumption is as cleare and thus we prove it If false Churches have not the promise of Gods presence they cannot from the Word of God exspect his blessing upon what they doe But the first is true Ergo the second The Major which is only controversall wee prove thus If every false Church be an Idoll b Exo. 20. 45. and God require his people to come out thence c Rev. 18 4. threaten to destroy it d Rev. 20. 8 9. and will doe it and promise his presence unto the true Church e Mat. 18. 20. Then is he not present * We mean such a presence of God as by his Word we can be sure of it in the false But the first is true therefore the second Here I might name sundry learned Men who give witnes to this thing Christ saith Raynolds f De Rom. Eccles idolat l. 2. c. 1. pag. 99. the Pastor of his Chruch doth tell us that he feeds not in Antichristian assemblies in the denne of Theeves neither is it his will that his flock should there rest at noone But in the pleasant pasture by the still waters that is in the shadowes of the true Christian Churches detesting idolatry Another thus They that doe usurpe Ministeriall function in the Church g Dr. Slater on Rom. 1. Pag. 8. cannot exspect Gods blessing on their labour Doctor Ames layes it downe as a reason why a lawfull calling is necessary namely that so they may exspect a blessing from God It is true which these men say for our ground for Hearing in church way is not because the speaker is a man gifted able to open and apply the scriptures c But because that which he doth is a a divine institution an ordinance charged on vs to practice to which God hath promised his presence and blessing Let our opposites shew vs where it is writen that the gyfts and personall graces of the man is sufficient to iustifie the hearing of him * We intend Ministeriall teaching a Chap. 23 2. but rather the reason wherefore we he are him is because of the lawfull calling which he hath to administer the holy things of God Our Saviour as it appeares by Matthew approves of the hearing of the Scribes and Pharisees But upon what ground not because they were able to open and apply the doctrines of Faith by that Church professed but as Piscator saith because they were called and ordained of God Adeo vocati at que constituti suâ—t vt legem Mosis in Synagogis populo praelegant cumque ad 〈◊〉 observationem exhâ—â—tentur Analis in Mat. 23 v. 2. that they should preach the Law of God in the Sinagogues to the people and exhort them to the observation thereof-Aretius on the place saith the like and adds their calling bound the people to heare them Soe then here wee see that men being lawfully called to the ministery are to be heard howsoever in some qualifications defective but that such who have taken on a false office are to be heard thâ—s I deny and ever shall doe vntill they shew me some divine precept for it as wee have for the other which is Tantah horto fructus colligere a thing that they can never doe For his phrase Balaam-like to curse I passe it by onely I thinke good to put our opposites in mind of that which is writen in Iâ—sh 6. 26. Cursed be the man before the Lord that raiseth vp and buildeth the city lericho J am sure God of old-hath devoted Babilon to destructioÌ„ let men therefore see to it that they bring not themselves vnder a greater curse by using their pens and tongues to rise vp againe one part of the Kingdome of the beast which the Lord before had consumed with the spirit of his mouth SECT 4. THE Treatiser frames our second objection in this manner To heare such a minister is to honour approve and vphold his office of ministery Object In confutation of this thus he saith If this hee simply true then when the heathenish Athenians heard Paul preach Treat or when an unbeleever comes into the Church assembly an a heares the preacher he approues honours and vphold the office of the ministery Ansvv The virgins in Cypryans time granted they walked with young men talked with them went led with them but when they came to the act they absteyned The Treat writings here and in all the rest of his Booke is much to the same purpose He grants that men may walke to the Harlots House * But the Word of God forbids it Pro 5
he layes downe for hearing to wit that there is no Religious Communion betweene the persons preaching and hearing They cannot be chalenged to approve of the Ministers state or standing They have no communion with the office of the Ministery c. I say were these things so which are not yet would this practice be found sinfull because as we have before shewed herein men worshipp God in or by a way and meanes which idolaters have instituted Our second argument is taken from the Treat words following which are these Treat I professe I heare them as Ministers of the Bb. sending and of the Parishes sent 〈◊〉 Hence I argue thus He that heares the Ministers of the Bb. sending and of the Parishes sent too hee heares in the sence of the Scriptures false Prophets But it is not lawfull to heare false Prophets Therefore it is not lawfull to heare the Ministers of the Bb sending or of the Parishes sent too The Major is proved clearely in the defence of our 12. Objection The Minor is certaine by these reasons 1. The hearing of false Prophets is forbidden in the Word of God a Ex. 20. 5. Pro. 5. 8. Mat. 7 15. Philip. 3. 2. 1. Timot. 5. 22. 2. The practice of it is will-worshipp b Joh. 4. 23. Rom. 12. 1. 2. Mat. 15. 9 Col. 2. 23 the which is vnacceptable to God 3. It is to rebel against the Lord and to seeke what is in man to uphold that thing which the Lord will cast downe and consume c Num. 16. 2 Thes 2. 10. 11. Rev. 18. 1. 2. 1 Sam. 15. 22. 4. This is to embrace the bosome of a stranger so to coÌ„mitt spirituall whoredome against the Lord d Pro. 5. 20. Psal 106. 39. 5. It defileth the name of God e Ezech. 43. 7. 8. 6. This is to hold conformitie with idolaters and to be like them The which thing ought not to be f Levit. 18. 3. and 19. 19. 27. 28. Exo. 23. 24. Deu. 12. 30. 32. 7. It shewes that a man is not one of Christ sheepe but carnall and unconverted g Ioh. 10. 4. Esa 30. 22 27. 9. 8. It manifesteth great want of the love and zeale of God h 2 King 23. 4. Rev. 2. 3. 4. Psal 119. 128. Ioh. 2. 16. 9. It is to serve Satan and Anti-Christ as it is written His servants ye are vvhome ye obey i 2 Chro. 11 14. Rev. 9. 20. 10. It defiles the soule k Eze. 20 7 Lastly the doer hereby is exposed to the wrath of God l Re. 144. 2. Thes 2. 8 10. Thus the Treat like the Bee is drownd in his owne Honie And truely pitty it is but all pleaders for Baal were alwayes thus entangled in their owne words Rev. 14 9 Eze. 16. 54. according to that in Ovid. Non est lex iustior ulla Quam necis artifices arte periâ—e sua The Treat Lib. 2. de arte amand speakes on thus But not as my Ministers either sending Treat or sent to except I be of those Parishes or at least in Ecclesiasticall Vnion with them Answ A man bent to declyning is glad of every couler which he may pretend to justifie himâ—elâ—e in declyning It is a poore distinction which he useâ—h here to declyne the point in question For 1. what use was there to tell us He beares them not as his Ministers This well might have beene spared and something said to warrant by Scripture the hearing of them at all If a woman be accused of adultery and to excuse her selfe shall suy The adulterer is in no covenant or band with mee Is this enought to cleare her No. I have proved before that all religious performances in false Churches are idolatrous actions Now then to worship God there for excuse to say we are not in Ecclesiastical union vvith the state or Ministery I may well say lingua quo vadit it is idly spoken and much like the Fryars plea vve are exempted Lord. Againe for his distinction it is the same which Papists and others alleadge to justifie there idol-Ceremonies They say how soever these are things which Ievves Pagans did be ore them yet their end and respect in doing them is different What is said of some in answer thereunto I may here say the like To practice that thing in Gods worshipp which neither directly nor consequently is included in the word is an open breach of Gods Law bee the doers meaning this or that What jealous or wife husband if his wife should receive some love-tokens froÌ„ a knowne adulterer one that goes about to undermine her honestie would take it for a sufficient excuse if she should say I receive indeed such things from a knowne adulterer and as he is an adulterer but not wine c. The weight of the Treat distinction lies betweene meum tuum Hee proâ—esseth to reciue love-guifts from spirituall adulterers and as they are so but not his Now I maruaile how his pen could drop such poysen and he not smell the stinck of it When he wrote it I wish all men in all places to take heed that they deceave not their owne soules by such folish distinctions for if such things will not stand before sor-ry-man how then before the greate God Who is a jealous husband and a consuming fire Now let vs heare what followes in the Treat Treat By hearing and receiving there Christ meanes properly the hearkening too beleiving obeying the doctrine taught by the Apostles which many dispised vnto whome he opposeth the former that heard it Answ He that coÌ„es to the field without his weapon it is an argument he meanes to save himselfe by flying and not by fighting Whether the Treat had on any armour to fight with against this objection I will not determine but this I say and will abide by it he flyes away from the poynt and speakes nothing either for it or against it For 1. Were his distinction granted betweene hearing them as BB Ministers and not as his And againe that by receiving the Apostles Christ meanes properly hearking to and obeying their doctrines I say suppose this but I grant it not yet doth not this take a way the weight of our reason nor in truth so much as touch it I shall expect that he who comes nex to the field in the behalfe of Antichristian Ministers doe prepare a better Answer to this objection And that he may know what he hath to confute I will a litle inlarge the poynt 1. The Treat in applying hearing receiving to the doctrines of the Apostles doth not well For the first only respects their teaching the latter their persons This is evident in the Text Mat. 10. 14. whosoever shall not receiue you and heaâ—e my words c. Implying that Christ is two wayes received in the ministerie of the Gospel viz. In the person of the Teacher and in the doctrines taught by
him And thus doe out best Expositers vnderstand the place Caluine Pareus Piscator Aretius Musculus It is further to be noted where Christ sayh he that receiveth you receiveth me c. His meaning is that such as hearken to and obey the doctrines of his Ministers therein doe acknowledge his authority power kingly office over his Church to appoynt her lawes I meane in a worke of their â—ffice offices ordinances c. and also the fathers donation or the delivering up of the same into his sonnes hand To apply this As they who hearken vnto Christs ministers doe therein approue of his lawfull power over his Church of the fathers guift this way to him soe contrariwise such as hearken * to Antichrists Ministers doe therein approue of Antichrists vnlawfull power over the false Church and the devils ‡ Satan is the author of false ministries in the apostasie of the man of sin donation or his putting of that power into his eldest sons hands If any say we intend not so I answere Res ipsa aliud ostendit the actioÌ„ which they do is so quid verba audiam cum factae videam And here that saying of a learned a man is fulfulled There are some which deny that they worship Idolls T. C. Repl 1. p. 88. 204. when in the meane time their owne doings chargeth them with it Now there are too many in those daies grosly guilty this way His next words are Lavat in Iosh 22. Hom. 61. Treat The Minissters in the Parishes haue not the doctrines of the Gospel from the Bishops as they haue their offices but from God in his word Answ It was a law b Eugin Boron Iure consult l. 1. p. 120. among the Romanes that whosoever passed not into their Citty at the gates but attempted to break throw the walls or to clyme over them should be put to death The Treat in pressing the hearing of the truths of the Gospel would perswade us so we do receiue them it is no matter whether it be by order or disorder whether from the Ministers of Christ or Antichrist Whether in a true Church or in a false But this counsell we cannot take because to our knowledge ther is a divine statute in force against it therefore as we must c T. C. Repl. 1. p 155. care for the truth so must we care of whom we haue it he giues this reason d Ibid. p. 83. As God hath ordained that the truth should be preached so also hath he ordained in what order and by whom it should be preached We may not therefore adventure e Penry Exhort to the govern of Wales pag. 46. to go vnto him for those things which he hath no commission to deliver Suppose Carah or some other in that Conspirasy should haue said thus Come to us yee men of Israell and hearken to beleeve and Obey the truths taught in our Tents If you object that our Calling is anti-Mosaicall and false we answer this cannot be any barre or let in the thing seeing the doctrines we teach are from God in his law J cannot see according to the Treat arguing how in such a case they could haue staid without for if we may go into the Sinagogues of Antichrist so the Doctrines of the Gospel be there preached I would know then of our Opposites why an Israelite vpon the same ground viz. to heare the Doctrines of the law might not haue gon with them rebels into their Tents I beleeve if we come to open termes these will be found to be par pari things alike and the one as lawfull as the other both starke naught But to come more neerer to the point the thing which the Treat harpes most vpon is that they teach the truth And our opposites vse this as their speciall and main position viz. Where the truth is taught there they may lawfully heare To discover their follow herein J pray let it be minded what was said before As the hearing in question is a religious action so to haue it lawfull and good the circumstances perteyning to it must necessarily be observed of which circumstances the truth taught is only one particular It is a received maxime both in divinity and Philosophie that circumstances make actions formally good or bad so write Junius f De pol. Aquinas g 1a 2 a. q. 8. Art 3 Camerius h Praelect Tom. 2. p. 49. and Burgesse i of the lawfullnes of kneeling C. 1. confesseth they are intrinsecall and essentiall to actions and especially making up there nature Fed Morellus vpon these words of Seneca k Scho. 2. Lib. refert quid cui quando quare saith that without these circumstances of things persons time place c. facti ratio non constat Friar Ambrosius Caturinus l Counc l. 2 p. 224. following the doctrine of Thomas meanteyneth in the covnsell of Trent that to do a-good worke the concurrance of all circumstances is necessary What these circuÌ„stances or parts are is shewd in that old vers Quis quid vbi quibus auxilijs cur quomodo quando And to apply them to our point howsoever it be granted that their teaching may be without vitium rei yet in it there is vitium perfoÌ„ae loci ordinis relationis c as the. Trâ— * in aletter to D. Ames published in Brownists schis phraseth it else wher 1. The Person designed is not lawfully called now a false Office and a true worship are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they are no way compatible 2. As it respects the place that is the Idoll-Churchstate so it is to worship God there where he hath forbidden men to worship him 3. For the instruments and meanes in this men make themselues beholding to Antichrist for his order constitution manner and way to serue God in and by Now fye for shame that any should be so base as to scrape acquentance with that Babylonian whore who is the greatest enimy that the Lord hath vpon the earth Iâ— is a most certaine â—igne saith one m Estque merae proditionis certissimum indicium si quis aliqueÌ„ ex suis videat concilia claÌ„ cum hoste captantem aut in eius aurem insuâ—ure anteÌ„ of a very traitour when a man shall see one of his owne take secret counsell with his enimy whisper him in the eare Touching the other circumstances viz. why how when these all are also here wanting as I could instance in sundry particulars if need were But to winde vp all bring all the former into some fewer heads the goodnesse or badnesse of divine worship is to be considered either in actu signato and quo ad specium or in actu exercito and quo ad individium Divine worship is said to be speciated by its object and individuated by its circumstances when divine worship is good or evill in respect of the object of it we say it is
interpreted then have not the Ministers of God any more to say for the justification of their standing then the Ministers of Satan I use Pauls phrase * 2. Cor. 11. 15. have to say for theirs Yea moreover hence the base Familists a H. N. his Exhort to his Childr and such giddie-heads who deny all outward calling to particular men and say every one that can preach the Word are Ministers alike Are justified ‡ He that justifies the false claime of a usurper condemnes the partie whose title is right and good in their most vile assertion ☉ facinus horrendum sancti viri But to cleare the Text from the Treat false glosse And by it to prove the truth which we hold I will here lay downe this argument If Paul by sending Proofe 1. Rom. 10 14 15. doth not at all intend unlawfull Ministers Then are not unlawfll Ministers to be heard But the first is true therefore the second The proposition which needeth only to be cleared may bee thus manifested Such as the Apostle intended Rom. 10. ought and may Lawfully preach But Antichristian Ministers neither ought nor may Lawfully preach Ergo the Apostle Rom. 10 meanes not Antichristian Ministers The Major is most evident and cannot be denyed by any that beares the face of a Christian The Minor is cleare and certaine by these Scriptures b Heb. 5 4. Numb 16. 5 and 18 7 2 Chro 26 18 Act. 14 23. ler. 23 21. Besides granted of all both Papists and Protestants To wit that it is great sinne to exercise any spirituall functioÌ„ or Ministerie without a true outward calling Of this judgment were Francis Ribera c Comment in Heb. 5 4. Toletus d In Joh. 10. pag 597. Royardus e Feria Ter Post Pent. Luther f Comment in Gal. c. 1 v. 8. Pareus g Comment in Heb. 5. 4 Piscator h ibid. Ames i Cas Consc l. 4. c. 25. Slater k On Rom. 2. v. 3. Cartwright l Repl. to Whitg p. 54 63. Wilson m Comment on Rom. 10 v. 15. Bilson n Chur Gov. others 2. If we may Lawfully communicate in and with that Ministery which the Apostle speaketh of Rom. 10. 15. then he intends not here any unlawfull Ministerie But the first is true Ergo the later is true also The Proposition cannot be doubted off The Assumption wee prove by our Opposites Confession For they grant it is unlawfull to communicate in and with a false Office 3. If the Holy Ghost doth testifie that by sending Rom. 10. the true and Lawfull Ministers of Christ are intended Then are not false and unlawfull Ministers intended in that place But the first is true Ergo the later is true also The Proposition is grounded on the words of the Text How shall they preach except they be sent As it is written how beautifull are the feet of them that preach the Gospell of Peace and bring glad tytings of good things These words are taken out of Esa 52. 7. where the Prophet according to the interpretation of all Learned men upon the place hath reference to the Ministers of Christ I say to such only whose outward calling whether extraordinarie or ordinarie was Lawfull and true So Cyrillus o Comment in Esa 52. 7. Dionysius p ibid. Areularius q ibid. Wigand r ibid. Hyperius s On the place Bullingerus t ibid. Mollerus u ibid Zwinglius x Marloratus y ibid Gualte a ibid Musculus b ibid Vrsinus c ibid Oecolampadius and others The Assumption needs no proofe except a man would make some question whether it should be day when it is manifested to him that it is not night 4. If unlawfull and false Ministers are not sent from God But from the Devill and Antichrist Then doth not the Apostle in Rom. 10. 15. intend false and unlawfull Ministers But the antecedent is true Ergo also the consequence The Major or antecedent is ground d ibid on these Scriptures * Ier. 14 14 Rev 9 3 and 13 14 15 16 and 18 15 17 2 Thes 2 3 4 2 Chro. 11. 15 Rev. 16. 3. And among other reasons layd downe by Zanchy e Quia non mittuntur ab eo sed a Diabolo Explicat Philip 3. 1 p. 176 Tom. 4. wherefore unlawfull Ministers â—hâ—uld be avoyded he gives this for one Because God sends them not but the Divell So Cartwright ‡ f Repl to Whitg p. 88 204. speaking of the Hierarchy vvhich comprehends all false Offices in the Kingdome of the Beast sayth it came out of the Bottomlesse pitt of hell and from the Devill Perkins g Expos Serm mount Mat 7 p. 239 vol. 2. Pareus h Comment in Mat. 24. 23. Musculus i Comment in Mat. 7. Latton k Syons Plea the Authors of the Admonitions to the Parliament l Admon 1. and others say so too The Assumption is as manifest For durst any man affirme that Ministers not sent from God but from Satan and Antichrist are here meant by the Apostle 5. Such have a promise of Gods gracious presence with them and of his blessing on their labours and Ministerie who are said Rom. 10. 15. to be sent But unlawfull Ministers have no such promise of Gods presence with them nor of his blessing on their labour and Ministerie Therefore by sending Rom. 10. the Apostle intendeth not unlawfull Ministers He that should denye this argument would shew more spight then wit For both paâ—ts are as cleare as the Sunne at noon-day For the other part of the reason there can be no exception against it For seeing this place which is the foundation of their cause is very Sand the whole building like a tottering wall must needs fall to the ground 2. For his saying He hath before shewed that it is Lawfull to heare him that hath no Lawfull calling I answer I cannot finde this proved any where in his Booke For I professe in the word of truth I see little difference betweene his grounds for hearing in false Churches and the Nicolaitants reasoning for eating in idol-Temples For thus they would plead m Euseb lib 3 cap. 29 Ireuaen lib 1. c. 25 Meats and Drinkes are the good Creatures of God and may be used in a civill way Lawfully Now we receive them no otherwise whatsoever ends and respects others have Convenient rebus nomina saepe suis What is the Treat plea but the same Hearing is a naturall action And although he heares false Ministers yet is not his private meaning to honour the state of the Office as the rest doe Thus Chius ad Coum their Doctrines are alike But doth not this in the meane time shew a desperate cause which hath not any authenticall records of the Holie Ghost Vnder the shadow whereof it can find any shelter to shrowd it selfe What in the whole Booke of
presume above that which is written Surely if men may take such boldnes in expounding of the Scriptures the grossest Idolater may excuse himselfe easily 3. I grant that to heare is some time taken for beleeving approving following c But what of this Will it therefore follow that Christ in Ioh. 10 5. doth not speake of the outward hearing of strangers I may safely protest his proofe here is onely his bare opinion ‡ And so it is all along the booke And he argues ex non concessis From that which is not granted I thinke no wise man will engage himselfe to defend the conclusion which cannot be defended * Ne conare quid fieri non potest 4. Where he saith the strangers of whom Christ speaketh were of the true Church and of Israell Jf his meaning be that Christ here hath respect only to them he is greatly deceived For he intendeth all strangers which in the sence of the Scriptures either then were or afterwards should come into the world whether of the true Church of Israel or not It hath hitherto been a ruled case among divines not to distinguish where the Word makes no distinction But the Treat keeps seldome this Canon For as Lizards who out of the open field doe runne into Bushes So he leaves the plaine Text and literall sence of the Scriptures And turning their necks cleane about * I heare that some say that these later workes of the Treat are farre better then the first Now these say so because they lead to loose walking and therefore they like them the better For otherwise they are much worse Vnles to prove a thing soundly by the Word of God is not so good as a bare and bold affirmation makes them speake what he pleaseth And by this meanes neither dealeth with the Objectson nor cause of the Lord as is meet * I heare that some say that these later workes of the Treat are farre better then the first Now these say so because they lead to loose walking and therefore they like them the better For otherwise they are much worse Vnles to prove a thing soundly by the Word of God is not so good as a bare and bold affirmation 5. Jt is a question whether the Godly in the Iewish Church having by hearing discovered the Scribes Pharises to be strangers that is false Prophess mought afterward heare them againe The Treat a See his justificat separat pag. 434. was once of the mind that they might not and gave some reasons for it b To be lightly moved in Religion is Childish weakenes sayth he divine Mor. Observ p. 44. It had been a happy thing for the Church of God if he had not shewed such a Childish weakenes But howsoever the case is not easily to be determined considering the state of that Church time Yet this is cleare to all men of sound judgment that in the Churches now under the Gospell false Prophets may not bee suffered But after due and orderly conviction beeing found so and abstinate they are to be rejected and so no outward hearing of them any more Of this judgment Camerius c Comm. in Apoc. c. 3. Borrhaeus d In Apoc. c. 3. Tossanus e In Mat. c. 7. Oecolampadius f In Mat. c. 7. and others Lastly by his answere all false Prophets may bee heard For if nothing make a false Prophet but as hee sayth unsound Doctrine And Christ doth not forbid the outward hearing of such Then what I said followes necessarilie Now if this were true Lord in what a miserable case were Gods people But it is neither so nor so For the Scriptures shew the contrarie besides he contradicts here himselfe and is so variable and unsetled in that thing As it may be said of him as it was said ‡ Melanch in Cron. of Severus Omnia fuit nihil fuit Hee turneth every way and cannot passe any way He anglieth in all waters and yet catcheth nothing he hath spent all his oyle in making a salve for the foule sore Antichristian Preists and yet to say as the truth is hath left them in a worse cause * For they need not by his writing leave their unblessed standing For so they only preach the truths of the Gospell They sinne not And then what need is there to lay downe their false Office then he found them SECT 12. THe 12. Objection followes thus The Scriptures of the Old and New Testament warne Gods people of false Prophets vvhich the Ministers of that Church are having an unlawfull calling To this he thus replies Treat 1. They warn not to hearken to them nor to beleeve them But to try them which without hearing them cannot be done Not that all false Prophet are to be heard by all that they might try them For that were to tempt God But now I answer * Not as Apollo answered the Iewes by the Scriptures Act. 18. ult for so he could not seeing hee writes against them the Scriptures cited which speake of Prophets in the true Church which were to be heard till they were orderly repressed or at least plainly discovered by their Doctrine heard to be such Answ The souldiers which served Marcus Antonius fell unawares on an Herbe * Appian de Bell. Parth. the vvhich greatly distempered their heads To say vvhat my mind gives me it vvas an unhappie thing that ever the Treat found out this Wild gourd for it much weakned his large abilities and caused him in this point to be no more like the man that he was when he was against it Then an apple is like a nut ‡ We cannot apply the saying in the Greeke Proverbe to him 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Our later thoughts be wiser then our first For here he rather striveth then teacheth As Ierom. confesseth of himselfe beeing reproved by some for writing some thing against lovinian as the Treat doth against us by way of contention rather then of Doctrine Hierom in Apolog. ad PammachiuÌ„ pro libris adversus Iovinian Some thing he would say here but to professe my owne ignorance I doe not understand him For 1. he peremptorilie denies the whole Objection and so conquently affirmes that all False Prophets may be heard yet presently with the same breath he unsayes what hee had sayd before And sayes all false Prophets are not to be he heard by all And within 4 lines after le ts both sayings fall againe and sayth false Prophets beeing discovered so to be are not to bee heard This is so deepe and inextricable a riddle for me to unfould that I must confesse my selfe here Davus not Oedipus And therefore will leave it for what it is and come to the defence of our Aâ—gument 1. * 1 Cor. 6 15. Howsoever the Treat in the point of hearing of false Prophets is off and on so that no bodie by his words can well tell what