Selected quad for the lemma: state_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
state_n	church_n	power_n	society_n	1,162	5	9.1993	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A82314	The city-ministers unmasked, or The hypocrisie and iniquity of fifty nine of the most eminent of the clergy in and about the city of London. Cleerly discovered out of two of their own pamphlets, one intituled, A serious and faithful representation; the other A vindication of the Ministers of the Gospel, in and about the City of London. Together vvith a prophesie of John Hus, touching the choosing of a new ministry; and an ancient prophetical farewel of Hildegards, to the old corrupt ministry. Both very useful for the knowledg of the long deceived nations. / By a friend of the Armies, in its ways to justice and righteousnes.	Dell, William, d. 1664.	1649 (1649)	Wing D920; Thomason E546_2; ESTC R206085	24,534	40

last of all the Presbyters these three Sects making up the NVMBER OF HIS NAME Now how unsafe this is for this State or any other to have another outward Kingdom besides its own with its power laws and government joyned and mingled with it which is not at all of it let any wise or rationall man judge For where there are two different outward powers in a Kingdom to wit Civill and Ecclesiasticall each will be striving for precedency as we see all along throughout the periods of Popery and Prelacy for the Ecclesiasticall State will think fit to take place of the Civil and the Civil will think much to have another outward Kingdom and Power above it self and so heart-burnings and contentions and wars arise as appears in all former Histories And so likewise for this new Sect of Presbytery which is the last round in the triple crown and so the least which is the comfort of it suppose the national Assembly of the Church an outward Society should excommunicate the Parliament an outward Society and the Church power with their adherents in this and the neighbour Kingdom set against the State power for when they are able no doubt but as they have been they still are and will be willing to uphold their Kingdom by force what work I pray would this soon be And if the Clergy now before they are masters of their much desired and longed for power are thus impudent and troublesome against the State what would they be if they sate upon their throne And therefore I desire the State would well consider it that it cannot be safe for it to have two externall Kingdoms Powers and Dominions in one Nation or Common wealth For it was never known yet but the Ecclesiasticall Kingdom did exalt it self above the Civil as oyl above the water and so it hath bridled and sadled and rode upon the Nations for many hundred years together But now it s hoped this Kingdom will ca●● off its proud rider and suffer him to get up no more And thus now it is plain that Presbyterie is the most dangerous Sect of any other to be tolerated in the State it not being s●fe for the power of the Kingdom to suffer any externall power in the same Kingdom that shall not slow from it and depend upon it And the power that flows from a State must be State-power it cannot be Church-power seeing nothing can give that which it hath not it self first Whereas they that hold Christs Kingdom to be spirituall and not of this world and that it is only to be managed by a spirituall power flowing from him whose Kingdom it is these people can neither be dangerous nor in the least measure troublesome to any civill State in the world And thus now I proceed from the reproaches they cast upon the Army to the Councel they give them And their Councel branches it self into three Particulars 1. That they be not too confident of former successes seeing God in his great judgment suffers men to prosper sometimes in sinfull courses c. Now for my part I must profess I greatly wonder that these could never yet see the most manifest presence and hand of God in the most admired and constant successes of the Army and have not hitherto been so convinced as to say with the Egyptian Sorcerers Sure the finger of God is here yea the right hand of his power and righteousness But it seems blindness is come upon them not in part but fully so that these above all others are the men who when the hand of God hath thus gloriously been lifted up would not see it but God in due time shall make them see and be ashamed for their bitter envy at his people But because they are so unlearned and ignorant in these successes and providences the manifest and mighty works of God I will minde them of something in this matter if yet any thing might at last prevaile to do them good God had a great work to do in this Kingdome for the true and reall Reformation both of Church and State and when this Councell of his first began to take place amongst us the King and all his Clergy and corrupt party of all sorts throughout the Kingdome being farre the more numerous rise up in all the strength they could make to hinder this work And yet this work being of God prevailes through his power and wisdome only and all that is opposite to it is thrown down Hereupon say the unbelievers this cause prevailed for behold what helps it had the major part of the Parliament the City of London the Scotch Army and above all the eminent Clergy of the City and else where who said of themselves they had done the Parliament as good service in their pulpits as their Armies in the field and therefore a cause thus supported and strengthned must needs prosper Hereupon the Lord because his work was thus hid by these instruments so that he had not the honour due unto his name he proceeds in another way and method and turnes the hearts of those to hate his cause who before had outwardly appeared for it so that now all the former friends of Gods cause are become the most deadly enemies of it the former enemies being still the same and so if God uphold his cause and people now sure all the world must acknowledg his hand for now the major part of the Parliament is directly against it and the rich and populous and proud City of London and a Scotch Army comes in against it more numerous then that which came in for it and the Clergy for causes well known tooth and naile against it and all these joyne in one work and Councell with the malignants though upon different ends against the work and cause of God and now alass what will become of it how can it escape perishing Yes it is Gods cause still though left never so desolate and so prospers as well all these being at last against it as when they were first for it And so the Malignants are overcome every where in field and City the numerous Scotch Army vanquished by a few the City subdued the Parliament purged and the Clergy confounded and the work of God like the Sunne in the Spring appears with beauty and comfort and yet these men cannot see the mind and councel and hand of God in all these things as if the fulness of outer and inner darkness were fallen upon them at once And yet a little farther for I take pleasure to mention the righteous acts of the Lord the last Summer when so many enemies rose up at once in so many severall places in Wales Kent Essex Lincolns●ire Huntingtonshire Surrey c. Some of which were at first quite shattered in pieces and others driven into fenced Towns and Cities and the poore Army 〈◊〉 without in the fields the Summer proved like a winter more cold and unseasonable and wet almost constantly yet for

and Prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink for they are worthy and with the Angel out of the Sanctuary it is the holy faithfull Christians they say even so Lord God almighty true and just are thy Judgments By all which and much more that might be said it may appear that these men are not well and throughly acquainted with the Scriptures though they make it their only profession And secondly they are much mistaken in the constant Judgment of Protestant Divines for the Divines at home it may be they may say true for the terror of Kings kept men so in awe that they durst not whisper of this matter but for Divines abroad it is evident that they were of this very Judgment with the Parliament and Army The judgment of Pareus in this point is sufficiently known in his Comment on Rom 13. whose book for this cause suffered martyrdome in this Kingdome because his person was in another Zuinglius also a very godly man doth largely handle this very matter in his 42. Article which is well worth the reading He shewes there how Kings may be put from their Office for misgovernment and doth prove by clear Scriptures how God punished the people of Israel for permitting their King Manasseh to be so wicked whom they ought to have restrained and removed and also he shews by whom evill Kings should be punished saying Quum consensu suffragiis totius aut certe potioris partis multitudinis Tyrannus tollitur Deo fit auspice c. When a Tyrant is taken away by the consent and suffrages either of the whole or of the better part of the people it is done by the conduct and disposition of God So the children of Israel if they had discharged Manasseh from his office they had not been so grievonsly punished with him If you ask how that may be done that the greater part of the people should consent to that which is good To this saith he I say as before If they do not agree to take away the evil let them bear the yoke of the Tyrant and at last perish with him Neither let them complain that injury is done to them when through their own fault they deserve to suffer any thing And a little after Non ergo desunt viae per quas Tyranni tollantur sed deest publica justitia i. e. There are not then ways wanting by which Tyrants may be taken away but there wants publike Justice Thus he and so no question divers more if a man had time to search after them And yet you tell the people that no godly Ministers are of this minde and therefore it is a wicked and damnable attempt for the Parliament and Army to travel in this untroden path and yet you see here are two godly men and Orthodox forthwith witnessing against you in this matter So that the Army is freed from any guilt in this matter as well as in the former Now it seems to me the chief business you aym at in these two weak and absurd Pamphlets of yours and it is easie also to guess your ends is to testifie to the world that you were enemies to this publike Justice as Zuinglius terms it And to let this present and the following ages know That God in the yeer 1648. had a great and glorious work to do even a high example of impartial Justice to shew to the world and there were fifty nine who called themselves Ministers of the Gospel that under colour of Religion and the Word stood out in opposition and open defiance against it to have hindred the Justice and Righteousness of God if it had been possible from prevailing in the world Wherefore it is evident that these men are as well enemies to the Justice of God in the world as they have been to the Righteousness of Christ in the Church and who now can make voyd that Scripture the name of the wicked shall not The third Crime they charge upon the Army is Their framing a new Agreement and changing the Fundamental Laws of the Kingdom The Fundamental Law of this and all Kingdoms in the World is Salu● populi The safety and welfare of the people and the Army is so far from going about to overthrow this Law That their whole drift and Councel is to establish it and all that they have done through so many hazards and so much blood and all they are yet doing is to maintain this Fundamental Law unto which all other Laws are to give place and which alone being preserved the Nation will be both free and happy though the outward forms of Law be changed a thousand times But how are these Clergy men wedded to the empty forms of things not onely in the Church but State too and because they are not able to rise up to the first pure principles of right reason and equitie they content themselves with the muddy puddles of dead forms as if all Law were comprehendin them What strange Notions have the vulgar people of Laws they consider no● that Civil Laws were first made by men and made for the welfare of the people and that when once they become prejudicial to it they cease to be Laws and they that made them have power to alter them Wherefore let all that are not of the brutish among the people know That since but few Laws among us are the pure results of right reason and equity but there is something of humane darkness or lust or humor or interest cleaving to them therefore as men grow up into more reason they may change the Laws which themselves have made and as succeeding generations grow up into more clear and refined reason then their Ancestors so may they change the former Laws as less suitable to them seeing Laws are to be suited to the peoples reason and not the peoples reason to the Laws in this case Right reason and equity carry all Laws in their bowels and will at all times be a fruitful womb of them for the peoples good when the tyranny of form is done away And it is much better for people to go to Reason for Laws then to Laws for Reason Each generation can judg better what is for its own good then their forefathers who could not foresee what was to fall out in the world after the revolution of so many providences and for men of this age to depart from their own reason and to live in the reason of former ages or it may be in their folly and mistakes is the greatest bondage mankinde can be brought into and hath kept the world in the ignorance and rudeness of a childe to its old age The Laws of former ages were answerable to that measure of reason and equity which men that made them had attained unto but when men attain to higher and purer reason the Laws must be proportioned thereunto as the shadow to the body and the clothes to the man It is one of the

great evils of this age for men to admire and adore Laws and yet not to understand or minde the reason and equity of them and hereupon to prefer Laws above the safety and welfare of the people as though men were made for the Laws and not the Laws for them Our Ecclesiastical men not well understanding these things cry out against changing the Fundamental Laws and bringing in a new Agreement of the people which they think will be prejudicial to them who never prospered so well as by the peoples disagreement and therefore have they still stirred up such broyls and troubles in the world And therefore the peoples Agreement so much desired by all honest men is ready to break their hearts Again they see more right reason and equity appear in this Agreement then they think they shall be well able to master Besides it shews a more righteous way of Government then will stand with the profit of their Ecclesiastical Kingdom which can never be maintained by Laws of right Reason but only by the Authority and Tyranny of Kings And hereupon both these of England and those of Scotland cry out so much against this Agreement of the people which as the Proverb is Will mar their market But pray suffer me to ask you but one question here and I will no longer exercise your patience in this matter Why may not the Parliament and Army as well change the Government of the State as you of the Clergie the Government of the Church Why might not they as well change those Laws that were the slavery of the people into the Agreement of the people as you change Prelacy into Presbytery Why might not they propound as well a new Agreement as you a new Directory Catechism Confession and Discipline You said heretofore there might be a better Government then the former for the Church and they know assuredly that there may be a better Government then the former for the State Wherefore then do you deny them that libertie which your selves contend for But it hath been your ancient way always to approve what is for your own commodity and always to disapprove what is for the peoples to ease your selves of your own burdens but to endevor to continue theirs But this is not to fulfil the Law of Christian love but the lust of self-love Fourthly You farther declaim here and there against Toleration which yet the Commissioners of the Kirk of Scotland have allowed in a case not their own viz. in the Agreement of the people and what they plead to exempt all men from compulsion in this matter may equally be pleaded to exempt them from compulsion to their Government Let therefore but the word Government be put in the place of the peoples Agreement and observe then how notably they plead for Toleration in their own book against it their own Pen betraying their own cause Their own words are these How comes it to pass that a few take upon them to impose this Government upon others and that it is desired the opposers may be punished Let it be yielded that some at first may condescend unto the moddel without the knowledg of the whole body yet when it is offered to them what if the one half or the greater part shall refuse to consent or submit thereto Shall they be compelled by others to do it and be destroyed if they will not obey Is not this to take power over those who have equal power with themselves and to incroach over the freedom of those who are as free as themselves If they say they impose in things necessary We demand who are judges of these things Have not those that refuse as much power and freedom to judg as those who would impose it upon them And if they judg it to be contrary to their freedom who can controul them herein without incroaching thereupon and offering violence to their Consciences who may conceive such a way neither to suit with Religion nor Righteousness So that if the case be but altered who can speak more clearly against the inforcing the Scotch Goverment then the Commissioners of the Church of Scotland And so in the snare they have laid for others is their own foot taken But by the way What have the Commissioners of the Church of Scotland to do with the Agreement of the people of England Why are they so busie to impose their own Church Government on us and to hinder us from our own State Agreement Reader do you think yet they are out of their sphere or no Or are they yet become our Lords and Masters that they thus set themselves over us Can the Church of Scotland thus commission them to deal and trouble and then after fish in the State of England O the boundless priviledges of the Church But I hope the Common-wealth of England will not long allow them any such Toleration as this is Well now because you are so hot against Toleration of Sects I will make it appear that there can be no Sect so prejudicial to any State as the grand and dominecring Sect of Presbytery which is the third disguise of Antichrist as the Papacy and Prolacy were the first and second And in all these three gra●d Sects of Papacy Prelacy and Presbytery which make up the triple crown of Antichrist these things are notably remarkable 1. That they were set up and preserved and established by the power of the Mgistrate but not one of them by the bare power of the Word 2. That each of them in its season would endure no Sect besides themselves but would sit as Queen alone 3. That they all would have an outward and visible Kingdom and Dominion in the world and yet this should be independent on the worldly Kingdoms wherein they lived All which things have made this Antichristian Sect which is but one and the self same though under three disguises Antichrist having this policy that when he is discovered in one guise presently he goes off the stage and puts on another and being discovered in that he withdraws again and puts on another I say these three things make this Sect the most dangerous Sect in the world For to insist only on the last how dangerous a thing is it to any State to have two outward powers or two outward Kingdoms in one Nation But would Presbytery have so Art thou a stranger that thou knowest not this Why all their Writings are stuffed with this particularly the Commissioners of the Kirk of Scotland which corrupt fountain hath filled all the Clergy of England with its impure streams do blame the Parliament of England for incroaching upon the Royal Sco●●er of Jesus Christ as they call it in denying to him any externall government over his house but such as is dependent upon them See here they would have an external Government ●f the Church not depending upon the civill Magistrate and for such a government the Pope pleaded first the Prelates next and