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state_n	church_n	civil_a	punish_v	1,086	5	8.9722	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A38575	A treatise of excommunication wherein 'tis fully, learnedly, and modestly demonstrated that there is no warrant ... for excommunicating any persons ... whilst they make an outward profession of the true Christian faith / written originally in Latine by ... Thomas Erastus ... about the year 1568.; Explicatio gravissimae quaestionis utrum excommunicatio. English	Erastus, Thomas, 1524-1583.	1682 (1682)	Wing E3218; ESTC R20859	61,430	96

make a Volume to recount what advantages the Church did hereby reap most certainly they can't be set out in a small compass for first this Excommunication made men to look for salvation from the Sacrament for thus they fram'd the Argument The Exclusion from the Sacrament draws down Death and Damnation say they therefore the Receiving of it gives Life They scarce could entertain a doubt of the truth of the Antecedent whilst they were taught that this was so dreadful so Soul-destructive a punishment and when they thought themselves by being shut out from the Sacrament to fall straight into the very clutches of the Devil and be wholly at Satan's mercy which has made it thought by some that they could not die without being housled as I said before This Errour grew and got strength from the many great and long Penances the Solemnities of Absolution and the like amongst which none was more prevalent than that they would not administer the holy Eucharist to them till the very point of Death and that then they gave it them 't was of pure compassion that they might not go hence destitute of the Souls necessary food for if any through whatever Accident was so unfortunate he was held for a man damn'd and lost to all Eternity as if God would not forgive them their sins who heartily and sincerely repent and vouchsafe unto them everlasting life unless these Elders should adjudge them qualified for the Lords Supper What errour is there of a more detestable and fatal consequence But another Fruit of this was that all the World now began to believe that 't was in the power of men to shut and open Heaven when and to whom they pleased and therefore the younger Theodosius would not eat his Dinner because having denied an importunate Monk's Request he stood excommunicate by him for his pains and though the Bishop of Constantinople told the Emperour that the Excommunication was invalid yet rest good man he could not nor would not till the same hand absolv'd that had bound him So Ambrose for eight months together kept an Elder from Church from Sermons and all the acts of publick Worship 'T is true offended he had but more pardonably than Ambrose himself as any man that has his eyes in his head may see upon the perusal of Nicephorus his History and the Chronicle of Philip Melancthon By these steps has the Roman See encroached upon the Western World and made Princes Kings and Emperours to lacky to her Lust and arbitrary sway in pretended Spirituals Dyed has been the German Empire in the Gore of hundred thousands that fell a Sacrifice to this Roman Diana to excommunicating Popes and excommunicated Emperours Kings and Princes Religion she has chopt and chang'd mangled and disfigured debased and vitiated at her pleasure none daring to question her Canons dispute her Decretals or look her Bulls in the face the whole World were Caligula's and durst not shew their heads when she sent her Thunder of Excommunication abroad The God of Foxes spoken of by Daniel Dan. 11. 38. if we weigh that passage aright signifies nothing but this Excommunication or the Prohibiting men the use of Sacred things especially the Lords Supper For this Excommunication acts a very God in earnest 't is to this day a God of Forces a God who has put all things all the power of Heaven and Hell under the Popes feet And there are not wanting now-a-days too another sort of men acting upon the same Principles who would make all Humane Authority and the Civil Christian Magistrate truckle to them and dread their Censures as far as the Popes ignorant Votaries do his Bulls But I hope the time will come when this God shall stand expos'd and condemn'd for a false and feigned God and be stript of all its God-like terror and dread and whatsoever may or has so long plagu'd and enslav'd the Church In fine this Idol Excommunication had every where such an Ascendant that 't was the constant Belief of the World that they who by Church-Censures and Interdictions from the Sacrament and publick acts of Worship were denounced unworthy of eternal Life were thereby wholly fallen from divine Grace as on the other hand saved must they needs be whom the Church received and would have so Can we hope better terms or greater moderation from our Modern Church-men than the World has experienced in their Predecessors I fear he that should expect it would find himself deceiv'd and that he has but little weigh'd what either the Scriptures or Experience might inform him of LXXIII I see no cause why Christian Rulers should not now-a-days do what God in the Jewish Common-wealth requir'd of the Civil Magistrate Do we conceit that we can frame a better Model and Form of Discipline in Church or State than God gave to them since we read in Deut. 4. that the Nations for this should praise and admire the People of Israel for their Wisdom and Understanding evinc'd by those Statutes and Judgments which God had given them yet God never taught them Excommunication But the Power of punishing the Debaucheries and restraining the looseness and licentiousness of manners was wholly in the Magistrate whose duty 't was not onely to animadvert on such Crimes by the Rules that God had in their Law prescribed them but the management of all the Externals of Religion the Disciplinary part and Constitution was in them For 't was not Aaron but Moses that did this God still commanding it and we know this Jurisdiction was transferred over to Joshua not to Eleazar 't was Joshua on whom God laid that Injunction of seeing the Israelites circumcis'd the second time and not Eleazar Josh 5. 2. and this was to be universal without exception of one man the Bad were to be circumcis'd as well as the Good and Bad there were without question And the keeping the Passover then was by him too directed nor was any person that we there read of excluded from it for dishonesty of his life The Ark of God was carried from place to place as he gave the word and in all things relating to Religion he interpos'd his Commands as may be observ'd throughout the whole book of Joshua Eli and Samuel who had the charge of Religious as well as Civil affairs they offer'd and administred at the Altar as Priests but as Judges they manag'd both Church and State for 't was lawful for the High Priests under the Old Testament to meddle with the arts of Government and Secular affairs as they were the Types of Christ our King and High Priest but under the Gospel 't is another case IT SHALL NOT BE SO WITH YOV says Christ See 1 Pet. 5. 3. which is pertinent to our purpose LXXIV If we go farther to the Kings the case is no less plain As to David there 's none can doubt it since it appears that he order'd all the Offices and Charges relating to God's Worship he that pleases may read

1 Chron. from the 22th to the 27th Chapter Then for Solomon who was a King and no Priest he not onely built the Temple but dedicated it To the same purpose is that famous relation 2 Chron. 19. of Jehosaphat which being well consider'd gives great light to the matter in hand So does that of the good King Hezechia and indeed the whole Old Testament witnesses no less If therefore the State and Church was founded instituted and established upon so much Wisdom that which makes the nearest approaches to the Form and Model thereof as far as the present circumstances and different state of things will allow challenges at least our Praises and Approbation if not our Imitation And therefore in whatever Nation the Civil Magistrate is Christian Pious and Orthodox there 's no need of other persons who under another name or title should set a governing us and call us to account or punish us for our misdeeds as if there were no difference betwixt a Believing and Infidel Prince But says D. Wolfgangus Musculus in his common places de Magistratu from whom I have borrowed and transcribed what I said last 'T is a most pernicious Errour and big with dangerous Consequence that so many think no better of a Christian Magistracy than of an Heathen one whose power is to be allowed of no farther than meer Temporals If then Believing Governours had authority not onely to interpose in the ordering religious matters agreeable to Scripture-rules and to regulate the Offices and other the Ministerial parts about it which is the reason that Moses commands that when they should chuse them a King he should write him a Copy of the Law in a Book and that to be with him and he to read therein all the days of his life but had also power to punish Vice in the same manner 'T is a needless fruitless attempt for men to be now-a-days contriving and setting up new Models of Government which levels Magistrates themselves to the Rank and Condition of their Subjects for this Ecclesiastical Jurisdiction in point of Manners hath no place of Holy Writ to vouch for it or set it up not but that Civil Governours will do well to advise in all Doctrinals with those that are learned and have labour'd in the Word LXXV But now in those Churches whose mishap 't is to live under a Profane Government as in the Dominions of Turks and Papists they should make choice of pious sober persons who agreeable to St. Paul's command might arbitrate between contesting Members might take up Quarrels might do every thing of that nature might chide and admonish debauched flagitious men and such of the Ministry themselves who walk disorderly and if this avail not then might they punish them or rather recal them to a better temper by avoiding their company by debarring them of private Commerce by reprehending them publickly or by some such-like marks of their displeasure but to thrust them from that Sacrament which is of God's Institution when they are minded to come is more than any Church or man has a right to do for none can judge of the Heart but God alone It may chance that some sparks of Piety and Remorse may kindle in a sinners Soul whilst he sits in the Assembly which it can be no hurt nay may be greatly good to cherish since Religion forbids it not And how can it be I would fain ask but horrid absurd and impious to boot to turn away any man from publickly and solemnly paying his Thanks to God and commemorating the Death of his Saviour when he finds Impulses from within to do it and would fain celebrate it with his fellow-brethren the Church and declares 't is his hearty desire to be and continue a Member of it and that he would give publick testimony that his past life is irksom to himself APPENDIX IT will not be amiss perhaps by way of Corollary or Supplement to mention the Decrees that were made in the year 1523. at the Diet at Norimberg by all the Layety of the Imperial States and were sent to the Bishop of Rome for 't will appear by that that we are not the first who have started this Question but that the Divines began to think of it nigh 46 years since I am confident no man that is any whit vers'd in the German Affairs can believe or imagine that any such thing should be enacted but requested by them from the Bishop of Rome without the Clergies knowing of it But that the Authority may be the more authentick and the thing clearer I have been content to compare the German Copy which was writ at that Diet with the Latine one sent to the Pope and which Matth. Flac. Illyricus caus'd to be reprinted at Basil 1565. with his Book De Sectis Dissensionibus Papistarum and upon comparing both to publish the entire Decree or Act. Therefore among the 100 Grievances which were fuller express'd at this Session at Norimberg than they had two years before at Worms this following is the 34th Item Many Christians at Rome and in other places besides are by Archbishops Bishops and their Ecclesiastical Judges excommunicated for Civil causes and on a Temporal account whereby many weak Consciences are disturb'd and brought to despair so that upon a moneyscore and for the transitory things of this life and very often for very trivial causes are some brought into danger of perishing Soul and Body too contrary to the Law and Command of God besides the losses they suffer in Estates and Reputation thereby Whereas no person ought to be excommunicated or held for such unless he be convict of Heresie as the Holy Scripture bears witness And therefore the Lay-states of the Empire beseech your Pontificial Holiness that as becomes a godly and religious Father you would take away these Grievances of Excommunication at Rome or in the Roman Court and provide that the same be done every where else by the Archbishops Bishops and other Ecclesiastical Judges And lastly that your Holiness would command That no person be excommunicated or reputed for such for any cause whatever besides the plain and prov'd Crime of Heresie in matters relating to Religion for that no person ought to be separated or removed from God and his Church for any Temporal cause or otherwise or for any other humane crime except Infidelity or Heresie To the same purpose is that of Joh. Stumpias in his second Book of his Chronicon Helvet cap. 29. where he says That the Swedish Clergy about the year 1245. when Henry Landgrave of Turing and after his death William Earl of Holland were chosen by the instigation of the Pope in opposition to the Emperour Frederick the second and Conrade his Son taught with great constancy among other things That never was there such a Power granted to mortal man under the Sun to prohibit Christians Spiritual Duties and the Worship of God and therefore did they continue to say Mass says he though the Pope had interdicted them and denounced them Excommunicate FINIS Hieronym upon Tit. chap. 1. * See Mat. 11. 28. Luke 5. 5. Joh 4. 6. 1 Cor. 4. 12. Eph. 4. 28. 1 Thess 5. 12. which helps mightily to the explaining this 1 Tim. 5. 17. 1 Tim. 4. 10. 1 Cor. 15. 58. alibi