in you which Christ hath lightned you withal which light shines in your consciences and convinces you of your evil deeds it reproves you for vain words and ungodly speeches it will let you see what your hearts goes after and what your love goes out unto and if you love that it will lead you to Christ and he will be revealed in you to teach you and to give you the witness of peace and reconciliation with God the light is your eye by which you may see God it will lead you out of all idolatrous worships and works and from your false worships which is abomination to the Lord and you must be converted and changed into a new nature and you must put off the old man his works before you can worship God aright for he is worshipped in spirit and in truth onely and such the Lord is now seeking to worship him therefore cease from your steeple-house-Steeple-house-worship which is in the traditions of men and not in the spirit of the Lord and that worship must be confounded for its root is corrupted and its branches will wither and the breath of the Lord is kindled against it if you love the light of Christ and walke in it there is your teacher and if you hate it there is your condemnation The next day after the Dispute this was written and sent in a little time after to Draton and up and down that ways Richard Goodgrom FRiend hath not thy ignorance folly and wickedness towards me now appeared and is it not made manifest in the sight of many people And now thou maist cease to boast and also to back-bite for the time to come and no more secretly to surmise behind my back to the raising of unruly spirits against me so much as in thee was possible and hadst thou been more crafty and more subtle more mischief thou mightst have done but the innocent is delivered and thou art taken in the snare which thou laidst for another and false doctrine is proved to proceed forth of thy mouth and thou and thy company may be ashamed when you consider the managing of your worke against me who many times appeared immoderate in speaking many at once consusedly and also were unreasonable in not being satisfied with just answers but it shews your blindnesse and unbeliefe who cannot understand the truths of the Gospel of Christ but comends against them though in the end you are forced to confesse to them as was sufficiently witnessed that day of the Dispute and thou in particular who reproachedst me behind my back in divers places where I have heard of it by my friends whom thou judgedst had not been so jet they have discovered the naughtiness of thy heart both in the Country and in the City Thou hast given forth that I had preached false Doctrine and such like wicked reproachfull back-biting language behinde my backe not like a man faithfull to God and thy neighbour but one that hath surmised evill against the harmlesse and thou mayest remember all these things which thou objectest against who would have made a great matter of them against me yet are they sufficiently proved to the understanding of many honest people And if thou and thy company will be blinde it is because you harden your hearts against the truth and I am clear in the sight of the Lord and all shall know that have an eare to heare that what I professe preach and practice is the saving truths of Iesus Christ though they may be branded to be heresie by such as thee who may call light darknesse and darknesse light and put good for evill and evill or good at a convenient opportunity I may take in hand to prove that thou thy selfe hast held forth that which cannot be justified by the Scriptures but are condemned thereby Many things fell from thee in my hearing which I may object against and prove the contrary and I shall not goe behind thy backe as thou hast done to slander thee but I shall rest contented and wait the opportunity to lay open thy nakednesse and weaknesse in the sight of all people And whatsoever thou judgest The Scriptures the writings and the things written of is two things The one is the word of God but the other is not and this all sober men confesseth too Though thou jangle and twist about it with thy lame arguments to no purpose at all except to shew thy weakness and folly And also no man is justified by Christs righteousness untill he receive it and as he receives it and this thou shalt one day witnesse for though righteousness be in him sufficient to justifie yet by it art thou nor any man justified but in the receiving of it and dwelling in it and this shalt thou confess to be truth in the day of the Lord And in the mean time let me bear thy false censure in calling this heresie And also a man may be tempted to sin and there may be evill motions to him yet he not being overcome of the temptation not consenting to the motion of sin it is no sin unto him neither shall sin be imputed to him if he commit it not but he that commits sin though he profess never so much of justification yet for his sin shall he be condemned and this shalt thou witness in the day of Iudgement Also that there is a perfection attainable in this life even to be perfect and without sin in Christ Iesus and this I affirm to be the truth of the Gospel and that wherein the faith of Gods people standeth and though thou madest a twisting a wrangling against it yet it is too strong for thee and in thy wisdome and thy arguments is thy folly and thy weakness seen and truth stands over thee and thou canst not it nor me reprehend and also that some of the Scriptures was spoken to the world and not to the Saints this I also have sufficiently proved and thou art not able to detect it and all thy snarling in opposition to these things is confounded and thy arguments made without effect and all whose eyes are opened sees thee to be of too short a measure and of too weake a capacity to understand the deep things of God which is hidden from thine eye and them thou savourest not in that wisdome though thou hast the words yet thou art ignorant of the life and the life is in dominion over thee and to it must thou submit and lay down thy Crown and from thee am I hidden in that life and truth which I do possess And though I be as a deceiver yet am I true And though I be slandered and reproached and back-bited by thee yet it is for Christ Iesus sake and for his truths sake and not as an evill doer But friend learn more wisdome then to judge a man before thou hear him or to condemn the matter before thou hear the proof of it for by these things thou hast not gained a good report but God condemns thee for it men sees thy shame in it and the burthen of it one day shalt thou beare even then and all that own thee in these things And now thy spirit is tryed and it is found too light and cannot stand in judgement for it is unfavoury And though separate from the world in appearance yet is thy spirit of the world and reacheth not the knowledge of the things that are eternal but art imagining in thy minde not being guided by that Spirit which gave forth the Scriptures and so thy konwledge is naturall and cannot contain spirituall things Therefore friend come down to Gods witnesse in thee the light which shews thee sin and convinces thee of evill that light is thy teacher if thou love it and thy condemnation if thou hate it I have divers particulars against thee at a convenient season to manifest thy folly and weakness by them and what ever thou judge me I am a friend to thy soule E Burrough Richard Goodgroom held forth at the Dispute at Draton the 18. day of the 11. moneth 1657. HE said the Letter was the word and by Letter he said he meant the thing contained in the Scriptures And when I said I had the Letter in my hand meaning my Bible but not the thing signified he said but I had the thing signified and he said people were justified by Christ excluding the new birth and the work of sanctification and Christ justified sinners as sinners that is while sinners remaining in sin At Justice Fortescues house in the yeare 1656. he did deny that any was converted to God by a light within and then asked if it was not that same light which converted which gave the knowledge of God and they confessed yea and yet did deny that the light within converted to God though I shewed them that Scripture 2 Cor. 4. 6. which did confound the deceit At Uxbridge one time he said Christ needed not to have come to have judged the world for there was sin enough in the world to judge it before he came Then I asked if sinne judged the world and he answered yea and he said they were in the Covenant of God spoken of Nehem. 9. which turned the law of God behind their backs THE END
SOMETHING OF TRUTH MADE MANIFEST In Relation to a Dispute at Draton in the County of Middlesex in the first Moneth last in opposition to the false account given of it by one Philip Taverner in his BOOK styled the QVAKERS-ROVNDS OR A Faithfull Account c. And this is written for the Truths sake by E. B. LONDON Printed for Thomas Simmons at the Bull and Mouth neer Aldersgate 1658. FOrasmuch as one who hath I suppose ambitiously stiled himselfe Mr. Philip Taverner hath taken in hand to set forth to the view of the world an account relation of a dispute happening in the 11. moneth last at Draton neer Colebrook to which relation I am a little engaged to write somthing by way of answer thereunto that all people may know the truth and being the truth is somewhat concerned herein that is the reason wherefore I have taken in hand to write a little by way of answer to his relation being without any prejudice towards the man as concerning any wrong he hath done to me though me as well as the truth he hath wronged as may appeare to such who desire to know the truth It 's true a publique dispute I had the time and place mentioned with a company of Priests and this same Philip Taverner was one of them and the occasion of the Dispute was thus I being a few weeks before at a meeting with some friends in the said Towne one Richard Goodgroom in his relation mentioned was present at the hearing of what was spoken but at that time did not object any thing though afterwards in London and other places he went up and down in a backbiting manner and gave forth that I had held forth blasphemous Doctrine or the like whereupon I much desired a dispute for the tryall of those things and it was accomplished and that day the truth was much made manifest and deceit consounded and as to all the things objected agauist me by R. G. which he would have seemed to have taken great occasion thereby as if some great matter of heresie and errour had been uttered by me I say the very truth of all these things was demonstrated according as I had laid them down and his arguments against them made of none effect and though such as hardned their hearts might go unfatisfied and in greater unbelief then they came yet I am sure the upright-hearted and such as desired the knowledge of the truth were wholly satisfied and this many can give testimony of with me And though by his relation it may appear otherwise to some yet wherein he hath related falsly it shall fall upon his own head and his folly shall truly more appear in the end then he would have or seem to cause any in me to appear at this present and so he might with more credit to himself been silent then to have medled in that wherein he hath shewed himself so imperfect For I believe that this same Philip Taverner hath given a relation of four times as much as he did speak at that meeting and have related as though he spake that which he never uttered by so miny times so much as I have said and have not related so much by many times as was spoken by me and by them of my part as many may witnesse which work of his seems not to be perfect neither yet altogether honest as sober men may judge but such a thing must redownd more to his own dishonour then to the truths disadvantage And first as to the Title of his false relation which is stiled The Quakers Rounds or a faithfull Account c. To this I answer that the very Frontispiece and Title of his Book savours of a vain light scornfull spirit and so every spiritual man may judge of it to be so but why dost thou P. T. say a faithfull account but that to confirme falshood with audacious words having a shew of confidence upon it thereby the more easily to enter into the hearts of the people as if it were irreproveable coming also from the hand and under the hand of a Mr. Philip c. having so stiled thy self to make thy fame great and to publish thy work under a seeming authority but hadst thou had more humility lesse pride would have appeared and hadst thou had a better heart lesse of unfaithfull dealing would have proceeded from thee but as I have said evill shall fall upon himselfe that hatcheth it for another but why dost thou say Faithful Account in the Title page signifying to the world that all in it is true and nothing of truth wanting in relation to that Dispute and yet in thy Epistle saith thou dost not undertake to set down the multitude of words that that day was filled withal and page 29. saith that a third man of the company made a large discourse concerning the person justified but relates not one word what was said by him and here thou hast not dealt faithfully nor given a faithful account And page 31. thou saith E. B. at such a time did multiply many words but doth not relate his particular words and so hath not in this dealt faithfully nor given a faithful account and also in many other things thou hast not related what was spoken at all and thus thou hast contradicted thy self in saying a faithfull account and yet consessing in effect unfaithfulnesse And thy own words being compared together proves a contradiction in thy own minde and pen for to give a faithfull account as thou saist thou hast is to relate the whole truth and not to keep any back neither to speak more then the truth by adding thereto any thing But again thou saist thou undertak'st not to relate the multitude or every particular of words neither doth relate what particular words such a one and such a one spake but saith he said so and multiplyed many words not saying what his words were and therefore thou hast heaped a contradiction upon thy own head and it shall remain till it have made thee ashamed And now as to the particulars upon which the Dispute depended so far as they are truly laid down in my words and in my intent and meaning I am ready to justifie them at any place or time convenient or before any Auditory whatsoever upon lawfull occasion but as thou hast laid them down or some of them thou hast wronged me and the truth and either not understood my meaning or subverted and perverted my words to thy own advantage And whereas in the Epistle thou saist I would not owne them viz the particulars laid down to be mine at first and yet owned every one of them in the discourse c. Answ. I did not own them but how and how did I own them but thus the Objector had laid down some of the particulars not in my words which made them vary from the intent of my meaning and others of the particulars he had laid down utterly false and so I did
divers of us at that meeting which is not particularly related which definition of our justification they could not except against for we never were nor are ashamed to declare what we hold concerning justification which is through faith in the blood of Christ the seed of the Covenant and though at that time they made much jangling yet to no purpose as to convince us of any errour or any sober men there present of any errour in us as concerning that thing And whereas it is related as if I should say We are men brought up at plow-tayle and understand not Scholar like terms my words were not thus spoken but upon the occasion of their speaking words which is not in Scripture-language as inherent righteousnesse for such like Whereupon I desired them to keep to the form of sound words and of Scripture-language that people might understand what they spoke For said I ye are Scholers as ye professe and some of us were brought up at Plow or Cart and may be doth not understand Scholar-like termes though I did not meane all of us and what some of us do understand as to that I shall not now speak yet this I say the least of us doth understand betwixt truth and error and between that which is righteous and that which is unrighteous and in that is more peace then in the knowledge of Arts or Tongues and our knowledge in that is dung and losse in comparison of the other And as to Justification upon which subject we contended a long time though they foolishly charged us with it we do deny utterly the works of man and the works of mans righteousnesse as in relation to our justification and that it is only and wholly by grace and gift of God and the righteousnesse of Christ who is revealed in all that believe in him by which justification comes yet say we that faith without works is dead and will not justifie a man but by that faith which brings forth works even the works of God in us and through us by that faith are we justified and according to the Apostles words so we believe not by works of righteousnesse which we have done nor by a dead faith without works but by a living faith which worketh in us are we justified Let vain men deduct what they may this is truth in the sight of the Lord and all men These indeed are the particulars upon which the Controversie depended and having been some hours together they were willing to depart and R. G. would give little hearing to me when I charged him with something uttered by him at divers times in my hearing which I should have proved to be unsound doctrine and error had he had that patience to have stayed and whereas P. T. doth speak of having a Pope in our bellies with such like scornful words which a discreet man would not have defiled his mouth withal but that he must shew himself to be of the generation of Priests who persecuted the innocent in every age and for his telling of our error and recovering of our feet out of the snare and delivering us from the delusion its true his words stands but upon a supposition and that supposition stands upon the report of others as he seems to intimate which is but a thing far off true credit for what error and snares and delusion did P. T. convince us of in five hours discourse not any at all but the rather was forced to confess to the most part of what we delivered then what need was there to utter these his words in writing as if he had heard some great matter of delusion or error but all these his words I do bear and if he hath harboured such thoughts of us as it appears too much by his words let him cleanse his heart by repentance lest his intended evil bruise his own head And whereas he hath commented upon a book called a Standerd lifted up which book I own and that which is therein written and himself is forced to own what himself objects against and comments upon if saith he E. B. mean so and so then his words are truth but if so and so then it is Pope like or such like Alas poor man must I be judged upon thy own meaning nay or must thy interpretation be the judge upon my words We have no such law my words stands true as I have laid them down to be received by such as are spiritual and such as loves to raise constructions falsely where there is no just ground their judgement I do deny and charity will teach P. T. to judge upon the best sence and so let him own my words as truth and judge himself for his false construction of true and upright words onely this I take notice of saith P. T. A perfect conformity to the Law of God in our own persons though not wrought in our own strength but in the strength and power of grace the spirit working all in us and for us is no other then the righteousness of the Law I need not much strive to confound this black doctrine by many arguments or multitude of words for the thing as laid down in his own words is vile and abominable to the understanding of any spiritual man for say I if it be the spirit working in us and for us not in our own strength then is it God that worketh in us both to will and to do and the fulfilling of the righteousness of the Law in us and not the righteousness of the Law wrought by us and if it be in the strength and power of grace not in our own strength then it is the work of Christ in us and the work of Gods own righteousness in us and any man that knows the least of God in truth will witness to this and against his imagined doctrine held forth by P. T. I might demand a proof of him from Scripture where it is said or signified that the working of the spirit all in us and for us and the working of the power of grace in the creature is reckoned to be our own righteousness the righteousness of the Law and my words stands true from which he draws his false consequences and layes down his dark assertions and my own words I do own which are such as are taught by Christ and guided by him in all the wayes of righteousness are justified by him and none else not in any word or work whatsoever but in what they are led to fulfil by him and in these words there is neither contradiction nor unsoundnesse though he hath ignorantly charged them with both but the words shall stand for a testimony against him and all his false deductions and he and all shall know that God justifies the righteous and condemns the wicked and that it is the new man that is justified and not the old and let righteous men judge what can be in such a mans heart who can draw so bad
consequences from such upright words But farther he goes on and hath transcribed more of my words as Christ Iesus the Son of God is the light and life of the world and hath inlightned all mankind that comes into the world with the true light c. Now saith he how doth these agree with mans state in the first Adam in transgression is a state of perfect enmity and death raigns in every man he is possessed with blindness and unbelief c. I say these do very well agree and they are both true for death raigns in every man and he is in unbelief and ignorance and in a state of perfect enmity against God as he is in the first Adam yet Christ hath lightned him and the light of Christ shines in darkness in him and the darkness comprehends it not he is inlightned that he may be changed from death to life and from ignorance to knowledge and though he walk in darkness and be in blindness and in a state of enmity it is because he doth not walk and believe in the light which Christ hath lightned him withal and in my words there is no disagreement nor contradiction the darkness is in his own mind who cannot comprehend the light nor the words that proceed from it Further he questions upon my words of having the witness in themselves of being restored again First whether none are restored again but such as have the witness in themselves I answer all that are restored again and doth believe hath the witness in themselves and none doth believe nor are restored but they have the witness of it Secondly he queries whether all are restored but some want the witness in themselves I answer All are not restored nor doth believe and such wants the witness in themselves that are not restored to God but them that are restored wants it not And again he queries whether the light which is in all is sufficient without any thing further of grace super-added to bring up every man to believe in Christ c I answer The light which every man is lightned withal by Christ is sufficient to bring up every man to believe in Christ that loves the light and walks in it and unto such is grace added and increased daily for as every man improves the measure of the gift of God so it is increased the light is increased grace is increased faith is increased but still the light of Christ in it self is sufficient Again from my words to wit the spirit is given to be the guide and rule of life to the children of God from whence he queries whether the spirit is so given to be the guide and rule of life to the Saints that they have no more need to attend upon the Scriptures I answer It is promised that the spirit shall lead into all truth and such doth own the Scriptures but not as their teacher for the anointing dwells in them and they need no man to teach them but as that anointing teacheth all things and they have no need of the Scripture to teach them for all the children of God are taught of God and needs not any other teacher nor needs not to say one to another know the Lord and yet all such doth own the Scriptures to be the testimony of that which they believe and have received Again from my words to wit the light of Christ in every one shall give testimony to the truth of what I spake unto which I do commend my self from this he queries can these be witnesses to me and of the truth in me who are ignorant of the life and power of the Creator c. who are following the counsel of their own hearts which are evil c I answer Yes the light of Christ in such shall judge one day and to it I commend my self and by it one day shall be approved though now the wicked hate the light yet doth it witness against them and for us that we are of God though its true they cannot judge between light and darkness between truth and error yet the light in them which shines in their darkness doth judge and put a difference and when the book of conscience is opened it shall justifie us and condemn our enemies Again he queries whether I make the Holy Ghost and the eternal Spirit two I answer no they are one neither do I seem to make them two it is want of knowledge in him who cannot understand but raiseth objections where there is no cause Again from my words this is acceptable and well-pleasing to God above all words and outward conformity c. from this he questions whether the doing the greater things of the Law is acceptable where the less are neglected I answer No for every tittle of the Law less and greater must be fulfilled by Christ in us in whom we are accepted and thus I have returned a few words to the consideration of people and particularly the people of Draton and the Country thereabouts to whom I direct my speech thus All ye people who are scattered as sheep without a Shepherd and knows not Christ the everlasting shepherd to lead you to rule you cease oh cease from all your teachers without you who are dumb shepherds which doth not gather you to God such are they that preach for hire and devine for money and that takes gifts and rewards for preaching who through covetousness by feigned words doth make merchandise of souls such do keep you always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth under their teachings your souls are starved under them and you perish for want of true knowledge and death raigns amongst you and many are in the broad way that leads to destruction but few in the strait way that leads to life and iniquity and wickedness abounds amongst you and like teachers like people for from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness Jer. 6. 13. great ignorance hath blinded your minds and great darkness is over your hearts and your teachers doth deceive you and they cause you to erre and you give your money for that which is not bread and your labour for that which doth not profit even as the people of Israel did so do you and in their transgressions do you walk and your teachers are in the steps of the Pharisees they are called of men Master as the Pharisees were they stand praying in the Synagogues and Temples as the Pharisees did and they have the chief seats in the Assemblies as the Pharisees had and they even shut the kingdom of heaven against men as the Pharisees did and will not enter in themselves nor suffer them that would cease from all your outward Priests and hearken to the voice of the Lord which breaks down that nature which is contrary to God and raiseth up the seed which is heir of Gods kingdom turns your minds to the light