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A47813 The casuist uncas'd, in a dialogue betwixt Richard and Baxter, with a moderator between them, for quietnesse sake by Roger L'Estrange. L'Estrange, Roger, Sir, 1616-1704. 1680 (1680) Wing L1209; ESTC R233643 73,385 86

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Uniformi●y made Episcopacy and Common-p●ayer unlawf●ll 'T is the Law that Silences an● not the Bishops Non-Conformists silence themselves Berter particulars suffer then 〈◊〉 Order o●●●vernment be dissolved Richard ag●ees with Dr Reynolds 〈◊〉 conform'd Richard pleads altogether for Love Ba●ters way of e●pressing ●ichard against rash ●●nsuring 〈…〉 Baxter ag●inst Rich●rd Mr Ba●ters Cha●ity to the Clergy and discip●ine of ●he Chu●ch His brotherly Love Church ann State arraign d. Richard and Baxter of two quite different spirits The persecuted are the perssecutors Be sure first of what spirit ●he Non-Confo●mists are The spirit of the Non-Conformists His Late Majesties Judgement Experience upon it The spirit that Richard pl●ads ●or Richards ●oleration Who are the Judges the Government or the People Modest Dissenters deserve pity The Dispute is not Scruple but Power Plain dealing Richard puts the Case of a Saint and a Schismatick Baxters Saints Baxter sully resolved to go to them that dy'd in Rebellion He joys to think what Company he shall have Baxter says that Professors will rail and lye c. But that neither Perjury drunkennesse Incest Concubines nor Idols can make them dotoriously ungodly The Saints that are cast out for hereticks Either Tolerate All or None but upon a Penalty No men must be Tolerated if no Errour Baxter shews the Inconveniences of Toleration Pride makes one mans Religion Faction anothe●s Which ends in bloud And yet pass●● for doing God good service And the motion of the spirit Enthusiastick zea● Dotage●●a●en fo● Re●elations Scripture the Ru●e But who must expound it One mans Faith must not Impose upon anot●ers Mistake will not justifie the Errour nor ex●use a Disobedience Men will be zealous even in Errour More zeal then understanding is not good None so fierce and bold as ●he Ignorant Even Teachers themselves are false Guides M● Baxter himself has been mistaken Ill luck with his Aphorisms How Richard was wheedled in i. e. he was reconci ' d to the Church Richards best Christians found to ●e Schismaticks Great m●n misled and why not 〈…〉 Believe not every spirit T●e Dissenters Cause is still Gods cause Their false Prophets T●e Kings death directed by a Revelation Sedgwicks day of Judgment Vavas●r Powe●s Prophecy of no more Kings or Taxe● Rather the Law of the Land then the Humour of the people A Fear of sinning ought to be cherished even in a mistake Dangerous trusting to scruples Who would have thought it Th● Episcopal Clergy Simeon and Levi. O the force of a misguided Con●cience The very Case of the seduced mu●●i●ude The Name of Libe●ty does mo●e ●●en ●he conside●atio● 〈◊〉 Heaven it self Baxt●r against Liberty And Toleration Liberty the way to set up Popery Mr. Richard an Improper Advocate for Toleration Richard is a Conformist Mr. Baxters Sermon that brought the King in Presbytery for the Lords sake Oh the happy times when Presbyterians rul'd Have a care of scandalous Inventions The Ignorant Church-Tyrants Richard not absolutely against the Cross. ●axters a Loyallist Errour is no e●cuse for disobedience The Pre●eoce of Natu●e and true Reason avoids ●ll Law A Popu●ar Fallacy The Presby●eri●n way of b●in●ing in ●he King Richards challenge In justification o● the Non-Conformis●s The Non-Conformists charge A Presbyterian defin'd Presbyterians swallow ap all othe● Sect● at ●irst and t●en sp●w the● up ag●in Richard say● that the Episc●pal m●n b●gan ●he war T●e two Hous●s Lord ●ieu●e●●n●s O●●ic●r Civil and Mi●i●●●y Assemb●y 〈◊〉 Divine● a●m●st all Episcop●l m●n The Kings ●●gag'd Enem●●●●ere all 〈◊〉 〈…〉 The Parliament b●ought in the Scots Few worthier Assemblies since the Apostles days Their good na●u●e toward the Independents The Guild-Hall ha●●ngue● 〈◊〉 brought in the Scots His Majesties Proclamation against the Assembly of Divines Jun 22. 1643. Painful Able Laborious Ministers The Loyall Presbyterians The 〈…〉 Kings Proclamation A Dutiful Proposition The Worthy 〈◊〉 The 〈…〉 An Abuse put upon the Nation An Extract of Par●iament Proceedings 1643. The Assembly stir up the people to rise Prov'd to he a Presbyterian War Richard says the War began about Religion Baxter says it began about matter of Law Richard says 't was about the Militia Baxter says the War was made for Reformation A lewd scandal upon the late Kings Government R●c●ard will not allow of war ●ot Religion Baxter i● for a Re●igious Wer. They are fools that think ●ther 〈◊〉 In ca●● o● p●r●secuti●● we figh●●or our own and our pos●eri●●●●●al●ation The late Kings s●ffe●ings forgot en among g●eater 〈…〉 Pryn Burton and Bastwick lamented but not a word ●f the Royal Mar●yr Presbytery not setled say● Rich●rd Baxter contradicts hi● And co●fo●●s himsel● with comparing 〈◊〉 day of Richard P●otector wi●h Charle ● Ten 〈◊〉 Hypocrites Now 〈◊〉 One 〈◊〉 Baxters Comp●e●en● to the Sons of the 〈◊〉 1659 Richard Cromwells fait●full Subiects Mr. Baxters Political Aphorismes composed expresly to keep out the King Poor R●chard like 〈…〉 and pr●ying again●t the Scots The spirit of Malignity has taken 〈◊〉 the Army The Presbyterians Per●ecuted The Presbyterians Journey-men the Army se● up for themselves Somewhat of an accomoda-Generosi●y in the Independents The poor Presbyterians persecuted by the Army for not joyning against the Scots Oh the persecution o● forcing men against their Conscien●es But so long as ●hey do not suffer as evil-doers No persecution to oppresse the Church and all that love it Mr. Baxt●r places the Crown upon the wrong Head The King destroy'd by Presbyterians as Presbyterians The Loyalty of ●axters Orthodox sober Ministers Richard subject to the Higher power but not resolv'd which it is An Even score of Orthodox sober Divines The last Kings bloud not valu'd at a Ceremony ☞ The Kings Murther justify'd the day after it was committed All Christian Kings Anti-Christianiz'd ☜ A Reflection upon ●is Majes●y a●●er his De●e●t at Wo●cester Prelacy Anti-Christian A Pedant triumphing over Charles the II. and Monarchy it self And calling the King Tyrant Are These Fit Agents for Unity and Peace Richard True to the King but he mistook the King Baxters Re●stauration Sermon Asserts the Presbyterian Loyalty Makes the King a Subject and worse Pleads for Presbytery without a word of restoring the King The War rais●d for King and Par●ia●ent Their Oaths Covenants were fast and loose at pleasure The pretext of the War Religion the Cause Ambition The Loyal Presbyte●ians usurp Sovereign Power The Two Houses were the King in the Covenant No Reconciling of the Covenant King the Legal Richard holds Oaths to Princes to be Dispensable Baxter holds Oaths of Allegiance to be Indispensable Richard will hate the Covenant binding as it is a Vow The League and Covenant and Vow and Covenant The League and Covenant Impos d. Baxter is his own on●essor ●nd bsolves himse●f The Covenan● for the King qualify'd for Re●igion If the King be against Religion the Covenant is against him Richard lays the Death of the King to Oliver The Baxterians attack'd the King And they fough● to kill
Disobedience to their Guides and of Schism and doing much more to the hurt of the Church a very great Sin Peter Lot and 't is like David did oft commit greater Sins R. B's Five Disdutes of Right to Sacraments P. 329. But a man must be guilty of more sins then Peter was in denying and forswearing Christ that is notoriously ungodly yea then Lot was who was drunk two nights together and committed Incest twice with his own Daughters and that after the miraculous destruction of Sodom of his own wife and his own miraculous Deliverance Nay a man that is notoriously ungodly in the sense in hand or Unsanctify'd must be a greater sinner then Solomon was with his Seven hundred Wives three hundred Concubines and gross● Idolatries P. 326.327 Mo. And are These the Saints Gentlemen that you are afraid should be cast out for Schismatiques They must be of your own Canonizing then for I assure you I finde no such Saints in our Kalendar But let me hear I beseech you whom we are to keep out and whom to take in Ri. We must either Tolerate All men to do what they will which they will make a matter of Conscience or Religion and then some may offer their Children in sacrifice to the Devil and some may think they do God service in killing his Servants c. Or else you must Tolerate no Errour or fault in Religion and then you must advise what measure of Penalty you will Inflict Church-Divis P. 363 364. Mo The two great Difficulties will be to say what Errours are Tolerable and what not and then to bring the Magistrate and the People to an Agreement upon the matter Ri If no Errour were to be a Tolerated no men were to be Tolerated and the Wisest in the World must be numbred with the Intolerable as well as the rest Church Divis. P. 348. Ba. But some People make those things to be Duties which are no Duties and Sins which are no Sins calling Evil Good and Good Evil and having made a Religion of their own confidently think that it is of God valuing all men that they have to do with according as they are nearer or further off from This which they account the way of God chusing a Church or Party to joyn with by the Test of This Religion which their Pride has C●osen Church Divis. P. 11. Thus they divide the Kingdom and Family of Christ destroying first the Love of Brethren and Neighbours in themselves and then labouring to destroy it in all Others by speaking against those that are not in their own way with Contempt and Obloquy to represent them as an Unlovely sort of Men and if the Interest of their Cause and Party require it perhaps they will next destroy their Persons And yet all this is done in zeal of God and as an Acceptable service to him Ibid. P. 12. And they think it a resisting of the Spirit to resist their Judgment P. 13. I have known too many very honest-hearted Christians especially Melancholique Persons and Women who have been in great doubt about the Opinions of the Millenaries the Separatists the Anabaptists the Seekers and such like and after earnest Prayer to God they have been strongly resolved for the way of Errour and Confident by the strong Impression that it was the Spirits Answer to their Prayers and thereupon they have set themselves into a Course of Sin Ibid. P. 162. And In truth it is very Ordinary with poor phancyfull Women and Melancholy Persons to take all their deep Apprehensions for Revelations Ibid. P. 167. Mo. Well but these people all this while take themselves to be in the right Ba. But as for that which is Contrary to Scripture I am sure it is contrary to the Will of God Church Divis. P. 166. Mo. Out of all doubt but what if They expound the Scripture One way and You Another Ba. Why if they believe That themselves which they can give you no reason to believe they must be content to keep their belief to themselves and not for shame perswade any other to it without proof If they say that God hath revealed it to them tell them that he hath not revealed it to You and therefore That 's nothing to You till they prove their Divine Revelation If God reveal it to them but for themselves they must keep it to themselves Ibid. P. 166. If they say that the spirit hath told Them the meaning of the Scripture say as before that it is not told to you which is not proved to you Ibid 167. But if we do through weaknesse or perversnesse take lawful things to be unlawfull That will not excuse Us in our disobedience Our Errour is our Sin and one Sin will not excuse another R. B's Five Disput. P. 483. He that mistakingly thinks any thing is good or bad Duty or Sin which is not so will be zealous in persute of his Mistake if he be serious for God Cath. Theol. Pref. It is an Ill sign when your zeal is beyond the proportion of your Understanding And your Prudence and Experience is much lesse then other mens as your zeal is greater Church Divis. P. 123. Beside that the more weak and worthlesse and Erroneous any ones Judgment is usually the more furious are they in the prosecution of it as if all were most certain Truth which they apprehend These are the boldest both in Schisms and persecutions Ibid. 357. Mo. But you will say that in cases where the common people may be imposed upon by Cred●lity Phancy or Weaknesse they may repair to their Teachers to set them right Ba. Even the most of Teachers take abundance of things for true and good that are false and evill and for false and bad which are true and good Much more are godly vulgar people Ignorant and consequently erre in many things Cath. Theol. Pref. And I my self was mistaken in my Aphorisms of Iustification and the Cov●nants as I have acknowledged in the same Preface Mo. You have had very ill luck Sir with your Aphorisms Ri. I must confess that when God had first brought me from among the more Ignorant sort of people and when I heard Religious Persons pray without Form and Speak affectionately and seriously of Spiritual and Heavenly things I thought verily that they were all undoubted Saints till e're long of those whom I so m●ch honoured one fell of to Sensuality and to Persecuting Formality and another fell to the foulest Heresy and another to disturb the Churches Peace by Turbulent Animositys and Divisions Church Divil P. 23.24 c. Ri. I thought once that all the talk against Schisme and Sects did but vent their Malice against the best Christians u●der those Names But since Then I have seen what Love-killing-Principles have done I have long stood by while Churches have been divided and Subdivided one Congregation of