Selected quad for the lemma: spirit_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
spirit_n	pray_v	prayer_n	supplication_n	6,912	5	11.1562	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A81412	A dialqgue [sic] betwen [sic] a dissenter and a church-man touching general and particular points. General, viz. of common-prayer, surplice, cross in baptizm, kneeling at sacrament, god-fathers and mothers, baptism it self. Particular. Of original sin, general redemption.		1689 (1689)	Wing D1293aA; ESTC R227165	12,793	20

A DIALOGVE BETWEN A DISSENTER AND A CHURCH-MAN Touching General and Particular POINTS General Viz. Of Common-Prayer Surplice Cross in Baptizm Kneeling at Sacrament God-Fathers and Mothers Baptism it self Particular Of Original Sin General Redemption Contend earnestly for the Faith once delivered to the Saints London Printed in the Year 1689. A DIALOGUE Between a DISSENTER And a CHURCH-MAN c. Dissenter VVEll met Brother Protestant in this day when there is so many Fears and Jealousies abroad in the World one cries one thing another cries another thing but none of them can tell what to say Church-man Why what do they say if I may ask you for I am a Man that do not much enquire after News Dissen Why some say the Bishops will have the Dissenters down and will not allow Liberty of Conscience others say they will be all upon even ground but it is certain nothing can be before the Parliament settle it But what think you Church-m I think and hope the Dissenters will not have that Liberty that you think they will for they are a Factious People and such as will sow Sedition amongst us and what have been the effect of their having their Liberty but Trouble and unhappy Wars Dissen Well but why so fast upon the Dissenters you make as if they were the worst People in the World you Run upon them but pray instance in what they are so bad Church-m Why they will not comply with the Laws of the Land and Government of the Church they will not allow of the Common-Prayer and Latteny of the Church with the Surplice and other Ceremonies of it Established by Law. Dissen First you say they will not comply with the Laws of the Land pray what Law is it that they break Do not they pay all manner of Taxes and Excise and Custom as others do All that you can charge them with is in matters of the Church and that of their Conscience and in that Cause whether it be lawful to obey God or Man judge you and I hope before we have done I shall find you of a more Charitable temper and do hope we shall better agree for I delight not in the heats of Passion but had rather do all things in Love I am perswaded were there a right understanding of our Principles you would not have so hard thoughts of us And you ought to put on if you be the Elect of God Bowels of Mercy and yet let us cōntend earnestly for the Faith delivered to the Saints and that Faith let us stick and stand by it is but some hot spirits that will not come to the Touch that have made all those Differences among us that are Secondly in matters of the Church you say they disagree well this is a Point of Conscience and we cannot agree with your Church in this for they hold a Form of Prayer and we a Spirit of Prayer and this is a Point to be cleared Church-m Why it is clear enough the Apostle commands that Prayers and Supplications be made for all Men Mark the Word he made and if made who shall they be made by but by the holy Men of the Church Dissen Well I grant the Apostle doth say so but what doth the same Apostle say Pray in the Spirit and pray with Understanding now if by the Spirit not by a Form for if you go by Form you tye up the Spirit to that Form beside the Apostle bid us walk as you have us for an Example now if he had intended a Form of Prayer would not he have given us the Example now if I must follow a Form I must have the Example of the Apostles for it and also the same that they had if any Man receive any thing in the Woship of God more then God hath Instituted and Commanded by the Apostle let him be accursed And do not your Church make the Common Paryer a Tradition in the Church and teach it for a Doctrine nay do not they say it is more Sin to neglect that then it is to neglect a Sermon from the Word of God and they show it plainly for if a Man come to the Sermon and not to the Prayer they will nevertheless Excommunicate them from Communion Church-m You require an Example of the Apostles well I will give you the Example of their Lord and Master when you pray say Our Father which art in Heaven c. I hope this will convince you that a Form is lawful and so end the Controversie shortly Dissen Now you say well and here I must fall if I cannot stand I acknowledge Christ did give this Form but we must consider two things first the Reason why this Prayer was given secondly the time when it was given and first the Reason why because they should not be like the Heathen which in a Form used long Prayers to be seen of Men and therefore our Saviour tells thom when you pray let it be in secret another Reason was because as yet they had not the knowledge of Prayer according to the Will of God Secondly the time when the Prayer was given it was when the Apostles were Young and they had not received the holy Spirit which our Saviour told them should lead them into all Truth so that then it was very necessary that they might know what to pray for but as in the Type of the Law when the Antitype appeared the Type vanished so now when the Spirit of Truth appeared to lead into a Spirit of Prayer the Form of Prayer must cease now Christ tells them as though he should have said I give you now a Form of Prayer that you may know how to pray that so you may be found in your Duty till I go and then I will send you the Spirit of Truth and that shall direct you into Truth without a Form and besides when the Holy Ghost came down like cloven Tongues in the days of Penticost do you think it came with a Form Besides if our Saviour had intended Forms would he not have given more and seeing he hath given no more how dare you use more if it were law ful seeing the Apostle saith Let him be accursed that add or diminish besides you make the Spirit of no effect for if Christ hath said he will give his Spirit to them that ask and that that Spirit shall lead into all Truth and yet you will not trust to that Spirit to lead you do not you tell our Lord that you will not believe him nor his Spirit but will rather pray by the Example of Men then by that Spirit and so you make it of no effect tell you or your Ministers of a Spirit of Prayer and do not they make a Laugh and a Scoff at it Oh for shame away with this Spirit Church-m Well I see you think your self wiser then all the Fathers of our Church but a Man in his own wisdom may fall what then do you say that our Prayers were not

Pen'd by the Inspiration of the holy Spirit this is hard judging but suppose they were writ by Inspiration of the Holy Ghost what then can you say against it but that it is good and ought to be used but I see you will grow hot upon it and so we had as good leave of while we are Friends Dissen No no I am resolved not to go into any heat but to go on in Love for we must contend for the Faith First you say I think my self wise and my Wisdom may fall I do not think my self wise but that Wisdom I have I hope it is from God and if God doth suffer that to fall his Word shall not fall you say it might be Pen'd by the Holy Ghost well we will grant it that it was tho I cannot tell but do your Bishops and the Docters of your Church that Pen'd it pretend to Infalibility yea or no Church-m No our Church holds no Infalibility Dissen Well then there is no Church that can claim Superiority over the Consciences of Men in matter of Religion but that Church that can claim Infalibility and if your Church could claim Infalibility she could not force all Men to believe it for by that Consequence all that decent from the Church of Rome must be Hereticks indeed as she calls them for she claims to her self Infalibility but if you have no Infalibility why then do you compel Men to come to that which may be subject to errors as well as themselves So that make the best of them you cannot make more of them then the Tradition of Men and what doth our Saviour say of them that teach for Truth the Traditions of Men. Church-m Come come with all your ado I do not believe that you can make better Prayers then the Prayers of our Church and therefore do not despife them they are good Dissen Stay Friend the excellency of a Prayer does not consist in the multitude of Words and eloquence of Speeches for then the Pharisees would a had Heaven for their Prayers besides we have a precept from our Lord Use not long Prayers and vain Repetitions but my Son give me thy Heart and God accepts of the broken in Heart and the Lord saith If their Prayers be as the Chattering of a Crane or a Swallow if it be in sincerity he will accept it and he will not despise the day of small things and the bruised Reed he will not break but he will bring forth Judgment unto Victory and many such like places of Scripture all to show that it is not the Mouth but the Heart that God asks and beside there is nothing acceptable to God but what comes from him now can another make a Prayer that may sute my Condition No none can tell my wants so well as my self Church-m Why is there not a Prayer for all Conditions that you can name Dissen But I tell you God accepts of nothing but what comes immediately from himself and how can that matter come from his Spirit which must be limitted in a Form Church-m By having a Form we know what to pray for before we come to God and so we come with a sence of what we go to beg for Dissen But still this does but strengthen the Argument that you will not trust the Spirit of God to indite the matter in you but you will rather trust to Man when as God hath said I will give my Spirit to them that ask it and our Saviour said when you come before Men Take no thought what you shall say for it shall be given you in that same hour And do you think that he who hath said he will do so for you when you appear before Man and in the Cause at the most of but a natural Life for the Body will leave you and not give you what you shall say when you come before God and for such high things as are Spiritual eternal and that which concerns the Soul Oh do not think it what do you think Christ dyed for but for to be a Mediator now if you come to go in such exact Forms and they be holy what need is there of him to wash your Prayers he must stand by for nothing Church-m Well I wonder how you can speak against them being they are most of them taken out of the Scripture sure then you must over-turn the Scripture Dissen You think you have done well now but hear what the Scripture saith He that addeth to it let him be accursed now here is the Scripture and the Traditions of the Fathers put together and that which makes it the Sin is the teaching of it for Truth and making it the bounds of Communing for let a Man be of what Principle he will if he will but come to Church and hear the Common-Prayer he may Commune where as on the other hand let a Man be never so sound Principled if he do not come to hear the Common Prayer he is no Communicant so that it is the Composing by Men and the Imposing upon Men which makes it the Sin and beside all this as the New Testament was put to the Old the Common Prayer was put to both now of these things judge you where the error is and if you have any more to speak as to this Point say on or else let us pass to something else what you please Church-m Say what shall I say say what I will you will have it your way and therefore I had as good hold my Tongue and if you will go further you shall propound what Dissen No I will not have my way no further then the Scripture will judge and try it but since you have put it to me to state the question pray let it be about the Surplice why have you that Ceremony in your Church and also the Cross in Baptism and Kneeling at the Sacrament what mean all these Ceremonies in your Church and after we have cleared these we will come to particular Points Church-m First You say the Surplice doth that offend you I will tell you in all Ages the Priests were to have Garments to distinguish them from other People as in Aaron's time the Priests were to ware a Linning Ephod and his Garments were to have Bells upon them and so the Priests Garments were appointed by God and they must do as God commanded them and if so why in this time may not the Priests go in such Garments as may distinguish them for what did God do so for but to distinguish them from the common People Secondly You say the Cross in Baptism does also offend you tho I am sory it should for our Church do declare when they do it that it is in sign of bearing the Cross of Christ and to show that they should not be ashamed of the Christianity into which they were Baptized Thirdly You say Kneeling at the Sacrament I confess these are Ceremonies of the Church but yet they are good in