tho my Answer were sound yet not very Acceptable for it was in Scripture terms It is true I am utterly against it that Scripture should bow to vain Philosophy and to be wise above what is written and also it seems one thing not liked my forsakeing those People with whom I have walked it is true while they walked I walked with them but when they grew weary and sat down must I be blamed for not doing as they did because I walked still and that by the Footsteeps of the Flock according to there own adivce and cannot set down or turn back There is one thing that I have observed of the like nature and is counted rather a Vertue then a Vice in others which is this in the time when the Sheepherds fled and the People scattered the Cross of Christ appearing the People crept in under the Wing of the Church of England for shelter I do not say to avoid the Cross of Christ look they to that sheltered they were and fed too with such food as they had to give them if not wholsome why did they use it What made them there Why did their Stewards permit it if they found the Bread of Life there Why are they drawn off again was not this permitted by thee and others if not approved and why was it to keep the Children quiet that they might not Cry for Bread when the Stewards would not give them any for the Lyon was in the way was it good Bread then and is it Husks now Now they will feed these People themselves or rather these People must feed them for their Bread now yeildeth a good rate and if they will not come up to the price we will go to another Flock Well now these People must leave those with whom they have walked and be blamless but blamed if they will not leave them surely I must needs say that they all dealt very disingenously with the Church of England to leave them now they have most need of them as I have told many to there Faees and not only so but rejoyce in there Ruin which is an ill requital for there former kindness but enough of that In thy former Letter thy Charges were drawn and in thy last Letter I expected proof of what was then Charged but I have failed of my Expectation and of fare dealing too for the first Bill is lost and a new Indictment is drawn up which is not fare it yet lieth on thee to prove it or bare thy shame In thy first Letter we were Unchristianed by thy false Accusation and lying Slanders no small Evil for a Minister of Christ to be found guilty of to unchristian such a body of People with a bare say so it is a Spot but not of God's Children they are Children that will not lye and it hath caused my Heart to grieve that such a one as thy self should be the author and spreader of them so that many in this place who have had thy Person in admiration have been doing the same evil Work having an Implicet Faith much like a Generation of men who believe as the Church believeth and it is true because the Church saith it and so they did believe it and spread it because thou said'st it But now the Refuge of Lyes is sweeping away People having had oppertunity of hearing Friends and Conversing with them in this place thy Folly now appeareth and thy Assertions are found to be Lyes tho' John Flavell have said it Hicks Faldoe and others for the Earth is lightned with the Glory of the Lord and we would that all men knew us as we are and then let them judge for we are not ashamed of our Principles But to leave the first and come to the Second Charge or Indictment He cannot be a Christian that rejects the Scripture as a Rule But what I have yet found I may say to thee as Nathan to David Thou art the Man for by what Rule are we thus falsely accused and abominably slandered And it is a rare thing this day to find many such as thy self to Slander us Ignorantly and not Malitiously But to the matter of Fact what was Abel's and Noah's and Enoch's Rule Leader or Guide before the Scriptures were written was it not the Spirit of God and the same Spirit that gave forth the Scriptures in time and moved the holy men of Old who spake as the Spirit gave them utterance even the same Spirit of Truth that Christ promised should be given to his Disciples and remain with them and lead them into all Truth John 14. 16 17. chap. 16. 13. We own and honour the Scriptures above all other Writings in the World and they are profitable for Doctrine for Reproof and for Correction and Instruction in Righteousness 2 Tim. 16. We own we are not of the same mind with an Assembly once gathered that the Scriptures are the only Rule then â—arwell to the Spirit of God say I We do believe that it is not in the Power of men to deprive the Saints of their Rule Leader or Guide which iâ— the Spirit of the Lord But if the Scriptures be the only Rule then it is possible that men may be deprived of their Rule by their Enemies Matth. 11. 17. No man knoweth the Father but the Son and he to whom the Son shall reveal him And now I will appeal to all the Faithful in those late Years when their Teachers fled from them when trouble came and Preaching and Hearing became expensive had not a Remnant been taught of God had they not had the Spirit of the Lord to lead and guide and instruct them what had become of them Had there not been Springs in the Desert and Rivers in the Wilderness streaming from the Lord to refresh those distressed Souls what had become of them 3dly He cannot be a Christian that affirmeth Perfection or freedom from Sin on this side Heaven How is the Scripture rejected here and made to bow down to the experience of men who are taught by their Teachers that it is impossible to have the Works of the Devil destroyed and so make void Christ's Coming when something there is that cannot be parted with and therefore a Cry is made damnable Doctrine to have Sin destroyed I shall first lay down that God hath commanded it Gen. 17. 7. Walk before me and be thou perfect Matth. 19. 24. If thou wilt be perfect sell all All must go if God call for it or no Perfection he had done many things and that from his Youth up and many Sins doubtless were slain and the man dead to them A brave Professor for our days but one thing must be kept a Wedge of Gold a Babylonish Garment he had great Possessions and that he could not part with for Treasure in Heaven the pretiousness of which he had not the Experience of by Faith and this made him go away sorrowful doubtless he liked not the Doctrine of Perfection like the
People of our days men can be content to have Drunkenness and Swearing Murder Theft and such like Goliah's slain this is possible to live without to some and cry they will enough against those that will not and well worthy But what Sin is it I would fain know that the Lord cannot yea will not destroy and keep us from as well as these if People did not hide them and will not let them go Is it possible men may have the greater and not the lesser slain by the Power of the Lord if they would bring them forth he would slay them before theâ—r faces There is something that is sweet to them like as to Saul goodly in their Eyes and that must be spared but that which is Wild Disgraceful and Reproachful that must be destroyed but sparing of the other was his Ruin Ah if People were but ingenious and bring forth that to the Sword that is for the Sword and that to the Fire that is for the Fire would not then this Sword and Fire of God's Spirit burn up and destroy those Fatlings and Lambs that they keep in their Bosom as well as that which is Wild and Refuge I shall desire thee to view what thy own Pen hath written pag. 7. of the Saint indeed thy definition of keeping the Heart it is to have the Heart set right It will be too tedious to transcribe all view it what thou sayest there what man was by Creation what man became by Degeneration and what man is by Regeneration where all is set right again and pag. 22. Had they kept their Hearts with God all had been well and what is that but to keep from Sin pag. 13. holy Job durst not suffer his Heart to yield to an impure Thought surely then to no wicked Action and so in a Sinless State as long as he kept there I would fain know of thee if thou dost please whether it be possible for a Christian to observe those directions laid down in thy Book If possible whether that Soul will not then be kept from Sin and if possible why are we then Unchristian'd for believing of it If impossible why thou dost press People then to Impossibilities and take Money for it to view thy own Book well and practice it also and I dare to say thou wilt come to that blessed state Look to the 191 pag. read it at large where thou cryest out Away with bold Censuring But it was but a little way for in the 194 pag. thou canst Censure the Quakers that they never knew what belong to Practical Godliness and study of their own Hearts I beseech thee in the bowels of Love do not be found in the number of them that say and do not by what Scripture-Rule dost thou thus judge the Secrets of thousands of Hearts Persons whom thou never knewest nor sawest View 198 and 199 pag. where thou complainest of the Lives of Professors and how can it be otherwise What is the Reason of it they are told it is impossible to get themselves free of Sin and so one sets down Captivated with one Sin and another with another Sin I tell thee in the Bowels of Love that if ever the Lord did send thee to Preach the Gospel it was for the Perfecting of the Saints and turning men from the Power of Satan to the Power of God and from Darkness to Light and not to tell them the strong man cannot be cast out and all his Goods spoiled But say you there is something that cannot be destroyed Where then is the Purgatory to cleanse Souls You say and it is true That as the Tree falleth so it lieth and if men dye in their Sins where Christ is gone they cannot come and no unclean thing can enter the Kingdom of Heaven and yet poor People cannot be cleansed Ah the Souls that split on this Rock 3dly The Scripture holdeth forth there have been Perfections I shall quote the Scriptures Psal. 64. 4. Gen. 6. 9. Job 1. 1. Prov. 2. 21. 1. Cor. 2. 6. 2 Cor. 13. 9. 11. where the Apostle Prayeth for it and Exhorteth to it Rom. 6. 1. How shall we that are dead to Sin live any longer therein Men must know a Death to Sin or I will be bold to say shall know a Death for Sin Vers. 6. They must know the Old man Crucified that the Body of Sin may be destroyed that henceforth they should not serve Sin Vers. 7. He that is dead is freed from sin men will not know a Freedom from Sin until they know a Death to Sin Vers. 18. Being then made Free from sin they became Servants of Righteousness Vers. 22. When dead to sin then servants to Righteousness and then men have their Fruits to Holiness and their End is Everlasting Life This is the Doctrine of Christ. But the Doctrine of Devils is to say that men may Sin and not dye he was the first that preached it Gen. 3. 3. Ye shall not dye here is the great Lyar And what are those men that say men cannot be free from Sin till they come to Heaven cannot cease from Sin till come to Heaven that Sin cannot be destroyed What is this but to make Christ's coming void who came to destroy the Works of the Devil to save his People from their Sins Is not this a departing from the Faith that overcometh the World the Flesh and the Devil and a giving heed to the seducing Spirit and Doctrine of Devils to speak Lyes to uphold the Devil's Kingdom 1 Tim. 4. 1. and unchristian all that believe as the Scripture hath said that Christ saveth from Sin not in Sin from the Power and Practice from the Filth as well as the Guilt all that he will save from Hell and its Damnation and who are those that cry out against it but those that will make Christ Scripture and all bow down to their sinful condition Is there not some little one in them that they will not give up to God's Sword and Fire some Fatlings in their Bosom goodly in their Eyes like Saul and yet think their Souls shall live for all this that gather up the Failings of the Saints to feed upon that because Noah David and Peter and others failed they may yea must sin all their days I beseech thee in the tender love of the Lord to perswade the Children of men to a thorow Work of Sanctification in Body Soul and Spirit and a perfecting Holiness in the Fear of God and a Cleansing from all Unrighteousness and a casting out of the Heart all that offend him not only some things but all things that offend him all which is to be done by the Power of the Lord and so come to know a Perfection in Christ and so come to be one with Christ as he is with the Father and the strong man cast out and all his Goods spoiled and so come to be a Habitation for God through the Spirit My Heart is here enlarged and my
giveth in those sweet and blessed Comforts to his People And is it not there he poureth out his Wrath on the Wicked And is it not in the Heart that he is striving with the Children of Men to reclaim them by his motions And Mens Disobedience to it is a grieving of him and rebelling against him 1. Thes. 5. 19. And it seemeth to me that any man that hath Reason or Religion should be satisfied with this account unless those that will Unchristian others that they might be thought the best Christians themselves and bespatter others that themselves might shine And So I have answered the first four Charges and if I am besides the Truth I desire it may be manifested to me in a few Lines I look on it as a Just and Reasonable thing that before any Man Unchristian another that first they prove there own Position to be according to Truth And Secondly that they prove those Persons guilty of denying those Truths for which they Unchristian them which neither is done in thy Letter but by a bare say so as if it must be true because it is said and said by such a one but it is no new thing such there were in the dayes of old Rev. 2. 9. But he that hath the Key of David hath opened a Door to us that no man can shut and by this little strength we have kept his word and have not denyed his Name Rev. 3. 8 9. For which the People are angry that we do not as they have done And nothing less then to Unchristian us will serve But what if the day should come that you should acknowledge the Lord hath loved us sure it would be a great change I shall not inlarg any furher to speak of the five last things but may refer them until I have the answer from them from whom it is expected and as I have said formerly wherein I am beside the Truth in what I have written let it be signified to me in a few lines who am a well-wisher to the prosperity of Sion and desire the Good of all men Clement Lake We are not the People we are reported to be for we are falsely represented to the World by those who have made Lyes there refuge Esa. â—8 15. And under falshood have hid themseves But Judgment the Lord will lay to the Line and Righteousness to the Plumet and the Haile shall sweep away the refuge of Lyes verse 17. A Second Letter sent to me from John Flavell which is an Answer to my former Letter the seventh of the eight Month 1687. Clement Lake I Received lately an Answer to my Letter written many Years since to preserve you from Quakerism whether this Answer were made by you or others I examine not for it is nothing to the purpose our point is not what you believe But what is the known published Doctrine of the Quakers from which my care was to preserve you I told you that a Quaker owning the professed Principles of Quakerism cannot be a Christian and instanced in several Fundamental Points of Christian Doctrine denyed by them to all of which you gave me your own private Judgment in Scripture terms which seemeth generally sound as I hope you still remain in your own Principles But what is this to the Doctrine of that People with whom you now walk forsaking those Assemblies where first you found Christ if ever you found him I am only concerned to prove my Assertions that Quakerism overthroweth Christianity and this is plain by what followeth which I take not up upon Reports at Random but give it you out of their own printed Discourses First He cannot be a Christian that rejects the Scripture as a Rule But so do the Quakers Toldervy in his Book page 6. saith That searching the Scriptures is not the way to find out the mind of Christ but the turning of the mind to within One Mason in his defence of Cravon page 12. saith Did Paul or any of the Apostles walk by any letteral rule or was not their rules a measure of the Spirit of God committed to every one of them Nayler in his Book against â—ohn Rayner speaks thus of us who differ from him Their Law is without their Light without their Church without all which we witness to be within Farwell then say I to the written word Secondly He cannot be a Christian that affirmeth Perfection and Freedom from Sin on this side Heaven 1 John 1. 8. This hath been often asserted in my hearing by the Quakers and is Printed by Mason in page 3. of his Book quoted from Ephes. 4. 12. Concluding thus Were England's Blind Watch-men Commissioned from Christ they would not thus prate against Perfection Thirdly He cannot be a Christian that maketh no distiction between the Godly and the Ungodly but doth affirm that Christ enlightens every man that cometh into the World with a saving Light but so did John Stubs George Fox and many others affirm it and defend it in a set dispute with Mr. Wiggon in the Printed dispute Page 13. Labouring to prove that every man in the World hath the Spirit of Christ savingly in him from 1 Cor. 12. 7. If so we must alter the whole frame of cripture and Christian Religion And as to Christ's imputed Righteousness how slighting doth Nayler speak of it as a Doctrine of ours Page 20. of his Book but I need go no farther I could instance in many great points more as that of the Resurrection of the Body which hath been once and again denyed by the Quakers to my Face and that with scorne and contempt of my ignorance for affirming it so that I speak not uncharitably or untruly when I said what I did of their Opinions It may be you will say these were But perticular Persons and you reject there mistakes I say they were the leading men of your party and how shall we know your Opinions but from there Books as for you I pray the Lord would preserve you sound in the faith and return you to your first Love to his Saints and Ordinances I am full of compassion for your Soul and remain your Friend John Flavell An Answer to John Flavell's Second Letter sent 1687 to him from Clement Lake of Crediton in Devonshire I Received thy Letter and by it understand that thou hast received mine which thou dost question whether made by me or others I assure thee that no other but my self did indite or write one Line or passage of that or this thou tellst me again that a man owning the professed Principles of Quakers can not be a Christian and that thou didst instance in several Fundamental Points denyed by them to which I replyed they were false Charges and to all of them I should give my reply as my own private Judgment which was seemingly sound This is another abuse seeing I said it was the Faith of those called Quakers also and the Faith of those with whom I walked But it seems