but say a little for â—ustifying the King the Lawes and our Consciâ—nces and for undeceiving the people of these â—ists you would cast over their eyes then you â—â—ry out that we are uncharitable bitter and malicious Sure you who are so much for deâ—enfive arms may at least allow us to defend the truth the law and our selves with our Tongues and Pens DIALOGUE V. N. I Confesse you have much shaken me in the matter of the Bishops though I never find in my heart to love them But one thing stilâ— sticks they are great friends to the Common Prayer-Book which I cannot think upon in patience and therefore I cannot joyn with them C. Truly if that be your chief quarrel againsâ— them it is as well grounded as the rest N. How do not you think it a great matter to take from us the pure and spiritual Worship of God and in stead thereof set up a deaâ— and formal Liturgy C. I perceive you are still abused after onâ— manner your Leaders put big words in youâ— mouthes to make you stick stifflâ—y by them youâ— Government they taught you to account the interest and Kingdom of Christ they also woulâ— make you believe your Worship to be the onlâ— spiritual one and all others but carnal Now â— will let you see the great fallacy of this prayinâ— by the Spirit as you understand it To praâ— by the Spirit is when out of a deep sense of ouâ— misery and need and firm confidence in God wâ— draw near to him to offer up our prayers anâ— praises to him through Jesus Christ. Our heartâ— being moulded in this frame we pray by thâ— Spirit use we words or not the same or diâ—ferent expressions Nay it will appear wâ— are carnal when we need to have our devotion tickled and provoked with new words N. Now I clearly see the rottennesse of your heart and your superstitious cold formality C. This is great arrogance for you thus to judge of things ye understand not Consider then the Will is the supream power of the Soul and the fancy is a lower faculty the true and spiritual devotion therefore must be that which lies in the Will and not in the Fancy now the varying of one thing into several shapes is only a gratifying of Fancy and all the devotion can be raised by such Chimes is only sensible whereas one of a deep and stedfast spirit is equally affected with a thing though still in the same dress Since then for instance our petition for pardon of sin is fully comprized in this have mercy upon me O God doth it not shew that the thing and not the words affect him who with the newnesse of affection can make that prayer though an hundred times repeated at every return new whereas he must have a lower minde who needs a new phrase to renew his servour And thus you see it expresseth a more spiritual temper to be able to worship God in simple and constant forms N. I never thought to have heard the Liturgy-Worship called spiritual and the conceived one carnal You that are Schollers make any thing of any thing with your Logick but you will never make me think but our Ministers prayed by the Spirit C. It needs but a very little knowledge of our selves and none of Logick to make you comprehend this for do you think the heating of the fancy cannot make wicked men pray without the Spirit as to appearance very spiritually Finally words and all the heat begot by words gesture voice or phrases or the like are but a false fire in the natural powers of the Soul which may well heat the brain draw forth tears seem to wring the heart and all this is but a sensible fervour which as the temper raised by musick amounts to nothing but to a present tickling whereas the true devotion of the heart is an inward still humbling and melting thing and so equable that it is above these frisking fits of the fancy And it is certain to pray by the Spirit must be the immediat work of the Spirit of Grace Since then we see that the praying in words depends most upon Memory Fancy Eloquence Confidence and Custome he that abounds in these is like to excel in it whereas one defective in all these so that he cannot pray in a variety of words yet may understand interior prayer and spiritual converse with God better than any other N. This is new doctrine to me And I cannot understand nor believe it C. Consider then that the sublimest way of prayer is in the simplest acts such as these thou art my God and I am thine And in such breathings a devout minde will persist long with great sweetnesse and in this God hath strangely shapt Religion so that the highest strain of it is what the simplest minde can most easily reach Nay perhaps multiplicity doth lead out the minde from pure and still devotion And thus extemporary prayer cannot be called praying by the Spirit except by spirit you understand the animal or natural spirits for if it be by the Spirit it must be infallible since all that is dictated by the Spirit of God is so yet your people do not assert their prayers as such Further let one with a short-hand follow that mans prayer who you say prayes by the Spirit then may not that prayer be read and used over again or is the Spirit in the prayer so volatile that it evaporats in the saying and the prayer becomes carnal when it is repeated Finally if praying by the Spirit be a praying in new words then only he that conceives the prayer prayes by the Spirit since they who hear and joyn with him are tyed to his words N. The words were dictated by the Spirit to him that conceives them C. Then to the people it is not necessary the words be new since to them it is all one if it were once dictated by the Spirit But why do you not believe the prayer composed by the Church to be of the Spirits dictating as well as that of your Ministers And since the people can joyn and pray by the Spirit though the words be not of their framing why may not the Minister pray in the Spirit though he use words framed by others All this shows how weak and ill grounded a notion that of praying by the Spirit in the sense you understand it is And it clearly appears that the dresse of the prayer in words and the life begot by them is but sensible and low N. But doth not the Spirit help our infirmities and teach us to pray C. If you consider the words aright they speak out a thing very far different from what you would draw from them The Spirit teacheth us to pray for what we ought that is the matter of our prayers and as we ought that is the manner to wit the temper of our hearts For that words are not meant appears from what follows and maketh intercession for us with groannings
without it holiness is but hypocrisie C. I acknowledge that if you speak of the fundamental Articles of our Faith But all truths are not of equal certainty nor of equal importance now it is a certain and important truth that there should be an unity in the Catholick Church which is not to be broken but upon a matter of greater certainty and weight N. One precious truth is worth all the world therefore I will not quite one truth for the love of all men Not a hoof said Moses C. If you were required to condemn or deny any thing you judged truth I confesse you ought to obey God rather than man But it is another case to quite the communion of the Church because they are not as you think in the truth unlesse that truth be of greater importance than is the Article of your Faith The Catholick Church and the communion of Saints And when you are as sure of your call to contend for these truths as Moses was of the will of God you may use his words Let me then examine you a little how do you know your opinions are truths N. Who can doubt of it are they not the cause and interest of Christ his Kingdom and Crown his glorious work to which we are all bound by the oath of God taken in the Covenant whereinto even the children unborn are oblidged C. If big words prove truths you are full of them But remember of whom the Apostle gives this Character they speak swelling words of vanity And there is no party but have the same language in their mouth these are fine contrivances to lead away silly women captive who would be ready to judge your blustering confidence an evidence of truth when a modester way of speaking is suspect of diffidence whereas in right scales the one looks like arrogant pride and the other like the modest Spirit of Jesus Christ. N. How can you deny that what is now cried down was the work of God C. I confesse it was so the work of God as the Prophet said is there any evil in the City and the Lord hath not done it but in the sense you take it it was as far from it as darknesse is from light N. How can you speak so was not sin strangely born down in our dayes C. I confesse you studied to represse some sins so did the Pharisees But remember the Apostle divides filthinesse in that of the flesh and of the Spirit and indeed the latter proves a much subtiller and stronger opposition to the Gospel than the former It is true some of these were repressed by you though I must add in a way scarce suitable to the Gospel but for other sins you were very gentle to them nay were guilty of them your selves for they mingled in all you did N. Now you begin to rail and I cannot endure to hear those glorious dayes so spoken of Is this the moderation you so much proâ—esse C. I love moderation as much as any can and declare to you once for all that I have no quarrel at any for their opinions in these matters nor shall I labour to disgrace the leaders of your party by searching into their private escapes a practice much used by you against us your mouthes being ever full of bitter reproaches against some of our way but it is directly contrary to the Spirit of Christ and his Gospel wherein we are put in mind to speak evil of no man I shall therefore from your publick and avowed actions and printed papers shew how far you are out of the way of God And first what think you of your rebellion this was the Soul of your whole work and your Covenant was a Bond to cement you in this N. Call you fighting for God and his Cause rebellion C. It is yet under debate whether it be the Cause of God Suppose it were shew me one place in either Testaments that warrands Subjects fighting for Religion you know I can bring many against it yea though the old dispensation was a more carnal and fiery one than the new one is yet when the Kings of Iudah and Israel made Apostacy from the living God into â—eathenish Idolatry some of the Kings of Iudah polluting the Temple of Ierusalem as did Ahaz and Mannasseh so that God could not be worshipped there without Idolatry yet where do we find the people resisting them or falling to popular Reformations Neither do the Prophets that were sent by God ever provoke them to any such courses And you know the whole strain of the New Testament runs upon suffering N. The law of nature teacheth us to defend our selves and so there is no need of Scripture for it C. This is marvelous dealing in other things you alwayes flee from reason as a carnal principle to Scripture but here you quite Scripture and appeal to it but it seems you are yet a stranger to the very design of Religion which is to tame and mortifie nature and is not a natural thing but supernatural Therefore the rules of defending and advancing it must not be borrowed from nature but grace The Scriptures are also strangely contrived since they ever tell us of suffering under persecution without giving your exception that we resist when we are in a capacity And I appeal to your conscience whether it be a likelier way to advance Religion fighting or suffering since a carnal man can do the one but not the other N. How can we neglect the interests of Christ and let them ruine when we are in a capacity to defend them C. If there were not a God who governs the World your reasoning might have force but do you think that God cannot maintain his own right but the wrath of man must work his righteousnesse nay we see the contrary for from the beginning till this day God hath made the sufferings of his people the chief mean of propagating Religion whereas fighting hath been ever fatal to it And Christ did begin the Gospel with his suffering though he could have commanded Legions of Angels for his defence N. Christ knew it was the Fathers will that he must suffer C. This shews how little you understand when you speak so are not Christs injunctions our rule Since then he forbade his Disciples to draw a sword for him with so severe a threatning as whosoever will draw the sword shall perish by the sword this must binde us and what he sayes to Pilate on this â—ead My Kingdom is not of this world c. is so plain language that I wonder how it doth not convince all I know there are some pitifull answers made to those places but they are so irrational that they deserve not a serious reply and I am not of an humour to laugh at them only take notice of this that if an ingenuous man speak plainly much more must the God of truth Judge then whether these unworthy glosses make Christ likeer a nibling Logician then the true
reverent thoughts of one who died so piously and devoutly yet you ceased not to persecute and tear his memorie which in spite of your malice will be glorious to all posterity and that with the height of insolence and barbarity in the very hearing and presence of his Son who now reigneth This was your bold reproving of faults But how little were you in secret reproving faults When you got to the Pulpit there indeed you triumphed because you knew none were to oppose you Now it is certain reproofs should be begun in private and not brought to publick but upon the obstinate rejecting of private admonitions And for what end were you often so bitter to absents This and such other things could be upon no other design but either maliciously to disgrace them or to get a following among your party and the name of faithfull free and zealous preachers N. You speak with very great heat and passion against better men then your self and better preachers than ever any of your way will be C. May be so I wish both they and their Gifts had been seven-fold better than they were but if I shall judge of them either by their printed Sermons or those I have heard they are no extraordinary things And first The half of their Sermons were upon publick matters and what did these concern the Souls of the poor people Was not this for bread to give them a stone Next for the solid practises of a Christian life I scarce ever heard them named except overly Whom heard you preach against the love of the world seeking of esteem quarrelling seeking of revenge anxiety and passion Vertue was little preached and far lesse practised N. I am sure we heard much spiritual Doctrine from them for these are common matters C. Read our Saviours Sermons particularly his longest upon the mount and you shall finde these to be the great subjects of his discourse I confesse they are common but remember the commonest things are often most usefull As for your spiritual Doctrine the true heights of spirituality were as little preached as the living much in abstraction silence and solitude the being often in the still contemplations of God and Christ the becoming dead to all things else spending dayes and nights in secret fastings and prayers how seldom were these things spoken of N. What then make you of them since you dâ— not allow them to be spiritual doctrine C. I shall not deny but they were spiritual buâ— I add they were of a very low size and degree anâ— such as could never carry on the Auditors to anâ— great perfection and most of them were practiseâ— by the Pharisees You know they read the Scripâ— ture and knew it so exactly as no Christians do their Bibles they observed the Sabbath severly they prayed many and long prayers So that these external things are but the fringes of true Religion N. We heard Christ and him crucified preached much C. It was well if ye did but let me tell you iâ— Christ was so preached as to cry up a bare relying on him without obedience to his Gospel as I fear too many did this was a very antichristianâ— way of preaching Christ. Next you got amongst you a world of nice subtilties which you called Cases of Conscience and these were handled with so metaphysical curiosities that I know not whatâ— to make of them And the people that should have been driven out of these into the great practices of a Christian life were too much flattered and humoured in them I am sure our Saviour and the Penmen of Scripture had no such stuff N. This still discovers your carnal heart God help you who understand not the wayes of the Spirit C. Never tell me of other wayes of the Spirit but holinesse charity and humility c. I do not deny but some devout people will be under doubtings and fears but this is a weaknesse which ought not to be fed and humoured in them and such scruples are to be satisfied in private But to hear people who lead but common lives talk of such things is unsufferable I shall not here take notice of their strange methods which they so much admired in preaching though I could tell you how our Saviour and the Apostles used none of these but I shall be sparing in this it not being of so great or necessary concernment N. O but what powerfull Sermons were theirs they made my very heart shake C. I am glad it was so but see that by power you do not mean a tone in the voice a grimace in the face or a gesture and action or some strange phrases these indeed affect the vulgar much but considering people see through them and value them little The voice of God was a still voice and Christ was not heard in the streets N. But there were many converted by the preachings and then there was a great love to the word people running far to hear it C. Truly I am so far from envy that I wish from my Soul where one was converted by you a thousand had been But see that by conversion you do not mean only a change in opinion or outward behaviour which might be done upon interest and remember that there was a kind of Proselytes even to the service of God who thereby became more the children of the devil than they were And see that you do not mistake every heaâ— in the fancie for a conversion one thing I muâ— challenge you of that you call alwayes youâ— preachings the word of God for to term them so and yet to confesse you may be mistaken in them is a contradiction since Gods word is infallible Your texts indeed are the word of God but youâ— glosses on them are but the words of falliblâ— men Now this was a great Art to conciliat â— hudge veneration and authority to your preachings for you called them the words of the Lord and applied all the places of Scripture that belonged to the inspired and infallible preachers unto your selves that so you might be Rabbies in deed N. I but their lives was preaching and theâ— looked like the Gospel indeed C. I am far from denying that there were verâ— good men among you and there are some of theâ— whom I know to have the fear of God before theiâ— eyes but I must say they seem to be little advanced above babes in Christ. For your greaâ— men how strangely did they involve themselveâ— in all businesses and truly a medling temper look not like a devout one but what great spirituality appeared amongst most of them Leaders oâ— Churches and parties should be alwayes commending God and Religion to people and truly hear there is little of this in their mouthes shrewd presumption that there is not too much oâ— it in their hearts N. Alas you know us not we seldom meet but we expound Scripture and have spiritual exercise amongst us C. I confesse you have enough that way but that looks more