tongue of your crouching before idolles of the placing of the saide idolls in your Churches of your worshippe done vnto them of your pilgrimages of the supremacie of your holie father the Pope of your vnwritten verities and of all the rabble of your ceremonies ordinances and traditions whiche haue no warrant of Gods worde in whiche you repose saluation and by whiche you greatlie deceiue Gods people Will not the Lorde call you to an accompt for abusing and deceiuing thus his people in giuing them darnell and chaffe for wheate in feeding them with your owne inuentions without anie warrant or authoritie of Gods worde Hath not GOD set downe a platforme in his holie Scriptures howe hee wil be worshipped and serued commaunding That you shall neither adde nor diminishe turne âeither to the right hande nor to the lefte but syncerelie to walke in the wayes of the Lorde And hath threatened moreouer That if anie man shall adde vnto the things whiche bee written GOD shall adde vnto him the plagues that bee written And if anie man shall diminishe from the wordes of GOD his part shal be taken awaie out of the booke of life But either sufficient is spoken âr inough will not serue Onelie this âhing I require of you that you will âot take in ill parte whatsoeuer I âaue written the Lorde is my witâesse that I haue not beene mooued herevnto either of malice or of vaine âlorie neither haue I written or set âowne anie doctrine but onelie that âhich in my conscience as I shall answere at the dreadfull daye of iudgement I am perswaded to bee the verie âueth If you thinke that I haue not âllie absolutely answered your Interrogations and Demaundes which you haue set downe so diffusedlie and out of order repeating some one thing often and in heaping one vppon another without anie reason or iudgement in charging vs and laying those heresies to our charge whiche wee are so farre from mainteining of them as that wee do vtterlie abhorre detest yea flatlie condemne them I would haue âou to note and plainlie sette downe in what thinges I haue failed or what thinges I haue omitted or in what you bee not fullie resolued and I not to haue sufficientlie aunswered you For I am most willing according to that small talent and gift whiche God hath of his goodnesse bestowed vppon mee to imploye my trauell and spende my time in this kinde of exercise Let vs ioyne together in building God his Church for that manie soules bee in daunger by reason of controuersies and contentions whiche bee betwixt vs in that they halte as they did in the time of Elias the Prophete betwixt two opinions doubting what way were best to take Let vs seeke to aduaunce Gods worshippe which is spirituall and must bee done in spirit and trueth GOD is dishonoured either when wee woorshippe anie other then him alone giuing his honor to anie other creature or when wee giue him not that honor whiche hee requireth of vs in his sacred and holie worde or woorshippe him otherwise than hee appointeth The Lord graunt you a penitent hart indue you with true and perfect knowledge that you may seeke the sauing of your owne soule the profitte of Gods âurch and Congregation and the adâncement of his kingdome that âh one heart and one minde wee ây worshippe and serue GOD the âher and his Sonne Iesus Christ in âirit and trueth To whom with the holie Spirit three persons and one inuisible and immortall God be all glorie nowe and euer Anthonie Gilbie vnto the Reader THE miserable Iewes and proud Papistes are both alike deceiued by these and such like carnal cogitatioÌs as appeares in these popishe questions The Iewes will ãâã haue an earthlie Messias to whom all âââs shal be in subiection corporallie viâââ or else they wil haue none The Papists will haue an earthlie church visible kingdome of the same Messias to the which al nations âhalbe subiect or else they wil haue none ãâã poore Christ and his persecuted church âespised of both twaine The Iewes will ãâã of this poore Nazarite for their king ãâã âapists will not haue his contemptible ãâã to be their church The Papists boast âââir antiquitie and succession but the âââs if that wold serue haue better cause âast of both for their antiquitie is farre âââter by manie huÌdred yeres their sucâââon is alowed in the scriptures but the ãâã is successour in nothing saue in that âââer deââed his maister or when as hee ãâã Christ carnall worldlie counsell not to suffer but to spare him selfe Otherwayâ he succeedeth not Peter I say neither â place nor in doctrine neither in forme of gâuernemeÌt nor in maner of liuing so that tâ popish church canne in no wise bee the trâ church of Christ as may easilie bee proueâ The papistes talke of Fathers and of coâsent but what is that without the warraâ of Gods word The papistes will not be of tâ contemptible church they say that is despâsed in the world Christ saith that his churâ must be so They shall deliuer you vp â be afflicted and shall kill you and yoâ shal be hated of al nations for my namâ sake Againe he saith If the worlde haâ you knowe that it hated mee before hated you if ye were of the worlde thâ world would loue his own but becauâ you are not of the world but I haue châsen you out of the world therefore thâ world hateth you Remember the worâ that I said vnto you The seruaunt is nâ greater then his maister If they hauâ persecuted me they will persecute yoâ also These things haue I said vnto yoâ that you should not bee offended Theâ shall excommunicate you yea the timâ will come that whosoeuer killeth youâ I thinke that he doeth God seruice â this is the state of the true churche here ân earth whereby it is euident that the âshe Romishe Synagogue is not the true ârch seeing it is so ⪠loued and honored in worlde Christ the head of the true ârch went vp into heauen by manifolde âctions his members the Prophetes and âostles entred by the same doore of afflicâs not by the windowe of promotions âd holie Paule affirmeth That whosoeâr will liue godlie in Christ Iesus must âfer persecutions That our faith being âd like golde in the furnace as Peter âth might be found precious Thereâre Christ and his Apostles are poore in âis world and like seruants readie to serue âers the Pope and his Prelates like worldâe Princes rich wealthie and lordlie Christ âd his humble and lowlie the Pope his âoude pompeous and haultie Christ his âaied tribute to Caesar the Pope his take Peter pence and other payments froÌ Princes and nations Christ and his suffered humblie afflictions vnder Princes the Pope warreth against Princes treadeth on their neckes causeth them to kisse his pantaphles and to hold his stirrops like a Lucifer and childe of pride Christ and
God euery spirit which câfesseth not Iesus Christ to haue come â the flesh is not of God wherfore the samâ is not of God which denieth either the dâuine or humaine nature of Christ and tâ true vniting of them both or derogateth any thing from the office of Christ beeingâ king who onely hath all spirituall rule anâ authoritie committed vnto him beeing Prophet who onely is appointed to delâuer vnto vs his fathers minde and willâ and to teach vs all truth being a Priestâ who hath offered a sweete smelling Sacrifice for vs vnto God the father euen his owne body vppon the Crosse once for all which onely Sacrifice is of force and value to purge and clense the sinnes of all those that beleeue But who be they which denie Christ in person or in office ⪠euen that Church that woulde haue Christ as hee is ân to be in any other shape fourme then that which he receiued of the virgin Ma ãâã in sundry places at one time contrary the nature of a true body or affirmeth âat mankinde lost through Adams fal and ansâression could be saued by any other leaâes then onely by Christ whether it be ây mans merits and works or by the parâons and indulgences of the Pope or by ânie other deuise of man Finally that Church which teacheth anie other mediaâââ betwixt God and man either of reâemption or intercession then onely Christ âhe same Church denieth Christ to haue âome in the flesh and therefore is not the ãâã Church of god The bare name or title of the Church is not sufficient but as gold is tried by the Touchstone so we must prooue the Church by the woorde of ãâã which is the Touchstone of all truth This Church by the preaching of the Gospell by the Lodestarre of Christ his holy âord hath from time to time brought the âle of God from Gentilitie from Iuâme from the grosse Idolatrie whiche â haue vsed in your Church and from â darke dungeon of ignorance and blindnes into the cleare light shining brightnes of true knowledge Yea this same râligion and doctrine which nowe we dâ teach was deliuered first by Iesus Chriâ vnto the Apostles then preached by them afterwardes yet not without bloodshed taught from time to time for the space â sixe hundred yeares as the writings of aâ the auncient Fathers doo witnesseâ and so forwarde vntill by little and little your superstitious patched religion increased by fire and Fagot and other extremâ tortures and cruelties These thinges being manifest I tendering your saluation â which doo call your âelfe a Catholik or Papiste doo most earnestly admonish you that according vnto your promise yoâ would yeeld your self vnto the eternal God who knoweth all secrets and abhorreth all hipocrisie Let Christ Iesus by the scepter of his woorde rule your conscience and direct your hart in his trueth suffer the holy spirit of God to instill the sweete tast of Gods holy woord into your minde that you may hate your owne ignorance and blindenesse and study to attaine the true light and to bee guided by the motions of the same comfortable spirit of God which the Lord graunt to you for his Christs sake Papist Aske of him what Church it was which â hath induced the Christian people thoârow out the whole worlde to giue most â humble credit in all pointes to the holy âââkes of the Byble what Church hath had ãâã discerning and seuering them from oâââ writinges of all sortes what Churche ââth had the custody of them and most safeââ hath preserued them for the necessarie vse of Gods people and from the corruption of aduersaries aswell Iewes as Heretiks of all sortes and let the Protestant declare vnto me that this congregation hath had from time to time or euer had any right herein ââ anie other Church sauing the catholike Church and I recante Answeare I Do merueile with what face you can ârrogate vnto your Church that you haue moued the people throughout the âorlde to giue credit vnto the scriptures ãâã that your Church hath deterred the âââople from reading them affirminge âââm to be harde and difficult daungeâââus to the simple and vnlearned a nose ãâã waxe a shippmans hose a dead letter and either of enuie vnto the poore souâ whom you call dogges and hogges aâ sing this text giue not that which is hâ vnto dogges or of hate vnto the scripturâ you haue kept the key knowledge whâ is the holy woorde of God vnder a vaâ in an vnknowne tounge fearinge aâ iudge lest the misty cloudes of your persticious deuises would vanish awâ if the bright beames of Christ his Gâpell might shine in simple mens mindâ What humble credite do you giue vnto Scriptures seing that one of the pillerâ your Church saieth That the Scripturâ are not autenticall or of credite bâ onelie by the warrant and aucthoriâ of your Churche of Rome an other your Doctoures hath these woordeâ The Apostles saith he when they deliuâred the Creed neuer said I beleue tâ holy Byble or the holy Gospel but the saide I beleeue the holy Churche Aâ likewise in an other place he saith â any man haue the exposition of thâ Church of Rome touchinge any placâ of the Scriptures although he neitheâ knowe nor vnderstand whether or howâ it agreeth with the wordes of the Scriptures yet he hath the very word of God. ând how doubtful vncertain al your inâââpretations be Cusanus a Cardinall ãâã the Churche of Rome sheweth It ãâã no meruaile saith he though the practise of the Churche expounde the âââiptures at one time one way and at âââother time another way For the vnderââânding or the sence of the scriptures runâââh with the practise and that sence so agreeinge with the practise is the quicââninge spirite And therefore the scripââres followe the Churche but contraâiewise the Churche followeth not the Scriptures And whereas in verie âeede the scriptures be the light that geâââth sight to the blinde and rightly called ãâã candle whereby the theefe is taken the truth which doeth disclose all errours ãâã rule to square and frame mans lyfe ãâã power of God vnto saluation I muse âââuely howe you daââ presume to keepe his hid treasure from Gods inheritance ând yet preteÌd that you do perswade them âââstantly to giue most humble credit thereâââto And forsomuche as you do challeng âââe discerning seuering the Scriptures âââom other writinges of all sortes you haue in verie deed not onely corrupted the trâ sense of the Bible but also abased the authoritie of the scriptures and haue madâ equall or rather preferred your owne decrees and constitutions before the holâ Bible the errours in your old translatioÌ oâ the Bible which you falsly ascribe vntâ S. Ierome be so manifest so grosse thaâ euery childe may easily espy them as iâ the third chapter of Genesis these wordeâ are to be found Ipsa conteret caput tuuâ She shall breake
the which âuilding Christe is the chiefe corner stone âhough you haue taught the people of God âtherwise affirming the Pope to be head âf Gods Churche and to be of equiualent âucthoritie with Christ One of your scholeâoctors saith That Christe and the Pope âake one consistorie and sinne onely âxcepted the Pope can doe whatsoeuer God himselfe can doe And euen as you âeale with Christe for the preheminence ând rule so you will appointe him a body âr no bodie or alter or chaunge his bodie âs you liste You cannot limit GOD âis Church for his Church is in manie or âewe as his heauenlie wisedome appoyneth And therfore Christ saith That whenâoeuer two or three are gathered togeaâher in my name I am in the middest of âhem And as one doth say as is before âlledged Although there were but two âen remayning in the worlde yet in âhem two the Churche of God which âs the vnitie of the faithfull shoulde bee saued Therefore though man be ignorant whome God hath elected vnto saluation and who be of Christ his bodie yet God who vnderstandeth all secretes doeth knowe who are his And euerie member of Christ hath the spirite of God to assure his conscience that he is the childe of god God graunt you that inwarde testimonie and the comfort of the same spirit grounded vpon the Gospell which they doe feele in themselues Then will you neuer be so carefull for these outwarde shewes Papist 15 SHew me that the church which ought to be a Christian mans stay in troubles ⪠and tempests of doctrine might become so hidden or so close that no man could finde her or so hartlesse that she coulde succour no man nor instruct anie man in hâ doubte of conscience or distresse in faith Proue me that there may be such a decay â Goddes spirit truth and churche And I recant Answeare 15 IT seemeth that you are harping alwaieâ vppon one string but if you woulde dilâgently waie with your selfe the frailtie man who is dailie slipping away from dâtifull obedience towardes God and consider what bridles and bittes God hath ordained to pull him backe from the libertie of sinne to preserue him from daungers You shal finde other staies to grounde maÌs faith and settle his coÌscience then anie such outwarde shewe of a visible Church as you imagin The ground worke and foundation of faith and the staie and buttresse of mans conscience are the holie scriptures which Dauid the blessed Prophet calleth the Mountaines vnto which the faithful shoulde lift vp their eyes which are the onely comforte to theÌ in their troubles Christ exhorteth vs To searche the scriptures for they do beare witnes of him who is our peace our iustification our sanctification our redemptioÌ The Apostle assureth vs That the scriptures are the power of god vnto saluatioÌ to as many as beleeue whether they be Iewes or Gentils What need we any further proofe to teach vs that faith is staied vpoÌ the scriptures then that which is spoken by Paule the Apostle ⪠Faith saith he commeth of hearing and hearing by the worde of God. Howe shall we knowe God ⪠Howe shall we knowe Christ How shal we know Gods spirit howe shall wee discerne true faith from a fonde opinion but onely by the scriptures Faith as Saint Augustine affirmeth doth stagger if the aucthority of gods scriptures do faile True faith true knowledge and a right conscience are grounded vpon the worde of god Constantine that worthie Emperour spake openly in the Nicene Councel to the like effecte The writinges saith he of the Euangelistes and Apostles and the oracles of the auncient Prophets do instruct vs plainely what we ought to vnderstande and beleue of Gods will and pleasure and therfore all contention set aparte let vs seeke the solution of those thinges which bee propounded out of the scriptures of God which by the testimonie of the holy Ghost be able to instruct vnto all good workes The doctrine of the scriptures teacheth especiallie these foure principles Knowledge Faith Godlines Iustice true brauÌches of a christian mans life It is the parte of euerie Christian to learne to knowe God the Creatour and maker of all thinges to knowe Christ the the redemer of mankinde to knowe the holie Ghost the spirit of sanctificatioÌ what benefits he hath ond doth receiue by these âhree persons vnited in one Godhead which ânoweledge the wise man calleth Perfect righteousnes and the roote of immoralitie Also our Sauiour Christ saith That âhis is eternall life that they know thee âhe onely true GOD and Iesus Christ whom thou hast sent Man created according to gods Image may not be like the Horse Mule in whom there is no vnderstanding or to bee such as God by the Prophet complaineth vpon That the oxe knoweth his owner the Asse his maâters cribb But Israel hath not knowne âny people hath no vnderstanding It beâoueth him to beleue in these three persons and all thinges which he knoweth out of gods booke It is his part and duty moreouer to practise pietie and godlinesse towârdes God iustice and vprigh dealing towardes man But I knowe what you âhoote at Verely to haue vs to beleue and âo stay our selues vpon the aucthoritie of your Church of Rome and the vnwritten âerities of the same Church Because the true Church of God hath not alwaies appeared to the view of the whole worlde in outwarde pompe or shewe Therefore your indeuour to perswade yet I trust in vaine that man doubtfull in conscience and wauering in faith coulde receiue no comfort by that close inuisible and hartles Church as you call it I haue proued before that God hath raised vp in all ages since the beginninge of the worlde such as haue giuen a testimonie of their zeale and true religion vnto the worlde You must not limit and appointe God his Church or vpon whom hee shall power out his graces or in what measure he shall bestow his spirite God by the ministerie of his woorde doeth cure and heale suche as be broken in heart geueth medicine to heale their sickenesse maketh strong the weake faith and doth comforte the feeble minde of man by his holie spirite Gods spirite cannot decay or be of lesse power or Gods churche and spouse lesse honourable albeit there were but one simple man in the vniuersall worlde to mans iudgement which doeth imbrace the trueth of god Though Abell was but one thoughe Elias in his time was but one Noah and his housholde but a small number Christe our Sauiour and his simple Fishermen his Apostles men of no reputation a very few in respect of all the world besides had God therefore âo Churche in these times Notwithstanding the law was corrupted before Christ the true worshipp of God cleane extinguised all the people geuen for the most part âo idolatrie yea and no prophet to reproue the people from Malachie his time vntill
the comming of Christ sauing Iohn Bapâiste and he thirty yeares of age before hee preached was there no churche or was Gods spirite decayed and his trueth vanâuished all this while ⪠God forbid that âee shoulde bee so rashe in iudgement as ânce to thinke so For Gods spirite which âs the coÌforter of the faithful hath instrucâed the churche of God whether it hath appeared or bene hidde whether it hath beene close or open whether in manie or ân fewe euer since the beginning So Christe Iesus hath promised that his spirit shoulde remaine with the children of God though the wicked would not receiue him because they see him not neither knowe him The comfortable Spirite of God doeth woorke saluation âoth adopt into Gods fauoure doth puriââe our heartes doeth moue vs to all good and godlie actions doth comforte vs in al daungers and confirmeth vs to expecte the comming of our sauiour Christ Therfore to this spirite with the Father and the Sonne be all honour laude and praise Papist 16 SHewe me againe whether anie man can be saued except he beleeue the catholike Church and that is it which in the face of all the world hath practised preaching the conuersion of nations to the obedience of the Gospell that hath alwayes had the ministring of the Sacramentes the hearing of matters in coÌtrouersie the orderly succession of Bishoppes vniformitie in solemne ceremonies vnitie in faith that hath in her selfe all holy functions of the spirite a woorking of miracles remission of sinnes the true sense and interpretation of Gods word that is beawtified with diuersitie of states commended by Christ in the Gospell as with virgins martirs with confessors and the rest Prooue vnto me that this is not the true Church or that we be bounde to obey this Church and none other in all controuersies and doubts raised by the difficultie of the scripture or by the vaine contention and pride of heresie And I recant Answeare 16 Suppose that there was neuer any man which would looke to haue saluation by âods mercies in Christ that euer denied âe Church of god So we beleeue that âod hath had his Church euer since the âginning which Church is the Company â the faithfull dispersed through out the âce of the whole earth which church is the âouse of Christ builded vppon the doctrine â the Apostles and Prophets Christ him âfe beeing the heade corner stone Yet âe vtterly denye your Church of Rome to â this true Church of god The reasons âd causes why we will not close handes â agree with your Church be these First âur Church dooth refuse Christ Iesus to â her head in that she setteth vp her Pope â be her head wherin she wil be gouerned â all things euen against gods holy word âerefore your Church is not of god That âhrist is the heade of the true church not â but the spirit of God testifieth that God âath appointed Christ ouer all things â be the head to the Church which is âs body And again The husband is the âyues head euen as Christ is the heade âf the Church and he is the same which âeueth saluation vnto his body Your church appointeth otherwaies to be saueâ by then onely Christes death and passion yea doth persecute Christ in his members taketh away the key of knowledge whiâ is the woorde of God from Gods people for that ye wil not suffer them to haue it â their knowne tongue you feede them nâ with the sweete pastures of the holy scriptures but with the dregges of your blind Ceremonies and vayne traditions yoâ teach them to pray in a straunge languagâ to woorship the creature in steede â the Creator you mixe the woorde of Goâ with your owne deuises not to the benefite of Gods people but to get mony anâ to enrich your selues with the spoile â their soules You sett out all your practises as you call them to sale For of youâ church it is saide Omnia Romae vaenaliaâ All thinges are to bee had for monye aâ Rome The Poet saith That Templeâ Priestes altars sacrifices crownes fierâ frankencense yea heauen is to be soldâ and God him selfe But you giue smalâ credit vnto this author Will you hearâ what one of your approoued doctors saith Roma dat omnbus omnia dantibus omnia Romae cum praecio Rome doth âiue to al men which doo giue all things âo her all thinges are there to be had for âony at Rome Your owne decretales ây That Rome is the head of coueteousâesse and therefore all thinges are there âo be solde Your Popedome is in part âainteined with the tribute of Curtesans âr common stues which is the rewarde of âniquitie Thus you forbid lawfull matriâonie and mainteine open lecherie And âhereas you would haue the worlde to beâeeue that your Church of Rome hath alwayes had the due and right administratiân of the Sacramentes vnitie in faith orâerly succession of Bishoppes euen from Peter vniformitie in solempne ceremonies âebating of matters in controuersie all holy functions commended by Christ as virgins martirs and confessors and that all Churches are bound to obey the Church of Rome in all controuersies and doubtes raysed by the difficulty of the scriptures it shall appeare to all men that these are but vaine ostentations and shewes without truth But you wil aske me who shal iudge this matter for sometimes you stay vpon Counceles sometimes vppon Fathers sometimes vpoÌ customes Truly I would but wishe you and euery indifferent reader to examine whether your masse doe agree worde by worde with the last supper of our sauiour Christe You haue culleâ foorth these woordes Hoc est corpus meum This is my bodie And therevppoâ haue framed your masse The wordes be comfortable if you would take theÌ in a spirituall sense and meaning to signifie vnto vs the bodie of Christe as the godlie Father Augustine doth expouude those same woordes Non dubitauit dominus dicere hoc est corpus meum cum daret signum corporis sui Our Lord saieth hee doubted not to say This is my bodie when as he gaue a signe of his bodie Likewise Tertullian saith Hoc est corpus meum hoc est figura corporis mei ⪠This is my bodie that is to say This is a figure of my body But what shal I speak of al the abuses of your masse as the consecration the eleuation the aduocation the priuate receiuing the vnknowen tongue the ministration in one kinde keeping the âuppe from the Laie people making it a propiciatorie sacrifice for the quicke and dead which all are moste contrarie vnto Christe his institution in his last supper Furthermore you haue corrupted Baptisme and haue deuised fiue other Sacraâentes more then Christe hath ordained âd appointed in his worde Touhcing your succession of bishopes âd vnitie in religion they are two things âhich sound verie well together If so bee âu can proue your succession out of the âorde
we faithfully râceiuing the visible and externall signes according to Christ his institution in remembraunce of his death and passion spirituaâly doe feed vpon the body of Christ aââ receiue the fruites of his death euen remission of our sinnes Other sacramentes we haue no warrant for in the worde of god These sacramentes were onely vsed by Christ and his Apostles and by all their true successours The sacramentes in the olde Testament vnto which anie promise was annexed were these two onely that is circumcision and the Passouer which doe rightly and aptly represent ãâã two sacramentes set forth in the newe âââament as Baptisme and the Lordes âââer which haue bene vsed alwaies âââe true Church euer since Christ and âââued of the auncient Fathers as the onely knowne sacramentes appoynted by ââârist So Augustine affirmeth That ãâã Lord the Apostles deliuered vnto âââewe sacraments in steede of manie ãâã the same to be most easie in doing âââst reuerend in vnderstandinge and in âââeruation most pure to wit the sacrameÌts of Baptisme the celebratioÌ of thâ sacrament of the body and blood of ouâ Lorde Likewise another sayth The sacramentes of Christ in the catholikâ Church are Baptisme and the bodâ and bloude of our Lorde Which sacramentes also and all the principle poynte of our true religion Constantine the Christian and godly Emperour and alâ his noble successours mightely defended and set forth the same The same Constantine was christened not by the Pope buâ by Eusebius Bishop of Nicomedia noâ in a corner but in the presence of many other not popishe but Christian Bishopes Hee ouercame Licinium his sisters husbande who persecuted the Christians The same Constantine summoned a councell at Nice against that blasphemous heritike Arrius And as the historie saith the Emperour before named wrote vnto all the rulers of the Churches that they shoulde be at Nice by a day to the Bishop of the Apostolicke sea to Macarius Bishope of Hierusalem and to Iulius the bishope of Rome In that flourishing time liued sundry godly writers whose bookes nowe extant doe shewe that they embracced the same faith and religion which we at this day do professe touching the Sacramentes iustification by faith onely inuocation to God alone saluation onely by Christ and all other chiefe poyntes of doctrine whose workes if your Romish Church had kept inuiolable and had not corrupted as you did in like manner with the Canonicall books of the Bible you might haue learned a difference betwixt trueth and errour And if you would yet hearken to the doctrine which they doe deliuer they will teach you that your Romish church is a cage of vncleane birdes and that your religion is mingled with all heresies though you charge others with the same fault and that you haue no true discipline but rather crueltie no principall pastor sauing Antichrist no officers but Blood-suckers and no Churche in deede but the Sinagogue of Sathan that cruell mother whiche will needes haue the Childe to be cutte in peeces which spareth no Sexe or kinde no Infant though it bee in the mothers belly no hoare heade nor aged person finally your church hath no truth but falshood and iâ wholly imbamed with the heresies of aâ ages You take parte with the Iewes anâ Pagans you care not with whome yoâ shake handes so it be not with Christ or his holy Gospell vnto which you doo beare â deadly hate And yet you stand vpon youâ reputation and would haue men to beleeuâ you whatsoeuer you speake Whereas you call our Church A contemptible vnknowne close and secret company at thiâ day the Lord be thanked the greater partâ of Europe besides the countries I spakâ of before doo ioyne together with vs iâ one truth of doctrine I would haue yoâ to prooue by the worde of God for youâ wordes bee no warrant to auenturâ our soules vppon your Romish Church to bee the auncient and true Catholike Church and to professe the same faith and doctrine truely which Christ his Apostles left behinde them and that which was in the time of those godly Emperours of Rome and a long tyme after or that Christ did promise to leaue such a Church as should haue onâ generall and chiefe Pastor to sit in iudgement to punish offendors and to call a generall councell to try the truth or else we cannot ioyne with you against God and against his sonne Christ For we acknowledge no other principall Pastor but Christ Iesus whom the heauens must conteine vntill the time that all thinges be restored which God hath spokeÌ by the mouth of al his holy prophets since the world began who neuerthelesse is euer present with his Church Papist 7 AGaine I require of the Protestant to declare by good histories or by reasonable likelyhod when the true church as they account theirs to be decaied or in what yeare the religion of the Papistes came in and preuailed Whether all their true Church was so soundly sleeping that none would preach against it euen at the tyâe when it first entred Whether all nations sodeinly and in one yeare were mooued vnto the doctrine of the Papistes no one man of all their true âhurch either preaching teaching wriâââg nor attempting any thing against it â making mention of it Whether all âââkes of seruice were altered Whether ãâã a moment the masse was sayed in steede of their Apostolike communion Whether sodenly men began to pray for soules departed sodenly required the helpe of Saintes in heauen sodeinly the tongue of common praier was altered Tell me in what yeare of our Lorde vnder what Emperour vnder what Pope vppon what occasion this merueilous mutation was made by whome all these thinges were wrought who preached against it what storie maketh mention of it who of al your Pastoures preached against it Was Goddes Churche so voyde of the spirite of truth and strength that euen then when it most flourished it had none that durste open his mouth agaynst suche corruption of religion at the firste entering in of it and when it mighte soone haue beene repressed If it coulde not haue bene stayde tell me in what yeare of our Lorde this mutation was made and who of the true Preachers withstode our doctrine and yf wee note you not by the names euerye one of your captaines and the seuerall errours whiche they taught and the time and yeare when they rose against the receiued truth and the councels wherein they were orderly condemned If I say this canne bee doone on your side towards vs and wee do it not for improofe of your Church and religion I recante And for that purpose because the gouernement of the Bishoppes of Rome is moste misliked of them And yet moste notoriously knowne by euery Historie let them note the Pope that first brake of the course of his forefathers beliefe and Regiment in anie Articles of faith or necessarie Christian vsage And I recant Answeare 7. MY meaning is not to
of God and your vnitie to agree âith Christs veritie and Gospell But is ât this rather truely verified of your sucâssion which was vttered by Pope AâriaÌ Succedimus non Petro in pasceÌdo âd Romulo in parricidio We succeade âaith hee not Peter in feeding but Roâulus in murdering Succession of place âuaileth not one strawe if you cannot in âke maner proue the succession of Christ âs true doctrine The idolatrous priestes â al ages might verie wel haue boasted of âccession of place And so might the Phaâsees which bragged somuch of their temâle and of their succession euen from Moâes and yet they were fouly fallen awaye âroÌ the sincere pure Law of God worâhipped god in vain teaching the precepts ând doctrine of men You claime your sucâession from Peter the blessed Apostle of Christ for that as you saie he was Bishope of Rome If nowe you can proue that your religioÌ is the same that Peter taught written by the spirit of truth for the comfort of the true Church of God conteined in the newe testament of Christ Then not onely I but all which defende the same truth with me will willingly ioyne handes with you But and if you can not proue your doctrine by gods worde you must theÌ pardoÌ vs in that we wil not take your part against Christ I woulde to God that you woulde vnfainedlie sect forthe to the vse of gods people that religion which the Apostle Paule I will not say Peter for that there is no warraÌt in the scriptures for his beinge at anie time in Rome planted amongst the Romanes Which faith true religion the Apostle commendeth in theÌ âª Then surely we woulde not onely goe but ruÌne with you to the building of gods temple and woulde lay to our handes and our harts To this effect spaketh S. Ciprian that alwaies wee builde our faith succession and whole religion vpon a sure stedfast foundation If saith he The pipes of the cundit which before ran with aboundaunce happen to faile doe wee not serche to the heade c ⪠The priests of God ⪠âââing gods commaundements must doe the same that if the truthe haue fainted or failed in any point we turne to the very originall of our Lord and to the traditions of the Gospell and of the Apostles that from thence the reason of our actions or doings may arise from whence the order it selfe and originall first began Thus wee may say of your vnitie in faith your vniformiâie in ceremonies your holy functions If you can proue confirme these thinges by manifest places of the holy scriptures for my parte I will recant ând be of your religion But though you âr an Angel would perswade me to the coÌtrarie without the testimonie of Gods worde God assisting me with his spirit I will not beleue you I marueile why you will seeme to mainteine these matters seâng it is most repugnanc to the truth The âeade Capitaines of your religion and Doctours of your Church do not agree in âhe vnitie of your religion but do disâent in the principle pointes thereof Some âaye That Christes naturall body euen âhe same which was borne of the virâin Marie is receiued in the Sacrament âome denye saying that so soone as the forme of the bread is grated with the teethe straight way the body of Christ is caught vp into Heauen One sayth That a mouse may eate the body of Christ an other sayth That a mouse can not eate it and to dissolue these questions the cheefe piller of your church euen Petrus Lombardus saith What the mouse doth take or what she eateth God knoweth I can not tell And noting further the disagrement of your church men he saith Some men iudge thus some say thus some haue written thus some graunt thus some others haue taught thus that the verie substance of the bread wine remaine still And if a question saith he were moued what maner of conuersion or chaunge this is whether in forme or in substaunce or in some other manner I am not able to discusse An other saith How the body of Christ is there whether it bee by chaunging of something into it or Christes body beginne to bee there together with the bread both the substance and the accidents of the bread remaining still without chaunging it is not founde exprest in the canon of the Bible Innocentius the thirde Pope of that name sayth that there were some which sayde that as after consecration there remayned the very accidentes or formes of âreade so likewise the verie substance of the same breade remaineth still Marke howe the pleasâânt and swete âarmonie and concordaunce of your âhurch of Rome doeth agree and hange âogether as coÌcerning these weightie cauâs I thinke you iudge this transubstanâation a matter of faith You may see âen howe you agree or rather disagree â the vnitie of faith Concerning your âiformitie in your so manie superstitious âuiteles and tedious Ceremonies and âaditions of your owne inuentions it âay easily be veiwed and seene by the maâfold sectes of your religious stoare and âble of your heremites your Ankers âd Ancresses your recluses your holy âonkes of Benettes order of Cluniacenâs order of Lazarits order of Saint âieronimus order of Saint Gregories âder the order of the shadowed valley of âsaphattes order of the Humiliats orâr of the Celestines order of Gilberânes order of Iustinians order of the Charter house Monks of the Templaries order of the Iacobites order the Monks of Mount Oliuete Maries bretheren the order of the Flagellatours the Starred Monkes some white some black some graie some maled so called for thaâ they did weare male cotes next their skin the order of Iesuites and a greate company of orders besides these Of Friers somâ were called crosse bearers some Carmelitâ or white Friers some Minorities or greâ Friers some obseruant Friers some Mendicant or begging Friers some Dominicke some Franciscans so called of Sainâ Frances whose coule as Thomas Aquine faith had power to remoue sinne I omitte your Channons your Virgiâ Nunnes of all sortes but such as had nâ oyle in their Lampes your Nominals your reals I might make a long discourse here in describinge the varietie of this religions crue and companie not only in ceremoniall matters but also in matters of faith and doctrine But I trust all the world doth knowe howe they haue bene bewitched with such kind of sorceries and therefore I should but wast labour and lose time You aske further Whether wee bee bounde to obey your Church of Rome and none other in all controuesies and doubtes raised by the difficultie of the Scriptures or by the vaine contention of heresies Hereby you seeme to chalenge two thinges not onely a prerogatiue or preheminence aboue all other churches but also the interpretation of the scriptures solely and wholy to appertaine vnto you But I pray you tell me from whence you had this