when you had but thoughts that your own interest would not stand who are turned Traytors to their native Country ready to joyn with Scots or Devil in the ruine of it Your selves or those you call Anabaptists who are they at present that endeavour to kindle a fire in the neighbour Nations to burn up their own your selves or the Anabaptists In a word who are they that refuse or at least murmur against promising fidelity to the Magistrate in the common good your selves or the Anabaptists Let truth be judge and acknowledge your mistake and be ashamed for ever thus grosly to belye the truth and its servants laying your own blame and shame upon other mens shoulders And put case there be any that pretend themselves to be Christians in that profession you so much contemn that dishonour truth in any of these particulars mentioned by you Yet how dare you say they are such all of them laying the scandal upon the whole as if because there was one Judas all the Disciples must be Hypocrites But Sir if we should judge of you after this manner we could say more of you then you shall ever be able to say of us I trust I could tell you of Priests Free-willers Drunkards Swearers Whore-masters what not should I therefore say you are all such men but I forbear at present only this take heed how you take the Devils work upon you next to accuse the brethren if not I must speak more at large unto you as to the rest of the particulars you mention as the Twelfth that Christ died intentionally for all I say he dyed for all although not intentionally to save all for if he had intended to save all he had not failed of his intention 17. That its unlawful to go Law Is this such a grievous errour with you I answer 1. That its chargeable to go to Law and 2. That the Apostle reproves it as a sin and fault in the Corinthians 1 Cor. 6. 2. Dare any of you having a matter against another to go to Law before the unjust and not before the Saints And yet you dare to upbrade the Saints who dare not go to Law and yet you belye them too in respect either of persons or opion 1. Of opinion they deny not going to Law absolutely but in case of necessity when no other way or means will serve and that too secondly when it tends to the prejudice of their livelihood and being 2. Of Persons It s not all but possibly some few tender souls dare not own going to Law in any case and I wish all were more tender in this respect although they become your reproach and scandal more then yet they are 18. That Wars are unuseful c. Answ First it s the judgement but of some and I believe of very few that Wars are altogether useless Secondly Their judgement is that Wars are useless in the Kingdom of Christ and that its useful only in the Kingdomes of the world amongst men for the preservation of civil Rights and upon this account are they active in the present War so publike as that I wonder how you could without shame and blushing mention this particular but that you shoot your arrows so at random â—s that you neither fear or shame before God or man for those you brand with the name of Anabaptists and Independents have been and are the Instruments by whom God hath given a being to your selves and Nation though men are blind and do not or wil not see it Thirdly Are you an Enemy to the Saints because they are men of peace and not of War and blood like your selves Fourthly You discover much ignorance or wilfulness in your accusations of them or else you could not so contradict your self in it In the seventh Tenent you say They are tumultuous and raised Tumults in Germany and filled it with the fire of Sedition to the loss of six hundred thousand men And in the eighteenth Wars are useless Was there ever such contradictions heard And truly I must tell you I credit not the Relation of the German Wars I see how bold you are in lying while we are yet alive to give you Answer that I cannot credit that Relation the people being gone and their Adversaries too relate it I rather think the Priests were the cause of it as they were in this Nation and am confident if they durst give a Relation of things to another Age They would say as much of the Anabaptists or rather of the baptized Christians of this Nation as they of old did of those in Germany 19. That all Ordinances are legal that the spirit is all Here you contradict your self again if another should have done so much you would have thought him not in his right wits In the first you say Their Tenent is that none must be baptized untill they come to perfect age and can make confession of their Faith Here they own baptism you confess your self And in the 26. you say Their Tenent is that after rebaptization they cannot sin in which you belie them as much as ever the Devil belyed Truth but I pass In the 19 you say They deny all Ordinances Is not this contradiction Truly you teach people not to believe you and then you are angry with the people for it 20. The Magistrate must compell none in matters of Religion but must tolerate all Ans Can Magistrates make men Religious Is it not the work of Christ to make men Christians and Religious and to compel them by the power of love Or is it the work of the Magistrate I thought where to have you at last within the Borders of Rome and indeed Sir are you come no farther yet What a Minister of Christ and want the help of the Magistrate to make Christians to compel them to come in unto you And Sir Why may not a Jesuite have as good a Church as you if the Magistrate must convert them compel them to come in and so you will have in all Do you believe that its the work of God to convert and that he will take one of a City and two of a Tribe and bring them to Jerusalem How durst you then to bring in all by a Magisterial Power into the Church unless you resolve to make them Hypocrites and to damn them to the purpose or unless you see it stand for your profit and advantage the cloathing and feeding of your back and belly by the vulgar sort of people who are thus deluded by you And as for toleration we desire not the Magistrate to tolerate any in their wickedness and if any under the pretence of conscientious principles live and allow themselves in loosness baseness and prophaness let the Sword of Justice be drawn for the execution of Justice upon all such without respect of person or opinion and in it shall we rejoyce 21. That the Father Son and holy Ghost are not three distinct persons one in Essence c. But Sir Who told you they were three persons have you it in Scripture or by tradition from Rome if in Scripture produce it when you come forth in publick next for mine own part I know no such Scripture And this I shall with confidence affirm that neither Father Son or Spirit are at all called Person or Persons as God but it s a Title proper only to man in Scripture given
to this It is an Art and a Trade and by this we have our gain it cost us much the attaining therefore we must sell c. The preaching brethren say That where the love of Christ is enjoyed it s a law sufficient to keep from sin and to conform to Christ But the Humanists say nay it s a Doctrine of liberty and that its the Law of Moses fear and wrath that must keep from sin c. Thus have I given some few brief hints amongst many that so it may appear who are the renters of Scripture the gifted brethren or the Linguists You Query How a man should expound and reconcile Scripture without learning To that end you produce many Scriptures you say hard to be interpreted I answer That the Spirit of Christ which is the original of all truth and dwelleth in the Saints is sufficient and doth teach them those things of which the Humanists are ignorant Joh. 15. 13. 1 Cor. 2. from the 12th to the end You conclude there is need of Retorick and Arts to understand the Scripture 1 Thes 5. 19. quench not the Spirit that is the Gifts and yet notwithstanding all your Retorick Arts Learning c. you are the men that understand not the Scripture you are the men who quench the Spirit in your brethren and despise Prophesying if it comes not out of your forge for that is it which is there intended quench not the Spirit that is the Spirits workings in the Saints which many will do out of a low and base esteem of their brethren in despising of Prophesy which is but an interpretation of the former How do men quench the Spirit Answ In despising of Prophesy c. Hence the holy Ghost you say commends learning By the way holy Ghost and for all your learning is there any such word in all the Scripture as Ghost But you instance in Moses Act. 7. 22. Who was learned in all the wisdom of the Egyptians And no wonder being naturalized unto it bred up in it Daniel and his companions had skill in all learning and wisdom Dan. 1. 4. 17. For what was it these children were to be looked forth that in it they might preach or to teach the tongues and learning of the Caldeans to those amongst whom they were Captives vers 17. God gave them understanding in all learning and wisdom and to Daniel the knowledge of visions This was the gift of God immediate not acquired by Arts that they might set forth the glory of their Creator not themselves and their own pride Apollo was eloquent and mighty in Scripture So are your gifted brethren able in the might and strength of the grace of Christ to hold forth truth and to convince gain-sayers though not mighty in humane Arts c. Paul could speak languages more then they all but what languages acquired gotten by industry or of the Spirit its the gifts of the Spirit the Apostle speaks of not humane this is but a trick and shift of the Devil and Antichrist now they have lost those gifts of the Spirit to set up humane in the room a mystery of iniquity You say The Apostle cites Heathen Poets to convince the Grecians c. So may the gifted brethren produce Turks and Heathens to reprove you and your Christians He useth Syriack and Hebrew phrases No wonder when it was his own native Language Hence we read say you of Schools of the Prophets and Colledges erected c. Answ This is but your own Learned Retorical Exposition there is never a word of School or Colledge in the Text but the sons of the Prophets that is every one who had received the same spirit of the Prophets if there were Schools and Colledges as you imagine it s like the Lord dealt with them as he doth with you now adays he never that we read of took a Prophet from that School but from their Callings that the work might appear to be of himself and and not man but the truth is there were no such Schools of Idleness and wantonness as you have erected for your selves Well say you But how shall a man be able to preserve the truth how shall a man be able to Analyse and open Scripture without Logick Retorick Tongues c. And do you not know in good earnest how to do it Is your Philosophy the mother of your Theologie Your gifted brethren can tell you how to do it it s the light of the Spirit of truth in which they preserve truth and it s in the light of the same Spirit in which they understand and open obscure and dark phrases And indeed as you say Great is the pride and wantonness of the Priests to tread all that learning of the Spirit under foot without which the knowledge of Scriptures is not to be had laying all upon humane endeavors undervaluing the Gifts of the Spirit c. But you conclude your self That Arts and Sciences are necessary not of absolute necessity Well Sir To say no more about this Argument your gifted brethren they stick to that which is of absolute necessity the Spirit of Christ You bless your selves with that you confess is not of absolute necessity a man may be a Minister without it make you much of it little good wil it do you and little will it avail you in the evil day The seventh Argument from the sinfulness of it Whatsoever is not of faith is sin Heb. 11. 6. But whatsoever we do if we do it not by vertue of some Command or Call is not of Faith Ergo 'T is sin But the gifted brethren have a word of Faith and a Call as I have already proved therefore it s no sin You refer the proof of this Argument to the Examination of their Objections I shall do the like in my Answer purposing there to meet you c. The eighth Argument If none may preach but such as be Ordained then every gifted person may not preach but none may preach but such as be Ordained Tit. 1. 5. I will that thou Ordain Elders c. Answ This is but the substance of what you have said already and I have given a full Answer unto it therefore shall say but a word or two to the nonsence of your Argument Because Titus was left in Crete to Ordain and because they ordained Elders in every Church c. therefore none else must preach but such as be Ordained Whereas first As I have already said and proved Paul and divers others did preach before they were Ordained And secondly That unless men did preach before Ordination there was no ground for which they should be Ordained if their Gifts be not manifest Thirdly Ordination was not upon any such account as that by it they might preach the more lawfully but that the Gift might first be increased upon them 1 Tim. 4. 14. Secondly that they might attend upon the work of watching feeding reproving ruling c. The ninth Argument If no man
I shall give some brief hints 1. That Justification and Salvation is by grace alone through Christ without any relation to any thing done by the creature 2. That this Justification and Salvation is enjoyed by faith 3. That this faith is the gift of God 4. That where this faith is truly wrought it produceth an universall obedience to the whole Law of Christ and that its the Believers priviledge only to be baptized 5. That obedience to Magistrates is the will of God and they submit for conscience sake 6. That believers are to press forwards after perfection in the use of lawfull means as Prayer Preaching Conference Fellowship c. 7. That none are the Ministers of the Gospel but such as have received the Spirit and power from on high 8. That the Spirit of Christ and the Scripture is sufficient for the Ministers calling and both Minister and peoples salvation 9. That its the work of the Lord and of him alone in the ministery of the Gospel to convert and build up souls 10. That all the Saints may and ought to exercise their gifts for the good of others according to the measure they have received 11. That it is their duty to be men of peace and as much as in them lieth to live peaceably with all 12. That a vizard and shew of holiness and innocency to deceive others without the power and life of godliness is the deepest hypocrisie and shall be punished with the deepest damnation 13. Their expectation is of a change in the day of the Lord wherein they shall be made conformable to him in glory 14. And in the mean time they are saved by hope that as the Anchor of the soul is cast into that which is within the vail where they are held both sure and stedfast Where they are cheared and comforted against all the black mouths and false scandals and lying tongues of Devil Priests or men that shall be opened against them notwithstanding you fear not neither tremble to do the work of the devil in laying false scandals and accusations to the charge of Gods Elect without just cause the Lord will in his time reprove you and rebuke you Well but I pass by because I must hasten to your Arguments I shall only take notice of a word or two more because its bootless to trace you in your folly You say You have forborn all gall and bitterness and tempered your reproof with love and meekness that you have dipt your nails in oyl that your witness is on high that you have done nothing out of envie spleen or passion to the persons of the men c. Truly Sir you have buttered words were your deeds answerable when the truth is that there is nothing else but gall and bitterness lying and false accusations are these words rouled in Sugar you would fain be shut of them have them banished the Nation I thought to what your sugered words would amount at last and indeed no wonder for it is the best portion that ever the world could afford the Saints As for your ensuing preface unto your first Argument I pass it over because in answering your Arguments I shall answer those things which seem to have weight in them because reiterations are both needless and useless The Arguments against the Preaching of gifted Brethren Examined and Answered Argument I. If God were angry with those in the time of the Law that did usurp the Priests office then he being Jehovah the same for ever will be angry with those in the time of the Gospel that do usurp the Ministers office But God was angry with those in the time of the Law that did usurp the Priests office Ergo He will be angry with those in the Gospel that do usurp the Ministers office Your Major you say is clear from the immutability of Gods nature he is the same that is truth But for to give you a discovery of the Fallacie and weakness of your Argument I shall give you a two-fold Answer First Your Major joyns the Priesthood of the Law and the Ministery of the Gospel together when the truth is there is no comparison between them The Priests were to offer Sacrifice and they only to teach the people and to minister about the things of the Altar as they were Types of Christ the great high Priest who offered himself once for all a Sacrifice for the sins of his people But the Ministers of the Gospel they are no Types of Christ they do not offer Sacrifice for sin c. Therefore there is no comparison between them none might meddle with the office or work of a Priest because it was appointed of God and did so clearly represent that great high Priest Christ Jesus but the work of a Minister of Christ is to declare forth what they have heard and seen from the Lord Jesus who is already come 1 Joh. 1. 1. 2. and this is the work of every Saint according to the measure of the gift received But secondly I answer I grant the truth of your Major in the terms but I deny that gifted brethren usurp the ministerial office in their preaching usurpation is a sin but for men to speak of the things of God according to the measure they have received is no usurpation Rom. 12. 6. 1 Pet. 10. 4. 11. nor sin but every Christians duty although you by your Logick and Retorick and forged innovations and abusive Interpretations would amaze and amuze the world and affright the Saints with Vzzah and Korah Dathan and Abiram c. But know that they are such as never came from Christ but the smoak ascending out of the bottomless Pit endeavouring to darken the bright shining of the Sun of righteousness in and by Saints Korah Dathan and Abiram were smiten for doing that they were forbidden you smite the Saints for doing that they are commanded and for which they are commended 1 Cor. 14. from the first to the fifth You apply that unto the gifted brethren which retorts it self justly upon your self For first you say usurpation to the Office of the Ministry is a great sin gifted brethren only exercise their gifts not usurp the Office but your selves it is that usurp the Office without the gift many yea most of the Ministers of the Nation usurp the Office but for the gift they are not only ignorant of but enemies to it And secondly not only usurp the Office without the gift but usurp the Office likewise without any colorable ground for it They cry up Office Office of the Ministery when they know not what it is and have no more authentick Authority for their Ordination to their Office then the Pope and the Devil can give them You instance Korah c. and apply it to the preaching brethen but truly if the Lord give you eyes but to see it you might more truly apply it to your selves you thrust your selves into the Priests Office as if you were holy and none but you and
you must do all and monopolize all to your selves when you have no more to do with the Office of a Minister nor have no more Calling to it then Korah and his Company or the Devil himself I prove it thus First Those who usurp the Office of the Ministery to themselves and have no more Call unto it either according the letter or the Spirit then Korah and his Company are guilty of Korah's sin but the Ministery of the Nation have no more Call unto it then Korah had Ergo They are guilty of Korah's sin 1. They have no Call according to the letter by a right Ordination for that they have lost in Rome long since and now have brought forth the carkass the form only and like children bless themselves with that as if they had found some great pearl Secondly There is no Call from the Spirit they then should live in the Spirits light and not in the darkness of the Devil and do the Spirits work build up the Saints encourage them in exercising their gifts for their mutual good and building up not hinder them and reproach them for so doing bear their weakness cover their infirmities reprove with meekness and love not belye them scandal them falsly accuse them like the Devil And whereas you say 'T is dangerous for men to preach without a Call and 't is dangerous for people to bear such I say its truth but gifted brethren do not preach without a Call their gift and opportunity is their Call But you it is that preach without a Call for the gift in most of you it is a stranger and you are strangers unto it and believe it the punishment will be great the earth will cleave and swallow you up in conclusion To what you have added in your third Edition I add this Answer You say Remember Hind c. Sir Are you so impudent as to reproach Saints and Truth with particular mens sins and faults Might you not upon the same account reproach Christ himself behold one of his own Disciples betray him and Peter denying him an old trick of the Devil to reproach truth withall If I should deal thus with you as justly I might I could tell you of a zealous Preacher of your tribe one Williams of Munton in Somersetshire got his servant with Child and was outed by the Committee of that County and another of Chard in the same County very zealous and like your self preached bitterly against Sectaries yet got one of his nearest friends daughter with Child and was outed likewise by the Committee another very near the same place did the like And upon this account it may easily be made manifest that there are not a filthyer Generation of Adulterers and Devils in the Nation then your own Coat You say That for it he hath been cast out of his gathered Church A discovery of their integrity they cannot bear them that do evil that say they are Jews and are not but you entertain drunkards whore-mongers prophane all sorts in you Congregation both of Priests and people and never cast them out a demonstration that you are no Church of Christ but the Synagogue of Satan a Cage of unclean and hateful birds Argument II. If none may Preach but such as are sent then every gifted brother may not preach but none may preach but such as are sent Ergo. Every gifted brother may not preach Your Argument in the Minor I grant but the Major I deny that although its true none can preach according to the intention of that Scripture Rom. 10. 15 viz. for the working of faith and converting of souls yet it doth not follow that every gifted brother may not preach for every gifted brother is sent to preach according to the measure of the gift received And your grand mistake in this Argument is in the word sent whereas that word sent relates to the internal power of the Spirit in the Saints by which they are enabled to speak a word in season to the very soul you understand it to be an outward mission or sending a poor and low interpretation The mission you say implyes three things Election by the Churches Probation and Examination by the Presbytery separation by Ordination of the Presbytery First Election by the Church But by what Church not your Parochial Provincial or National Church The New Testament never knew such a Church nor Christ in the New Testament never did never will own such a Church a company of ignorant prophane carnal creatures both Priest and people yet have gotten the name of a Church and Ministery blessing themselves in that name and yet are ignorant what it is for a Church of Christ to whom Election belongs are a company of Believers Saints gathered out of the world by the power of the Lord in the Ministry of the Gospel 1 Cor. 1. 2. Act. 2. 47. chap. 4. 32. But you are Enemies to this Church rail reproach persecute they are the object of your scorn and malice I grant that where such a Church is Election belongs to them yet I say a man may be sent to preach though not elected by the Church Act. 8. 1. 4. The whole Church being scattered preached and I suppose none dare say that all of them were Elected and Ordained for I said before there is a preaching by way of gift and office and preaching by gift only and it s the Churches joy to see her Members gifted and exercised in this way But as for your selves as your Church is no true Church nor your Ministry no true Ministry so you fail likewise in your Election by that Church for you are in your way first ordained and then you are sent to your Churches Parishes whether they will or no and you take them by violence if you have a minde to their Tythes you will be their Minister though never elected by them and afterward if you have a Call to another place for your advantage you will leave them again and imbrace the second and the third too it may be yet you dare be so bold as to tell of your electing by the Church where as first it is no Church but a Parish consisting for the most part of ignorant carnal souls and secondly you press your selves upon them whether they will or no for the most part where then is your Election by the Church of Christ thus you fail in the first part of your mission non-Election by a Church of Christ and then I pray who sent you Your second is Probation and Examination by the Presbytery the Scripture you produce is 1 Cor. 14 32. For the spirits of the Prophets are subject to the Prophets c. A learned interpretation of this Scripture the spirits of those who are to be ordained to preach must be subject to the examination and probation of the Presbytery when there is not the least hint or intention of such a thing in the words for the Apostle saith Ye may all prophesie one
intend by Learning Humane and Divine whether you minde a perfection of Learning for you set no bounds upon your terms if so it s to be doubted that your selves are but Ignoramus's in both in your best and most experienced Art of humanity you come short of many Heathens and Philosophers and I am very confident that many in this Nation who never knew what an Art or Science meant in its form or method in way of School Study have more natural Philosophy Logick Retorick in their heads then your selves who so much pride your selves in your shame But whether am I wandring into the bottomless Pit of mans wisdom take your honour in this blackness and darkness and go on spoiling souls by your Philosophy Col. 2. 8. till the Lord prevent you You say in the Minor of your first Argument That every gifted Trades-man nailer tailor c. is not able to divide the word aright c. And is every Priest of your Calling in the Nation able to divide the Word aright in your own judgement or is one in ten nay in twenty be the judge your self if not be ashamed to bring such Arguments any more because every gifted Trades-man is not able therefore none are able c. because every Priest is not able therefore none are able Artificers in their art of preaching And in your second Argument you say most of them want learning c. And may not your selves say most of your own Calling want learning humane and divine I am sure you want divine learning else you would not make such humane Arguments against the divine truth but we confess your Argument we want learning not humane but divine and we wait on the Lord for his teachings acknowledging with the Apostle Who is sufficient for these things 2 Cor. 2. 16. You say Nor to convince a learned Adversary Truly now adays your selves are the learned Adversaries the Church of Christ hath to deal withall And this I must tell you and you 'l finde it by experience that the gifted brethren will in the light and strength of truth overturn all the wisdom of the flesh as it s exercised against the truth in you or any others God will make all fleshes wisdom and pride and glory vale it self and fall down at the presence of his truth in his Saints as Dagon before the Ark you are mistaken Sir to think its your humanity that makes you able to divide the Word aright and that makes you an able Disputant it s the power of the Spirit of Christ in his people that makes them able to divide the Word and to convince gain-sayers Therefore your Argument is weak and hath nothing in it if any thing it reacheth your selves as well as others nay more then others because you live in that sphear and yet want but the gifted brethren see their wants and acknowledge it not boast of their fulness like your selves and they see they may want learning both humane and divine and yet divide the Word aright be solid Disputants for the truth so far as they have received not walking without or beyond their line knowing the Lord is their light and strength who never fails those that trust in him and only one thing I desire to Query of you If ever the like was read or heard of in Scripture so much ado about humane Learning to beat down truth and prevent the free operations of the Spirit in Saints Did any seek to hinder Gods workings in this way Oh Sir you want learning humane Arts and parts Therefore prophesy not preach not unto us If Old or New Testament Law or Gospel Moses or Christ hath done the like pray produce it If not be ashamed for ever to account your self a Minister of the Gospel and to mak use of such an engine against truth and its Owners as never any in the world made use of but Babylon and Egypt You grant That Translations are excellent helps yet there is such an emphasis and fulness in the Original that the Translation is nothing to the glory of it Answ It s like that is the reason you are so filled and puffed up with this outward fulness as that the Original of all fulness the fulness of the Spirit is scarce ever spoken of by you as if the Spirit of the Lord was not sufficient for these things You complain What miserable wrakings and rentings of Texts have come into the world for want of this Learning Come Sir Let us now a little consider who are the greatest wrackers renters and tearers of Scriptures The learned Humanists or the preaching Brethren The preaching brethren they hold and say that salvation is through Grace and that without any relation to any qualification or good in the creature according to Isay 55. 1. Rom. 4. 5. The Humanists say no but there must be some creature qualification some good in the creature before the soul must presume to come to Christ The preaching brethren hold and say that none but believers are to be baptized because there is neither precept nor president for it The Humanists say Infants must though no Scripture for it and this is their practice The preaching brethren say That the Saints are the Church of Christ and that they dare not own any else to be members if they manifest the contrary 1 Cor. 1. 12. because they are the body of Christ chap. 12. 27. and compact together Ephes 4. 16. with carnal ones they can have no spiritual fellowship 2 Cor. 6. 15. 16. But the Humanists say nay to this They will turn the world into Church and make all Christians thus deluding them thus forming up a monstrous body for Christ if he would accept of it But you might with better acceptation present your Church at the feet of the Pope then at the feet of Christ Thus owning a communion with them rather in their Estates tythe Pigs Geese and Eggs then with their souls for some of you will confess they are no Christians but deluded ones for self-ends and would not own them nor have any fellowship with them were it not for their bellies their God is their belly and their glory will be their shame The preaching brethren they own none for Christians but those who are convinced and converted by the preaching of the Gospel The Humanists want the power of the Civil Magistrate to convert souls for them The preaching brethren they say That Christ is King of Saints and that its his work alone to accept or reject in matters of conscience relating to the knowledge or worship of him and that who so gets into his room is the Antichrist But the Humanists Pope-like and Queen Mary-like cry out imprison hang burn banish the Sectaries that will not do as we say c. The preaching brethren say That preaching is a Gift and that its the work of the Saints according to their measure to communicate having received freely freely to give But the Humanists say nay
loosness and prophaness lay not the blame upon the practice of the Truth but let it light where it is So that it s not the preaching of Gifted Brethren that brings in Errour but the preaching of uncalled and ungifted ones such as your selves are that brings in Errour and it s the preaching of Gifted ones that will be a means of its discovery and bringing out The sixteenth Argument If the Church be Gods House and Family then no man may presume to exercise any Function there without a Call from God but the Church is Gods House and that God should appoint Officers and Order in his own House is but reason Granted but this is the order of Gods House That all his Children should communicate each to other according to the Gift as I have already proved and it s the order of the Devils house to destroy this order of the Lords Jer. 11. 21. The seventeeneth Argument from the Rise of it That which springs from pride and self conceitedness cannot be good but this kind of Preaching springs from pride and self conceitedness Ergo It cannot be good The Major is granted that the Minor is true You say you judge by their actions you judge of springs by their streams and trees by their fruit But are you so ignorant bold and impudent as to judge of Saints for doing their Duty its their duty to Preach and Prophesie and in Humility and Obedience they act in it not taking the Office but exercising the Gift as they have received having freely received they freely give But it s your own preaching that flows from pride and self conceitedness you that would preach and none else we hinder none from preaching that hath the Gift your selves it is who usurp the Office by reason of your imaginary gifts being never called to it by God or man according to the Truth You it is who thrust your selves in by violence whether the people will or no the dry keck and bramble it is indeed who desire to rule that is the reason so many of the honest Party have left you because of your driness and emptiness and that is the reason you are so much troubled for want of the ruling scratching persecuting power but your preaching Brethren desire not to rule unless over their corruptions nor to scratch unless they could by the power of Truth scratch away your Ignorance Envy and Pride against the Lord and his Truth c. it s the irregular using of Gifts which is when men would by that means stifle all except their own this flows from Pride The eighteenth Argument If Christ at his Ascension gave only some to be Pastors and Teachers then all Gifted men may not Teach but Christ at his Ascension gave only some to be Pastors and Teachers Ephes 4. 11. 1 Cor. 12. 28 29. Ans If a gifted Brother should have brought forth such a gross and palpable untruth you would have thought it had been for want of learning the very Scriptures you produce to prove it being so evident against youâ— your falshood lieth in the words only Pastors and Teachers see the Scriptures God hath set some in his Church 1. Apostles 2. Prophets 3. Teachers c. how dare you be so bold as to say only Pastors c 1. Apostles That is men sent for the gathering of the Saints 2. Prophets That is Gifted brethren Prophesying according to the measure of Faith And 3. Out of these Prophets are taken Pastors and Teachers no Prophet no Pastor nor Teacher c. Thus briefly the falacy of your Argument is made manifest the gift is for all I will pour out my spirit upon all c. The nineteenth Argument That which hath neither precept nor president is neither commanded nor commended in the Word of God may not be tolerated in the Church of God But this kinde of Preaching by Gifted Brethren hath neither precept nor president in all the Word of God Ergo it may not be tolerated in the Church of God You conclude This new found Officer a gifted Preacher out of office is not to be found in the Bible I have already proved this truth that it is commanded and commended there is both Precept and President 1. Precept They shall declare the glorious majesty of thy Kingdom to the sons of men Psal 145. 11 12. As every one hath received so let them administer Commended 1 Cor. 14. 5 6. 2. President All the Prophets in the Old Testament acted sutable to the gift it was no Office viz. Prophesie but a gift 1. In the New Testament the scattered brethren Act 8. and Paul Acts 9. 20. straight way he Preached he never looked for an office as you dream and the truth is I can scarce imagine that you are so ignorant of this truth as you seem to be but that others might rest themselves quiet and satisfied in what you say Let your ignorance in presenting such gross untrue conclusions that this Preacher is not to be found in the Bible be recanted and repented of for shame The twentieth Argument From the practice of all Reformed Churches That which is condemned in all the Churches of God and is contrary to their practice ought not to be tolerated in our Church but this practice of private mens Preaching without a Call is condemned by all the Churches of God and is contrary to their practice Ergo. As for the Major and the Minor your Churches and your old Divines are no rule for me to walk by nor to any others who have their eyes in their heads no further then they follow Christ the Spirit and the Scripture The Spirit in the Scripture is the rule of Saints and this I am sure the custom of the Churches in the Scripture is contrary to your customs their custom was That Preaching brethren should both Preach and Prophesie 1 Cor. 14. 31. And for those who will be contentious against this truth there was nor is no such custom in the Churches of the Lord therefore keep the example of your Churches and Divines to your self who walk not according to the rule if any man walk not according to this rule it is because there is no light in him Isai 8. 20. Thus have I briefly run through your Pulpit-Guard and doubt not but that I have Routed you in all your Twenty Strong Holds that now the way being opened again the Gifted brethren may come in to your Pulpit without sin or shame As for your Indictment against the Lay-Prophet as you call him it is so ridiculous so poor and low not being accompanyed with common reason the Jury you pretend to call are your Witnesses the evidence you call it You have lost your self in the very form no wonder if you are lost in the matter you forsake the Scripture and flie to Apostatized Churches or rather to those who call themselves Churches Jews and are not but we have examined them and found them lyars you calling old Divines men of
not but who are blind as my Messenger Thou False Prophet that pretendest thy self to be my Messenger and Minister yet most blind of all Who blind as thee pretending to open the eye and seest not thy self opening the ear but hearest not thy self vers 19. 20. Therefore first that thou mayst yet know there is mercy with me for the worst of sinners that I may be feared I advertise thee to kiss the Son least he angry if his wrath be kindled but a little Oh blessed are they then that trust in him Psal 2. Be not obstinate against my truth and servants any longer resolve not to break my bonds and cords of love and grace any longer If thou hear and obey there is yet the kiss of love for thee but if thou be still rebellious and persist in thine obstinacy my Sentence is that thou with that Beast before whom thou hast wrought miracles and deceived them that dwell on the Earth shall be taken both alive and cast into the Lake of fire burning with brimstone Rev. 19. 20. Now you say You proceed to Answer all the Cavils Scruples and Arguments which are brought in defence of Lay Preachers in which I shall trace you and finde you too light The first Objection Gen. 18. 19. The Lord commends Abraham for teaching his Family Ergo private persons may be preachers You say This was a long Cutlers Argument and that its like their Logick c. But believe it it s an Argument that hath more weight and perpetuity in it then your long Gownes although this is not an Argument much made use on for this purpose therefore I shall say the less to it in this place only give a hint or two that the weakness of your conclusions may appear 1. You say That was his Family and its one thing for a man to instruct and teach his Family and another thing to preach But stay a little Sir is it lawfull for a man to teach his Family and is it unlawfull for him to teach others May he not teach the same to others as he teacheth his Family Is it unlawfull for him to teach the way of God to others Was there ever the like heard of in this world It s lawfull for a preaching brother to preach and teach the way of God to his Family but not to others for preaching is but a speech or speaking of words and this I must do to my Family or nothing at all and this I may do it seems but not to others the reason rendred is because God commanded it but it seems if God had not commanded it then it had been unlawfull for a man to teach his Family too as if the law of Grace did not teach to do good to all Soul as well as Body others as well as Family but its evident there is a time when every man shall teach not only his Family but his brother and his neighbour too saying Know the Lord that is teach the knowledge of the Lord Jer. 31. 34 which was or is a condition preceding a glory that was to be revealed Now Sir if you and your Churches do all know the Lord from the least to the greatest and have no need of teaching let us know it when you come forth next in publike but if not be ashamed and silent for ever thus to mince and wrest Scripture to your own ends For till then they shall teach every man his brother in the constituted Churches for believers are all brethren and every man his neighbour so much is clearly implyed in the Scripture And thou shalt not suffer thy brother to sin but shalt reprove him and tell him his fault c. And comfort one another with the same comforts with which you your selves have been comforted 2 Cor. 1. 5. 2. You say If it be granted that Abraham did preach publikely yet it will not be any advantage because he was a Patriarch and a Prophet Gen. 2. 7. which Title is never given to any one in all the Scripture but only to one in office You are mistaken much in this likewise For first I say Prophesie is not an office but a gift so it was in the old so in the new Testament They prophesied according to the measure of the gift received and no further and I say that the Name or Title of office or officer is not given to a Prophet in all the Scripture because it is a gift and not an office Hence I conclude contrary to yours that as prophesie is a gift and Abraham and the rest of the Prophets did prophesie according to the measure of the gift received both in the old and new Testament So may every Nayler Taylor Artificer having received the same Spirit according to their measure prophesie and preach forth the truths of God for the good of others If it be objected That prophesying was an extraordinary gift and that spirit given but to few I answer In the time of the Law it was so but in the Gospel dayes it is not so prophesying in the Gospel it is to speak to edification exhortation and comfort 1 Cor. 14. 3. which is proper to all the brethren as in the same Chapter none exempted but women ver 34. and they may prophesie too though not in the Church or at least by permission of the Church 1 Cor. 11. 5. all men that have the gift may teach in the Church 1 Tim. 2. 12. its implyed by the womans prohibition the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophesie and this is given to the brethren Rev. 19. 10. and he that can speak experimentally of the work of Christ for him in him and testifie his worth and work to others is a Prophet and may nay ought to declare this Jesus to others every spirituall man is a Prophet but the Saints are all spiritual therefore all Prophets 1 Cor. 14. 37. If any be ignorant of this let him be ignorant Wherefore my brethren covet to prophesie c. ver 38 39. The second Objection From Numb 11. 25. to 30. Eldad and Medad prophesied and Moses wisheth that all the Lords people were Prophets Ergo All that have gifts may prophesie and preach In answer to this first you say That this was an extraordinary spirit of prophesie Grant it to be so yet the spirit of prophesie in the Gospel is ordinary and proper to all the Saints it s poured out upon them all and accordingly they may prophesie 2. The spirit of prophesie here spoken of was a spirit of Government as appears by the Context ver 16 17. you had done very well to have produced one Scripture in the Bible if you could that saith the spirit of government is a spirit of prophesie Blindness with a witness Do you not know that Moses was a prophet as well as a prince and Leader of the People and that spirit of prophesie that was upon Moses was given likewise to the Seventy I make no question but that they
might be and were the better enabled to govern by this spirit but the spirit of government is nowhere called the spirit of prophesie then all good and wise Governours are Prophets and when they consult and talk about Government they do prophesie by this account These are a sort of Prophets I never heard or read of in Scripture its true many Governours were Prophets but not as Governours neither were they Governours as they were Prophets 3. Moses his wish was not that all might preach but that they might be able to rule oh that the Lords people had a spirit of government c. It seems by your words that Moses would have all the people to be governours who then should be governed for if all had the spirit of prophesie they must make use of it accordingly they must govern c. but I have told you already that there is a difference between prophesying and governing So that Moses desire is That all the Lords people were Prophets and then they might prophesie if Prophets He doth not desire to have Prophets and intend to forbid them to prophesie like the Priests of the Nation that pray that God would send Labourers into the Harvest and when they come are mad at them and would hang them if they could You say that his wish implies that none might prophesie till they were Prophets and men in office I say the contrary it implies that none could prophesie untill they had the gift and then they might and may prophesie but your selves it is who prophesie or preach if I may discoursingly give it that term without gift or office either as for gift you are enemies to it unless University gifts the smoke of the pit and so what you do is by art make it and then sell it this is your gift and as for office I have told you the rise of that already and from whence it came You conclude That to your apprehension it cannot hang together because Prophets in office might prophesie that therefore Lay-men might prophesie But I say all the Lords people are Kings Priests and Prophets and may Prophesie c. You say It will come no nearer together then St Jermans Lips which were nine mile asunder It s like this was the Saint that swallowed the Ox you mentioned but its strange he could not swallaw his tail too his lips being at such a distance It s like this Jerman was the great grandfather to the Saint Persons of England for they could never swallow so much as they do if their lips were not at a great distance each from other but its like Sir you do but tell a lye in jest his lips were not altogether at such a distance as you mention if they were he had a very great mouth its like and a body sutable to it he could digest Oxen Pigs and Geese nothing comes amiss it seems The third Objection From 2 Chron. 17. 7 8 9. 2 Chron. 19 to 11 29 25. Here saith Master Robinson are most pithy and exellent Sermons of Jehosophat and Hezekiah c. besides he sent his Princes to teach in the cities of Judah c. hence gifted persons may preach though not in office Your answer 1. Teaching is taken two wayes 1. Largely for Fathers c. Masters c. 2. For a Pastoral act so none but Priests c. might preach Answ Though not by way of Office yet by way of Gift they might c. Oh that Magistrates would promote the Ministry c. It seems you want promoting for so long you will promote the Magistrate but be sure no longer would bless our temporals exaltation and promotion is that you long for and the blessing of the Tithes But Sir its that we desire the incouraging of a faithful Ministry which is the ministry of the spirit in the Saints not a faithless self-seeking one 3. Princes say you teach Efficienter by causing the Levits to do their duty he sent Princes to see the people taught c. but that is but your word the Text saith He sent Princes to teach the People you say to see them who shall be believed the Scripture or your self should your Preaching brethren give such an Interpretation you would say that through ignorance they wrest the Scripture You say It is a rule that what I command my servant to do I am said to do it my self And is this a perfect rule may not you do that your self which you command your servant to do he that hath power to command may lawfully do that himself which he commands a nother if he hath ability to it If the Princes might command to Preach they might then as well and as lawfully preach themselves For any man to command that which is not lawful for him to do himself is sinful either in Civil or Divine affairs Your reason standeth good What I command my servant to do I am said to do it my self and if you do it your self by your servant you may do it your self by your self if the first then second is lawful 4. You answer That suppose you grant that Princes did Preach yet there is a vast difference between them and our Gifted Brethren 1. These were sent to teach by the Magistrates command but our Jehosaphats have prohibited our gifted brethrens Preaching Answ 1. Those prohibitions were but the fruits of your own hands gaining upon the Parliament in the time of their too high esteem of you and believe it for all that I know it may one day be laid to your account too and then I believe you will not boast of it 2. Our Jehosophats have of late rather incouraged the gifted Brethren for to teach to the people then prohibited them 3. If the Magistrate should in good earnest prohibit Whom should we obey God or Man judge you 2. These men were Princes and so men of choice Breeding rare Abilities c. As if the Lord could not furnish Taylors c. to that work but must of necessity be beholding to choice Breeding rare Abilities c. as if he could not as well furnish a Fisher-man a Publican as a Prince or a Priest 3. These had Levits to joyn with them who were men in Office but you scorn at Ministers c. No Sir we scorn not at Ministers neither own we Baals Priests whose work is to delude Souls there is never a tittle you mention that is given you but is truth Let such know say you that Christ takes indignities done to his Ambassadors as done to himself We own the Truth but we own you not to be his Ambassadors but such as usurp it to your selves hence it is that you know not your Message do not his work and you are like to have a bad reward in the end you would fain be Levits but you are but bastard ones Ambassadors but you are but ignorant ones you know not the Message Shepherds but you feed not the flock but kill them that are fed 4.
it s a greater work to gather souls out of your delusions then out of Heathenisme and downright Idolatry In conclusion you gather up all in a parallel in which I shall a little trace you too that so you may in your colours appear to the world The Parallel 1. Those dispersed had extraordinary gifts 1. Your gifted brethren have ordinary by the same Spirit 1. But your selves have neither but what you gain from Universities and men 2. Those had an immediate Call 2. The brethren immediate by the Spirit mediate by the Church and Saints 2. But you have neither for you are enemies to them both 3. These converted many souls 3. So the brethren convert many 3. But it s you who pervert and delude with Antichrists forms customs c. 4. The hand of the Lord was with them 4. So the hand of the Lord is with the brethren 4. But the hand of the Lord is against you and that makes you gnaw your tongus for pain and not repent of your deeds 5. Those preached the word of God 5. So do the brethren the Gospel of Salvation and in it the Law of righteousness and of love 5. But you preach the Law and your selves through ignorance not knowing what you affirm or say 1 Tim. 1. are enemies to the Gospel in its righteousness in its rule 6. These preached in time of persecution 6. So do the brethren and of peace too 6. You persecute and permit no time of peace for the Saints in your wils and desires 7. Those preached in unplanted Churches amongst Heathens 7. So do the brethren or at least in constituted Antichristian Churches which is the greater task to undo that which you have done 7. You are enemies to Churches planted according to Gospel rule and preach to build up Antichristian constituted Churches in Antichristian invented forms ordinances c. I suppose you may now notwithstanding your vain confidence if mercy enlighten you see the weakness and invalidity of your Answers and Parallels how far short you come of levelling the strong hold it s yet as strong as ever I now pursue you in the Rear upon your march unto the rest The sixth a Fort and so you will finde it boast not scorn not Acts 13. 14 15. Paul and Barnabas coming into the Synagogue the Rulers sent to them not as Apostles but as men having gifts that if they had any word of exhortation they should say on You answer 1. That Paul and Barnabas were men in office c. and had commission to teach the Nations c. I answer 1. That Prophets as I have already proved were not men in office but in gift and as for the Apostleship of Paul he owned it not in way of office as from men Gal. 1. and he preached before this in Chap. 13. by way of gift you dare not deny it and the separating and sending of them was not that they were ever the more impowered to any office for they had been at the work before but the Lord said Separate me Saul and Barnabas to the wark whereunto I have appointed them that is let them not abide in the Church but go forth to the work appointed for them preach to the world where was most need so that it was no new work or office but a going on in the work of the Lord in the gift of the Spirit which was not of man or by man but by Jesus Christ 2. You say They were known to be teachers in office and all to the end of this second is but probability known to be preachers in office when the Scripture mentions no such thing when they had never seen them before its likely and for ought you know had not heard of their fame but undoubtedly they did not know them to be men in office for they were unbelieving Jews and Gentiles zealous it seems of the Law and knew not what Gospel-office meant but rather in all places almost persecuted the servants of the Lord accounting them Sectaries like your selves therefore they could not know them to be officers 'T is a non sequitur that unbelievers men ignorant of the Gospel should know Gospel-officers that unbelievers should take those they never saw before for Gospel-officers and the Text it self is clear for they speak unto them to exercise their gifts not as men in office upon your own account but they sent unto them saying Ye men and brethren c. that is any of you men and brethren that have any word of exhortation to the people say on c. 3. You say This was practised in corrupt times c. that in corrupt times it was permitted for some out of order to preach c. as you say Apollonius confesseth c. you conclude that we are not to follow Jewish corrupt customs but to walk by rule c. I answer first I cannot but take notice of your ignorance in calling such an approved practise both in Law and Gospel a corrupt Jewish custome if it had been so indeed then no Prophet might have spoken unto them who prophesied by gift only and for the most of them they did no miracle to convince the people that they were extraordinarily sent If it had been a corrupt practise they should in your order have persecuted John for want of mission he did no miracle yet preached a new doctrine of Repentance and the scattered brethren should have had no admittance the custom should have prevented them as for the new Testament it was the custome as hath been proved already for gifted brethren to preach and for those that were contentious and denyed it There was no such custome in the Church of God 2. I answer that you are worse then those Jews who though in many things they erred from the truth yet in this they retained some principles of honesty willing to have the people instructed but you are the men who do what in you lyeth to shut up the Kingdom of heaven from the people c. 3. I answer you cry out against those approved practises of the Jews and continued custome in the Churches of the Gospel for corruption and confusion but you take up corrupt confused practices your selves never mentioned either in Law or Gospel and these pass for currant with you but the uncorrupted wayes of God they are corrupted wayes with you are you not of the number of those who call evill good and good evil c. how do you think to escape the wo c The seventh a Tower and it will not easily fall The example of Apollos Act. 18. 24. an eloquent man and mighty in the Scriptures taught diligently c. because he preached without a Cal therefore gifted brethren may preach without a Call this you say is a Tower a strong Tower c. But stay Sir reproach not scorn not that is no answer to the Truth You answer first That this is an example but no precept c. And is not example enough to
warrant the lawfulnes of the thing that the like may be done But Sir I cannot but take notice of your simplicity and contradictory spirit you contradict your own self For first You say there is neither precept nor president in the Scripture yet here you have produced a president and example your self gross mistake But it s just like all the rest of your preaching do and undo contradict upon every occasion To clear your business you quaere first Who it was that preached Apollos 2. What was he A Minister How is that proved 1 Cor. 3. 5. Who is Paul who Apollos but Ministers c I answer first its true he was a Minister by way of gift and so are all the gifted brethren nay all believers are Ministers for a Minister is the servant of the Lord and so are all the Saints As every one hath received the gift so let him minister and upon this account was Apollo a Minister and no other at that time neither can you prove that he was any other after you produce 1 Cor. 3. 5. which was a long time after this preaching and that Scripture doth not prove him a Minister in office as you pretend neither but a little to discover your jugling with the Truth as if you were blind or did think others to be as blind as your self you pretend to make much for your self in the first and second That he was a coadjutor with Paul c. But Sir do you believe that he was so when he first preached Nay Sir its evident the contrary for he was a stranger not only to Paul but to the rest of the brethren ver 27. 2. He was instructed but only in the baptism of John and needed an Aquila and Priscilla to teach him the way of the Lord more plainly And was he an ordained Minister think you and yet ignorant of the way of the Lord and the doctrine of Christ knowing but the baptism of John who ordained him think you Away therefore with your blind Sophistry you may as well reason that because you are a man now you were one an hundred years ago because Apollos was a Minister and might be so in office 1 Cor. 3. 5. therefore he was so before he was known of the brethren or knew the way of the Lord or the baptism of Christ only the baptism of John a likely conclusion c. 3. You ask What were the gifts of this Minister c. 1. An eloquent man 2. Mighty in the Scriptures 3. Instructed in the way of the Lord 4. Fervent in spirit 5. Taught diligently 6. The things of the Lord 7. Bold in the Synagogues All these I doubt not if you were not blind but you might in a measure see in your preaching Brethren c. 8. Rare humility he doth not disdain to be taught what he knew not of mean persons far differing from the pride of you parsons who scorn to hear or learn from your Brethren puft up with pride and self conceitedness of your own worth knowledge excellency c. 9. His teaching was operative fruitful c. he did not labour in vain c. So is your preaching Brethrens work they labour not in vain though to your grief and pain that makes you fret again c. Your second query is When he preached You answer 1. 'T was in a time when Churches were planting c. So are the Churches now planting and God gives gifts extraordinary comparitively with your selves for the gathering and building of the Saints 2. 'T was in a time when the corrupt custom was in practice among the Jews I Answer 1. You have often called it a corrupt custom when the Scripture calls it not so you have a very foul mouth to cry out so much corruption where the Scripture is silent and the custom was in it self commendable both in the Old and New Testament 2. By way of concession to give what is not granted Put case that it was a corrupt custom was Apollos corrupt in his practice for he was no Minister in office as is clear was he corrupt for his preaching out of Office in making use of his opportunity If you durst be so bold for shame I make no question but you would account him a corrupt Sectarian-fellow for his labour 3. You answer by way of concession that Apollos was not a man in Office it twill not help for this was but an instance of the liberty given by the Jews or taken when given And were they not both corrupt one for giving the other for taking You conclude Take in all c. and in like juncture of time others of like abilities may do the like Now is the like juncture of time gathering of Saints out of Babel from Antichristianism now is the like liberty now may gifted Brethren take that liberty c. Now given Parallel The Parallel 1. Apollos was a man of extraordinary Abilities 1. These most of them have ordinary from the Spirit of Christ 1. You selves have not ordinary from the Spirit but are enemies unto it 2. He is called a Minister and was a Preacher 2. These are Ministers and Preachers according to the measure of their gift 2. Your selves are neither Ministers nor Preachers in the Spirit but enemies to both 3. He was a helper to the Apostles 3. These are helpers on of the same work both in conversion and building 3. Your selves are Enemies to both strive to keep Souls in blindness for base and self-ends 4. He was Eloquent 4. So are the Brethren they have the tongue of the Learned and know how to speak a word in season 4. Your selves are loquent ignorant in this Mystery want this tongue are enemies unto it 5. He was mighty in the Scripture 5. So are the Preaching Brethren able to confound you in all your Philosophy c. 5. Your selves in Scripture ignorant to its ways and rules are enemies in Arts and Sciences mighty so spoiling Souls Col. 2. 8. 6. He taught the things of God 6. So do your Brethren according to the Scripture 6. You teach your own fancies the imaginations of your deceitful hearts 7. He taught frequently 7. So do your Brethren as opportunity is offered 7. You firely to confound them in their practice if you could 8. He taught boldly and openly in the Synagogues 8 So do the Brethren in the most publike places in the face of all men 8. You envy and publikely cry out against this their just and honest Practice 9. He was very humble and lowly 9. So are the Brethren not exalting themselves above the people willing to learn 9. Your selves are proud exalting your selves above the people scorning to learn 10. He had the approbation of the Church 10. So have the Preaching Brethren 10. Your selves want that for you are enemies and persecuters of the true Church 11. He convinced and converted many 11. So have and do the Brethren daily 11. You pervert seduce and lead blind-fold to perdition many
most of the people of the Nation c. The eighth a bulwark all your wisdom is not able to undermine it 1 Cor. 14. 1. 31. Where the Apostle exhorts them to desire spiritual gifts but rather that they might prophesy and tels them vers 31. They may all Prophesy one by one hence our brethren conclude that all that have gifts may Prophesy c. In your answer to this you pretend a great deal of confidence and assurance that your gifted brethren are deluded with the word All when the truth is that your self it is who is under the delusion The Question you say will be who are meant by this word All vers 31. ye may all Prophesy c. You answer first Negatively It cannot be meant of all the Saints for then women should preach who are forbidden I answer 1. The Scripture it self is clear women are excepted ver 34. All may c. There is no limitation no prohibition of any except women and women are not altogether forbidden neither compare this with cha 11. 5. Joel 2. 28. women may Prophesy by permission and in subjection to the man c. 2. You say Private Professors are nowhere commanded to leave their Callings and go study Arts Sciences c. Oh blindness with a witness Is not the Spirit of Christ sufficient to help men to preach prophesy unless they study Arts and Sciences the Scripture saith ye may All Prophesy Private men is a title you have learnt from Rome its true it doth not say you must all leave your Callings and study Arts and Sciences this is not commanded to any nor practised by any and truly Sir I think there are none but Asses in the things of God who study Arts and Sciences to help them to preach and prophesie your Scriptures produced 1 Cor. 7. 20. ch 12. 29. I have answered already therefore I pass it in this place 2. You answer positively by All is meant all such as are Prophets the Text is clear ver 29. Let the Prophets speak c. Thus far you say truth by All is meant the Prophets that is those who have the spirit of Prophesie you proceed and say They were extraordinary your reason is because they spake by Revelation without study ver 31. I say they were not extraordinary but ordinary such as could speak to edification exhortation and comfort ver 3. and this many of the brethren could do then and can do now it s your selves that are no Prophets for you cannot speak by revelation without study but in the strength of the Lord the preaching brethren can And here it is you are lost you measure other mens condition by your own because you cannot preach without study therefore you think none else can c. I conclude with you That the word All is to be confined to the Prophets All ye that are Prophets may preach All ye that have the Spirit and so the Gift of prophesy may preach and prophesy for prophesy was no Office but a Gift as I have already shewed So then notwithstanding all your sophistications and wrenchings All that have the Gift may prophesie the preaching brethren that have the Gift may prophesy You say It s worth the observing that the word Prophet is never given to any but Ministers men in Office I have already answered that Prophet or Prophesy is never called an Office in the Scripture but a Gift and the distinguishment of Christ between a Prophet and a righteous man Mat. 10. 41. its not the Office but the Gift every righteous man hath not a Prophets gift there are various operations still the same spirit You say That all that are Prophets and can open hard Prophesies without study interpret Scripture to edification c. Who so hath these Gifts may use them But Sir where and when do you mean 1000 years ago but not now Why this is all we plead for man you have granted our desire let the Hearers be judges let the Saints be judges let the Prophets be judges God hath given that Spirit of Prophesy to interpret Scripture speak to edification and comfort of the Saints c. You say They are Prophets because the duties of Prophets are ascribed to them No need of so much of one thing being so clear and granted of all But you must needs have them extraordinary Prophets and here you harp or else you were gone But you say You will easily prove them to be extraordinary Prophets but stay Sir not so easily done as said But you say You prove it vers 30. If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by c. They preached extemporary Revelations they were by the singular Revelation of the Spirit to give the sense of Scripture Answ 1. I wonder from whence you had this distinction of ordinary and extraordinary Prophets Doth the Scripture teach you any such thing I suppose you minde by extraordinary such as foretold things to come as in the Old Testament c. But why you call them extraordinary I know not and for ordinary such as by the same spirit can speak for the edifying of the Saints the difference is onely in the operation of the same spirit in some one way in some another in some more in some less but it s given to every one to profit withal 2. That upon your own account and in your language these Prophets were ordinary extraordinary were such as could foretel things to come as Elijah Elisha Esay c. In the New Testament Agabus Act. 11. 27. chap. 21. 10. 11. such these Prophets were not For the work of the one was to foretell of the other to build up and edifie the Church You say These Prophets are set amongst extraordinary Gifts or Officers Ephes 4. 11. I wonder how you dare thus to abuse the Scripture and truth who or where are those Gifts or as you call them Officers called extraordinary but it s your own ignorance if not baseness to delude the people under these terms you call Apostles and Prophets Evangelists extraordinary and pick out from amongst the same Pastors Teachers for ordinary What Scripture teacheth you this to call one ordinary the other extraordinary If I can shew you no Prophets c. you shall shew me no Pastors nor Teachers in the World Well you say There were three things objected 1. They could not be extraordinary because their doctrine was to be tryed c. You answer first That this trying and judging did not consist in calling them to an account c. But I say It consisted in judging the truth of what was spoken to try the spirits whether they were of God for there were and are false Prophets for this was the Church of Ephesus commended Rev. 2. 2. For trying those who said they were Apostles and were not and found them lyars 2. You say An extraordinary Prophet though in penning Scripture infallible yet in other things he might err you instance in Aaron Exod. 32.
4. Peter Act. 10. 15. about the calling of the Gentiles c. You will make the Scripture it self to be of small Authority if what you say were truth for all extraordinary Prophesies are written and if they might and did miscarry in Prophesying as you say then you derogate from the truth of Scripture for all extraordinary Prophesies are written And you say Extraordinary Prophets may err But Sir You have produced no Example of such erring in matter of Prophesy Paul and Peter and Aaron c. did not err in matter of Prophesie if they had they had been false Prophets like your self the point in hand at present is about Prophets in time of their Prophesy ye may all Prophesy c. And you say They were extraordinary and yet might err oh full of all subtilty What Are all the Prophesies in the Old Testament then if extraordinary Prophets might err in their Prophesyings Yet at last you come to say That all things are not revealed to one and that which is not revealed to one may be to another That is truth and that is the reason why all may Prophesy You say There might be something mingled with that which the Prophets received and they might adde something of their own c. therefore it was to be judged and tryed And is this truth which you lay down and yet are they extraordinary Note 1. Were there any in the Old Testament to judge of the Prophesies whether they were truth when spoken 2. Might the Prophets extraordinary as you call them in their Prophesies add of self unto it and err in it let all men judge of the truth of this Doctrine but it s like your self c. 3. Did those extraordinary Prophets prophesie according to the Rule of Scripture and look what others had said before them or by an immediate Inspiration As you confess these Prophets were to prophesie according to the rule of faith Isa 8. 20. to the Law and to the Testimony Was their prophesie subject to error had need to be judged might be something of self in it tryed if according to Scripture c. Yet extraordinary strange and unheard of confusion out of your own mouth shall you be judged c. 2. You say 'T is objected That those could not be extraordinary because it s said vers 3. They spake to edification exhortation and comfort as ordinary Prophets did You answer it easily The extraordinary Prophets as Amos Esay Ezekiel c. did preach to edification exhortation and consolation c. Answ 1. That it s more then the Scripture affirms if they did teach in this way of prophesying 2. If they did yet they took not their denomination of prophets from this kind of prophesying but those 1 Cor. 14. are called Prophets upon this account their speaking to edification c. And this was the end and work of Prophets to edifie the Church Eph. 4 12. not to foretel of things to come therefore the Apostle renders the reason of their prophesy that All may be instructed and All may be comforted vers 31. And again these Prophets were such as needed directions from the Apostle as to the manner and order in prophesying which if extraordinary they could rather have directed the Apostle as Agabus Act. 21. 10 11. 3. You say 'T was objected that the Apostle forbidding women did give liberty to men to preach you grant by way of concession The Apostle forbids women and enjoyns men to preach But what men not all Gifted but all gifted and Called I say All that are gifted are Called to exercise Gift and may prophesy 2. You draw the Argument thus The Apostle forbids women gifted or ungifted to preach therefore all men gifted or ungifted may preach c. This is the good your University doth you make you wise to do evil and pervert truth to draw scurrilous conclusions to dishonor truth and its servants All women gifted or ungifted are in this Scripture prohibited but all men that have gifts are authorized And truly I shall say thus much too that I should look upon that member to be very weak and useless that hath not some gift or other for good in the Church in the body But Sir your ridiculous conclusions will not establish you You conclude That all Orders Officers Members in the Church above Ministers may preach c. I thought you had owned none above you but that you had sate in Peters chair been supream Lords to binde and loose at your pleasure children to the holy Father at Rome but you 'l be sure to own such to be above you which are not in your account and then as good as none at all absolute Lords for all that You mention Apostles Prophets Evangelists but you think there is neither of these in being therefore you are the chief Lords over all but you are mistaken for Apostles Prophets Evangelists are no more extraordinary in the Church then Pastors Teachers c. for they are all reckoned together Ephes 11. And if you will say there are no Apostles Prophets c. I will say and make it good there are no Pastors Teachers Presbyters or others nay no Church of Christ without Apostles Prophets there may be a Church without Pastors c. but none without Apostles Prophets c. He hath set in his Church first Apostles then Prophets c. and after this Pastors and Teachers 1. Apostles men sent for the gathering of the Saints 2. Prophets next because when gathered the Prophets viz gifted brethren they exercise their gifts for the edifying of the body untill there be Pastors and Teachers and then the gifts of the Prophets are not to be quenched or slighted for they are Prophets still and out of the Prophets in process of time may be chosen men for Office Teachers by Office as well as Gift and these are elected by the Prophets viz. the Church for they are all Prophets though they have not Gifts alike So that first then in the Churches of Christ there are Apostles men sent to gather Apostles signifying as much and Prophets when gathered before the Ministry you so much cry up 2. Your selves are neither Apostles Prophets Evangelists Pastors nor Teachers according to the-Scripture account for first you gather no Churches but rather endeavor to scatter those that are gathered 2. You build up no Churches but ignorant carnal prophane creatures in a way of formality to their eternal ruine you administer no Ordinances according to the Rule of Christ but of Antichrist and your own inventions I shall conclude this with your Parallel The Parallel 1. These were Prophets 1. So are the gifted brethren 1. Your selves none nor know not what they are 2. Those no extraordinary but ordinary Prophets 2. So are the gifted brethren 2. Your selves not ordinary but Enemies to it 3. Those had a spirit of Revelation 3. So have the brethren else none of his 3. You are ignorant of it have a philosophical spirit of
delusion 4. These could expound Prophetick Scripture 4. So can the Preaching brethren to your terror and amazement 4. You wrest them and darken them for your own ends 5. These subjected their prophesy to the judgement of the rest 5. So do the preaching brethren 5. You are puft with pride none may question what you say be it never so false 6. The Spirit of those was subject to them 6. So it is in the preaching brethren 6. But you are subject to your spirit of pride none may speak but your selves yet know not what prophesy is 7. These spake by two or three the others judged 7. So do the preaching brethren 7. But you speak all your selves but permit none to judge The ninth Objection Rom. 12. 6 7 8. Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us whether prophesy let us prophesy c. Hence they gather that all that have gifts of prophesy may prophesy c. Your answer 'T is granted that they who have the gifts of prophesy may prophesy c. But who are they that have this gift they that are Prophets by Office and not those who who have abilities only c. I have answered this already That there is no Office of Prophesy but Gift only and they that have abilities may prophesy the Gift is given them for that end You say It will appear more fully in the context and scope of the Chapter having exhorted to duties of Piety in general ver 1 2. he comes ver 3. to 9. to particular duties of Ecclesiastical persons and Officers viz. that they should not be proud of their Gifts c. Sir it were well if you who so account your selves c. could learn that lesson but Sir you very much fail in your interpretation for the Apostle speaks to the whole Church throughout the whole Chap. and in these verses mentioned ver 3. he speaks to the whole Church Let no man think of himself c. He doth not say let no Ministers in office think c. but no man Let no man be proud or lifted up with his gift to think more highly then he ought of himself but to think soberly according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of Faith Mark as God hath dealt to every man you say every Minister in Office the Scripture saith every man c. ver 4 5. the Apostle relates to the whole Church We being many are one body c. What Sir do you suppose that none are the body of Christ the Church but the Priests or do you not see your ignorance that its the whole body the Apostle here speaks of 2. You say He sets down a distinct and perfect enumeration of all the standing officers in the Church c. To which I answer 1. That all your wisdom and Logick have not cannot distinguish these Officers 2. He enumerates the various gifts in the whole Church though officers are not excluded yet there is no office but depends upon gift else no Office And 1. He mentions Prophets Whether prophesie let us Prophesie c. that is let those who have that Gift make use of it for the good of the Church That this is the intention of the Scripture note first that the Apostle is speaking to the whole as you have heard Verse 5. 2. The terms under which it s express'd that is 1. Prophesie according to the proportion of faith answering ver 3. according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith Hence note that its every mans liberty nay duty to prophesie according to the proportion of Faith c. 3. See Verse 7. There if anywhere you have the Office or Ministry Let us wait on our Ministring c. The first is a Gift without Office according to the proportion of Faith the other is an office to be waited on though office depends upon Gift likewise You confess That this is not the extraordinary but ordinary Prophesying And why this ordinary more then that 1 Cor. 14. 31. But Sir it is not your understanding of the Scripture that makes you give the right Interpretation of it but because it suits best with what you drive at for that I perceive is your great work to make the Scripture speak to your own purpose be it what it will You conclude Now let us see what they can gather hence because Pastors and Teachers who were Prophets c. men in Office are commanded to Prophesie and Expound the Word therefore private persons may c. this is kneading trough Logick I answer Where did you read your Logick in Scripture that Prophets were called Pastors or Pastors and Teachers called Prophets but that you can say any thing make the Scripture to say any thing for your own ends And this is Logick learnt from your father the devil Read and apply Joh. 8. 44. The tenth Objection 1 Cor. 11. 5. Every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head covered c. Hence say they were women that did prophesy If gifted women did prophesy much more may gifted men thus Miriam Anna and Hilda prophesied 2 King 22. 14 c. This I suppose is a Scripture of your own invention in this place there are enough more to the purpose then this for I should be unwilling to do as your self turn the Scripture every way for your own ends yet Sir I shall a little trace you in this that so your pride and folly may appear You say Here is chalk for cheese we speak of ordinary gifted men and they flee to women that were called extraordinarily c. And how prove you that Sir Is there ever such a word in the Text 1 Cor. 11. 5. he saith pray or prophesy was it extraordinary praying too I wonder you left out that As for Phebe Rom. 16. 13. You say She was a Diaconess to minister to the sick and not to preach or have Peters Keyes jingling at her girdle I thought Sir you were very loth to lose the Keys having been Peters successors so long but I wonder how you got them from your father the Pope who sayth he keeps the chair still Aquila and Priscilla were helpers to Paul Rom. 16. 3. that is say you by their private instructions But who told you so that it was by their private instructions and why not publike as well as private So you say Not only men but women should teach their children servants neighbours the way of the Lord. Prov. 1. 8. 6. 20. Act. 18. 26. Tit. 2. 3. Confess the truth sometimes that out of your own mouth you may be condemned this is all we plead for that its the duty of the Saints according to the measure of their gift and proportion of faith to teach the way of the Lord to children neighbours any as opportunity is offered but I suppose you have a secret reservation or relation to that word private c. and why private Sir Is it lawfull in private