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A15512 A modest briefe discussion of some points taught by M. Doctour Kellison in his treatise of the ecclesiasticall hierarchy. By Nicholas Smyth Knott, Edward, 1582-1656. 1630 (1630) STC 25779; ESTC S102767 83,544 218

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vnlesse he did compasse those pretences he would leaue all which my Lord a man of so great learning and zeale would neuer haue vttered if he had conceiued the very receiuing of Confirmation to be of so great necessity that for it alone all Catholicks are obliged to endure increase of persecution for if the matter be so that sacrament alone were likewise a verie sufficient cause of my Lords stay in England although other pretences should not sucseede especially it being a certaine doctrine of Deu●nes that Bishops haue greater obligation to administer Confirmation then people to receue it Moreouer seeing my Lord hath stiled himselfe Ordinary of Scotland doubtlesse he would extend his charity to that kingdome if he were of M. Doct. opinion cōcerning the necessity of Confirmation in a countrey groaning vnder a heauy persecution as at this present the Catholicks of Scotland do and therfore stand in greater neede of that Sacrament Neither do I thinke M. Doctour will condemne of deadly sinne the Catholicks of Scotland for not seeking to haue a Bishop to administer that Sacrament or my Lord of Chalcedon for not going to administer it But now let vs see what M. Doctour in his 14. chapter where he handleth this point doth bring in proofe of his doctrine 14 His first argument is because without confirmation we cannot be perfect Christians seeing according to S. Thomas by confirmation we receiue our perfect growth To this I haue already answered now onely wish the reader to be mindfull that according to S. Thomas confirmation and consequently the effect thereof for example perfect growth and whatsoeuer else may be had without a Bishop and so if M. Doctour will sticke to S. Thomas his opinion must go downe 15 Then he alleadgeth S. Clement Epist 4. saying thus Omnibus ergo festinandum est sine morarenasci Deo demum consignari ab Episcopo id est septiformem gratiam Spiritus Sancti percipere quia incertus est vniuscuiusque exitus vitae Quum autem regeneratus fuerit per aquam postmodum septiformis spiritus gratia ab Episcopo confirmatus quia aliter perfectus esse Christianus nequaquam poterit c. All therefore must make haste without delay to be regenerated to God and then to be consigned by the Bishop that is to receiue the seuenfold grace of the Holy Ghost because the end of euery ones life is vncertaine But when he shal be regenerated by water and afterwards confirmed by the Bishop with the seuenfold grace of the Spirit because otherwise he cannot be a perfect Christian c. To this authority I answere 16 First M. Doctour should not haue grounded so hard a doctrine vpon an Epistle which I suppose he knoweth not to be so authenticall as to settle thereon a doctrinall point as he may see by Bellarmine in his booke de Scriptoribus Ecclesiasticis Secondly I may answere out of Estius in that very place which M. Doctour cyted out of him for the necessity of confirmation in time of persecution and it seemeth not faire dealing to bring Estius as farre as he seemeth for his purpose and not so much as take notice or confute what in the same authour in the same place and to the same purpose he finds against him Estius therefore obserueth that the Fathers when they say that without Confirmation faithfull people are not perfectly or fully Christians doe generally allude to the name of Christ which signifieth Annoynted therefore they deny that they are fully Christians who haue not receiued Episcopall Vnction namely hauing reference to the word Christians as S. Augustinel 17. ciuit cap. 4. sayth that all who are annoynted with Chrisme may rightly be called Christi Christs By this is clear● on what sense the words of Clement cyted by M. Doctour are to be vnderstood Thus farre Estius whom M. Doctour highly commends for a learned and holy man the reader may see how directly he doth not onely answere M. Doctours argument but also saith that it is cleare in what sense the words of S. Clement are to be vnderstood It seemes a hard case when M. Doctour is forced to alleadge Estius as his chiefe Authour for the necessity of Confirmation as afterwards we shall see who in the very same place destroyeth a maine gro●d brought by M. Doctour for the necessity of the same Sacrament Thirdly there occurreth an answere clearely deduced out of S. Clements owne words and I doubt not but will fully satisfye the learned reader The common practise of the antient Church was and is yet in the Easterne Church and at Rome when conuerted lewes or Turkes ar● solemnely baptized together with Baptisme to giue the Sacrament of Confirmation and so whosoeuer in those times was not confirmed wanted also Baptisme hence S. Clement might well say that he that was not baptized and confirmed was not a perfect Christian But this is farre from proouing that without confirmation as separated from Baptisme we cannot be perfectly Christians This sense is manifest if we ponder S. Clements words for hauing sayd All must make haste to be regenerated to God and then to be consigned by the Bishop he sayth not afterwards But when he shal be confirmed by the Bishop because otherwise he cannot be a perfect christian but still ioyneth it with baptisme and sayth But when he shal be regenerated by water and afterwards confirmed by the Bishop because otherwise he cannot be a perfect Christian stil as I said repeating together both those sacraments because they were wont to be administred at one time and whosoeuer had or wanted one infallibly had or wanted both of them in that manner it was all one to say one was not confirmed as to say he was not baptized Besides S. Clements discourse All must make hast to be regenerated to God and then to be consigned by the Bishop because the end of euery ones life as vncertaine makes it cleare that his speach is of Baptisme For howesoeuer necessary Confirmation be yet certainely it is not of so great hast as S. Clement vrgeth yea it is che●fly for those who are to liue haue occasion to professe there faith as S. Thomas alledgeth out of Pope Melchiades S. Tho. 3. p. q. 72. a. 8. 〈◊〉 4. therefore it had bene an vnfit reason of S. Clement to hasten men to confirmation because the end of euery ones life is vncertaine for as I said the lesse certainety we haue of life and more vicinity to death the lesse necessity we haue of Confirmation but for Baptisme his reason of the vncertainty of mans last end is very fit and vrgent therefore it is cleare S. Clements speach is refered to the sacrament of Baptisme My fourth answere is that S. Clement is not faithfully alledged by M. Doctour For S. Clement after he had said When he shal be regenerated by water and afterward Confirmed by the Bishop with the seuenfold grace of the Spirits because otherwise he