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A17192 A moste sure and strong defence of the baptisme of children, against [the] pestiferous secte of the Anabaptystes. set furthe by that famouse clerke, Henry Bullynger: & nowe translated out of Laten into Englysh by Ihon Veron Senonoys Bullinger, Heinrich, 1504-1575.; VĂ©ron, John, d. 1563. 1551 (1551) STC 4069; ESTC S109521 39,895 92

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The Anabaptystes do teche the thynges that they can not proue by the scryptures IOI That ye Anabaptistes are agayn ouerthrowē and that ye haue taught that thing whiche ye could not proue by the scriptures and yet for all that ye are so obstacle and stubburne that ye wyll in no wyse gyue place vnto the truth Who woulde haue beleued the to be so stiffe necked that I should be fayne to dryue the to it wyth the scripturs SIM What make these thinges to the baptizing agayn IOI Very muche for if the doctryne of Ihō and the doctrine of Christ be al one their baptisme alsoo is all one There is no exaumple of baptizinge again in all the scryptures Ergo ye haue no example at all of your rebaptizatyon or baptyzing gayne Also they whome mentyon is made of Actes .xix. Chapter could not haue bene baptyzed wyth the baptisme of Ihon. that is done in the water and againe be rebaptized by Paule For so they shoulde had bene twise baptized with one baptism of water and the one should had abolisshed the other which thing can not be done by no mean For theyr baptisme is all one SIM Thou sayest ryghte well yf there were onelye one baptisme There is onely one baptysme which the anabaptystes do deuyde The doctrine is more excellente then baptisme IOIA. Ye do not onely deuide the churche but also baptysme I do bring against the the wordes of Paul which saith Chryst hath sent me not to baptyse but to preache the gospel Now I do aske the whether of these two is more excellent the doctryne of the Gospell or the baptysme SIMO The doctryne is more excellente then baptisme for baptisme is annexed and ioyned to the doctryne IOIADA If Christe and Ihō do agre in the doctryne it foloweth that they did also consent and agre in the baptysme ergo theyr baptysme is all one SIMON It can not be alone for the Apostles and Christe dydde baptyse in the name of Iesus alsoo in the name of the father of the sonne and of the holye ghost Ihon dyd not so Ergo it can not be all one baptysme IOIADA Christ hym selfe dyd not baptyse but hys Apostles in hys name Ihon .iiii. Chapter Ihon .i. Chapter Marke .i. Chapter Iuke .iii. Chapter Ihon and the Apostles dyd baptise in the name of Iesus Ihō .iiij. Cha. Where as thou sayest that Ihon dyd not baptyse in the name Iesus thou doste greatlye erre For Ihon .i. Chapter Mar. i. chap also Iuke the thyrd Chapter it is most manyfest and playne by his own words that Ihon dydde baptyse in Iesus For there he doth expound his baptysme sayinge I doo baptyse wyth water but he that shall come after mee wyll baptyse you wyth the holye ghoste What other thing is thys but that I do prepare you to Christe whyche shall make you perfecte Is not thys to baptise in the name of Iesus In what I praye the dyd the apostles baptyse but in the name of Iesus Actes .ii. Chapter Actes .ii. Chap. Se nowe what thou hast wonne truely none other thing but that with thine own wordes thou haste confyrmed and proued that theyr baptisme is all one SIMON Yet he dyd not baptyse in the name of the father the sonne and the holye ghoste IOIA. Although Ihon did not know Christ to be one god with the father the holy gost Whereby it shoulde folowe that when Ihon dyd baptyse and sende or directe men vntoo Iesus that he dyd baptyse directe or sende them vntoo a bare man Whych thinge how vngodly it is who doth not see Ihon Baptist dyd knowe Christe to be the sonne of god equall with the father in all thynges he knew also that the spirite of god did inhabyte and dwell in hym whych was geuen vnto hym after no measure Ihon .i. Chapter but of whose fulnesse all men did receyue Ihon .i. Chapter For this cause he attributeth so muche vntoo Christ that he did send all men vnto him and prepared the people for hym Farthermore he dydde baptyse theym in the name of Iesus because that he knewe hym too be one god with the father and the holy ghost SIM These be thy reasons not the word of god IO. I wyl proue the these thinges by the worde of god When Ihon did baptise Christe in Iordan the heauens did open he did se the spirit of god descending and comming doun vpō him And behold a voice from heauen saying Thys is my welbeloued son In whō I am pleased Who wil say now that Ihon knew not the father the holy gost Ihon .iij. Ihon .iii. Chapter Chap. He dothe celebrate and set furth with manye goodly praises the maiestie of Christe emong al other thynges speakyng after this maner He whō god hath sent speaketh the word of god For god doth not geue hym the spiryte after a measure The father loueth the son and hath giuen al thynges into his hand These thinges doo testifye and wytnesse that Ihon dyd knowe ryght well the mistery of the trinitie and vnytye in Christe SIMON I graunt that he did know as thou saiest yet it foloweth not therby that Ihō did baptyse in the name of the father the sonne and the holy gost IO. It foloweth plainely For I do aske the whether he that baptizeth in Christ doth baptyse in man or in god SIMO In god truely IOIA. Nowe I aske whether Christ touching his own godheade be seperated from the father the holye ghost SIMO No for there is but one god onely IOIA. Now make thine argument after this maner Christe Iesus touching his diuine nature is not dyuyded from the father and the holy ghost And he that baptizeth in Iesus baptizeth not in his humain nature but in his diuine and godly nature Ergo he that baptizeth in Iesus baptizeth in the father and the holye gost Ihō as it is proued before did baptise in Iesus Christ that is to say in hym that should come after him Ergo Ihon dyd baptise in the father the holy gost for these sentences are of lyke syngnificacion and importaunce he did baptise in god he did baptise in Iesus Christ he dyd baptise in the name of the father the sonne and the holy gost For there is one god onely vnto whom we are brought and grafted by baptisme SIMO I neuer vnderstode this thyng afore for I thought that Ihō had onely begon with hys baptism but that the baptisme of Christe had thē at length begonne when he dyd sende his apostles in the last chapter of Mark and of Mathew Whiche thyng if it were true the baptisme of Ihon and the baptisme of Christ coulde not be all one IOIA. Of thys dyd come and springe the errour of of the Anabaptistes Because that they thinke that baptism was thē ordeyned instituted after that Christe did ryse from death And I do merueyle that they did falle in too thys errour sithens that with playne testymonyes
of the scryptures it is set forth and expressed that Christ had by his apostles baptized before his death and afore that they had receiued the holy ghostes Ihon .iii. Ihon .iii. and .iiii. Chapter and .iiii. Chapter After thys Iesus dyd come and his discyples into the lande of Iuery and there he did abyde with them and did baptise Ihon also dyd baptyse before Christ wherfore he was called baptyste SIMON Ergo baptysme hath hys beginnynge and institutyon of man IOIADA Truly Ihon was a man whych thing no man can denye yet notwythstanding his doctryne and baptysme were not of man but of God Math. xxi Chapter Mathewe one and twenty Chapter But it is called the baptysme of Ihon and of the apostles not because it is theyrs but because it is mynystred by theym I wyll speake more playnely Math. xi Chapter how thys sayinge The lawe and the prophetes were tyll Ihō cam Christ Mathewe .xi. Chapter saythe that the law and the prophetes were tyll Ihon came whereby Christe doth shew that the thynge that the Prophetes dyd afore prophecye to be or too come was more fullye set furthe and declared by the preachyng of Ihon. For the thynges the afore by the prophetes were prophecied to come vnder darke fygures of wordes the selfe same thinges are sette furthe by Ihon as fulfylled and presente Ihon begynneth wyth hys baptsme the gospell and newe testament and are in a maner shewed with the fygure The lawe had a misticall lambe Ihon dydde shewe the true lambe wyth hys fynger Ihon therfore doth begyn first the gospell and the newe Testamente and sheweth that the Messias is come It was necessarye then that he should abolisshe the olde sygnes and chaunge them into other that should be without bloud worthy of the new testamente Circumcyon is chaūged intoo baptisme For circumcision was chaunged into baptysme Therfore Ihon beginneth baptisme first as a signe or seale of the people of God But let vs heare his owne wytnesses and testimonyes of that thynge Math. iii. Chapter Mat. iii chap When he did se manye of the Pharyses and Saduces cōming too his baptysme that they also might receiue baptism of him he said vnto them Bryng ye furth frutes worthy of repentaūce By the whiche wordes Ihon doth plainlye declare wherfore for what purpose vse he did minister baptism although he shuld saie It shal not be sufficiēt to haue your body wasshed in the water but rather this ye must haue a respect vnto that ye be new mē that ye be sory and repente of your mysdeedes that are passed and take heede of them that are to come There is no cause why ye shuld boste your selues to be the children of Abraham onlesse ye do folow the fayth of Abraham What did Abrahā he dyd beleue in god hee was obediente vnto the worde of god hee dyd approue hym selfe or shewed hym selfe faythfull in all thinges vnto the same god For I say vnto you the god is able to rayse vnto Abraham Chyldren of these stoones that is to saye of the gentils Now also the axe is laid to the roote of the tree What is to be vnderstanded by the vnprofitable bowes wher wyth the vnprofytable braunches that bring forth no fruyte are cutte of That is to saye the bowghes that dyd growe of the naturall olyue tree I meane thee vnfaythefull Chyldren beynge cutte of and cast awaye from the Testamente of god shal be destroyed and burnt Vnderstande therfore my wordes a ryght Prepare your heartes agaynst the comming of the Messias the newe king I do baptise you wyth water and in a maner initiate you or giue you the first instruction in the religyon of Christ to the intente that ye be such the wil repente receiue Christ When he is receiued he shal baptise you with the holye ghoste that is to saye Too baptism with thē holi ghost he shal seale and make you perfect with his holy spirite he shall pardon and forgeue you your synnes he shall also endue you wyth fyer that is to saye wyth feruente charytye Study wyth all diligence to receyue hym worthely c. By these testymonies we do conclude and gather that Ihon dydde baptyse fyrste and that he dyd also baptise in Christe The apostles after that they had receyued Christ dyd vse none other baptysme but the same that they had learned of Ihon. Yea Christe hym selfe was alsoo baptyzed in the baptysme of Ihon. The baptisme of Ihon is the true baptisme els Christ was not well baptized Yf Ihons baptysme is not trewe it foloweth that Chryste was not truely baptyzed and that he oughte too be baptyzed agayne Who is soo madde too say so Ergo the baptysme of Ihō is the true baptisme whych Chryst dyd confyrme and sanctyfye in him selfe SIMON I doo agre vntoo all these thynges but what doo they make agaynste rebaptyzatyon IOIADA Thys trewlye that the men of Ephesus whome mentyon is made of Actes the nynetene Chapter Were not baptyzed again syth that the baptisme of Christ and the baptisme of Ihon be all one Yf they were not baptyzed agayne the anabaptistes haue no example at all of theyr rebaptyzation Whereby it foloweth that theyr rebaptyzatyon is not of God For they deuyde that one onelye baptysme Paule sayth One god one fayth one baptysme whyche is in the churche of god wythout the whych there is noo baptysme Syth then that the anabaptystes do forsake the church The anabaptistes haue no baptisme yea do deuide the churche and are felowes of herytykes they haue noo baptysme For they are not in the churche of Christe Ergo. theyr rebaptyzatyon is repugnaunte vntoo GOD and is nothynge elles but a newe secte agaynste the vnytye of the churche Obiection both foolyshye and chyldyshe SIMO But thou doest dissēble this that they do abhorre the baptisme of the busshop of Rome none otherwise then in tymes passed the holy fathers dyd abhorre the baptysme of heretykes or minystred by heritykes For they that had bene baptyzed by herytykes and scysmatikes were baptyzed agayne IOIA. Who dydde euer baptyse men wyth the baptysme of the Busshoppe of Roome Dyd the busshop of Roome begyn baptisme SIMON No Ihon did begyn baptisme but the busshops of Rome did adde manye thinges of theyr owne IOIADA The thynges that were added by the busshop of Roome as salte Oyle coniurynges c. are they baptisme or parte of baptysme Thoughe the byshoppes of Roome haue added many thyngs to baptisme yet it ought not to be called the baptisme of the Byshope of Rome SIMON Neyther of them for then neither Christ nor Ihon had baptyzed truely whyche dyd not adde those thinges IOIADA If these new added thinges are not baptysme nor yet parte thereof whye do ye call it then the baptysme of the busshop of Roome Or was euer anye man that dyd baptyse in the name of Clemente Bonyface Leo or Gregorye SIMO No manne IOIADA In