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A29125 A compendious answer to a book called A brief survay of the judgement of Mr. John Goodvvin, and the Church of God walking with him, touching their reasons of dissenting from many of their brethren, in these imprtant heads of doctrine; 1. Election and reprobation. 2. The death of Christ. 3. The grace of God in and about conversion. 4. The liberty or power of the will, or of the creature man. 5. The perseverance of the saints. VVherein the absurdities of all their dissenting doctrines are clearly exhibited, by a loving friend to the truth it self, Ellis Bradshaw. Bradshaw, Ellis. 1652 (1652) Wing B4139A; ESTC R212996 33,087 46

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to them that love him and keep his Commandements Conseq 2. And then it would likewise follow that it were all one and no greater disparagement to be the children of fooles and children of base men that are viler than the earth than the proper seed of such as love God and keepe his Commandements See Job 30.8 Conjeq 3. And then it would follow that the Apostle said not true when he said Else your children were uncleane but now are they holy 1 Cor. 7.14 If it be so that all children being new borne be alike uncleane or alike holy and in the same measure Conseq 4. And then it would follow that it is all one whether we possesse our vessels in holinesse and in honour or in the lust of concupiscence like such as know not God If by that meanes our seed when propagated should not be the better and the more holy and honourable in the sight of God See 1 Thes 4.4 5. Conseq 5. It would follow that there were unrighteousnesse with God in that fevere exclusion of Ammonites and Moabites and Bastards likewise from entring into the congregation of the Lord to their tenth generation Deur 23.2 3 4. Conseq 6. Then it were all one to be as Ishmael borne after the flesh as to be borne as Isaac a child of promise to wit At such a time will I come unto thee and Sarah shall have a sonne See Gal. 4.23 28. and Rom. 9.8 9. Gen 18.10 Conseq 7. Then it would follow that the fruits and operations of the Spirit are all alike good in the sight of God with the fruits and effects and operations of the flesh if we must expect to reape the same fruits or the like effects And then it is no matter of walking in the spirit that we might not fulfill the lusts of the flesh And so adultery fornication uncleannesse lasciviousnesse evill concupiscence and inordiuate affections are all one in effect with love joy peace long-suffering gentlenesse goodnesse faith meeknesse temperance as Gal. 5.16 19 20 21 22 23. and Eph. 1.2 3 4 5 6 c. to 13. Col. 3.5 6. Then it were all one to walke after the spirit or to be drawn away by our owne lusts and entised and so when lust hath conceived saith the Apostle Iames it bringeth forth sinne and sinne when it is finished bringeth forth death whereas every good gift and every perfect gift cometh from above Jam. 1.14 15 16 17. and Chap. 3.17 Whereas all other affections are but from beneath earthly sensuall or devilish vers 15. Yea then it is all one to sow to the flesh as to the spirit yea to make provision for the flesh to fulfill the lusts thereof as to sow to the spirit if we may expect the same fruits Gal. 6.6 And so all these Scriptures untrue and vaine See also Rom. 8. to 15. Conseq 8. Then it would follow that it might as properly be spoken of the Elect as of the wicked Psal 58.3 4 5. to wit The wicked are estranged from the wombe they goe astray as soone as they be borne speaking lyes Their poyson is as the poyson of aserpent they are like the deafe adder that stoppeth her eare which will not hearken to the voyce of charmers charming never so wisely Conseq 9. And so by consequence we may pray as David against not onely the wicked but all mankind to wit Breake their teeth O God c. vers 6 7 8. and prophesy as vers 9. How suddainly they shall be destroyed at which the righteous shall rejoyce as vers 10 11. Conseq 10. Then it would follow that all generations are alike and have the same spot or stampe and temper of spirit contrary to that text Deut. 32.5 to wit They have corrupted themselves their spot is not the spot of his children they are a perverse and crooked generation And contrary to those various expressions of the sorts of generations that we reade of in Scripture as Prov. 30.11 to wit There is a generation that curseth their father and that doth not blesse their mother There is a generation that are pure in their owne eyes and yet is not washed from their filthinesse v. 12. There is a generation Oh how lofty are their eyes and their eye-lids are lifted up v. 13. There is a generation whose teeth are as swords and their jaw-teeth as knives to destroy the poor from off the earth and the needy from among men v. 14. And contrary to our ordinary experience as for the most part it is for though godly parents may have some prophane children and prophane parents may have some godly children yet for the most part as the Scripture speakes it is found by experience that like father like sonne like mother like daughter For by generation their likenesse is stamped or propagated from them in the very seed of generation so that generations of vipers are a viperous brood and therefore Iohn the Baptist wondred much who had forew arned such to fly from the wrath to come And an evill and an adulterous generation are an evill and an adulterous brood and therefore was that though they sought a signe there should be no signe given unto them but the signe of the Prophet Jonas And againe some are called children of wickednesse because wickednesse was predominant and the chiefe cause of their generations And some againe are called children of the Devill sonnes of Belial and are therefore said to be of their father the Devill by Christ himselfe though of the Jewish nation and therefore Christ told them plainly they did and would doe their fathers workes or lusts John 8.44 and 1 John 3.8 He that committeth sinne is of the Devill Cain was of the wicked one and slew his brother v. 12. And on the other part some are called An holy generation a chosen generation the generation of the Just which shall be blessed the off-spring of God a righteous seed a seed left us as a remnant when others are destroyed yea a seed which the Lord hath blessed and of whom he testifieth that he formed them from the wombe and that he will helpe them and that he will poure his Spirit upon their seed and his blessing upon their off-spring and they shall spring up as among the grasse as willowes by the water-courses One shall say I am the Lords and another shall call himselfe by the name of Iacob and another shall subscribe with his hand unto the Lord and simame himselfe by the name of Israel Isa 44.3 4 5. Salomon was no sooner borne but David by the Spirit of prophecy called his name Jadidiah because the Lord loved him and whom he loves once he loves to the end He saith allso to Ieremiah Before I formed thee in the wombe I knew thee and before thou camest out of the wombe I sanctified thee c. Jerem. 1. and Iohn the Baptist was filled with the Holy Ghost in his mothers womb and sprang in her womb at the voyce of Mary for gladnesse of spirit And
ordained you c. verse 16. saith our blessed Savior to whom God hath given power over all flesh that he should give eternal life to as many as God had given him John 17.2 Some are of the world and therefore it is that they speak of the world and the world heareth them But some are of God and he that knoweth God heareth them but he that is not of God heareth them not and thereby may be known the spirit of truth and the spirit of error see 1 Jo. 4.5 6. And again He that is of God heareth Gods words saith Christ ye therfore hear them not because ye are not of God John 8.47 So that it is clear some are of God before they hear God words and do therfore hear them because they are of God and not of the world For the truth is they are so of God by generation as that God is the chief cause of their very separation or propagation from the very loines of their natural parents And this is properly their actual election which is accomplished in time according to his eternal purpose or counsel of his will to elect in Christ having in his immutable counsel determined with himself what he would effect and bring to pass in time for he worketh all things in time according to his eternal purpose or counsel of his will before there was time But without all question such who are thus separated by the hand of God through means of generation and so are properly selected out of the world as peculiarly his own these you cannot chuse but must needs acknowledge their election is sure in the sight of God so as they cannot possibly perish And again so many as God had called justified and sanctified them you must needs acknowledge shall be glorified and so cannot possibly perish else you deny these plain expressions of the Holy Ghost before cited and go about also as hath been said to put even the best and holiest men into doubts and fears whereas you should labour to edifie in the faith and not to destroy their faith So that I cannot imagine what you should possibly mean or intend in this doctrine unless you so judge as that the Decree of God or counsel of his will before the world began was not so capacious and comprehensious as to determine before hand what should certainly become of every particular person that should be begotten from the beginning to the end But only determined with himself concerning the species or certain kinds of men in the gross or general and no further at all as so you seem to express your self saying There is no Election or Decree of Election of particular persons as such but only of an intire species of men from Eternity In which assertion you plainly deny the omnisciency of God and render him to us altogether blind in respect of particulars till they be existent and so you also exclude the Election of Christ himself as hath been said and every other particular of the Elect of God out of his eternal purpose as though he had not known as well the particulars as the gross and generall of all his works from the beginning to the end Whereas the text is clear that he worketh all things according to the counsel of his own will Ephes 1.11 And it is also clear that his understanding is Infinite see Psal 147.5 So that he cannot possibly be ignorant any more of the particulars than of the intire species or sorts of people for if he were ignorant of any thing his understanding were not infinite And if he did any thing at all in time that he had not purposed in himself in the counsel of his will before-time Then he could not be said to work all things according to his own purpose or the counsel of his will For if any particular work should be effected by him which he did not purpose in the Counsel of his will that particular work could not properly be said to be effected according to the counsel of his will nor as he had purposed in himself if he did not purpose that very particular work Obj. But you it may be will object That what is decreed to be done to or concerning all such of the same kind or species is also decreed to be done to every particular of such species or kinds of poople Answ I answer true But upon what ground can you possibly exclude out of the prescience or foreknowledge of God the foresight and knowledge of every particular work that he accomplisheth in time How can you prove that he did not purpose that very particular work Can you possibly imagine that he did not foresee from the very beginning all past present and future occurrences that have been are or shall be effected to the very end How dare you limit the Holy One of Israel and so diminish his Attributes Whereas you well know His understanding is infinite Conseq Therefore he is not ignorant of any occurrences from the beginning to the end And though many things seem unpossible unto men yet with God all things are possible saith our blessed Saviour Conseq Therefore it is possible that he should foresee all and every particular effect and occurrences from the beginning to the end this you cannot deny it were absurd if you should And you know likewise that The very hairs of our heads are numbred and that a sparrow falleth not to the ground without the will of our heavenly Father Which one would think were matters of too little moment for our wise Father to reckon up or regard and take notice of But the reason is he being omnipresent and omniscient and that eternally cannot possibly be ignorant of the least occurrences that may possibly insue He being an infinite spirit and all things being naked and open before him and that from the very beginning he declareth the end from the very beginning He saith unto Job Where wast thou when I laid the foundation of the Earth declare if thou hast understanding See Job 38.4 By which it appeareth that the Lord well knew and could also declare where the very materials of Job were of which he was composed and that from the very beginning And Job acknowledgeth also I know that thou canst do every thing and that no thought can be hid from thee Chap. 24. 2. Nay he understandeth our thoughts long before we think them The Lord foresaw and discovered unto Moses what the people of Israel would do after his decease and therefore gave him a propheticall song to be a witness against them See Deut. 31.16 c. to the 22. He knew their Imagination which they went about even then before he brought them into the land But I should hope that you would not stand in such conceits and misapprehensions as to set bounds and limits to the understanding and knowledge of God which is infinite and unsearchable and his waies in some things past finding out And if you will