Selected quad for the lemma: spirit_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
spirit_n	flesh_n	fulfil_v	law_n	6,597	5	5.9828	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A65868	The he-goats horn broken, or, Innocency elevated against insolency & impudent falshood in answer to two books against the people of God called Quakers : the one intituled, A fuller discovery, which is stuffed with such a multitude of lyes, slanders, and perverting the truth, as the like hath not been extant : the authors of which are John Horn, Thomas Moore Senior, and Thomas Moore Junior : and the other book is falsely called truth's triumph by John Horn : which are answered for the information of the people, and the clearing of the servants of God, and the way of truth to the simple hearted from the lyes, delusions and fallacies that have proceeded from the spirit of Antichrist and blasphemy, in these men aforesaid, who profess themselves ministers of Christ but are proved ministers of Satan and unrighteousness / by a witness of Christ and his work against all the works of darkness, G.W.	Whitehead, George, 1636?-1723.	1660 (1660)	Wing W1933; ESTC R38606	53,172	64

Righteousness nor have any of his Righteousness in them And this is to make God account sinful men Righteous and so not to padiffere utnce between the holy and prophane which was the false Prophets practise as it is yours also who have also said that maintaining a justification by a Righteousness within is a meer Unrighteousness wherein you do no less than charg the Apostle with maintaining a meer unrighteousness for he tould them of the Righteousness of the Law being fulfilled in them who walked not after the flesh but after the spirit Rom. 8. 4. And the Saints were justified by the Spirit of God in them and had the Righteousness of faith in them so were not justified in sin but from it Acts 13 39. 1 Cor. 6. 11. Phil. 3. 9. but their state are you far from who have been pleading for sin which is your natural heritage which makes you so unwilling to part from it and you would fain be accounted righteous in Christ when you are unrighteous and deceitful being ignorant of the righteousness of God and not having it in you and so would be counted what you are not and therein are Hypocrites deceiving your selves and others And where we asked you what is the Light with which Christ Lighteth every man which cometh into the World which T. Meer said is both natural and spiritual To this you say we vary T. M's saying as you falsely say divers times we did our own Question about the Light at that meeting for you say his Answer was to our Question as thus stated what is the Light which Christ giveth And his Answer to this was that he is the author and giver of both 〈…〉 Light Reply In this have you spoken falsely on both hands for we did not then ask what is the Light which Christ giveth but whetter the Light with which Christ Lighteth every man that comheh into the World be natural or spiritual and T. M. said it is both natural and spiritual as also you have lyed in saying that we vary T. M's saying for he and you have confessed in P. 61. That the Light wherewith Christ Lighteth every man is both natural and spiritual and yet one Light that is both natural Spiritual you could not shew thus are you taken in your self contradictions and deceit And where you say that Christ is the author and giver of all that is truly called Light and good to men this is not to my Question for it was touching the Light with which Christ Lighteth every man and not touching all good that he is the author and giver of for there are many good things that Christ is the author of that are not the Light wherewith he in lighteneth every man so that you discover your weakness about the Light And where you ask where we read that the Gospel is Preached in every Creature Answ. See Col. 1. 23. in the Greek its {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} in every Creature And where you say you have answered in simplicity and p●ainnese and not with hidden things of dishonesty but by a plain manifestation of the Truth in the words of Truth have declared your minds that others when they read may understand ●our knowledge in the mysteries of Christ Herein your boasting Spirits are seen you would make men believe as if what you have written were infallible by a plain ma●ifestation of truth but presently after you say if in any thing they find you speak not according to the word let them refuseit and shew you in love by evidence of Scripture your mistake and you shall thankfully accept it you say To which I say what confusion deceit and doubting is this you are found in And what untempered stuff is this It appears by this you are not assured that your work is all in the Truth for all your boasting of your answering by a plain manifestation of Truth and of your knowledge in the mysteries of Christ and now both your lies slanders and mistakes in many things are made manifest and you may see them if you be not still wilfully hardened and many more aspersions and slanders besides those I have mentioned have you vomited out in your rage and envy against us in these your answers which will be a heavy burthen upon you when you come to be silent in darkness as the wicked shall and to reap the fruit of your doings which will be terrible to you one day And where you desire the Reader if ever he see any Reply to this of yours he would distinctly observe if we pervert not or alter your sayings by taking them in pieces and changing expressions to mar the sense c. and in observance of this caution you say you doubt not but the Reader will be satisfied even from our selves concerning our Antichristian Spirit without your adding any more by way of return to ours which though you will not bind your selves from yet you do not resolve to do though we should give you occasion by such sorry shifts and pretended Answers as hitherto we have returned you say Reply As for your suspecting us to mar the sense of your sayings by perverting them and to lie at the catch to get some matters to snarle about as you say these are your own practises and it s your own evil thoughts against us wherein you muse of us as you use your selves and that arises from the Antichristian spirit that is in you and not in us and you are the snarlers as your many lies and frequent perverting our words doth plainly shew and not we what are you afraid to fall into your own pit 2. And as for your not resolving to add any more by way of return to ours I say to what end should you add any more in return to ours for you thereby would but add more to your former wickedness and slanders and blasphemy against the spirit of the Lord which is in us which sees over your deceits and this would but ad more to your shame for your lying Books many are grown weary of them who before you vomited out your malice thus against us had a better esteem of you than now they have as also you have falsely said that we have been already proved deceivers and Antichrists which if it were so then away with your work there is no more need of it against us but your malignity and falseness herein is largly made manifest to many and you had better never have been born than have vented such wickedness perversness out of your mouths if you repent not A Brief Reply to John Horne's Book Called Truth's Triumph over Deceit c. Wherein his Deceit Insolency and vain boasting and his Triumphing in his wickedness and Lyes is plainly manifested and here reproved and the Truth Vindicated I See that the Diviners and Deceivers strive against the Truth of our God and the more their madness and folly and falshood Appears as it is evidently fulfilled

again ascended are no local places but some Conditions or Conceits in men 5. That neither the Souls nor Bodies of the Wicked shall rise again to Judgment This with several other Lies J. Horne and Thomas Moor charge us called Quakers with maintaining or asserting insome Queries I sent to them when as I only queried them to try their belief in these things without asserting them so what unreasonable men these are is easie to see who distinguish not between Questions and Assertions who proceed in their lies thus 6. That we agree with Himneus and Philetus that said the Resurrection is already past 7. That Christ came not to Redeem men from out of the natural bodily Death 8. That such Faith as that of the Elect mentioned Rom. 8. 33 34 35. is by our Doctrines to be rooted up 9. That by our Doctrine Christ is not the Author and procurer of all good to men both natural and spiritual 10. That we deny Justification by a Righteousness imputed to us 11. That to endeavour to detect and make manifest the delusions of any to preserve people from them is a being impatient under and raging against Gods Judgments which they falsely charge us called Quakers with maintaining And with maintaining 12. That these Teachers whose Hearers do sleight and neglect the Truth Preached by them and remain sloathful formal Covetous are false Prophets whenas the words were not so spoken by us but we spoke rather in particular against them and such as being false Prophets and Hypocrites who being neglecters of Christ and abusers of the Truth themselves as they have confessed they have not profited the People Again these abusers of the Truth viz. 13. J. Horne and T. Moor charge us falsely with plainly denying Judgment after the natural Death and with denying and jearing at Christ that Holy and Innocent man that was born of the Virgin Mary as having the form and body of a man 14. That we set up another thing in his stead viz. an imaginary seed within every man 15. That we plead for a Christ without any body of man distinct from others or out of them but a certain seed with an imaginary flesh and blood dying and bearing sin in every man having no other body but what is in some men dying yea in every man in its time 16. That our Christ hath been alwayes dying and rising in men from the beginning of the World and so will be to the end 17. That we make nothing of the coming again of Christ but scoffs at him that dyed 1600. years ago 18. That we account Christ's Death and Resurrection but a shaddow 19. That the seed which we speak of in men is but a conceited Spirit that is within them with a conceited flesh and blood in them too of which they say such an Idol was scarce ever in any Generation of men set up before Wherein J. Horne and these two Moors have both lyed shamefully and blasphemed for the seed which we spake of is Christ whom the Apostles Preached which the promise was to in them and this is not an Idol as they heve blasphemed nor his flesh and blood a conceited and an imagined thing but our meat and drink without the eating and drinking of which a man hath no life in him 20. Again J. H. and T. M. falsely accuse us with maintaining that our Christ in all the reality of his body with his flesh and blood is wholy within us sensibly bearing our sins though not willingly 21. That the coming of Christ to raise the dead bodies of all that sleep in Jesus c. and the Resurrection of the dead and Judgment afterdeath is by us altogether denyed 22. That whatsoever is said of the true Christ or of his Church in the Scripture we apply to a false Christ and to our selves 23. That we come in our own Name and Authority boasting of our selves and witnessing to and of our selves and obtruding things upon men not by and in the Light and evidence of the Spirit 24. That we say our sayings are better than the sayings of the holy Spirit in the Scriptures 25. That George Fox said in Bury at Goal of one Disbrough brother-in-Brother-in-law to Joseph Hagger being a Tradesman in London that he was Priest and Hireling and took Tyths which with the rest is an odious lie and slander and denyed by George Fox as also are these viz. 26. That we count our selves Lords and disdain to have any over us and revile and likely would destroy if in our power at our pleasure 27. And that our principle leads to it 28. That I wilfully played the Jesuite or Sophister to delude the ignorant with seeming like tearms 29. That Christopher Wade clearly proved a whole dozen of notorious lies against George Fox 30. And that in my Answer I give the goe-by most egregiously and in none of them reproves C. Wade Which also are filthy lies against both G. F. and me as may be seen in my Book intituled Truth defending the Quakers so that these things here mentioned against us called Quakers which John Horn and T. Moor have accused us with which are inserted in their Epistle I return back upon them as wicked lies and slanders proceeding from the envious Spirit of the wicked one in them and yet they are but a few in comparison of many more which they have uttered against us which we are clear of and more of their lies and slanders in their Book are as followeth viz. 31. That some of us say we are Christ 32. That we cast mists and cloudes in our expressions 33. That we turne Scripture sayings into fables perverting the whole Scripture to a corrupt sense 34. That by dead in Christ we mean but the spiritually dead in some some fancyed death sleeping in him the Trumpet and shout and Resurrection all Allegorical 35. 36. That we are denyers of the Resurrection Preached by the Apostles And that all men may see us to be so 37. That we count the Preaching of the Cross foolishness and turn it into a Fable or Allegory 38. That we confess not Christ come in the flesh but make him a figure of a spiritual wickedness or mysterious deceit that works in them that perish 39. 40. That we turn the words of Truth into a lie Not only neglecting but wholly trampleing the true Christ under our feet 41. That we deny the God above In these slanders also with many others against us have they shewed themselves to be frequent and common lyers all which we return back upon them as things never owned by us which if they further assay to make them good we shall know further how to make our defence that our innocency may be clear from them as we are clear in the sight of God But in these they have but done by our words as they use to do by the Scriptures of Truth perverted them and raised lies from them which is the manner of their Preaching And

say that the false Apostles were never the better for their Paeaching freely but the worse Answ. Herein have they plainly perverted that of 2 Cor. 11. 12. for there is no speech of the false Apostles Preaching freely see the malice and envy of these accusers how they envy the practise of the true Apostles and Ministers which was to Preach freely and not for filthy lucre Mat. 10. 1 Pet. 5. Which they have not yet proved the false Apostles did as they have affirmed for they ran into covetousness and were deceitful workers having the forme of godliness but denying the Power 2 Tim. 3. And in their affirming that the false Apostles Preached freely here they have set the false Apostles above themselves for neither J. H. nor Thomas Moor Senior have Preaching freely to boast of whilst they are setled in Parishes and taking Tyths and Gifts as the other Priests do whom they have called greedy dumb dogs strong to appetite c. in their Pamphlet called a Brief Discovery c. T. Moor's Principle Page 2. That sin is in the believer as a natural heritage from Adam while he is in this mortal body and to prove it he brings Rom. 7. 17 20. for I know that in me that is in my flesh dwelleth no good thing and that it was not he that did sin but sin in him and saith there 's his natural heritage To which I Answer Herein hath he wrested the Scripture for Paul did not say that sin was in him as a natural heritage from Adam while he was in the mortal body neither did he own it as his natural heritage for while it was in his flesh it was his burthen after that he was turned to the Spirit so he waited till it was done away that he could witness the Creature delivered from sin and become new in Christ Jesus who redeems out of the first Adams state and nature And where we laid down this as T. Moors Principle that their nature is restored in Christ and that their nature is a filthy nature and Christ took upon him their nature this they say is falsely expressed and perverted and yet J. H. and T. M. a little after say thus viz. That our nature kind or being as in us not in Christ is corrupt and filthy in it self yet Christ took upon him our nature not as it is filthy in us by sin in it c. and they say that we might as well have taxed the Apostle of confusion for saying men by nature do the things contained in the Law Rom. 2. 14. And yet by nature are Children of wrath Ephes. 2. 3. To which I say we may justly tax these men with confusion indeed but not the Apostle for here they cannot discern between the sinful nature and the pure nature for the nature of Christ is pure so that it s not their nature for their nature is filthy and therefore it is not in Christ and their bringing that of Rom. 2. 14. and Ephes. 2. 3. together to prove their confusion sheweth that they cannot discern between that nature by which men do the things contained in the Law and that nature by which men break the Law and are Children of wrath but make as if it were all one But be sure they are out of that nature by which some did the things contained in the Law since their nature is filthy and by it they cannot do these things contained in the Law but plead against that state and for sin to continue in them as their natural heritage while in the mortal body Again J. H. and T. M. Say that the Apostle saith not that Christ in them is the mystery but the riches of this mystery is Christ in men * the hope of glory not the possession of glory which is not to be injoyed till his glorious appearing when these mediums now in use will cease Answ. So herein would these deceivers put Christ the possession of glory a far off as a thing not to be injoyed by the Saints till after their decease till which time also we know they put Christs glorious appearing afar off But then how was Christ all and in all his believers and how were they changed from glory to glory and had the heavenly treasure in earthen vessels 2 Cor. 4. 7. and 3. 18. if they did not possess his glory when the riches of the glory of this mystery was Christ in the Saints ' the hope of glory What was not these riches the possession in them too How grosly do these men wrong the Saints and their words in counting them not possessors of the glory before their decease when as the Saints even when they were in the pure hope then rejoyce they with joy unspeakable and full of glory 1 Pet. 1. 8. and again after these men aforesaid have so wronged the Saints in counting them not possessors of the glory while here they go about to prove their corrupt Principle viz. That sin is a natural heritage in believers so long as they are here so that by these mens account the Saints had not Christ in them as their possession but sin as their possession or natural heritage while they lived which no where the Scripture saith how sadly have they herein wronged the Saints and blasphemed against the Tabernacle of God which is with his people in whom he dwels J. H. and T. M. Tell of an instrumental and outward Object or a medium of faith which they say is the holy Scriptures and then they say the last and most inmost and absolute Object is God in Christ 1 Tim. 4. 10. Rom. 4. 24. And so they say the Object of faith is one I Answer If the Scriptures be the outward Object or medium of faith and God in Christ be the most inmost and absolute Object of faith then how is the Object of faith one What is the Scriptures without and God one Or are the Scriptures God Here 's confusion indeed and where does the Scripture say it is the outward Object and medium of faith Here these men are come under that confusion they have charged us with as according to their own account for in Page 59. they charg us with counfounding the Author with the medium which they call a piece of confusion when in Page 6. they confess that Jesus Christ is both the Object of faith and living and enlivening medium by which any comes to God and believe in God Heb. 7. 25 1 Pet. 1. 21. so that in Page 8. they say true in saying that we did wisely to say that their darkness and confusion may easily be seen for so it may who after in their false inference are telling of some being guilty of the imperfection of wit-lesness because they have in them their guts that be wit-less and thus their lightness and folly appears J. H. and T. M. accuse us that the true Christ we say p. 10. we desire not the knowledge of In which they have shamefully belyed us

some of his Books that Christs body in Heaven is a body of flesh and bones without blood in it and that he ascended without material blood But against this their own assertion they say in Page 26. yet that his body is a body of flesh and bones in Heaven without blood in it they determined not So who should believe these Hypocrites who assert things that they themselves are so doubtful of and Preached their own conceptions and imaginations which they have no Scripture for and against their own words have guessed above what is written and have given forth their private conceptions not as an Oracle to be believed Oh! what darkness and folly are they in And yet after that they have confessed that what they have said of Adams body not having blood in it before the fall is but a private conception which they give not as an Oracle to be believed They go about to vindicate this private conception of theirs in these words viz. but how prove we that Adam had blood Why blood is the life T. M. may answer it is so in the fallen state follows it it was so there they say So then it follows from these mens words that it is in the fallen state that men have blood in their bodies that then it is the life but not in the innocent or spiritual state from whence they might as well say that then Christ had never blood in his body for he was never in the fallen state and that the Saints that were Spiritual had not blood for they were not thus in the fallen state What miserable blind guides are these that tive go about to maintain their foolish conceptions which they gall not forth as Oracles to be believed And to our saying that Nations are made of one blood Acts 17. 26. J. Horn and T. Moor say but neither doth that cross T. Moors apprehensions for there was no Nation nor man made of Adam before his fall he fell before he propagated they say Answ. Here again their folly and sottishness exceedingly appears for Adams falling before he propagated does notargue that he had no blood in his body before he fell for Nations to be made of for he might have propagated if he had not fallen seeing that when God had created man in his own image male female created he them then God blessed them and God said unto them be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth and subdue it c. Gen. 1. 27 28. And where we asked them whether they believe there was no blood left in Christs body when crucisied They answer how should we certainly believe what is not revealed Some judge it probable there was not because it is said after his fide was pierced forthwith came there out blood and water water is mentioned last as if blood might be all drained out till water followed it they say I answer Here again they have shewed their weakness in that they have here shewn that they do not certainly believe there was no blood in Christs body when Crucified because it s not revealed to them and where they say that forthwith came there out water and blood I say what could the blood all come out forthwith so that people may take notice that all their former asserting that Christ ascended without material blood and that his body is in Heaven without blood in it their thus blindly reasoning for it as they have here done is but all in darkness since what they speak of it is not revealed to them and therefore they say they find some good men that had the oversight of the Churches here in Queen Elizabeth and the following dayes did not disbelieve or deny such a conception for they say it is printed amongst those songs set before or after the Psalms in the complaint of a sinner Thus they The Scripture doth declare no drop of blood in thee for that thou didst not spare to shed each drop for me Page 54. Whence the Reader may see from whence J. Horn and old T. Moore and his Son have part of their Faith or their Testimony for it even from among Songs which were Invented by men what sad stuff is this but sure could they have proved their Faith and their Conceptions by the Scriptures they needed not to have gone to among old Songs to have proved it which are but Aditions of men not given forth by the Prophets or Apostles After that John Horn hath in pag. 55. Confessed himself subject to forgetfulness and over-sights and that he did in his forgetfulness write Job for Elihu because the Book doth wholly bear the Title of Job he further proceeds in his Deceit to Vindicate his words in a Letter to Eliz. Underwood which were that the good Angels are not pure in the presence of God and to prove it he brought Job 4. 18. and 15. 15. where it s said behold he putteth no trust in his Saints and his Angels he charged with folly which were none of Jobs words but Eliphaz his words who was one of the Miserable Comforters that came against Job and one of them against whom the wrath of God was kindled and spoke not the thing of God that was right as Job did Job 42. 7. but John Horn replyes that what Eliphaz said of the Angels as charged with folly is related by Eliphaz rather as a thing Revealed to him and said to him in a Vision by a Spirit I Answ. But what Spirit it was that led Eliphaz to speak so against the Saints Angels thou J. H hast not made appear but in thy Darkness and Deceit hast Joyned with that Spirit that hath accused the Brethren and the good Angels as thou hast done further then Eliphaz did for where provest thou that the good Angels are not pure in the presence of God and what Sin canst thou prove the good Angels Guilty of that makes them Impure and what are the names of those good Angels that thou hast so accused and doest thou believe that God putteth no trust in his Saints according to his words that thou hast quoted to prove thy Deceit Again Pag. 57. J. H. and T. M. Say they said about that in 1 Cor. 15. So flesh and blood cannot Inherit the Kingdom of God that in the Changed state what was blood before might be Changed into Pure Life and Spirit the thing and Substance remaining though they say not in the same Form of Blood which yet they Conclude not they say Answ. Here again they have shewed their folly and Imaginations for which they have been reproved in Laying down that which they have no Scripture for but their own blind Supsition which now they Conclude not and so are but uncertain of their blindly saying That in the Changed state what was blood before might be changed into pure Life and Spirit and yet the thing and Substance remaining So how can others believe these men when they seem hardly to believe their own

the Believers and not the Anointed which is also false for Jesus Christ is the Anointed of God who is in the Saints and the Anointed and Anointing is not devided J. H. and T. M. p. 94. That Christ in the Body of his Flesh may be truly and properly said to be Ascended or gone up far above all Heavens not onely in respect of Glory and Dignity but even in respect of place or Local height also Rep. But what place or Local height it is that Christ is Ascended into far above all Heavens Eph. 4. 10. you have not discovered but say it was Heaven it self or the Heaven of Heavens as if you had said Heaven itself the Heaven of Heavens is far above all Heavens and then it must be far above itself when the Apostle saith he that Descended is the same also that Ascended up far above all Heavens that he might fill all things Eph. 4. 9. 10. and it is the same that first Descended that Ascended far above all Heavens this is spoken without exception of place or Lo●● height as you except and the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain that glory that he is in who is ascended who is both in the Heavens and far above them all Our 10th Question is where or how came Christ into the House where his Disciples were met after his Resurrection the doors being shut John 20. 19 26. have not some of you said that then his body being spirituallized it glyded in at the key hole of the door you answer That none of you have said as related Reply But in this you have not all cleared your selves from speaking these or the like words for one that informed me how Thomas Moor the elder spoke of Christs body glyding in at the key hole of the door hath been one of his own hearers whom I know durst not bely him but would be willing to witness it openly to his face if called to it and Barthel Wormel Alderman who owns you did not go about to clear T. Moor from what was said of him as mentioned when he took upon him to answer that question and it appears that T. M. and you have had such like whimseyes in your minds by what follows where you say these words viz. Further also you are assured that even the Children of the first Resurrection when they shall attain to that Resurrection of the dead and have their bodies that now are vile fashioned into the likeness of his glorious body they in those very bodies being spiritual immortal powerful incorruptible shall be equal to the Angels who cannot be hindred from passage by any corruptible things as doors walls or the like but can make their own passage thorow any such obstacles more easily than mortal bodies through the Ayr and why should it be thought a thing incredible c. Reply Here people may see these mens imaginations and dreams and how against what they have professed they would appear wise above what is written for we never read in all the Scriptures that the Children of the first Resurrection in these very bodies of flesh and bones shall be so equal to the Angels in the Resurrection as that they may make their own passage thowrow any such obstacles as doors walls and the like more easily than mortal bodies through the Ayr as you may see plainly these men imagin wherein they shew themselves intruders into things they have not seen being vainly puft up in their fleshly minds and more like such as are peeping and muttering and running into sorcery and magick then men in the simplicity of the Gospel for it is not at all natural nor proper to a body of flesh and bones it being of such a substance to make its own passage thorow doors and walls more easily than now it can thorow the Ayr thus have they shewed their dreaming in the night of thick darkness that is over them And in P. 129. J. H. and T. M. are speaking about the second coming of Christ and say that his second coming his glorious appearing never yet hath been to any nor now is c. Reply herein they might as well say that then never yet were any come to Salvation by Christ for his second coming is without sin unto Salvation and for the same end he will appear to them that yet look for him even to save them from their sins for his coming in the flesh wherein he was once offered to bear the sins of many Heb. 9. 28. This was one coming of Christ and after this the Saints who looked for him received his coming in Spirit to work their Redemption and to make them witnesses of his Kingdome Glory and Reign and to Reign with him over darkness and unrighteousness but these things have these deceivers put afar off and discern not Christs Kingdome Reign and where they say that Christ shall then stay all the wicked even every one that doth not presently submit to serve him and his People and that then all the Saints that come with him shall have immortal bodies being as equal to the Angels and that they shall Reign with Christ on Earth and Judge the World until the final and eternal Judgment seize upon all the ungodly at the last and general Resurrection Reply Herein they have spoken but faintly and in darkness for what service it is they imagin the People of God shall then have from the wicked when they shall be in these raised immortal bodies they have not told us nor what need the Saints in these immortal bodies can have of the other part of the Creation or of the wicked to serve them especially if their bodies be such as can make their passage so immediately thowrow any such obstacles as doors and walls as these men have said and yet these bodies must be bodies of flesh and bones according to their words But these vain conceptions do arise from the same Spirit in them that leads them into pride self-exaltation and to look for master-ship in the Earth like those that look to gain an Earthly Kingdome or to Reign with Christ in some outward pomp and glory and so to bring all under them and then they would be Lords indeed but their expectations after that will fail them as for their bringing Revel. 20. 4 6. It proves not what they would have it nor the other Scriptures they have blindly quoted that Christ shall personally Reign a thousand years * for in Revel. 20. 5. it ' spoken of the first Resurrection which he is blessed that hath a part in for then he hath a part in Christ who is the Resurrection the life whose Kingdom is an everlasting Kingdome which hath already appeared unto his People and is set up among them that they are come to Reign with him over the World and it's deceivers and these men as appears imagin that after Christ hath at his coming raised the dead bodies of the Saints and reigned

answered again Herein hast thou shamefully Lyed again for thou hast gone about thorow much of thy Book to plead thy own Cause and hast not taken good Hezekiah's Counsel as thou hast pretended but hast answered again though to thy own confusion And in Pag. 7. Where thou sayest The Quakers would be thought to be better than the Prophets and Apostles This is thy Lye and slander J. H. And in Pag 8. To my saying the true Prophet sayes all his Judgements were before me and as for his Statutes I did not depart from them I was also upright before him and have kept my self from my iniquity 2 Sam. 22. 24 but thou sayest that David acknowledges he had then Iniquity for how was Iniquity his if there was none in him In which thou hast perverted Davids words for David saith he kept himself from his Iniquity and did not depart from the Statutes of the Lord so that then he was not a Sinner and our transgressions and our Sins the Saints spoke of when they were washed from them and their transgressions done far from them Psal. 103. 12. Rev. 1. 5. In P. 9. J. H. Saith It is true too that God promises that his People shall be all Righteous and clean from all their filthiness c. and that God is performing his promises to them that they may all be perfectly Righteous even in themselves in the New Heaven and Earth and New Jerusalem where shall be no unclean thing he saith To which Reply In this hath John Horn overthrown his former Doctrine for if the People of God shall be cleansed from all their filthiness as in Ezek. 36. 25. and be all perfectly Righteous in the New Jerusalem then they are not to be Sinners nor have sin in them so long as they live as J. H. hath affirmed for the Saints before their decease were come unto New Jerusalem and to be Citizens there and to a Kingdom that could not be shaken into which no unclean thing could come and to see the removing of the old Earth and Heaven which were shaken Ephes. 2. 19. Col. 1. 13. Heb. 12. which yet J. H. and all such as he who are contending for the Devils work are Ignorant of And as for those that John saw Rev. 14. who were without fault before the Throne of God I. H. saith all that heartily believe in Christ and are not moved away from the hope of the Gospel it is Christs Office to present them holy unblameable and without Reproof in Gods sight Col. 1. 22 23. not because they are sinless in themselves he saith Mark his confusion and deceit here according to J. H. his words here the Saints who are without fault before the Throne of God and holy blameless and without Reproof in Gods sight are Sinners notwithstanding as if sin were no fault and not to be Reproved or blamed in Gods sight Oh! what darkness and deceit art thou in I. H. what art thou wholly past feeling doest thou not know in thy own particular that every Sin thou hast is Reproveable and art thou not Reproved in thy own Conscience by the Light for it surely thou art exceedingly hardened and hast denyed Christs Office in thy contending for sin to continue even in them whom Christ presents Holy unblameable and without reproof in Gods sight who live not to themselves but unto the Lord And in P. 10. I. H. Saith He that in such a sence as in 1 Joh. 1. 9. confesseth his Sins is Righteous as Christ is Righteous for Christ is his Righteousness and yet he that confesseth his sin is not without sin in himself In which he hath uttered Blasphemy against Christ for Christ hath no Sin in himself to confess as they have who are but confessing their Sins which they have who are not freed from Sin for they who are Righteous as Christ is Righteous do witness Sin condemned in the flesh and destroyed and walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit being purified from all the filthiness of flesh and Spirit And to my saying that Paul witnessed the groaning and travelling in pain before the Birth was born in him or before he was Born of God which I. H. hath deceitfully perverted and wronged my words about and that Paul spake to Conditions below his own to the Romans which I. H. saith cannot be true and the other too for if Paul was but then groaning to be born and not born of God he spake of his own state and if he spake to others states below his own then is it not true that he had while an Apostle a time in which he was not born of God To which I say in this hath he shewed his blindness and falsehood for he hath not a ground for these cavals against me in that I never affirmed that Paul was but groaning to be born of God when he wrote to the Romans nor that he was not born of God when an Apostle but I know he witnessed the groaning and travelling in pain before the free born state was witnessed in him as also after he was come into that state himself he suffered with the body where it suffered and travailed for its redemption where it was not redeemed which body was not one member but many and for the suffering seeds-sake in those members Paul condescended to states below his own even when he wrote to the Romans all which he himself could not then be in when he so wrote yet a sufferer and a traveller under all those burthens which the body under went about whose condescending I have more fully writ in that Book called the Quakers no Deceivers Page 14. 15 16 17. the truth's whereof J. H. cannot get over for all his cavails And where thou sayest J. H. in P. 9. that the temptations God tries his People with are to try and purifie their faith from the mixtures therein In this thou art ignorant of the faith of Gods elect and the mystery of it for it is pure and stands in the power of God where there is no mixture of sin it being of another nature than sin for it worketh sin out J. H. in P. 16. Speaking of the birth which is born of God he saith he denies not but in that birth there might be degrees and grouth after nor will the perfection of it be as to the body till the resurrection thereof from the Dead To which I say that birth thou never knew nor its perfection For how could the body be a Temple for the Lord if the perfection of the birth be not as to it For the Saints were born of water and the Spirit which cleansed them from all filthiness of flesh and Spirit so that they became members of his body of his flesh and of his bone J. H. saith The Prophet Isaiah doth not witness that in them a Child was born and a Son in them was given Answ. Christ was the first born in many Brethren {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman}

{non-Roman} Rom. 8. 29. and was not Isaiah one of these Bretheren Who also had been as with Child Isaiah 26. 17. Jer. 30. 6. And where in P. 19. thou chargest R. H. and me with counting Christ's coming in the flesh to be but a figure in this thou hast belyed us for it was never so affirmed by us J. H. saith Some did believe in the Light before they believed that Jesus is the Christ as Nathaniel and Cornelius and divers others Answ. Where proves he that by Scripture For Christ is that Light which Cornelius and others believed in who is not devided His words here implyes as if they that believe in the Light believed in they knew not what If they believed not Jesus to be the Christ when they so believed And my saying a man must believe that Jesus is the Christ and believe in him too before he be born of God as Christ said believe in the Light that ye may be the Children of the Light of this J. H. sayes what is this but to fight against the Apostle John 1 John 5. 1. and sayes I stick not to make John a lyer P. 21. In which he hath shamefully lyed for I own what John said and I spoke according to Christ's Testimony who put believing in the Light before being Children of it for they received Christ and believed in his name that they might become the Sons of God John 1. 22. and 12. 36 So that J. H. in not owning and believing in Christ before being born of God implyes that while the birth which is of God is but in bringing forth in man before it be born man is but in the unbelief while that work of God is but in effecting and not effected which shews J. H. his ignorance of the new birth which is not conceived without faith in the Light before it is brought forth J. H. saith P. 24. That the Creatures deliverance into the liberty of the Sons of God and the Redemption of the Sainte body which they groaned and waited for Rom. 8. 19. 20 21 22 23. could not be before those Saints deceased for saith he the Apostle vers. 17 18 speaks about their sufferings with Christ and reigning with Christ and speaks of the sufferings with him as first and the reign as a thing afterward the sufferings are of this present time or life but the glory is to be after revealed and therefore spoken of as in the future to this present time Answ. Here you may see the liberty of the Sons of God and the redemption of the body which the Saints in their life time groaned and waited for and the reigning with Christ and the revealing of his glory in the Saints all these hath J. Horne put afar off as things not attained by any in this life in all which he hath shewed himself voyd of understanding and hath denyed the Sons of God their liberty and priviledges and so hath denyed the end and effect of the Saints travail and sufferings and the work of the Spirit of adoption which was sent into their hearts and of the Son of God who was made of a woman made under the Law to redeem them that were under the Law that we might receive the adoption of Sons Gal. 4. 4 5 6. and that adoption reacheth to the body of the believers and was its redemption which for a time it groaned and waited for Rom 8. and the Saints were brought to reign with Christ upon the Earth and made pertakers of his glory being made more than conquerers in Christ thorow their sufferings and even then the Spirit of glory and of God did rest upon them Rom 8. 37. 1 Pet. 4. 14. And what gross darkness is it for him to say the Creatures deliverance into the glorious liberty of the Sons of God could not be before the Saints deceased as if it were not possible to be so And whereas from J. Horn's not owning that the Saints may attain to the redemption of the body before the bodies be raised out of the grave according to his wores I said from this then Paul is not yet come to the redemption of his body which so many hundred years since he groaned and waited for seeing that the Resurrection of the bodies is not yet come Oh! how J. Horne is vexed at me ' for thus discovering his blindness as in P. 25 he shews his venome in calling us wicked and corrupt and poor shifting for he saith the Fathers that dyed in the faith received not as then the promises and that Abraham hath not yet received all the promises for which he hoped which is another case than Pauls groaning and waiting for the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption for the Scripture does not say that Abraham groaned and travelled for that which he hath not yet received for it s said that these all dyed in the faith not having received the promises but having seen them afar oft and were perswaded of them and imbraced them Heb. 11. 12 13. but hath not Abraham now received the promises which was to him viz. seen the increase of his seed and received the Heavenly City and Country which he and the Martyrs spoken of in Heb. 11. dyed in the hope of Since th●●Abraham yet liveth and is in the everlasting Kingdome but 〈◊〉 is besides J. H. his matter about Pauls not yet being come to the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption which so many hundred years since he groaned and waited for which bondage of Corruption J. H. and T. M. have accounted to be the Corruption of mortality in which the body corrupteth in Death and in the Grave as also they have called it rottenness in their other Book P. 48. from which it follows that Paul groaned and waited for his body to be redeemed from the corruption and rottenness in the Grave before ever the body was either Dead or laid in the Grave or corrupted there And thus their sottishness appears so that this we may lay down as their principle that the redemption of the body from the bondage of corruption which so many hundred years since Paul groaned and waited for when he lived he hath not yet attained to it Alas then they would make poor Paul have a long travail and suffering as also according to what they say in their other Book Page 47. 48. viz. That it was the Apostles part to groan after the redemption till Christ's descending from Heaven which they say is not till after the decease And whereas I said that Asa's heart was perfect with the Lord while he did that which was right in the sight of the Lord which might be all his dayes till that was written in 2 Cron. 15. 17 18 19. but not when his heart was departed from the Lord and he turned into the Rage Oppression and Persecution nor when he was in the natural state which is clear ●●cording to 2 Chron. 16. 7 8 9 10 11 12. J.