Selected quad for the lemma: spirit_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
spirit_n	father_n	son_n	speak_v	11,770	5	5.4768	4	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A74992	An ansvver to Mr. J.G. his XL. queries, touching the lawfulness, or unlawfulness of holding church-communion, between such who have been baptized after their beleeving, and others who have not otherwise been baptized, then in their infancie. As likewise touching infant, and after baptism. In which answer, the undueness of such mixt communion is declared, the unlawfulness of infant-baptism, and the necessity of after baptism is asserted. By W.A.	Allen, William, d. 1686.	1653 (1653)	Wing A1054A; Thomason E713_17; ESTC R207237	74,298	97

audaciousnes in any man once to imagine If so then what is more plain then that the Commission of Christ to them was to teach and baptise first and to admit into Church fellowship thereupon and not otherwise as is visible in that prime example of theirs Acts 2.41.42 Then they that gladly received his Word were Baptized and the same day there was added unto them about three thousand souls And they continued stedfastly in the Apostles Doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in Prayers Where you see they were first taught by Preaching secondly did gladly receive the Word by which they were taught thirdly were baptized fourthly were added unto them viz. the Church ver 47. fifthly continued stedfastly in the Apstles Doctrine and fellowship c. Addition to the Church then and fellowship in it did follow baptism and not go before it according to the actuated commission of Christ Jesus And why should any servants of his then desire to vary from it unless they presume themselves wiser then he and hope to finde a greater good in their own way then in his 3. Baptism must needs precede the enjoyment of Church priviledge in Church fellowship in the Apostles dayes because it was then as it ought still to be a means of planting men into Christ or into the body of Christ the Church Hence they were said to be Baptized into Christ Galathians 3. vers 27. and to be baptized into his death Romans 6. v. 3. and to be planted together into the likeness of his death upon that accompt ver 5. of the same chapter And what does a planting and a planting together import but the first puting together of Christians in order to their growing together in Christ and yet all this is done by Baptism And may you not therefore as well suppose trees to grow together before they are planted together as to suppose Christians to grow together before they are planted together and yet planted together they are by Baptism not into this or that particular Church but into that one Church of Christ which is distributed into severall parts and particular Societies Hereupon it is that Baptism is called one of the Principles or begining Doctrines of Christ and likewise part of the Foundation Heb. 6.1 2. And what house stands without its Principles or is built without a foundation Nay the Apostle 1 Cor. 12 13. doth plainly declare Baptism to be of so constant and universall a use as to the inchurching of persons of all sorts ranks and degrees that were incorporated at all in his time as that none came into the Church but through this door For he sayes they were all Baptized into one body i. e. Church body whether Jew● or Gentils bond or free And if any man can name any persons that were neither Jews nor Gentiles neither Bond nor Free then I will confess those possibly might be brought into the Church without Baptism But otherwise though they were Jews and had been formerly entred in their Church by circumcision yet when they became of the Gospel Church it was not without Baptism Or if Gentles a people sometimes a far off yet by Baptism upon their beleeving were brought into capacity of the same enjoyments with the Jews If free as Masters yet not admited without Baptism if bound as servants yet made equally capable of the same Church priviledges by Baptism For so he sayes again Gal. 3.27 28. As many of you as have been Baptized into Christ have put on Christ there is neither Jew nor Gentle bond nor free male nor female for ye are all one in Christ Jesus i. e. all having thus put on Christ are become all one in him Some indeed seem somewhat to doubt whether the Apostle speaks of water Baptism when he sayes That by one Spirit we are all Baptised into one body or whether he does not rather speak of the Baptism of the Spirit without water Though these indeed are the doubtfull thoughs of some contrary to the generally received opinion of men upon the place yet I must do my honored Querist that right as to quit him from fellowship in that opinion and to acknowledge that he not long since in a discourse upon the same words did teach the Auditory to understand by being Baptized by one Spirit into one Body and by being made to drink into one Spirit as is exprest in the latter part of the verse that the Communion which Beleevers have with the holy Spirit in the two Ordinances Baptism and the Supper of the Lord is intended by the Apostle and this he did without doubt to me according to the truth For what else can be intended by drinking into one Spirit but the Saints communion in Spirit in and by the Supper drinking by a Synecdoche being put both for eating and drinking If so why should we not as wel understand the fi●st Ordinance Baptism in its proper sence for water Baptism in the former part as the latter Ordinance the Supper in its proper sence in the latter part of the verse Neither can we reasonably unde●stand the same thing to be intended by being Baptised by one Spirit and by drinking into one Spirit which yet we must do if a being indued with the Spirit were all that is here meant for they are said to be Baptized into one body but to drink into one Spirit and surely Baptizing and drinking here are no more the same then the Body and the Spirit are the same into which they are said respectively to be Baptized and to drink But cleerly the Apostle seems hereby to intend to minde these Corinthians how that by means of the same spirit working upon all their hearts they became members of the same body through Baptism and that being of the Body they came to have communion in Spirit or with the Spirit in the supper And that which will yet further serve to evince that it is not a Baptism with the spirit but a Baptism with water that is here meant is this because the spirit is here set forth by the Apostle as the Agent or working cause and Baptism as the effect and it is ridiculous to make both cause and effect the same thing It is true indeed the scripture doth speak of a being Baptized with the spirit but when ever it does so it still declares either Jesus Christ or God the Father as the Agent Baptizing with the spirit but never as making the spirit both the subject matter wherewith and also the Agent whereby men are Baptized in the same Baptism See for this Mat. 3.11 Mark 1.8 Luke 3.16 Act. 1.4 5. with Luke 24.49 Acts 11.16 The premises therefore considered I hope it will sufficiently appear and that to the satisfaction of any indifferent man that in the primitive times none were admited to Church-communion without Baptism and if so have we in these dayes reason to do any other wise Ought not that which was a reason to them not to admit

other Scripture they are or if the Querist will grant that children are hereby excluded Communion in the Supper then we desire him if he can to shew reason why such a requiring of faith in persons to bee baptised does not as well exclude children from Baptisme as from the Supper there being no other Scriptures that doe any more warrant the baptising of children then the admission of them to the Supper of the Lord. XXIX Querie answered That dipping is of the essence and necessity of Baptisme I conceive there is good reason to believe But that they are selfe-Baptisers who by going into the water dispose their bodies for a buriall under the water by the hands of the Baptiser I do no more believe then I believe they are selfe-Murderers or selfe-Slayers who lay their bodyes downe and their necks upon the block when they are to be executed Nor have I seene or knowne any to convey all but the head under water in order to their being baptised or dipped nor do I judge it convenient so to doe unlesse a shallower water cannot conveniently be come at though I believe withall that so the body of him who is baptised be buried under water by him that does baptise it does not at all varie the case as to the thing of Baptism whether a man goe lesse or more into the water the Scripture placing the thing not in a mans going to the knees or neck in water but in his being baptised or buried in water XXX Querie answered I demand of the Querist whether God in the institution of Circumcision Gen. 17. did any more prescribe or determine all circumstances essentiall to Circumcision then God then Christ have determined all circumstances requisite to Baptisme in the Commission given by them to baptise John 1.33 Mat. 28 19. Did God command Circumcision So God so Christ have commanded Baptisme Did God appoint what persons should be circumcised viz. every male child among the Jewes so hath Christ who shall be baptised viz. such of the nations as shall be taught or made Disciples Did God appoint the eighth day for Circumcision Christ hath appointed the time of Baptisme viz. though not such or such a day yet that it should follow mens being discipled or taught without any long intermission as the very words of the Commission doe import and Scripture examples conforme to this Commission doe shew Did God direct what part of the body should be circumcised viz. the flesh of the fore-skin So Christ hee hath appointed the subject matter to be Baptized under this word or expression THEM Baptizing them i. e. Such persons of the Nations as shall be taught not this or that part of them but THEM even them themselves by which personall expression when applied to washing or dipping in Scripture is wont to be signified not the washing of this or that part as Hands Face Feet or the like which are wont to be particularly mentioned when no more is intended but a totall washing or dipping as very many learned Men though friends to Infant-Baptism doe also render the word Baptize to signifie Did God declare for what end circumcision should serve viz. For a token between him and his people So Christ in Commissionating his Disciples to Baptize in or as it is rendred from the Greeke into the Name of the Father the Sonne and the Holy Ghost declared that Baptisme should be a solemne putting or planting of Men into the Father Son and Spirit or into a professed expectation of Salvation from and of the service of and subjection to the Father Son and Spirit Nay I may say the Commission for Baptiz●ng is more particular and expresse then that for circumcising for here it is directed by Christ by whom or by what hands Baptisme shall be administred viz. D●sciples but it is not prescribed by what hands the Males should be Circumcised nor yet with what instrument as viz. whether with a Knife or sharp Stone or the like And therefore there being in the Commission of Christ to Baptize as much yea in some respects more particularity of subject and manner of Administration as was in Gods Command to Circumcise and the same might be said if compared with the Passover or Supper of the Lord the Querist doubtlesse had no reason rashly to charge those with making themselves wise above that which is written or with obtruding upon the consciences of men an institution of their own in the name of the Ordinance and Institution of God Who undertake to determine particularity of subjects or manner of Administration in Baptisme which yet he does But I would demand of the Querist whether he doth not determine particularity of subject and manner of Administration in Baptisme when he Sprinkles such and such Infants in that form and manner which hee uses therein and whether hee doe this of his own head or by vertue of any Institution or command of Chirst If he will say he does it by verture of an Institution or Command from Christ then at least in his opinion there must be a commission from Christ found in Scripture which prescribeth such circumstances as hee Judges essentiall to that administration as well as there is for the essentialls of Circumcision Passover and Supper of the Lord if so why does hee suppose there is no such thing to be found in Scripture Or if hee will say there is no such Commission in Scripture as does determine particularity of subject and manner of Administration in Baptism as hee must hold or else hee is to blame for changing those who ever they be with making themselves wise above that which is written c. That doe prescribe and determine particularity of subject and manner of Administration in Baptisme But as I say if hee will say there is no such Institution or Commission which is equivalently the same then does not hee make himselfe wise above that which is written and obtrude upon the consciences of these that joyne with him an institution of his own in the Name of an Ordinance and Institution of God when hee undertakes to determine Infants particularly to be the subject of Baptisme and Sprinkling in the Name of Father Sonne and Holy Ghost to be the manner of Administration and accordingly practise the same XXXI Querie Answered 1. Though it should be granted That many if not the generality of those that have entred into the way of new Baptisme as the Querist miscalls it it being indeed the old way of Baptizing Have received their precious Faith and other Graces under the d●spensation of their Infant-Baptisme yet this would be no more a reason obliging their continuance in their old wonted forme supposing there is yet a more excellent way then it was or would have beene to those who were wrought upon in a saving way under the Popish and after that the prelaticall forme to have continued still their abode in their Tents 2. It is like no good use would be made of it by

suppose that those 3000. stood neerest unto him that spake and with best advantage to hear there being many thousands more present which can hardly be the supposition of any considering man in the case in hand Respon Not to take much notice how far the probable opinion of some will be accepted for proof against us when nothing but demonstrations will be accepted on our behalf I shall first demand of the Querist that if the children and families of those that gladly received the word and were baptized were indeed part of that number of 3000. that were added to the church or to the Discsples as he sayes it is the probable opinion of some that they were then I demand I say whether these children and families were baptized or no If he shall say they were not then he puts to rebuke another of his opinions which is that when believers themselves were baptized their children were baptized also to the belief of which he would perswade us at least as probable in his 24. Quaere from Acts 16.15.33 1 Cor. 1.16 If he say they were baptized why then though it should be granted that these were some of the number yet how would this prove that others besides those that were baptized were added to the church which yet is the thing he was to prove But then 2. to put the matter quite out of doubt that none of the children of those that gladly received the word were part of the 3000. that were added to the church if by children he mean little children or infants for els if they were adult ones they might gladly receive the word and be baptized as well as their parents it sufficiently appeares in that it is said They i. e. they that were added as well as they to whom they were added continued stedfastly in the Apostles Doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers and I presume the Querist will not say that little children infants did continue stedfastly in the Apostles doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and prayers and if not then they were none of the number of the 3000. that were added to the church and so I think by this time the probable opinion of some in this behalf is rendred more then probably to be a weak groundlesse and erroneous opinion 3. To remove that doubt touching the improbability that 3000. men should distinctly hear the voice of a man speaking unlesse we will suppose them to stand neerest to him that spake 1. Evident it is that they did hear and so hear as to receive the word gladly but whether they were neerest to him that spake or no is more then he or I can tell or need to know But 2. There is no necessity to suppose that all the whole 3000. did all of them heare and convert in the self-same hour or juncture of time for one while the Apostle might preach to one company of them and another while to another company and yet this would not hinder but that they might all be converted baptized and added to the church the self-same day 3. Neither do I see any necessity to hold that all these 3000. that were in one day converted baptized and added to the church were thus converted and baptized by Peter only but by him and the rest of the Apostles or by them and the other Disciples also For 1. it is said that Peter standing up with the eleven lift up his voece and said unto them c. and doth not this imploy that the eleven did take part with him and assist him in the work 2. These men of Israel being pricked at their hearts they do not cry out to Peter only but the text saith They said to Peter and the rest of the Apostles men and brethren what shall we do ver 37. and therefore it should seem the rest of the Apostles as well as Peter had ministered occasion to them of this demand Nay 3. which is yet more it s said ver 4. that they all to wit the whole number of Disciples that were present together being filled with the Holy Ghost began to speak with tongues as the spirit gave them utterance which certainly was to the understanding of the multitude and also about such things as did much affect them for it s said the multitude were confounded at it and marvelled saying we do hear them speak in our own tongues the wonderfull works of God ver 6.7.8.11 All which things considered I think it will not be irrationall to suppose that others besides Peter might be instrumentall in the conversion of those 3000. Querist Nor 2. is it said or so much as intimated or hinted in the least that any of the whole number of the 3000. who were added unto them were added by means or upon the account of their being baptized although this addition be not mention'd till after their baptizing It is ten degrees mere probable that their believing or Discipleship which were precedent to their baptizing and not their being baptized were the reason and ground of Lukes saying they were added to the Church considering first that the originall main and principal foundation of the holy brother hood amongst the Saints is not the ceremony of their baptism but their fellowship and communion in the divine nature and inward relation to the same Christ by one and the same precious faith Respon We do not affirm that they were added to that particular church by baptism immediately without any other act intervening but we say they were not added without baptisme and so much is in effect acknowledged by the Querist himself in that he sayes this addition is not mentioned till after their being baptized and therefore their baptism must needs go before their addition to the church unlesse we will suppose Luke to have begun at the wrong end of this part of his Narrative in mentioning that first which was last done and that last which was first done and if so then according to the order of things done they were first added to the church and then afterward did gladly receive the word to conversion and were baptized which I suppose no man is so void of common sense as to believe And if their baptisme did precede their addition to the church then why does the Querist strive so as he does to interesse their believing or Discipleship with exclusion of their baptism as the reason and ground of Lukes saying they were added to the church For if he does not exclude baptisme in recounting the reason of that addition then we are agreed for there is no question but that their gladly receiving the Word or believing the Word or becoming Disciples by the Word was one reason or grou●d of their addition to the church but not the only one f●r Luke mentions their being baptized as well as that and why should any man go about to seperate them The question is not whether faith or baptisme is the originall main and

meaning is that the offer and tender of Salvation did belong unto them and their children and to all a far off and the good of it to as many as God should call Though there be in Scripture severall Discoverie of the gracious councell of God concerning little children yet where ever any termes of grace and salvation are offered or promised upon the taking place of something to be believed or done by the creature there the Promise or Offer of Grace is alwayes to be understood to respect not Infants but persons having the use and exercise of their reason and understanding Deut. 11.1 2. Mark 4.9 23. and consquently not to Infants and if the Promise did not belong to Infants as Infants then no Baptisme upon account of the Promise The things here promised are the rem●ssion of sinnes and gift of the holy Ghost for those are the things the Apostle does ascertaine them by the Promise Now this Promise of remission of Sinnes and gift of the holy Ghost is either absolute and without condition or else it is only conditionall for betweene these there is no mean If absolute then the remission of Sinnes and gift of the holy Ghost were promised to all the Jewes and their children without any condition at all whether they did repent and were baptised or no but this I think no man will affirme If the Promise then was conditionall as you see it must needs be then none had right to the Promise that is to the things promised but those that had performed the condition for take away the condition of the Obligation or Promise and the Obligation ceases to be now the condition of the Promise is here clearly set by the Apostle to be if not Repentance and a being baptised in the name of Jesus Christ for if any knowes how upon good ground to divide them herein let it so be yet I am sure Repentance is Repent and be baptised c. and ye shall receive c. that is and thereupon ye shall receive c. And if Repentance was the condition of the Promise here mentioned by the Apostle then I am sure the children of these Jewes could no more have right to the Promise here made untill they did repent then the parents themselves could and consequently no more right to Baptisme upon account of the Promise then they had Which thing is so evident and cleare that I shall wonder if any rationall man shall not discerne it if he will but give his reason and judgement full scope to consider it XXXV Querie answered Here the Querist demands Whether God doth smell in the assemblies of those which he sayes judge themselves the only duly baptised persons under heaven with any such pleasure or delight as he smelleth many the Assemblies of those who are called unbaptised or are they filled with the glory and presence of God at such a rate or are there any such manifestations of the spirit there or are the powers of the world to come so active and busie in the Church meetings of the one as they are in the other Had the Querist given us to understand in what respects he speaks these things and by what he makes judgement when and when not such appearances of God as he speakes of are vouchsafed men in their Assemblies we might have knowne the better how to have satisfied his demand If he judge of the presence of God and the activity of the powers of the world to come in this case by those effects which the ministration of the Gospel in such or such Assemblies works in men in causing them to deny themselves in their worldly interest not seeking the great things of this world but being content to lose the favour and respect of men the love of relations and to expose themselves to the censures hard thoughts evill speakings reproachings revilings scoffings laughings and oppositions of men that they might approve themselves faithfull to God and likewise in causing them to seek the honour of God and good of Men in dispensing the Gospel freely and perswading all to a close and intire conformity thereto both in their drawings nigh to God in the matters of his house and worship and in their deportment and carriage towards men in common conversation I say if judgement shall be made of the presence of God with his p●ople by such eff●cts as these which yet were the great tokens of the presence of his grace in the fi●st times of the Gospel then doubtlesse the Querist needed not to have made a question of it where these are most visible Or if he will estimate the presence of God we speak of by those glorious successes which he is pleased to give unto the meetings Ministery and endeavours of his Servants in bringing in great numbers and multitudes both of men and women to be obedient to the Faith according to the Doctrine and Order of the Gospel then I shall desire him to cast his eyes abroad in the Land and then tell us by whose hands the greatest part of those many Churches that are separated from the nationall way have been planted especially in those places where not long since scarce so much as a face of Religion was to be seene As concerning many of those of whom such Churches do consist it is very true that that which our Saviour speaks of the Ministry of the Prophets disposing and preparing a People for the hands of the Apostles and for that Gospel-mould into which they were to cast them may aptly enough be applyed to the Ministry of the Baptists in planting and building of Churches of such materialls as were in part prepared to their hands John 4.37 38. Herin is that saying true One soweth another reapeth I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour Other men laboured and ye are entred into their labour But the Lord hath been pleased not onely to use them as his workmen to polish some living stones which were in part hewne before and for the building them up into spirituall houses putting them into the right order and way of worshipping God perfecting as to this that which was lacking before but hath also so wonderfully prospered his word in their mouthes in turning of men from darknesse to light and from the power of Satan unto God in severall the dark places of this Nation that I confesse I have not heard of the like testimony given by God to the endeavours of any other sort of men in these dayes and surely such things as these were wont to be accounted signes of the presence of the Lord with his people Acts 11.21 And the hand of the Lord was with them and a great number beleeved and turned to the Lord. Ne●ther can it reasonably be thought that the Scriptures are as a sealed Booke among these Men whilst such effects are produced by their opening and pressing of them Well may it be indeed that the Scriptures are not dished and carved out