Nature and Humanity of the same Mind the same Meekness Gentleness Humility Kindness Fear of the Lord Obedience c. that was in him Else how can any be true Christians If W. H. answers viz. I grant that Christ is present with and in his Saints by his Spirit that I mean the Holy Ghost who is God and infinite and can be and is in * See Antid pag. 13. all the Saints both that are in Heaven on Earth at once not the Spirit of the manhood an essential part that is a finite Creature ‖ He confessâ—th that the Consideration of the Manhood of Christ in Heaven doth give Boldness Access in Prayer God hath rendred himself much more familiar to us this Way We are very apt to be swallowed up with the abstracted Thoughts of the Deity But does this Man pray to and worship Christ as a finite Creature that has not Power to extend his Spirit to him No but as in Vnion with the Deity then we hope as in that Union he has Power to minister of his own Life and Virtue to all that believe in his Name However he grants that as God Christ is in all his Saints in Heaven and Earth Well shew us the Father and it sufficeth us To which Christ answered He that seeth me seeth my Father also John 14. Therefore the true Knowledge and Sight of God is through his Son as his words are page 10. Now Christ as God is immense as to his Presence he is every where and as to his Saints he is with them always and in them by his Spirit Antid pag. 5. Rep. Now you have his Opinion how Jesus Christ is in and with his Saints that is That the immense infinite God is in and with them But is nothing essential to the Heavenly Man Christ Jesus the Son of God as such extended to them See but what a Labyrinth the Man runs into through his deviating from plain Scripture-Language dividing Christ the Head from his Body to such a vast distance as he knows not the Omnipresence of an infinite God who questions But how does he own his SONSHIP or Manifestation Operation or Dispensation of the SON of God as such or as Mediator between God and Men or the Kingdom of the Mediator And when Christ said All Power in Heaven and Earth is given unto me Lo I am with you alway is this only as an infinite God Who then gave him this Power And who gave the Son Power over all Flesh or impower him to give Eternal Life Did God give it to himself Did not the Son say My Father is greater then I But if as a Son he be wholely excluded and separate from the Saints on Earth how said he If any man love me I and my Father will come unto him and make our Abode with him And if any man have not the Spirit of Christ he is none of his And because ye are Sons God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your Hearts crying Abba Father Gal. â— Is there nothing of the heavenly and holy Manhood in this Spirit of the Son but only the meer infinite Deity it self or does it then mediate intercede or cry Abba Father to it self without Respect to any lower State or Dispensation as a Son as the Way and Means to come to God or to Christ Jesus as the eminent Instrument and Workman of God as Mediator The Gospel we have received we had it in the Name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost who are inseparable and not divided either in Heaven or in Earth We have nakedly confessed Jesus Christ the Son of God as having all Power in Heaven and Earth to be both God and Man he is that Immanuel God with us And hath not he Power as such to breathe upon and inspire his Saints and to give Light and Life to Mankind without any lessening or limitation to his own Being as Jesus Christ the Son of God It is the Spirit of the Son wherein we receive of his Life Vertue and Power and its only in and through the Mediator that Man is capable of receiving the Knowledge of God For God who commanded the Light to shine out of Darkness hath shined in our hearts to give the Light of the Knowledge of the Glory of God in the Face of Jesus Christ 2 Cor. 4. 6. Whose Knowledge and In dwelling we have in measure received according to the Measure of the Gift of Christ whereby we feel him to dwell in our Hearts by Faith as truly as we know that God dwelleth in us and we in him because he hath given us of his Spirit Jesus Christ received the Spirit without Measure we by Measure Moreover is not all the Graces and Operations thereof in us and spiritual Good we receive from God to our Souls said to be through Jesus Christ a Phrase frequently used in Scripture who said also Without me ye can do nothing And how is Christ Jesus the Way to the Father given for a Covenant and Leader to his People and for Salvation to the Ends of the Earth if not at all upon Earth and why did he say No man cometh unto the Father but by me Was this considered only as God without any Condescension as a Son or Mediator below the meer Deity were not this to confound the Order and Manner of the holy Ghost's plain and distinguishing Testimonies in Scripture relating to the Dispensation of Christ Another Instance we have to prove the Blessed and Heavenly man Christ Jesus not now upon Earth in or with his Members with respect to HIS Spirit or spiritual Presence and that is Act. 3. 21. Whom the Heavens must receive till the Times of Restitution of all things ‖ Which God had spoken by the mouth of all his holy Prophets since the World began These words he leaves out If quoth W. H. they would mind this one Scripture it would put an End to all their Cavils which Times let them dare to say are already come pag. 9. Answ Dare he say that these Times of Restitution of all things spoken by the holy Prophets are not begun in these Gospel-Times wherein Christ's spiritual Appearance Dispensation and Revelation is made known what 's the Restitution and the Times of it Is it not a Restauration gathering and making up the Church of Jews and Gentiles into the spiritual Fellowship and Faith of the Son of God who therein are the Seed of Abraham whom God promised to bless in sending Jesus to turn away every one from his Iniquities see Acts 3. 20. to the end And are not those Times of Restitution Gospel Times New-Covenant Times Let it be considered according to Scripture how far the Times of Restitution of ALL things spoken by the Holy Prophets extend and what that Restitution is and it will appear Whether those Times and that Restitution are not begun and whether or no its now a Time to perswade People that Christ Jesus is not
another false and feigned Iesus Answer A blasphemous Aspersion See our Testimony pag. 7 8 9. which is unto the same Christ Jesus that was miraculously conceived by the holy Ghost overshadowing the Virgin Mary that was crucified and put to Death as concerning the Flesh buryed rose again ascended c. that we have alwayes believed and owned the Man Christ Jesus according to the plain History of him in the holy Scripture as well as in the Mystery Where 's now the false and feigned Jesus If W. H. will not believe our Confession herein to be Real but Quibling we may not swear to it nor shall we need an Asseveration to clear us but leave him to God to deal withal for his Abuse Instead of proving That the Quakers denyed the same Numerical True and Real Manhood of Iesus Christ in Heaven c. at their Dispute with the Baptists at Barbican London which he instanced for proof thereof as one main Ground of this Charge he is now fain to pull back his Horns as to that Proof being so evidently disproved by our Citation of that Passage at the said Dispute viz. W. P's Confessing in the Name Person of the Quakers That we do believe the Man Christ Jesus to be glorified in Heaven We do believe the Holy Manhood to be in Heavenly Glory c. This evidently making against W. H's Asperâ—â—on he is fain to tell his Reader instead of proof from that Dispute That some that are not acquainted with their Way of speaking may think this sufficient calling this a brave Sound of Words but others that have been used to them cannot till W. Penn describes what he means by the Man Christ Jesus and what by the Manhood p. 6. See here instead of proving his Charge from the Dispute quoted by himself for it he is now to seek W. Penn's Meaning when it concerns Matter of Fact Oh silly Adversary His Instance of G. F's telling of Christ in the Male and in the Female and that Christ's Nature is not Earthly or in that Sense humane proves not that the Quakers deny the Man Christ Jesus to have ascended into Heaven any more then that the Apostles did so in confessing to Jesus Christ in them their HAVING the Son of God and Life in him the Spirit of Christ in them and because ye are Sons God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your Hearts crying Abba Father And the Apostle plainly distinguished between the first Man Adam that was made a living Soul and the last Adam that was made a quickening Spirit the first Man being of the Earth earthly the second MAN the Lord from Heaven 1 Cor. 15. 45 47. Let our Caviling Opposer fight with plain Scripture if he will if he still believes Christ's Manhood or Nature to be of an Earthly Substance i. e. as that of the first Adam 's p 7. He may keep his Faith to himself and take his Unscriptural Expressions back again or endeavour to reconcile himself to the Scripture-Language The second MAN is the Lord from Heaven c. Is not here a Heavenly Manhood opposed to the Earthly For if Man was Created in the Image of God so as Man is called the Image and Glory of God 1 Cor. 11. 7. And the second man who is Lord from Heaven the Image of the invisible God Col. 1. 15. The BRIGHTNESS of his Father's Glory the EXPRESS Image of his Substance Heb. 1. 3. Doth this Manhood or Image consist of man's Corporal earthly shape or figure Nay Is not here a Manhood of a higher Nature Image and Glory then that of the earthly Natural Body shape or form of it Which doth not at all deny Man that Body or Form that God hath at his own pleasure alotted for him and is proper to his Condition But the sum of our Confâ—ssion that we believe the man Christ to be glorified in Heaven c. he saith is this viz. That the Light within being heaâ—kened to and obeyed is lifted up and exalted and glorified in the heart of man and that nothing is more obvious in our Discourses with them then that Heaven is within them p. 7. When they say the same Man ascended into Heaven they mean nothing but that Globe which we call the Earth p. 8. Rep. Oh Disingenuous Man when thou canst get nothing against us as Matter of Fact from our plain Confession thou wilt forge Meanings for us as when we have plainly told thee as thou thy self hast cited viz. That the same MAN CHRIST that suffered and was put to Death in the Flesh and was raised from the dead by the mighty Power of God ascended into Heaven ascended both as to change of Place and State of Glory Thou makest our Meaning to be nothing but that Globe which we call the Earth as if by Christ's local and visible Ascension from the Earth which was a signal Evidence of his being the very Christ the Son of the Living God we meant his Descension into the Globe of the Earth Oh! gross Perversion We could not have more plainly and historically signified our Meaning then we did from these Scriptures Luk. 24. 50 51. Act. 1. 9 10. yet still withal confessing Christ's SPIRITUAL PRESENCE in the Hearts of his People who are quickened and saved by him the Mystery of Christ in Spirit no wayes opposes the History of Christ in the Flesh mark that unto which our Confession before is so plain that W. H. addeth to it viz. Is not here a full and plain Confession Would not you take the Hartford Quakers more orthodox then others of them p. 7. Whereas the Quakers have neither been taught nor confest the contrary whatever he would insinuate against them to the contrary W. H. addeth They have altogether lost their Credit and Reputation with many as in this matter in that we have so frequently caught them jugling ‖ Gross Slanders equivocating quibling cogging the Dice that we can no more trust them p. 8. Answ They are not out of Credit and Reputation with any but such prejudiced envious perverse and partial men as thou art who slanderest us in saying We have so frequently caught them jugling c. We have caught thee in Forgery Lyes and Confusion who beliest us in saying We unsay what we have said as to Christ's Ascertion and Exaltation into Heaven and Glory as before By our saying that it was not that he might remain separate from his Body which he is Head of for was Christ's Ascention or being taken up into Heaven from his Disciples that he might remain separate from them as to his spiritual presence when he said I will not leave you comfortless I will come unto you John â—4 2. ver 18. which thou confessest speaks of HIS comiâ—g in the Power of the Spirit to their Hearts to comfort them in the Evil Dayes wherein they should be cast p. 13. his coming whose coming The same Christ's that went away Is this to unsay or deny his
Ascention or being in Heaven W. H. thou art quite out Again that Change that we believe Christ Jesus to have had into a State of Glory which as the Son he had with the Father before the World began doth not at all deny Jesus of Nazareth to be the Messiah as most unjustly thou hast accused us both in thy Antidote and Animadversions p. 6. for it was the same Jesus that so prayed Father glorifie thy Son glorifie thou me with thine own self with the Glory which I had with thee before the World was John 17. 1. 5. yet it is a plain falshood to say that We suppose that the manhood as thou calls it that was taken of the Virgin is turned into an Immeâ—se iâ—finite being a Deity It was never our Supposition p. 6. that the meer â—lesh Blood that the Son took of the Virgin which was part of the same the Câ—ildren had became a Dâ—ity an Immense infinite being when thou wantest proof for thy Slanders against us thou must needs Invent and Forge suppositions meanings and absurd Consequences for us Oh! perverse Man is this to support thy Credit and Trade among thy Hearers to say we do suppâ—se that which never entred into our Hearts W. H. His Soul was in the Saints We may dispare at this rate ever by words to understand one another here 's Babel p. 8. Answ In Babel thou art who accusest and revilest us and drawest thy absurd Meanings upon us without understanding us shewing thy ignorant Confidence Of the Soul or Spirit of Christ we shall speak anon Against our saying He Christ had all Power in Heaven and Earth given him and therefore could descent at his pleasure and he promised to be with his Disciples alway to the End W. H Objects To Argue from Christ's Power to his will was never accounted strong or right Reasoning * But the learned and Zealous Protestants affirmed Christ's Spiritual presence with his Church in opposition to the Papists Doctrine of his Carnal presence in their Sacrament The Papists argued thus against the Martyrs for their Transubstantiation viz. God had Power to turn Bread into his natural Body Ergo p. 8. Ans A most gross perversion and abuse not only against us but against Christ's own Testimony whereby his WILL to be with his Disciples to the end of the World as well as his Power to come again unto them is signified And JESUS spake unto them saying ALL POWER is GIVEN unto me c. Lo I am with you alway even unto the end of the World Mat. 28. 18 20. But W. H. has denyed Jesus Christ to be here on Earth as he is Man that is either as to his Body or Spirit Antid p. 2 3. It is not a Corporal and carnal Vnion between Christ and his Members that we plead for that 's not the Controversie nor do we speak of the manhood being locally or Personally present with and in the Saints as he would Insinuate p. 9. But the spiritual presence of Christ Jesus according to his promise Mat. 28. 20. As the SON of God to whom all Powâ—r IS GIVEN according to his own sense And though our Adversary has denyed the Holy manhood of Christ even in the Spirituallity of it that is as to his Spirit to be on Earth in or with his Church yet hath he confessed that CHRIST is in the Saints by his Spirit Antid p. 5. And that Christ hath alway been present with his Disciples in the discharge of their ministerial Gifts and will be to the end of the World by HIS Spirit Animad p. 9. Where 's now the Controversie Is the heavenly Man Christ wholely separate from his Church and Members not only in Body but in Spirit also yea circumscribed in some place as far as the highest Heavens are supposed from the Earth Antid pag. 6. As a Man may be many Miles distant from his Wife c. Anim. p. 9. And yet this same Christ alway present with his Disciples And as there 's one Soul throughout the natural Body of man the same in the Head and in every Member so ONE Spirit in Jesus Christ the Mystical Head and in every one of his Members the Saints Anim. p. 9. Now if thiâ— man meant really as he speaks as to the spiritual Presence and Union of Christ Jesus with and in his Saints and Church on Earth and would lay aside his Enmity and Confusion and keep to Scripture-Language the Controversie between him and us would be at an end But in p. 10. he has framed a Dilemical Quarrel against the Spirit of Christ being in every Saint which he sayes we invest with the Office of the holy Ghost which he concludes cannot be so either with or without the Body nor yet extending from it in Heaven to every Saint upon Earth For that were to render the Soul of Christ immense iâ—finite and then there must be a new created God in time the Soul of Christ's Manhood was created in time Error is Crookedness Absurdity and Rottenness quoth W. H. And yet he saith The Saints ought to worship the Humane Nature of Christ in Vnion with the Deity Anti. p. 6 7. And that the Humane Nature giveth Life to our Souls p. 7. Can it do so and yet his Spirit not so much as extend to us though immensly impowered with the Deity How doth he darken Counsel by words without Knowledge And W. H. leaves us not thus but has another fling at us p. 19. But he Christ is on Earth the Quakers say at least in one essential part of his Manhood His Soul is in every Saint You see Error is big-bellyed and fruitful And p. 20. 30. Refining Religion and the blessed holy true real operative Manhood of Jesus Christ into Air Wind Fancy Nothing ‖ Gross Lyes c. Rep What a heap of jumbled Arguing mudled Stuff with a most false Conclusion against us is here as if we went about to annihilate the most holy and glorious Manhood of Jesus Christ Now we would query of this Man First If the Soul and Spirit of Christ be not one and the same 2. If he was the Son of God before the World was what then is his Soul and in what time created 3. If the Spirit of Christ and the holy Ghost be separate or divided 4. If Jesus Christ in all the parts essential and proper to him viz. in Body and Soul or Spirit be so circumscribed and limited in Heaven as in no sense or degree to be in or with his Saints or Members on Earth then how is his own Promise or Saying made good Lo I am with you alway to the End of the World And how has the Father given the Son Power over all Flesh that he should give Eternal Life to as many as the Father gave him John 17. 5. And doth not God send the Spirit of his Son into Believers Hearts that thereby they might partake of his holy and heavenly
both and so hâ—s dealt unâ—aiâ—ly and not only in these but in many more Particulars hath he abused perverted and confounded our words as well as the Scriptures which would fill a Volumn to open distinâ—tly He makes no Conscience of belying us and grosly perverting our Words and Intentions 'T is probable he would take it as an Affront and Injury if we should retalliate upon him or enumerate the Consequences of his Carnal Conceits to shew what a strange Chriâ—t he has set forth But at present wee 'l suppose these two to follow from his Doctrine until he reconcile and clear himself better then he has yet done viz. 1. Thâ—t Christ being wholely in the highest Heaven and his Body there more bright then a Thousand Sons Antid p. 6. yet cannot be seen by any Teliscope or Prospective Glasses as many unseen Stars may He must needs be at a wonderful vast Distance from his Saints and Members on Earth 2. That his very Spirit or Soul is so bound up in that Body at that vast height and wonderful distance in Heaven that it cannot so much as extend to any Saints upon Earth to viâ—it and comfort them in any of their Tryals or See p 10. Temptations Satan it seems has more Power to come and tempt them then Christ has to come to help them though beyond measure endued with Divine Power sad and inconsistent News And yet the Flesh of Christ is such as giveth Life to our Souls in quickning of us to Righteousness Antid p. 7. It seems then his Flesh extends farther then his Spirit But the true Christ is not divided His Heavenly Humanity and Divinity act in Union in quickening whom â—e will the Seed that he has sown in the Souls of men and the Spirit of Life that he breaths in are of himself as truly as that HOLY THING conceived in the Virgin was of the Holy Ghost And was not Christ spiritually formed in the Saints by the same Power of the Holy Ghost And Christ said He that eateth my Flâ—sh and drinketh my Blood dwelleth in me and I in him John 6. 56. Moreover We do both firmly believe that the Worlds were made by the Son of God and that by him all things consist he being that Word that was with God and that was God in the Beginning and that this Son of God was the first born of every Creature and the first begotten of the Dead and since by Man came Death by Man came also the Resurrection of the Dead And also we do as really confess according to holy Scripture That this Son of God in due time took upon him a real Body prepared for him of the same Flesh and Blood which the Children had Hebr. 2. 14. was made of the Seed of David according to the Flesh and declared to be the Son of God with Power according to the Spirit of Holiness by the Resurrection from the Dead Rom. 1. 3 4. That this Christ the Son of God took upon him the Form of a Servant and was made in the Likeness or Habit of men and being found in fashion as a man he humbled himself and became obedient unto Death even the Deaâ—h of the Cross wherefore God hath highly exalted him c. Phil. 2. So that he being come sâ— low as to be thus made and fashioned as in the similitude of men as man his Soul was capable of Humiliation Sorrow and Affliction for Mankind and of sympathizing with his Servants yet still was the Only begotten of the Father and was full of Grace and Truth the express Image of his Father's Substance he was also made a quickning Spirit to all who are spiritually quickened by him he was taken up into Glory he was glorified with the Deity or God himself with the same Glory that he had with the Father before the World began he ascended far above all Heavens that he might fill all things for it hath pleased the Father that ALL Fulness should dwell in him So that the True Christ is neither divided nor may we entertain such Mean Low Carnal Thoughts of this Son of God this only begotten of the Father as That he is a FINITE Creature in a natural earthly Body in Heaven and he therein wholly separate as one there circumscribed or limited to such a wonderful far Distance as is supposed from all his Saints and Church on Earth We have neither thus learnt Christ or received the Son of God nor thus read of him in the holy Scriptures under those Terms but have a Measure of the Knowledge of the Son of God as the Father hath revealed him in us Finally There is no more Inconsistency or denying the Man Christ between our confessing his Ascention into Heaven and Glory yea far above all Heavens and his coming again in Spirit to be spiritually present with and in his Church then is in these Testimonies of the holy Apostles viz. 1. That Saying of Peter Who is gone into Heaven and is on the Right Hand of God 1 Pet. 3. 22. And Behold I lay IN SION a Chief Corner-stone elect precious 1 Pet. 2. 6. As also Heb. 4. 14. Seeing then that we have a great High Priâ—st that 's passed into the Heavens Jesus the Son of God Compared with Hebr. 12. 24. Ye are come to Jesus the Mediator of the New Covenant c. Ephes 1. 20. Which he wrought in Christ when he raised him from the Dead and set him at his own Right Hand in the Heavenly Places Compared with Ephes 2. 6. And hath raised us up together and made us sit together in Heavenly Places in Christ Jesus 1 Cor. 15. 3 4 5. Christ dyed for our Sins he was buried rose again the third day was seen of Cephas then of the Twelve c. Compared with 2 Cor. 4. 11. We which live are alway delivered unto Death for Jesus's sake that the Life also of Jesus might be made manifest IN our mortal Flesh Gal. 2. 20. I am crucified with Christ nevertheless I live yet not I but Christ liveth in me c. Rom. 8. 10. If CHRIST BE IN YOU the Body is dead because of Sin but the Spirit is Life because of Righteousness 2 Cor. 13. 5. Examine your selves whether ye be in the Faith prove your own selves know ye not your own selves how that JESUS CHRIST IS IN YOU except ye be Reprobates Let our Adversary Answer these Scriptures if he can but we suppose he dares not accuse them with Inconsistency nor any of them with denying the Man Christ But if W. H. be minded to busie himself with an Answer or Reply to this Treatise and thereby put his Hearers to further Charge with his Books we would advise him first to consult with some of his learned Brethren who are wiser then himself that they may view his Work before it go to the Press and take special Care that he writes pertinently and consistently lest he run into further Absurdities and self-contradictions
THE TESTIMONY OF THE Hartford Quakers FOR The Man Christ Jesus VINDICATED From the Malicious Slanders Perversions Confusions Impertinencies and Idle Quibling of William Haworth an Independent-Preacher in his ANIMADVERSIONS on the said Testimony from the Hartford Quakers as in Derision he calls them With a Brief and Serious Reply by Mary Stout to what concerns her in William Haworth's former Book Entituled The Quaker converted to Christianity Re-established which about two years since John Crook and William Bayly have more fully Answered in their Book entituled The Counterfeit-Christian Discovered intended hereafter to be published unto which THE SUBSTANCE of this Tract will serve for an APPENDIX He i. e. Christ is despised and rejected of men c. who shall declare his Generation Isa 53. Behold I lay in Sion a Chief Corner-stone elect precious but unto them which be disobedient a Stone of Stumbling c. 1 Pet. 2. Printed in the Year 1676. A Brief Introduction TO THE Unprejudiced Reader SInce we have in our late Testimony to the Man Christ Jesus in the Fear Sight and Presence of Almighty God seriously confessed unto the VERY CHRIST the Son of God both with respect to his miraculous Conception by the Holy Ghost his being born of the Virgin Mary his Life Sufferings Death Resurrection Ascension into Glory his Coming again in Spirit and in the Power of his Father c. according to the plain Testimonies given of him in the four holy Evangelists Matthew Mark Luke and John the Acts of the Apostles c. William Haworth in the Pride and Malice of his Heart has endeavoured to invalidate our Profession and abusively rendred us Lyars Cheaters Equivocaters pag. 11 12. Poor Vnbelieving Creatures p. 15. like a Railer aspersing us with The deadly Poyson Inchantments Divinations Errors of the Socinians Quakers Ranters Muggletonians Papists thus he ranks us And with his impertinent Scribles hath opposed our Confession of Christ's spiritual Coming and Presence with his Members on Earth limiting the Spirit of Christ to a wonderful distance from his Saints and Members on Earth because he sayes 'T is the Soul or Spirit of Christ's Manhood or Humanity in Heaven which Spirit or Christ's spiritual Presence that it should so much as extend to the Saints upon Earth this he cannot swallow Animad Pag. 10. on this much of his Work against us depends yet let it be remarkt that to the utter Overthrow of his own Cause he has in plain words confessed thus viz. We confess again that the Deity perfects all Good IN US and for us but then the Humanity is in Vnion with it and ACTS WITH ☞ IT and they must not be put assunder p. 28. Howbeit when he often grants that Christ is present with and in his Saints on Earth by his Spirit which is all we would have granted if it were in Reality he sayes he means the Holy Ghost who is God and infinite and can be and is in all the Saints both in Heaven and on Earth at once not the Spirit of the Manhood that is a finite Creature he saith But where proves he by the Scripture that the SON of God is a Finite Creature Yet to vary and go round again We are very apt to be swallowed up with the abstracted Thoughts of the Deity Antid pag. 13. And that Christ hath a Fellow-feeling with his People in all their Streits being touched with the Feeling of their Infirmities Hebr. 4. 15. p. 12. Besides the plain Scripture he cannot get over viz. If any man have not the Spirit of Christ he is noâ—e of his Rom. 8. 9. And God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into our Hearts crying Abba Father Gal. 4. 6. But it will appear in the following Tract that this man has confusedly rambled varyed from and confounded Scripture-Language relating to the Manifestation and Operation of the Son of God as the Way and Means of Man's Deliverance and Salvation from Sin and Death and coming unto the Father for no man cometh unto the Father but by the Son This Way and Method of God's Salvation through his Son we stand for against Confusion and Darkness For the Light of Truth is risen over it all Note that when W. H. is proved a Forger in his citing the Dispute between the Baptists and William Penn c. at Barbican to prove that we deny the Manhood of Christ in Heaven then to prove his Slander that we deny Jesus of Nazareth to be the Messiah he closely sticks to a Certificate dated Sept. 19. 1676. and signed by Daniel Doughty Iohn Albury Steph. Tothill which is That at the Discourse they had with William Bates they did more then once hear him plainly say That what Christ took of the Virgin had now no Being And to aggravate the Matter against the Quakers and to prove them No Christians Seducers c. W. H. saith He hath heard it out of the Mouth of a Prophet of their own with Three Witnesses and hath read it in their own Books without pag. 3. quoting any such Books and Pages But Note that in his Epistle to his Antidote c. which we had some Moneths before the Date of the said Certificate he has it in some other Terms viz. That W. Bates frequently said He did not believe that the Humane Nature that which was taken by Christ of the Virgin had now any Being See his Variation as to Matter of Fact The Phrase Humane Nature and that he frequently said it is not mentioned in the said Certificate However we own neither Passage but look upon the words as unadvisedly spoken whether way soever William Bates did express them or if he spake any thing to the same import he was ensnared by the Priest's Craft and therefore his Charging the Quakers hereupon with denying Jesus of Nazareth is as utterly false as his calling W. Bates a Prophet of our own to prove us guilty whereas he was never esteemed nor known to be that we know of either a Prophet Preacher or Teacher among us And W. H. his charging the Quakers Antid Epist yea many Thousands of them with disowning Jesus of Nazareth from the words of that one Person shews his Injustice and Malice And we having plainly confessed to the same Christ Jesus as still in being W. H. to his own Contradiction sayes they evidently see we are not all Anim. p. 11. guided by one and the same Infallible Light It seems then that though W. Bates was not others of us are More Shame then for our Adversary to brand the Quakers in general and to call us gross Lyars and Cheaters for this one man's Occasion Would he have himself and his Brethren to be so served Has he done as he would be done by Oh Shameless Man And we demand of him to know in what Books of ours he has read these words as he saith viz. That what Christ took of the Virgin hath now NO Being Let him produce those Books
Pages of ours wherein those words are asserted by the Quakers as their Opinion or forever stop his Mouth and be ashamed of Reviling and Abusing us as he hath done We doubt not but the Righteous God will rebuke his Malicious Envious Lying Spirit and manifestly abase him for his Perverting the Truth and Belying and Reviling the Servants of Christ as he has frequently done in his Writings Here follows a brief Collection of William Haworth 's Doctrines about which the Controversie between him and us Chiefly hath depended 1. OF the Body of Christ in Heaven That it is a Humane Natural Body of an Earthly Substance having the same Materiality Form and Figure and Shape ESSENTIAL to it that it had when here upon Earth Anim. p. 10 11. 7. 16. compared with Antid p. 6. Contrary to Phil. 3. 21. 1 Cor. 15. 44 45 46 47 48. 2. Yet in Contradiction That it is a very Glorious Body more bright then a Thousand Suns gloriously represented and painted out to us by Daniel and John in the Revelation 3. That Steven saw the Heavens opened and the Body of Christ yea Christ Iesus on the Right Hand of God with his Bodily or Carnal Eye from Acts 7. 55 56. See also Antid p. 6 12. compared with Animad p. 14 15. 4. That the Man Christ Iesus is not here on Earth as to his Spirit nor is or may his Soul or Spirit be so much as extended to the Saints upon Earth Antid p. 2 3. compared with Anim. p. 10. Yet in Contradiction to this by his own Expressions CHRIST hath alwayes been present with his Disciples in the Discharge of their Ministerial Gifts and will be to the End of the World by his Spirit The Vnion between Christ and his Church is mystical and spiritual not corporal and carnal as there is one Soul throughout the natural Body of Man the same in the Head and in every Member so one Spirit in Iesus Christ the Mystical Head and in every one of his Members the Saints 1 Cor. 6. 17. Animad p. 9. Christ is present BY HIS SPIRIT IN his Saints p. 30. And whoever hath not the Son hath not the Father p. 26. Note If he knew what he saith and were real in his Confession so as not to vary from it the Controversie in this would be at an End since Christ is confessed by both of us to be God and Man But further observe W. Haworth's Doctrines 5. That Infants are not Innocents but have the Guilt of Adam's Sin upon them pag. 21. Contrary to Ezek. 18. 20. Chap. 18. 15. Mat. 18. 3. 19. 14. Mark 10. 14. 6. That the Light within every one is nothing but Nature which is corrupt We are by Nature Children of Wrath p. 21. But in plain Contradiction This Light within is the Law of Moses written in the Heart that the Apostle he 's sure calls it Nature Rom. 2. 14. But now to Mark. come off how miserably soever he saith The Law of Moses in the Heart is the Work of the Law p. 22. Query But we ask were those Gentiles who did by Nature those things contained in the Law Children of Wrath by the Work of the Law in their Hearts contrary to plain Scripture Psal 19. 7. Rom. 2. 13 14. Now risum teneatis amici 7. That the Apostle saith of these Gentiles that had done by Nature the Things contained in the Law and had the Works of the Law written in their Hearts notwithstanding this they were unrighteous Sinners guilty c. as a natural Man doing Part of the Law by the meer Strength of Nature is nothing but Sin is a Child of Wrath in a damnable Condition no right Principle from whence he acts not a Dram of true Faith in Jesus Christ p. 22. Query What then was it or could it be corrupt sinful Nature by which those Gentiles mentioned Rom. 2. 14 15. did those things contained in the Law and were justified 8. That W. H. and his Brethren cannot dare not must not admit of any Thing no not so much as our Faith though it 's wrought in us by the Spirit into that Righteousness that justifies us in God's Sight p. 23. Contrary to plain Scripture Rom. 5. 1. 1 Cor. 6. 11. 9. He questions whether there be any Works done by the Spirit upon any of the Sons of Men except Christ but there still remains a Body of Sin in them Intimating that a Body of Sin still remains in them all Christ excepted Contrary to Rom. 6. 7. ver 18. Col. 2. 11. And contrary to his own Confessions viz. God works upon us by his Spirit to renew our evil Natures after his own Image p. 24. We confess that the Deity PERFECTS all Good in us c. p. 28. 10. That we are not justified by Works done in the Spirit as Abraham 's Works David 's Works c. p. 26. Contrary to Jam. 2. 21 24. 11. That David describes the Blessedness of the Ma◠unto whom God imputeth Righteousness without Works DONE BY THE SPIRIT Antid p. 18. Contrary to Psal 32. 2. 12. That Isaiah calls HIS observing Moses 's Law in THE SPIRIT filthy Rags in that Place Isa 64. 3. p. ibid. 13. That Paul 's delighting in the Law of God after the inward Man which was to keep it in THE SPIRIT he counted Loss for Christ when converted to Christ and this but his own Righteousness on Phil. 3. p. ibid. 14. To the Question Is it good Doctrine to say that Paul when a Christian counted his spiritual Obedience Loss and Dung for Christ W. Haworth answers ‖ This is the Man that pretends highly to esteem value the inward Work of the holy Spirit in the Hearts of Saints and his Renewings Comfortings Quickning◠c. p. 22. Yes very good sound blessed and comfortable Doctrine received by Millions of Saints in Heaven and Earth he addeth in Point of Justification Animad p. 27. Contrary to Rom. 8. 13. 6. 16. 16. 26. 2 Cor. 10. 5. 1 Pet. 1. 2. 14. 22. Heb. 5. 9. Acts 5. 32. Jer. 7. 23. Isaiah 1. 19. Deutr. 30. 14. Rom. 10. 8. 15. We are not justified by any Righteousness of ours done in the Spirit this he calls the Deeds of the Law contrary to Rom. 8. 1 2. 16. That our own Righteousness that which the Apostle Paul calls his own in Phil. 3. 9. is within us Inherint in our Souls it CONSITS in those Gifts and Vertues that the Spirit of God works in our Minds and we express those outwardly c. His proof for this Doctrine is viz. Faith is called your Faith Love is called your Love c. The Spirit works Faith in us See his Quaker Converted Epistle Dedicatory Observe See what an exposition is here made upon Paul's words about his own Righteousness which he desired not to have but counted it loss for Christ How horribly has this Man perverted this Scripture Phil. 3. 9. Those Gifts and
Vertues of the Spirit of God in Paul as Faith Love c. Could he part with these and count them loss for Christ when he had gained them by Christ And W. H. acknowledgeth That it is Regeneration that makes us meet for the Kingdom See how he is confounded 17. That that Righteousness of Faith by which we are justified is wholy without us in the person of Christ Quak. con Epist Contrary to Isa 26. 12. Rom. 8. 1 2 4. and 10 6 7. 18. Regeneration is to be distinguished from Justification as the Cause from the Effect Justification the cause of Regeneration Animad p. 27. Note As if men were justified in an Unregenerate state contrary to 1 Cor. 6. 11. Tit. 3. 5 6 7. 19. What he calls the personal Righteousness of Christ upon which only he placeth the Justification Imputation and merit of God's Kingdom he explains viz. That is only by the BLOOD-SHEDING of Jesus Christ Anim. p. 27. Note This SHEDING of Christ's Blood then has he preferred above the Vertues and work of his Spirit in us And whose act was the SHEDING of his Blood pray you Was it not his Persecutors Whereas it was by the eternal Spirit in him that HE OFFERED up himself a Lamb without spot to God So that his Offering up himself was Act of obedience proceeding from the inherent Righteousness and Holiness which dwelt in him 20. Of Satisfaction A Vengeance ready to punish Sin This is as dear to HIM i. e. God as his mercy IT being HIMSELF it must therefore be satisfied this way it is satisfied viz. THE FATHER POURED OUT ALL HIS WRATH UPON HIS SON JESUS CHRIST upon whom the Guilt of his People was Charged vid. Quaker Converted Epistle Dedicatory Note Oh! Wonderful yet un scriptural Satisfaction Thus W. Haworth has shewed his Respect to the Son of God thus highly to set the Father against the Son even as much as his Brother T. Powell in his affirming THAT JESUS CHRIST WAS THE GREATEST SINNER * Note his Blasphemy IN THE WORLD Whence it must needs follow THAT THE FATHER POURED OUT ALL HIS WRATH UPON HIS SON Do the Independant Congregations thus think to live at ease in their Sins and go Scot â—ree or accquite themselves from the Wrath of God If they do their Hope and expectations will fail them By these Doctrines before wherein William Haworth has shewn his Madness against the Light within and the Works wrought by and in the Spirit of God in the Saints and against the Son of God himself by rendring him the Subject of his Father's wrath the Reader may suppose what kind of stuff the rest of his work Scribling against us is We have here forborn to give a particular Answer to all these his Doctrines and Confusions or a Recitation of all his Lyes the matter being fully Answered elsewhere in other Books particularly by John Crook in his Treatise Entituled The Counterfeit Convert discovered in Reply to William Haworth's Book Stiled The Quaker Converted to Christianity Re-established which since W. H. hath given us new occasions and like a cracking Boaster now Dares us to Reply is intended to be made Publick so soon as may be with Conveniency If the Lord will We are Friends to all that desire to know the Truth as it is in Jesus Christ viz. Richard Thomas Edward Flumsted jun. H. Sweeting Abraham Rutt Richard Martin H. Stout Here followeth William Bates his Retraction and Account to stop William Haworth 's Clamours on that Occasion WHereas William Haworth has taken occasion to reproach the People of God called Quakers as being no Christians Seducers c. from some words which fell from my self in discourse with him which his Witnesses certifie were thus viz. That what Christ took of the Virgin had now no Being At four sundry times W. Haworth did set upon me with Accusations and Questions And the first time when he with several of his company came as appears to ensnare me with an Unlearned Question about the Body and Humane Nature of Christ Whether it be not the very same Flesh Blood and Bone in Heaven as he took of the Virgin I cannot deny but some such words past from me as before cited wherein I do acknowledge it was my Weakness and Oversight to give him any such Answer And that my Weakness herein may not be further charged upon the People called Quakers I do in the Sight of God affirm That I never was taught any such words among them nor do I know any such thing to be held by any of them as that What Christ took of the Virgin had now no Being I should rather have answered his Question with Silence for I did not understand his word Humane Nature However I hope I shall be more careful how and whom I answer for the time to come Yet nevertheless let it be noted That when I perceived W. H. had gotten Advantage at my words I presently confessed my Belief of the same Christ Jesus as still in Being several times desiring him not to write those words which had given him Advantage yet he told me But he would and still made use of the former Advantage against me â—â—lling me I was a Mad Quaker he had had discourse with divers of the Quakers but never heard the like from any of them and withal That my Brethren would call me to an Account for what I had said In the Fear of the holy God I do declare this to be the very Truth of the Matter so near as possibly I can remember The 16 th of the 10 th Mon. 76. William Bates Now observe Reader how disingenuously this W. H. hath dealt in this matter Ist In accusing the Quakers on this Occasion with denying the same Man Christ and disowning Jesus of Nazareth to be the Messiah when he knew as appears the contrary by expecting they would call W. Bates to an Account for what he had said Oh Unconscionable and void of Common Honesty how like the Devil has he acted when he has ensnared a Man then insults over him and since that to accuse a People from that particular Occasion And 2dly To notifie the Man to the Nation as a Prophet of ours for these words which he desired him not to write down but thereby intimated a desire they should not be insisted upon and here he hath honestly retracted them and therein shewn more Respect to Truth then ever W. H. hath done or is like to do whilst he persists in his Lying Aspersions and Abuses against us For which the Righteous God will judge him and his Folly and Madness against God's holy Truth will the more be manifest to his Shame and Confusion if he persist therein THE TESTIMONY OF THE Hartford Quakers FOR THE Man Christ Jesus VINDICATED TO William Haworth's Accusation in his Title Page W. H demonstrating that it is not the same true and real Man Christ Iesus that they i. e. the Quakers give Testimony unto but
sent for such a Work as that of Restitution as also how far the Phrase Heavens and Heavenly Places according to Scripture extends Whereas to our saying The Apostles had Signs and Evidences of Christ's Coming who by HIM wrought Miracles Act 4. 10. i. e. saith he The Miracles were Signs of his Personal Coming since his Ascention p. 14. Personal Coming are none of our words but this Man 's own Meaning on ours therefore his Risum teneatis amici with all his scornful Stuff toucheth not us It was Christ's Spiritual Presence and Power that we pleaded in those Miracles And he is fain to grant that Miracles wrought by the Apostles were only Signs of the Coming of Christ in Power and Spirit P. 14. Well then CHRIST came again in Power and Spirit after his Ascention yes and on that Scripture Jo. 3. 13. he confesseth CHRIST was spiritually in Heaven with his Saints when on Earth and is spiritually on Earth with them now he is in Heaven p. 13. Is CHRIST so Why then does this Man cavil against us The Reader knoweth saith he what we mean by the spiritual Presence of CHRIST with his Saints He means That God whose Presence is immense and infinite filling Heaven and Earth is with his Saints not really Christ Jesus in Spirit as Man though he be the second Man the Lord from Heaven the last Adam and made a QUICKNING Spirit 1 Cor. 15. 45 47. But is Christ divided Is he not God and Man in Union And to our Citations on Acts 3. 11 16. and chap. 4. 10. By the Name of Jesus of Nazareth whom ye crucified whom God raised from the Dead EVEN BY HIM doth this Man stand before you whole and vers 30. That Signs and Wonders may be done by the Name of thy holy Child Jesus whom thou hast anointed And Act. 2. 32. Having received of the Father the Promise of the Holy Ghost HE hath shed forth this which ye now see and hear Well 't is granted that these Miracles were only Signs of the Coming of Christ in Power and Spirit wherein he was spiritually on Earth If he still sayes This only concerned the Deity or Omnipresence of God the Father and not the spiritual Presence of the man Christ nor his spiritual Manhood This were to tell us that Peter and the Apostles only went about to convince people of an infinite Deity and that his infinite Presence was with them without respect to the Presence and Work of Christ as a Son or Mediator with them when they endeavoured to promote the Name of Jesus Christ who was crucified and said Even by HIM doth this man stand before you whole and prayed that Signs and Wonders might be done by the Name of the holy Child Jesus Which was that through him the Power of God and Christianity in the Life and Power of it might be promoted and spread For by HIS MEANS we believe in God that raised him from the dead and gave him Glory that our Faith and hope might 1 Pet. 1. 21. be in God And seeing thou W. H. confessest in Joh. 14. 18. I will not leave you comfortless I will come unto you That this Scripture speaks of his Coming in the Power of his Spirit to their hearts to comfort them in the Evil Dayes wherein they should be cast p. 13. And yet As for his Deity it is infinite and can in no wise be said that the Heaven received it p. 9. God is immense as to his Presence he is every where with his Saints alwayes c. Antid p. 5. From hence we may then answer thee Argumentum ad hominem or according to thy own Reasoning It cannot be said that Christ meerly as to his Deity did come again unto them any more then in that respect he ascended or went from them his Deity being infinite filling all places therefore his Coming again surely must in some sense have respect to his heavenly and blessed Manhood by virtue of the divine Power of his Father wherewith he was wonderfully endued and exalted Eph. 1. 21. But still to our Opposers circumscribing the Man Christ Jesus the Mediator as to his whole Manhood both in Soul and Spirit as well as Body to some remote place in Heaven from his Members on Earth and deriding at us for confessing to his spiritual presence in and with them We desire the Reader to observe one passage wherein he has overturned his Work given away his Cause and plainly hedged up his own way and that is in p. 28. of his Anim. viz. We confess again that the Deity Anim. p. 28. ☞ PERFECTS all good IN US and for us but then the Humanity is in Vnion with it and acts with it and they must not be put assunder How now W. H. What hast thou been contending against us for for confessing something of Christ in us as Man as well as God and for the Doctrine of Perfection And yet hast here plainly confest to both that the Deity PERFECTS all good IN US and for us And that the Humanity which is the manhood is in Vnion and ACTS with it and they must not be put assunder what can be more plain And hast thou not confest The manhood with the Deity is but one Christ one Mediator and both spoken of in that place p. 19. John 6. 53. And that the Flesh of Christ which thou callest this Human Nature giveth Life to our Souls in quickening of us to Righteousness Antid p. 7. Thou hast said enough stop thy Mouth and Pen and Cavil no longer with us in this matter thou hast fairly given away thy cause and contest do the Saints now partake of any thing of Christ below the Divine being it self what sayest now doth not the Deity and the holy manhood work together in perfecting all good in us Thou hast now fully answered thy self and Scrible as much as thou wilt thou canst never get over it And what sayest thou to these Scriptures where God said to his Son It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my SERVANT to raise up the Tribes of Jacob and to restore the preserved of Israel I will also GIVE thee for a Light to the Gentiles that thou mayest be my Salvation unto the ends of the Earth Isa 49. 6 8. Acts 13. 47. And said Christ No man cometh unto the Father but BY ME John 14. 6. And said the Apostle Ye turned to God from Idols to serve the living and true God and to wait for his SON FROM HEAVEN whom he raised from the Dead even Jesus c. 1 Thes 1. 9 10. Looking for that blessâ—d Hope and Glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ who gave himself for us Titus 2. 13. The God of pâ—ace that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus that great Shepherd of the Sheep through the Blood of the Everlasting Covenant make you PERFECT in every good Work to do his will working IN YOU that which is
well pleasing in his sight THROUGH JESUS CHRIST Heb. 13. 20 â—1 What 's more plain then that God enlightens us and Works in us by his Sâ—n Jesus Christ in condiscention and subâ—erviency to himself and that those Primitive believing Gentiles waited for his Son from Heaven looked for the Glorious appearing of the great God AND our Saviour Jesus Christ as â—is Grace taught them and that he did work in them what was well pleasing in his sight THROUGH JESUS CHRIST Mark tâ—at did the Heavens then and yet contain Jesus Christ at such a Remotenesâ— from all Saints on Earth Were all these former Believers disappointed in their hope and expectations and waiting for the Son of God from Heaven Or did they only attain to the Glorious appearing of the great God not of Jesus Christ does not this suit thy Notion who speaks not IN Christ nor IN his knowledge who never wast Baptized into Christ thou hast not received the Spirit of the Son 't is a Mystery hid from all such aâ—ry Notionists who hast signified to us that All those places where we Read of Jesus Christ by name APPEARING are to be understood that either they saw him the Heavens being opened as 't is said of Stephen â—r his was in extacy Antid p. 4. And thou hast explained how Stephen saw the Heavens opened and the Son of Man standing on the Right Hand of God that it was with his Carnal Eyes his Sight being strengthned in a wonderful way Antidote pag. 4. 12. ☞ And what is that other way of seeing Jesus Christ in his appearâ—ng It is in Extacy What 's that It is as when one is in a Trance or Swoon when one so forgetteth himself that he is not in the exercise of his Reason or Understanding Thou mayest preach and pray long enough before thou wilt be in any such Extacy or Trance or see the Heavens opened and Christ's Appearing with thy Carnal Eyes But were the believing Gentiles waiting and looking for the Son of God from Heaven the glorious Appearing of the Great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ 1 Thes 1. 10. Titus 2. 13. in Expectation either to see him with their Carnal Eyes the visible Heavens being opened or to see him only in some Extacy Trance or Swoon If so then they were not to see Jesus Christ while in their right Wits or Understandings or in the exercise of their Gifts Strange Doctrine Yet we grant that great Visions and Raptures have been in Extacies A Man in Christ caught up into the Third Heaven whether in the Body or out of the Body I know not said he Peter at Prayer fell into a Trance and saw Heaven opened Act. 10. 10 11. But this hinders not the Saints Spiritual Sight and Sense of Christ in their daily Enjoyment of him and living in him But Stephen being full of the Holy Ghost saw the Glory of God and Jesus standing on his Right Hand and said Behold I see the Heavens opened c. Could he with his Carnal Eyes see all this viz. the Glory of God his Right Hand and Jesus standing at it And were the Heavens outwardly opened What mean Conceits hast thou of God and Christ who also tellest of Stephen's seeing Christ in Heaven with his Bodily Eye it being strengthned by the Lord Anim. p. 14. And did he see the Glory of God and his Right Hand with his Bodily Eye also Thou sayest Thou wouldest not be guilty of any Carnal Thoughts of God or his Glory but yet darest not but believe the Scriptures of Truth in these Matters although thou shouldst not satisfie thy Reason And addest I do believe the Deity it self cannot be seen no Mortal Eye can approach that Invisibility p. 16. And then where do the Scriptures say that Stephen saw the Glory of God with his Bodily or Carnal Eyes The Scripture in the same place as plainly saith That he saw the Glory of God as that he saw the Heavens opened and Jesus standing on the Right Hand of God And thou hast granted No Mortal Eye can approach the Invisibility of the Deity it self See how thou art shaken in thy Work about thy saying Christ passed into the invisible Heavens thou now variest it to unseen as many Stars are invisible yet capable of being seen by any Teliscope or Prospective-Glasses p. 14. So then by Invisible most supream Heaven that 's far above all Heavens i. e. all Heavenly Powers all Angelical Nature and Perfection He is above them all Antid p. 8. we are to understand thou meanest an Vnseen yet Visible Heaven above all Heavenly Powers all Angelical Nature c. that may be seen by the Carnal Eye when eminently strengthned as thou thinkest Stephen's was What then is this Angelical Nature and those Heavenly Powers which this invisible unseen visible Heaven is so far above Thou comest off but poorly in this how poor and Vnbelieving Creatures soever thou countest us p. 15. Thou art high and rich in thy own Conceit but is it not with other mens Notions intermixt with thy own Conceits confused and carnal Fancies In the 13th page of our Testimony we required thee To shew us that Book and Page of ours where ever from these Scriptures Ephes 4. 10. Mat. 28. 20. or 1 Cor. 15. 50. the Quakers thus argued viz. Therefore Christ is not in Heaven in his Manhood how then can he be in Heaven But instead of producing us Book and Page or Dispute for these Words or Inferences thou proceedest in thy Forgery to abuse us still charging thy own Objections with the same Inferences of thy own forging upon us with thy Ergo He is not in Heaven c. p. 13. Oh Forger and Perverter And for thy Belief of Christ's Manhood and Nature being of an Earthly Substance Anim. p. 7. A Humane Natural Body p. 10. having the same Matter Finiteness ☞ Shape Form Figure it had on Earth p. 11 17. and that Christ's Soul or Spirit an essential Part of his manhood Antid p. 3. is a Finite Creature Animad p. 10. How shall we reconcile these words with thy Confession viz. We say the WORD was made Flesh Joh. 1. 14. and in that Flesh ascended into Heaven p. 12. We hope thou wilt not say That WORD was made an Earthly Substance a Humane Natural Body nor yet a Finite Creature for all things were made by that Word Joh. 1. 3. And this was the Son of God by whom God made the Worlds Hebr. 1. 2. Thou hadst need use some nice Distinction here by some Figure or Communication of Properties to wind thy self off from Socinianism and Confusion though thou exclaimest highly against the Socinians and it s a question whether that will do thy Cure For what Preeminence hast thou allowed Christ if both his Essential Parts be but such finite Creatures i. e. His Body in Heaven but a Humane Natural Body of an Earthly Substance of the same Matter and Form it had on Earth and his
it a general Charge which is falâ—e But thou sayest How honest soever they be in their Callings thou knowest there are Errors of a deep die amongst them Answ I say it is easie to prove a bad Conversation to be a Fruit of Error but it is hard to prove a good one to be so and it is not thy calling our Principles Error that doth prove them so to be I have often heard thee call them so both by Word and Writing but I never heard thee prove it by either Scripture indeed thou mentionest many to that end but so iâ—pertinent to the Business that there needs no other to prove thy self to be in Error and we to be in the Truth Thou sayest The Scriptures do no where call the Light that every man hath the Light of the Son of God and I may as properly call the Sun in ths Firmament so Answ The Scriptures are plentiful in this Case but that of John 1. vers 4 9. is enough In him was Life and the Life was the Light of Men and that was the True Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the World I know thy answer will be That was meant of the Person of Christ which was to be believed in But I ask thee What Possibility was there then or is there now of knowing him to be the true Christ that should come and which was to be believed in without a measure of his spiritual Light to reveal him seeing that Flesh and Blood cannot real him and he that seeth him seeth the Father also But we know it to be the Light of Christ by the Effects thereof the Works that he doth bear Testimony of him thy own words also will witness against thee iâ— this in pag. 109. of thy Book where thou grantest There is a Spark remaining in fallen man of that Light which Adam had in a full Flame before Transgression and also that it will teach some Truths and some divine things that there is a God and he is to be worshipâ— and this the Sun in the Firmament could never do Thou also sayest Thou hast this Light and walkest not contrary to it but it is not thy Guide nor Rule but the Spirit leads thee to the Scriptures as thy Rule and there thou hast seen higher things then the Light could discover to thee and so bids me take heed I have not rebelled against the Knowledge I once had from the Scriptures Answ Dost thou here speak like a Minister of Christ tâ—at had received hiâ— Spirit Did the Spirit in Paul lead him to the Scriptures as his only Rule and Guide after he knew the Son of God revealed in him then His Spirit was his Rule and Instructer as he saith Ephesians Chap. 4. Vers 12. every where and in every thing and opened his Understanding to know the true Meaning of what the holy Men before him had writ and spoke which before he knew not notwithstanding all his Knowledge from the Scriptures and the Prophets and true Ministers of Christ in all Ages did point to the Spirit as the Rule and not to their Words for those high things which they saw could not be seen but by the same Spirit in which they saw them Thou sayest Thou considerest thy self to be in Christ and that thou art doing that which he would have thee do for him in thy Generation and thou art fighting for Jesus of Nazareth against the Quakers Christ Answ To be in Christ is a high State and it were well for thee if thou knewest what thou sayest but if thou didst truly know Jesus of Nazareth and wert in him thou couldst not fight against the Quakeâ—s Christ for he is the same and not anotâ—er and he never employed thee to fight against his Spiritual Aâ—pearance in his People thou hadst better lay down thy Weapâ—ns and submit to him for he will be too strong for thee and a Woful Reward for thy Work wilt thou receive at his Hands if thou Repent not Thou sayest Thoâ— art bâ—und to do thy Duty and leave thy Work with Christ and though thou mayest apprehend our Kingdom wâ—ll prosper yet thou art not discouraged but believest we are in Error stâ—ll and though none of you can yet Christ can and will in time still the Ragiâ—g of the Sea and divide and dry up these Waters and though wâ— soar as high as the Clouds in vain Boasting yet thâ—u canst mâ—uâ—t aâ—ovâ— us in the Spirit of Faith and Confidence Answ Vain Boasting we deny but none shall hinder our Glorying in the Lord bâ—t the Day will declare and the Fire will try every man's Work of what sort it is and the Righteous Judge will determine unto whose Judgment alone we desire to stand But what Spirit is it that hath lifted thee up so high seeing thou denyest and opposest the spiritual Light of Christ which is the Door of Entrance to all that find Pasture And the same that said I am the Light said also I am the Door of the Sheep fold John 10. 9. and all that climb up another Way are Thieves and Robbers and so although thou art climbed never so high yet down again must thou come to this else the higher thou mountest the greater will be thy Fall Thou sayest thou believest and therefore speakâ—st infinitely stronger is he that is with you then he that is against you Ans If he that you think is with you be in you as Christ said he would be in his People John 14. 17. by whom they overcame because greater was he that was in them then he that was in the World then you need not fear but he will overcome for you but there is cause to question it when as thou dost not adventure to say so and thy Words afterwards do import that thou dost hardly believe he is to be so known else what dost thou mean when in answer to my witnessing to Christ's being in his People to lead and save them thou say'st Why not Emanuel as well God with us as in us Ans His being in us denies not his being with us as he is known in us he is with us but what is it that renders us so Erroneous and such who by the Consequence of thy words thou accountest God's Enemies whom he will drive back and divide as the Sea and still the Raging thereof Ans The Saints who writ the Scriptures tell us it was Sin while they were in it and wicked Works that made them Enemies of God and it was those who remained in Sin that did oppose them when they departed from it which the Lord overcame both within and without them But thou sayest Thou never expects to be free from Sin whilest in this Tabernacle and that there is none of Christ's Righteousness at all in your Minds but in his own Person then that Hope is vain and will perish which expects to see Christ conquer his Enemies to thy Comfort when thou dost not know him in thee so
as to expect he will conquer his thy Enemy which is Sin for when he is known within so as to reign then his Righteousness is there too for therein doth his Kingdom consist in Righteousness and Peace and Joy in the holy Ghost These things truly considered thou hast Cause to fear that those whom thou accountest God's Enemies he accounts his Friends then Wo will be to those that fight against them for it is not those that cry Lord Lord but they that do the things which he commands whom he accounts his Friends Thou sayest Thou appealest to Christ with what Spirit thou hast preached and writ against the Quakers and I am too low to judge thee and out of my Place and thou caust not preach the Gospel but thou preachest against them Ans I am not to learn the Duty of my Place of thee thou art not so high but that the least Child in the Truth seeth over thee and far beyond thee I am sure thou art out of thy Place First in calling the good Spirit of God by which his People are led The Spirit of Delusion and his true and faithful Ministers Witches Jugglers and what not that is bad enough those whom he hath sent forth in the Power of his Spirit to turn People from Darkness to Light and from the Power of Satan unto God that they may receive Remission of Sin and an Inheritance amongst those that are sanctified through the Revelation of the Son of God in them and this was the Gospel or Power that Paul believed in and which he preached to others and if that Gospel which thou preachest be another then read what follows Gal. 1. 8. And Thousands there are that do witness this Effect through their Ministry and are come to know the Lord to teach them a Teacher that cannot be removed into a Corner and so are not at a Loss as sometimes your Hearers have been when their Teachers have been removed into Corners Thou sayest Thou art not of my Mind that the Sun did rise in the North about twenty Years since and that then began the Day of God when Fox came from thence as I intimate through Grace thou seest the Light of the Gospel the Law that goes forth of Mount Sion Ans As to the time and Place and Messengers I shall not say much though much might be spoken in that particular It is sufficient to me to know the Sun is risen and that by the Light thereof I see my Way when others are groping for the Wall at Noon-day And as to the Knowledge thou hast of the Law that goes forth of Mount-Sion and thy Sight of the Light of the Gospel it may easily bâ— gathered what it is by thy expressing thy self both before and afterwards Thou sayest If I mean a further breaking forth of the Light in thee thou hast known Conversion by the Spirit but I may read in thy Boâ—k that Work is of a different Kiâ—d from that which our Light effecteth Ans I have read thy Book and I do find indeed that Conversion which thou speakest of is of a differâ—nt Kind and Nature frâ—m tâ—at which the Ligâ—t of Christ effecteth now and which the Saints in former Ages witnessed also for the Light deceives none but discovers all things as they are and doth not make them appear as they are not and so long as Sin hath a being in any it reproves for it and the Creature yielding Obedience thereunto Power is received which removeth and taketh it away and saveth from it and so a Temple is prepared for the Lord to dwell and walk in But that Conversion which thou speaks of is consistent with Sins having a Continuance for Term of Life in the best of Saints yet no Condemnation to them because they are in P. 60. 24. Christ thou sayest But thou shouldest have read the next Words after Rom. 8. 1 2. and they would inform thee they were such as walked not after the Flesh but after the Spirit whom the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ had made free from the Law of Sin and Death unto whom there was no Condemnation and such as were in Christ were new Creatures old things being passed away and all things become new And if that be the truest Conversion thou knowest I desire never to partake with thee for that Liberty is perfect Bondage and thou must retract for instead of being come so far as Mount-Sion when thy Eyes are opened thou wilt find thy self in Egypt not come so far as Mount Sinai Thou sayest Thou canst not learn from the Scriptures that the Light in every man is the Voice of Christ Ans That the Scriptures are full to this purpose nothing is more câ—ear Moses often exhorting the Israelites to hearken to the Voice of God and tells them it was not far from them but his Word was in their Mouth and Heart that they might hear and do it And Paul quotes his Words saying that was the Word which he preached to be believed in and that is his Vâ—ice also which speaks in his true Ministers Thou sayest Do not I here proclaim my self to be one of those silly Women which were ever learning And how can you but pity us to see us imbrace a Shadow and let the Substance go Ans It were well for you if you could pity your selves we need none of your Pity we are very sensible what Pity we were like to recâ—ive at your Hands but what is it that makes us such Objects of Pity in your Sight Thou sayest That Fox and Nailor should so bewitch us as to cause us to dance about this Shadow the Light and adore it we know not what to call it but rather then miss we will call it every thing that Christ is called Ans Surely thou art very full against Fox thou hast him up so often with Derision thou hadst much better let him alone for all the Darts thou shoots at him and many others whom thou mentions will but return back and wound thy self but what hath thiâ— thou callest Witchery produced This it seems is an Effect thereof in thy Account my using the Apostle's Words to testifie that many were come to witness the Saints Conditions who said The Son of God is come and haâ—h given us an Vnderstanding to know him that is true And many are in him and do know the Elect Seed born that cannot be deceived Thou askest Is the Light in every Man the Son of God then it is God Eternal and of the same Nature with the Father before it was but his Voice now it is himself sayest thou and afterwards his Light and so thou bidest me see my Inconsistency Ans His Light is his Voice and he speaketh by it and would lead all out of Darkness thereby and those that follow obey it he leadeth unto the Life And my expressing of Christ under several Denominations doth not manifest my Inconsistency but thy terming
it so manifesteth thy own Ignorance in the Wayes and Working of the Spirit of God not understanding that the several Expressions of Christ relate to several States and Conditions that People are in and to know him as in one Manifestation is in order to another and although we believe the Light in every man is the Light of the Son of God and is Eternal yet it cannot be said tâ—at all that are enlightned do hear and know his Voice neither can it be said that all that know his Voice do know the Elect Seed born yâ—t there is no State so high to be attained unto but still his Voice is to be hearkned to and obeyed to be preserved in that State but Christ saith My Sheep hear my Voice and they follow me And he that will be my Disciple let him deny himself and take up his Cross daily and follow me And so it is those and only those that follow him in the denial of self whithersoever he goes that know the inward Washing and Regeneration till the new Birth is brought forth by the Immortal Word which lives and abides forever and this is the Elect Seed which is Heir of God's Kingdom Thou sayest Did not the Son of God come before this Doctrine came out of the North Answ Yes the Apostles were Witnesses of his Power and Coming and all that know he is come now must know it by the Operation of the same Power in them Thou sayest He is come implying there was a time when he was not come what dost thou mean this to be his first or second Coming Answ If thou didst effectually know his first Coming and the End thereof thou neâ—dst not ask me what I mean for then thou wouldst wait for his second according to his Promise which is that I mean John 14. 3. 18. I go to prepare a Place for you I will come again and receive you to my self This he spake unto his Disciples which knew he was come yet he had many things to say unto them which then they could not bear for which Cause it was expedient for them that he should go away that so the Comforter might come the Spirit of Truth in which he would more fully and largely manifest himself to them then before he could do but they were first to know a time of weeping and lamenting and they had a spiritual Travail to go through And then I will see you again and your Hearts shall rejoycâ— and your Joy no man taketh from you John 16. 21 22. Thou sayest Is the Light within the Elect Seed then it must be saved yet it goeth to Hell with many Answ I have told thee before what I understand the Elect Seed to be and the Light also and now how thou canst make such a Blasphemous Conclusion as this to beget a disesteem of the Light which is not fit to be mentioned is very strange to me that the Light goes to Hell with many whenas iâ— ever thou knowest Redemption from Hell the Light must be the Way and Means whereby the Lord doth bring it to pass Thou sayest We Quakers go the same Way with the Pharisees and thou knowest Christ is the Way believing in him and the Spirit can make this Way easie and short and the Work of the Law upon thy Conscience hath compâ—lled thâ—e to this Way Answ The Spirit doth make the Way easie to all that obey it and are led thereby in the Way of Holiness in which the Unclean cannot walk and it gives Ease and Satisfaction to that Seed which hungers and thirsteth that Righteousness may be exalted which hath long been oppressed under the Egyptian Bondage of Sin God hath heard the Sighs and the Groanings thereof and is come down to deliver from under that heavy Yoke Glory to his Name forever but there is no Ease to the Rebellious Nature which is in Enmity against God that is still to be yoked till it be cut off and rooted out Branch and Root So what Way soever thou hast found out short of this it will end in Sorrow and Disappointment Thou sayest Following the Dâ—ctates of Nature is not the Yoke of Christ for it leads to the Covenant of Works which is a heavy Yoke to work for Life and you are under it sayest thou Answ I know the Dictates of Nature is not the Yoke of Christ but that which teacheth to be meek and low in Heart and gives Rest to the Soul is and that yokes the first Nature which can dictate no good thing and brings to paâ—take of the divine Nature and it doth not lead to the old Covenant to work for Life but to the new where the Lord doth not only command but gives Power to fulfil what he commands which is the great Benefit in the new Covenant for he never intended by making a new Covenant to make void his holy righteous Law as to his People but brings it nearer then before and writes it in their Hearts and puts his Spirit in their inward Parts and I will cause you to walk in my Statutes and ye shall keep my Judgments and do them Ezek. 36. 27. And so those that are led by his Spirit are not under the Law for they are led out of all those things which the Law was added because of those who are meek temperate and gentle against such there is no Law Gal. 5. 18 23. And although the same Work may be wrought which the Saints work yet not being led thereunto by the Spiriâ— of the Lord they are not accepted of and Christ did not find fault with the Pharisees foâ— their outward Holines but because they were not inwardly so too and for omitting the great and weighty matters of the Law These things saith he you ought to have done and not to have left the other undâ—ne and they did it in their own Strength not submitting to the Leadings of his Spirit this Paul law to be their State after he knew the Son of God revealed in himself they being ignorant of Christ who is God's Righteousness went about to estabâ—ish their own and did not submit unto the Righteousness of God So he goes on and tells where he was to be found Say not in thy Heart who shall ascend or descend to fetch Christ but the Word is nigh in thy Heart and Mouth that thou mayâ—st â—ear and do it and that was the word which they preached to be believed in Rom. 10. 8. and so he doth clearly distinguish between the Righteousness and Works which is accepted and that which is not as in Ephes 2. 9. By Grace you are saved not of Works lest any man should boast here he excludeth man's works for we are his Workmaâ—shâ—p created in Christ Jesus unto good Works which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them So here he includeth the Works wrought by and in the Spirit of Christ Now thou wanting the Key of Knowledge that which openeth the Understanding to know the