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A63893 Choice experiences of the kind dealings of God before, in, and after conversion laid down in six general heads : together with some brief observations upon the same : whereunto is added a description of true experience / by J. Turner. Turner, J. (Jane) 1653 (1653) Wing T3294; ESTC R27571 50,831 242

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for my own particular I must needs say though I am still but weak yet through mercy my gain by those things is so great that I would not be without it though I desire not to purchase any more at that rate Thirdly In relation to others that through their experience they might be the more able to forewarn others who may meet with the like temptations for certainly had the Saints in those daies had that experience of Satans workings in that nature which now they have and had the Mouth of truth been so open against it as it is at this day it would doubtless have prevented much and therefore by the way I must needs say I am perswaded it will be a great aggravation of sin for any to be taken or held by those things when there is so much means to avoid them as through the mercy of God there is in these daies almost in every place Now the Lord having these and other such like ends in permitting those things I desire that my self with others who have experienced them in any measure may be carefull to answer those ends for doubtless if our deliverance be of God and that we are cleerly brought off from those confusions we shall answer all those ends of God in some measure In the next place as to the way and means by which the Lord hath been pleased to recover his people from these things I shall say little because I believe it hath been various some by one means some by another as they were in various Conditions for my own particular I have declared at large how it was with me only these General heads I shall again remind First I was brought into great straits and much confusion in Judgement Secondly the Lord was pleased to withdraw his presence from me Thirdly Being sensible of that confusion and want of communion with God I was put upon enquiry into my own heart what might be the reasons of it Fourthly It pleased the Lord to make me willing to be informed and to examine things by the Scriptures Fifthly he was pleased to draw forth my heart with much earnestness to seek to him by prayer which through great mercy was largely answered And thus I doubt not but by what I have written it will appear that I have not without good grounds both from Scripture and experience Judged those things to be the greated mystery of iniquity and the most dangerous and worst of all errors And here I cannot but mind something further as to the continuation of those things which is as they are the worst of all others so their time is short for according to my most serious observation wherever they come and where they continue longest their rise reign and ruin is all accomplished in a few years for in a short time generally persons have been so confounded that they have either come to see themselves deluded and so have turned from them or else they have run to absolute Atheism and so ended there I shall now only answer one objection as to my own experience and so end this discourse Some have said that I cannot judge of these things by experience because according to what I have declared I never had but little experience of them but only in three or four things and those I could never fully come up to neither in Judgement nor practise neither could I leave these outward things which all must leave before they can see the glory of the inward And those that have not put themselves on such things but were led to them by the Father have and do see that glory This Objection hath specious words but weighed in the ballance of the Sanctuary will be found lighter than vanity with the rest of the like nature which I hope is already made manifest only I shall add a few words by way of Answer First for my Experience as to my self in particular I confess through the mercy of God it was far short of that which many precious ones in those daies fell into yet I can truly say it was so much as did cleerly discover to me the nature and tendency of them all to be so vile that I I do not know any thing that ever I did since I knew God that I can own with more shame to my self than those things Secondly for my experience as to others I have seen and known that sufficiently to satisfy me that there is no such glory in them but a meer delusion but I desire to judge by experience no otherwise than as it hath relation to the holy Scriptures for though I do very highly esteem of Christian experience as to the operations and effects of truth in the soul as indeed it is the very life of Christianity yet as to rule I value one word of Scripture more than all experience and I am sure the Scriptures will not own them which are the rule and touch-stone by which I desire to try and judge all things For that which the Scripture sets up they throw down and that which the Scripture forbids they set up for instance the Scripture exalts the Lord Jesus Christ in all his Actions Offices and Ordinances they set up somthing else in opposition to this calling it fleshly carnal and outward things and for the fathers leading persons to them which words carry indeed a seeming shew of excellency but it s a meer delusion There is no such thing for the Father and Christ are one and what was appointed by Christ was appointed by the Father John 10. 3. 14. 24. and he doth not lead from his own appointments but those that continue in them he will love and he will send his Spirit to them which shall abide with them for ever Joh. 14. 16. and the Father and Christ will come to them and make their abode with them verse 23. I having already written that which may more fully answer this objection shall say no more but desire that all the Lords people may be delivered and kept from such deceivings The sixt Note of Experience in relation to Qualifications the habits of Grace or fruits of the Spirit how and by what means I have and do daily find an increase or decrease in those things TO make way for me to lay down my thoughts as to gracious qualifications I shall first consider the severall kinds of qualifications which I conceive may be three 1. Moral 2. Legal 3. Gospel By Moral I mean such as are from Moral dictates meerly from nature Civility breeding or education By Legal I mean such as are from legal dictates meerly from fear of wrath without any cleer apprehensions of the free grace of God in the Gospel But here I desire to be very tender judging that it is possible there may be some seeds of the Gospell sowen in such hearts by which those qualifications may be wrought though as yet it may not appear neither to themselves nor others that they have received