help of Scriptures or Christian Churches or teachers what need the Apostles to have been sent forth into all the world and that with so great effusion of blood to publish that which was known before or might have been known without their help That were to make our Lord needlesly profuse of his servants blood And what need was there that they must stay in Hierusalem till they were endowed with power of working miracles For without doing some miraculous works the people were not bound to believe the Apostles for so our Lord said If I had not done the works amongst them which no other man did they had not sinned but now their sin remaineth John 15.22.24 Moreover St. Paul saith How shall we escape if we neglect the doctrine of so great salvation confirmed by so many miracles signes and wonders Heb. 2.3.4 And therefore doubtless the mysterie of Christian Religion is not instamped in the Law of nature For then it might have been known without such a conflux of miracles to have witnessed it to us How can they believe without a Preacher saith St. Paul Rom. 10.14 that is they cannot The natural man cannot understand the things that be of God The Wise men of the East notwithstanding their great talents of natural wisdome and knowledge must come to Christ the Eunuch must hear Philip Cornelius must send for Peter without which no light was able to inform them in all things needful to Salvation And therefore for any to pretend to know by the light that is in every man and that by it alone without any Scriptures or books churches teachers or tutors to know every thing needful for his salvation doubtless its a great errour and such an one as upon which many others do depend as namely it forceth them off from Christianity yea and to leave off all the ordinances of Christs Church both Sacraments Lords daies yea all daies dedicated by the Church to the service of our Lord the which Quakers now do and indeed to center in very Gentilisme not observing in Christianity any more but what the law of nature teacheth onely I do not say that Christ cannot teach without Scriptures Churches Preachers c. For he who is God blessed for ever can do all things and with him nothing is impossible He can make bread of Stones and Fish of Serpents for his children He could cure Naaman without washing seven times in Jordan and save also people without Scriptures Churches Teachers or Sacraments but for us to trust and that contrary to his revealed divine wisdome directing is a most unpardonable presumption And yet to these streits do the principles of Quakers drive them upon But this is a sad condition that poor deluded souls are in and therefore O my friends stand pause and consider your danger Scripture saith that Heresie proceeds from worse to worse 2. Tim. 3.13 Heresie is a dart that strikes through the liver whereby the soule like the poore bird hasteth to the Snare knoweth not that it is for her life But her house saith that Text is the way to hell going down to the Chambers of death Prov. 7.23.27 Such deluded Souls forsake the Church the guid of their youth and forget the Covenant of their God Their house inclineth unto death and their pathes unto the dead None that go unto her returne again neither take they hold of the pathes of life Prov. 2. These passages the Ancient Fathers as Vincentius Lyrinensis in his Golden rule saith are principally meant of Hereticks deluding poor souls but your boldness saith the Fathers have erred and James Naylour even to me said that the spirit which searcheth all things even the deep things of God hath revealed unto him and many more that which Teachers and their Churches Parents and Tutours were all Ignorant of though they had the Scriptures said he often talked over This is according to their principle that the Spirit instructed them and that without Scriptures Churches Teachers or Christian Tutours I answer This assertion is so audaciously bold that it cannot be paralleld by any Hereticks But this I pray these men to think upon that their boasting of the Spirit is the very way of the worst of Hereticks and if they can demonstratively make it appeare that their spirit upon which for infallibility they so much boast of is any better then the very worst spirit of all Hereticks that ever was in the world both I and many others will be of their Religion But alas my Friends I know you cannot do this you can do nothing but condemne the Church and Fathers and boast of your particular spirit and so did all Hereticks Consider moreover our Lord did not make promise of sending the Holy Ghost to any particular men which were averse from the Church but to the Church in general for them to decree to bind and loose when they were gathered together He said he would be with them and that to the end of the world and what they did on earth the same he would confirme in heaven Particular men Sons of the Church had his spirit for particular ends profitable for people in their condition namely to hear and obey their guides and superiours Obey those whome God hath set over you saith the Scriptures and submit your selves for they watch for your souls as they that must give account thereof Hebr. 13 17. It is true that in the Apostles daies several members had several gifts but ever by one and the same spirit and that for the good of the Church And in this kinde the spirits of the Prophets were subject to the Prophets that so there might be no Schisme in the Body or Church 1. Cor. 12. To this end though St. Paul were taught his Gospel of God and not of man and had an extraordinary calling from Christ himself yet as he saith he was sent to Jerusalem by revelation to conferr the same Gospel which he had preached with the Elders which were the Apostles before him least sad he I had runne or should runne in vaine Galat. 2.1.2 Behold the Humility of St. Paul But you will say in Elihu's words that Inspiration of the Almighty giveth understanding and great men are not alwaies wise men neither do the aged alwaies understand Judgement Job 32. I answer Jobs Freinds as confident as they were of a right spirit were deceived For God Almighty saith that they had not spoken right as his servant Job had done And therefore said God Take a Sacrifice and go to my servant Job and let him pray for you for him will I accept least I deale with you after your folly Job 42. This is a good sample for Sectaries that without they be reconciled to the Church and the Church pray for them notwithstanding their Confidence in the spirit God will deale with them after their folly ver 8. And therefore my Freinds be wise Good men have been deceived and why may not you Be serious in your thoughts
A REVIEW Of that which RICHARD HUBBER THORN Did affirme to the KING AS The chief Principle of the QVAKERS Whereby it doth appear that HUBBERTHORN did not declare fully the Quakers Principle WRITTEN In a friendly way to undeceive the QUAKERS if possible and to prevent others from falling into their errors LONDON Printed by I. C. 1661. My Friend YOu and I having had some speech about that place John 1.9 That Christ is the light that lighteneth every one that comes into the world Which in the conference betwixt the King and Hubberthorne is termed your principle viz. that every man in the world hath within himself a sufficient light and that without Scriptures to instruct and guide him in all things appertaining unto God for his salvation if the fault be not in himself And this you conclude from that saying He is the light that lighteneth every one that comes into the world John 1.9 Although that Hubberthorne declared not that principle in these very words to the King yet others of your way do affirme that the light which is in every man is of it self without Scriptures Churches Fatheres Teachers or Tutors from Christian parents or others a sufficient guide to salvation This assertion you would not deny After thoughts upon this our Conference made me write these lines which I Pray you seriously consider This I affirme that Iesus Christ the second person in the blessed Trinity consists of two natures that of the Deity that of the Humanity The Deity is from Eternity but so is not the Humanity This place in St. John speakes of Christs Deity as he was God from all eternity he inlighteneth every one that comes into the world But this faith James Nayler denieth crying out that in so saying thou dividest Christ thereby plunging himself into a condemned heresie viz. that our Lord consisted not of two natures but for some help to our understanding you may be pleased to consider that Eusebius in his third book of his Ecclesiastical History Chapter 21. speaking there upon what occasion the Foure Gospels were written saith that John preached but writ nothing till by intreaty he was moved Now other Authors write more plainly who moved him and upon what occasion namely for that Ebion and Cerinthus two Arch-heriticks did then deny and oppose the Deity of Jesus Christ the Bishops in Asia desired St. John to write his Gospel in opposition of them Hereticks which he then did and began his Gospel as you see In the begining was the word and the word was God c. This in Eusebius is very remarkable for saith he He wrote nothing till he was moved and then omitted the Genealogie of Christ amply laid down by Matthew and Luke and begins his Gospel with the Divinity of Christ which is thus In the begining was the word and the word was with God and the word was God and all things were made by him and without him nothing was made that was made Marke I pray you how manifestly plain this is spoke of the Deity of Jesus Moreover St. John goes on upon the same Subject ver 4 In him was life and the life was the light of men Now that was the true light St. John saith that lighteneth every one that comes into the world ver 9. A like speech St. Paul hath Heb. 1.2 By him saith the Apostle he made the worlds speaking there of more then one namely worlds visible and invisible The meaning there is explained in another place Coloss 1.17.18 By him all things were created that are in Heaven or that are in earth visible and invisible whether they be Thrones or Dominions or principalities or powers all things were created by him and for him and that he was before all things and by him all things consist This must be meant of the deity only for the humanity was not then in being till many hundreds yea some thousands of years after the Creation Moreover Christ is called the wisdome of God 1 Cor. 1.24 and so he is to be with God from everlasting before ever the earth was laid and when the earth was laid then was I saith that Text. I what I Christ Jesus termed Prov. 8. and 1 Cor 1. called the wisdome of the Father I was with him as one brought up with him and I was dayly his delight Yea he was with him in the Creation and by him man was made for there was nothing made without him He inspired into man the breath of life and man been me a living soul Gen 2.17 This spirit or breath of God made the soul immortal and in this is a Candle or Lamp planted which is called the candle of the Lord which gives light to all our actions and thoughts searching even to the inmost parts of the belly Prov. 20.27 And this is no other but the conscience in which is written the natural or moral Law Rom. 2. which inlighteneth the conscience which accordingly doth now either accuse or excuse and in the Judgement day shall with God acquit or condemn And this is the light or candle of the Lord in Scripture so called that lighteneth every one that comes into the world But this light alone without Moses and the Prophets declared not nor instructed men in the Ordinances Statutes and Judgements of Moses Law neither doth it without the Scriptures of the new Testament the Apostles and Successors teach the doctrine of Christianity This light alone instructs not men in the doctrine either in the Old or New Testament any further then they are the same with the Law of nature For the Statutes and Judgements which by Moses were made known to Israel were not shewed to any other Nation but to them alone Psal 147. ver 20. And as for the doctrine of Christ no natural light informs men of it For who can by nature without Scriptures Church Fathers Teachers or Tutors by Christian parents or others come to believe in him that was Crucified at Jerusalem as in the true eternal Almighty God and Saviour of the world yea or to beleive any particular point of Christian doctrine that is not radicated and rooted in the Law of nature The boldness of this assertion is a wonderment to men O Lord how doth Heresie bewitch and brazen mens foreheads Doth not common experience state them in their faces and tell them that let their pretence be what it will there 's not one Quaker that could talk conferr or dispute so as they do but that they have been first tutored among Christians Scriptures or books yea and Christians have been the Sampsons Heifers to help these Philistines For alas without the help of Scriptures they could no more speak of the mysteries of Moses law and Christs Gospel then the Philistians could of Sampsons Riddle without the help of his wife And therefore my friends blush with a holy shame for this bold assertion and repent If the doctrine and mysteries of Christian Religion could have been known without
for your Souls lye at the Stake Be advised by the Prophet Jeremy who saith Thus saith the Lord Stand in the wayes and see and ask for the old paths where is the good way and walke therein and ye shall finde rest to your Souls Jerem. 6.16 This is the language of holy Scriptures God bids Israel to aske of the Antient daies that were before them Deut. 4. and appointeth the Fathers to declare unto the Children the use of Ancient monuments Jos 4. and of Ceremonies Exod. 12. And Gideon professeth his beleife of the Miracles which his Fathers had told him Judges 6. and the Psalmist saith we have heard with our eares O God our Fathers have told us Psalm 44. and again I have considred the dayes of old and the years of Ancient times Psalm 77. and Moses bids us remember the daies of old and the years of many Generations Aske the Fathers saith he and they shall shew thee the Elders and they will teach thee Deut. 33. O my Freinds this was the way of Gods people both in the old and new Testament See an example of this in the Song of Solomon Tell me O thou fairest among women whom my soul loveth where thou feedest If thou knowest not saith the Spouse go thy way forth by the foot-steps of the flocks and feed thy kids by the Shepheards Tents Canticles 1.7.8 Ayasworth cites the Rabbies exposition of this place who say The Congregation which is like to a fair Virgin and whom my soul loveth saith God let her walk in the waies of just men and order her waies by the mouth of her Governors not by her private conception let her lead her posterity learn her Children which are like unto kids of the Goates to go unto the Synagogues and the Schooles Thus speak the Scriptures and Antient Interpreters farre differing from your way The Apostle bids us keep the customs of the Church 1. Cor. 11.16 Also that we hold fast the Traditions which we have learned whether by word or by Epistle 2. Thess 2.15 Also our Lord bids us hear the Church and obey the Church and he that will not is to be accounted as a Heathen and a Publican Matth. 18.17 Answerable is that in 2. Thess 3.14 If any man obey not our word saith the Apostle note that man and have no company with him Again Obey those that have the rule over you for they watch for your souls and must give an account for them that they may do it with joy and not with griefe for that is unprofitable for you Hebr. 13.17 Marke that for the greiving your Pastours now will be grevious to you in the judgement day But by your doctrine you acknowledge not for your souls neither rulers teachers nor guids but only the light within you for which you alledge Jsa 30.20 Thy teachers shall not be removed into a corner any more but thy eyes shall see thy Teachers But according to your doctrine this light viz. your teacher in every man less or more was never in any other corner then where he is now Besides all this the old Testament sheweth that if any controversies did arise for resolution the Jewes were to go to the Preists of the Levitical tribe Deut. 17. but according to your doctrine neither they nor you ought to go either to ruler Preist or teacher for that 's within you a light that lighteneth every man borne of a woman which light was never in any other corner then in that which it is in now O my Freinds we count many of you honest men and rational men and wonder at your Stupid senselesness O Lord what hath bewitched you Some foregoing sins certainly hath provoked the Almighty so that he hath permitted an evill spirit to delude you Consider your by-past lives with trembling Many of your leaders before they were Quakers were in Armes against the King and the Church thereby to get a liberty to serve God without trouble in the Flesh and by consequence to make void the Cross of Christ O this was a deadly Sin you fought against your Soveraign to gain a liberty to the flesh Also many of you have renounced the Baptisme that you had received in the name of the Blessed Trinity into the saith of Christs Church O this was a deadly Sin by which in a manner you did put your selves out of Gods Protection and so became active Instruments to the Devill for rebellion or heresy I do not say all have thus done but I saysome and perhaps others by a loose and evill life made some gradual Stepts into or towards this way But you will object and I have heard it objected that you are now become what you now be of better lives then ever you were before O my Freinds let not a good life in Schisme or heresie delude you for by the seeming good lives of Hereticks the Devil hath ever promoted his Kingdome So Corah and his complices were of seeming good lives and notable Oratours for which they compared themselves with Moses and Aaron Numbers the 16. The Israelites thought so also crying out against Moses ye have slain the Lords people said they verse 14. And truly as it was then so it ever was that the Schismaticks that pretend to reforme their mother-Church generally they seem to be of better lives then the Church was of for if this were not so they could have deluded very few But so it ever happens Ministers of Satan transforme themselves into the habits of Angels of light to deceive 2. Cor. 11.13.14.15 And therefore let not this gloss keep you in snares but deliver thy soul as a Roe from the hand of the Hunter and as a bird from the hand of the Fowler Prov. 6.5 you that are opposers of Gods Church if possible recover your selves out of the Snare of the Devil who as yet by him are led Captive at his will 2. Tim. 2.26 Which that you may shall be the earnest prayer of your faithfull Freind T. S. POSTSCRIPT Q. What esteem do you beare to the Scriptures of the old and new Testament A. We account of them the very best of all writings and as they issue forth from their Original Authors they then were the pure wine of God but as they have passed through the hands of many Copies and since them again of many Translators and Printers these Scriptures have in length of time passing through the Antichristian chanel contracted some Rust and are now helped by the Spirit in the saints which is no other but the same spirit by which at first those Scriptures were declared to the world Q. But for that they were declared to several people and that upon several ocasions of what use are they now of to another people and that also in another generation A Of great use if applied by the same spirit to others to the same end for which at first they were given forth then are they profitable for doctrin reproof correction Instruction 2 Tim. 3.16 Q. But are they not also profitable to himself that hath the spirit A. Not for these ends for he needeth them not be having the unction that teacheth him all things 1 Joh. 2.20 Yea the deepe things of God 1. Cor 2.10 And needeth not that any man teach him for he hath the Anointing faith that text that teacheth him all things 1. Joh. 2.27 so that for a particular mans salvation that hath the Anointing the written Scriptures profit him nothing Q. Why then do they preach by Scriptures or in Scriptures phrases this argueth that ye need the help of Scriptures to preach by A. It is for the sake of others who so highly esteeme of Scriptures we are forced to use that they so highly esteem to convince them by and moreover in this we seem weak with the weak that we might save some 1. Cor. 9. and in this kind did Humphry Woulridg as he said condesend to rebaptise a woman not that he regarded baptisme but that the woman had a minde to be dipped he condescended to her weakness that thereby he might bring her out of the water unto the Rock this be mentioneth in his book which he Intitleth The unlimited God Reply This is the very answer that Josiah Carbrane the pretended prophet to John Roberts who made himself God he that writes heard him speak it that they used not Scriptures for their own sakes but for the sakes of others and moreover that they would deale with any men even with their own weapons viz. Scriptures so he spake there were six or seven that fell down before Justice Hubberts Face worshipped this Roberts for a God as the woman worshipped Naylor for a Christ but as Naylor was worshipped and Pillered for his blasphemy so was Roberts and his worshippers sent by Justice Hubbert to the prison in Sr. Joane's But why was it said the woman worshipped James Naylor for a Christ and Roberts by his followers was worshipped for a God why not the Christ and the God but a Christ and a God Ans James Naylors answer was that in whomsoever the light viz. Christ is eminent the same is a Christ or Saviour Obadiah ver 21. Saviours shall come on mount Sion to judge the mount of Esau and in the same sence would Roberts prove himself a God Thus we see how horribly the Scriptures are abused FINIS