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A13774 The true copy of tvvo letters, with their seuerall answeres, contayning the late apostasie of the Earle of Lauall, after his returne from Italy VVherein the principall poynts in controuersie with the papists, are learnedly and fully confuted. By D. Tilenus. Faythfully translated by D.D.S. Tilenus, Daniel, 1563-1633.; Coligny, Guy Paul de, 1555-1586, attributed name.; D. D. S.; Laval, Antoine de, 1550-1631, attributed name. 1605 (1605) STC 24072; ESTC S118417 23,042 42

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great fame and his disgrace shall stand Inrol'd fer euer with a Brittaynes hand D. D. S. The Aduertisement of the Authour to the Christian Reader CVriosity and pleasure are two dangerous diseases and euery one apart is strong ynough to ouercome his patient how much more while being both together they conioyne to assayle him as it were agreeing both by the body and the soule the one ingendring himselfe within the spirit the other within the flesh each of them consuming and destroying the parts that breed it euen as the Worme destroyeth the Apple the Viper her mother They symbolize in many things and as two sister-like twinnes they attyre thēselues with one selfe same habit the definition of the one not much disagreeing frō the nature of the other So that to this end an ancient Father sayd That Adultery was nothing else but a curiosity of an other mans pleasure the one alienating the spirit of the patient from the knowledge of saluation and causing him to take appetite to those things wherof the ignorance is wisdome and the practice damnable maketh him the disciple of the father of lyes subiect to the Prince of darknesse the first inuenter of those mysteries of hell the other changeth his body which ought to be the member of Iesus Christ the temple of the holy Ghost into the member of an harlot and habitation of vncleane spirits both of them be bad very fit to corrupt youth to seduce it to the stewes of Antichrist where there is somewhat to please both those intising humours for what doth more resemble the curiosity of Magicke then the charmes of hallowed Agnus Dei of the Transsubstantiation to the characters of Soccrers then the marks of the beast deciphered in the book of Reuelation A great part of this deuillish Art bewrayeth itselfe by auricular confession imitating the forme of interrogatories registred in the decrees of Buchart Bishop of Wormes As touching the pleasure of the flesh where may a man find the exercise more free the excesse more enormous then within the great Babylon where the bodily lust hath no lesse sway then the spiritual Where haue bin inuented these sacred Canons which do not only with the Council of Toledo permit concubines but also commaund and ordaine the community of wiues with Plato and of goods with the Anabaptists Behold these two rocks which as wel as ambition couetousnes ouerwhelme the faith of many by lamentable shipwrack This is the course wherin lately the Earle of Laual ouerthrew himselfe to the great griefe of those who hoped hee would one day succeede to the piety and vertue of his predecessors but these qualities are gifts personall not hereditary as the name temporall goods After that he had languished a long time in these diseases possessing both his spirit his flesh there was also marked in him diuers symptomes and signes of an euil successe and among other things was perceiued a fact direct cōtrary to that which S. Luke describes for hauing past to change the ayre in Italy a country which is not thoght very good for those persons that be most wholsome and whole he did not refuse all kind of pleasures for his body besides made prouision of mortall receits for his soule buying at a high rate writings like to those which the disciples of the Apostles cast into the fire notwithstāding they were of great value so soone as they did imbrace the christiā faith at Ephesus by which purchase he declared very well to be more disposed to take place in the Temple of the great Diana of the Papists thē to haue preserued that wherwith it pleased God to haue honored him in his true Church who condēneth those detestable curiosities and in the end the Apostem beginning to grow gorge forth the venome contained in these his two letters in which he propoūdeth diuers questions not so much as to receiue light of his doubts wherin such diseases had tane away both his desire vnderstāding but because after a iust refusall of a verbal conferēce made vnto his vniust demaūds being addressed to those who vnderstood that resolutiō which he had already taken he had need thē of some other mask to end the Catastrophe of his Tragedy instead of extreme vnction funerall preparations of his religiō dead in his soule long time before dissembling in the mean time this spiritual death toward these who did their indeuour for his preseruatiō as appeares in matters of estate who cōceale for certaine dayes the death of their great Princes but seeing he could not so wel coūterfet the voyce of Iacob but that the hands of Esau did discouer him neither was he able himself to support any longer the pestilēt smel which his neutrality did breathe forth amōg the liuing the dead betwixt the preaching of the Gospel the Idolatrous masse but that he was forced to discouer his maske And hauing trāsported himselfe to the Couent of the Capucians in Paris he burted solemnly his religion accōpanied with many exorcismes abiurations confessions pentiencies and such ceremonies which did serue him no lesse to his obsequ●es thē did the desperate painting attiRes to Iesabel which she did take in the instāt houre she was to be cast Forth of the window to break her neck They had great desire to adorne the lamentable pompe of the poore young Earle by some pray which they thought to haue caught on our professors and to this effect after the refusall of the verball conference which he demanded the Iesuits had perswaded him to aduise in that same instant vpon the said doubts with diuers persons in diuers places hoping that in diuersity of stile they might incoūter certain differēces of beleeuing in those that should answer but not finding one iust subiect on our part to fal in any such inconuenience but rather to alienate him frō the wickednes of the corrupters of his youth We supposed nothing should diuert vs frō putting to light the obiections made on the one part the answers giuen on the other side to the end that cōFerring the one with the other euery one who hath eyes to see may vnderstād that those which wil not know that which is should imagine to thēselues to see that which they see not which be the two kinds of blindnes wherwith God by his iust iudgement doth punish those that forsake the spirit for the flesh the truth for vanity the light for darknes the Sauiour of the world for the son of perdition neuerthelesse we hope God willing that those who haue not much edified Christs Church by their life shall farre lesse ruine the same by their death seeing that their voluntary separation from our cōmunion doth no other thing then ease vs frō the necessary trouble of cutting thē off frō our society no more then the wind which driueth away the chaffe in the ayre easing thē which in the meane time are about to clense the floore
as from a corrupt instrument I answere that my letter beareth not that it is necessary of right but that this was found wanting in our first pastors this was not any want but to acknowledge the fault to amend it our chiefe perfection consisting to acknowledge to correct our imperfectiōs seing we be neither Anabaptists who acknowledge not the Churche where there is a great notable want in maners neither Papist who maintaineth that their Church cannot erre in the faith an error or rather a receptacle couertour goulf of al the errors of the world which carry away with it not only the feeling of the disease but also the hope of their healing He that furnished to you this point should consider that in throwing it against the Church reformed he might verie well retorqueted against the Romane church in the which we finde the Popes thēselues to haue bene made by instrumēts very corrupt among others the Pope Simmachus was cōfirmed by King Theodorick who was an Arrian leauing to speake of those that were rather monsters then Byshops or men hath giuen the sending or calling to the whole race of their Hierarchie And as cōcerning the feminine Papesse Iane ye haue learned in your voyage that in Rome they holde not the whores there for corrupt instruments by the testimony of Cardinal Bellarmine the magistrates sin not in assignīg to them to haue a quarter within the Cittie for theyr dwelling albeit he knowe perfectly that they would abuse it to an euill purpose The Clergie of the holy citie not being so superstitious as were they of Grece in the time of Theodorus Studites who said that it was a dāgerous thing for the soul of a Frier to haue but one beast of the feminine kinde And to the second point of your Reply I say that wee avowe that there was sacrifices in the time of S. Cyprian that there shall be sacrifices to the consummation of the world But yet that concludes no thing for the Sacrifice of the Masse pretended reall propitiatorie for the liuing and for the dead for their sinnes paines and satisfactions good to coniure stormes to heale diseases to winne Battels to purge the great crimes to draw the soules out of purgatorie to finde things lost c. The word sacrifice is taken sometime for the whole office and diuine seruice Saint Paul saith that he sacrificed the Gospel And he called sacrifice the faith of the faithfull also their prayers to God their almes for the poore their collecting for the Ministerie the offerings that were made to the holie assemblies and from whence they tooke the Euchariste was called Sacrifices this is one of the occasions for the which the name was attributed to the holy Supper The same answere may serue to your last Reply As touching that which I spake of the testimonie of the Fathers whereon you conclude seing that I accept then on the questiōs of fact in matters of their time I ought thē accept the Masse which S. August witnesseth to haue caused to be celebrated in his time I say that the same equiuocation which is in the word of sacrifice is in the word of Messe albeit the vsage of this heere is farre more new in the Christian Church then that was of theirs In diuers Fathers it is not found at all onely but touched in S. Augustine that but in a writtē work which the most learned holdeth to be counterfeit that alwayes in a farre different signification than it is taken for nowe adayes I counsell you to take it into that same sence which S. Augustine doth by the proper confession of of Bellarmine that is Promissione for one dismissing and that you giue one fare well to the Masse which is called in Lattine Missam facere missam Touching that newe question which you make in your letter to wit seeing that the way to saluation hath beene open in all Ages to all those who will apply vnto them the mirrit of the death of our Lord. What doctrine I pray you professed they who were of the choosen number three or foure hundred yeeres since and if I had beene in those dayes in what vessell should I haue cast mee into for comming to the port of saluation I answere that the great Doctor of the Elect in all Ages is the holy Spirit for they are taught of God as witnessed Iesus Christ and all their doctrine in all times is that of the olde and newe Testament which neither Sathan neither his Vicar the Antichrist could euer destroy Of this doctrine God hath alwaies reuealed as much as was necessary for thē to saluatiō whether they did read by themselues or that they vnderstood it by others you haue an notable example in the Historie of S. Barnard who being a little while before the time which you set downe perceiuing the corruptions of his time at the very houre of his death rempted by Sathan he clensed himselfe of that filthinesse confessing that he could not obtaine saluation by his merits which was the doctrine publiquely taught in the Schooles at that time neither pretending it but by grace declaring that our Sauiour possesseth it by a a double right by the inheritage of the Father and by the merit of his Passion and that contenting himselfe with the one he gaue him the other if you desire a more particular clearing of this question see the Book of the Cathologue of the witnesses of the troth and you shall finde that there hath beene no age so darke wherin the troth hath not spread some beames amids the smoakes which arise out of the bottomles pit of Rome And if God had giuen me life in those times I beleeue assuredly that he would haue giuen me the grace either to abstaine from this Papisticall poyson or to vomite it vp in time preseruing me frō this infection as hee preserued his children from the fire of the Babylonian Furnace In briefe I would haue done that which afterwards I did in Spaine and at Rome and that which I wish you had performed in the same place by the example of some of your followers making their prayers and exercises of godlinesse in priuate without defiling themselues with idolatrie which is committed in publique to goe out of this Babylon in heart though they found them as touching the body there engaged The totall summe is to saile in the sea of this world which is visible and materiall is required a ship visible and materiall but to arriue at the hauen of saluation as this port is spirituall in no wise of this world so many enter there without materiall and visible vessell that is without being locally and corporally in any certaine materiall Temple or visible Church And this I maintaine is happened to many during this great and generall reuolt vnder the tyrannie of Antichrist foretold in the Scripture which like a long and furious tempest hath rent and strangely disfigured the ship of the visible Church by the wines and waues of humaine inuentions which haue made many both Pilots and passengers for to loose the Loadstarre of Gods ordinances But suffer mee I pray you Sir to aske you to what port or hauen you pretend to attaine in this ship of neutralitie in which you stay so long in the roade betweene the two barques of Preaching the Masse And if he who iudgeth men such as he findeth them calling you vnexpectly to appeare before his throne finde you thus disposed what sentence would you hope from his mouth I beseech him with al my heart to cause you to thinke vpon it and so to prepare and direct you rather by change of life then Religion In the meane time I rest SIR Your most humble and affectionate Seruitour D. TILENVS FINIS Lib. 9. cap. 5● Dist 3. C. 4. Is qui non habet Caus 12. q. 1. c. dilectissionis Act. 19. 19. 2. Cor. 11. Ephes 4. 7. Heb. 18. 38. Apoc. 12. 14. Math. 2. 13. Bellar. li. 3. cap. 2. de eccl Annal. tom 6. an 484. §. 4. tom 7 an 530. §. 5. 2. Thes 27. Acts. 20. 2● Mat. 13. 25. Sur. tom 1. die 8. Ian. Bar. Tom. 9. Anno. 805. §. 3. 2 Conc. Chal. de Laicis cap. 20. Praef. in lib. de Pontif. 3 Lib. 1. Epist 4. 4 Mark 8. 24. 2. Cor. 4. 5. 5 Orat. 2. in Arrianos 2. Tom. 3. 6. The 21. 9 O art 8. Mat. 28. 6 D●ft 9. C. uoli meis 1 Cor. 13 9. Ephe. 4. 7. Luk. 24. 48. Act. 1. 8 Annal. tom 1. an 34. An. 39. §. 22. Didy de Spirit S. Virgil. cont Sabel c. August ad Dard. De consocrat dist 2. C. ego Bereng Bellar. de Imag. l. 2 cap. 22. Cic 1. Off. Rom. 14. 13. Ioh. 11. 29. Mat. 13. 46. Psa 119 Cal. lib. 4 sect 3. 1 2 3 4 5 1 2 3 1 2 Tom. 5. an 399. s 19. 20. 3 Theodor. lib. 16. 23. 24. 4 Oauph In vita marcil lib. 2. non video q̄uōmodo quolocum hunc altissimūtonent slu●ri possunt I see not how those which hold this high place can be safe Theod. le ior lib. 3. Bell. de a miss in grat statum pro 2. 18. Beron tom 9. Ang. 26. verse 54. Rom. 15. Philips 3. Iohn 6. ver 11. In the life of S. Barnard neere the mids therof