Selected quad for the lemma: spirit_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
spirit_n	excellent_a	find_v	great_a	421	4	2.1545	3	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A62281	The necessity of adhering to the Church of England as by law established, or, The duty of a good Christian, and particularly parents and masters of families under the present toleration by William Saywell ...	Saywell, William, 1643-1701.	1692 (1692)	Wing S801; ESTC R40636	34,235	49

she is a very corrupt part of it and those of that Communion that amongst us set up separate Assemblies do oppose the constant tradition of the Catholick Church the Canons of the generall Councils and follow a private Spirit and are as proper Schismaticks as any of our Fanaticks and Dissenters Obj. But those of the Church of Rome do not only charge us with Disobedience to the Pope but with Heresie and false Doctrine in rejecting many Articles of Faith and other Ancient practices of the Church Answ But if you will consult your Bishops and Ministers they will make it appear that the Points we reject are so far from being Articles of Faith and ancient practices that they are Moddern errours and corruptions not known to or else condemned by the Primitive Church and this we may see evidently made out by severall late Writings and Disputes Obj. I am glad to hear you say the Catholick Church does plainly condemn the Usurpations and Errours of the Church of Rome as well as the Scriptures which seem plainly against them and we think against many Orders of the Church of England also that are meer Humane inventions if not old Popish Superstitions which we cannot Lawfully joyn withall and therefore are forced to serve God in such a Manner as we can and which we think is better pleasing to Him thô in separate Congregations Answ Humane Inventions and Popish Superstitions are frightfull words indeed but so you must remember are Slanderers Schismaticks Hereticks and disobedient to Parents c. as all those are that accuse the Church and cannot prove what they say Obj. But our Preachers have told us that these Orders of the Church are Popish Anti-christian c. and therefore our Consciences would condemn us if we should comply with them Answ But will you run into so great Sins against the plain Word of God because your Preachers tell you so I thought the Word of God had been your Rule but now I perceive you follow your Preachers against the Word of God and will not obey your Governours according to it Obj. We think our Preachers are Good and Holy Men and Teach us the Truth Answ Why should you not have as good an opinion of your Bishops and Ministers But when the Preachers take upon them thus to draw you into Schism Disobedience and teach you to have uncharitable thoughts of your Governours and to condemn the Church and fellow Christians you ought to suspect if not their honesty yet their Judgment and Discretion for they are Men and may be transported by Passion and Interest or else through errour and mistake and lead you into heinous Sins For why should you think them wiser and better then all other Divines Obj. But I hope still they teach us right Answ But it is not enough to say you hope you must be sure the Governours of the Church are in the wrong or else you are in a most miserable condition to run your selves into so many Sins and dangers by separating from them Obj. But my Conscience tells me I am in the right Answ But 't is not your Conscience will excuse you unless you have some Command of God to build upon Now turn your Bible over and over you will not find any thing in the Scripture against any duty required by the Church Obj. But pray where have you any Command of God for your Common-Prayer and Ceremonies Answ We are commanded in Scripture to make Prayers and Supplications for all Men 1 Tim. 2.1 and to see that all things be done Decently and in Order and since the Words and Ceremonies are not determined in Scripture 't is better the Governours should consider and make Rules and Orders then to leave it to every bodies Fancy so that we have command in Scripture for what we do But pray where have you any command of God for your irreverent Prayers and disorder in Gods service Obj. Why do you call our Prayers and Service irreverent and disorderly Answ Because they are so and cannot be generally otherwise for when every Preacher is to follow his own heated and Rambling fancy and every Hearer is lest to Sit or Kneel or Stand or Lye along to put on his Hat or put it off what can commonly be expected but irreverence and disorder Obj. As for these Modes Gestures and Postures which you call Irreverent we matter not them Answ But thô you matter them not yet the Scripture does require all things should be done Decently and in Order 1 Cor. 14.40 and we find that our Saviour and his Apostles did kneel down and shew all outward Reverence and therefore we think the Church of England has good reason to require People to imitate their examples in behaving themselves Reverently and Orderly when they are in the House of God and not let their Service be more rude there then when they are at their houses at home so that nothing is commanded in this kind but what civility and good breeding would teach Men to observe and for which we have the command of God and the example of Christ and his Apostles and other Holy Men. Obj. Perhaps it would be better if People were more Reverent at their Meetings Answ But how can that be expected when all your Prayers and the whole Performance is left to the Arbitrary pleasure and discretion of every Preacher amongst you who are Men and those none of the ablest neither and may err and be ignorant Obj. But we think they Pray by the Spirit Answ What do you mean by Praying by the Spirit do you mean that the Holy Ghost does put all those words immediately into their Mouths and so they use no other Prayers but what are dictated by the Holy Ghost Obj. We do think so and our Preachers keep us up in that belief Answ But how do they prove this For if that be true all their Prayers are as Divine and Infallible as the Word of God it self For the Holy Ghost is as Infallible now as when he did guide the Apostles to write the Holy Scriptures But it is evident to all the World that these Prayers are often so far from being Divine that they sometimes are such as scarce become a sober Man Therefore you may see what Men your Preachers are that abuse you in this manner and cheat you with false stories if your Preachers are dictated by any Spirit 't is generally by the Spirit of delusion for it is not to be thought that the Holy Ghost will work a Miracle at every Conventicle to inspire every dissenting Preacher when ordinary gifts are sufficient not only for such but much more excellent Prayers And any One that will but attend those Meetings and weigh their Prayers with Judgment will find more of the errour and weakness of the Man then of the least evidence of the Holy Spirit Obj. But we have heard other Men Pray and Preach but could never find so much satisfaction and comfort as

we do from these Men. Answ Perhaps their passionate way of speaking their Noise with now and then an affected Sigh and Groan may stir up a present passion in you as a good Actor at a Play does who can make the People cry and laugh when he will I hope therefore you will not say that the Actor is moved by the Spirit and those are all made Godly People that are thus moved and affected as to burst into Tears so that if you Judge of the soundness of your Religion by such outward Passions I fear the Player when he sets about it will make you believe he is the most Sanctified Preacher Setting then aside this which is no argument of the working of the Holy Spirit but an act of the Man and all the efficacy is lost in an hour or Two assoon as you come into Company or are taken up with business and other affairs You must not therefore Judge of your Religion by a sudden passion but by your sound understanding and steady performing all parts of your Duty Obj. But this cannot be a sudden Passion only in me but must be a real work of the Holy Spirit because I find a great change in my Life I am grown more sober read and meditate upon Gods Word and mind Religion more then I did before Answ But that is no Argament that you are in a safe way so long as you continue in Schism for when the Devil did find he could no longer ruine your Soul by open prophaness he now may tempt you to more secret Sins to more Spiritual wickedness which are as heinous in the sight of God and as dangerous to your Salvation Obj. We have satisfied our selves all along upon these accounts Answ But you see they are weak grounds to rely upon for all this while thô you are Zealous for some you may be wanting in many other necessary duties and you are guilty of Schism disobedience to Parents destroy all Discipline and Order in the Church encourage Atheism and Prophaness and endanger the safety both of Church and State meerly upon fancies and humours for I can call it no other because there is not One good thing that you can learn and observe there that you cannot as well have and practice in the communion of the Church Besides you act against the Sense of the Primitive Church and all other Churches in the World Obj. If it be so we are much mistaken and greatly abused by our Ministers Answ It is certainly so and while you follow such blind and erring guides no wonder if you fall into destruction Obj. We have been told by our Preachers and therefore did verily believe that the Ancient Church were Papists and when the Divines of the Church of England did talk to us of following the Doctrine and Government of the Ancient Church we thought it was only with a design to prepare the way to bring us to Popery Answ Now I hope you are satisfied that the Church of England is no wayes inclining to Popery but does endeavour to teach you your Duty according to the Holy Scriptures and further to confirm the Truth and soundness of their interpretation of Gods Word by the Doctrine of the Primitive Church and the generall Councils and tradition of the Catholick Church And this you may see if you read their late Writings they do as heartily maintain against the Church of Rome as they did before against the other Dissenters and Fanaticks Obj. I am very well satisfied now that the Men of the Church of England are far from being Papists but you tell me that all other Reformed Churches do approve of the Church of England and are ready to joyn with her in communion and condemn those for Schismaticks that set up separate Congregations Answ Yes I do so and if you will but advise with your Bishops and Ministers they will easily be able to prove it to your satisfaction You may read much to this purpose in my Evangelical and Catholick unity where you have the opinions of Luther Melancthon Bucer and Calvin in their own words to this purpose Obj. Then therein I perceive our Teachers have greatly abused us also Indeed I find many rational and sober Men of the Church of England and I believe there may be a great deal of Truth in what you say but yet they are of such a persecuting spirit that they will let no body live quietly by them that are not of their perswasion which we think to be a very ill temper not becoming the moderation of the Gospel Answ It is a sad thing that the Church of England which is the most gentle and moderate and does disclaim all cruelty and hard usage upon the account of Religion should now be accounted the greatest Persecutor as I perceive she is at this time People strangely forget themselves and the opinions and practices of their own Party when they lay such an accusation upon the Church of England which does disown any power of temporal punishment Obj. But there were many Statutes that did inflict severe penalties upon Dissenters Answ These are made by the State for the security of the Government for they finding Dissenters generally enemies to the publick Peace and endeavouring changes and alterations by Mutiny and Sedition saw it necessary by Penal Laws to restrain them from growing too numerous and to keep them within the bounds of their duty Obj. But does not the Church of England then allow of Penal Statutes Answ In a moderate way she does to make Men hear and consider but not to undoe them Obj. But surely Men need not to be used like Children they have discretion to mind their duty without being stirred up by punishments Answ They should have so but 't is plain that they have not Rom. 13. and therefore God Almighty has placed Governours and Officers to be a terrour to evil doers and a praise and an honour to them that do well and mind their duty Obj. Yes if punishments were inflicted on evil doers we should like that well but they punish Godly People because they will not go against their Conscience Answ Do you account then all the Idle Lazy people that lye at home and sleep or else sit drinking at Ale-houses in time of Divine Service and will never so much as take pains to understand their Catechism and bring their Children to be instructed in the Grounds of the Christian Religion Godly People Now 't is evident these idle and ignorant People unless they be stirred up by punishment will never give themselves the trouble to understand and do their duty and so will ruine their own and their Childrens Souls Obj. If you did punish only such idle and lazy People that did live like Heathens and require them and their Children to hear and do their duty no sober Man but must approve of such Discipline and will say such People deserve to be punished But you punish Godly People that do read