Papists are our Teachers but art in the Reliques of their worship thy self for which we with the light deny them and thee and your teaching Our 11. Query Whether thou hast seen Gods face And to this thou utters a deal of confusion saying That by the eye of reason thou hast seen God to be infinite incomprehensible and saith none hath seen God and then asks a Query Whether he that hath seen God do abhor himself as Job did and says is it likely that ever those men had the true knowledge of God who exalt themselves as having the Spirit and being perfect men without sin I say Art not thou ashamed of thy folly who would perswade people that having the Spirit and being without sin could keep from seeing God Thou blind sot Can any come to know God but by the Spirit and where wilt thou have this Spirit if not within Can he be any of Christs who hath not his Spirit or can any unclean Rom. 8. 9. thing stand before God or come in his sight But if any witness this Spirit and sanctification by it thy filthy mind calls it pride Blush for shame Did ever any but the Devil minister against having the Spirit or freedom from siu How art thou afraid thy fathers Kingdom should fall Yet being told of this thou calls it railing as thy fore-fathers would be ever in the Devils work but would not be called his Children but would call God their father but hated all that was in his work as thou dost 12. Query Whether you have the same infallible Spirit as the holy men of God had who spoke forth the Scripture And instead of answering plainly thou falls a lying again saying thou hears the croakings of our Papist guides and thou wouldst thrust us in with them because we say the Spirit is infallible and they say that their Church is infallible so that for us to say the Spirit of God is iâ—nfalible is Popery but what Religion is thine who cannot bear it to say the Spirit is infallible Where must the infallibility be in your Church or in the Letter or in you Priests It is likest thou intends the last because you would bind all to believe your meanings but when thou writes again deal plainly and tell us where thou would have it since it must not be in the spirit But to the Answer thou says the Prophets and Apostles were guided infallibly in the manner and matter so that what they writ to the Church was true but thou hast no such infallibility I say if thou had such a Spirit your Pulpits would have more truth and thy Book not so full of lies as it is but wilt thou not call it railing if I tell thee that thou who hast not that Spirit hast the Spirit of the Devil If thou do yet the truth is no less for the Spirit of God is but one and who hath it hath an infallible guide in matter and manner if he keep to it And he that is not guided by this hath the Spirit of Satan and I know that so far as any are led by the Spirit it guides into all truth if it be not erred from But says thou I shall never like such pretenders to the Spirit I know thou dost not for that guide leads out of thy Kingdom Sayest thou All true Christians are certain of their Fundamentals yet with doubting Here thou hast declared thy damned foundation but true Christians know a foundation without doubting and thou falls to comparing us with the Pope and would make us like him I say were it not we cry down his Worship means and authority that remains in you we should not have so much of your malice Are not you his dear Children as like as may be Have you so soon forgot who be got you into your Parsonages and Masterships and Ordained you and your place and form of Worship He is but a young Priest who was not Consecrated by his Cathedral Order though now you see the Bishops your Masters are down with the Magistrates and the people You can talk against them as they did against the Pope their Master when the Kings would own him no longer nor they could not be suffered to proâ—ess his authority in this Nation then they would rather turn than fly and have not you stuck to Episcopal Worship till you see you were like to be turned out and then your wisdom would convince you of your error Is not he blind that sees not you one with the Papist in the main It s not getting into their houses and talking against them that can blind us when we see their foundation-standing and not one thing you do which is as the Apostles or believers did it But either as the Pope and his Councels invented or as you have invented since in your Councels but never came to the Saints form much less to the power For shame be silent in this businesse till you have more hopes of hiding your selves you have lost your old way of stopping preaching and printing and now your slandering your Popery upon other mens backs will but cause all to see you more plainly people are now grown so wise as they begin to know the tree by its fruit your words will not serve your Covering growes thâ—n it must be rent and your refuge of lies are a sweeping away your rowing in your own filth doth but cast dung in your own faces the truth is living and pure and will clear it self and all that abide in it but shame shall cover the wicked And thou calls the Ranters our brethren but they are your brethren and hearers they come not amongst us unlesse it be to oppose as you do there is no more Communion with us and you then light and darknesse will this cover you who have them with you preaching to them and they maintaining you nay it s well known that there is none so bad in the Nation but if he have but any thing to adde to your hire you are for him and he is one of your Church and brotherhood is there either Drunkard Swearer or Whoremonger whatsoever but you will reap his Carnals with or against his will and you will tell him you sow to him spirituals and such is your seed and such fruits comes on it yet thy shamelesse lips will call such our brethren when we have turned from them for these filthinesses and you have received them with it nay some of you boast of such Converts when we have denyed them 13. Qu. What is hells mouth that the wicked go in at And to this thou sayes it sufficeth thee to know that hell is a state of endlesse misery where such as we shall everlastingly bear Gods wrath I say that 's thy desire to know but wert thou not blind thou wouldst know it is for liars slanderers the man of sin and his disciples who plead for his Kingdom 14 Qu. Whether the Bible be the Word of God and Matthew
AN ANSWER TO A BOOK CALLED The Quakers Catechism Put out by RICHARD BAXTER Wherein the Slanderer is searched his Questions Answered and his Deceit discovered whereby the Simple have been deceived And the Popery proved in his own bosom which he would cast upon the Quakers Published for the sake of all who desire to come out of Babylon to the Foundation of the true Prophets and Apostles where Christ Iesus is the Light and Corner Stone where God is building a Habitation of Righteousness and everlasting Peace where the Children of Light do rest Also some Quaeries for the discovering the false Grounds of the literal Priest-hood of these days in the last times of Antichrist If you know the truth the truth shall make you free Iames Nailor London Printed in the Year 1655. AN ANSWER TO A BOOK CALLED The Quakers Catechism To thee Richard Baxter WHo hast bent thy Tongue against the Innocent casting out thy envious slanders against the Lamb who is appeared against the oppression and deceit of all sorts of people who have professed his pure Name in words but have not joyned to his life and Spirit but are joyned to the worldly lovers and stand in your own will and the poor is oppressed by him that is too strong for him and with that proud Spirit art thou joyned pleading its cause against the Lamb who cannot bow to any unrighteousness and against him art thou fighting with the same weapons that ever thy Generation used Canst thou behold and not blush at the lies thou hast mustered up in this book against the truth Is this the end of all thy profession that thou art become a bloody persecuter Is there no difference with thee now between suffering for conscience sake and burning a Thief in the hand thou art he that ever numbered the Lamb amongst transgressors and what are we that thou art set against a poor despised people troden upon every where at your wills and pleasures Will this be for your honor to combine together against a people which by thy own words are so contemptible Is all your proud hye-flovvn spirits joyned against so low a people that any one can trample under-foot It 's easily seen there is something in the bottom of greater price then all that 's visible else why should you gather thus from all Quarters truly this will not be for your peace He against vvhom you are risen will break you to pieces vvhat ever become of our persons and thou vvilt see the day Rich Baxter vvhen thy deeds vvill come to remembrance and thy slanders set in order and thou shalt see to whom thou art an enemy though novv thou be wilfully ignorant of him Were there any jot of his fear left in thee might thou not once look back and see thy vvays to be such as none of Christs Ministers vvere ever found in Dost thou believe that ever thy vvorks must be proved or that thy Kingdom of Sin must come to an end must not thy Covenant of sin be broken though thou intend it for term of life yet remember thy latter end Was not ever the old Persecuters as blinde as thou art till vvrath vvas upon them from Heaven must they accompt for it that do not visit him in Prison and shall such escape as cast in Prison Will it avail thee then to say thou knevv not that it vvas he Is not this sufficient ground for thee to suspect thy vvay seeing none of Christs vvas ever in it before but remember novv thou art warned while thou hast time Though striving for master-hood and vain jangling I abhor yet for the truths sake and the seed that is scattered I cannot be silent but must reprove that lying Spirit that 's gone out into the World and hath got entrance and hath hardened many vvho sometimes vvere somewhat tender but novv hath he brought them forth against the Lamb to battle and he hath none like these for his design being finely covered with words but their Works finde them out Blessed be God for ever In vvhat thou vvrites to the Reader in thy Book thou says thou says thou supposes he vvill marvel thou troubles thy self vvith so vvilde a Generation as the people called Quakers are or that thou writes these fevv hasty lines on such an occasion but thou saist thou vvilt tell the cause vvhich is that they have sent to thee five several Papers one of them vvith these Quaeries vvhich thou Ansvvers and others of them almost nothing but a bundle of filthy railing vvords as Serpent Liar Deceiver Childe of the Devil cursed Hypocrite dumb Dog I say every rational man may well marvel that these words should be so hastily by thee called filthy railing words who professes thy self a Minister of Jesus Christ and the Scripture thy rule seeing there is not one of these words but by the spirit of Jesus Christ they have been used to such who are in that nature to whom they belong and the same Spirit can do no other but use the same words without respect of persons where ever any is found in that practice Hadst thou said we had been railers the sin had not been so great but to say those words given forth by the holy Ghost as is plain in Scripture are filthy railing words here thou calls the Spirit filthy and unclean but if thou read Mark 3. 29 30. there thou mayest read thy blasphemy and what generation thou art of and what shall befal thee Dost thou profess thy self a Minister of Christ and says the Scriptures are the word and calls the Language of them filthy railing words That â—hese words belong to thee and that thou art in the same Generation against whom they were spoken I shall manifest it from thine own mouth and bring thine own Book to witness against thee and leave them to any honest heart who shall read them both to judge if thou be not found in the same practice and so guilty of the same reproof I tell thee the Scribes and Pharisees and false Prophets might have had more shew to have spoken thus of these words then thou hast for they had no Scripture that had them in but thou professes that Scripture which declares of the words from whom they were spoken and to what sort of people and art found in their works and of such Christ himself was judged to be besides himself and we are called a wilde Generation So the servant is no better then his Lord and the Scripture is fulfilled Thou saist further They chose a day to come into your assembly and fell a questioning the Preacher thine assistant and because he avoided disputing with them and fled therefore they called him the hireling that fleeth and so confessed themselves to be Wolves I say that you are hirelings is plain by your practice and thou confesses he avoided to dispute with thâ—m and fled and was not this true but though the hireling did flee doth this prove them Wolves or did they then
had no Religion inclines to them I say therefore one day shall those whom you have most setled in your deceit have most cause to curse you when they shall see them come from far and sit down in the Kingdom and themselves cast out Saist thou I had far rather they had continued Separatists and Anabaptists then turn Quakers therefore wouldst do all thou canst to hinder I say thy Generation of Priests was ever haters of the greatest appearance of truth and that we can witness When we were of those Churches we were hated by you when we walked as near as we could to the Letter though the life we knew not but now you have ceased your envy against all them and against the Life and Light of Christ in us is your greatest envy And saist thou It s better to stop them where there 's some hope of Salvation then let them run to perdition I say thou hast undertaken two ways to stop us one is with lies and slanders which thy Book is full of and another way taken with thee and thy Generation is to get us stopt into Dungeons and Prisons and strait watch set that none come to us nor that we may have liberty to write nor speak to any But the latter of these is holden by you for the better weapon yet both to no purpose further then to prove our patience and obedience in Jesus and yourselves of your Father and in his works acting that by them ye may be known and we also But says thou I chose rather to tell the world of these passages between us then leave them to their reports especially hearing how they increase in London and other parts and that the ignorant have need of some plain information to prevent their Apostacy and Perdition in this temptation I say they are ignorant indeed that needs thy information and what thou tellest is most suitable to the world to be believed for all who owns that light that leads out of the world or where that eyâ— is open that leads out of the world thy false information is judged and prevented thy perdition and thy temptation and with that Light that sees thee and thy deceit shall we grow both in London and other parts and thy refuge of lies be swept away AS to thy Paper to the Separatists and Anabaptists as thou calls them I desire not to be busie in other mens matters onely this whereas thou casts it on the separated people to be nurseries of impiety and Infidels I say thou dost but here manifest thy shameless Spirit who matters not what thou sayest of others so thou may but seek thy own praise for all that know any thing of the fear of God knows that most of those people have separated from you parish Teachers upon this very account to wit your infidelity and impiety and if any amongst them turn so grosly filthy that they cannot keep them amongst them left it should shame their Religion yet these return to you who forthwith receive them and boast of them as rare Converts nay none so bad in their conversation but if they have but either Pig or Goose or ought to be got towards hire they are yours and you are their masters such as no one Sort of people in the Nation will joyn with but onely you Parish Teachers But it seems thou hast lost some of thine also as well as the Anabaptists and thou prints a Letter thou saist thou sent to one of them to reclaim him under pretence that he desired thy thoughts of us and thy evil thoughts thou returns him in this Letter And thou says He was a yong and unsetled one yet tells how much pains he had taken in duty how much zeal he had professed for God And that he by so great a work of grace was converted from prophaneness c. and thus with thine own shame thou goes about to cover thee having boasted afore as though none followed us but separated people or such as had no Religion or ever was accounted so to be And thou goes on to shew him that he must needs be fallen from grace because he is fallen from your Ministry and thy Arguments are such as these Are not we those Ministers and in those Ordinances you despised before Conversion I say The greatest Papist in the world having begot a Proselyte if he turn away from him may as well use that Argument as thou if falling from any such form or person be the error but thou should have first proved thy self a Minister of Christ in thy life and thy worship as he appointed it and not changed in matter or manner then hadst thou said somewhat to the purpose else it s no error to deny the hireling and his false worship and turn to the light of Christ by it to be guided by all deceits And says thou Alass that ever a man in his wits should no better know the work of Christ from Satans nor know that it is the Dragon whose warfare these men do manage I say Thou shameless one dost thou cause the servants of the living God to be hailed to prison and suffer them almost to be murthered before thy face not at all resisting but the people by thee stirred up to the thing and for no other thing but coming to declare to thy face against thy false worship which God ever sent his servants to do And faist thou We manage the war of the Dragon and do the work of Satan Is not the war of the Dragon to devour the Lamb where he is manifest which ever was the work the hirelings was found in and is it not the Devil that casts into Prison the innocent Rev. 2. 9 10. and was ever any under the Gospel found in that work but such who was of the synagogue of Satan though they called themselves Jews as you call your selves Christians but in the same nature and deeds And do we manage the Dragons war who suffer all this at your hands and much more prove that in Scriptures or be ashamed of thy false accusation and take it to thy self till thy rage cease and thou give over devouring the Lambs Such never take pains with mens souls who takes care and lays snares to destroy their bodies Christs sheep was never such wolves by their fruits we know them they who believe these to be Christs Ministers may soon believe the Devil is God as thou saist who would be worshipped and obeyed in you Thou further goes on and tells him whence this error comes even from Hellish pride and to prove this thou tells him Where we have spent one hour thou hast spent an hundred in study and meditation and prays to God for his Spirit of truth and grace and that thy Prayers is as earnest as ours and thy life is much more holy and heavenly then ours and therefore God is as it were more ingaged to thee to make known his truth to thee then to us and is not
this apparent pride for us to be so confident that we are wise and beloved in the eyes of God and that we run about with the shels on our head c. in comparison of thee I say the hellish pride thou hast plainly discovered where it is But whose righteousness is all this by which thou hast thus ingaged God to thee who art but yet praying for the Spirit of truth and grace will God be ingaged with thy graceless lying spirit which thou uses in this thy Book wherein thou utters so many graceless untruths to ingage the world to thee thou art mistaken God will not be so ingaged nor with that Spirit he will be served with his own Thy earnest prayers and righteousness before the Spirit of truth and grace and without it how they ingage God thou mayest read in 1 Kings 18. from the 16. to the 30. and Luke 18. 11 12. and there thou may read thy boasting lines and their acceptance and thy ingagements and thy name We know God freely gives a measure of his Spirit to every one of us freely to profit withal and improving that to his praise we receive more freely and we are so far from ingagement of God by all we do that we finde our selves unprofitable servants but this thou knowest not with thy vaâ—n light words who tells of our running away with the shell on our head Our head thou knows not who must break thee to pieces with all thy light boasting vain words Thou tells of Paul forewarning Timothy to ordain none who was a novice lest he should be lifted up with pride and so fall into the condemnation of the Devil then thou mayest take this back aâ—ain and apply it and therein read thy self and thy end in whom the pride is sound and not in the Quakers and they are blinde who cannot see it And thoâ— saist Pride is the master sin of the Quakers and thou proves it because that we go in a poor garb and cry our-against pride as if we were sent from Heaven to perswade men to wear no lace cuffs or points and to damn so many Ministers for being called Master But saist thou spiritual pride is the most killing and so goes on railing against us for these things calling that spirit in scorn An excellent Spirit that can trample on all worldly glory I say Blasphemer thou shalt know when thou hast finished thy rage that thou hast spoken against the holy Spirit of God sent from Heaven which both in Christ and his Apostles did perswade against and condemn such things which thou by the spirit of the Devil would uphold and dost plead for and thou sets down four particulars wherein thou wilt prove our language of Hell and the Devil speaking by our mouthes and the first is They affirm themselves perfect without sin and this thou saist is unpossible and they are mad that believe it I say That we affirm self-perfection is but thy lying slander or that we say we are Christ or God as thou saist we do but that we witness perfection from sin so far as we have received Christ we own it as Gods commands and guift the end of Christs coming and of giving forth his Ministery as these Scriptures may witness Matth. 5. 48. James 1. 17. 1 John 3. 8. Eph. 4. 11 12. 13. And that it was the work of the Ministery whereunto they labored read Col. 1. 28 29. and thou that Ministers against this and calls it the Language of Hell and the Devils mouth which the Scriptures witness art a Blasphemer and a Minister of Antichrist and it s no railing to judge the tree by its fruit and when thou hast done Thou saist the Devil himself hath less pride then to think himself perfect without sin and if we have no sin what need we pray or what need have we of the blood of Christ I say Thy confusion is manifest who before accused us that the Devil spake this in our mouthes and now thou art clearing him of it but what hast thou to do or he either with perfection who art out of Christ and in your own wills worldly-pleasing and envious murtherers in rage what perfection is there unless perfect wickedness neither doth perfection exclude praying and the blood of Christ for in his blood and prayer it is wrought and we kept Thy second thing is That we set up our selves above all the people of God on earth that we vilifie the most holy and eminent servants of God and condemn all the Churches of the World To which I shall say no more but this That these are three of thy lies rancked up together lest thou should fail Thy third thing is That we damn all the people of God for 1600. years at least I say This may well be matter of offence to thee to deny all thy Generation since the Popâ— to this day therefore thou call'st it unmatchable pride but â—or those whom you have tortured martyred and burned whipt and imprisoned to this day who suffered for conscience sake followâ—ng the Lamb in their measure them we own and with them we suffer though thou say God had never such a people on earth of these mens ways yet was this the Church of Christ whereof he was the head and is the head and there it was visible and there it is to all who are not blinde but none of these pleaded for honorable Titles as thou dost nor none ever did that believed such was ever out of the faith read James 2. to the 10 verse John 5. 4. and 44. and if these be the few Hereticks thou tells on that thou says were our Predecessors of old I say We cannot but own these in their measure though we go under the name of Hereticks with them by the same Generation Thy fourth thing is That which thou callest our proud scornful railing Language which thou saist should put it out of doubt what spirit we are of to any who are acquainted with Christs Spirit and of Satan and are able to judge of Spirits and know darkness from light I say The Language of Christ we use to thee who aâ—t found in the work of Satan therefore thou canst not bear it but thy filthy â—nclean words thou hast cast upon us in thy Book which none in Scripture ever used we shall leave to the judgement of Him that judges Spirits and to all who know light from darkness But thou fore-seeing thy self guilty makes an Objection It is Scripture Language which they speak and when thou hast done deceitfully answerest saying The greater your presumptious sin in making so ill an use of Scripture Language and calls it serving Satan and thus thou proves iâ— saying What if Christ called Judas a Devil is it therefore lawful to call Peter so I say yea If Peter be found in the Devils work Matth. 16. 23. much more thou and thy Generation who none of you yet came so far as Peter who denyed all to follow Christ but
more than others that say the like Ans Our call and commission is invisible as to you as ever it was to the world yet herein is it shewed that we are found in the same practise and suffering that all the Saints of God ever was for declaring against the false worships and this we refuse not to show in the midst of your envy in the patience of Christ and his long suffering in the midst of your bloody persecution and here is your commission shewed also and from whom you have it even him that is within you who is known by his fruits outward a murderer from the beginning so is the Spirit of God by its fruits outward a sufferer from the beginning so each tree is known by its fruit whatsoever you tel us and that 's the sot which cannot see it nor believe it qu. 18. Seeing you cry down our Ministry and Churches tell us which is the the true ministry and Church and when yours begun and where it hath been since Christs abode on earth til now speak plainly and let us know whether you indeed are Papists or Pagans Ans The true Ministry and Church is those who abide in the doctrine of Christ guided by his Spirit in the way of his worship and this Church begun to be seperated from the world first in Abell and since Christs abode on the earth hath been thrust into corners persecuted and imprisoned and killed by Cains generation who was ever worshippers yet in their murderous nature and here we speak plainly such was Pagans and Papists though they called themselves Catholicks the same are you now who are found in the same works though you call your selves christians and such churches we cry down and their ministry who hath their hands in blood and persecution whatsoever they are called by and now that we have spoken plainly and truth also see thou be not angry and call trailing and plot mischiefe against us in secret as your father Cain did and all his generation when you cannot do it openly qu. 19. Is not that man an infidel and a scorner of Christ that dare say he came into the world and shed his blood to gather onely a few raging quakers â—n England 1652 years after his incarnatâ—on if Christ have no subjects but these he is a poore King â—f Christ have been tâ—ll now without subjects he was no King if without a Body he was no Head if without a spouse he was no husband Therefore shew us what a church Christ had or confess your selves infidels Ans The nearest comparison as I finde in Scripture whereby to shew what a Church Christ had since the mystery of iniquity and Popish Priesthood and Parish Masters was set up in the â—ailing away may be compared to his Church from the time that the hirelings and false Prophets begun amongst the Jews to preach for hire and bear rule by their means c. even til Christs comming in the flesh which Church was sometimes visible but â—n a few dâ—spised Prophets who were sent one after another to cry down the false worships covetous practises and to testifie of his comming which alwaiâ—s suffâ—red by the multitude oâ— Priests and salâ—e Prophets who when they came stil conspired against him and if thou look back since your lordly authority was set up in your Ministry you may see they have had their hands in the like practise against those who lived in hope of his appearance denying their worships and now it is â—alne into your hands who are garnishing their Sepulchers crying out against your fathers the Popes and the Bishops for their cruelty but are found deeper in it to your power than ever they was scarcely ever ceasing to stir any authority of the nation against the Lamb and his Light where it is made manifest yea many of your Generation not finding the Magistrate so ready to execute your bloody designes as you would have them have shed blood with your own hands even of the innocent and they are not a few that are guilty hereof in the north parts of this Nation and the kingdome of Christ hath been poore according to thy judgement yet hath these been his subjects nor hath he been without a body nor without a spouse so thou mayest read what a Church Christ hath and what a Church he hath had formerly yet is he not come to save a few raging quakers only but with ten thousand of his saints is he come to be avenged of that bloody Generation and for the Infidell thou tells on and the scorner of Christ that is he that cannot believe in him and his Light to be sufficient and what a church Christ hath had and hath we have shewed qu. 20. Did not the spirit of the Quakers speak in numbers 16. 3. just as you do now against magistrates and ministers and is not God very patient that causeth not the earth to open and swallow you up quick as it did them do you understand that the Simonians or disciples of Simon Magus and the Nicholaitans whose Doctrine and deeds Christ hateth Rev. 2. and other gnostick heriticks in the Apostles dayes did deal by them and the Church then as you do by us now and that the second Epistle of Peter the Epistle of Iude much of the first of Iohn and the second of Iohn were written purposely against them besides many other Scriptures and have you wel considered those Scriptures and applyed them to your selves Ans That Spirit of Christ we own is that meek Spirit that was in Moses against which the Rebellious Levites was then gathered who would condemn it of too much purity saying that all the congregation was holy the same which you do now calling all Christians and sprinklâ—ng their Children under the name of believers and that Spirit which we own speaks not against Magistracy nor Ministry such as are appointed by God though it hath ever testified against the corruption of that Magistracy which by God was appointed yet canst not thou here shelter thy selfe who art out of the Doctrine of Christ in all thy Ministry and was never called by him and thy spirit we understand to be worse than Simon Magus for he believed in the Light of the Gospel but thou denyest it and he would have bought the gift which thou would sel if thou hadst it neither had he a hand in such works of envy against the Truth as thou and thy generation are found in though there then was heriticks who dealt with the Apostlesthen as you do with us now and those was and are the heriticks who abides not in the Doctrine of Christ who are proud and covetous cannot cease from sin have hearts exercised in wicked practises after Cain and Balaam and of these did Peter and Iude speak of in their Epistles 1 Iohn 4. 2 3 and Iohn also who declared that then Antichrist was gone into the i Iohn 5. 9 i0 World and that was the Spirit of
you will have all you can get though you deny Christ and all his Rules for the getting of it and such are no faithful servants of Christ but of their own bellies and their lusts and pride as thou goest on still pleading for thy masterhood saying Alass that a Christian should be so ignorant as not to know that your being called Master and Lord too is commonly allowed in the Scripture and that it is not the Title but the Lording over mens faith that is forbidden I say All those that know any thing of the Faith of Christ sees you to be guilty of both but will give you neither which saith leads out of respect of persons and to serve a better master then he that bears rule by his means And thou tells thy thoughts of us saist thou it was the main advantage that the Reformers had for the ruine of the Papal Kingdom to perswade men that the Pope was Antichrist and to disgrace the Popish Clergy and says thou They would attempt the destruction of our Church by the same means I say Why not why may not that which lopt off some of your bâ—anches now the time is come cut up the whole root being laid to it by the same power in a great measure Thou saist Our first way is to bring people in dislike with their Teachers without which we have no hope of succeeding I say Why not you being of those who ever shut up the Kingdom therefore Christ his Prophets and Apostles did ever most cry out against the false Prophets blinde Guides and Hirelings who in all ages withstood him coming to his Kingdom as you do now with the same weapons in this Generation and Christs way is not changed so the same wo against you is pronounced which you must inherit And whereas thou saist That the Papists have begotten this present Sect of Quakers I say The Devil is not divided against himself had we been begot by the Papists we should have had more favor from you who are come of that Line as having hopes of us to have been restored to your former Kingdom which ever stood so much in multitudes of people that you might be Lords and Masters over them And thou says We have here and there a Papist lurking to be the chief Speaker amongst us I say here thou dost but manifest thy envy and deceit to us and the Commonwealth if thou know such amongst us and do not produce it then art thou deceitful to the trust of the Nation but if thou know none then art thou a false accuser and out of thy own mouth art thou judged who says we are headeâ— with dissembling Fryars and this thou would make people believe with adding lies saying that we say the Pope is not Antichrist that we undermine the Scriptures decry the Ministery unchurch Churches slight Justification by imputed Righteousness draw men to admire our adherent Righteousness set up strength of mans free-will the exalting of Monastical Community and Virginity and Alienation from worldly Imployment All this saist thou the Papists hath taught the Quakers so thou makes them up ten Lies together And instead of proving us headed with Fryars thou hast proved the Devil thy head and father for we confess the Pope to be Antichrist and all your Popish Clergy of his Linage and with the Scriptures we so prove it which Scriptures we own with the true Ministery and Churches Justification by Christs Righteousness freely put and given to us whereby our own Righteousness we deny and set up the light within us and witness Revelations which the hirelings know not therefore not common and we witness a judge above Scripture and before Scripture which we will not change for the Pope and all his Clergy which we extol and do not abstain from worldly Imployments further then by the Lord we are called whom we preser before all the world which is our perfection and freedom from sin in this life which none of the Popish Clergy can teach us though you may talk on it but onely the Spirit of God which we witness which the Devil and the hirelings never befriended Thou makes another Objection That they hold out many certain truths and cry down pride and drunkenness and worldliness and cry up mortification charity and humility And in thy Answer thou saist So do you as well and better then we can do it is common amongst you and thou hopes a little better maintained These you say are Points where you agree with the Papists I say much like and to the same effect but see how it is maintained in your practice thy crying up humility is seen in this thy boasting who says Thy teaching is better then we can do were it the gift of God thou would see it to be free and he not limited by thy cannot but free to give it to whom he pleaseth without respect of persons And for thy charity which thou cries up is that it by which Thomas Goodair was carryed twice to Prison for coming into the Idol Temple if that be it it s preached through the Nation thou might have saved labour of Printing it not many of thy Brethren but they have acted it And if thy mortification stands in Cuffs and Ribonds Lace and Points being called Lord and Master c. then it cannot be decryed but thou hast cryed it up in thy Book and that very strongly And for your crying down pride drunkenness and worldliness let your Kirks and Markets witness for you or against you the effect of your crying and fruits of your Ministery which have all bent your selves in your Pulpits to Preach up sin for term of Life in your selves and your hearers and here thy crying up Cuffs and Points and such like stuffs And thou bringest against us the Testimony of a Fryar whom thou calls Master Coppenger thou saist of the Franciscan order I say by the Mastership thou givest him he is one of thy Order whereby you are both distinguished by the words of Christ to be none of his Ministers and so fittest for your purpose and if reason may judge most likely came over to second your envy against those you call Quakers else why did not you keep him seeing the Law required it then might it have been proved if he had been a Speaker amongst us but you shew your selves and your envy in this thing as in many other who would force the Testimony of a condemned person and he not present nor no two ever see him by thy own confession in thy Paper and yet this you Print so often over thereby to deprive thousands of their liberty in the service of God who are faithful and have made proof of it having thereto been called against the Popish Clergy and Bishops and the Powers they stirred up as the Nation can witness and if you were numbered from the first to the last with your secret actings against us there 's not many of you in the Nation would
Mark Luke and John the Gospel and whether there were any Gospel before them and whether they be the light and to this thou gives not answer but tells of a temporal Word so much knowes thou of that word that endures for ever and a word that is a sign of Gods mind and such confused stuffe and tells of a different sense betwixt Christ the Scriptures and thou sayes it was written that it might be a standing rule and kept intire and sure to the worlds end but how often have you and your generation altered this rule insomuch as scarce two of you can agree about it what is the meaning of it and how many Copies is there of it which of them is the standing rule that which stands most suitable to your wills and pleasures and how intire is it kept when much of it is quite lost but thou might have said of it as of the infallible Spirit if the letter be not it thou hast none thou knows on that had been plainer dealing and thou sayes this word is the Light but not as Christ is the Light or the Spirit for there are many lights and so with thy many lights thou shews thy self to be ignorant of the one light the Scriptures speaks of which holds out but one light and word but thou hast many in the dark-lanthorn of thine imaginations not one like another and so imagines that Christ the Spirit and the Word are not one nor enlightens all alike sayest thou mans reason is the eye and the Gospel is externall and the Spirit cloâ—eth these two together and so breedeth a spirituall illumination which the word alone could not procure whereas the Scriptures witness the word by which alone all externalls were made and the word for reconciling again and making new but sayest thou the word without reason and externalls cannot produce and this is thy word thou preaches and so it seems by what it produces And thou asks some queries 1. Whether we believe the Scriptures be true I say yea then â—ayes thou they call themselves the word of God and thou brings some scriptures to prove it but not one that sayes the letter is the word and thou brings Rom. 10. 8. The word is nigh you even in your heart and in your mouth but is the Bible there and thou brings 1 Pet. 1. 25. The word of God endures for ever and before called it the temporall word Thy 2. qu. Will we give you leave to smel the Pope in our endeavours to dâ—sgrace the Scriptures though our nose be stopt I say were thou not stark blind and drunck with envie thou might see thy own confused scornfull spirit with which thou hast discovered thy folly who one while will have the word temporall and another while to endure for ever and to prove the Bible to be the Word brings the word is in the heart but no wonder thou be blind who sayes mans reason is the eye 15. query Whether you own revelations or no And to this thou sayes thou owns all divine revelations and disowns all diabollicall ones but in thy 10. page hath denyed revelations but the revelations thou own is what is written but hath not the Devil these also yes and can preach them as wel as you and take them to plead for his Kingdome as wel as thou yet sayes thou these are able to make men wise to salvation without any further additions and when thou hast done sayes they must have the Spirit of Christ to help them but thou might do wel to shew thy opinion whether the Spirit can make wise to alvation without them it seems to be thy opinion that it is not by thy former query where thou asks whether the light of Christ be sufficient where your Gospel is not preached which no Gospel you have but the Letter which if you had it not you would be as dumb as those which Isaâ—ab speaks on and in thy conclusion thou tels of other helps which are oâ— slat necessity besides the Spirit and thy litterall revelations which before thou said was sufficient to salvation without any addition but by thy own words if there had been no Book thou had had no revelation and yet in words seems to deny thy father the Pope who hath kept thee thy revelations else thou had been without for ought thou knows yet you cannot beare it to be called ministers of the Letter and not of the Spirit and the Apostles was Ministers not of the Letter but of the Spirit this with you is railing 19. qu. Is about singing Davids Psalms and for answer to this thou sends us to a Book of Cottons and Ford and say thou knows no reason why thou should add any more a pretty shuffle to get shut of that thou canst not prove yet though thou have lost thy reason to answer thou wil ask more queres 1. If the Scripture be written for our use why may not we speak to God in Davids words I say because David would not keep a lyar in his house may thou who art found a lyar sing these words the Scripture was not written by such a Spirit nor to such a spirit nor doth such learn ought by the Letter but to cover thy shame and deceive others as appears by thy practise 2 que They being used by the Church till the Apostles time where was they abolished I say is that Church thou means on the Pharisees such a Church uses them now though not so wel as they did for they did not put them into rimes as you do and when the Saints sung with the Spirit and with understanding and he that had a Psalm sung his own and not anothers then was the way of Pharisees abolished 3. qu. Whether is it more lawful for us to sing in the words of David or for you to take together all the sharp reproofes in Scripture to rail on me with I say there is as much betwixt the lawfulness of them as betwixt truth and a lye for when we take Scripture language by the same spirit that gave it forth to reprove the same deceit in thee which Christ and his Prophets and Apostles did in the chiefe Priests Pharisees and Hirelings then we speak truth though thou call it railing but when thou and thy hearers sings Davids words saying you have no scornfull eye you have rored all the day long your bones hath quaked you have made your bed to swim with tears no lyar shall dwel in your houses c. are not a nest of lyars all found lying together and he that sayes otherwise of you is a lyar like you 17. qu. What is the soul of man c. And thou sayes it's the cause of our life I say thou knows not him who is the cause of our life no more then thou dost the soul but here thou would deny God to be the cause of life and put the soul in his stead as thou hast denyed the spirit to set the letter
in his stead so art thou drawing downward as fast as thou canst but sayes thou the whole man in Scripture is taken for â—an the cause of life dye or be defiled the soul so by thy opinion the man is the cause of life so thou hast shewed what life thou lives and what thou knows of the soul yet thou wilt ask more queries though resolve none and first thou begins to wrangle with the command of Christ that forbids thy master-hood saying is not many words in the Scriptures translated master of as low and humble importance as ruler I say the words of Christ was ever in the way of the Hirelings and Pharisees and Priests and their pride but they could not get them removed though they was vext at them and would not have them applyed to them no more than thou but let his words alone thou must not wrest them out of their place and power thou canst not bow them but must bow to them they was given to break thee and thy pride and not to be broken by thee nor thy teachings 2 qu. Thou sayes if God bid people obey you as Rulers and the quakers perswade people to reject you as Serpents c. which is to be obeyed God or the quakers and whether is the Spirit of God or of the Devil the quakers speaks by I say God did never bid people obey Hirelings and such as are out of the Doctrine of Christ as you aâ—e but the Spirit of God called such Serpents and so doth now which is not the Spirit of the Devil as the Devil would slander it to be both Mat. 23. 33. then and now you being now found in the same practise are reproved with the same spirit 3. qu. Thou asks Is it the Ministers or quakers that have the rule over people and wait for the good of souls I say the quakers abhors such rule as you bear and for the good of souls thou must first know what the soul is before thou can watch for the good of it nay thou watches to destroy souls for dishonest gain hirelings was never souls shepheards 4. qu. Thou sayes if the present Pastors be not true Ministers tell you who are and where you may find them and where they have been from Christ til now I say those are true ministers and ever was who wandred to and fro having no certain dwelling place of whom the world was not worthy who ever bore witness against the false Prophets that bear rule by their means and the Priests that preached for hire and the people that loved to have it so and whose manner was to go into the Synagogues and Idols temples to disprove the hirelings false worship and call people from them to the true shepheard and you may find many of these in the most prisons of the nation for so doing by your means against whom we are sent to witness and these have been banished to and fro since the mystery of iniquity and the popish priesthood was set up into corners but now are come to light to witness against the mystery of iniquity therefore do the heathen rage the man of sin and all his ministers because his end is near 5. qu. Thou asks if it will be for the peoples profit to despise their Teachers and guides I say you who have despised Christs commands to set up your own lusts and pride covetousness and false-worship must be despised and when such guides are discovered then shal the people profit when they come to be guided with that spirit God hath given to every man to profit withall which thou wil keep them from as long as you can that you may fil up your measure and wrath come upon you to the uttermost being captivated by the Devil soul and body the God of this world having blinded the eye so that the Gospell 2 Cor. 4. is hid from you and you lost letting up the Letter instead of it having denyed the light and erred from it are got up into hardness of heart imprisoning beating and making havock like mad beasts what ever the Devill did where he reigned so do you being the head of the Serpent which Christ is come to bruise as he did in his own person so he is the same for ever to the same brood who now are found in the same bloody plots against the seed of God worse than ever any seeking the lives of others for practising that in life which your selves wil preach in words for money â—uch a generation of raging beasts was never yet in the world who seek to devour on every side you and who departs from sin is your prey the greatest deceivers thatever yet come now when you come to be revealed who would have belâ—eved that you who have had so many millions of pounds for teaching people to forsake sin and now if any declare that he hath forsaken it and is set free you preach it down as the most dangerous error that ever was and cry out to drunckards swearers thieves and murderers and whoremongers come not near them least you be deceived and now get up more money for preaching up sin while the world stands than you took for preaching it down yet if we tel you you are bringing people into Covenant with the Devil for tearâ— of life you say we rail on you when you have be got the faith of that Covenant in the whole nation ask any that ever believes your teaching if they believe that Christ iâ— able to redeem them from committing sin in this world and presently they are ready to give an account of their faith nay none can be free heâ—e but when they are dead in another world they shall â—o the faith and covenant is sutable for no less time then till men can sin no longer and if any have broke this Covenant through the righteous Covenant they are ready to stone him yet least thou should be seen in this filth you cast a mist before the simple saying you must strive after perfection and freedom and purity and to be set free from sin but once knowing that unbeliefe is in the bottome there is little danger of freedome for the Devil whose work you are doing knows fulwel that if he can but have people to believe they cannot be free he knows they are safe with him for ever comming at it no faith no obtaining according to every mans faith so shall it be unto them and that striving which is not in faith to obtain is selfe-righteousness but Heb. 7 25. who believes that Christ is able to save to the uttermost all that come to God by him shall see it so but this the blind knows not who would have believed that these Priess that now is had been the greatest persecutors that ever was before them who have preached so long against it but say you this persecution of ours is not as theirs was they persecuted Christ and such as he sent but these are wandrers
and Vagabonds and disturbs our peace and worships c. but the light is come your mysts wil not hide you the Sun is risen and you are seen in the work against the same Spirit nothing altered but the persons or places or time where had ever ministers of Christ hand in persecuting any upon any account whatsoever prove your practise herein Then thou goes on to tell what that death is that passed upon all men and thou sayes its the separation of the soul from the body thou blind for did not death pass upon Adam til soul and body was separated this is like thy opinion of the soul but how canst thou who art in death know what it is those whom Christ quickned who were dead Eâ—h 2. 1. 5. was they such who had no souls nay thou must own the Light before thou know what death is death reigns in lyars and envious ones 18. qu. What is the Flaming Sword that keeps the Tree of Life the Cherubims and this thou answers with calling it a foolish question and adds a lye to it saying we have not seen it thou sayes it shall suffice thee to know there is such a thing which knowledg is no more in thee but hearsay but the sight thou puts far off into the world to come and the Tree of Life also for thou that never saw the Flaming Sword Cherubims never came near the Tree of Life but as I said before feeds upon death thy own cursed carnall knowledg which God hath forbidden 19. qu. Whether they that stand praying in the Synagogues or Idols Temples and love greetings in Markets and bind heavie burthens on the people are called of men masters be not out of Christs Doctrine and this falling upon the head of the Serpent being thy own practise thou art forced to take thy old crooked winding wayes to get out and thou begins to question instead of answer saying if your Temples be Christ Temples do not we make Christ an Idoll by calling them Idolls Temples I say they are not Christ Temples unless thou mean the Pope be he whose Temples they are who builded and consecrated them into the names of dead men and women and set up in them a dead worship all which Christ never commanded but the Temple of Christ is made without hands and there he dwells and not in Temples made with hands hast thou a face to father those upoâ— Christ wherein you generation of blood-suckers have worshipped in them ever since they was builded do not they stand witnesses against you that you are the children of them who slew the Martyrs and now are found beating in the same SYNAGOGUES and shedding Blood as far as you can get the same power by which they did it CHRIST had never such TEMPLES stop thy MOUTH for SHAME And thou goes on and where thou cannot deny but thou art in the steps of the PHARISEES yet sayes thou I do not love it they loved it to be called Master c. but I do not wel thoâ— sayes in words thou loves it not but come to thy practise and it wil appear thou who art but one hast made more lyâ—s and crooked wayes to uphold it in this thy book then all the generations of thy fathers the Pharisâ—es â—iâ— that ever was before thee and dost thou think to cover all this by saying thou loves it not but you have used so long to lead the blâ—nd that you would put out the eys of them that see thou saies it was pharises pride that was condemned I say so it is your pride that is your condemantion nor can thou clear thy self of the very same things they was found in but least thou should lose all yet sayes thou Christ bids them hear the hypocriticall pharisees and observe to do as they bid you I confess to plead for hypocriticall teachers is the likest way to get in to have people commanded to hear you had not you run so gross til you have lost all also even the outward form of godliness which they had and upon that account he bad hear them because they sate in Moses seat and read the Letter truly without adding but you are neither set in Moses seat nor Christs but run in your own imaginations till neither Law nor Gospel-letter wil warrant any one thing of your worship matter nor manner means nor maintenance as I shall be ready to prove that not one particular of your worship you act in your Idolls Temples nor wages for so doing can you prove by plain Scripture to be so much as in the form commanded oâ— practised by Christ and his Saints and yet calls your selves uprâ—ght and faithful ministers for shame be silent as to boasting til you acquit your selves of this charge by plain Scriptures without wresting it and would you have us bound to hear such under pretence of hypocrites who have lost both power and shew of Godliness and sayes thou it is not being called master that Christ intended thou lying spirit would thou make him a lyar like thee did not he intend as he spoke or thou takes him to be an hypocrite like the Pharisees whom thou would thrust in amongst with thy consequence and thou sayes he forbids the name of fathers I say he forbids not children and fathers but such as you then thou goes on in thy old way lying sayâ—ng we forbid the owning of any relations and all affections and respects to them I say thy father hath fitted thee with boldness to bring forth his work who dare declare thy own shame to all that know our practise what dis-affection canst thou charge uppon any of our relatâ—ons unless thou accuse us because we cannot affect the Devils pride and bow to it in such as thee And to plead for this mastership further thou sayes thou wil tel us something we know not and that is that the disciples of the sect-masters of the Pharisees so gloryed in their masters that they were ready to go by the ears and kil one another and this thou would send us to see amongst them as a strange business which we see daily amongst you and your disciples how many Sects and Sect-masters is amongst you Priests and your Disciples and have been all by the ears as thou calls it even unto blood til you have vented all your envie against the Lambs of Christ as they did then though thou would put it far off yet we see it here present and sayest thou these called they Rabbies as the Papists do the Pope but why wilt thou not read on one woâ—d further as your hearers do you no doubt but this is as true though not so much for thy purpose who art hiding thy selfe by accusing others and so now that I have set thee in thou may read on all the rest of thy charge against the Pope and find thy selfe guilty and stop thy mouth and see the Pharisees the Pope and thee and thy brethren all on a Line
and that it is not words we contend about but your whole practise which being found in and condemned words and meanings cannot hide you and if the Scriptures be not right translated as thou pleads then is less confidence to be put in any of you who had it in doing yet thou sayes its a standing rule thus Babylons Children are clashing one against another but all against the Stone by which we see your fruits to be the same with the Pharises change the letter as often as you will wo to him that hath no other guide and rule but that which you have so often chopt and changed and not still wil it please you thou may wel call it a temporall word for you wil make it serve all times or you must want of your wils it s no haâ—d thing with you to take Pauls words who wandred up and down in hunger and nakedness 2 Cor. 11. 27. coveted no mans money nor gold nor apparell and was chargeable to none nor took ought against the will of the owner c. and with two or three consequences and meanings from your originall you wil make it prove you four or five hundred a yeer and a great house to live in and this you will not have by favour but force and yet they are thieves that denies to give you their goods when you ask it but now when your practise and Pauls are compared they are as far distant as before could you bend his life as you do his words to your own then might ye deceive the elect but God hath left this a rule for ever by their fruits shall you know them so by your works you are so farre from Paul that you are out-run Balaam and all the false Prophets and greedy dogs you read on in the Scriptures who never took it by force under pretence of a Law taking three for one as you do yet this truth which is as clear as the Sun must be called railing because it falls upon your deceit and because a servant calls master in Scripture sayes thou why may not thou be so called as a minister thou may as wel say because a servant doth own his master why may not I break the commands of Christ and sayes thou Paul he was called a wise master builder I say those words wil not fit thee who would build up thy pride with them he was Paul a Servant and not Master Paul if thou canst own it thou may if not let it alone I say thou must be proved by thy deeds not with wresting his words nor was the masters of assemblies Solomon spoke on such as thou but of one shepheard which the hirelings never knew nor any who would take Solomons words to destroy Christs commands did thou know him thou would not teach men to break one of the least of them much more that which hath ever distinguished false Prophets from true nor is there any one command more plainly expressed nor more faithfully obeyed by his ministers then this that thou art teaching men to break it being now the great controversie with Christ and Antichrist who should be master and who should be bowed to and how loath are his ministers to lose it as is seen by thy crooked wayes thou takes to keep it but thou must lose it and the Lamb must have it who wil not bow to thee and Abraham and Festus and Agrippa cannot bear the out in breaking Christs command those was not forbidden as thy practise Iohn 5. 44. is who art pleading for titles of honour to you Priests as a duty O shame thou infidel how canst thou believe that 's seekâ—ng for honour from men was ever any mâ—nister of Christ found in that work and is not this the greatest thing thou stands for in thy book is it not seen whole honour thou art seeking against the commands of Christ nor is he void of the fear of God who denies thee to be a faithfull Minister of Christ who ministers against the command of Christ nor are we so soâ—tâ—sh but we can judge who is in the work of Christ and who is against him with lyes saying a Minister of Christ is called Master and that to deny your Greek and Hebrew is to deny Christ as though a naturall language was Christ and thou calls some sacred languages thou â—dolater is not every language natural to them who are bâ—ed in them is not our Englâ—sh as sacred among the Greeks as theirs is here but such as thou wil worship any thâ—ng rather then the Spirit and after all thy lyes in this book sayes we are not able to charge thee with any câ—ime but humaine frailtâ—es when thou art found full of gross wickedness as in thy book is laid open and here thou may receive an answer to thy query and thou boasts that thou can talk better then we I say thou makes it not appear in thy book for it truth had ordered thy tongue I had not found so many open falsehoods and conâ—usions as I have laid open already and thou â—ayes thou would thresh and dig and labour if God would give thee leave I say what a God doâ—t thou serve which will not allow of labour our God condemns â—dleness and sayes if any wil not work neither should he eat but the God of this 2 Thess 3. 10 World is the God of idleness and fulness of bread which the Priests of this nation have been known to serve more than any one sort of people else and thou sayes our prater is a lyer foâ— saying if thou had no pay thou would not preach I say prove him a lyar and shame him come out and preach freely and then if he say so of thee I shall say he is a lyar too but I suppose thy Godwil not suffer thee to do this no more than he wil suffer thee to labour for these must go together but let me ask the one question amongst all thâ—ne qu. The Ministers or Christ said follow us and walk as you have us for examples but if thou should say so to thine and all the Parish masters in this nation also and your hearers should follow you as you do what a nation would here be all idle all proud and covetous all live on the sweat of other mens brews all Masters c. would not this destroy relations who would you have to worship you therefore take heed how you bid them sollow you I have heard oâ— some of you may be foreseeing part of this have been so wise as to say do as I say but not as I do I say this is plain dealing compared with thee who acts all this charges God with it and when thou haâ—t done sayes we are not able to chaâ—ge thee with any crime so thou would have us to charge it upon him who wil not let the labour 20. qu. Did ever the Lord of Heaven and Earth or Jesus Christ bid thee or any of you go and preach to
a people or was any of the Apostles or Ministers oâ— Christ made Ministers by the wil of man To this thou answers after the old way and begins another story telling the Lord called the Apostles by his own voyce and leâ—t them to call one another to the end of the world end to prove this untruth thou brings Mat. 28. 21. which Chapter hath not 21. verses in but there is not one verse in that chapter nor in all the book that sayes that the Apostles was to leave such an order to the end of the world so that a verse beyond number is fittest to quote for such a ly but what Apostle was that who least order with the Pope from whom all the Parish Teachers both in this Nation and many more have had their ordination and holy order since the Pops tieme he â—â—ves from Peter and if thou say so tool I shall not believe you till I see â—â—tter proofe than yet thou hast quoted but thou proceeds to deny any tâ— expect a call from Heaven and the signes of thy call thou sets down First thy competent qualification yet hast thou nought freely but so hard to study for it that thou hast no time to work and that never was Christs call nor qualification 2. Thy thirst after the good of souls yet thou knows not what the soul is 3. The ordination of authorised Church officers what sort those are and the rise of them hath been declared before 4. The call of the people and their consent over whom he hath set thee I say none that ever was sent by Christ ever went to ask consent of the People 5. The success of thy labours but how many of thy hearers are set free from sin yea thy self yet a lyar 7. Some testimony of the Spirit yet thou denies any infallibility and that Spirit with the Spirit of God that never erred is denyed These seven sayest thou set together are the signes of Christs call and thy mission shew you the like if you can to which I say never any of Christs Ministers shewed the like nor do I neither and thou tels the old taile over again that no immediate call since the Apostles which thou never proved yet and thou concludes wil not all this suffice I say those who know not the Scriptures nor the power of God may trust thee and be sufficed with a lye but who knows either sees whence thou art was not Annanias and Barnabas and others in the Scriptures called immediately Acts 9 10 11. and with the power and Spirit by which I am called immediately Acts 13. 2. do I testifie against thee with the Scripture 21. qu. Whether had any Ministers of Christ an hour glass to preach by or tooke a Text and raised Doctrine uses Reasons Motives or a carnall BELL to call people together by prove these things by plaine SCRIPTURE or else be silent and never profess your selves to be Ministers of Christ more And to this thou answers with telling of Spectacles Doublet and Breeches and such like vain words but dare not compare your practise with the SAINTS in SCRIPTVRE thou will not be tryed by thy own standing Rule but sayes these are purposely left by Christ to be determined of humane providence what providence is that which is humane providence to Iohn 16. 13. which your worship of God is least is his worship humane and your tythes divine they who worship in truth have the Spirit of Truth to guide them into all truth in his whole worship but your humane providence hath led you out of that worship in all things and thou sayes thou can limit thy selfe and not limit the Spirit so the spirit and thou are not one I say I know selfe orders thee and thy times are in thy own hands but with Christ and his it never was the query is of the manner of thy worship and thou answers did the Apostles preach in Doublets and Breeches is Doublets and Breeches forms of Gods worship a man may alter Doublets and Breeches but may he alter the form of worship which Christ appointed The Saints meet together sayes thou and did not stay two or three dayes therefore why may not I have an Hour-glass I say they meet together sometimes stayed whole dayes and sometimes whole nights as they was moved and this did not limit the Spirit but can you therefore set an hour to begin and end for hundreds of years by a glass or by a clock either and not limit the Spirit if thou knew the spirit and its moving thou would know to the contrary Christ would not go to worship at his own time nor any that knows the Spirit but they are ordered by it both for time and manner but this the wolves never knew thou sayes if thou had our spirit thou should be angry at the hour-glass and preach the people out of their places I say thou art a man pleaser who keeps an Hour-glass to please the People and a man pleaser canâ—ot please God but the hireling must do his work as may assure him of his wages if people set you your work its fit that they should have it done in their own time and after that manner they like best this we should not deny you did you not pretend ministers of Christ but if Christ set a work it s as much reason that he should have the like freedome to order his workmen seeing he never sends his to the woâ—ld for counsel nor hire this we know though thou dost not and thou sayes Christ took a Text and applyed it and this thou would bring to prove your litterall Ministry to be the Ministry of Christ I say Christ took a Text and said it was fulfilled in him but if you take no Text but what is fulfilled in Mic. 3. 5. you then you must take only such as Iohn 10. 12 13. and those Scriptures Mat. 23. that tel of a Priesthood that were called of men Masters bore Ier. 5. 31. rule by their means cryed peace while people put into their mouthes but if not prepared wars that were proud and covetous taught for flecces beat and cast out of Synagogues wolves in Sheeps cloathing c. these and such like which sure your practise you must take and then say this day is these Scriptures fulfilled in your ears and then read your portion so take your own then you are no thieves for the word of God you have not nor was it ever preached in your manner nor for your ends and your dividing is to cry peace though God hath not spoken peace in the conscience and are daubers and tread the Lambs under your feet read Ezek. 22 25. 26. and you may see what dâ—viders you are and what it is you divide 22. qu Whether are not they that bear rule by their means and seek for their gain from their quarter and seek for the fleece and make a prey on the people and are
in you quakers I say Iohn was there shewing to little children that there could be none free from sin further then they was in Christ not in selfe nor while any thing of self remained therefore sayes if we so think we deceive our selves and though Iohn say we yet was it not his condition but as he comes down to them to minister to their measures who was not yet cleansed so he saith we whereof he was not guilty no more than Iames the Apostle was of cursing men with his Tongue where he saith therewith bless we God therewith curse we men Iam. 3 9. And many other places of Scripture where they come down to the condition of the weak yet partake of no mans sin though such â—nclean beasts as thee would take these Scriptures to plead for sin so long as the world stands which Iohn wrote that they sinned not and thou concludes with this question if you think you are perfect without sin whether do you also think that you are already in heaven or perfect glory for what can keep the soul from perfect enjoyment of God but sin and to enjoy God perfectly is to be glorified perfectly but sayest thou I have forgot that your brethren think heaven hell is onely withâ—n men I say hadst thou forgot that lye it had been an injury to him whom thou serves but I find little of that forgetfulness in thy Book and for perfect enjoyment of God had not Adam in his innocency perfect enjoyment of God and Christ in his time when he was upon the earth though their bodies was upon the earth and so far as any is covered with Gods righteousness so far perfectly glorified but thoâ— and thy brethren knows little of this nor none that ever â—ought the honour and glory of this world the prayers of such was ever an abomination and their profession out of the saith of Christ Ioâ—â— 5. 44. Thou proceeds to ask more queries and thou desires me to speak truly to the point in question I say so I shall in plainness passing by words to no purpose And first Thou sayes are not they the very same MINISTERS you raile at which all the Drunâ—ards Sweâ—rers Whoremongers and sensuall wretches in the COUNTREY do hate and raile at and are not ye on their side and pâ—oâ—â—sses the same SPIRIT would not all covetous MALIGâ—ANIS have Tythes down as well as you were not they of the same sort of MINISTERS which the late BISHOPS silenced is it not then the same SPIRIT by which you are acted Ans I say railing we deny and speak the truth against those we find out of the Doctrine of Christ who are one with drunkards swearers Whoremongers and sensual wretches and whose Church hearers is made up or many â—uch and who by such are upholden maintained and defended who fight for such a Ministry with clubs and stones and stocks and these are of the same spirit with them and on their side against the servants of God beating in their Synagogues and hailing out as they ever did the ministers of truth who was sent to preach the Gospel and bear witness against their false worships whom they raged against with carnal weapons as they had opportunity and for havâ—ng tythes down they are so plaâ—n against the practise of the saints by you upholden that they are blind that sees it not yea good and bad except those who have a gain by them and I cannot blame the enemies oâ— God for wishing that down which is contrary to God and for Bishops silencâ—ng I say you are in the same work and would silence all the appearance oâ— God had you power exceeding all the Bishops herein having persecuted and imprisoned more in one yeares space than the Bishops did in ten and â—or such truthes declaring as the Bishops would have been ashamed to have imprisoned for yea some of you Priests proceeding to blood with your own hands being more exceedingly mad than ever your fathers was who would pretend a law for that which they did but you have none for many things you do so you are acted by the same spirit but exceedingly heightned in rage more than ever they was Thy second Query is made up of a bundle of lyes which I shall return thee again from whence they came as first That we seduce the people from true teaching 2 That we contemn the Scriptures 3. That we prefer some Translation or Language before another 4. That we maintain free-wil before conversion 5. Or deny it to be only the fruit of the Spirit in the Elect. 6. That we hold forth any for the fulfilling the commands of God but Christ only in them that believe 7. That we make our perfection only in casting off worldly callings relations names or any other thing but in Christ himself 8. or that thou hast any thing under our hands that â—aith so 9. That we place our righteousness in our own works 10. That we deny the imputed righteousness of Christ 11. That we instead of preaching the righteousness of Christ we call out for our own formal righteousness 12. That our righteousness consists in any outward thing or places 13. That we say no man may call master oâ— mistris any further than Christ foâ—bâ—ds it to the devils pride in proud men as pharises hirelings or the like 14. That our righteousness lyes in forbidding those things 15. That we are ignorant of Christs righteousness 16. That we take the most satannical lyes and slanders to be our righteousness 17. That the Papists and we conspire together These seventeen devillish lyes hast thou laid upon us yet if we so call them the father of them is offended though we have no other name for them by the Spirit of God which comes not to cover the lyar but to lay him open nor gild his works with a fine name and thou sayes thou could tel many more were it not too tedious but if thou undertake in plainness to prove but one of these thou hast telled it wil be more tedious than they are all in telling and for the Papists denying your Ministry or confessing the sufficiency of the Light of Christ or witnessing freedome from sin in him wherein by thy confession they come nearer to the truth in words than you do though as far off in practise I say shall we deny the Truth because they profess it or the light of Christ and his redemption because they profess it in words I say nay nor doth this prove us of the same Spirit with them for it is the fruits that manifests the Spirit and not words and by that we deny both the Papists and you and all that say and do not and wherein you say the truth Mat. 23 3. that we observe but do not as you do and so to the point the question is answered Quest. 3. Whether there were ever greater Monsters of ingratitude than these are who set their hearts and tongues against the Ministers
of Christ that lay out themselves for saving of Souls through all the scorn and opposition of all sorts of wicked men with whom these wretches joyn against them yea and make their very study and labour their crime when it were much easier for us to preach without study and that I hope with somewhat more truth sense and order then they that so boast of the Spirit Ans The sum of this query hath been formerly answered that you are not the Ministers of Christ neither do abide in his Doctrine but are those with whom these wretches they speak of joyne both in your worship and to uphold you and that Ministry which abides not in the Doctrine of Christ is not for saving of Souls nor do we make your study your crime but your whole worship which by the Doctrine of Christ we deny and for thy more sense and order which thou boastest on then we that boast of the Spirit I say we have nothing else to boast on but that Spirit that was alwayes counted madness and disorder to thy generation and that 's the Spirit of Truth which with thy sense and sensuall wisdome thou reproachest and this is the end of thy study as appears in thy paper qu. 4. Were not these faithfull servants of God that suffered martyrdome under heathen and Arian persecutors just such Ministers as these men vill fie or wherein was the difference and do not these wretches justifie their murders Ans I say no nor like them no more than the sufferer is like the persecutor and therein was the difference and is the difference they suffered in obedience to that measure of light in their times and we suffer in obedience to the light of Christ in these times they suffered by the chiefe Priests in their times who had got power from the Magistrate and we suffer by the chiefe Priests who have got power from the Magistrate and it is not the name of Pope Bishop or Priest that makes just such or not such but the practise wherein they are found and such are the servants of God who are found in the work of God such are the servants of the Devil who are found persecutors then and now justiâ—ying their murders who then acted â—uch qu 5. Are not the Ministers whoâ— these men despise of the same calling practise as those were that suffered death in the flames in queen Maryes dayes such as Bradâ—â—â—â— Hâ—â—pâ—â— Lâ—â—â—er Riâ—ley Cranmore Saunders Philpot and the â—eâ—t were not these called Masters did they not preach in pulpeâ—s and take tythes or money for preaching as their due maintenance and the other things that the quakeâ—s accuse us for and do not these men justâ—fie the bloody opposers of them and condemns Gods Saints afreâ—h Ans. I say it was for denying of that which was the Popish way â—â— worship according to their measure of Light that these men then suffered and being faithful to that measure they were excepted though the fulness of the Light was not then come but this is no ground to uphold the rest of their Popish inventions contrary to Gospel worship and if they thus fared who did but witness against some branches what may we expect who holds forth that light which strikes at the Root therefore we think it not strange to see your rage greater if you had power then theirs was and it is you that justifies the bloody opposers and condemns the Saints afresh as may be seen in the Goals of the Nation whom you have imprisoned not having yet an opportunity for blood and here you are found in the practise that the popish Priests was in persecuting and not suffering qu. 6. Whether ever the earth bore men that did more proudly despise others in comparison of themselves and whether their language savour of the Spirit of the Lamb of God or can he have any tast of that Spirit of Christ in himself that doth not even feel that their proud and railing language is of the Devil An. Proud despiteful comparisons we deny find thee in that nature in thy 3. qu. Wherein thou says without study thou canst preach more sense and order than we that boast of the Spirit where thou compares thy sense with the spirit and boasts above it neither canst thou charge us with any language but what the Lamb used and those that was guided by him and thou that calls that railing and the Language of the Devill hast no tast of the Spirit of Christ in thee qu. 7. Was there ever a Generation known on the earth that did more arrogantly step up into the Throne of God and sensure his servants whose faces they never saw and who they can charge with nothing but being Preacheâ—s of the Gospel and that in a Pulpet having an hour-glass taking tythes c. to be Ministers of the Devil sons or Perdition with much of the lâ—ke though Christ hath said judge not left ye be judged and who art thou that judgest another mans servant to his own Master he stands or falls Ans This Query is wholly made up of deceit for they are not the 2 Ioâ—n â— preachers of the Gospel whom we charge neither in power nor form but out of the Doctrine of Christ and the practise of his Ministers both in maintenance and manner of worship who preach in pulpets with hour-glasses and take tythes c. and finding them out of the Doctrine of Christ and practise of his Ministers they are declared to be the Ministers of Antichrist and no Servants of Christ and so they are judged and Christ never said judge not such but prescribed a rule whereby we should judg them even by their fruits ye shal know them so to thy master thou art fallen and to him thou stands pleading foâ— his kingdome and in this fruit I finde thee and know thee and with the Spirit of Christ I judge thee though thy face I never see and thâ— generation that ever judged such was never known to the earth though they walked on the earth and by the earth suffered whereâ—â— is arrogancy that steps up into the Throne of God and persecutes hâ—â— servants qu. 8. Was there ever a Generation of men on whom the image â—â— the Devill was more visible then on these he is the Prince â—â— Darkness Pride and Malice and the depth of ignorance and height of pride and malice breaks out so aboundantly in their carriage and discourse that all that are not utterly blind may see it it is the work of the devil to be an accuser of the Brethren and so it is the very religion and business of these wretches to accuse Ministers godly people to be hypocrite lyars children of the devil Serpents vipers with much the like An. There was a generation of men wherin the â—mage of the devil was the Prince of darkness these was they that denyed the light of Christ to be sufficient were proud and covetous laid heavy burdens on the people
said and did not professed God but brought forth the works of the Devil and the depth of their ignorance and height of pride brake out so aboundantly in their practise that all that were not utterly blind might see it and it was the practise of Christ and his Ministers to declare these openly to be hypocrites lyars children of the devill serpents vipers and much the like and they did not herein accuse the brethren nor Godly Ministers nor godly people but such as walked contrary to God and to speak the same words to the same generation that are found in the same works by the same spirit is the same to God as it was then and the same to that generation who are found in their works if not prove thou when it was changed else thou art the accuser of the brethren and that falsly qu. 9. Is it no kinde of blasphemy of the Holy Ghost for such WRETCHES when they have powred out the most horrid LYES SLANDERS RAILINGS and false Doctrines to profess solemnly that all this is from the Spirit of Christ within them and make God and his holy Spirit the pater of all Ans To be found in the same practise that Christ and his Ministers 〈◊〉 â— 44. was found in bearing witness against the same things is no railing slandring nor no false Doctrine being done from the Spirit of Christ within them is no blasphemy against the Holy Ghost but obedience to it and in thee who knows not Gods holy Spirit to be the author and patern of all thy author and patern is the Devil where God is not the Author and Father the works begotten and brought forth by him such are of your father the devill and his works you do this is that Spirit I told thee of before who denies God to be thy author and paterne the author and finiâ—her of our faith and works so must we needs be contrary the one to the other both in judgment and practise as far a Christ and Belial as in our measures we have received him who is the faithfull witness in all Generations against those wayes you now live in qu. 10. Can that man that hath one spark of Grace believe that he hath no sin c. Ans I say by grace we are saved which we have received of God which teacheth us to speak the truth by which truth we are set free so far as we know him and so far we declare our freedome according 2 Cor. 4. 10. to our measures and he that sees himselfe set free from all sin by that Gal. 2. 20. power and brought wholly unto Christ where there is no sin selfe-shame 1 Iob. 8. 5 6. the body of sin put off and nothing living in him but the life of Christ if he declare this to his praise he is no lyar and if such an one abide in Christ he sinneth not neither doth such an one say he hath no knowledg of Christ nor need of the Physician nor that he wil not be beholding to him for his blood or to make intercession neither doth he deny that he hath sinned but confesses to his praise who hath him cleansed according to his measure nor is this to say he wil not be beholding to God any more who stands by faith in his power and is beholding to him daylie and to his blood dayly which as it hath washed so keeps pure from horrid railing slandering and other wickedness thy swearing and drinking thou speaks on and this is to confess Christ come in the flesh the just man on the earth that doth good and sins not who is greater then Solomon and such deny the Pharisees and Papists and all that justifie themselves are Lyars before him and to Heb. 7. 19. him Solomon confessed though the Law made not perfect yet he doth all that come to him and so presents them to the father and this is Isa 59. 19. our standart against the enemy that would overflow us which the hireling knows not whos 's the sheep are not nor their pasture who are not wretched nor under the power of the deceiver which things thou would charge upon us qu. 11. Whether those that deny Scripture to be Gods Word as these quakers do and deny that there is any such person as Jesus Christ which suffered at Jerusalem now glorified in Heaven in the humane nature and only cals somwhat that is within themselves by the name of Christ I say whether are not these abominable infidells having nothing to do with the name of Christians Ans That we deny the person of Jesus who suffered at Ierusalem now glorified in Heaven in his body is a lying slander but thou that denies God to be the word and sayes the Letter is the Word art ignorant both of the word and Scriptures as plainly they shall witness a-against thee which sayes God is the word and the word of God is the Ioh. 1. Name of Iesus as the Scripture declareth but never takes that name Rev. 19. 11. to its selfe And the word of God endures for ever and this is the word 1 Pet. 1. 25. which by the Gospel is preached which is not the Letter and thou that knowest not the Letter within thee art the Infidel and Reprobate 2 Cor. 13. 5. thou speaks on who hath nothing to do with the name of a Christian who art adding thy lyes and slanders as though only we limited Christ within us because we witness him in us so with the Scripture thou art proved to be ignorant of them and the power of God from which they were written qu. 12. Is it not damnable hypocrisie in the wretches to prate so much of Scripture and call for Scripture while they thus deny it to be Gods word Ans In this query thou shews thy confusion one while charging us to prate too much of Scriptures and call for Scriptures and yet thy end is to make people believe that we deny Scriptures because we will not own the Scriptures by the name of Christ who is called the word of God and in thy seeking occasion to slander but can finde none thou shews thy damnable hypocrisie and wretchedness denies both the Word and Scripture que 13. Is it not damnable hypocrisie in them to call themselves Christians when they are infidells and deny the person of Christ crucified to be in Heaven Ans It is damnable hypocrisie and wickedness for thee to continue thylying saying that we deny the person of Christ crucâ—fied to be in 2 Cor. 13. 5. Heaven and thou thy self art the infidell who cannot believe Jesus Christ in the Saints but calls it a thing within us but canst not own it by the name of Christ as in thy 11 query and that faith is Reprobate Ioh. 5. 10. and thou that knows not Christ in thee art the Infidell for he that believes hath the witness in himself qu. 14. Is not he a Pagan and no christian
Antichrist who denyed Christ in them but they that believe hath the witness in themselves and they that abode not in the Doctrine of Christ and had the Father and 2 Iohn 9. 10 the Son they was not to receive them into their houses neither bid them God speed and wouldst thou be found in these practises and have us to apply these Scriptures to us who deny those practises thou canst not hide thy self here when thou finds us in those things apply thou those Scriptures unto us in the mean time take thy portion from them being condemned by them and we have considered those Scriptures and finde them written against thy generation and your practise and so we apply them unto you And for the clearer manifesting what Gospel and faith thou Preaches I shall lay down these queries following they being that which every true Minister knows and very needful to be known to all people FIrst Hath the first Adam power upon earth to defile all that are in him and hath not the second as much power and vertue to cleanse from all sin all that are in him if so then what is the cause men must commit sin and be imperfect while they live in this world 2. Whether is that new birth spoken on without which none can be saved Christ formed in believers or only a believing that he was manifest in the flesh 1655 years since and hath not the Devil and reprobates this beliefe latter mentioned 3. Hath any life eternal in them but who hath the flesh and blood of Christ in them and is life eternal known any other way savingly in this world while people live 4. Is any the Sons of God further then they are guided by the Spirit of God in all things and is not the Spirit of God a sufficient guide to all who have it in all things without any other help according to the measure received 5. Whether the Spirit of God in them who have it according to its measure be not the absolute Judge of all Spirits the opener of all Scriptures and whether needs it any visible thing to add to it or can any other thing judge it 6. Whether can any other Spirits judge of Scripture or any of the works of God aright but wrests Scripture to the destruction of creatures and calls light darkness and darkness light and can any other spirit judg according to God in any thing 7. Whether the Word of God can be changed or can it admit of severall meanings as to one particular thing is it visible or invisible â—â—r is there any word but one and whether was that word before the letter and shall be when the letter is turned to dust 8. Whether is the least measure of saving faith present power against the greatest power of darkness and able to keep out of all sin whatsoever if the creature abide in it 9. Whether ever any Minister of Christ had any hand in imprisoning any man for coming into their meeting places or was any beat in the meeting places where a Minister of Christ was preacher and was it not the manner of the Apostles to reason and dispute in the Synagogues against their false worship and was not all persecutors and fighters against God who opposed them and is it not the same now where the same Spirits are and is that the Spirit of God or of the Devil which sayes its no more persecution to put such in prison than to burn a thiefe in the hand as thou dost 10. Where that temple of God is where the man of sins sits shewing himself that he is God and must not the Light of Israel reveale him first where he is and then binde him and cast him out and when he is cast out whether is not the body of sin wholly put off yea or nay or can he return in again unless the creatures mind go out to his temtations first and do not such depart out of the covenant of life and faith and so make shipwrack of the good conscience 11. Whether is the light of Christ Spirituall or can it be known any other way but in Spirit within and is not the light of Christ within the absolute way out of death and darkness or doth it stand need of any temporall thing to help it to enlighten those who are turned to it believe in it and love it 12. Whether is the Gospel Ministry the same it was in the Apostles times both for matter and manner means and maintenance if nor when was it changed and by whom into Steeplehouses Tythes and great Parsonages and that order of worship now used seeing you are erred out of the way of the Apostles in every particular of your worship 13. Whether may not the Spirit of God in whom it is use the same words against false teachers now as it former hath done against them that was found in the same practise and is there any plainer tryall of these two Spirits in this world theâ— by their fruits herein as is found in Scripture and is it now any more railing and blaâ—pâ—emy than it was then or by what name mâ—â—t a lye be called according to Scripture and the practise of Christ These queries I have not put forth to keep up strife but being things much contended about with many if thou in plainness give an accompt oâ— thy faith herein the difference may be known betwixt us and you Priests Teachers and whether of us owns the Saints practise as is declared in Scripture but if thou fold them up by six together and send us to a book to seek an answer we know not where as thou dâ—dst in thy last book or if thou answer them with sleighting and shuffling when thou come to the Thing intended as thou hast done thou wilt be seen and thy cover wil discover thee to all the children of light FINIS