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A54177 The new witnesses proved old hereticks, or, Information to the ignorant in which the doctrines of John Reeve and Lodowick Muggleton, which they stile, mysteries never before known, revealed, or heard of from the foundation of the world, are proved to be mostly ancient whimsies, blasphemies and heresies, from the evidence of Scripture, reason and several historians : also an account of some discoourse betwixt L.M. and my self, by which his blasphemous, ignorant and unsavory spirit is clearly and truly manifested, in love to the immortal souls of those few, who are concern'd in the belief of his impostures / by a living true witness to that one eternal way of God, revealed in the light of righteousness W.P. Penn, William, 1644-1718. 1672 (1672) Wing P1326; ESTC R15258 38,470 64

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new thing 'T is strange therefore that Moses was not rather of the two elected to represent him in Heaven who was a Figure of him on Earth But though Reeve would not tell us so I am of the mind I know the Reason of it namely That Christ did not call Moses Moses but Eli Eli when upon the Cross and I am perswaded he had no other Ground for that Conceit not considering that Eli Eli are Hebrew words importing no more Elias Elias then they do Moses Moses but My God My God as the place expresly shews us Much more might be said but let this serve Thirdly That the Immortal God could never Dye or cease to be is manifest and the contrary Blasphemously False 1. If God was he that made all things and by whom they are upheld as all believe that believe there is a God at all then had he ceased to be the Creation had ceased to have been upheld and consequently all had fallen into its first Chaos or the World can subsist without Him 2. That he whose Nature it was never to have Beginning and ever to live without Variation could never become so contrary to his own Nature and Being as to change dye or cease to be but such was the true God therefore he never dyed 3. If Saints live move and have their being in God as say Reeve and Muggleton pag. 201. D.L.G. then either God never dyed or there were no Saints when the Jews Crucified Christ or the Saints dyed too They deny them all they say God Dyed and there were Saints and they Lived Moved and had their Being in God though Dead which how all or any of them can hang together let sober People judge 4. If God dyed who lived and by whom for nothing can live of it self that had beginning from or dependance on another as had all the visible World on God therefore because all lived and was preserved that had its Being from God He from whom they had their Being could not be annihilated whilst they remained in being 4. If God was raised by Elias then either Elias was the True God or Elias the Creature was stronger then Jehovah the Great Creator Let this serve to confute and forever to overturn these idle Chimera's of those filthy Dreamers Reeve and Muggleton That this Blasphemous Conceit of the Immortal God's Mortality is not new I shall make appear 1st Valentinus is said opened to have published at Rome That Christ brought a Body down from Heaven and that he after some time passed through the Virgins Body again Noetus affirmed That the Father Son and Holy Ghost were Flesh or that one Person of the Son of Man or that Person so long since at Jerusalem to be Father Son and Spirit and that when he suffered on the Cross the Father Son and Holy Spirit dyed See Euseb his 4th Book and 10th Chap. Ireneus Epiphanius Heres 31. 57. about Anno 150. which is 1522. years since What Strange New Revelation this is Lastly I May mention another of their Tenets held at this day by all Calvinists abroad and of several Sects in these Nations namely Predestination or that God from all Eternity without any other Inducement then his own Pleasure hath decreed some for Salvation and some for Damnation contrary to which all their Obedience or Rebellion shall be in vain to alter his Determination That this Principle is Accurst by SCRIPTURE I prove First The Righteousness of the Righteous shall be upon him and the Wickedness of the Wicked shall be upon him but if the Wicked will turn from all his Sins that he hath committed and keep my Statutes he shall surely live he shall not dye Ez. 18.20 21. 1. If Righteousness or Wickedness are the Grounds of God's Rewarding or Punishing the Souls of men then is there no Predestination previous without consideration had to their Works but the Text affirms most plainly therefore such Decrees are denyed and disowned 2. If Man may turn from his Righteousness and Wickedness then are the Means no more inevitably predestinated for men to use then before mentioned but men may turn from either and accordingly they will be rewarded therefore no such Predestinated Damnation or Salvation Secondly For it is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour who will have all men to be saved and to come unto the Knowledge of the Truth 1 Tim. 2.3 4. If the Apostle writ by the Spirit of God that gives to know the Mind of God then it was the Good Will of God that all men not excluding any upon a Predestination should come to the Knowledge of the Truth and be saved And consequently there is no Predestinated Restraint upon men's Understandings from knowing the Truth nor fore-appointed Bar from their enjoying the End of such True Knowledge even the Salvation of their Souls Thirdly The Lord is not slack concerning his Promise as some men count slackness but is long suffering to us-ward not willing that any should perish but that all should come to Repentance 2 Pet. 3.9 The Long-suffering of God either related to the Elect or Reprobate or Neither Not to the Elect because there is no need of fearing their Perishing Not to the Reprobate for there is no possibility of their Repentance Therefore to neither and consequently either the place is spurious or deceitful or else those kind of Elections and Reprobations are meer Phantisms Let these few Instances serve of those hundreds that might be mentioned most expresly to confirm the same That this is highly Inconsistent with REASON I briefly prove First It renders God most Vnwise to make so many thousand Creatures on purpose to Rebel against him to Kill Lye Steal Blaspheme and commit all manner of Outragious Wickedness to the grieving of his own Spirit the making him Repent he had made the World and Obstructing of his Glorious Work of Reformation Secondly It greatly Disparageth his Justice which consists in proportioning Rewards and Punishments to the Good and Evil Works of Men and overturns both by making the Eternal States necessary and unavoidable upon a Predestination without any Regard to their Works so that man is damn'd for not doing what he can't do no more then it is possible for him to break an Almighty Decree Thirdly It quite destroyes his Mercy and renders him the most Cruel of all Beings for instead of not being willing or desiring the Death of a Sinner He is here made to desire and take Pleasure in it too nay so essential is this Unutterable Cruelty to his Glory as say the Asserters of this Opinion that it would be lessened or ecclipsed without it Oh Infamous Fourthly But above all things it strikes at the very Root of God's Rectitude and Faithfulness and makes him worse then the worst of Men or Devils for whilst he sayes Your Sins have kept good Things from you as I live I delight not in the Death of a Sinner Repent and that Iniquity
same Glorious Nature both in Spirit and Bodie as God is T.S.T. p. 46. Therefore the most Wise and Holy Creator created the Bodies of Angels Spiritual and their Natures Rational and he made the Body of the Man Adam Natural and his Soul Spiritual For if their Spirits and Bodies had been both of the Divine Nature then it would have been impossible for them to have been capable of any Sin or Evil no more then the Creator Himself for what would have been formed but Creators only instead of Creatures D.L.G. pag. 9 10. Animadversion II. If to be in Body and Spirit Spiritual be to be Creators then Gods and if the Saints are to be of the same Body and Spirit then they are to be Creators and consequently Gods which is absurd For if the Reason why Man was not at first made all Spiritual but the Soul Spiritual and the Body Natural was because he had been a Creator as they say which was impossible then if Man is to be of the same Body and Spirit that God is as they affirm Man is to be a Creator in the next World Monstrum Horrendum Contradiction III If the very God-head had not dyed that is If the very Soul of Christ which the Eternal Father had not dyed in the Body or with the Body to quiet or satisfie the Cry of the Guilt of Sin in Men's Spirits all men would have perished to Eternity Thus the Father and the Son was but one unseparable Person in Immortal Glory from all Eternity and became in time one unseparable Person in Mortality T.S.T. p. 25 26. If Angels and Men had been both of God's Divine Nature in their Creation then instead of their being capable to be changed into a higher or lower Condition at the Divine Pleasure of the Creator would they not rather have been Unchangeable Creators then Changeable Creatures D.L.G. p. 9. Animadversion III. If the Reason why Men and Angels are not of the Divine Nature be That they are subject to Change and that if they had been made of it they would not have been capable of Mutation into lower or higher Degrees at Divine Pleasure then because God is of that Divine Nature it is inconsistant with his Nature to Change or be Transmuted as they often speak from an higher State to a lower and so their whole conceit of the Deity 's Mortality is vain and by themselves Contradicted Contradiction IV. Again Many seeming wise men do imagine the Lord to be a vast Spirit D.L.G. p. 16. Others blasphemously say that the spirit of Man is God and that the Body only dyes These say also God is an Infinite Spirit T.S.T. p. 44. Is not that Infinite Spirit and its Glorious Properties but only one Essence or God-head Substance D.L.G. p. 106. You may know that all things are possible and very easie for an Infinite Spirit to bring to pass D.L.G. p. 114. Animadversion IV. It can be no Crime for any to believe God to be an Infinite or Vast Spirit as one while they would have it whilst presently they call the God-head Substance an Infinite Spirit and confess all things to be possible unto an Infinite Spirit O Gross Contradiction Contradiction V. I say In the Great and Notable Day of the Lord by his Decree they shall every one of them rise out of the Dust together not with the same Bodies that dyed because there was somewhat of God in those Bodies T.S.T. p. II. So likewise that Infinite Spirit abiding within the glorious Body of Christ is so unspeakably fiery Glorious that no Created Spirit of Man nor Angel is able to bear the In-dwelling Essence of it D.L.G. p. 69. Animadversion V. If something of God dwells in this Life in the Souls and Bodies of Men then it is not so fiery Glorious but it may abide in them and they not be consumed For God's Nature or Essence is irreconcileable to nothing but Sin the Righteous shall behold him Face to Face So that one while God dwells in Men another while if it should be so Man would be Consumed Behold the Self-Opposition of these Miserable Witnesses Contradiction VI. How can any Rational Wise Man possibly think that Man or any other Living Forms should ever be without a Glorious Creator to give them their Beeings at first D.L.G. p. 16. This was the Creator's very case in the matter of Creation and who dares speak against it no Spiritual Wise Man I am sure only some Lustful Persons may dispute against it though it be contrary to their own Reason when it is sober D.L.G. p. 12. I confess it is not only contrary to Reason but far above all Reasons Reach truly to understand the Mysteries of the Creation D.L.G. p. 114. Animadversion VI. If an Appeal be made to rational Men concerning the Creation by a God and if it be contrary to sober Reason not to believe so then it is not far above nor contrary to all Reason to understand the Creation for else why is it render'd by them so agreeable to Reason and an Appeal made unto Rational Men concerning it Contradiction VII Again For your Information in whose Persons the Lord by his Holy Spirit Delights to dwell T.S.T. p. 22. Whoever thou art that boastest of a God and a Christ and his Ordinances and of a Glory to come without thee in the highest Heavens if thou shouldst be left to the Pride and Envy of thy Formal spirit to condemn the Invisible Teachings of the Lord Jesus Christ in his Innocent People because they are contrary to thy Opinion I say from the Everlasting Emanuel That thou art also but a Reprobate D.L.G. p. 68 69. For in him dwelleth all the Fulness of the Godhead bodily and from his Fulness we all receive and Grace for Grace If Christ or his Spirit were within men when they uttered those words all Faith or Hope in reference to Eternal Glory was vain D.L.G. p. 67 68. Animadversion VII If Christ delighteth to dwell in the Persons of his People by his Eternal Spirit and that he thereby teacheth their Souls what he requires from them as say they then it is not in vain to believe or hope though Christ or his Spirit were within as they also say nay they affirm That the Souls of the Redeemed is the Throne of God on which he now sits D.L.G. p. 46. And therefore though Christ or his Spirit were in Believers yet that would not make their Faith and Hope void Why Because they stand therein Contradiction VIII Is that Eternal Spirit in its Heavenly Vertues any thing else but Immortal Crowns of bright Burning Glories Though the Eternal Spirit be that Invisible God that by the Power of his Almighty Word hath created all things and though all Power Wisdom and Glory proceeds only from an Invisible Eternal Spirit D.L.G. p. 106. Can this Infinite Spiritual Glory be sensible of its Divine Excellency or be a perfect Blessedness except he hath a distinct Body suitable to