thus_o scotus_n not_o only_o teach_v transubstantiation_n himself_o but_o prove_v it_o out_o of_o s._n ambrose_n who_o make_v most_o frequent_a mention_n of_o the_o change_n and_o conversion_n of_o the_o very_a nature_n of_o bread_n which_o be_v the_o thing_n express_v by_o the_o word_n transubstantiation_n by_o which_o it_o be_v plain_a that_o scotus_n must_v have_v hold_v this_o doctrine_n for_o the_o substance_n thereof_o to_o be_v as_o ancient_a as_o s._n ambrose_n at_o the_o least_o and_o if_o so_o ancient_a then_o even_o from_o the_o beginning_n his_o meaning_n therefore_o in_o say_v it_o be_v determine_v of_o late_a in_o the_o council_n of_o lateran_n be_v only_o this_o that_o whereas_o the_o word_n of_o consecration_n may_v be_v understand_v of_o the_o real_a presence_n of_o our_o bless_a sauiour_n body_n either_o by_o transubstantiation_n that_o be_v by_o change_n of_o the_o bread_n into_o his_o body_n or_o otherwise_o so_o that_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n do_v remain_v the_o church_n have_v determine_v that_o the_o word_n be_v to_o be_v understand_v in_o the_o former_a sense_n as_o may_v be_v gather_v by_o his_o manner_n of_o speak_v of_o the_o church_n expound_v of_o scripture_n which_o he_o say_v she_o do_v by_o the_o same_o spirit_n wherewith_o the_o faith_n be_v deliver_v to_o we_o to_o wit_n by_o the_o spirit_n of_o truth_n 11.9.3_o v._o scot._n in_o 4._o sent._n do_v 11.9.3_o which_o be_v nothing_o against_o the_o antiquity_n of_o transubstantiation_n and_o though_o it_o be_v also_o the_o common_a belief_n of_o the_o church_n from_o the_o beginning_n yet_o it_o may_v well_o be_v say_v not_o to_o have_v be_v de_fw-fr substantia_fw-la fidei_fw-la yribarne_n speak_v because_o it_o have_v not_o be_v so_o plain_o deliver_v nor_o determine_v in_o any_o council_n till_o greg._n the_o 7._o his_o time_n wherein_o it_o be_v first_o define_v against_o berengarius_fw-la and_o that_o but_o by_o a_o particular_a or_o provincial_a roman_a council_n which_o notwithstanding_o the_o article_n in_o itself_o may_v be_v ancient_a though_o not_o so_o express_o deliver_v as_o i_o declare_v more_o ample_o in_o the_o first_o chapter_n 25._o you_o have_v little_a help_n then_o sir_n humphrey_n from_o alfonsus_n a_o castro_n scotus_n and_o yribarne_v which_o although_o you_o have_v yet_o be_v not_o that_o sufficient_a for_o discharge_v of_o your_o credit_n you_o have_v promise_v we_o acient_a father_n against_o transubstantiation_n which_o these_o three_o be_v not_o for_o one_o of_o they_o to_o wit_n yribarne_n be_v perhaps_o now_o alive_a another_o to_o wit_n alfonsus_n a_o castro_n live_v not_o pass_v 100_o year_n ago_o the_o three_o to_o wit_n scotus_n about_o 300._o year_n since_o which_o be_v far_o from_o the_o antiquity_n of_o father_n as_o we_o ordinary_o speak_v of_o they_o wherefore_o bethink_v yourself_o at_o last_o you_o bring_v we_o a_o father_n or_o two_o to_o wit_n s._n aug._n and_o theodoret_n tell_v we_o that_o s._n aug._n be_v so_o whole_o you_o that_o maldonat_n expound_v a_o place_n in_o the_o 6._o of_o s._n john_n say_v that_o he_o be_v persuade_v that_o if_o s._n aug._n have_v live_v in_o these_o time_n and_o see_v that_o caluin_n expound_v the_o same_o place_n as_o he_o do_v he_o will_v have_v change_v his_o mind_n and_o for_o theodoret_n you_o say_v that_o valentia_n observe_v he_o to_o say_v that_o the_o consecrate_a element_n do_v remain_v in_o their_o proper_a substance_n and_o shape_n and_o figure_n he_o make_v the_o like_a answer_n that_o it_o be_v no_o marvel_n if_o one_o or_o more_o of_o the_o ancient_a father_n before_o the_o question_n be_v debate_v do_v think_v less_o considerate_o and_o true_o of_o transubstantiation_n this_o be_v all_o that_o ever_o you_o have_v out_o of_o the_o father_n which_o how_o little_a it_o be_v and_o how_o much_o to_o your_o shame_n shall_v upon_o examination_n appear_v io._n aug_n er_fw-mi 26._o in_o io._n 26._o for_o s._n augustine_n then_o what_o be_v it_o that_o he_o say_v in_o favour_n of_o you_o in_o expound_v that_o verse_n of_o the_o 6._o of_o s._n john_n where_o our_o saviour_n say_v your_o father_n have_v eat_v manna_n and_o be_v dead_a he_o that_o eat_v this_o bread_n shall_v live_v for_o ever_o he_o say_v that_o their_o father_n that_o be_v the_o naughty_a and_o unbelieve_a people_n of_o the_o jew_n die_v to_o wit_n spiritual_o in_o their_o soul_n because_o they_o in_o eat_v manna_n do_v consider_v only_o what_o it_o present_v to_o their_o outward_a sense_n and_o not_o what_o it_o represent_v unto_o their_o mind_n by_o faith_n whereas_o the_o good_a man_n among_o they_o as_o moses_n aaron_n phinees_n and_o other_o who_o he_o say_v be_v our_o father_n and_o not_o they_o do_v not_o die_v to_o wit_n spiritual_o because_o they_o do_v not_o consider_v it_o only_o according_a to_o the_o sense_n but_o according_a to_o faith_n remember_v that_o it_o be_v but_o a_o figure_n and_o a_o figure_n of_o this_o heavenly_a bread_n which_o we_o have_v as_o the_o same_o holy_a father_n say_v express_o in_o the_o same_o place_n hunc_fw-la panem_fw-la significavit_fw-la manna_n manna_n signify_v this_o bread_n and_o he_o say_v it_o be_v the_o same_o of_o judas_n and_o other_o bad_a christian_n which_o receive_v of_o the_o altar_n and_o by_o receive_v die_v because_o they_o receive_v it_o ill_o do_v not_o this_o make_n much_o for_o you_o now_o sir_n humphrey_n do_v not_o you_o see_v how_o whole_o s._n aug._n be_v you_o how_o he_o say_v that_o manna_n be_v a_o figure_n of_o this_o our_o heavenly_a bread_n that_o we_o receive_v it_o from_o the_o altar_n do_v not_o all_o this_o make_v fine_o for_o you_o but_o you_o will_v say_v then_o if_o it_o make_v nothing_o for_o we_o why_o do_v maldonate_fw-it say_v that_o if_o s._n aug._n have_v live_v in_o these_o time_n he_o will_v have_v interpret_v otherwise_o i_o answer_v not_o that_o this_o interpretation_n be_v for_o you_o but_o because_o the_o other_o be_v more_o against_o you_o to_o wit_n thus_o whereas_o s._n augustine_n give_v the_o reason_n why_o they_o that_o do_v eat_v manna_n die_v to_o be_v because_o they_o do_v not_o eat_v it_o with_o faith_n maldonate_fw-it make_v the_o difference_n to_o be_v not_o so_o much_o between_o the_o person_n which_o do_v eat_v as_o between_o the_o food_n which_o they_o do_v eat_v say_v that_o our_o saviour_n make_v this_o a_o special_a prerogative_n of_o the_o b._n sacrament_n far_o above_o the_o manna_n that_o this_o holy_a sacrament_n give_v life_n to_o they_o that_o eat_v it_o which_o the_o manna_n do_v not_o give_v of_o itself_o and_o indeed_o with_o dew_n reverence_n be_v it_o speak_v to_o s._n augustine_n authority_n this_o interpretation_n be_v more_o suitable_a to_o the_o text_n and_o discourse_n of_o our_o saviour_n in_o that_o whole_a chapter_n which_o be_v to_o compare_v and_o prefer_v that_o true_a bread_n which_o he_o say_v his_o heavenly_a father_n do_v give_v before_o that_o of_o manna_n which_o moses_n give_v their_o father_n it_o be_v more_o also_o against_o the_o haeretique_n of_o these_o time_n in_o regard_n it_o be_v more_o for_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n which_o they_o labour_v might_n &_o main_a to_o depress_v and_o that_o be_v the_o very_a reason_n why_o caluin_n rather_o follow_v the_o former_a interpretation_n not_o for_o any_o love_n to_o truth_n or_o reverence_v which_o he_o bear_v to_o s._n augustine_n authority_n 27._o how_o false_a then_o and_o absurd_a be_v that_o scoff_a speech_n of_o you_o sir_n humphrey_n in_o the_o next_o leaf_n of_o your_o book_n where_o you_o say_v ironical_o thus_o s._n augustine_n do_v not_o right_o understand_v the_o corporal_a presence_n for_o he_o will_v have_v change_v his_o opinion_n if_o he_o have_v live_v in_o these_o day_n as_o if_o forsooth_o maldonate_fw-it do_v say_n that_o s._n augustine_n do_v not_o right_o understand_v the_o real_a presence_n and_o that_o he_o will_v have_v change_v his_o opinion_n concern_v the_o same_o if_o he_o have_v live_v now_o in_o these_o time_n you_o hereby_o insinuate_v as_o if_o s._n augustine_n think_v otherwise_o thereof_o then_o we_o now_o teach_v but_o how_o gross_o false_a this_o be_v may_v appear_v plain_o by_o what_o i_o have_v here_o say_v to_o wit_n that_o it_o be_v not_o the_o real_a presence_n whereof_o either_o s._n aug._n or_o maldonate_fw-it speak_v but_o how_o they_o that_o eat_v manna_n have_v dye_v and_o they_o that_o eat_v the_o body_n of_o our_o lord_n shall_v live_v according_a to_o our_o sauiour_n saying_n which_o be_v clean_o a_o different_a thing_n wherein_o sir_n humphrey_n you_o be_v line_v s._n aug._n somewhat_o but_o maldonate_fw-it you_o be_v line_v much_o more_o by_o make_v as_o if_o he_o acknowledge_v s._n augustine_n to_o be_v against_o the_o real_a presence_n and_o that_o he_o shall_v
shall_v send_v forth_o the_o rod_n of_o his_o power_n to_o rule_v in_o the_o midst_n of_o his_o enemy_n 109._o psal_n 109._o that_o be_v of_o worldly_a wisdom_n and_o power_n otherwise_o it_o have_v be_v no_o wonder_n beside_o that_o though_o these_o man_n be_v at_o first_o weak_a and_o unlearned_a in_o worldly_a learning_n yet_o by_o the_o holy_a ghost_n they_o be_v replenish_v with_o all_o knowledge_n of_o heavenly_a wisdom_n and_o endue_v with_o power_n from_o heaven_n of_o which_o their_o learning_n s._n hierome_n have_v a_o large_a and_o excellent_a discourse_n paulin._n hier._n ad_fw-la paulin._n which_o not_o to_o be_v too_o long_o i_o refer_v you_o unto_o now_o by_o this_o be_v also_o answer_v your_o other_o place_n of_o s._n matthew_n of_o hide_v thing_n from_o the_o wise_a and_o reveal_v they_o to_o little_a one_o for_o it_o be_v understand_v of_o little_a one_o by_o humility_n for_o only_a such_o be_v apt_a to_o receive_v heavenly_a wisdom_n and_o such_o can_v no_o haeretique_n be_v that_o proud_o prefer_v his_o own_o judgement_n before_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o whole_a catholic_a church_n as_o if_o god_n have_v forsake_v his_o church_n and_o enlighten_v he_o alone_o which_o be_v as_o much_o to_o say_v as_o that_o the_o funne_n do_v not_o shine_v to_o the_o whole_a world_n else_o but_o shine_v in_o only_a at_o his_o window_n but_o here_o be_v enough_o of_o this_o matter_n 7._o now_o for_o miracle_n which_o you_o say_v we_o make_v a_o character_n of_o the_o church_n it_o be_v true_a we_o do_v indeed_o but_o whereas_o you_o call_v they_o the_o work_n of_o satan_n i_o answer_v it_o be_v a_o say_n that_o can_v come_v from_o none_o but_o a_o child_n of_o satan_n to_o attribute_v the_o work_n of_o god_n to_o satan_n but_o our_o comfort_n be_v that_o our_o saviour_n foretell_v we_o of_o it_o and_o arm_v we_o against_o it_o by_o his_o own_o word_n &_o example_n si_fw-mi patrem_fw-la familias_fw-la beelzebub_n vocaverunt_fw-la 10.25_o mat._n 10.25_o quanto_fw-la magis_fw-la domesticos_fw-la eius_fw-la if_o they_o call_v the_o father_n of_o the_o family_n beelzebub_n how_o much_o more_o his_o family_n and_o if_o the_o pharisee_n attribute_v our_o sauiour_n miracle_n to_o beelzebub_n be_v it_o to_o be_v think_v that_o haeretique_n who_o far_o surpass_v the_o impiety_n of_o the_o pharisee_n will_v not_o do_v the_o same_o of_o the_o miraculous_a work_n which_o his_o servant_n do_v in_o his_o name_n that_o be_v for_o his_o honour_n and_o by_o his_o power_n this_o you_o do_v sir_n humphrey_n or_o rather_o will_v fain_o do_v make_v our_o miracle_n to_o seem_v the_o work_n of_o satan_n and_o you_o will_v also_o prove_v it_o to_o be_v a_o mark_n of_o a_o false_a church_n and_o foretell_v by_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n for_o proof_n whereof_o you_o bring_v something_o out_o of_o s._n paul_n 2._o ep_n to_o the_o thessaly_n of_o a_o strong_a delusion_n and_o deceivablenes_n of_o unrightuousnes_n which_o god_n shall_v send_v 22._o 3._o reg._n 22._o v._n 22._o because_o we_o do_v not_o receive_v the_o love_n of_o truth_n but_o remember_v sir_n humphrey_n there_o be_v one_o in_o scripture_n that_o start_v up_o and_o say_v ere_o spiritus_fw-la mendax_fw-la in_o ore_fw-la omnium_fw-la prophetarum_fw-la i_o will_v be_v a_o lie_a spirit_n in_o the_o mouth_n of_o all_o the_o prophet_n this_o your_o discourse_n show_v he_o not_o to_o have_v be_v far_o of_o when_o you_o write_v this_o for_o mark_v sir_n humphrey_n how_o many_o lie_v here_o be_v in_o a_o few_o line_n you_o say_v out_o saviour_n and_o his_o apostle_n discover_v the_o mark_n of_o a_o false_a church_n &_o where_o i_o pray_v you_o good_a sir_n do_v our_o saviour_n speak_v of_o such_o a_o false_a church_n or_o where_o do_v he_o set_v down_o the_o mark_n thereof_o and_o this_o among_o the_o rest_n for_o my_o part_n i_o find_v it_o not_o and_o as_o for_o the_o apostle_n though_o they_o speak_v many_o time_n of_o haeretique_n yet_o do_v i_o not_o find_v they_o to_o do_v they_o so_o much_o honour_n as_o to_o call_v they_o a_o church_n unless_o it_o be_v in_o that_o sense_n that_o holy_a david_n say_v the_o church_n of_o the_o malignant_a or_o s._n john_n the_o synagogue_n of_o satan_n 2.9_o psal_n 24._o apoc._n 2.9_o but_o yet_o even_o there_o i_o do_v not_o find_v the_o work_n of_o miracle_n to_o be_v a_o token_n of_o such_o a_o church_n from_o whence_o then_o do_v you_o prove_v it_o out_o of_o that_o place_n of_o s._n paul_n which_o you_o bring_v well_o suppose_v the_o proof_n to_o be_v good_a that_o be_v but_o one_o apostle_n not_o apostle_n in_o the_o plural_a number_n but_o beside_o sir_n humphrey_n here_o i_o convent_n you_o before_o your_o own_o conscience_n whether_o it_o be_v true_a that_o s._n paul_n speak_v there_o of_o any_o church_n or_o company_n of_o man_n or_o whether_o he_o do_v not_o speak_v of_o one_o only_a man_n to_o wit_n antichrist_n you_o can_v deny_v but_o he_o speak_v of_o he_o alone_o and_o that_o most_o plain_o how_o then_o do_v you_o make_v man_n believe_v he_o speak_v of_o a_o church_n be_v it_o not_o that_o lie_a spirit_n that_o put_v this_o into_o your_o head_n and_o who_o be_v those_o that_o the_o same_o apostle_n say_v that_o god_n shall_v send_v they_o strong_a delusion_n and_o that_o they_o shall_v believe_v lie_n because_o they_o receive_v not_o the_o love_n the_o truth_n these_o you_o say_v be_v catholic_n but_o you_o may_v say_v any_o though_o never_o so_o absurd_a and_o false_a by_o the_o privilege_n of_o your_o spirit_n how_o else_o can_v you_o say_v a_o thing_n so_o evident_o false_a it_o be_v most_o clear_a by_o the_o apostle_n phrase_n and_o discourse_n the_o person_n also_o to_o who_o he_o write_v consider_v that_o he_o mean_v that_o of_o the_o same_o kind_n of_o people_n of_o who_o and_o to_o who_o our_o saviour_n speak_v in_o a_o manner_n the_o same_o word_n ego_fw-la venio_fw-la in_o nomine_fw-la patris_fw-la mei_fw-la &_o non_fw-la accipitis_fw-la me_fw-it 5.43_o io._n 5.43_o si_fw-la alius_fw-la venerit_fw-la in_o nomine_fw-la svo_fw-la illum_fw-la accipietis_fw-la i_o come_v in_o the_o name_n of_o my_o father_n and_o you_o do_v not_o receive_v i_o if_o another_o shall_v come_v in_o his_o own_o name_n you_o will_v receive_v he_o these_o be_v the_o jew_n who_o reject_v christ_n shall_v receive_v antichrist_n neither_o can_v it_o belong_v any_o way_n to_o catholic_n who_o though_o you_o may_v say_v they_o have_v forsake_v the_o faith_n of_o christ_n yet_o you_o can_v deny_v but_o they_o once_o receive_v he_o whereas_o both_o our_o saviour_n and_o s._n paul_n speak_v of_o they_o that_o will_v not_o receive_v he_o it_o be_v the_o spirit_n you_o wot_v of_o that_o suggest_v this_o unto_o you_o as_o that_o also_o which_o follow_v next_o where_o you_o say_v that_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n foresee_v that_o our_o doctrine_n will_v consist_v in_o forge_v not_o only_o of_o father_n of_o counsel_n of_o schoolman_n but_o of_o daily_a miracle_n for_o where_o do_v the_o spirit_n foretell_v our_o forge_n of_o father_n schoolman_n counsel_n etc._n etc._n you_o charge_v we_o before_o though_o false_o of_o elude_v or_o reject_v &_o counter_a fayt_v the_o father_n but_o not_o a_o word_n of_o forge_v schoolman_n or_o counsel_n till_o now_o whereof_o if_o you_o can_v have_v allege_v any_o example_n or_o shadow_n i_o presume_v we_o shall_v have_v have_v it_o before_o now_o i_o take_v this_o therefore_o to_o be_v but_o a_o hot_a fit_n of_o your_o spirit_n which_o transport_v you_o beyond_o yourself_o and_o sure_o unless_o you_o have_v some_o such_o help_n it_o be_v not_o possible_a for_o you_o so_o to_o over_o line_v it_o as_o you_o do_v here_o as_o for_o that_o which_o you_o bring_v here_o out_o of_o lyra_n of_o feign_a miracle_n wrought_v either_o by_o priest_n or_o by_o their_o companion_n for_o lucre_n sake_n it_o show_v you_o will_v say_v something_o if_o you_o know_v what_o 14._o 1._o cor._n 14._o be_v it_o so_o that_o some_o naughty_a priest_n or_o their_o companion_n work_v feign_a miracle_n for_o lucre_n sake_n what_o then_o be_v there_o no_o true_a miracle_n therefore_o a_o proper_a argument_n like_o this_o there_o be_v tinn_n and_o copper_n in_o the_o world_n ergo_fw-la no_o silver_n or_o gold_n some_o bad_a man_n ergo_fw-la none_o good_a a_o trim_a argument_n sir_n humphrey_n 8._o but_o to_o conclude_v this_o section_n you_o come_v with_o a_o say_n of_o saint_n augustine_n which_o will_v make_v all_o sure_a which_o be_v this_o that_o as_o miracle_n be_v necessary_a before_o the_o world_n believe_v to_o induce_v it_o to_o believe_v so_o he_o that_o seek_v to_o be_v confirm_v by_o wonder_n now_o be_v to_o be_v wonder_v at_o most_o of_o all_o himself_o in_o refuse_v to_o believe_v what_o
essay_n of_o your_o poor_a endeavour_n to_o make_v the_o world_n see_v it_o be_v no_o difficult_a matter_n for_o a_o mean_a lay_v man_n to_o prove_v the_o ancient_a visibility_n of_o the_o protestant_a profession_n provoke_v thereto_o by_o a_o iesuit_n challenge_n to_o show_v out_o of_o good_a author_n that_o the_o protestant_n church_n be_v visible_a in_o all_o age_n before_o luther_n and_o this_o you_o undertake_v to_o do_v not_o only_o out_o of_o the_o most_o orthodox_n father_n but_o alsoe_o out_o of_o the_o romish_a bishop_n doctor_n cardinal_n etc._n etc._n this_o essay_n of_o your_o labour_n sir_n humphrey_n be_v poor_a indeed_o not_o to_o stand_v complementinge_v with_o you_o as_o i_o shall_v after_o show_v and_o for_o your_o proof_n out_o of_o father_n and_o other_o writer_n in_o the_o roman_a church_n we_o shall_v there_o also_o see_v what_o once_o they_o be_v that_o be_v either_o nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n or_o out_o of_o author_n brand_v with_o the_o mark_n of_o 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to_o find_v out_o the_o doctrine_n which_o be_v a_o thing_n more_o spiritual_a and_o less_o subject_a to_o the_o sense_n by_o that_o which_o be_v corporal_a and_o more_o subject_a to_o the_o view_n of_o all_o sort_n of_o man_n for_o this_o be_v the_o way_n that_o all_o scholar_n in_o the_o teach_n of_o all_o science_n take_v to_o wit_n to_o begin_v with_o that_o which_o be_v know_v and_o evident_a and_o by_o it_o to_o come_v to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o that_o which_o be_v hide_v according_a to_o aristotel_n doctrine_n 6._o and_o this_o have_v ever_o be_v the_o way_n which_o the_o holy_a father_n have_v take_v either_o in_o prove_v the_o catholic_a faith_n or_o disprovinge_v of_o heresy_n so_o tertullian_n marcio_n tertullian_n praescrip_n cap._n 32._o &_o lib._n 3._o car_n adu_fw-la marcio_n so_o irenaeus_n 43.45.46_o irenaeus_n lib._n 3._o cap._n 1.2.3_o &_o lib._n 4._o cap._n 43.45.46_o so_o cyprian_n 76._o cyprian_n ep_v 52._o &_o 76._o optatus_n parm._n optatus_n lib._n 2._o adver_v parm._n and_o most_o of_o all_o that_o great_a doctor_n s._n augustine_n 7._o augustine_n psal_n 2._o part_n don._n &_o ep_n 165._o &_o the_o util_a credend_a cap._n 7._o in_o several_a place_n and_o particular_o in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr utilitate_fw-la credenai_fw-la where_o write_n to_o his_o friend_n honoratus_n who_o he_o labour_v to_o draw_v from_o the_o manichaean_n heresy_n and_o put_v case_n that_o he_o do_v doubt_v what_o religion_n to_o follow_v he_o say_v without_o doubt_n he_o be_v to_o begin_v his_o enquiry_n from_o the_o catholic_a church_n proculdubio_fw-la ab_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la catholica_fw-la sumendum_fw-la exordium_n for_o say_v he_o whereas_o there_o be_v among_o christian_n many_o heresy_n all_o which_o desire_v to_o seem_v catholic_n and_o call_v other_o haeretique_n there_o be_v one_o church_n as_o all_o grant_n if_o you_o regard_v the_o whole_a world_n refertior_fw-la multitudine_fw-la ut_fw-la autem_fw-la qui_fw-la noverunt_fw-la affirmant_fw-la 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be_v wont_v also_o to_o say_v a_o man_n be_v better_a not_o hear_v mass_n at_o all_o than_o not_o to_o hear_v it_o devout_o or_o a_o man_n be_v better_a not_o to_o do_v such_o or_o such_o a_o thing_n than_o not_o to_o do_v it_o well_o or_o willing_o and_o the_o like_a though_o indeed_o in_o our_o judgement_n we_o think_v it_o better_o the_o thing_n be_v do_v though_o with_o some_o imperfection_n than_o not_o at_o all_o but_o this_o we_o say_v to_o signify_v the_o desire_n we_o have_v to_o see_v it_o well_o do_v or_o that_o we_o do_v not_o receive_v that_o content_n by_o the_o slender_a or_o slight_a manner_n of_o do_v it_o and_o this_o be_v the_o very_a truth_n of_o s._n chrysost_o say_n 10_o bell._n de_fw-fr miss_n lib._n 2._o cap._n 10_o as_o bell._n make_v it_o to_o appear_v plain_o both_o by_o a_o example_n out_o of_o scripture_n and_o by_o other_o argument'_v out_o of_o s._n chrysost_o himself_o which_o you_o may_v look_v better_o upon_o again_o and_o consider_v well_o with_o 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once_o in_o a_o twelve_o month_n 10._o the_o 9_o ancient_a author_n be_v prudentius_n who_o word_n you_o cite_v not_o but_o only_o say_v thus_o if_o we_o cite_v prudentius_n bellarmine_n answer_v i_o say_v no_o more_o of_o he_o but_o that_o he_o play_v the_o poet_n but_o what_o i_o pray_v you_o sir_n be_v the_o reason_n you_o forbear_v to_o cite_v prudentius_n his_o word_n or_o sense_n any_o man_n may_v easy_o guess_v there_o be_v something_o in_o the_o wind_n something_o that_o you_o think_v better_o conceal_v then_o discover_v but_o i_o shall_v for_o once_o supply_v your_o want_n herein_o first_o put_v you_o in_o mind_n that_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o section_n you_o tell_v we_o you_o will_v show_v how_o we_o elude_v or_o reject_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n or_o to_o use_v your_o own_o word_n the_o record_n and_o real_a proof_n in_o father_n and_o other_o learned_a author_n touch_v the_o chief_a point_n in_o controversy_n betwixt_o us._n now_o let_v we_o see_v 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all_o this_o section_n as_o if_o you_o allege_v only_o such_o as_o make_v for_o you_o in_o your_o controversye_n against_o we_o and_o your_o very_a word_n which_o you_o use_v here_o thus_o if_o we_o cite_v prudentius_n etc._n etc._n import_n as_o if_o you_o do_v cite_v prudentius_n for_o yourself_o in_o that_o matter_n whereto_o bellarmine_n answer_v yet_o it_o be_v plain_a on_o the_o other_o side_n that_o there_o be_v not_o any_o difference_n betwixt_o you_o and_o we_o in_o that_o matter_n for_o i_o never_o hear_v that_o any_o haeretique_n of_o this_o time_n say_v any_o such_o thing_n as_o that_o the_o damn_a find_v any_o release_n or_o ease_v of_o their_o pain_n by_o the_o prayer_n of_o the_o lyve_n what_o say_v you_o then_o sir_n humphrey_n do_v not_o you_o allege_v prudentius_n to_o very_o good_a purpose_n do_v not_o this_o show_v a_o strange_a contentious_a spirit_n in_o you_o that_o care_v not_o what_o you_o say_v whether_o it_o be_v to_o the_o purpose_n or_o not_o so_o it_o may_v seem_v somewhat_o against_o we_o though_o indeed_o it_o be_v not_o but_o now_o for_o bellarmine_n answer_n it_o be_v true_a and_o good_a and_o it_o be_v well_o know_v that_o poet_n word_n be_v not_o always_o to_o be_v so_o strict_o interpret_v nor_o truth_n to_o be_v altogether_o so_o exact_v at_o their_o hand_n as_o at_o other_o man_n the_o restraint_n which_o they_o be_v fain_o to_o use_v in_o the_o number_n of_o their_o verse_n give_v they_o a_o little_a more_o liberty_n in_o the_o matter_n 11._o the_o 10._o tertullian_n 6._o bell._n de_fw-fr eccl._n lib._n 3._o cap._n 6._o who_o word_n you_o do_v not_o alsoe_o cite_v but_o only_o say_v that_o if_o you_o object_v he_o bellarmine_n answer_v his_o authority_n be_v of_o no_o great_a account_n when_o he_o contradict_v other_o father_n and_o when_o it_o appear_v he_o be_v no_o man_n of_o the_o church_n his_o word_n i_o say_v you_o do_v not_o cite_v but_o yet_o in_o say_v if_o we_o object_v he_o and_o indeed_o in_o name_v he_o you_o seem_v as_o if_o you_o have_v some_o controversy_n with_o we_o in_o that_o point_n for_o which_o he_o be_v cite_v which_o be_v of_o the_o virginity_n of_o our_o b._n lady_n in_o our_o sauiour_n birth_n that_o be_v whether_o she_o be_v a_o virgin_n in_o the_o birth_n alsoe_o or_o not_o but_o though_o the_o haeretique_n of_o this_o age_n general_o speak_v very_o mean_o and_o contemptible_o of_o this_o most_o sacred_a virgin_n yet_o i_o do_v not_o find_v that_o your_o protestant_n be_v so_o earnest_a against_o her_o virginity_n as_o to_o make_v the_o contrary_a a_o point_n of_o your_o belief_n much_o less_o a_o chief_a point_n as_o you_o make_v all_o that_o you_o bring_v ancient_a author_n for_o in_o this_o place_n but_o for_o the_o matter_n it_o be_v this_o bellarmine_n speak_v of_o a_o authority_n of_o s._n ambrose_n his_o which_o may_v seem_v at_o first_o sight_n to_o make_v against_o the_o same_o then_o say_v that_o origen_n and_o tertull._n have_v something_o like_o also_o and_o so_o answer_v altogether_o he_o show_v of_o origen_n &_o s._n ambrose_n that_o they_o be_v not_o against_o we_o by_o expound_v those_o place_n which_o seem_v against_o it_o by_o other_o plain_a place_n out_o of_o they_o for_o tertullian_n he_o say_v his_o word_n be_v obscure_a nor_o much_o to_o be_v regard_v when_o he_o contradict_v other_o father_n and_o when_o it_o appear_v he_o be_v no_o man_n of_o the_o church_n which_o last_o word_n you_o translate_v false_o and_o withal_o leave_v out_o a_o authority_n of_o special_a moment_n the_o word_n false_o translate_v be_v these_o cùm_fw-la constet_fw-la since_o it_o appear_v whereas_o you_o say_v when_o it_o appear_v which_o be_v a_o different_a