his preposterous actions Physiologus Preposterous actions indeed for the diuell to appropriate to himselfe the peculiar organon of the possessed mans soule Do you imagine the Lord euer propounded any such end to himselfe in the creation of bodies Or do you suppose the Lord euer granted so large a commission or that the diuell himselfe euer receiued such an absolute power concerning the bodies of men But go to what becomes of the soule or spirit all the while the diuell himselfe is really inherent in the possessed mans bodie Remaines the soule still in that bodie as in her proper habitation appointed of God till the day of her vtter dissolution by death Or is it for the whole time of the diuell his being in that bodie vtterly exiled thrust out from the same Lycanthropus Naie the soule is not euen then secluded or shut out from the bodie at al but continueth and lieth therein like a subdued prisoner fast bound hand and foote yeelding ouer to the diuel for that present his whole interest concerning the bodie and endureth perforce his inexorable and tyrannous crueltie Physiologus But tell me I pray you is not the soule or the minde of a man an incorporall substance or a spirit equally diffused and spred throughout the whole bodie and euerie part thereof according to powers and proportion not Arithmeticall but Geometricall so as all the members of the bodie it selfe doth effectually fulfill their peculiar offices accordingly They being the proper instruments of that selfesame minde or spirituall substance furdering freely the organicall operation thereof and excecuting readily whatsoeuer the minde shall giue them in charge And that therefore this selfesame bodie being thus vtterly depriued as you say for the present of the soules organicall operation is in effect but dead to the soule because wheresoeuer is an vtter priuation of the soules operations concerning the bodie there the life of that man is for the present dissolued Hold you all this for a truth Lycanthropus Yea I may not denie any part thereof Physiologus Seeing then you doe flatly conclude that the minde or spirit of man is the first substantiall forme or action in a liuing bodie and the originall or primarie cause of all effects whatsoeuer performed duly therein as being that onlie whereby we doe liue perceiue desire are moued in place and doe also vnderstand how is it possible that the soule or mind of a man being naturally in perpetuall motion should at any time lie idle in her bodie it being the proper Organon of the soule peculiarly appointed vnto it by God yea euen vnto the very dissolution thereof Or how should the said soule or minde lie bound like a prisoner in her proper bodie and not execute effectually those selfesame operations and powers which are peculiarly appropriated vnto it for the special seruice of that selfesame bodie Lycanthropus What meane you by the proper operations of the soule or minde Physiologus I vnderstand thereby all those peculiar actions which doe necessarily succeede the powers of the minde as proper effects peculiarly appertaining vnto it Otherwaies this peculiar power of the minde it being a meane betweene the substance and operations of the minde are the only efficient cause of the said mindes operations should be vtterly in vaine and to no purpose at all vnles the peculiar effects of that selfesame power did vndoubtedly and immediatly succeede the same Howbeit these selfesame effects cannot possibly succeed the saide power of the minde so long at the least as the Diuel himselfe really possessing the bodie doth wholy and absolutely take vp the said bodie with the members thereof to accomplish his mischieuous purposes As for example all the operations of the minde are either organical or animal The organical operations they are those seuerall actions which the minde can in no wise accomplish but in the bodie it selfe and by all the seuerall members thereof as by the proper instruments for that purpose peculiarly appointed vnto it Namely the nutritiue augmentatiue and generatiue operations appertaining especially to the vegetatiue life also the facultie of seeing hearing tasting smelling handling and of common sense moreouer the imaginatiue the memoratiue the concupiscible irascible and motiue faculties being all attendant vpon the sensitiue life Now then these and euerie of these are the organical operations of the minde yea and such also as the minde cannot possibly effect but in her owne bodie and by all the partes thereof as by the peculiar instruments appointed of God And therefore how should the possessed mans minde his bodie it selfe being thoroughly surprised and taken vp as you say by the Diuel at any hand accomplish either all or any one of these organical operations Lycanthropus As the minde her selfe cannot but be in perpetuall motion so surely being forcibly restrained from these her organical operations she must for the present be faine to put in execution and to practise as she may her animal operations Physiologus The animal operations they are such speciall actions as the minde of it selfe both can and may effectually accomplish without the bodie namely those three essential powers of the reasonable soule called the vnderstanding affection and will Whereof the two last are fitly termed the intellectiue appetite whereas the organical affections arising only from out of the hart the lyuer and entralles are called the sensitiue appetite But for as much as these animal operations all the while the minde it selfe is seated in her proper bodie are by the order of God appointed to be the directours and moderatours of all the organical operations I aske you by what meanes the mind may accomplish her appointed dutie concerning the direction and moderation of those her organical actions so long as the Diuel himselfe doth really and wholy take vp the said bodie with her seuerall partes to become the vnhappie instruments of his Diuellish attempts Lycanthropus I see no possible helpe but that the minde it selfe must giue place to the Diuel for a time Physiologus Giue place for a time for how long I beseech you Put case this man be really possest of the diuell for seuen yeeres togither or more and that in the meane time he should die before the diuell be dispossest of his bodie which for any thing knowne to the diuell he may very well do for his daies are determined which he cannot possiblie passe Now then the soule it selfe being surprized by death and so seperate from the bodie it selfe before she recouer her pristinate power concerning the saide bodie or any the organicall actions appertaining vnto it to whom must those the disordered actions wrought in the bodie all the whole time of the diuell his reall possession therein be imputed I pray you Whether to the possessed mans minde or to the diuell himselfe that possesseth his bodie And whether of both must yeeld an account vnto God for those seuerall actions of the sinfull bodie Lycanthropus The verie soule it selfe is answerable
I take it for those sinfull actions Physiologus But seeing sinne it selfe is onely a voluntarie transgression of the law of God how holdes it with equitie that the soule should be answerable for those selfesame organicall actions which she did neuer voluntarily assent vnto accomplish affect or approoue Lycanthropus Because the animall operations of the soule they being appointed by God to direct and to moderate the organicall operations of the bodie did faile in doing that dutie Physiologus How should shee possiblie accomplish that her appointed dutie concerning the direction and moderation of those organicall operations shee being before verie violently and absolutely dispossessed of the bodie it selfe by whom those organicall actions should haue beene wrought according to her proper and onely directions Besides that the peculiar actions of the vnderstanding affection and will are meere animall respecting either the minde it selfe or the minde and bodie togither Touching the minde it selfe her animall operations are onely to vnderstand to affect and to will These animall operations they are such as the minde her-selfe both may and doth effectually accomplish without the bodie and being quite seperate from it And also she hath her animall motions whereby she is locally mooued without the bodie and being quite seperate from it For so the soule of Lazarus his bodie being dead fower daies in the graue did locally mooue and returne yea by such a non organicall or animall motion the verie soules of the saued damned are at this present continually moued The animal operations respecting the minde and bodie togither they are the dutifull applying of the vnderstanding affection and will to an orderly direction and circumspect moderation of al the organical actions To the timely discharge of which duty the minde especially is bound so long as she is naturally inherent or peculiarly predominant ouer the bodie Else she is freely exempt from all charge of the bodie and hath then her animall operations wherein her office doth wholie and onely consist And euen as in the minde so also in the body there be some such meere corporall actions and motions as the bodie it selfe both may and doth also accomplish without any direction or moderation of the minde As for example The dead carkasse of a man being quite seperate from the soule it hath notwithstanding her corporall dimensions figure situation and habite yea and is locally mooued either downewards by a natural motion or else vpwards or ouerthwart by a violent motion Yea and all these corporall operations and motions the bodie hath and may also accomplish by herselfe alone without any her soules direction moderation or guidance they being especially such actions and motions as appertaine not to the minde at all Now then as the soule hath some such animall operations peculiarlie appropriate to it as it may well and doth effectually accomplish without the bodie being freely seperate from it and therefore no reason the bodie it selfe should any waies be answerable for those peculiar actions of the minde whereunto she was no waies assistant so surely the bodie it hath and may haue some such corporall actions and motions peculiarly appropriated or violently enforced vpon it as it may and doth also effect without any the direction moderation or consent of the soule it being quite seperate from it or from any the directions thereof at the least and therefore it is absurd to imagine that the soule should be brought to account for any those peculiar actions or motions of the bodie which it neuer directed the bodie vnto nor neuer gaue consent to the same in any respect Lycanthropus I know not which waies to answere your speech howbeit very certaine I am the diuell hath really in man a corporall possession at least Physiologus How do you know it for certein sith the diuel is onelie a spirit of a spiritual substance simplie and absolutelie without all mixture of corporall matter and therefore he needeth no such real possession in anie mans bodie Lycanthropus He needeth no such real possession in any mans bodie I confesse in regard of his owne essential beeing Howbeit respecting more especiallie the timely execution of his tyrannicall tormenting of bodies there is necessarilie required in the parties possessed an essential possession at least Physiologus Why man as the Lord God in the verie first creation did constitute spirites and diuels essentiallie absolute in their owne proper beings without anie apparant necessitie of such an essential mixture with humane bodies so surelie you are neuer able to proue from the word that the infinite wise God did euer propound to himselfe in the creation of bodies anie one purpose at al concerning such essentiall possession of spirites and diuels Neither are you able to show by the scriptures that the diuel did euer receiue so large a commission from God concerning mens bodies For very certeine it is that the diuel did earnestlie entreate and the Lord for many respects did purposelie permit as much scope to the diuel concerning Iobs bodie as anie mans bodie besides either before him or after him and yet did the diuel neuer begge nor the Lord neuer graunt anie further power at al concerning the bodie of Iob then onelie an actual afflicting but not anie essentiall possessing at al. Besides that the whole man bodie and soule was preordained by the secret purpose of God to be for euer the liuelie image of his absolute maiestie respecting especially the perfection and holines thereof yea and which more is to be also a perpetuall habitacle and glorious temple for his sacred spirit and therefore it is incredible that the foreseeing wisedome of God would euer permit any such essentiall possession to spirites and diuels as should not onelie most beastlie pollute and deface his owne image but which more is euen reallie as it were transforme the habitation of his holie spirit into a filthie cage of vncleane spirites a most stinking stie for satan him selfe and a most horrible dungeon for damned diuels Lycanthropus Why sir this metamorphosis or change was primarilie effected in the persons of Adam and Euah who being both created according to the image of God concerning body and soule did not onelie quite loose the said image of God but which more is did presentlie put vpon them the verie image of the diuel who is called the strong armed man and they are now become that dwelling house of his which he possesseth and keepeth in peace Physiologus The image of God it was not lost in Adam and Euah as touching the essence but concerning onelie the perfection the sanctitie and holines thereof Neither did they essentiallie but onlie actuallie put vpon themselues the image of satan Neither did that strong armed man the diuel at any time essentially but onely effectively possesse or keepe them in peaceable possession as an house for himselfe And therefore either you must necessarily acknowledge the diuel to haue an essentiall possession not onelie in
which is too too absurd as was told you before Lycanthropus I wonder you are so peremptory in denying this point I hauing not onely the Philosophers as you heard euen now but ecclesiastical fathers both old and new on my side Orthodoxus Your philosophers they shoote faire and farre off as you also haue heard euen now You say you haue fathers both old and new on your side let vs see first whether your old fathers doe come any neerer the marke Lycanthropus First Origen he flatly affirmeth that spirits and diuels are endued with their proper bodies Orthodoxus Origen if that booke be his owne is not to be regarded concerning this question because therein he doth nothing but play the Platonist iumpingfull patte with Psellus in euerie point And therefore he deserueth none other answere then that which was giuen to those other before Let vs heare more authentical fathers or end the discourse Lycanthropus Hilarie he saith there is nothing which in it owne substance and in respect of creation is not corporall And therefore spirits and diuels they hauing their substance and being created are also corporall Orthodoxus Hilarie he saith so indeed but giues no one reason of saying so It is not enough for your selfe to crie out and say Hilarie he speakes it vnlesse Hilarie also doth prooue what he speake which he doth not in the place you alleage He onely propoundeth the matter without any proofe and may easily be answered thus The soule of man it hath her substance and was also created and yet incorporall For or euer it was infused into the bodie and after the dissolution thereof it doth substantially exist and is also immortall accomplishing continually her animall operations Neither needes shee an humane bodie in any respect of her proper essentiall being but onely in regard of her organicall operations as was shewed before And therefore Hilarie he helpes you nothing at all Lycanthropus Tertullian verie plainely affirmeth Angels and spirites to haue their peculiar bodies Orthodoxus Whatsoeuer Tertullian saith there concerning this question the Schoolemen they doe excuse and qualifie his speech on this sort They say that Tertullian by the name of bodie vnderstandeth onely the spirituall substance of Angels and nothing else And this he doth saie they in an onely regard of the simplicitie of that people with whom he delt who helde that nothing coulde possibly exist in nature without a bodie Tertullian therefore in that onely regard did purposely call the substances of spirites and diuels by the name of a bodie Lycanthropus Yea but Tertullian auoucheth further that God himselfe is also a bodie and therefore much more that spirits and diuels they haue their bodies His wordes be these Who will deny God himselfe to be a bodie although God indeed be a spirit Orthodoxus This is so farre from confuting as it rather confirmes that qualification which the Schoolemen doe make Namely that by the worde bodie Tertullian vnderstandeth nothing but the spirituall and simple substance of spirits and diuels Besides that it is one thing to be a bodie and another to haue a bodie Tertullian saith onely that God is a bodie he saith not there that God hath a bodie Lycanthropus Notwithstanding all this he saith elsewhere that spirits and diuels are corporall his reason is because the soules of men are also corporall Orthodoxus Herein his pouerty bewraieth it selfe being constrained as you see to beg his cause wherin also he would proue the same by the same namely corporall spirits by corporal soules Howbeit we haue proued before do here affirm it a fresh that the soules of men they are incorporal and therefore by consequence spirits and diuels they are not corporal but spiritual substances Besides all this Augustine verie flatly affirmeth that the incorporall doe differ fully from corporall substances and denieth withall that whatsoeuer is created the same is a bodie yea he sharpely reprehendeth and derideth Tertullian for auouching the soules of men to be corporall And in the end he thinks it too too absurd to hold that a reasonable soule should be a bodie in any respect because the same is onely and altogether incorporall And thus you may plainely perceiue by Augustine how vnfitly Tertullian doth fit your turne Exorcistes But Augustine himselfe elsewhere verie flatly affirmeth that all reasonable creatures are corporall substances yea and that euen the intellectuall creatures namely Angels spirits and diuels are euerie of them also corporall powers howsoeuer they subsist not of flesh and bloud Orthodoxus How Augustine agreeth with Augustine your selfe may plainely perceiue and therein also may wisely consider what credit consists in such varietie But that your Augustine may also receiue his answere let vs heare his argument whereby he would prooue spirits and diuels to be corporall substances Lycanthropus He reasoneth thus We doe therefore affirme the intellectuall powers to be corporall substances onely because they are circumscribed with place euen as humane soules are also inclosed with bodies Orthodoxus This is his argument Whatsoeuer is circumscribed with place that same is corporall but spirits and diuels they are circumscribed with place therefore spirits and diuels they are corporall I answere the proposition is faultie and halteth downe right For the localitie of spirits and diuels doth not simply depend vpon a bodie which after it owne manner I meane circumscriptiuely and sensibly is no doubt in a place but it ariseth properly from the finitouesse and dimensiuenesse of the angelicall nature it selfe Which said angelicall nature being created of God is therefore but finite and circumscribed also with those her owne termes which are competent and proper vnto her And therefore the intellectuall powers they are in a place because they be finite substances although yet they are in a place but definitiuely or determinately So then spirites and diuels you see they are vndoubtedly in a place because they be locall but they are therefore said to be local not because they be corporall as Augustine imagineth but for that being finite they haue their muchnesse or quantity after a sort I meane no predicamental but an intelligible quantity And therefore Augustine he speaketh soundly you see against Tertullian but proueth your purpose nothing at al. Exorcistes But the author of the Ecclesiasticall opinions writeth plainely that we must beleeue nothing to be incorporall or inuisible but onely God Who alone is truely said to be incorporall because he is euery where present replenishing al things and therefore also inuisible to euery creature because he is incorporall His first argument is framed thus Whatsoeuer is incorporall that same is euery where because vbiquity is the cause of incorporality But spirits and diuels they are not euery where therefore spirits and diuels they are not incorporal Orthodoxus The proposition with his prosyllogisme halteth downe right the same being a deceaueable Elench making that the cause which is not properly the
their coniecturall opinion Howbeit for a further declaration heereof I do answer with Gregorie Beda Damascene the Schoolemen and others who doe all iointly affirme that euen as the knowledge of spirits and diuels in comparison of our knowledge is verie excellent and woonderfull large although yet in comparison of God the same is but shallow and shorte so surely those the supposed bodies of spirites and diuels in comparison of our earthly and palpable bodies may fitlie be saide to be spirituall whereas yet in comparison of the omnisufficient and incircumscriptible spirit of spirites they may after a sort be saide to be corporall And this our censure concerning corporall spirites being rightly vnderstood as it ought to be that is being graunted comparatiuely may very well stande with the truth For certeine it is that Angels are not spirites purely simple as God is most simple neither are they infinite and incircumscriptible spirits as God alone is but are marshalled within their proper dimensions and bounds All which being graunted it doth not thereupon necessarily folow that therefore Angels they are not created incorporall finite spirits and such as after their manner are limitted definitiuely within their proper dimensions but this rather folowes thereof namely that therefore spirits and diuels they are not most simple most infinite illocal nor omnipotent powers For the specialls do alwaies retaine the common nature of their generall and therein they fitly accord howsoeuer by reason of some repugnant formes they doe otherwaies dissent among themselues And thus your Fathers you see both old and new they are fully answered concerning their supposed mannaging of this your opinion of corporal spirits or diuels Philologus Are you able Lycanthropus to reply to his answere Lycanthropus I am vtterly vnable But sir sith you so confidently do hold that spirits and diuels are incorporall let vs heare your reasons and authorities concerning this point Orthodoxus With very good will my reasons are these First spirits and diuels haue not flesh and bones saith Christ as you see me to haue Wherein it is very apparant that there is one substance of humane bodies and another of spiritual powers Spirits they haue neither flesh nor bones therefore they cannot be comprehended with the sight of the eie nor handled by the sense of feeling both which are proper to the sensible perceiuing of humane bodies Againe the Lord saith the Apostle hath made his spirits his messengers and his ministers a flame of fier The which place albeit Dauid doth properly vnderstand of the operation of winds yet for as much as the Apostle applieth the same to the Angels it is not to be doubted at all but as the name Spirit so likewise a spirituall essence appertaineth vnto them Againe we read that a legion of diuels namely sixe thousand sixe hundred sixtie and sixe possessed the man in the Gospell whom Christ deliuered But if diuels be corporall substances and doe essentially enter into the bodie of man it is vtterly impossible that there should so many be crouded together and all contained at once within the narrow corners of an humane bodie Exorcistes Some doe hold there was in deed but one onely diuell in the possessed whose name was Legion Orthodoxus As though it were possible that one onely diuell could be really inherent in two seuerall persons at once Besides that it is verie apparant in Marke and in Luke that there was not one but many diuels yea and Mathew also exchanging the name of one into many he saith the diuels besought Christ that they might goe into the heard of swine Exorcistes Sir I onely haue shewed you what some others doe hold but proceed in your purpose Orthodoxus I proceed thus The spirits or soules of men are incorporall therefore spirits and diuels are also incorporall For if the reasonable soule or spirit of a man be not corporall in any respect I meane if it be neither solide nor palpable as are the earthie and terrestriall bodies neither yet subtile or slender as are the airie and celestiall bodies then without doubt spirits and diuels they are likewise incorporall because they also are spirits For the nature and definitions of a spirit and a bodie do altogither and in euery respect differ betweene themselues And thus besides those Philosophicall reasons which Physiologus propounded before you haue hetherto heard from the Scriptures such seuerall arguments as doe verie plainely conclude the non being of corporall spirites or diuels Pneumatomachus Beleeue me Lycanthropus before we began this our conference I doubted greatly of the essentiall being of spirits and diuels Howbeit now I am cleere in that point and by this discourse doe farther perceiue them to be admirable and woonderfull powers Lycanthropus Verie true as you saie But sir let vs heare I beseech you your authorities also concerning this point Orthodoxus With verie good will Wherein I assure you that this our opinion concerning incorporall spirits and diuels is generallie receiued in the church of God approoued by the consent of many Diuines and confirmed fully from the Laterane Councel Lycanthropus For the generall receite thereof in the Church I make little doubt but let vs heare now your seuerall authorities Orthodoxus Content First Dionysius writeth thus Wee account not saith he the celestiall and deified powers or spirits to consist of innumerable feete or to haue a manifold countenance neither yet to be like vnto liuing and corporall creatures albeit the sacred Scriptures in speaking of them doe vse these Poeticall and fained formes Chrysostome he saith the Seraphimes are called spirits that is incorporall and supernaturall powers And a little after he saith they be called fierie or flaming creatures because their substance is most pure Augustine be defineth them thus Angels and diuels are spirituall powers incorporall substances inuisible insensible reasonable intellectuall and immortall the good ones they are shining and impassible the euill ones blacke and passible Theodoret he saith that God created the vniuersall nature of incorporall substances constituting decreeing and ordeining their said nature to be intellectuall and also immortall Andreas of Ierusalem he saith that Angels and spirites are all without their bodies Gregorie also he saith in like sort that spirits and diuels they haue no flesh Isidore he saith that Angels and diuels according to their nature are called spirits Damascene he saith that Angels and spirits are intellectuall substances euermore mooueable and free by the arbiterment of their proper power incorporall the ministers of God obtaining immortalitie by grace not by nature the portraiture bounds of whose substantiall being onely the creatour of spirites he knoweth himselfe Carolus magnus he saith the essentiall substance of Angels and diuels is immortall because they be spirits by nature Vigerius Saonensis he saith that Angels are all of them spirituall substances without any bodies at all consisting of vnderstanding and will and
no vndoubted true signes of any dispossessing of Satan But in all the adiurations which concerne the aforesaid examples there was no crying aloude no rending sore nor no leauing as dead therefore in all the adiurations which concerne the aforesaid examples there were no vndouted true signes of the dispossessing of satan Thus then it is very apparant you see by all the premisses that vnlesse you will purposely fall into palpable absurdities you may at no hand auouch that those cryings those rendings and tearings and that leauing for dead are the vndoubted true signes of the dispossessing of satan No you must rather perswade your selfe they were purposely reported for speciall and proper effects of that speciall and proper action of Christ and not considerately put downe for perpetuall and vndoubted true signes of all the actuall dispossessings of spirits and diuels in whomsoeuer Notwithstanding be it supposed which will neuer be prooued that your selfe did vndoubtedly driue foorth a diuel from the yoongman at Mahgnitton and that some cryings aloude some rendings sore and some leauing as dead were then also the speciall effects of that your supposed speciall action doe here tell vs I pray you after what speciall manner you effected the action Whether onely by meanes or by a miraculous manner Exorcistes Surely euen onely by meanes and not by any miraculous manner of working at all Physiologus Good Maister Orthodoxus let me argue this matter a little Come on Exorcistes doe you hold in good earnest that diuels may bee driuen foorth from men and that onelie by meanes Exorcistes I am very confident therein I assure you Physiologus Make your mind plaine before we proceede And tel me I pray you whether spirtts and diuels by very natural or corporall meanes may be truely dispossessed and driuen from men Exorcistes Yea euen by very naturall or corporall meanes Physiologus Why man spirits and diuels they are meere spirituall creatures But such is the proper condition of spirituall creatures that all corporall matters whatsoeuer they come short thereunto by many degrees and therefore we may boldly conclude that those corporall or sensible things can work nothing efficiently in spirits and diuels can offer no violence at all vnto them nor possibly expell them from any their actuall possessions Exorcistes Yes sir I am able to demonstrate this matter by an argument of comparison thus There is one and the selfesame condition of spirits and of liuing mens soules for they are both of them spirituall essences But euen by a meere corporall or sensible meanes may some violence be offered to liuing mens soules yea they may thereby eftsoones be separated quite from their bodies and therefore euen to spirits also by meanes of some corporall or sensible matter there may eftsoones some violence be offered and they also may be expelled quite from their actuall possessions in man Physiologus Your argument of comparison it consisteth not of such pares as are equally alike in euerie respect no it halteth downe right in that selfesame point wherupon it is more especially grounded and therefore it enforceth no necessarie conclusion vpon vs at all For the condition of spirits and of liuing mens soules howsoeuer alike in spirituall essence it is vtterly vnlike respecting the bodies whereupon they both worke Soules they are properly conioyned to their owne proper bodies as the verie first essential forme thereof appointed by God howbeit spirits not by any proprietie but by vsurpation rather they are onely actually there as the afflictors or tormentors permitted by God So then for those former respects the soules of liuing men doe necessarily require in those their owne bodies some such certaine dispositions and qualities as the diuels themselues they being no true essentiall formes of those bodies require not at all And therefore spirits or diuels they may actually afflict and torment those selfesame bodies of men how vnfitly soeuer they finde them whereas the soules of men vnlesse those their said bodies be aptly proportioned and fitted thereto they cannot informe them at all Exorcistes Sir howsoeuer you enforce a disparison betweene spirites and soules concerning especially their dealings with bodies and thereby would frustrate the force of my argument verie certeine I am that spirits or diuels they may be driuen foorth from mens bodies and that onely by meanes Physiologus But by what meanes I beseech you whether by an vncreated or by a created meanes Exorcistes Not by any vncreated meanes at all For how can I possiblie practise that thing which is either vncreated or not existing in nature Physiologus Then you do flatly conclude that spirites or diuels they may actually be dispossessed euen by a created or meere naturall meanes Exorcistes Yea so much I flatly conclude Physiologus This then I must tell you for certeine that you doe very fondly conclude you wotte not what For this is vndoubtedly true that no created or naturall meanes whatsoeuer may efficiently extend themselues to any such supernaturall actions as do anie way concerne the dispossessing of diuels Because all such supernaturall actions they proceed not at all from any power of nature but from the onely power of obedience By the onely efficacie of which obedientiall power euen any thing of euerie thing may easilie be effected although yet in an onely respect of the mightie Iehouah himselfe the sole and onely efficient thereof For albeit the Saints of the Lord namely Moses and manie others are saide to effect supernaturall actions yet therein wee must rightly vnderstand that onely the Lord alone he workes that by his Saints which he workes by himselfe And therefore in saying as you do that spirits or diuels they may be dispossessed from men by any created or naturall meanes you do therein very ignorantly auouch you wot not well what Exorcistes Yes sir I wot well what I say and am able to demonstrate the truth thereof by many examples Physiologus Let vs heare your examples which make for this matter Exorcistes With verie good will First therefore Iosephus verie plainely reporteth that when Titus and Vespasian besieged Ierusalem there was an Exorciste that time in the hoste who by a certeine stone in a ring deliuered many that were possessed of Satan Moreouer Eleazar the Hebrew as the said Iosephus recordeth he vsed certeine Exorcismes which were inuented and made by Salomon for the expelling of spirits and diuels namely ringes rootes herbes and such other like sensible matters But the stone in the ringe those rootes and those herbes they were onely created and meere naturall meanes therefore some onely created and meere naturall meanes it hath and may haue in it selfe an actuall power for the dispossessing of spirits and diuels Physiologus Why doe you not also alleage that which the said Iosephus and Aelianus also reporteth concerning the herbe Cynospastus being otherwaies called Aglaphotis which hath they say a certeine speciall operation for the powerfull expelling of spirits and
Hermes Trismegistus Hugo Cardinalis Harmonia confessionum Henricus Iaakob Hortus sanitatis I IOsephus Isidorus Iacobus Pamelius Iohannes Brentius Iohannes Drusius Iohannes Chrysostomus Iohannes Caluinus Iohannes Piscator Iohannes Auenarius Iohannes Ferus Iohannes Wierus Iohannes Wulcurio Iohannes Bromyard Iohannes King Iohannes Bodin Iustinus Martyr Iulius Scaliger Iohannes Darel Iohannes Gorraeus L LAmbertus Danaeus Leonardus Culmanus Leonardus Fuchsius Laurentius Codmanus Lauaterus Leuinius Lâ—mnius Ludulphus Lucas Lossius Legenda aurea Lucianus M MArtinus Bucerus M. in historijs Methodius Michael Psellus Marcilius Ficinius Malmesburius Malleus mallificarum Marcus Vigerius Moses Barsephus Moses Pellacherus N NIcephoras Nicholaus Lyra. Nicholaus Hemingius Nichol. Selneccerus Narration of Darel O OTho Casmannus Origines P PAulus Frisius Patricius Paulus Aegenitus Paulus Burgensis Petrus Martyrus Petrus Lambertus Petrus Thyreus Philosophus Pellicanus Philippus Barough Plinius Plutarchus Pompanatius Prosper Proclus Pythagoras R R. D. Kimhi Rodulphus Gualterus Robertus Rollocus Reginaldus Skotus Rhemish Testament Robertus Pontus Ruffinus S SEbastianus Martyr Stenchus Eugubinus Strabus Sanhedrin editio Basiliens T TErtullianus Thomas Aquinas Theophylactus Theodoretus Theodorus Beza Theupolus Timotheus Brichtus Tatianus Thomas Cooperus W WOlfgangus Muscul. Wilel Minatensis Wilelmus Fulke Wilelmus Perkins X Xantis Pagninus Z Zozomenus FINIS The seuerall arguments of the seuerall Dilogues following in order The first Dialogue pag. 1. The Argument 1 THat there are essentiall Spirits and Diuels as appeereth plainelie from their essentiall creations and effectuall operations Their spirituall and substantiall being The second Dialogue pag. 31. The Argument 2 THe power of Spirits and Diuels Their possession what it is with the seuerall parts thereof And whether the Diuell doth essentially enter into the possessed mans minde or not The third Dialogue pag. 64. The Argument 3 WHether Spirits and Diuels doe essentially enter into the possessed mans bodie or not And whether for that purpose they haue peculiar to themselues their true naturall bodies The fourth Dialogue pag. 99. The Argument 4 WHether Spirits and Diuels can assume to themselues true naturall bodies What bodies they are said to assume And how those Scriptures are to be vnderstood which be for this purpose produced The fifth Dialogue pag. 165. The Argument 5 WHether Spirits and Diuels can essentiallie transforme themselues into any true naturall bodie And how those Scriptures are to be vnderstood which many produce for that purpose The sixt Dialogue pag. 131. The Argument 6 OF actuall possession what it is And whether Spirits and Diuels in these daies of the Gospell do now actually possesse either the minde or the bodie by any extraordinarie afflicting or vexing The seuenth Dialogue pag. 199. The Argument 7 COmmon experience what it is Whether the actuall possession of Spirits and Diuels especially that supposed in the yoong man at Mahgnitton may be prooued thereby And of the Diuell his power of obsession The eight Dialogue pag. 232. The Argument 8 OF the vndoubted true force for the timely subduing of this the forenamed power of the Diuell Whether any created meanes may therein preuaile And whether praier and fasting haue any power in themselues to effect such a worke The ninth Dialogue pag. 263. The Argument 9 WHether praier and fasting be established by Christ as a perpetuall ordinarie meanes for the powerfull expelling of Spirits and Diuels Whether the power therein be a vocall or a personall power Or whether a true iustifying faith apprehending some supernaturall power of God doth effect that worke The tenth Dialogue pag. 304. The Argument 10 WHether a miraculous faith apprehending the power of God for the powerfull expelling of Diuels be yet still continued what a true miracle is And whether the working of miracles be now fullie determined in the true Churches of Christ The eleuenth Dialogue pag. 339. The Argument 11 A summarie recapitulation of all the premisses verie concludentlie repeating and proouing the precedent purpose with a patheticall perswasion to subscribe to the vndoubted truth thereof A briefe Analysis or summarie resolution of this present treatise the same affoording vnto vs Certaine Dialogicall discourses declaring especially 1. that there be spirits diuels this prooued from 1. Their essentiall creation 2. Their effectuall operation 2. What we haue to consider in them namely 1. Their power the same being a power either 1. Of possession and this also is either 1. Reall the same being either Mentall 1. essentially in the mind Corporal 1 essentiallie in the body by their assuming of true naturall bodies their traÌ„sforming of true bodies 2. Actuall this also either by a mentall afflicting and grieuing a corporall tormenting vexing 2. Of obsession which stands either in an outward assaulting and circuÌ„uenting inward suggesting and tempting 2. The subduing of that power by a power 1. Immediate and this in Christ. 2. Mediate by others this either Apostolicall hauing from Christ a power ouer diuels Ecclesiastical it being in the church either Primitiue wherin the continuaÌ„ce of that power Successiue wherin the compasse of that power DIALOGICALL discourses of SPIRITS and DIVELS The first Dialogue THE ARGVMENT That there are essentiall Spirits and Diuels as appeareth plainely by their creation and operation Their spirituall and substantiall being The speakers names PHILOLOGVS LYCANTHROPVS PNEVMATOMACHVS PHYSIOLOGVS ORTHODOXVS EXORCISTES Philologus WHat Lycanthropus and you maister Pneumatomachus my olde companions well mette at this present From whence come you whether walke you so fast if a man may be bolde to enquire the same at your hands without offending your persons or hindering your busines Lycanthropus We come euen now from that famous citie Mahgnitton my good friend Philologus and are presently trauelling towards the Iland of Eirtwab with speede vpon verie speciall and vrgent busines concerning the glorie of God and the good of his Church Philologus What newes from Mahgnitton I pray you Lycanthropus Newes sir the strangest newes I assure you that hath been heard of this hundred yeeres Philologus What newes is that Lycanthropus Of a yoong man there Who being reallie possest with a Diuell was very strangely or rather miraculously deliuered by prayer and fasting Philologus How strange newes soeuer the same seemeth to vs verie certaine it is as appeeres in the Gospel that Diuels haue been driuen foorth by prayer and fasting Howbeit that the Diuel should now in these daies of the Gospell haue a reall possession in any is greatly doubted of the most and very flatly denied of some Lycanthropus The real possession of Diuels may iustly be called in question if Pneumatomachus his opinion be canonized for currant who very confidently auoucheth that there are neither Spirits nor Diuels at all Which being so howe should there be a reall possession of Diuels in any Philologus Verie true for Diuels must first be before they can haue a reall possession in men But Pneumatomachus he holds I am sure no such opinion vnlesse it be for argument sake Pneumatomachus Yes I am verie confident
essentiall being The rather because euery creature else how contemptible soeuer being once created it hath an essentiall substance and if the basest of all then much more the Angels they being indeed such excellent creatures Pneumatomachus Well goe to how next from their effectuall operations Orthodoxus Thus their operations haue beene and now are apparantly euident to all the world whether we respect the Lord or his church So that for any to doubt of their essentiall being is to call in question the sun-shine at mid-day and as wel may he denie their operations whatsoeuer Pneumatomachus Good sir is this your substantiall proouing of Angels and Spirits I denie that the Lord God euer created any Angels at all and then to what purpose doe you vrge their supposed operations Orthodoxus Sith you so confidently denie both Spirits and Diuels tell me what you imagine those to be which we generally hold for Spirits and Angels Pneumatomachus Sir I take those your supposed spirits for none other matters at all but the good or euill motions and affections arising in men as also those your imagined Angels I hold them to bee nothing else but the sensible signes or tokens of Gods vnspeakeable power Orthodoxus You do then conclude it should seeme that our faith concerning those matters is grounded altogither vpon bare supposals and idle imaginations of wandring braines I like well your plainnes in laying open your minde although I alowe not your pestiferous opinions iumping so pat with the Parepateticall and Sadusaicall sort Who flatly denying either Angel or Spirite do confidently auouch that there is nothing immortall in man which is a verie dangerous gulph of hell that deuoureth and swaloweth vp all sound diuinitie and sincere knowledge of God For first by opposing your selfe against all the essentiall spirits and powers of the Lord what doe you else in effect but implicatiuely reiect the essentiall being of the holy Ghost and then next you do also by consequence verie flatly deny that there is any God at all for what I pray you is God but a Spirite Pneumatomachus Nay sir howsoeuer I oppose my selfe to the catholike opinion of Spirits and Diuels I do confidently auouch and confesse that there is one true euerliuing God of an incomprehensible inuisible and spirituall essence distinguished into the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost And moreouer concerning men and my selfe I do with like confidence verie cleerely acknowledge that euerie of vs also are essentiallie endued with spirituall and immortall soules Orthodoxus You cannot faithfully finally hold these infallible truthes from your hart but you must and will presently banish those other palpable errours from out of your brest For euen as Aaron his rodde deuoured foorthwith the counterfeite rods of all the Egyptian Sorcerers so surely these your confessed truths concerning the essentiall spirits and powers of the Lord being faithfully held from the hart will in the end I doubt not be another Aaronicall rodde to confute and confound those other Sadusaical sorceries wherewith the Diuel hath so dangerously bewitched your soule Lycanthropus Verie true if he be not to opinionate therein Pneumatomachus Sir howsoeuer I haue beene hitherto opinionate in this speciall point I am notwithstanding very loth that reason should be ouerruled by will or that the holy truth of God should giue place vnto errour and therefore proceed I beseech you in the timely vnfolding of this hidden mysterie Orthodoxus With very good will wherein also for your speedier conceiuing of that which is spoken we will first lay open the originall fountaine from whence this errour floteth abroad and then next hauing fully answered your arguments we wil directly prooue vnto you both Spirits and Diuels Exorcistes A very excellent order For there by first you shall cleere our iudgements and then next you shall the more fully confirme vs in the infallible truth Lycanthropus That is certainly so But what thinkes Pneumatomachos Pneumatomachus I acknowledge no lesse and do promise withall to giue an attentiue eare to whatsoeuer is spoken Orthodoxus Well then to proceede therein accordingly this I dare boldly affirme that your Parepatetical opinion or rather that this your Sadusaicall sorcerie concerning the non being of Spirits and Diuels proceedeth directly from a two-folde false ground Namely first from the naturall corruption of your proper minde and secondly from a carelesse misconstruing of some certeine places of Scripture Both which saide false grounds albeit I could and might well relate them my selfe yet because the first is rather Philosophical then Diuine I do purposely put ouer the prosecuting thereof as of al other like points to this my good brother if it please him to trauell therin reseruing the latter to entreate of my selfe Physiologus Sith it is your good pleasure to haue it so I will gladly giue my endeuour to satisfie the man so it seemeth him good Pneumatomachus With all my hart if first you will tell me who you are and what is your name Physiologus I am I assure you a friend to the truth and my name is Physiologos Pneâ—matomachus In very good time be it spoken But may I be bold by the way to aske you a question without offence Physiologus Propound at your pleasure and aske what you please Pneumatomachus Was not your name also purposely giuen to purport vnto vs your proper nature For Physiologus you say is your name which vnlesse I be fowly deceaued is as much to say as a babler or pratler of naturall Philosophie or it signifieth rather some notable discourser of naturall causes I hope you are none of those cogging companions of whom the Apostle doth wish vs beware who goe purposely about to spoile men with Philosophie and vaine deceit Orthodoxus Nothing lesse For the man I assure you is both a sound Philosopher and a sincere Diuine Neither would I haue you once to imagine that Paul doth there purposely oppose himselfe to all true Philosophie whether naturall or morall no but reprooueth rather that false and counterfeit Philosophie which hauing onely an appearance of truth and not the substance of truth it selfe is cunningly foisted in by cogging companions to spoile and deceiue mens mindes of the truth indeed For otherwaies all true Philosophie is the speciall gift of God and a principall helpe to Diuinitie so far foorth especially as she is made a submissiue Moderatour in naturall causes and not a commaunding Mistres ouer Diuinitie Then I assure you shee comes in her naturall kinde and thrice happie is he that hath a true insight into her according to that old accustomed saying Foelix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas The wight that could all causes skan Might count himselfe an happie man Now then such a Philosopher is this and therefore be bold vpon my warrant to harken freely vnto him concerning the first ground of your errour Pneumatomachus I credit your words let him therefore proceede in his purpose Physiologus
a blush that God and spirits haue visible formes and corporall substances And thereupon you doe rashlie conclude that spirites and Diuels must necessarily be euen such as your selfe by those places suppose or none at all But now because you your owne selfe with your corporall eies did yet neuer behold any such corporall Diuels as you by those Scriptures haue grossely imagined therefore you doe flatly resolue with your selfe that there are neither spirits nor Diuels at all Pneumatomachus Why what other thing else should those corporall formes attributed to spirits Diuels in the sacred scriptures import but either that Diuels and spirits are visible substances if those scriptures say true or that there are at the least neither spirits nor Diuels at all as I haue hitherto held Orthodoxus That the scriptures say true being truely vnderstoode no true harted Christians may dare to denie That there are also both spirits and Diuels though in truth and in substance they haue no such visible formes as those places of Scripture do literally import shall be prooued anone In the meane time this I must tell you for truth that those scriptures which attribute to God and spirites a corporall forme as eies eares hands feete bodies wings such like may at no hand be expounded literally but must rather be metaphorically and spiritually vnderstoode of vs. So that by any those corporall formes we may not grossely conceiue in God or in spirites such corporall members appertaining especially to their essentiall being but we must spiritually vnderstand â—hereby those their supernatural vertues operations and actions which by such corporall formes are metaphorically commended to our humane capacities And without doubt such a carnall misconstruing of scriptures was the onely maine cause which made the silly old monkes in elder times to fall fearefully into the palpable errour of the Anthropomorphites who by vnderstanding such scriptures literally did groslie attribute to God such humane actions and passions as are proper to men The holie scriptures then I perceiue they may not be interpreted hand ouer head neither are they in euery place to be opened literally Orthodoxus Nothing lesse for so should you fall into a thousand absurdities And therefore vnlesse you will purposely shew your selfe a swinish Saducee or impudently make your selfe knowne a monkish Anthropomorphite be now ashamed I beseech you of this palpable grossenes and hold confidently with the catholike church that there are essentiall spirites and Diuels Philologus Pneumatomachus howe goeth the matter Pneumatomachus That which hath beene hetherto spoken doth sufficiently set foorth a twofold ground of erronious opinions Howbeit this my opinion concerning the non being of Angels or spirits appeares not for any thing heard as yet to be erronious at all And I yet verely thinke as before that Diuels are none other thing else but those good or euill motions in men which doe maruellously comfort or afflict their minds Orthodoxus Thinke you so as you say Goe to then tell me I pray you what was the Serpent that tempted our grandmother Euah in Paradice Was that any good or euill motion in Euah If so then tel me further whether you thinke that motion was within or without her If within her how came the temptation then from the Serpent and from without her altogether But if it came from without her how should then the temptation be iustly accompted any motion of hers sith the same cannot truely be said to arise from within her Againe if you take Diuels to be but the good or euill motions in men what thinke you that tempter was who tempted Christ in the wildernes Was it thinke you any motion in Christ If yea then whether was it an euill or a good motion An euill motion you may not auouch it to be because Christ being free from all sinne could not possibly haue in him any euill motion at all As also it were verie absurd to affirme it a good motion for how could that motion be good which tempted Christ vnto euill Moreouer if you take Diuels for the good or euill motions in men what thinke you then that Legion was wherewith the two men were possessed Could the motions of men craue leaue and enter into a whole heardship of Swine And what became of those motions when they were cast foorth by our Sauiour Christ Were they drowned together with the Swine in the Sea If so what then became of the men themselues from whom as you dreame those motions arose Were they dead all the while their mindes were bereft of their motions For the minde you know is in perpetuall motion Or if those men all the while and euer after their motions were cast foorth and drownd in the Sea remained still in their liuely estate it should seeme that Spirits and Diuels are some other essentiall powers then the bare motions and affections arising in men Briefly if Diuels be nothing else but the good or euil motions in men what thinke you those tormentours to be which vexe and torment men in Hell with the Diuell and his Angels Yea and doe tell me I pray you what goeth to Hell the good or euill motions If only the euill what then must become of those other which were good in the man For sith none in this life can possibly be either so good or so euill but that they haue in them both good and euill motions it cannot otherwaies be but that either the good and euill motions in men must after this life be monstrously confounded together or else if the good motions goe roundly to Heauen and the euill vnto hell then the bodie and soule must be diuided part vnto heauen and part vnto hell like an indiuiduum vagum or some litle new nothing that hangs in the ayre To be short if man with his good and euill motions together goeth foorthwith either wholy to heauen or wholy to hell how then should his ioyes or his torments be either absolute or endlesse Because looke how fast his good motions doe minister comfort vnto him so fast at the least his euill motions will afflict and torment him Phylologus Surely Pneumatomachus this opinion I see is so absurd and so sottish as euen a sucking babe would blush to be taynted therewith Lycanthropus A sucking babe blush yea it is such a stale ridiculous iest as might make euen a mad man to hide his head in a corner Pneumatomachus Verie true and I also my selfe am now ashamed thereof Notwithstanding how soeuer it is certaine that spirits and Diuels be more then the good or euill motions in men it appeares yet for any thing heard that those your supposed Angels are nothing at all but the sensible tokens or signes of Gods power Orthodoxus What meane you by the sensible tokens or signes of Gods power Pneumatomachus I vnderstand thereby those extraordinarie iudgements of God which demonstrate vnto vs the incomprehensible maiestie and might of his power
away my cogitations are violently taken from me I meane morashe lebabi the possessions of my hart That is those happie and comfortable cogitations which my soule in a good conscience by the blessing of God did chalenge to it selfe by a peculiar right or possession In like maner from iarash ariseth the word morashah which signifieth properly such a kinde of possession as people enioy by a certaine peculiar right as appeareth in Deuteronomie where the people say thus Moses commanded vs a law morashah kehillath Iaakob I meane a peculiar inheritance for the congregation of Iaakob That is such an inheritance as shall passe by an hereditarie right or possession among the house of Israel from generation to generation The like vse of this word morashah doth euidently appeare by those seuerall quotations of scripture which we haue purposely put downe in the Margine By all which it is verie apparant that albeit the holy Ghost should haue purposely vsed any one of these Hebrew words to expresse your pretended possession of Diuels yet could you not haue concluded from thence any such an essentiall inherencie of Diuels in the bodies of men as you would beare vs in hand Licanthropus But doth not the Greeke word which the Septuagint vseth to expresse the word iarash import so much Orthodoxus Nothing lesse I assure you For from that word iarash ariseth orizo and orixomai which signifies to bound or determine the territories and possessions of land From thence also is deriued these following nownes namely orion and orismos which signifieth a bondarie a definition or constitution Also this word exorizo that is to exterminate or to disherite Also exorismos which betokenth an exile or banishment From whence also ariseth verie fitly the inheriting or dishinheriting or rather if you please the possessing and dispossessing of heirs The Gretians in like sort they vse another word called cleronomia which signifies properly an inheritance or rule of possessions Briefly albeit the holy Ghost in the new testament hath sundry words to set out the possession of things as appeareth by the places put downe in the Margine yet could no one of them all haue fitted your turne or possibly haue extended it selfe to this your pretended purpose By all the premisses then it is verie apparant that if the holy Ghost had euer determined to establish your supposed essentiall possession of Diuels he wanted not proper and significant wordes to expresse his said purpose Albeit notwithstanding if he had purposely put downe any one of these wordes either Hebrew or Greeke to import a possession vnto vs yet woulde no one of them all in any congruent speech haue euer beene able to auouch that essentiall inherencie of Diuels in the bodies of men which your selfe woulde fondly conclude from our English translation without any warrant at all from the originall text Lycanthropus Though none of the Euangelistes haue precisely put downe in any one of those places no such word at all as may properly expresse the essentiall possession of spirits and Diuels perhaps yet they haue some other word else equiualent therewith in sence Orthodoxus Perhaps no and without al peraduenture they haue not For the very word it selfe which the holie Ghost obserueth in euerie of those your quoted Scriptures is Daemonizoménoi which with all true interpretours both Latine Italian French and English is ordinarily and vsually translated Demoniakes that is men Diuillished I meane actually afflicted tormented or vexed with Diuels But no one of them all did euer translate it thus namely men essentially possessed with Diuels inherently in them Yea this very word Daemonizoménos is not onely so translated but is so also vnderstood of the most iudiciall and soundest Diuines For not any one of them all do vnderstand the same of essentiall possessions but euery of them do take it to signifie onely some such extraordinarie actual affliction vexation or torment as Satan himselfe by the speciall appointment of God doth effectiuely inflict vpon men for a time If you haplie doe call the truth of that which I speake into question let their seuerall writings be exactly considered and then tell me whether any one of them all do vnderstand by Demoniakes any such persons as are essentially possest with a Diuell inherently in them as your selfe very fondly imagine and not such rather as by the extremitie of those their actuall torments are become outragiouslie furious cruell and quite out of order Thus then by all the premisses it is very apparant you see that neither by a proper significant terme nor by any other word else equiualent therewith neither yet by the translations of learned Interpretours or the exquisite iudgement of soundest Diuines you may from those your quoted scriptures in any possible or congruent order vndertake to conclude as you doe the essentiall possession of spirits and Diuels but must necessarilie take them onelie for such Demoniakes or diuellished persons as are actually afflicted tormented or vexed by Satan Lycanthropus Why then shoulde the translatour so presumptuously put downe the word possession if no such thing be apparant in all the originall Orthodoxus That there is no such matter there as your selfe supposeth you haue sufficiently heard before Neither did the translatour himselfe as it seemes intend any such essentiall possessions but onely an actuall vexation by Satan howsoeuer he did to careleslie put downe the word possession as a worde more familiar amongst vs. No surely it is certaine the Euangelist himselfe he neuer entended such essentiall possessions by the word Daemonizoménoi but onely an actuall affliction vexation or torment And therefore the other two Euangelistes Marke and Luke reporting with Mathewe those selfesame stories concerning the aforesaide Demoniakes they vse not the worde possessed at all But those whom Mathewe intituleth Demoniackes Marke termeth a man hauing an vncleane spirite and Luke he saith there mette Christ a man who had a Diuel a long time Making it a matter meerely indifferent and alone in effect to be a Demoniacke and to haue a Diuel or an vncleane spirite as for the word possessed they neuer vse it neither is the same found throughout the originall applyed to Diuels And vndoubtedlie these words possession or possessed being carelesly thrust into the texte hand ouer head by our English translators is not the leaste occasion that the whole world by a common receiued errour from hand to hand hath beene so vniuersallie possessed with manie grosse errours concerning the Diuel his supposed possession in man Moreouer whereas you boldely affirme that the Euangelist Mathew in euery place els where like occasion is offered doth vsuallie obserue the selfesame phrase that is not so For speaking of the woman of Canaans Demoniacke daughter he saith not haue mercy on me for my daughter is pitifully possessed but my daughter is miserably vexed with a Diuel Exorcistes What then I pray you doth your selfe vnderstand by the Diuel his power of possession Orthodoxus By
substantially possesse the minde can neuer be proued and the contrary by me hath been plainly declared Notwithstanding I do freely confesse that the diuell hath an actuall or powerfull possession concerning mans minde so far foorth especially as tendes to the effectuall tormenting and tempting thereof other possession he hath none at all as shall be shewed hereafter Whereas therefore the diuell is said to enter into or to possesse the minde of a man that is to be vnderstood onely according to his effectuall working with the bodie it selfe And in this selfe same respect the possessed mans minde may truely be said to be silde with the diuell as the drunkards are saide to be filled with wine For the verie substance of the wine doth not substantially enter into the verie substance it selfe of the drunken mans minde because then there would be a violent rending and separation of substances as was shewed before but onely the fuming efficacie or power of the wine binding the vaines and sinnewes and stopping vp the secret passages of the vitall spirits is that which oppresseth the minde it selfe being peculiarly seated in her proper place The verie selfe same thing may be said concerning the diuell his mentall possession For the diuell himselfe touching his essentiall being doth nor essentially enter into the verie essence it selfe of the possessed mans minde because then there would be a penetrating of spirituall dimensions and so two distinct substances should be together and at at once in one and the selfe same place which were absurd to affirme as was shewed before but the diuell by his onely effectual power tormenting and tempting the sensible parts of man doth so mightily disorder the sensitiue faculties and so malitiously forestall the true notions and passages to a found vnderstanding as euen the minde it selfe it cannot but be maruellously distracted during the whole terme of that his tyrannicall dominion And this is all in effect that I yet see or can say concerning the diuel his mental possession Philologus This sir is enough I assure you and that which doth satisfie me to the full but what sayth Lycanthropus concerning this point Lycanthropus Howsoeuer you seeme to be satisfied me thinke yet in all reason that the diuel should haue essentiallie in some a mentall possession Physiologus Sith you relie so much vpon natural reason go to Lycanthropus let me argue this point to the ful Lycanthropus Take leaue and argue as pleaseth your selfe Physiologus You remember I hope how Maister Orthodoxus hath sufficiently showed before that angels and diuels are substantiall creatures and not any phantastical imaginations as was handled at large in our former discourse concerning that point Lycanthropus I remember it well and doe truelie beleeue the same to be so Physiologus Wel then sith yow hold spirites and diuels for substantiall creatures do now tel me whether you take them for spiritual or corporal substances Lycanthropus I know not what substances they are whether spirituall or corporall diuels I am certein they be verie pestilent diuels yea such dangerous diuels as vndoubtedly haue a reall possession in man Physiologus If you dare credit the Scriptures I will tell you God willing what creatures they are Lycanthropus I credit the Scriptures or else it were shame Physiologus This then I auouch vnto you for certaine that Angels and Diuels are Spirits by nature and Angels by office That they are not creators but creatures created by God Neither did they all issue out of one as all men by propagation were procreated from Adam but were all ioyntly togither and foorthwith created Neither is one in another as in the trinitie the father is in the sonne and the holy Ghost in both for then they should be of one and the selfe same substance whereas they are onely of like substance one to another Albeit they were created I confesse in a most absolute estate of substance but yet onely created For there is not one of them an infant a yoong one or an olde one neither come they to perfection by little and little or growe vp by nutriment and exercise but do continually retaine that selfe same estate of subsistance which they euer enioyed from their first creation By this then you see what creatures they are Lycanthropus This prooues them essentiall creatures which was prooued before howeit I haue nothing as yet from the sacred Scriptures concerning their peculiar substance Physiologus Yes I auouched them to be by nature essentiall spirits And this I say further that Angels and diuels are immortall and spirituall substances That they are so it is apparant in sundrie places of scripture I will saith the diuell be a lying spirite in the mouth of Achab his prophets Againe Christ cast out an vncleane spirit Againe the vncleane spirit walketh through drie places Againe he taketh to him seuen other spirits Againe we wrestle not against flesh and bloud but against spirituall wickednesses and so foorth All these and sundrie such places doe demonstrate vnto vs the truth of this matter Now then I reason thus The scriptures deliuer vnto vs not corporall but spirituall diuels therefore diuels are not corporall but spirituall substances I folow it thus Bodies and spirits are opposed the one to the other therefore they cannot possiblie be one and the same for as a bodie is not a spirit so neither is a spirit a bodie because a spirit hath not flesh and bones as a bodie hath Lycanthropus This I hold for an infallible truth Physiologus You acknowledge you say the diuels to be spirituall substances Well goe to then tell me whether you holde them not likewise for finite creatures and therefore also circumscriptible and locall Lycanthropus I doe for none but God alone can be infinite and incircumscriptible Physiologus Seeing you doe freely confesse the diuels to be spiritual substances finite and locall before we come to speake of their possession or placing doe tell me whether you take not that mans minde into the which as you saie he doth really enter to be for the time of his present possession the very receptacle or place that circumscribeth the diuell and whether the diuell also himselfe concerning his essence be not for that time wholy and substantiallie comprehended therein Lycanthropus Yes the verie minde it selfe for that present possession must needes be the receptacle wherein the diuell is wholie and substantially conteined Philologus Fie fie Lycanthropus this is too too absurd For by this meanes you make the minde of a man to be greater in muchnes in substance or essentiall being then the spirite of the diuell else howe should the diuell be possiblie comprehended therein sith that which is lesse can at no hand include or containe the greater Lycanthropus Nay that is no necessarie sequel because the diuell for that present may contract diminish or lessen his substantiall being Physiologus This your
imagined may do can conclude no certeintie of doing at all Neither do we dispute what the diuell either may or is able to doe but what in deed and in truth he doth truelie accomplish Howbeit to vse fewe words in a long matter and plaine termes in a doubtfull case this I auouch for truth that the diuell neither can contract nor possibly may diminish his substantiall being at all For as he is a spirituall creature created for vengeance so hath he for that selfesame respect an essence and forme especially proper vnto himselfe alone yea and the same so peculiarly appointed vnto him as he himselfe cannot possibly augment diminish or any waies alter the same but must needs be contented therewith as with that which the onely wise God hath in wisedome especially ordeined and assigned vnto him yea euen as peculiarly as he hath appointed to euery of vs our proper substances without any power at all to alter the same Lycanthropus Tush let mans mind be what may be whether bigger or lesse in proportion then the spirite of the diuel I passe not a pinne this I constantlie hold that the same is the verie receptacle or place of abode for the diuel during al the whole time of his real possession Physiologus Sith you wil needes haue mans mind the verie habitacle or place for the diuel his real possession go to then tel me what kind of place you hold it to be Whether do you take it to be a common or proper place Lycanthropus What meane you by a common place Physiologus That wherein manie substances are or may be at one and the selfesame time Such as is the heauen the earth a temple an house and such like al which may truelie be saied to be common places for that manie substances may ioyntlie be placed in them al at once As for example Some thing may truely be said to be conteined within the celestiall firmament because it is in the fier in the fier because it is in the ayre and in the ayre also because it is in the earth For al and euerie of these at one and the selfesame time are ioyntlie comprehended with in the firmament or cope of heauen Lycanthropus Then I doe hold mans mind for no common but the diuel his peculiar place of abode for the present Physiologus If you hold mans mind for the diuel his peculiar place then must his said mind be able absolutelie and fully to circumscribe the diuel his essential being For a place is the circumscription of an essential substance And by this you may plainelie perceiue how at vnwares you are grosely ouertakē with that palpable absurditie which Phylologus not long since enforced vpon you Namelie that the mind of man it being as you falslie suppose the peculiar place of the diuel must necessarilie if so we may speake be larger in muchnes and proportion then the spirite of the diuel For howsoeuer neither spirites nor diuels they being no corporal substances stretched out by Dimensions or by anie massie huge matter may truely be said to be in a place commensuratiuelie or dimensiuelie notwithstanding al this both spirites and diuels they being finite and circumscriptible substances may truelie be said to be in a place definitiuelie or determinatelie Spirites therefore and diuels being as your selfe doth suppose definitiuelie though not dimensiuelie in the possessed mans mind his said mind concerning the essential being thereof must determinately and definitiuely exceede in proportion and muchnes the spirit of the diuell Howbeit sith in anie case you will needes make the possessed mans mind the peculiar place of the diuel for the present do tel me I pray you Whether you accompt his said mind to be a verie corporal or onelie an imaginarie place Lycanthropus Euen a verie corporal place for the present Physiologus If you accompt the possessed mans mind a verie corporal place of the diuel the diuel then him selfe he must needes be a moueable bodie because a corporal place is that wherein a moueable bodie both moueth and ceaseth to moue Howbeit the diuel you haue heard he is onelie a spiritual essence and no moueable body and therfore it is very absurde you should affirme the possessed mans mind to be a corporal place for the diuel And that which is much more absurd the possessed mans mind it selfe it being properlie in perpetual motion should by this meanes be made also an immoueable bodie sith it is one special condition of a corporal place to be of it selfe immoueable Because a corporal place is none other thing els but the interiour superficies of a bodie contayning the thing placed therein and the superficies is onelie an accident in the predicament of quantitie Howbeit accidents we know they are not moued of them selues or by their proper motion but onlie by accident I meane by the motion of some other namely by that selfesame subiected moueable bodie whereunto it is peculiarly and properly inherent Otherwaies if a corporall place should by any locall motion be mooued of it selfe then of that selfesame mooueable place there must needs be another place because whatsoeuer is mooued of it selfe the same is mooued in a place And so by consequence there would be a progresse in endlesnes which thing euen nature it selfe doth abhorre By all the premises then you may plainely perceiue how grosse and absurd a thing it is for your selfe to auouch that the possessed mans mind should be for the present the corporall place of the diuel and therefore you are necessarily enforced to make it an imaginarie place or no place at all Lycanthropus What meane you by an imaginarie place Physiologus That selfe same receptacle wherein any thing is vnderstood to be imaginarily or spiritually and not dimensiuely or corporally As for example Angels spirits diuels soules seperate from bodies as also immateriall accidents all these we imagine to be in a place whereas yet they occupie no corporall place neither doe they supplie or fulfill any place at all Lycanthropus An imaginarie place then I perceiue by your speech is in deed and in truth no place at all Nay sir I may at no hande auouch the possessed mans minde to be but an imaginarie place of the diuell for so should I vtterly ouerthrow his reall and substantiall being in man Physiologus And yet euen such a place you must assigne him you see concerning his reall possession in man or no place at all For besides those corporall places which we handled euen now there is ordinarilie and naturally no place to be found Lycanthropus Why then do the scriptures auouch in plaine termes that the diuell entreth and dwelleth in man if he haue in man no substantiall or reall possession Physiologus The meaning of those termes woulde be easily vnderstood if you were once throughly acquainted with that ordinarie doctrine which respecteth those three maner of waies whereby any thing is saide to be in a place Lycanthropus
to answere Augustine by Augustine himselfe both in the very same booke and else where besides Wherein he flatly affirmeth that the angels do outwardly helpe vs by certaine visible apparitions or sights which they propose offer before our eies Those selfesame apparitions hauing not onely an apt resemblance of naturall bodies but which also are subiected vnder their Angelicall auctoritie and power Thus the Augustine you see is so variable in himselfe concerning this point as no certaintie can be concluded of that which he speakes Lycanthropus By this one shift you may easily shift ouer what truth soeuer the holy fathers affirme Ortâ—odoxus I neuer yet sought to shake of any truth by shifts Neither doe I preiudice Augustine or any of the fathers by viewing and reiecting their variable opinions for so Augustine in his latter Retractions oft times reiecteth himselfe And howsoeuer Augustine or your selfe doe dreame in this point very certaine I am as was shewed before that the good Angels of God in their orderly execution of any peculiar office appointed by God were neuer essentially mingled with the minds of the godly No verely but in all their ambassages they doe either manifest themselues by seeing and hearing or assist vs eftsoones by some other sensible meanes howbeit they at no hand do helpe vs by any reall commixture of their proper substances together with ours No that God of order who ordereth all things in number in waight and in measure hauing decreed no such course at all would at no hand permit such confusion of substances nor endure such shamefull disorder among anie his creatures in heauen or in earth Lycanthropus Tell me then by what meanes they do hurt men Orthodoxus Not by any essentiall possession or reall commixture of themselues with mens mindes but by that selfesame effectuall power which euen now worketh mightily in the disobedient children By the efficacie also of which working power they become lying spirites in the mouthes of false prophets they worke lying woonders in all deceiueablenes of vnrighteousnes they buffet mens mindes with fearefull tentations they endeuour to sifte and to winnowe mens soules as men winnow wheate they circumuent them with wiles they make men vncleane they possesse them by deafenes they strike them with blindenes they subdue them through dumbnes they ouercome them by lamenesse yea and euen binde them as it were with diseases a long time togither Brieflie the diuel hauing power ouer death by the efficacie of that power he doth vexe and torment men within and without compassing ouer the earth running like a ramping roaring lyon continually about to deuoure Lycanthropus Yea but how should they possiblie either hurt or deuoure hauing in men no reall possession Orthodoxus You do ouer-grosly conceiue of the matter and with as good reason might aske me howe an enimie should possiblie hurt the captaine which keepeth an hold he hauing in the saide captaine no reall possession Howbeit this me thinke you might know by experience that notwithstanding the want of reall possession the enimie may many waies hurt the said captaine as by giuing him bribes to betray the hold by assaulting by battring by undermyning by pyning by wounding yea and by slaying some of his souldiers before his face All these and many moe annoiances the enimie may offer the captaine though not essentially inherent in the captaine himselfe yea and by the dispatching of these he cannot choose but vexe and torment the captaine himselfe euen as if he had really and substantially possessed his person After the selfe-same maner dealeth Satan with such as he is said to possesse For albeit he doth not substantially enter into the possessed mans minde which is as it were a grand-captaine ouer the bodie yet for all this the diuell that sworne aduersarie of man by deuising procuring applying and by ministring many strange sicknesses diseases and deathes to the bodie he doth no lesse violently vexe and torment the minde it selfe then if he were essentially entred therein Yea and all these the forenamed annoiances he effecteth at his owne will and pleasure Partly for that he is of long experience in mischief hauing bin a practitioner therein from the beginning of the world Partly thorough a more easie maner of knowing things he being very sharpe sighted throughly acute not needing those meanes which earthlie men neede to vnderstand and to find forth the natures effects and causes of things And partlie also by reason of the excellencie of their proper nature they being most speedelie caried from place to place being of infinite power in comparison of vs and being also of such an exquisite knowledge as eftsoones they vndertake by obseruing euents and by conferring of causes to coniecture the timelie successe of manie their mischeiuous enterprises By al the premisses then it is verie apparant that the diuel he hath such an effectuall power permitted vnto him as he needes not essentiallie enter mans mind to accomplish any his diuellish enterprises Lycanthropus If diuels enter not essentiallie into the possessed mans mind how should they possiblie encline or bow his saied mind to their purpose Orthodoxus Touching the enclining of mindes if we speake herein according to truth God alone is properlie said to worke in the minds of men and to encline their wils which waies he please although yet spirites and diuels they may also be considered as helpers herein howbeit such helpers no doubt as doe rather moue by external reasons then encline at al by internal actions And euen so the lying spirite in the mouth of Ahab his prophets was after a sort an helper to God Concerning therefore the enclining of minds we must here distinguish betweene the interiour efficient who onlie is God and the exteriour agent namelie spirites and diuels Againe the meanes whereby the exteriour agent doth worke is twofold The first is the external obiect of the mind it being apprehended of the vnderstanding for good and effectuallie offered also vnto the wil. For euerie facultie of the mind is especiallie moued by his proper obiect not only offered but apprehended also effectually The other external meanes enclining the mind is seated in those affections and passions that are placed in the sensitiue appetite namely lust anger loue and such like by which also the wil after a sort is inclined to something Now then spirites and diuels they are able by external obiects to stirre vp affections and passions in the sensitiue appetite Howbeit not simplie and absolutelie as God who is said to haue the hearts of kings in his hand and who also is able alone to encline mans wil effectuallie to whatsoeuer he please but after a sort and so far forth also as they by external reasons are able like councellours to perswade the wil vnto something For they cannot possiblie compel the wil the same
some few but euen in Adam himselfe and al his posteritie or els you must grant that that possession which the diuel hath in anie it is onlie an actual possession Howsoeuer the latter be true the first you may neuer acknowledge for shame Because if the Lord created the members of our bodies for these two onelie respects namelie that they should be for euer the liuelie organons of our owne proper soules and the expresse images of him their Lord creator it is vnlikely that satan should euer haue power through the permission of God to frustrate those former effects by assuming our bodies essentiallie vnto himselfe and by applying them so forcibly to his slauish seruice in an vnuoluntarie action whether they will themselues or not Lycanthropus Why may not the Diuel for a time essentially vsurpe the possessed mans bodie to accomplish therin his Diuelish actions Physiologus The question is not what the Diuel may doe but whether he doth so essentially vsurpe vpon the possessed mans bodie as your selfe doth absurdly imagine For if an humane soule be only made capable of an humane bodie then also an humane bodie it is only made capable of an humane soule But the first in all reason is vndoubtedly true and therefore also the latter and so by consequence there can be no essential possession of spirits and Diuels Lycanthropus Why sir the scripture saith that the strong armed man possesseth his house in peace Physiologus That must only be vnderstood of an actual and of no essential possession at all I prooue it thus Satan so possesseth as Christ inuadeth his house But Christ inuadeth only effectiuely and not essentially therefore Satan he possesseth only effectiuely and not essentially Besides that if Satan essentially and inherently dwelleth in the possessed mans bodie what then for the present becomes of the soule and who must become accomptable to God for those corporall actions which are wrought in the possessed mans bodie as was shewed you before the man or the Diuel If the man how can it stand with the iustice of God to punish those things in a man whereunto he was violently enforced and drawen against his owne will If the Diuel then should something be effected in the possessed mans bodie which nothing concerneth himselfe Briefly you cannot possibly propound to your selfe any one necessarie vse or end for such an essentiall entring of Diuels into the bodies of men Lycanthropus Oh yes sir it is needfull for this special end namely that they might thereby the more fitly afflict and torment such persons as the Lord in iudgement hath committed vnto them Physiologus All this may as fitly as fully and as effectually be effected by an only actual possession as shall be shewed hereafter in the meane time you shall neuer be able to prooue your imagined real possession of Diuels while you haue any breath For if Spirites and Diuels be in deed and in truth in the possessed mans bodie then are they so either as the part in the whole or as the whole in the part or as the special in the general or as the general in the special or as the accident in the subiect and forme in the matter or as the efficient in the effect or as the intention in the end or as the thing placed in the place at the least But he is not in the possessed mans bodie according to any of these respects therefore not essentially or personally in the possessed mans bodie at all Lycanthropus Though not according to any the former respects yet are they in the possessed mans bodie as we say autoprosopos I meane euen personally not putting any other qualitie in the bodie which it had not before but only mouing and stirring the said bodie with the seueral partes to such extraordinarie operations as by the prouident disposing of God are permitted them to accomplish thereby Physiologus He is in the possessed mans bodie you say only as a mouer and stirrer vp of the same to some extraordinarie operations this is too too absurd For then he must be in that bodie either as one hypostatically ioined with that man in his essence which hypostatical vnion is only proper to Christ or els formaliter as the Schoolemen doe call it to giue an essential forme to those the entended operations and so there should be in the selfe-same subiect two essential formes at once which is too too absurd For Diuels being incorporal spirites are also inuisible impalpable insensible yea such spirituall creatures as cannot possibly be discerned by corporall sence such a substance I meane as can neither be seene nor felt nor handled nor possiblie perceiued by corporall or sensible meanes And therefore how should your selfe be able to iudge or the possessed man certeinlie know when the diuel is really and substantially inherent within his bodie as a moouer to such operations Lycanthropus The same is verie apparantly perceiued by the diuell his violent rending and tearing and such other vnnaturall and preposterous actions Physiologus This perceiuance or knowledge is giuen neither to you nor the possessed himselfe by any meanes of the diuell his essentiall being within him but by reason of his effectuall working in the possessed mans bodie By which said effectual working that selfesame rending and tearing with other like vnnaturall and preposterous actions may effectually be wrought in the man though the diuell doth neuer essentially enter into the possessed mans bodie or any part thereof Euen as also the efficacie and heate of the sunne may effectually be perceiued and felt both outwardly and inwardly and yet the verie substance of the sunne it selfe neuer essentially inherent in anie mans bodie And thus at vnawares you do fully ouerthrowe you idle supposall of an essentiall and reall possession concluding withall that the diuell hath onely an actuall or powerfull possession whereof also hereafter we will conferre to the full Lycanthropus Staie heere a while I beseech you me thinke you are somwhat ouerswift in gathering vpon me For albeit I do freely confesse that spirits and diuels are spirituall substances and therefore not sensiblie perceiued or felt of vs by any corporall or sensible meanes yet doe I not hold them for such absolute and simple substances but that they haue also their proper bodies peculiarlie appropriate to them though of another nature and farre different also from ours And therefore the diuels entring into the possessed mans bodie with those their owne bodies they may by meanes of their said bodies so violently worke in the possessed maus bodie as that their essentiall being therein may easily be discerned of others and verie sensiblie also perceiued of the possessed himselfe Physiologus A man had need to be swift in gathering when he lighteth vpon one so lauish in laying abroad For besides your conclusion heere against your owne cause you do flatly discent a fresh from that we concluded before in our first conference concerning the
essence of spirits and diuels Where I telling you that the Scriptures deliuer vnto vs not corporall but spirituall diuels that spirits and bodies are opposed the one to the other and therefore cannot possibly be one and the same thereupon we concluded that spirits and diuels are not corporall but spiritual substances all which you held then for an infallible truth Howbeit being here driuen to a straight you doe now either ignorantly forget or purposely peruert the verie truth you affirmed before For now you say plainely that diuels haue also their proper bodies peculiarly appropriated vnto them What is this else but to say and vnsay and to turne with euerie winde not vnlike to the wauering Weathercocke Lycanthropus I denied them to be corporall substances in comparison of our grosse and elementarie bodies when yet notwithstanding I doe simply hold and confidently auouch them to haue also their bodies Physiologus Make plaine your meaning and tell vs whether you hold them to haue their proper or assumed bodies Lycanthropus Euen proper and peculiar bodies created for them Physiologus Goe to then euerie created bodie is either celestial or elementarie Whether of both these thinke you is proper to Diuels Lycanthropus Surely I thinke they haue celestiall bodies Physiologus Verie well But I pray you consider this also that the diuels if they haue corporall bodies then also they haue their corporall motions Now euerie naturall motion we doe know is either circuler or elementarie The circuler motion for celestial bodies the elementarie motion for elementarie bodies Whereupon it followeth that if diuels as you say be indued with celestial bodies then also those their celestiall bodies must naturally follow the circuler motion On the other side the possessed man you know he hath an elementarie bodie and therefore his said bodie it must and will naturally follow the motion of that element whereof it doth chiefly consist Pneumatomachus What inferre you hereof I beseech you Physiologus Thus much I inferre namelie that Lycanthropus his opinion concerning the real possession of diuels doth draw after it manie grosse and palpable absurdities As for example If the diuel as you your selfe doe confidentlie hold hath a celestial bodie then how should he really and essentiallie enter into the elementarie body of an earthlie man or possibly make any personal abode in the possessed mans bellie sith the diuel hauing as you say a celestial bodie naturallie attending and folowing the circuler motion he cannot be long from that natural motion but must eftsoones mount aloft to that celestial heauen whereon his supposed bodie consists to folow his circuler motion and then what wil become I beseech you of the possessed mans bodie Againe if a spirit or diuell hauing as you hold a celestiall bodie should essentially enter into the elementarie bodie of a terrestrial man then surelie for the whole time of that real possession there must be both in the diuel and the man either no motion at al which were absurd to imagine or else in the one or in both a supernaturall motion and so by consequence that reall possession should be verie miraculous which were now in these daies of the Gospell incredible to heare For the diuell he being as you say really essentially yea and corporally also in man that man hauing an elementarie bodie which naturallie attendes the elementarie motion and the diuell he hauing a celestiall bodie which must naturally folow the circuler motion how can the bodie of man conuerse with the bodie of the diuel it following naturally the circuler motion but that selfe-same circuler motion must needes be in the possessed mans bodie a supernaturall motion Or how should the bodie of the diuell be really inherent in the possessed mans bodie and so folow therein the elementarie motion but that selfesame elementarie motion also must needes be a supernaturall motion in the diuell his bodie And so by consequence a miracle in the one or in both Againe if the diuels what bodies soeuer they haue whether celestial or elementary do as appeeres in the word mooue euery way vpward and downward on the right hand and left before and behinde vs If the diuels as the Platonists affirme can verie easely stretch out their bodies into what bignesse they please or contract them into what smalenesse they list and can varie in them as their pleasures whatsoeuer colour or figure they fansie briefly if the diuels as Psellus reporteth haue such bodies as are euery day tortured with griefes tormented with materiall fiers surely it were verie absurd to suppose that a celestiall bodie is in any sort fit for any the precedent matters but farre opposite to them and therefore much more absurd to imagine that diuels haue celestiall bodies Philologus Surely Lycanthropus if diuels be indued as you say with their peculiar bodies I would rather imagine them to haue airie then celestiall bodies because the Apostle he cals them airie spirits and as Chrysostome saith the whole aire is replenished throughout with diuels Physiologus Howsoeuer Paule or Chrysostome affirme there be diuels in the aire that doth not conclude that therefore the diuels they haue airie bodies which opinion is much more absurde then the other before For first that the diuels should haue airie bodies it is vtterly impossible Because the aire is as we commonly say a bodie of one and the selfesame kinde so as euerie part of ayre is ayre neither can any reason be rendred why this part of the ayre should be more the bodie of a diuell then another and so the whole ayre should be a continued bodie of diuels Besides that an organicall bodie consisting iointly of distinct members must haue bones synowes vaines arteries flesh and must also receiue some proportion shape or figure all which are impossible to be made of the ayre Againe the ayre is inconstant and continueth not long in a place and therefore by ascribing to the diuel an ayrie bodie we might rather conclude him a runnagate land-leaper then an inherent land-lord in any mans bodie Briefly if the diuel hath an ayrie bodie then also his said bodie is subiect to corruption and dissolution for the ayre is a corrupt and dissoluble bodie and so by consequence the diuels should be mortall as touching their ayrie bodies And therupon either they must haue new bodies made them a fresh when those other be dissolued or we must else beleeue also a resurrection of the bodies of diuels all which you may see is verie absurd Lycanthropus But Augustine he holdeth the contrarie For therefore saith he is the bodie of a Diuel incortuptible because in the aire and fire there is an actiue force as also in the water and earth a passiue force and so by consequence the bodie of a Diuel being airie is rather actiue then passiue Physiologus By Augustines leaue this accordeth neither with sound Philosophie nor yet with common experience For with the
Philosophers the aire is rather passiue then actiue because his proper qualitie is thought to be liquide Howbeit heate and cold are said to be actiue but drinesse and humiditie passiue qualities Moreuer it hath beene prooued by manifest and daily experiments that the aire is both passible and corruptible and may easily be corrupted and changed And therefore if the Diuels haue airie bodies they are subiect to corruption and dissolution and so by consequence the Diuels they should be indued with mortal bodies as was affirmed before Lycanthropus But manie for all this doe flatly auouch that the Diuels haue either fierie or aierie or waterie or earthlie bodies yea such bodies as can feele and be felte both hurt and be hurt in so much as they lament when they are stricken and being put to the fier are burnt And that they themselues continually burne in such sort as they leaue ashes behinde them as hath beene manifestly prooued in the borders of Italie Physiologus If you lend you eares to the opinion of the Platonists or but listen a while to the dotages of dreaming Psellus they will fill your head full of these and such other Italian tales wherein it were more ease for a man to beleeue them then to run into the borders of Italie to reprooue them of falsehood Howbeit if Diuels in deede should haue elementarie bodies they could not be eternal For the elements they haue in them both heate and cold drinesse and moisture yea such actiue and passiue qualities both as by contending together continually must needes in the end be vtterly dissolued And therefore these toyes which the Platonistes and Psellus doe tattle abroad are matters that cleaue together like thombe-roppes of sand hauing in them no soundnes of truth Besides that their Philosophie herein is very improbable for if the Diuel be earthie he must needes be palpable if he be palpable he must needes kill the man into whom he really entreth Also if he be of earth created then must he be visible and vntransformable concerning that point for Gods creation cannot be annihilated by any deuise of the creature So as although it were graunted that the Diuels might adde to their being either matter or forme yet very certaine it is they cannot possibly diminish or alter the substance whereof they consist As not to be spiritual or to relinquish and leaue earth water fire aire or this or that element whereof they were first created and made But howsoeuer they imagine of water of aire or of fire very certaine I am that the earth must alwaies be visible and palpable yea and the aire must be alwaies inuisible and fire must be hote and water must be moist And of these three latter bodies especially of water and aire no shape nor forme can naturally be exhibited to mortall mens eies by any possible meanes of the creature Lycanthropus Well yet for any thing heard I can hardly be perswaded but that Diuels haue their proper and peculiar bodies Orthodoxus I haue forborne a long time to speake in hope that Physiologus and your selfe would haue growen to some issue concerning this point But sith you persist in your fond opinion doe tell me what it is that makes you imagine the Diuels to haue also their bodies Lycanthropus This especially perswades me vnto it I finde in the scriptures fower sortes of spirites Namely first a diuine spirit which only is God who although he be a spirit yet hath he no need of a bodie touching either his being or his working The second are Angelical spirites namely Angels and Diuels who albeit they neede no bodies at all in respect either of their being or of their proper actions yet neede they their bodies in communicating their actions vnto vs. The third are humane spirites who in regard of their essential being doe neede no bodies for they really exist and liue being disioined asunder from their bodies Although yet concerning their organical actions appertaining especiallie to the vegetatiue sensitiue life they at no hand may want their proper bodies The fourth and last sort are brutish spirites which neither can be nor do any thing at al without their bodies By al which it is cleare that of these foure sorts of spirits the diuine spirit alone the omnipotent God I meane he needeth no bodie al the rest they haue al neede of and doe also enioy their owne bodies for the vse of themselues and of others and this either to helpe or to hurt And for these selfesame respects the very diuels also themselues do stand in neede of their bodies Orthodoxus By this your distribution of spirites it doth plainlie appeare that spirites and diuels they neede no bodies at al touching either their beeing or working For first they haue their essentiall beeing without anie body in as much as they are spiritual substances and then next they neede also no bodies concerning their proper actions for they loue they hate they affect they doe wil and vnderstand without anie helpe of bodies at al. Lycanthropus I speake not now of their proper but of their ministeriall actions which they cannot possiblie accomplish without their peculiar bodies Orthodoxus And I vnderstand it also of their ministerial actions which they may and do eftsoones accomplish by assumed bodies without any their peculiar bodies at all And heerin also I speake onely of good Angels but goe to proceede in framing your argument Lycanthropus I frame it thus Ministers they cannot possiblie accomplish their appointed ministerie to those that liue in the bodie without hauing a bodie But the Angels are all ministring spirits for such saued ones as liue in the bodie therefore they cannot possibly accomplish their ministerie to them without hauing a body Orthodoxus I vnframe it thus The truth of your proposition is onely particular hauing speciall relation to some certeine kind of ministerie and therefore it doth not nor cannot so generally conclude as you would haue it to doe Because Angels or spirits they may and do eftsoones vndergoe some certeine offices without any assistance of an externall bodie yea euen all their offices whatsoeuer they might and could wel vndertake without any bodie at all if it so seemed good to the Lord. Howbeit some other offices againe they doe execute in bodies not because there is otherwaies in themselues a defect for that work but for their sakes onely to whom they are sent Neither is it of any necessitie that the Angels for some speciall respects should alwaies consist vpon and haue peculiarly vnto them their owne proper bodies because for such speciall respects they may and haue eftsoones assumed to themselues some other bodies from else where Howbeit what need of assuming of bodies at all if Angels and spirits be alwaies endued with their proper and peculiar bodies No surely then to assume where no assuming of bodies in deed but rather a stretching out a rending and dissoluing of substances
cause in deed For neither is infinitenesse nor the vbiquity depending thereon the only proper cause that any thing is incorporal but some other thing els As for example an omnipresence or if so I may speake an incorporiety is truely in God howbeit God is incorporal not so much in regard of his vbiquity as because he is a simple spirit Angels in like sort are therefore incorporal in their proper degree because they be spirits but yet created spirits and they are therefore local because they be finite substances Thus then your said author his first argument afordeth smal force you see to your present purpose Lycanthropus But he argueth secondly thus Whatsoeuer is incorporal that also is inuisible spirites and diuels they are not inuisible therefore also not incorporal Orthodoxus First the assumption is meerely false because it maketh spirits and diuels naturally visible which al men do know to be otherwaies by common experience For who euer hath hitherto seene or could possibly perceiue a spirit or diuel as they are in their proper nature Againe in the proposition he failes as before by pretending a cause which is not the cause For the denying of a corporal or bodily beeing is not the proper cause of inuisibility but the absence the vitiousnesse the depriuation or fault of some other thing els which are necessarily required in the action of seeing Besides that by this argument a man might also deny the aiery element to be a body or corporal substance for who can possibly behold or sensibly see the purity of the ayre it selfe Thus then your old fathers you see they in deed and in truth are not interessed at al in that misbegotten ofspring which your selfe so desirously but yet fasly would father vpon them and therefore let vs now here what better hap with the new Lycanthropus With a very good will First Rhodiginus he affirmeth confidently that spirits and diuels haue their proper bodies Orthodoxus How should he so confidently affirme his opinion not hauing the conformitie and concord of truth consorting therewith Besides that Rhodiginus he proues his assertion by the bare and onely authority of Augustine the which auctority and opinion of his as you haue heard it disproued before so surely Rhodiginus himselfe he doth dangerously crosse and annihilate it by opposing many vnauoidable exceptions of scholemen against the same And therefore Rhodiginus his authority is nothing authenticall or currant concerning your question Lycanthropus But Caietanus explaining these the Apostles words according to the prince of the airie spirits or powers he is not afraide to affirme that it holdeth best with reason and sound Philosophie to beleeue that spirits and diuels are constituted naturally of airie bodies Orthodoxus Doth Caietanus say so indeed Oh the wit that abounds in a Cardinals hat But what is his reason I pray you Lycanthropus He hath a reason that knockes it dead namely this Euen as saith he the vegetatiue substance is found without the sensitiue and the sensitiue without the motiue and an intellectiue without either sensitiue or motiue according to place so is it credible that an intellectiue may be found without a sensitiue with a motiue onely according to place and such saith he are spirits and diuels Orthodoxus Doth Caietanus conclude as you say Now faire fall his good hart for his cunning conclusion surely he himselfe alone hath striken the Popingaie dead This I confesse is an admirable argument Howbeit this I must tell you that such maner of arguments howsoeuer they may seeme at a blush to giue a glimmering shewe of conueniencie they haue in them verie small force to conuince And without doubt if Caietanus his conclusion be canonized currant it might in like maner be granted that the sensitiue substance is to be found without the vegetatiue and the intellectiue with the sensitiue without the motiue according to place and so no one thing shall be wanting which may tende to the generalitie and absolutenesse of such kinde of couplings togither Which when all is done your opinion for any thing Caietanus concludes is like to lie in the dust Exorcistes Yea but Georgius he affirmeth plainely that spirits and diuels are not onely corporall and airie substances but that they haue in them also the power of generation and can shedde forth seed for that purpose Howbeit when they come to a woman saith he then they do contract gather togither or thicken their airie bodies fashioning them fitte for the purpose which they presently affect yea and that also their ofsprings are properly Gyants Orthodoxus Notwithstanding Georgius his impudent and shamelesse affirmation of a matter so shamefull I will at no hand be drawne any longer to heare it much lesse doe I giue credite vnto it and which more is I will neither defile my toong nor infect your chaste eares with the filthie contagion thereof it being so impossible in nature and so incredible in all sound Diuinitie Howbeit if any of the learned be further desirous to heare this his grosse impudencie and foolerie more fully confuted I referre them ouer to the learned Treatises of such as haue sifted that offensiue argument vnto the bran More especially to the seuerall workes of Wierus Engubinus Casmannus Aristotle Frisiuss Scaliger Cassianus and others who do euery of them so soundly beate downe this your Georgius his grosse assertion as I my selfe shall not neede to deale in it at all Lycanthropus But yet Zanchius a man of excellent learning he not onely enclineth that way but holdeth withall this my opinion of corporall spirits Orthodoxus Zanchius imbraceth the same I confesse as the more probable opinion in his conceite but what manner of bodies spirits and diuels should haue he doth not determine That they haue airy bodies he seeth not he saith how the same should be proued But he verely supposeth spirits and diuels to haue other manner of bodies then either airie or celestiall bodies and that the substance of their bodies is more like to the substance of that heauen of the blessed which is properly called the Empyrial or fiery heauen Thus this excellent learned man he doth giue among others his coniecturall opinion concerning the bodies of spirits and diuels A coniectural opinion I say very purposely consonant to that other opinion which himselfe and some others doe hold about the creation of Angels in that the forenamed heauen of the blessed Howbeit neither Zanchius nor any of the rest do certeinly determine this matter in question Lycanthropus Well yet Zanchius and the other they purposely encline to this my opinion concerning corporall spirits and diuels Orthodoxus Not so For whereas your selfe do certainly hold that spirits and diuels are endued with grosse and airie bodies Zanchius and some others suppose they do rather consist of empyriall or fierie bodies as was shewed before where also I haue purposelie put downe the speciall reason of this
therefore they are euerie of them called Angels as it were by a Christian name Culmannus he saith that Angels are not corporall but spiritual substances because they be spirits For a spirit is not a substance consicting of elements or hauing flesh and bones in which onely respect the Scriptures do call them ministring spirits Briefly Bernard he saith the verie wals are vnable to withstand the Angelicall spirits but that all bodies how solide or palpable soeuer they are vnto them verie penetrable Loe heere we haue summoned a grand-Iurie of ancient Fathers who haue all with one generall consent giuen vp their verdit concerning the non being of corporall spirites and diuels Go to therefore Lycanthropus what say you them Lycanthropus I saie they are all good men and true Orthodoxus Waell then I hope you will yeeld this question namely that spirites and diuels they haue not materiall bodies peculiar to their essentiall being but are altogither simple and incorporall substances and that therefore their essentiall being in men if the same should be granted can neuer be perceiued by corporall sense and so by consequence no corporall possession at all Lycanthropus I yeeld no such matter vnto you Orthodoxus Why man it was the determination of that grand-Iurie of Fathers whom you acknowledge for good men and true Whereupon their verdit was foorthwith authentically recorded and may not now by any orderly course be reuersed Lycanthropus It may be they were to inconsiderate and rash in giuing their verdite and therefore let vs heare your Laterane Councell concerning this matter in question Orthodoxus What man must the credit of a grand-Iurie of Catholike Fathers be made to depend vpon the approbation of a generall Councell Well then the Laterane Councell doth flatly confirme that Angels or spirits they are incorporall created of God and were not eternall before al beginnings but created onely in time By all the premisses then you may plainly perceiue by swaie of argument by plaine euidence of Scripture by authoritie of Fathers yea and by the whole consent of a generall Councell that spirits and diuels are incorporall substances and that therefore if diuels doe essentially enter into the bodies of men as your selfe do fondly imagine they enter not so by any bodies of their owne because they haue no bodies at all Lycanthropus Whether diuels haue bodies or no bodies it makes no great matter verie certaine I am they haue a reall possession in men and I prooue it thus Spirites and diuels they can essentially assume to themselues true naturall bodies therefore they can essentially enter into the possessed mans bodie Orthodoxus Are you fledde on the sodaine from the diuell his reall possessing of bodies to his essentiall assuming of bodies Can you find no fast footing to setle your selfe vpon that you thus plodde hether and thither from point to point as a man fearefully distracted or suddenly fallen in a maze Lycanthropus Yes sir I haue fast footing I warrant you for whatsoeuer I hold although yet now I rather desire to heare what you are able to say concerning the diuell his essentiall assuming of true naturall bodies Orthodoxus Well then I perceiue your store is not great being thus constrained to spend on the stocke Howbeit because this matter wil craue a longer discourse then the present time will affoord let vs therefore goe take our naturall rest and meet here againe betimes in the morning to discourse this point to the full Physiologus Your motion is good for vs all Philologus Very true as you say And therefore we three wil repaire to our Innes to take our rest and meete you God willing to morrow by six of the clocke Orthodoxus Wel then let vs forthwith arise and depart The end of the third Dialogue The fourth Dialogue THE ARGVMENT Whether Spirits and Diuels can assume to themselues true naturall bodies What bodies they are said to assume and how those Scriptures are to be vnderstood which be for this purpose produced The speakers names PHILOLOGVS LYCANTHROPVS PNEVMATOMACHVS PHYSIOLOGVS ORTHODOXVS EXORCISTES Philologus LYcanthropus I haue this night in my sleepe beene so strangely troubled about thy last argument as if thou take heed to thy selfe I verily beleeue thou wilt giue them the foile Lycanthropus I am so perswaded my selfe howbeit if I be conquered therein I haue another in store that will trouble them more then that by a thousand fold Pneumatomachus Make much of your arguments against the intended skirmish and all little enough for you are to encounter with sharpe sighted aduersaries Lycanthropus Be as sharpe as they will they shall be sure to receiue as hot as they bring But behold where they come Orthodoxus What sirs God giue you good morrow You haue preuented our purpose which was to haue perused an author or twaine before your comming Howbeit sith you are all so readie Goe to Lycanthropus propound your argument to vs. Lycanthropus I propound it thus Spirits and Diuels they can essentially assume to themselues true naturall bodies therefore they can essentially enter into the possessed mans bodie Physiologus We haue hetherto denied and your selfe was vnable to prooue any reall or substantiall possession at all and would you now thus cunningly insinuate some essentiall entrance of diuels vnder the pretence of assumed bodies Which assuming of bodies if it should be denied would perhaps be as hard to prooue as any the points before Philologus What sir would you beare vs in hand it were hard to prooue that the diuell can assume to himselfe a bodie That was neuer yet doubted of any and dare your selfe vndertake to denie the same Physiologus I vndertake no absolute deniall thereof but onely do here make it a Question Howbeit sith your selues are so resolute concerning this point doe tell me what bodie the diuell doth assume to himselfe Whether a true naturall or phantasticall bodie Pneumatomachus Surely a true natural bodie or none at all Physiologus If a true naturall bodie then tell me further whether it be a bodie created before or to be newly created Lycanthropus It is a bodie created before Physiologus If you hold it a bodie created before then tell me yet further whether you take it to be a liuing or dead mans bodie Exorcistes I take it to be some liuing mans bodie if any at all else how should it possibly serue the diuels purpose Physiologus I woonder you should so grossely imagine an impossible matter For where hath the diuell receiued power from the Lord to dispossesse liuing soules of their organicall bodies And what must become of that liuing mans soule all the while the diuell assumeth his bodie it selfe to serue his mischieuous purpose Moreouer it is verie absurde to suppose that the diuell can possibly assume to himselfe any liuing mans bodie Because the Lord hath so vnchangeably established such an inseperable vnion betweene the soule and bodie of a liuing man as vnlesse the bodie and soule be substantially vnited
together that man may not truely be termed a liuing man And which more is the soule and body are so inseparably conioyned by the creation of God as no one creature in heauen or in earth may possibly disioyne them before the finall separation of life according to the determinate councell appointment of God Briefly be it supposed that the diuell could in deed assume to himselfe some liuing mans bodie and could also for the present extenuate the same and transforme the substance thereof into spirituall congellations as Tatianus affirmeth yet this is verie certaine and a generall rule that two substantiall formes cannot possibly be inherent together and at once in one and the selfe same subiect And therefore to bring the substantiall forme of a diuell without feeling into the substantiall body of a man without either killing or hurting and which more is to transforme the same into such a slender and impalpable substance as cannot of the possessed him selfe be sensibly perceiued or felt no not at the first entrance into him it may well be vnlikely but very certaine I am the same is vtterly impossible for all the diuels in hell to accomplish such hard hap they haue in assuming a liuing mans body Pneumatomachus For my part I rather suppose that the Diuel doth assume to himselfe some deads mans bodie Physiologus This your supposall is no lesse absurd then the orher before For first if that bodie which the Diuel doth assume be the body of a dead man departed long since then surely it is an hundred to one that that selfesame assumed bodie is either eaten with wormes and so vnfit for the seruice or is else so putrified with filthie corruption as the Diuel by entring into any therwith must needes poyson the possessed man vnto death Againe if that assumed bodie be the bodie of a dead man but lately departed this life the Diuel then by assuming such a newly departed bodie must be supposed to appeere in a white winding sheete as he was heretofore thought to appeere vnto Saul in Samuels supposed bodie with a mantel about him must so for the present forsake that his supposed forme which the Poets and Painters doe hold to be griesly and blacke Besides that in supposing the Diuel can assume to himselfe the bodie of a man you doe therein very grosly oppose your selfe to the blessed Apostle who saith most confidently that mens bodies are created for the Lord himselfe and not for infernall Spirits That they are the members of Christ not the mansions of Belial the temples of the holy Ghost not a dungeon for Diuels a stie for Satan not an habitation for Helhounds Briefly if the Diuel doth assume to himselfe some dead mans bodie whether long since or but lately departed we must by this your supposall imagine a resurrection of bodies before to the generall iudgement and therein also must attribute to the Diuel that absolute power of raising the dead which only is due and proper to God and so by consequence conclude that the Diuel can accomplish and worke true miracles Whereas the Lord only is able to take life from the dead and to restore them againe vnto life which is such a miraculous worke of the omnipotent God as by an infallible consequence approoueth the Deitie Seeing therefore that by this your supposal you doe in effect but Deifie the Diuel bee foorthwith ashamed to hold that Spirits haue power to assume to themselues the bodie of a man alreadie created whether dead or aliue Lycanthropus You grant then that the Diuels doe assume to themselues some vncreated bodie Physiologus I grant no such thing For how is it possible either Diuel or Angel should assume that which is not at all or that they should take to themselues a bodie not yet existing in nature Philologus Very true But after the creation of such an essentiall bodie you doe then confesse the Diuel may assume such a bodie Physiologus I confesse no such matter vnlesse you first shew me by whom those selfesame supposed bodies should be essentially created whether by God or the Diuel Exorcistes They are surely created by God or not at all for the Lord onely alone is the creator of all things Physiologus Though the Lord in deed be the Creator of all things yet doth it not necessarily folow and your selfe shal neuer be able to proue that he is also the Creator of these things And how dare you then so confidently auouch that these your supposed bodies for the seruice of diuels are essentially created by God Exorcistes God is of infinite power and therefore may doe it Physiologus Your may be concludeth nothing at all Neither doe we dispute what God either may or is able to doe but what in deed and in truth he doth certainly accomplish And albeit the Lord I confesse be of infinit power yet is his said power restrainde to his will for whatsoeuer the Lord willeth that doth he in heauen and in earth So then vnlesse you can shew the Lords word to witnesse his will concerning such extraordinarie creation of bodies for the seruice of Satan whatsoeuer your selfe shall haplie imagine that God may doe therein you must yet giue vs leaue to doubt of the doing there of in deed Lycanthropus But why may not the Lord for the execution of iustice create them such bodies Physiologus First because the Lord hath infinite meanes besides and those also of more excellent maiestie for the execution of iustice and therefore he stands in no maner of neede to haue such a patched supplie Secondly for that the Lord will neuer do that which may any waies witnes against himselfe But for him to create such essential bodies afresh at the pleasure of the diuell and so oft as he pleaseth doth derogate greatly from the certaintie of that sacred truth which sealeth vnto vs the certaine accomplishment of all his workes whatsoeuer in sixe daies space and the vndoubted ceasing from all his labors the folowing day Moreouer to hold for infallible truth that those your supposed bodies for the seruice of Satan must in any case be created of God what doe you else in effect but thereby conclude the Lord him selfe to be slauishly subiect vnto Satan his accursed commaund in creating him bodies afresh and so oft as seemeth him good Briefly sith the glory of God is the maine end of all his creation what one glory may possibly redounde to the Lord by creating such your supposed bodies as being altogether by Satan abused are prepared neither to destruction nor glorie And therefore it is grosse impietie or rather an horrible blasphemie for any to hold that the Lord alone must be the Creator of any such essentiall bodies as your selfe and some others suppose the diuell doth assume to his seruice Lycanthropus It is certaine then that those assumed bodies are created by Satan him selfe Physiologus It is euen as
certainly so as that S. Donston did hold the diuell fast by the nose with a paire of pincers the very first day he appeared vnto him in such an assumed bodie wherein Donston serued the Diuell of trust and according to his due desertes to teach him to be medling with the worke of creation before he had gotte a Comission from God But alas Lycanthropus are you not highly ashamed to hold so maine absurd and horrible impieties or rather such execrable and intollerable blasphemies For be you throughly assured of this that your selfe imagening the diuell a creator of bodies you doe thereby ascribe vnto him a supernaturall power and therein also doe attribute that vnto diuels which onely is due vnto God because creation of substances was neuer yet graunted to man or Angell much lesse vnto diuels Besides that if it were in the power of diuels either to create or assume to them selues essentiall bodies at pleasure it is not then to be doubted but that such and so endlesse is their malice towards men we should shortly haue the whole world replenisht with corporall diuels yea and their number would farre surmount the number of men if all be true that is set downe in Salomons notes of coniuration Wherein are named seauentie nine principall diuels hauing euery of them vnder them and at their commaund some tenne twentie thirtie fortie fiftie sixtie seauentie yea and some of them eightie legions of diuels at the least So then howsoeuer your selfe shall otherwaies dreame of a power in Satan for assuming of bodies sith they can be no such bodies as are newly created either by God or the diuell sith they can be no bodies created before sith they can be no bodies of men either dead or aliue it must necessarily follow that those imagined bodies which the diuels are supposed to assume to them selues they are in deed and in truth no true naturall bodies Lycanthropus It is like then that the diuels they do onely assume to themselues but a phantasticall body Physiologus And it is like then that the diuels they haue onely in men but a phantasticall possession which is the very same issue you were brought vnto before when we discoursed of the mental possession of diuels Philologus How now Lycanthropus are you brought to a non-plus before you well wiste Lycanthropus I wot not I assure you which waies to winde my selfe out from these windings and turnings howbeit for any thing hitherto heard I will neuer beleeue but that the diuell can assume to himselfe a true naturall bodie Orthodoxus What man will you with such setled pertinacie dwell in your opinion not hauing sound reason therefore Lycanthropus Yes sir I haue reasons and authorities both support me therein Orthodoxus Let vs first heare your reasons Lycanthropus With verie good will wherein first from the like I doe reason thus The good Angels of God they haue appeered to men in assumed bodies therefore spirits and diuels they may also appeere vnto men in assumed bodies Orthodoxus Your argument is faultie the same not consisting of things essentially alike in euery respect For neither haue the infernall diuels those heauenly priuiledges which the celestiall Angels enioy neither yet are they equall with them in knowledge and power So as although the good Angels doe sometimes assume to themselues essentiall bodies yet doth it not necessarilie folow that therefore the euill Angels or diuels are able to do the like Againe howsoeuer the good Angels haue at some time assumed essential bodies yet doth it not appeer and your selfe cannot prooue that they created those bodies themselues but by the prouident power and appointment of God they had them from else where for that speciall seruice whereunto they were sent Moreouer there is no sound consequence in this viz. Good Angels they do visible appeere vnto men in assumed bodies therefore euill Angels they doe the like This I say doth not folow because of the good Angels appearing in visible bodies we haue had often and manifest experience but of the euill Angels appearing so no example or instance at all can be giuen Briefly your argument is but a deceaueable Elench from a may be to the being indeed whereof no certeine conclusion can folow For thus you reason Good Angels haue appeared to men in assumed bodies therefore spirites and Diuels they may also appeare vnto men in assumed bodies This your may be concludeth nothing for certeine Whereas you should haue argued thus Good Angels appeare in assumed bodies therefore spirits and diuels do appeare vnto men in assumed bodies but then your consequent woulde haue been ouer-hard to prooue and besides that it is the very question it selfe By the premisses then it is very apparant that this your first reason hath in it no reason at all to support your opinion Lycanthropus But sith it is certeine that the good Angels doe oftentimes appeare in assumed bodies why should not spirites and diuels be able to do the like Orthodoxus As though because the omnipotent God doth furnish and endowe his heauenly messengers with sensible bodies when and so oft as seemeth good to himselfe therefore euery impotent and infernall spirit or diuell is able also to do the like at their pleasures Lycanthropus Why may not the Lord do as much for spirits and diuels Orthodoxus The Lord may do whatsoeuer he please that it will be his good pleasure to do this which you dreame of who can certeinly say His pleasure in the one hath beene made apparant vnto vs by often experience for the other we haue neither worde nor promise nor example to my remembrance Exorcistes Yes there is a plaine proofe heereof in the Psalmes where Dauid saith plainly that the Lord powred foorth the fiercenes of his wrath vpon the Egyptians by sending his euill Angels among them Orthodoxus What vnderstand you by the euil Angel there Exorcistes Those spirits and diuels wherewith they were dailie tormented Orthodoxus Consider diligentlie the story concerning the Egyptian plagues and tel me where you find any one diuel afflicting them nay tel me what one plague was among them which was not inflicted vpon them by the message and ministery of Moses and Aaron And therefore you are deepely deceiued in mistaking these words by sending the Angels or messengers of euils Which place Tremellius vnderstands not of spirites and Diuels sent among them but of Moses and Aaron rather whom the Lord sent to the Egyptians as his only Angels that is the only messengers and executioners of all those his euils which were cast vpon Egipt And this sense is in my opinion according to the purpose coherence and scope of the Psalme it selfe Lycanthropus But it is as Exorcistes saith in the vulgar translation Orthodoxus It is true and therefore let it so stand as he saith for euil Angels I meane for spirits and diuels But now tel me withal how much this place doth make for the assuming of bodies by
spirits and diuels Thus you reason The Lord sent his euil Angels among the Egyptians therefore spirits and diuels they assume to themselues what bodies they please This consequent hath in it no sequel at al and it is quite contrary to the words of the text For Dauid saith not that the Lord sent his euil Angels essentially into them but among them I meane the Egyptians which proueth nothing for Satan his assuming of bodies Exorcistes But yet we haue a notable example concerning this point from the diuel his tempting of Euah in the serpent Orthodoxus Wel go to frame your argument Exorcistes I frame it thus Satan he did put vpon him the body of the serpent and spake very sensibly in that selfesame serpent therefore spirits and diuels they can and are able to do the like with any body els whatsoeuer Philologus Maister Orthodoxus this argument I beleeue will set you hard Orthodoxus Not so hard as you thinke by then the ambiguous termes are opened more plainely And therefore doe tell me here what you meane by satan his putting the serpents body vpon him Exorcistes I meane this namely that he did really and essentially enter into the very essence and substance of the serpent it selfe Orthodoxus Then it must folow by necessary consequence that the diuel himselfe did essentially become the serpent in deed or the serpent essentially the diuel at least during the whole time of that action Lycanthropus Yea what else Orthodoxus Do you aske me what else I aske you for answere whether your hart be so deeply bewitched with blindnesse as you cannot perceiue the absurdity hereof it beeing so apparantly euident to all the world For is it possible thinke you that the diuel should be able vtterly to annihilate the essētiall being either of himselfe or of any other creature vnder the heauens Or is it likely that satan can cause himsele to be a diuel or no diuel and the serpent to be a serpent or no serpent when and so oft as it pleaseth himselfe If this were certeinely so what one creature in al the world could any long time continue in that proper estate wherein it was first created of God For the diuel hath wil and malice enough to do mischiefe if he had but that absolute power to accomplish the same Moreouer from satan his assuming of the serpents body alone you doe plainely conclude an absolute power in diuels ouer all other bodies else whatsoeuer and so from one perticular example you do cunningly gather a generall conclusion thus Satan he did essentially assume the body of the serpent therefore spirits and diuels can essentially assume what bodies they please This argument is vtterly vntrue in euery part For first whereas I plainely deny that the diuel can so essentially assume a body the which thing you should proue your selfe by a pitifull begging of the cause in question do take it as graunted and thereupon would proue the same by the same attributing also to the diuel such an absolute power therein as is vtterly impertinent to any creature and thereby also you doe highly derogate from the diuinity and power of God Secondly your argument also is faulty in that it concludeth more largely then was put downe in the premisses namely from one particular practize of satan it concludes an absolute power as was said ouer al bodies whatsoeuer which is a deceiueable kind of reasoning For albeit we should grant which will neuer be proued that satan had for that once some speciall preuiledge granted from God and did thereby also essentially enter into the very essence of the serpent as your selfe suppose yet doth it not folow that therefore spirits and diuels they can also essentially assume to themselues what bodies they please Howbeit to the end we may the more directly and plainely proceed doe tell me whether it was the diuel alone or the serpent alone or the diuel and serpent together that gaue the onset vpon Euah in that temptation Philologus It could not be the diuell alone for he is not named at all in the action Orthodoxus If he be not named at all in the action how comes he then to be charged for the principall author in that selfesame action Exorcistes In other places of scripture his malice that way is mightily tainted and himselfe accused for a murderer from the beginning although in the historie of Euahs tentation he be not precisely named any author at all Orthodoxus Yea but how can those places of Scripture in anie sounde reason impose the blame of the action vpon satan himselfe if neither absolutely nor properly nor historically nor Allegorically nor metaphorically nor any waies else he be specially named in that very historie of Euahs tentation wherein the action it selfe with the seuerall circumstances is fully and plainely expressed Exorcistes Moses you know doth not set downe the story of the Bible at large but onely compiles the same in a summary abridgement Orthodoxus But that action especially being so waighty a matter was necessary to be knowen in euery point and therefore it is not to be doubted but that the history concerning the same is so exactly set forth with euery circumstance as that any man may be able to iudge of the principall actors therein at the least So then although the diuel in that history be neither absolutely nor historically nor properly expressed by name yet must we acknowledge him to be therein allegorically and metaphorically set forth at the least or otherwaies impose no blame vpon him at al concerning the action Lycanthropus Yes euen by that selfesame story he is allegorically or metaphorically set forth in the serpent Orthodoxus Then was it no natural serpent but the diuel himselfe metaphorically set forth by the name of a serpent who gaue the onset vpon Euah in that tentation For by allegories and metaphors there is euermore some other thing ment then that which is literally expressed Lycanthropus But yet for all that the serpent is said to haue tempted Euah Orthodoxus That is the diuel alone metaphorically set forth as you say by the name of a serpent was he that tempted our grandmother Euah I proue it thus If in that action the diuel himselfe be not historically and properly but allegorically and metaphorically called a serpent because he is most crafty and subtile then vndoubtedly the obiection of a serpent is very inconuenient but the antecedent is true and therefore also the consequent Exorcistes Proue your antecedent Orthodoxus I wil. First besides that which you grant your selfe it is an accustomed thing in the sacred scriptures to vse the names of other creatures in setting forth to our sense the intellectual creatures themselues Hereupon it is that in the Apocalypse the diuel by a perpetual allegory is called a dragon or serpent and therefore in this history of Euahs tentation by the like perpetuall allegory he is also called a serpent Secondly Moses in that action doth purposely
the bodie of a serpent sith he might by himselfe alone verie sufficiently accomplish that worke Pneumatomachus Doe you hold it for truth that the diuell in that action did not vse the ministerie of the serpent at all Orthodoxus What I doe hold therein shall hereafter be heard Onely because your selfe doe so confidently insist vpon satan his essentiall assuming of the serpents bodie at his tempting of Euah I haue here as it were by the way very apparantly proued that for any thing you are able to propound to the contrary the diuell he might easily effect that worke by himselfe alone without any helpe of the serpent as you haue heard by the former auctorities and may yet haue the same further confirmed by Cyril him selfe Who doth flatly affirme that the serpent was no true and naturall serpent in deede but onely the forme and shape of a serpent vnder which the diuell him selfe did talke with the woman and wherein also he did vndergoe the curse of God denounced vpon him And I pray you what absurditie impietie offence or inconuenience were it at all for any to hold that Moses vnder the person of a poysoning serpent did metaphorically set forth the diuell himselfe who poysoned Euah From whence comes it else that the diuell is called a viper or serpent and his children the generation of vipers but from that first description which Moses makes of him in this selfesame action There are none so grosse I suppose as to dreame that the diuel is a materiall serpent nor any so madde as to imagine that the wicked are the the generations of snakes and vipers according to the literall sense Briefly let this action concerning Euahs tentation be conferred exactly with that description and dealing of satan set downe in the Apocalypse and tell me who will not conclude but that it was the diuel himselfe metaphorically set foorth by the serpent that tempted Euah And in consideration hereof he is there purposely called not simply a serpent but that old serpent which name it selfe is afterwards exegetically expounded by the diuel and satan who deceiued the world and was a murtherer from the beginning Philologus If it was no serpent as you say but the verie diuell himselfe that tempted Euah why then is he not called by his proper name in some part of the historie concerning that action Orthodoxus It was vndoubtedly the diuell himselfe that tempted Euah whose name saith Tremellius and others was purposely concealed by Moses in an especiall regard of the simplicitie and rudenes of that present people to whose slēder capacities he sets foorth the matter in forme of a Tragedie producing the Lord the serpent the man and the woman as actors therein to the end our weake vnderstandings might be the more sensibly enformed concerning that matter Howbeit because in the historie of the creation there is no perticular mention of Angels or spirits therefore the proper name of the diuel is heere especially concealed and himselfe is metaphorically described vnder the serpent least they hearing in that action of some spirituall substance vnheard off before might happily haue a window set open to prophane curiositie and so either fall into grosse Idolatrie or runne with the Maniches into the palpable errour concerning two sundry beginnings or creators of things By all the premises then it is verie apparant that notwithstanding the contrary opinions of some I should commit no absurditie at all in auouching that Satan himselfe alone gaue the onset vpon Euah hauing some speciall reasons the testimonies of fathers yea and the opinion also it selfe verie authentically priuileged in our English church by publike authoritie Lycanthropus Notwithstanding your auctorities and reasons whatsoeuer I will neuer be perswaded that the diuell alone did set vpon Euah Exorcistes And surely whether the diuell alone or not I will neuer beleeue it was the serpent alone that did it both because serpents and snakes could neuer properly speake and for that the enimitie which was put betweene them two and their seed may not possibly be vnderstood of the snake and her broode Orthodoxus The common receiued opinion is that it was the diuell and serpent together whereunto also I doe willingly subscribe Partly in an especiall regard of two other places of Scripture which seeme to encline to that sense and partly also for that in the originall the very name of the serpent importeth so much she being called nachash of nachash or nichesh that is to diuine or to charme Signifying thereby that the diuell according to the very purport of the name it selfe did as it were so bewitch and so charme the serpent as that through his craftie suggestion she was very well able to propound such a diuination or soothsaying as did presently circumuent and deceaue our graundmother Euah But goe to let it be graunted that the diuell and the serpent together gaue the onset vpon Euah now tell me in what maner they wrought Lycanthropus In this manner First the diuell he entred essentially into the serpent and then after he vsed the serpents toong to set the temptation an end Orthodoxus But how doe you certainely know that the diuell did essentially enter into the serpent Lycanthropus How doe I know it euen by the apparant effects thereof for how came it to passe that the serpent did speakevnto Euah Orthodoxus Could not the diuell apply the serpents toong to his purpose vnlesse he did first essentially enter into her Lycanthropus No how is it possible he should Orthodoxus Why how doth a minstrill make his pipes to sound what he please doth he essentially creepe first into the bagge it selfe and then tune the pipes to his purpose or doth he only dispose the sound by his breath Philologus What how now Lycanthropus I beleeue you haue heard such a fit of mirth as if you daunce after the same but a while your opinion concerning the essentiall assuming of bodies will be driuen out of doores Lycanthropus Not so For howsoeuer a minstrill might by his breath alone be able to cause the pipes to squeake yet could he neuer distinguish the notes vnlesse with his fingers he kept the seuerall stoppes howbeit spirits and diuels are incorporall creatures hauing neither fingers nor hands nor any member else to frame the words Orthodoxus Well then thus much yet you confesse by the way that a minstrill by his onely breath may cause the instrument to giue foorth some sound howsoeuer vnable to distinguish the tunes Goe to what say you to the trumpeter he vseth no helpe of any one member at all to distinguish the sounds saue only his breath and yet only therewith he causeth so certaine a sound as euery one that heares him can tell what is played or sounded Now then if it be possible for a reasonable man thus to applie a dead instrument at his pleasure to serue his turne without any essentiall creeping into
it why should it be deemed impossible for an intellectuall power or diuell to apply to his purpose the toonge of his liuing instrument the serpent I meane in the tempting of Euah without any essentiall entring into her at all And therefore let vs heare other reasons of more waighty importance or otherwise put an end to this present discourse Lycanthropus The Angell he assumed essentially the body of Baalams Asse and did sensibly speake in that selfe same body therefore spirits and diuels they can also assume essentially such naturall bodies and worke in them the like naturall actions Orthodoxus How know you it was an Angell that spake in the Asse Exorcistes There needs no manner of doubt to be made thereof for Lyra Martyr Zanchius Casmannus and many other besides doe iointly affirme it Orthodoxus Because those learned men do iointly affirme it you therefore imagine their said affirmation to be such a threefold cord as cannot possibly be pulled a sunder We are not sworn vnto men but vnto the infallible truth of lesus Christ and therefore seeing no one warrant for that their affirmation I am greatly induced to doubt of the truth thereof The reasons why I differ from them are these First by the very text it is plaine that the Lord himselfe he opened the mouth of the asse Secondly Moses in that place putteth not downe the word Elohim which although it signifies God yet sometimes also it is vsed for Angels but he hath only the word Iehouah there which word throughout the scriptures is neuer attributed to any but the Lord himselfe And therefore sith the text doth auouch that only Iehouah himselfe did open the mouth of the Asse I see not how any man should dare to affirme that the same was done by the Angel Besides that the very coherence and course of the historie doth plainely conclude that the Angell spoken of there could not possible do it in such sort as your selfe doth imagine For that Angell standing thrise in the way with a sword drawne in his hand to encounter with Balaam who rode on the asse could not essentially speake in the Asse and essentially also stand in the way at one and the selfe-same instant vnlesse haplie you imagine that the Angels they haue a peculiar power to be in sundrie places at once And therefore whatsoeuer your selfe or those learned men may affirme to the contrarie I perceiue not as yet how it should be an Angell that spake in the Asse but rather the Lord himselfe by an immediate power by which power he opened also the eies of Balaam himselfe before the face of the Angel Exorcistes Though the Lord himselfe was the efficient cause of opening the Asses mouth yet might he effect that worke by the Angels meanes and so the Angell notwithstanding all this he might ministeriallie speake in the Asse Orthodoxus What the Lord might haue done therein we all do know what he certeinly did therein neither you your selfe nor any are able to say In like maner the Lord might also by the Angels meanes haue opened the eies of Balaam but he did not that as the text doth plainely declare therefore nether the other Besides this the Lord at that verie instant did otherwaies imploy the Angell three seuerall times in the way with a sword drawne in his hand to encounter with Balaam and therefore hee would not vse his ministerie this waies which your selfe doth imagine neither could the Angell at that instant time be essentially inherent in the Asses belly vnlesse haplie you do hold an vbiquity in Angels which onely is proper to God But be it granted that the Lord not immediately but by meanes of the Angell did speake in the Asse and then do tell me withall how and after what sort the Angell effected that speech Lycanthropus Euen by entring essentially first into the verie essence of the Asses body and then next by disposing and tempring her toong to that speciall purpose Orthodoxus If you confidently hold that the Angell did essentially enter into the verie essence of the Asses bodie then do you likewise conclude that the Angell also was essentially conuerted into the Asse and that Baalam withall did ride and gallop and spurre and strike and braule with the Angell all the while he was vpon the Asses backe which were absurd to imagine But tell me Lycanthropus are you still in this minde that the Angels cannot possiblie speake by the toong of a brute beast vnlesse they be before essentially inherent within their bellies Lycanthropus So do I verily thinke Neither may we imagine that the Asse herselfe could possiblie either frame or vnderstand such a sensible speech as was vttered there because a reasonable speech cannot possiblie be framed or vnderstood of any but of a minde hauing vnderstanding reason Whereupon it foloweth necessarily that the selfesame speech being so sensible and reasonable could not possiblie be framed by the Asse but by the Angell essentially inherent within the Asse Orthodoxus Well sith you will needes transferre this miraculous and immediate worke from the Lord himselfe to the meanes I meane to the ministerie of the Angell as your selfe doth suppose Let it be freely graunted that the Angell indeed did frame that sensible speech in the mouth of the senslesse Asse as by a fit instrument appointed of God for that speciall purpose and yet this I auouch withall that the Angell did not ministerially effect that sensible speech by any such essentiall insinuation as your selfe doth imagine but by an onely effectuall operation as I haue shewed before Briefly this sensible speech if you will needes attribute the same to the Angell might and was also effectiuely accomplished by some powerfull operation of the Angell without any such needlesse essentiall entrance into the Asse as by the simile of a minstrill or trumpeter we did illustrate before And heereunto also accordeth the iudgement of Lyra whom your selfe aleadged of late saying Those sensible words were framed neither by the Asse alone nor by the Angel himselfe essentially inherent within the Asse but by an effectuall operation or power of the Angell directing and disposing the toong of the Asse to deliuer such sensible speech for the further confusion of Baalam himselfe And therefore this reason you see is of little or no force at all to fortifie your fond opinion of the diuell his essentiall assuming of true naturall bodies Exorcistes Though this place doth not directly proue that the diuels may assume and essentially enter into a true naturall body because no such thing is apparant in this action of the Angel from whence the proofe it selfe should be brought yet doth it plainely conclude that the diuel by meanes of a true naturall body may deliuer a sensible speech because some such thing we find here effected by the good Angel of God Orthodoxus If I should tie you strictly to the words of the text you could find no such speech
deliuered by the Angel at al but only by the immediate power of the Lord who himselfe alone did open the mouth of the asse as was shewed before Howbeit you your selfe foysting in here by the way this cunning conceite do couertly goe about I perceiue to alter the state of our question which consisteth onely of the diuel his essentiall assuming and entring into bodies Pretermitting therefore to discourse here of the diuel his sensible speaking by the meanes of a true naturall body vntil we come to entreate of actuall possession Do now say what you can for the question in hand or presently giue ouer the same Lycanthropus Satan he essentially assumed the dead body of Samuel departed yea and appeared and spake sensibly in that selfesame body therefore spirits and diuels they can also assume to themselues some naturall bodies and performe in them such natural actions Philologus Well said Lycanthropus this argument I verely suppose will hold Maister Orthodoxus very hard to his pinnes Those other before were drawen from the good angels of God who are able to do more then the diuels by much and therefore no sound reason may be concluded from them to the diuels who wanting like priuiledges are also far vnequal to them in wisedome and power But this argument which you make now from the person of satan himselfe I beleeue is a toucher and such a one as is able to driue Maister Orthodoxus to al his shifts Pneumatomachus Beleeue me sir it is a soaker in deed and therefore what say you vnto it Orthodoxus Beeing such a toucher as Philologus affirmeth I would not willingly touch it for feare of being defiled with the follie thereof And therefore letting it lie soaking a while in the suddes of your idle conceites til the maine force thereof be wasted away with the wetting I doe here tel you by the way for an answere It is generally and iudicially determined by the whole church of God yea and the marginall note in your bible doth likewise auouch that it was not Samuel himselfe that appeared but the diuel forsooth in Samuels likenesse Which being certeinely so do now tel me what substantiall consequent can possibly arise from your antecedent it beeing so false and vnsound Lycanthropus Let the church and marginall notes conclude what they please I haue the plaine text on my side which saith it was Samuel and vnto that wil I stick Orthodoxus You say you wil stick to the text Very wel said hold you fast to the words of the text and then tel me which way you wil proue it the diuel himselfe essentially in Samuels body who appeared to Saul There is no mention of the diuel in all that story neither doth the text say it was Samuels body but Samuel himselfe that appeared Exorcistes Though the diuel be not nominally exprest in the story yet there be many things in the story it self which do implicatiuely vnfold his nature vnto vs and which can haue relation to none but himselfe Namely first the Lord hauing refused before to giue answere to Saul by liuing Prophets it is vnlikely he would answere him now by the dead hauing especially forbidden the same by his word And therefore not Samuel himselfe but the diuel in Samuels body appeared to Saul Againe he that appeared did suffer himselfe to be worshipped of Saul which thing neither Samuel nor any good Angel in heauen would haue permitted and therefore it was the diuel in Samuels body Moreouer he which appeared told Saul that the next day being slaine he should be with him but Saul was a reprobate and could not be with Samuel in heauen and therefore by all the premisses it is very apparant that it could not be Samuel himselfe but must needs be the diuel in Samuels body who appeared to Saul Orthodoxus As though because some things in the storie are hardly correspondent to Samuel therefore forsooth it must needes be the Diuel and none other There be as many other things in that storie which at no hand may be applied to the Diuel but doe more fitly accord vnto Samuel and yet dare I not from thence so confidently conclude that therefore it was Samuel himselfe that appeered As first the scriptures throughout that whole storie doe say it was Samuel himselfe not the Diuel in Samuels bodie but if it were not Samuel in deede the text should report an vntruth and offer great iniurie to Samuel in naming the Diuel so oft by his name Againe he that appeered complaines vnto Saul for being wakened but Diuels being spirits doe neuer sleepe and therefore not the Diuel but Samuel himselfe appeered to Saul Againe he that appeered did truly prophesie the death of Saul and his sonnes the very next day but this the Diuel could not doe he hauing no sound foreknowledge of things neither would he haue done it for he is a lier and the father of lying and therefore not the Diuel but Samuel himselfe did appeere Briefly he that appeered tolde such a tale vnto Saul as the Diuel himselfe vnlesse he were mad or had purposed vtterly to ouerthrowe his owne kingdome would neuer haue told and therefore by all the premisses it is very apparant that it was not the Diuel but must needes be Samuel that appeered to Saul Exorcistes Notwithstanding all this some of the old fathers suppose it was the Diuel that appeered to Saul Orthodoxus They doe so but let them or some of you shew me how he appeered to Saul Lycanthropus He appeered essentially in Samuels bodie Orthodoxus The text declareth no such thing at all and it tels vs plainly it was Samuel himselfe not the Diuel in Samuels bodie Lycanthropus You your selfe alledged euen now the consent of the Church and the marginall note to prooue it the Diuel in Samuels likenes Orthodoxus The likenes of a thing is not the thing it selfe and therefore if it was the Diuel only in the likenes of Samuel then not the Diuel essentially in Samuel his bodie And so this example you see concludeth no essentiall assuming of bodies by either spirites or Diuels which was the very maine point for the which you produced the same Lycanthropus Howsoeuer you presse me with the sway of reason I doe yet confidently hold it to be the very diuel himselfe in Samuels body Orthodoxus I wonder you wil be so confident in impossibilities For Samuel he died in the yeere of the worlds creation three thousand sixty eight and Saul he was slaine in the yeere three thousand and seauenty so that there were ful two yeeres and better betweene Samuels death and these desperate dealings of Saul Now then if Lazarus body lying but foure daies dead in the graue was subiect to stinking the body of Samuel lying dead three hundred and thirty daies at the least must much more be subiect to corruption and rottennesse And therefore how is it possible the
diuel should essentially assume to himselfe the bodie of Samuell it being before consumde in the earth Surely this your opinion as it auoucheth a resurrection of bodies before the generall iudgement so it ascribes to the diuell an absolute power of raising dead bodies which onely is proper to God as was shewed before and the marginall note may tell you withall that the diuell hath no power ouer the dead Besides that if it were Samuels body in deed then it was so either with or against the Lords will Against the Lords will it could not be because he is omnipotent and able euen to tread downe satan vnder our feete and with his will it would neuer be for it is vnlikely the Lord should suffer the body of so blessed a Saint to be defiled at all by the diuell especially after his death Moreouer how should the death of the godly be iustly termed that long lasting sleepe wherein by the ordinance of God their bodies must rest till the generall iudgement if the diuell hath power to awaken and to raise them vp at his pleasure yea and how can the faith of the godly concerning the continuance of their bodies in the dust of the earth be a certaine faith if the diuell can essentially assume their said bodies from the earth at his pleasure Briefly how is it certaine that death doth dissolue our bodies from sâ—ne and corruption and that the blessed which die in the Lord do cease from their labours if the diuel hath power to raise vp our bodies at pleasure and can cause them to labour afresh and vse them as fit instruments in his diuellish and sinfull proceedings And therefore doe cease for shame to hold any longer that it was the diuell in Samuels body who appeared to Saul Lycanthropus If it was not the very true and essentiall body of Samuell in deed what was it I pray you that appeared to Saul Orthodoxus I will tell you what some fathers affirme concerning this matter lesus Syrach lustinus Martyr Tertullian Ambrose and Ierome they do euery of them very confidently conclude that it was not the very true body of Samuell in deed which appeared to Saul but onely a meere phantasie deceite and illusion of satan for the better effecting of his tyrannous purpose intended to Saul whom he knew the Lord had reiected Yea the very decretals also doe flatly determine that it was not Samuels body at all but some ghost or fantasie deceitfully offered to Saule by satan his diuellish deuise There be others againe who doe as considently hold that it was Samuell himselfe miraculously raised vp by the power of God of very purpose to intercept the witches entent who went about to raise vp a diuell in Samuels likenesse by such meanes to satisfie Saul his importunate and earnest desire But this her purpose say they was preuented by God who refusing to haue the truth of that accident deliuered by satan did therefore extra ordinarily and miraculously raise vp Samuel to discouer the truth of the matter to Saul Briefly there be others who doe verily thinke it was neither the diuell alone nor Samuel alone neither yet the diuell and Samuel together nor any phantasie ghost or other illusion of Satan but a meere cosinage and a cosining tricke of the witch at Endor Who pretending an absolute power to haue raised vp whomsoeuer Saul should haue named vnto her neither did nor possible could cause any visible apparition at all but onely iuggled with Saul him selfe he being without and she close in her Cel or playing some legerdemaine at the least behinde a cloth no sensible vision appearing at all to the King Thus then hauing briefely deliuered mens seuerall opinions concerning this point you may deliberately conferre them with that which is spoken before and thereupon imbrace which pleaseth you best Pneumatomachus Good sir giue vs your owne censure concerning these sundrie opinions of men Orthodoxus I neither dare nor will vndertake the censuring of anie Onely if you simplie desire to heare what my selfe in an onely regard of our question do esteeme of their iudgements then this I must tell you concerning the first opinion Namely that howsoeuer it be granted for truth it serues not your turne for it denies the apparition to be Samuell in deed but rather a meere illusion of Satan Touching the second it is that you know which I argue against and therefore by their leaues I dissent from the same till that which I haue said be considerately answered As for the last howsoeuer it be new and therefore may haply seeme strange vnto some yet if your selues without preiudice and with a single respect to the truth would but deliberately peruse that priuileged discourse to the full you might happily perceiue it a verie probable opinion how pregnant soeuer in proofe Philologus Nay that opinion I disclaime aboue all the rest for it denieth there was any apparition at all whereas the text saith plainely that Saul knew it was Samuell and bowed himselfe Is it likelie that Saul would bowe vnto nothing Orthodoxus He bowed to as much as he sawe which was nothing at all as may easely appeere if you but carefully examine the confused conference betweene him and the Witch For saith shee being labouring alone in her Cell oh thou hast surely deceiued me for thou art Saul which she might and did know verie well howsoeuer she dissembled the same for the present Well go to saith Saul be not afraid for what seest thou As if he should say I my selfe do see nothing as yet that thou needest to feare O yes saith the Witch I see Gods ascending vp out of the earth as though she had brought vp a number of dead saints I do not yet behold any saith Saul but go to what fashion is he of for I my selfe see no fashion of any appearance Yes saith the Witch an old man commeth vp lapt in a mantell As though either Samuel had beene buried before in his mantel or the diuell he had had his Weauers and Tailers at hand to haue wrought him a new one vpon the sodaine Well nowe saith the text Saul knew it was Samuel that is by this her description he thought Samuel had appeared to her although he sawe nothing himselfe and thereupon he bowed to a phantasied Samuel Lycanthropus But sir if nothing appeared in truth how then was the conference afterwards performed to Saul Orthodoxus That was cunningly deliuered by the Witch alone in her Cell she being a cunning Ventriloquist as all Pythonistes are who can very hideously speake in the bottome of their bellies with an hollow counterfeit voice and therein by practise she was verie expert Philologus Lycanthropus we verily thought this last reason would haue striken all dead but now being come to the rifling I perceiue
assuming of bodies to the transforming of bodies your store then I perceiue is not great and it seemes you are almost drawen dry Howbeit because the handling of this point will craue a large discourse Let vs therefore breake off for the present And hauing with some small pittance refreshed our selues then wil we conferre hereof to the full til dinner be readie if you like of the offer Pneumatomachus Sir we like whatsoeuer you feele best for your selfe and therefore respect your owne health and we three in the meane time will repaire to our Innes and after will meet you afresh Orthodoxus Nay surely as we haue iointly ioyned together in spirituall repast so will we not sunder our selues in our corporall sustenance all the while our controuersie continueth And therefore if you doe like the thinne diet of schollers let vs in Gods name goe all together Philologus It is much to troublesome vnto you and chargeable both but sith you wil haue it so we will all iontly attend on your person Orthodoxus Let vs then arise and depart The end of the fourth Dialogue The fifth Dialogue THE ARGVMENT Whether Spirits and Diuels can essentially transforme themselues into any true naturall bodie And how those places of Scripture are to be taken which manie produce for that purpose The speakers names PHILOLOGVS LYCANTHROPVS PNEVMATOMACHVS PHYSIOLOGVS ORTHODOXVS EXORCISTES Orthodoxus SIth nature by the good blessing of God is something refreshed let vs now for a while keepe close in my parlour with ful purpose to proceede in our conference till dinner be ready and then after walke forth in the aire to recreate our spirits Physiologus With very good will and therefore linger not the time but go an end in your purpose Orthodoxus Goe to then Lycanthropus repeate your argument Lycanthropus I repeate it thus Spirits and diuels they can essentially transforme themselues into any true naturall body therefore they can also essentially enter into the possessed mans body Orthodoxus Proue your antecedent Lycanthropus What sir do you flatly denie that the diuell can essentially transforme himselfe into what bodie he please I am fully resolued to hold this point whatsoeuer be said to the contrarie Orthodoxus Your vnreasonable resolution is vnto vs no reasonable conclusion neither is the question betweene vs what you wil hold but what you are able to prooue concerning this point And albeit I doubt nothing at al but that you for your owne part will hold verie much till it comes to the pinch yet we hope you will change your purpose if once you be made to perceiue that none but your selfe are of this opinion Lycanthropus Yes sir all the world I am sure iumpes pat with me in this point and verie certeine I am I shall gaine your consent to the same in the end Orthodoxus Howsoeuer you seeme confident in the common consent of the world your gaine I assure you is not like to be great by any such a supposed grant as you haplie imagine from me Lycanthropus Will you not grant that diuels may essentially transforme themselues into what bodies they please Physiologus Master Orthodoxus let me answere this point if you please Come on Lycanthropus what is the thing you would haue granted vnto you Lycanthropus Why this namely that diuels may essentially transforme themselues into a true naturall bodie Physiologus Such a grant we may yeeld you at no hand because euen Philosophie her selfe is flat opposite to it who will neuer admit any such a confused participation of essentiall formes For as essence it selfe is impartible and vndeuidable or rather a certaine incommunicable and singular matter so surely the essence and vnitie of things being preserued intier essentiall formes they cannot possiblie be cnumōicated transferred or passed ouer from that substance it selfe whereof they are formes into any other substance or matter to giue the same also an essentiall forme Because not onely the constituting forming or framing but euen also the destruction of substances doth essentially arise from the forme it selfe And looke whereunto there is giuen a forme conuenient and proportionable to one onely essence thereunto also must necessarily be giuen an vndoubted true essence Because a proper forme is the principall part of essence yea and as some learned Philosophers doe flatly affirme it is the whole essence or nature of the thing it selfe And therefore if spirits and diuels be at any time essentially transformed into men then do they foorthwith cease for that time to be spirits and diuels and may truely be said to be men Lycanthropus I doe not well conceiue your meaning Physiologus I will further explaine it thus If there be any such essentiall transforming of spirits and diuels into men as your selfe doth imagine then vndoubtedly that selfe same essentiall transformation it is either according to the body alone or according to the body and soule together If according to the body alone then that selfe same transformed body it should at one and the selfe same time become both the body of a man and the body of a diuell which were to to absurde to imagine If according to the body and soule together then either the whole man both body soule must be essentially transformed into the very essence and nature of a diuell or the diuell he must needes be essentially transformed into the very naturall body and soule of a man at the least which none but mad-men will euer affirme Againe if that essentiall transformation be effected according to the body alone then howsoeuer that selfe same body be not for the present the body of a man but is wholy transformed into the very essence and nature of a diuell yet the soule of that man must either be forced to forsake his owne body and so bring present death to the body it selfe because death is nothing else but the dissolution of soule and bodie or else the same soule it must necessarily passe from out of it owne body into the very essence of a diuell and so by consequence there must needes be a meere confusion of spirituall substances or two essentiall formes in one and the selfe same body at once which were absurde to auouch and vtterly impossible by any created power to be euer effected Lycanthropus Let Phylosophie be opposite or what she will very certaine I am the diuell can essentially transforme him selfe into any true naturall body Physiologus What man will you in deed oppose your selfe to true Phylosophie then I perceiue you respect not at all the operations and powers of nature But goe to let master Orthodoxus heare what one reason you haue in true diuinitie to mannage your said resolution Lycanthropus What one reason quoth you why man the diuell he can essentially transforme him selfe into an Angell of light therefore how much more into any true naturall body Orthodoxus You are mightily mis-led herein by mistaking the word metaschemarizetai That is to say he transmuted transfashioned
you now confesse by an vnorderly course of nature which vnorderly course is nothing else in effect but an errour in nature declining from the true matter and forme it selfe in producing her worke Thus then you conclude at vnwares that they were no true serpents indeed by any orderly course of nature but either miracles or monsters in nature preposterouslie produced in an vnorderly course of nature it selfe Howbeit miracles you may at no hand auouch them to be because neither sorcerer not diuell could euer worke miracles And euen in that very point also appeered the difference betweene Moses his serpent and theirs it being supernaturally effected by the miraculous power of God theirs being subtilly exhibited by some craftie legerdemaine betweene them and the diuell Neither yet may you iustly affirme them any monsters in nature For then howsoeuer nature her selfe had failed in producing the worke they should yet haue had in them naturally their true matter and forme of true natural serpents which they neuer had and therefore no monsters at all in nature So then sith those your supposed serpents could not possiblie be true serpents indeed neither by any orderly nor vnorderly course of nature it foloweth consequently that they were not serpents by any naturall necessitie Lycanthropus Then were they such by some supernaturall necessitie Physiologus What meane you by that Lycanthropus My meaning is that they were formed true naturall serpents by some supernaturall and secret worke of the diuell himselfe Physiologus You are groslie deceiued for the diuell neuer had supernaturall power neither could he euer haue formed true naturall serpents by any supernaturall skill whatsoeuer Because a corporall substance such as true serpents are was neuer at any time so much subiected vnder the power of the diuell as that he was absolutely able of himselfe to transpose the said corporall matter to any true naturall forme no surely such an absolute power is onely and altogither reserued to God That the diuell himselfe hath no such supernaturall power I prooue it thus In all such naturall bodies as are compounded of matter and forme neither is the matter by it selfe nor the forme by it selfe but the whole composition is wholie formed togither and therefore the whole is wholâ—e transformed into the whole As for example the whole aire is whollie made fire so soone as the said airs is conuerted to fire Besides that the effect is euermore like to the agent and in that selfesame agent doth effectually preexist at the least And therefore a naturall bodie compounded of true matter and forme cannot possibly be produced but by such an agent as is either it selfe compounded of the selfesame matter and forme or hath otherwaies that whole composition in his owne proper power But a Spirit or Diuel is only a simple forme not hauing in himselfe any material part of such a bodily substance neither hath he at any hand the same in his proper power for the Lord only and he alone hath an absolute abilitie of producing such matter and forme And therefore by any operation of the Diuel there cannot possibly be formed any such a natural bodie as is compounded of true matter and forme no although euery thing in nature continued entire and sound But the essential transforming of a rod into a very true serpent doth implicatiuely include an essential bodie compounded of true matter and forme by a natural production and therefore impossible the same should be truly accomplished by any operation of the Diuel whatsoeuer And so by consequence those your supposed serpents compounded of rods they are in deede and in truth no true serpents at all but sleights of legerdemaine Licanthropus If they were not true serpents in deede why then doth the scripture terme them serpents Physiologus Because howsoeuer no serpents in substance yet being vndoubtedly such in an outward appeerance the scriptures doe purposely terme them according to the acceptation of Phaaroh and all the Egyptians Lycanthropus Yea but how could they possibly be seen such in appeerance not existing at al in a true bodily substance or how could Aaron his rod deuoure them they hauing no essential being at all Physiologus I doe freely confesse there might at that present be seene true serpents in deede but withall I doe flatly denie that the sorcerers rods were essentially transformed to serpents which is the very point it selfe that we argue vpon Those rods I say were not essentially changed into true naturall serpents but onely they seemed such in an outward appeerance Lycanthropus How should there be wrought a transformation in outward appeerance and no change in substance at all Physiologus Yes such an appeerance might easily be performed of Satan by sundry meanes First because notwithstanding the present remoouing of sensible things there might still remaine phantasies and imaginations within the head it may be that the very sensible and earnest beholding of Aaron his rod essentially transformed to a serpent before did by reason of the vndoubtednes take in the beholders so deepe an impression as that thereby only through some locall motion of sensible things remaining in the imaginatiue facultie together with the humours themselues wherein they were seated as in their proper subiect there might still be existing in phantasie a very liuely appeerance of some such bodily substance as was not subsisting in nature at all For much blood descending before into the sensitiue facultie there descends withall many imagined formes whereby there is forthwith procured a very liuely resemblance of some such things as are not existing at all By this meanes therefore there being beforehand procured a commotion of humours as well in the interiour as exteriour senses of all the beholders the Diuel might both inwardly and outwardly also applie certaine apparant formes to the very organons of all the senses euen as effectually as if they had risen only from outward sensible obiects and by such a legerdemaine might cause the sorcerers rods to seeme in appeerance as though they had beene true serpents in deede A notable experiment of such deceiuing of senses may fitly be found forth in a candle of Adders grease which all the while it be burning alone in the night will cause all the russhes strawed in the parlour to seeme as if they were crawling snakes Lycanthropus It is incredible that the external senses of all the beholders should by any such legerdemaine of the Diuel haue beene so grosly deluded Physiologus Why not they as well as the senses of all in the parlour aforesaid Secondly the diuel might not onely delude them thus by some false resemblance of serpents but might giue them withall an appearance of true serpents in deed For howsoeuer a corporall matter is not so freely and so fully subiected to the power of the diuel as that he either may or can possibly transforme the same to some other forme from that which essentially it is of it selfe yet notwithstanding such
man and euery liuing thing with their proper nature substance forme constitution qualities and gifts and directeth their wils faculties and powers accordingly so hath he alotted to spirituall creatures their owne substance and properties seuerall alone to themselues and appointed them their lawes and limits beyond which they cannot possiblie passe the bredth of an haire And therefore as it is absolutely against the ordinance of God that I should flie like a bird or swim like a fish or creepe like a worme or become another creature in forme to that which by nature I am insomuch as if God would giue me leaue I could not possiblie do it for it were flat contrarie to his owne ordinance and decree yea and euen opposite to the naturall constitution of that bodie which he hath created and giuen me so is it vndoubtedly incredible that either a diuell should be essentially transformed into a man or a man substantially turned into a diuell or that either of both should reallie change themselues into any other nature substance forme constitution qualitie or gift then those verie same which they haue by creation yea or that they should possiblie applie those which they haue to any other end or vse then that which God himselfe naturally decreed and directeth them vnto Otherwise either God should be contrarie to himselfe which is farre from him or else those things must needs be supernaturall and so a true miracle in whom soeuer Neither yet is Gods omnipotencie hereby qualified but the diuell his impotencie is rather manifested and more liuely declared Who hath no further power then that which God from the beginning hath appointed vnto him and the same also consonant to his owne nature and substance The diuell I confesse may well be restrained from his naturall faculties power and will but being Gods minister beyond the same he cannot possiblie passe the bredth of a pinne neither yet any other waies or further imploie his endeuour then onely in that verie worke which the Lord from the beginning hath enabled him to do Which is that he being himselfe a spirit may vitiate and corrupt the spirit of man and therein also he is diligent enough howbeit for the doing heereof he cannot substantially alter his forme at all Philologus I haue heard many very confidently affirme that the diuell hath appeared to them in the likenes of a man a cocke a catte or a dogge Orthodoxus Yea but how are those confident affirmers certeinly sure that the man the cocke the catte or the dogge whose likenesse they sawe in appearance was indeed and in truth either spirit or diuell and not rather the Legerdemaine of some coniuring Priest or cousening companion For if a diuell can indeed essentially transforme himselfe into the likenes figure or shape of a man a dogge a catte a mouse or a toade whie can he not also transforme a man a dogge a catte a mouse or a toade into the likenes figure or shape of a diuell sith there is a like reason and possibilitie of both Howbeit we may not beleeue saith Augustine that a mans bodie can by any Arte or power of the diuell be transformed into the lineaments of a beast much lesse into the forme or substance of any infernall diuell Besides that if spirits and diuels may possiblie transforme themselues into an humane bodie then could not Christ his argument propounded to Thomas be currant good where he saith behold my hands and side and put thy finger into my hands and thrust thy hand into my side and be not faithlesse but faithfull All this how truely soeuer deliuered by Christ could neuer in truth haue satisfied Thomas concerning the resurrection of Christ if it be true in deed that diuels can truely transforme themselues into true naturall bodies For Thomas remayning vnsatisfied might boldly haue answered thus oh sir why doe you will me to handle your hands and sides that is no certeine argument to demonstrate vnto me your rising againe from the dead Because spirits and diuels you know they can truely transforme themselues into true naturall bodies and therefore notwithstanding such an experimentall or sensible knowledge you may rather be some transformed spirit or ghost to deceiue me then my Lord and my God which came for to saue me Thus then you see that if these essentiall transformations be concluded for currāt Thomas his incredulity for any thing heard might passe vncontroled Exorcistes Though the diuell cannot alter his forme substantially yet may he change the same in shape or figure I doubt not and such a distinction hath Bodin saying The essentiall forme namely reason it selfe is not changed but onely the outward shape or figure Orthodoxus Bodin he strikes it dead no doubt For here he maketh the diuell a cunning iugler who by casting a miste before mens eies can giue to spirituall substances what outward figure and forme he please Howbeit till Bodin be able to demonstrate truely vnto vs that the diuell may haue power to alter essentially a spirituall substance we will neuer acknowledge any possibilitie of transforming their shape or formes at all Exorcistes Well yet Augustine subscribes to such transformations Orthodoxus He doth I confesse Yea those and other like matters are so common in many of his workes as I am driuen to suspect they were rather cunningly foisted in by some cunning popish coniuring Priest to credit his cosening practises then carefully inserted by Augustine himselfe to set foorth a truth Howsoeuer I say with Cardanus that how many of those transformations Augustine saith he hath seene with his eies so many I am content for the reuerence I owe him to giue credit vnto All the rest I account but Cabalisticall conceits and no better in effect then foolish toies to mocke an Ape Yea and so much the rather because Augustine himselfe affirmeth those transformations to be but phantasticall and that they are not according to the veritie but according onely to their outward appearance Lycanthropus Yet such then according to outward appearance Orthodoxus I alow no such supposed appearances made by diuels because I find no such power giuen them by God in all the scriptures Besides that if we admit that diuels may take onely but formes or shapes vpon them though not the very substance it selfe of a true naturall body yet then also Christ his argument made else where vnto his disciples had not been sound in euery point saying thus handle me and see for a spirit it hath not flesh and bones as you see me to haue Setting downe visibility and palpability as things opposite to the nature of spirits and diuels reducing his disciples in discerning of spirits to the iudgment first of their eies and then next of their hands and arguing thus Spirits can neither be seen nor felt but I may both be seen and felt therefore I am no spirit And then next he reasoneth a disparatis thus A spirit it hath
neither flesh nor bones but I haue both therefore no spirit Putting down there you see very apparant and manifest properties to seperate himselfe in shew from a spirit And therefore if spirits and diuels haue power by any possible meanes to transforme themselues but into the onely outward formes and shapes of true naturall bodies though not substantially transformed in deed yet could not that which Christ concludeth haue soundly established the disciples faith concerning the true body of Christ. Because they by reason of such supposed apparitions remaining still doubtfull might haue fitly replied thus Good sir though spirits and diuels haue not substantially flesh and bones and therefore no true and substantiall bodies yet can they truely transforme themselues into the outward shapes and formes of true naturall bodies and so notwithstanding we may be deceiued in an onely outward appearance These exceptions you see the disciples of Christ they might iustly haue made neither if these transformations be vndoubtedly true might Christ so sharply haue blamed their vnbeleefe Lycanthropus Spirits I confesse they are not palpable but only visible and therefore not the seing without the handling might wel haue satisfied Christ his disciples Orthodoxus Yea but whatsoeuer you imagine of the other disciples if you rightly way and exactly consider the text it selfe with the seuerall circumstances you may plainely perceiue that the fault of Thomas his incredulity was secondly bewraied and condemned for that the durst neither credit the vewe taken by the other disciples nor trust his owne eies concerning the truth of Christs body For saith Christ because thou hast seen not because thou hast felt thou beleeuest Also blessed are they that beleeue and see not and not they that beleeue and feele not Giuing thereby to vnderstand that our corporall eies may truely discerne betweene a spirit and a true naturall body which were not true if spirits and diuels could possibly transforme themselues into any visible shapes or formes of true bodies for thereby the sence of seeing might soone be deluded And in very deed it is very erronious for any to imagine that the eies may possibly be deceiued in discerning between spirits and diuels and true naturall bodies as appeareth by sundry scriptures Wherein Christ very sharply reprooueth his owne disciples for not crediting the iudgment of their owne eies in such a case Which could not I say be a certeine rule if spirits and diuels can truely and essentially transforme themselues into true naturall bodies or but change themselues into the true shapes and formes of such bodies And this I beleeue doth break the very neck of those your supposed transformations of spirits and diuels whatsoeuer Lycanthropus This that you say is vndoubtedly true and yet still me thinke the diuell should haue power so to transforme himselfe either in substance or appearance at least although I my selfe am vnable to render any one reason thereof Orthodoxus It is verie ridiculous saith one for a man to leaue manifest things and such as euen by naturall reason may soundly be prooued and so to seeke after vnknowen things which by no likelyhood may be conceiued nor yet tried out by any rule of reason but Good Lord how light of credit is the wauering minde of man How vnto lies and tales his eares attentiue all they can Lycanthropus Good maister Orthodoxus I am drawen by the very force of your speech into a maruelous perplexitie For when I examine the weight of your reasons propounded I am driuen to denie the transformation of spirits and diuels but so soone as I returne to the necessarie consideration of my present distressed estate then that former new-bredde conceit is cut in the necke and squashed quite Orthodoxus And why so I praie you Lycanthropus Surely sir because I my selfe am essentially transformed into a woolfe I make no question but that diuels can also substantially change themselues into any true naturall bodie Orthodoxus Verie true as you say the one is euery way as possible as is the other Lycanthropus Why then alas the Lord be mercifull to vs for what man in the world may possiblie be free from their malice Philologus How now Lycanthropus are you indeed in good earnest doe you verilie imagine you are essentially transformed into a woolfe now surely this is the oddest iest that euer I heard Lycanthropus Nay nay alas it passeth a iest for I finde it and feele it to true by experience Physiologus Well said Lycanthropus now I perceiue your name was not giuen you for nought it being so proportionablie answerable to your phantasticall nature You are called Lycanthropus that is a man transformed to a woolfe which name is verie fitlie deriued from the verie disease it selfe that disorders your braine called Lycanthropia Which worde some Physitions do translate Daemonium Lupinum that is a wooluish Demoniacke others Lupina melancholica and Lupina insania that is a wooluish melancholie or a wooluish furie and madnes And it is nothing else in effect but an infirmitie arising vpon such phantasticall imaginations as do mightâ—ly disorder and trouble the braine Lycanthropus An infirmitie say you It is a verie strange and fearefull infirmitie that can so essentially transforme a man into a verie naturall woolfe God blesse euery good man from such kinde of infirmities Physiologus Had you liued in such a time as beasts and beares woolues were supposed to speake like men it had beene an easie matter I perceiue to perswade you that you are a woolfe Lycanthropus Yea but how are you able to perswade me the contrarie Physiologus That may easily be done by describing briefly vnto you the verie true nature of that the aforesaid diseases which so fearefully affecteth your minde with these phantasticall imaginations and fond conceits Lycanthropus I praie you then describe it plainly vnto me Physiologus With verie good will Wherein you must principally consider that the verie first matter which causeth Lyâ—anthropie or this wooluish Demoniacke consisteth in the very selfesame matter or stuffe that maketh in any other man else a melancholike humour for either of both are melancholike persons Howbeit the peculiar cause it selfe which more especially procureth Lycanthropie is either that kinde of melaâ—choly which ariseth properly of choler adust or that which comes of a simple and naturall melancholie Sometimes also it proceedes of an impostume of bloud in the braine but verie seldome of bloudadust Now then that Lycanthropie which ariseth onely of the abundance of a simple melancholie as it is for the most part the verie woorst of all therefore is called Lupina insania a wooluish furie or madnes so is it commonly seated in the exteriour parts of the braine and hath an operation not vnlike to the matter of a desease called Karabitus which is a hotte impostume of the head seated in the verie ventricle of the braine it selfe causing choller adust and the melancholike matter verie much
sir we also our selues would gladly see that same Iesus whom the world so egerly affecteth and followeth Andrew no sooner perceiued their sute but he acquainted Phillip therewith and they both together propounded the whole matter to Iesus Now then Iesus considering in the zeale of those greekes how all nations affected his preaching and miracles and came flocking vnto him he answered Andrew and Philip thus I perceiue by all signes that the very hower it selfe is now come wherein the sonne of man must be glorified in the actuall manifestation of his effectuall power vpon satan by his sufferings and death Which his said death I assure you must now necessarily succeed to the actuall accomplishment of that actuall conquest a very liuely resemblance whereof you may plainely behold in the wheate corne Which vnlesse it doth fall into the ground and die abideth alone but if it doe die it bringeth foorth abundance of fruit And euen so if this body of mine were once wrapped within the bowels of the earth by the dart of death there would vndoutedly spring many moe branches from thence as from that liuing roote which quickneth many to eternall life Neither let any be so dismaied with the sight of my death as that therefore they themselues would not gladly vndeâ—goe the like shame of the crosse For whosoeuer is so taken vp with the loue of this life as he would not for my sake be throughly willing to put ouer the same to the extreamest aduentures of all that man without question shall loose his life Whereas they that for my sake doe make themselues ready to forgoe if neede so require their very life in this world they shal be sure to preserue the same to eternall life Yea and euen you also your selues whom I haue especially chosen my ministers to declare my said death to the world if in your said ministery you desire to serue me aright you likewise must willingly follow me your Lord and Maister now leading this dance vnto death For wheresoeuer I am there must my ministers willingly be Neither haue I any other purpose in suffering death for you but to giue you an example to follow my steps Wherein if you readily serue me assure your selues that then my father in heauen will honour you highly In deed this corporall death I confesse is extreamely fearefull to flesh and bloud For euen my very soule I assure you is so intollerably tormented with the terrours thereof as I would earnestly entreate my father that the approching hower of this my death might presently passe away were it not that euen therefore I came vnto this hower In consideration of which my determined death I will the more earnestly endeuour my selfe to vndergoe with patience the whole bickering whatsoeuer by crying incessantly vnto my father and saying Oh father glorifie thy owne name in these my appointed sufferings Moreouer to the end you may plainely perceiue the fruits of my praier you your selues shal be eare witnesses of my father his answere from heauen saying My son I haue both glorified it before in thy conception thy birth thy baptisme thy fasting thy preaching and miracles and I will now glorify it againe in thy death and resurrection because therein shal be actually effected the finall ouerthrow of satan his kingdom And howsoeuer the people here present may happely imagine this sound from heauen to be but a thunder or some voice of an Angel at the most yet I assure you it is the very thundring speech of my father himselfe Neither came this voice onely because of my selfe but for your sakes especially To teach you assuredly that euen now is the iudgement and reformation of this world because euen now must the prince of this world be actually cast foorth from thence as touching his actuall possession Yea and this so glorious a conquest ouer satan must euen now be actually effected by the power of my death wherein if I were once lift vp from the earth and fastned withall vpon the crosse I would then actually determine the actuall dominion of the diuel yea and would effectually draw his captiuated prisoners vnder my princely regiment Now all this haue I purposely spoken vnto you to shew you before hand what death I must die that so soone as you perceiue me to giue vp the ghost you may then certeinely assure your selues that the whole worke of your redemption from satan from death and from hell is actually effected finished Thus much for analysing the text it selfe Wherin you haue heard the occasion coherence proceeding and the orderly conclusion of all the premisses Lycanthropus The exposition is plaine in my simple conceite let vs therefore now heare the testimonie of writers for further confirmation thereof Orthodoxus You shall And first to begin with Augustine he saith that by the iudgement of the world we must there vnderstand not the iudgement of damnation which is reserued to the last day but the iudgement of discretion which consisteth wholie in reforming the worlde by the expelling of Satan For the diuell saith he possessed mankinde and held them guiltie of punishment through the handwriting of sinne He did dominier in the harts of Infidels and drewe them being deceiued and captiuated to worship the creature by forsaking the Creator Howbeit through that selfesame faith of Christ which by his death and resurrection was actually established and through his precious bloud which was shedde for remission of sinnes a thousand beleeuers being then actually freed from the power of the diuell were effectually coupled to the bodie of Christ and by the operation of his spirit became liuely members of his mysticall bodie For so Christ expounds himselfe in the very next words saying Now is the prince of this worlde cast foorth Vnderstanding by the particle now that which was then to bee done at his death not that which he was finally to accomplish at the generall iudgement The Lord therefore foresawe that worke which he knewe should be effected after his death and glorification namely that many thousands throughout the world should faithfully beleeue in his death From whose harts the diuel who worketh effectually in theÌ„ before should actually be driuen out by Christs death and finally be subdued through faith in his name Exorcistes The diuell then it should seeme by your speech was neuer driuen foorth from the patriarkes before the passion of Christ. Orthodoxus Not so For Christ was the Lambe slaine from the beginning of the world Neither speake we in this place of the effectual but of the actuall conquest which he made ouer Satan Yea and this I further auouch that euen as the particle now in an especiall regard of Christes actuall conquest respecteth especially the verie hower of his death so surely in some consideration also of Christs effectuall eonquest the said particle now may likewise haue a more speeiall reference to
the forenamed places or any where else doe so much as once mention the same and therefore the perpetuitie of actual possession is no such part of Gods counsell as may any waie concerne the sauing or killing of soules Exorcistes Though the perpetuitie of actuall possessions be not plainely expressed yet why may not the same be couertly implied in some part of the Scriptures Orthodoxus Because this your supposed may be cannot certeinly conclude from thence any such supposed implication at all and I argue further against you thus If the perpetuitie of actual pssession be either expreslie or implicatiuely conteined in the Worde then also the miraculous faith for suppressing such actuall possession is either expresly or implicatiuely contained in the word but the latter is vndoubtedly false and therefore also the first Exorcistes Why may not the miraculous faith be auouched perpetuall Orthodoxus Because the same was but temporarie and had onely her powerfull continuance so farre foorth as seemed good to the Lord for an extraordinarie sealing vp and confirming of the word with miracles folowing But that vse hath vndoubtedly ceased long since and therefore also the miraculous faith attending such temporarie vse is vndoubtedly ceased Howbeit of this more at large when wee come to handle the meanes of subduing the extraordinarie power of the diuell In the meane time I argue the matter against you thus All true Christian churches and the soundest Diuines in our daies doe generallie conclude a finall discontinuance of the miraculous faith in these daies of the Gospell and therefore by consequence the vndoubted determination of the diuell his extraordinarie power of actuall possession Exorcistes Do you then verie confidently denie all power to the diuell in these daies of the Gospell Orthodoxus I onely impugne his supposed extraordinarie power for the perpetuitie of actuall possession I denie not his power of obsession at all Exorcistes Why what vnderstand you by his power of obsession Orthodoxus This question I assure you is verie fitly propounded for hauing hitherto handled at large the diuell his power of actuall possession it remaineth now to entreate a little of his power of obsession wherein we need not to be tedious the same being apparantly euident and generally confessed of all men Now therefore by the diuell his power of obsession I do heere vnderstand some certeine predeterminate abilitie facultie or inclination of his spirituall nature for the more powerfull enabling of his restlesse endeuours and insatiable desires to worke our daily destruction wherein he eftsoones assaulteth circumuenteth encloseth inuironeth besiegeth the seruants of God a fresh with a purposed mind to deuoure them quite were they not very mightilie protected by an inuincible power of the Lord. And this his said power of obsession consisteth especially either in an outward assaulting and vexing or in an inward suggesting and tempting at least Lycanthropus What meane you by an outward assaulting and vexing Orthodoxus I vnderstand thereby all those their externall allurements incumbrances molestations and griefes whatsoeuer wherewith the whole nature of man is wonderfully distressed disquieted and vexed Partly by worldly auctoritie examples promises compulsions profites pleasures and so foorth and partlie by fleshly affections inclinations dispositions delights attempts and carnall practises whatsoeuer they be Philologus And what meane you by inward suggestings and temptings Orthodoxus I vnderstand thereby all those the internall allurements of satan whatsoeuer wherewith he endeuoureth to drawe mens mindes from their dutifull obedience to God by daring or thrusting into them all trecherous and diuelish deuises yea and by kindling within them all vngodly motions affections lustes and desires Nowe for the speedie effecting hereof the diuels they become lying spirits in the mouthes of false Prophets they worke lying woonders in all deceaueablenes of vnrighteousnes they buffet mens minds with fearefull tentations they endeuour to fifâ—e and winow their soules as men winow wheate they make men vncleane and replenish their hartes with filthie pollutions that thereby they might draw them into open dissimulation with the holy Ghost they vexe and torment men within and without yea which more is they so dangerously â—ncumber mens iudgements through the Law of their members rebelling against the Law of their mindes as eftsoones they enforce them to distrust their happie deliuerance yea and to desire their present dissolution to be presently with Christ himselfe Loe thus much in effect for the diuel his power of obsession Lycanthropus This sir I assure yon is a woonderfull power and such as should foorthwith awaken our harts to a continuall watchfulnes But tell vs further I pray you by what meanes the diuell especially effecteth these matters Orthodoxus Although the diuel hath vndoubtedly innumerable meanes to accomplish his villanies yet surely the most principall for the timely effecting of his power of obsession is an holding men fast in the ignorance of God That so all the while they doe carelesly continue in darkenes and sit still in the shadow of death the diuell might assault them eftsoones at his pleasure and come vpon them at vnawares to accomplish in them his mischieuous purposes Neither is this holding of men in palpable ignorance impossible for satan by the permission of God to effect Because the diuell himselfe being the God of this world and therefore of an admirable power be both can and doth purposely blindfold the minds of all infidels least at any time the light of the glorious Gospel of Christ the image of God should shine foorth vnto them That hauing so insnared and captiuated the men at his pleasure they might from thencefoorth walke on in vanitie of their mindes And which more is that their vnderstanding by this meanes being darkened they might through their owne ignorance and hardnes of hart become aliants strangers from the life of God and being past feeling might foorthwith giue ouer themselues vnto wantonnes to worke all manner of vncleannes yea euen with insatiable and greedie affections Exorcistes Wel sir. And how is it possible the diuel should accomplish these fearefull effects in any mans mind but by an actuall possession at least Orthodoxus Yes the diuell he wel may and doth easily effect all these with many other like fearefull effects onely by an actuall power without any actuall possession at all And this especially by depriuing the world of that eternall word of life which was giuen to enlighten mens soules He depriues the world of the word of life either by holding it altogether from them or otherwise by hindring the effectuall working power thereof at the least He holds the word altogether from men by forestalling and hindering the timely establishment of faithfull Preachers in euerie place Againe if he cannot possibly intercept the Preachers establishment then he endeuors eftsoones to hinder at least the affectuall working
diuels for thereby also you might haue borne vs in hand that herbes in times past haue beene workers of miracles Exorcistes Well sir howsoeuer you would scoffe out the matter doe answere Iosephus Physiologus I will Iosephus he hath heretofore so often beene tainted in matters of more waightie importance as we haue the lesse cause to credit his pen in these his senseles reports Besides that let this which he writes concerning these tryfling toyes be esteemed for certeine truthes I meane that some such dipossessions were effected in some outward appearance yet Wierus he flatly affirmes that Iosephus the Iewe Vespasian the Ethnicke and Eleazar also the Hebrew were euerie of them woonderfully bewitched with the iuggling sleights of the diuell Who for the present did purposely pretend the giuing of place to an imagined vertue in ringes in rootes in herbes and in stones that by meanes of such sundrie his illusions those persons themselues might the more easily be brought to repose greater confidence in those tryfling toies then in the almighty Iehouah the onely disposer and guider of all things And for the furthering of this his diuellish endeuour the better he brought it also to passe that all those his said Exorcismes they were very confidently fathered vpon Salomon himselfe in an especiall regard of his singular wisedome that by such legerdemaines he might winne the more credit to all those his sprituall illusions But seeing it is certeinly true that these created instruments could not effectiuely extend foorth themselues to the powerfull effecting of any such supernaturall effects what man will bee so wilfully madde as once to beleeue or once to esteeme those his tryfling tales for infallible truthes Againe sith Salomon the verie mirrour it selfe of heauenly wisedome being vsually accustomed as the Hebrewes report to dispute of trees and of herbes from the Cedar of Libanon to the verie Hysope it selfe and which more is of beastes of fowles of creeping things and of fishes in the knowledge of all which there lieth hid from the world much secret Philosophie for the admirable effecting of such admirable matters by meere naturall meanes If Salomon I say disputing these matters hath left no one monument at all of any such admirable skill throughout the whole scriptures recorded what wight is so sottishly minded as once to imagine that wise Salomon himselfe was the first inuentour of anie such palpable fooleries or that he was the author of any such Magicall enchantments and superstitious Exorcismes as are so iniuriouslie or rather so blasphemouslie fathered vpon him Exorcistes How basely soeuer you esteeme of these meanes which Iosephus reportes yet what say you to that which good Tobie declareth concerning the perfume made with the fishes liuer which expelled the diuell from out of Sarah the daughter of Raguel That perfume you know it was only a created and meere naturall meanes therefore an onely created and meere naturall meanes it hath and may haue in it an actuall power for the dispossessing of spirits and diuels Physiologus The booke of Tobiah it is not Canonicall and therefore not authenticall enough to conuince or confirme any matter in controuersie But be it supposed Canonicall yet thus then I answere the same Namely that the forenamed perfume so made of the liuer it might lessen in some sort the present affliction though not vtterly expell the diuell his possession For that perfume it might be some physicall meanes to drie vp or correct some bad disposition in Sarahs braine arising naturally from the variable disposition of the moone it selfe ouer moistning her braine and making it more apt for the present apprehending of satan his entended afflictions Which saide badde humour of hers being by that meanes something alaied the affliction withall it would something abate howbeit vtterly to expell the diuell his possession it could haue no possible power at all No that supernaturall action if any such were was supernaturally effected by a supernaturall power in the Angell Who taught not Tobiah by any force of that perfume to expell the diuell but tolde him rather before that so soone as the perfume was kindled the diuell should foorthwith be expelled Not that the perfume it selfe should effectiuely procure any such supernaturall action but be rather an apparant demonstration of the admirable effecting thereof For euen as it is not vndoubtedly necessarie that the washing of my handes shoulde be an efficient cause of the moones ecclipse though the moone it selfe at the verie time of my washing be vndoubtedly ecclipsed so neither was it necessarie that the forenamed perfume should effectiuely procure of it selfe that selfesame supposed dispossession of satan howsoeuer satan at the verie instant it selfe was truelie dispossessed So then the Angell he taught by that perfume what should then come to passe not rendring any one efficient cause why it so came to passe As also the verie text you alledge it telleth vs not that the perfume expelled the power of the diuell but that it was rather the Angell himselfe who cast the diuell foorth at the verie same time the perfume was kindled Now then what was it I pray you that expelled the diuel the perfume which rose vp from the liuer no but the Angell that bound him And how did he binde him by any effectuall meanes of that perfume No but at the verie same season the liuer perfumed the Angell he bound the diuell in the vtmost borders of Egypt Giuing Tobiah that selfesame perfume as an infallible signe but no effectuall cause at all of Sarah her happie deliuerance Thus then you plainely perceiue that no created or meere naturall meanes â—ath any efficient power of it selfe for the actuall dispossessing of spirits and diuels Exorcistes Wel sir howsoeuer you may iustly challenge the authority of Tobiah for not being authenticall I haue one example from the canonicall scriptures to confirme the infallible truth of that which I hold herein Namely that admirable action of Dauid who onely but plaied with his harp and the euil spirit of the Lord departed from Saul Howbeit that harpe and that playing of Dauid thereon were onely created and meer naturall meanes therefore some onely created or meere naturall meanes may haue in it naturally an effectuall power for the dispossessing of spirits and diuels Physiologus In deed if spirits and diuels had their peculier bodies naturally vnited vnto them as Apuleius affirmeth saying that diuels are liuing creatures constituted of airy bodies of passible minds and in time also eternall then there would be no inconuenience at all to hold that spirits and diuels by a melodious sound or some other such sensible meanes might be altered in their actions and expelled from men For the Platonists they flatly affirme that diuels are a certeine meane betweene the intellectuall spirits who are of a pure spirituall substance and between men hauing bodies constituted of the foure elements Howbeit because the sacred scriptures and
may by no meanes any longer endure your palpable vntruthes or rather most blasphemous speeches For where hath the Lord established praier and fasting as an extraordinary perpetuall meanes for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels Exorcistes Euen in the seauenteene of Mathew and ninth of Marke where he telleth vs plainely that this kind goeth not foorth or can by no other meanes else be cast out but by praier and fasting Orthodoxus What conclude you from thence Exorcistes This I conclude and very confidently hold namely that one beeing possessed praier and fasting is to be vsed for the casting out of satan as a meanes appointed of God to that speciall end Orthodoxus Do you hold that in good earnest Exorcistes Yea in very good earnest And this I doubt not but I am able to prooue by the holy scriptures and further to confirme the same by the testimony of ancient and late writers by the practise also of the primitiue church in all ages and the good successe thereof Orthodoxus Then will I be bound for one twelue moneths space to keepe your kine for nothing Howbeit because this point will craue a long discourse and I feele my selfe somewhat weary with sitting let vs go walke a turne or two in my parlour And hauing reuiued our spirits by the singing of psalmes returne againe to our purpose Physiologus I for my owne part like well of your motion Lycanthropus The same I dare say for all the rest Orthodoxus Arise then and let vs depart The end of the eight Dialogue The ninth Dialogue THE ARGVMENT Whether Praier and fasting be established by Christ as a perpetuall ordinarie meanes for the powerfull expelling of diuels Whether the power therein be a vocal or a personall power Or whether a true iustifying faith apprehending some supernaturall power of God doth effect that worke The speakers names PHILOLOGVS LYCANTHROPVS PNEVMATOMACHVS PHYSIOLOGVS ORTHODOXVS EXORCISTES Orthodoxus BLessed be the name of our God for these sweete recreations oh how they comfort the soule and refresh the bodie Surely our crazie bodies they would soone be infeebled were they not daily supported by such sanctified props yea and our soules also they would languish euerie hower were they not eftsoones comforted by such gracious refreshings from God Physiologus It is vndoubtedly so as you saie and therefore how highly are we bound to extoll his mercifull kindnes Orthodoxus Verie true But come Exorcistes let vs loose no time Hath Christ established prayer and fasting for the perpetuall expelling of spirits and diuels Exorcistes There is no doubt at all to be made of that matter Orthodoxus I am doubtfull thereof I assure you neither will you be able I feare to cleere me of that doubt so long as I haue breath in my bodie For this I must tell you for certeine that if praier and fasting be perpetually appointed by Christ for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels then must we necessarilie esteeme thereof as of an holy established ordinance for that selfesame purpose Exorcistes Yea no doubt it is an holie established ordinance for that verie same purpose Orthodoxus If it be an holie ordinance perpetually establisht by Christ as you beare vs in hand then hath it also an apparant commandement appertaining vnto it for the authenticall approbation of such a perpetuall establishment it hath also some certeine Canons and rules concerning out orderly directions therein But no such commandement or canon is any where extant in all the Scriptures therefore praier and fasting is no perpetuall ordinance establisht by Christ to any such speciall purpose Exorcistes I vnderstand not your argument it is so obseurely and so intricately propounded vnto vs. Orthodoxus It is apparant enough if you were not wilfully blinde howbeit I will repeate and propound it more cleerely thus If praier and fasting be such an established ordinance then that establishment is apparantly exprest in the Scriptures but the latter is false therefore also the first Exorcistes Why sir hath not our Sauiour himselfe put downe an expresse commandement for the perpetuall establishment of such an ordinance where he telleth vs plainely that this kind goeth not foorth but by prayer and fasting What may be more cleere then this Orthodoxus Do you call this a cleere commandement for the perpetuall establishment of such an ordinance Exorcistes What may be more cleere Orthodoxus You do herein too to fondly bewray your grosse ignorance and make cleere to the world your want of iudgement concerning the purpose of Christ in that place Which was onely to make knowne the accidentall impediment in that selfe-same action and not to put downe any essentiall commandement concerning the supposed perpetuitie of any such sacred ordinance as your selfe do imagine For what manner of argument is this that you make This kind goeth not foorth but by praier and fasting therefore from hencefoorth saith Christ I do solemnly establish prayer and fasting as a perpetuall ordidinance for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels for euer This foloweth faire and farre of from the purpose you aime at Againe if the holy ghost in that place had either expresly or implicatiuely entended to put downe a commaundement for the perpetuall establishment of any such falsly supposed ordinance then surely it is not to be doubted at all but that in a matter especially of such sacred importance he would neuer haue left vs at randome to deale therein as seemed good to our selues but in some other place else at the least he would haue inserted such certeine canons and rules as should more fuly haue serued for our orderly direction and guidance therein Howbeit neither in the epistle to the Romanes or Corinthians neither yet in any of those to Timothy or Titus where all church offices and officers are handled at lage doth he giue any one rule at all concerning the orderly practise of this your falsly supposed perpetuall ordinance and therefore the same is no such ordinance established by Christ. Besides that the apostle Peter hauing purposely laid open the perpetuall vagaries of satan to kill and deuour he maketh no mention at all of praier and fasting but onely of a strong faith to resist him withall As also the apostle Paul displaying purposely the compleate armour of christians against the power of the diuel whatsoeuer he speakes not a word of praier and fasting for the timely withstanding of any his fiery darts So then sith in all the canonicall scriptures there is neither commaundement nor canon for the timely fortification of any such new-found ordinance I wonder you blush not to braue out the matter as hitherto you haue done by pretending the authority of scriptures the testimony of fathers old and new the practise of the church in euery age yea and the good successe thereof to mannage the matter it selfe Exorcistes I could prooue the same in such sort as I say You could so I confesse if
you had wherewith all to doe it but this lingring delay in dooing the work doth notably declare you a non proficient or make your penury that way to apparant at least For it is full two yeeres since that your thrasâ—nicall vaunt was vented foorth whereas hetherto you haue not set any one of those your brauing huge barrels abroach to giue vs so much as a tast of your further stoare And therefore it cannot possibly be but that either you are drawen dry of your proofes before you begin the banket or that they doe at the least haerere in calamo cleaue so close to your pen as all the power you haue is vtterly vnable to procure their publike passage Well sir whatsoeuer be the want we will in speciall fauour attend with patience your more conuenient leysure for the expected performance of that your bumbasted and brauing abilitie concerning the irrefragable confirmation of this your imagined ordinance In the meane time we thinke it good to giue you an inckling of some one or two of the later writers whose iudgements are opposite to that which you tell vs. First Caluin vpon those selfesame scriptures he telleth vs thus Whereas Christ imputeth their not preuailing against that diuell to some want of faith in his owne disciples he teacheth vs plainely to ascribe the whole efficacie of euerie such miraculous action to the power of faith and not to our prayer and fasting Shewing vs therein how ridiculously the Papists haue constituted their actuall fasting alone as an effectuall counterpoyson for the powerfull expelling of Spirits and Diuels Thus far Caluin In like manner Bullinger vpon the selfesame place he writeth thus These words they are anagogecally or ascendingly transferred from that inferiour to a superior consideration or from that one perticular to an vniuersalitie thus The Lord you see he hath deliuered this one Demoniak or he hath expelled this one diuell doubt you not therefore of his further power for the timely subduing of the whole kingdome of Satan He saith not thus the Lord by his immediate power hath driuen out this one diuel from the child and therefore all spirits and diuels shall from hencefoorth be immediately expelled by prayer and fasting thereby prescribing a perpetual Canon to Exorcists no he entended not any such matter at all For this kinde saith Christ it goeth not foorth but by prayer and fasting Therein verie couertly deducing his speech from that one particular president to all manner of arts impurities and tentations of Satan whatsoeuer and not to a perpetuall establishment of any such falsly supposed ordinance for the powerfull expelling of spirits by prayer and fasting as your selfe doth falsely and fondly imagine Exorcistes Well yet for all this our Sauiour Christ doth vndoubtedly insinuate some secret force to fasting and praier for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels euen in those selfesame words expressed before otherwise he would neuer haue so precisely put them downe in that place And therefore the Church from age to age in their seuerall Exorcismes and we also at Mahgnitton haue delt according to the sacred Scriptures in practising praier and fasting for the expelling of diuels because besides that worke of faith which Caluin and Bullinger noteth these also in that place are iointly required by Christ. Orthodoxus Is this a good argument Christ by occasion doth mention fasting and praier in that place therefore he establisheth exorcizings by praier and fasting as a perpetuall ordinance for the Church to obserue This Iesuiticall iest was fitly and fullie answered by an excellent Doctor thus The popish church and you also your selues haue to grosly abused the ignorant people in making them beleeue you can cast foorth diuels whereas you haue no such power at all Neither can you by all your praiers and fastings coniure out one vncleane spirit from a man vnlesse you haue first like sorcerers and witches coniured them in Exorcistes Let it be a Iesuiticall iest or whatsoeuer you please I make no doubt but that praier and fasting is an ordinance perpetually establisht by Christ for the powerfull expelling of diuels Orthodoxus Be it euen so as you saie But do tell me withall I pray you whether our Sauiour Christ hath establisht the same as an ordinance generally for all to vndergoe or whether he hath onely imposed the dispatch thereof vpon some certeine speciall persons Exorcistes I hold it an ordinance belonging indifferently to all both men and women Yea and I am fully perswaded that the faithfull praiers of the partie and his friends might well haue preuailed with God in this case though no one preacher at all had beene present as in the dispossession of Thomas Darling was verie apparant Orthodoxus If praier and fasting for the powerfull expelling of diuels be an ordinance belonging to all as you say then the vndergoing thereof is also a dutie appertaining to all and so the partie at Mahgnitton as also his parents they failed greatly in doing their dutie that way Exorcistes I make no question of that Orthodoxus Verie well But what warrant had you to vndertake the timely discharge of other mens duties in a matter especially of such weightie importance and so neerely coÌ„cerning themselues you are not of this minde I hope namely that it is sufficient for men to discharge their duties either by themselues or by others Neither yet that your selfe is a second Atlas appointed by God to vndergoe the whole waight of euerie mans dutie or that you are able to accomplish at full any such supposed workes of supererogation as may fullie suffice for the timely dispatch of your owne and other mens duties Exorcistes No surely I am free from either of both the opinions Orthodoxus How then comes it to passe that your selfe durst so boldly aduenture vpon the discharge of that dutie which as you affirme did properly appertaine to the partie himselfe and his parents togither or why did you not rather aduise and exhort them to the timely dispatch of the selfesame dutie which you say appertained in dutie vnto them Is not this the practise of a Polypragmaticall mate yea and to become a busie bodie in other mens matters Exorcistes Nay sir your collections they are ouer strict and your censures to sharpe concerning my former speeches For albeit I did and doe flatly affirme that praier and fasting for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels is in deede a generall duty belonging to all the church yet I doubt not but that the same notwithstanding doth more specially apperteine to preachers and pastours For euen as all men are generally bound to pray vnto God for their forgiuenesse of sinnes and yet that generall duety it doth not exclude the ministers or preachers from praying publiquely for the remission of sinnes in all so surely albeit that praier and fasting for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels be a generall duety enioined generally to all the whole
more especially procure an apparant effect of spirituall graces to shinefoorth in some soule where they shone not before therefore the spirit of God may then be said truely to enter into such a soule because the efficacie thereof doth more effectuallie and more apparently breake foorth to the view of our eies And euen after this selfesame sort I assure you we are to vnderstand in this place the vertue going foorth from our Sauiour Christ to the curing of others because the Diuine vertue it selfe perpetually existing in the person of Christ at that verie same instant did more effectually cause health in those the diseased parties So then howsoeuer this place may serue verie fitly to shew foorth the efficacie of Christ his vertue in curing diseases it helpeth nothing at all to vnderprop your pestilent opinion of a vertue or power essentially proceeding from your owne or anie mans person for the powerfull expelling of spirits and diuels Exorcistes But tell me I beseech you was that miraculous curing of people by those selfesame touchings of Christ a worke of his Diuinitie onely or of his humanitie also Physiologus This I must shew you for certeine that Leo himselfe verie flatlie affirmeth all the miraculous actions effected by Christ to be effectually wrought by his Diuinitie onely For seeing saith Leo there are vndoubtedly in the person of Christ two distinct or essentiall natures the one Diuine which shineth foorth by extraordinarie miraculous actions and the other humane which doth solely vndergoe all offered iniuries It foloweth necessarily that looke how the humane nature applieth it selfe to the vndergoing of iniuries euen so the diuine nature disposeth it selfe to the effecting of myracles But the humane nature alone applieth it selfe to the vndergoing of iniuries because to suffer at all is a thing vtterly opposite to the nature of the Deitie therefore the Diuine nature alone it likewise disposeth it selfe to the admirable effecting of miracles because the effecting of such surmounteth the compasse of Christ his created humanitie according to that of Dauid Ichouah alone doth wondrous things Againe the miraculous actions they do highlie exceed the whole power of any created nature But the humanitie of Christ it is onely a created nature therefore the humanitie of Christ of it selfe can effect no miraculous actions Lycanthropus This I suppose is vndoubtedly true and without contradiction at all Physiologus It is so I confesse being warely and wiâ—ely vnderstood else there may lie some exceptions against it For the comparison it holdes verie fitlie in this one respect Namely that as the humanitie of Christ alone was a reason or cause of his vndergoing the offred iniuries so surely the Diuinitie of Christ alone it was also the reason or primarie efficient cause of his effecting the miraculous actions Howbeit that selfesame comparison it holdeth not so currantly in a second respect For howsoeuer it is no waies repugnant vnto the humanitie of Christ to be also an effector of miracles instrumentally yet is it quite contrarie vnto the Diuinitie of Christ to suffer afflictions in any respect I meane either principally or instrumentally because the diuinitie it selfe is wholy impassible Although yet I dare not denie but that in an onely especiall regard of the supposed identitie or communicable proprieties of both natures in the one person of Christ that which is truely said of the one may be as true said of the other For first respecting the whole person of Christ it is not vntruely said that the Godhead did suffer againe respecting the whole person of Christ it may as truely be said that this childe meaning Christ created the heauens Because Christ himselfe is that eternall word of the father whereby all things in the beginning were created and made And therefore that sentence of Dauid who saith that Iehouah alone doth wondrous things it is not so to be taken as happily you would haue vs imagine For the word alone in that place it excludes not the humanitie of Christ as any instrumentall but onely as a meere principall agent in working woondrous things Exorcistes But sir notwithstanding this your cunning distinction it is verie apparant that euen the humanitie of Christ alone as a principall agent it selfe did worke sundrie miraculous cures in sundrie diseased persons for so many as but touched his bodie yea or the hemme of his garment they were presently healed Now then if those selfesame touchings of Christ did not effectually worke in those the aforesaid cures it must necessarily follow that Christ did something in vaine But Christ he did nothing in vaine therefore euen those the aforesaid touchings themselues did effectually worke in those the forenamed cures Howbeit those sensible touchings they were onely meere actions of Christ his humanitie therefore Christ his onely humanitie did principally and effectually worke in all those the forenamed cures which succeeded those sensible touchings Physiologus Christ he healed so many as handled him spiritually by the apprehension of faith not all such as onely but touched him corporally by corporall sense Otherwise if onely a sensible touching of Christ or his garments had principally and effectually beene able of it selfe alone to worke those selfesame cures then Iudas that kissed him the souldiers that stripped him the high priests seruants that smote him yea and the rest of the people that thronged and pressed vpon him had beene euerie of them also effectually amended of all their maladies Howbeit saith Beda onely those men alone doe truely and effectually handle our Sauiour Christ who spiritually receiue his faith and his loue in their harts So then for a more plaine vnderstanding of our matters in question it shall not be amisse to proceed more exactly vnto a more orderly consideration of all miraculous actions and this also in a double respect Namely either principally or instrumentally First if we take due consideration of the working of miracles principallie I meane according to their primarie or proper efficient then are we bound without contradiction to beleeue and confesse that all miraculous and supernaturall actions do highly surmount the whole power of euerie creature whatsoeuer and are onely peculiar to Iehouah himselfe who alone doth woondrous things Yea this is vndoubtedly true that no one supernaturall action how simple soeuer in shew may possiblie be effected by any other power principally but by the onely supereminent power of El-shaddai alone I meane that al-sufficient omnipotent and almightie Iehouah himselfe Who is an vnmeasurable mountaine of goodnes the onely true cherishing dug that is neuer drawne drie yea and who only accomplisheth whatsoeuer he wils in heauen and in earth at what time in what place and after what maner best pleaseth himselfe Howbeit if we respect the working of miraculous actions but instrumentally I meane onely according to their secondary or instrumentall cause then must we in
the powerfull execution of which Processe he so canuassed that cumbersome Spirit as he was glad to betake himselfe to the vttermost borders of Aegypt and euer since then the countrey hath beene free from such dangerous bug-boyes and therefore you may boldly submit your selfe Exorcistes If I submit to this motion my credit is crackt in the world Orthodoxus Why stand you so much vpon your outward reputation before the face of the world against the plaine euidence of your inward conscience in the presence of God Or why will you in this case especially so fondly respect the flying reports of phantasticall felowes What will it preiudice your person though blind ignorance should cancell your credit in the transitorie tables of worldly mens harts when your owne conscience doth not rase foorth your name from the euerlasting Booke of the liuing Put case that those good reports which the world doth affoord you be not found to be faithfully registred in the closet of your conscience then what other effect can they cause in the same but an inward tormenting torture Put case againe that those bad reports wherewith the vile world would besmeere your credit among men be found vtterly false in the consistory of your secret conscience Oh what an exceeding great ioy will be resident there and keepe in the same a continuall feast So then if your owne conscience accuse you not you must not so greatly regard the causeles contumelies of cinicall censurers as that for the same you care not to torture your conscience with continuall torments Neither may you be perswaded that other mens lying reportes are esteemed more authenticall before the tribunall seat of Christ the righteous Iudge then the approoued testimonie of your owne conscience which stands there to be acquited in iudgement The premisses therefore considered I would aduise you rather to respect conscience then fame for fame may oftsoones be forged but so can conscience neuer and therefore submit your selfe Exorcistes Alas sir I am by the verie force of your speech so fearefully distracted as I wotte not which waies to turne me For if I stande out as hitherto I haue done you will repute me to be peeuishly obstinate on the otherside by submitting my selfe to your motion I should but confirme the Bishop in their badde opinion concerning my cause Who suspecting me to be confederate with the boie in some cosening practise haue hitherto handled me too too hardly Orthodoxus Your setled pertinancie in so apparant an vntruth hath bred in euerie of them that bad opinion and your peeuish persisting therein doth more fully confirme them in such a conceit Touching their hard proceeding against your person if you simply respect the cause they could do no lesse then they did although yet respecting especially your place and calling it were to be wished that as well on their as on your owne behalfe a more considerate regard had beene giuen to the maine cause it selfe without any such eger persute or preposterous apologies cōcerning matters of fact For then so soone as it had been made apparantly euident that there are now no possessions at all your standing out in the matter would foorthwith haue beene nipt in the head Whereas they now suspecting perhaps that you had some sinister purpose to manage your publike fasts by such a pretended false miracle haue shewed the more sharpenes and your selfe on the otherside surmizing it may be that they onely maligning the puritie of your pretended profession haue continued so much the more obstinate All which inconsiderate courses and preposterous practises would haue beene fitly forestalled if betweene you all the cause it selfe had beene cleered Howbeit the remedie comes neuer vnseasonablie which may fully effect the cure and that I assure my selfe may yet be accomplished by your dutifull and humble submission Exorcistes Sir notwithstanding anie your patheticall perswasions the premisses considered I may in no wise submit Physiologus Master Orthodoxus that which hath beene hitherto spoken may fully suffice to perswade any reasonable person affecting the sincere truth with freedome of conscience Howbeit this fellow I perceiue he is wholie ouerswaied with some spiced singularitie or with a peeuish selfewill at the least in not submitting himselfe to that truth which he is vnable to answer for any thing hitherto heard You haue I confesse beene toiled too much respecting especially your present meditations for the Sabaoth daies exercise and therefore it shall not be amisse to put an end to our conference In the meane time let Exorcistes repaire to his familiar friendes and those of his faction how many or mightie soeuer Let him intimate our whole discourse to their approoued iudgements Let them dulie consider and exactly perpend the seuerall points and then let them in a more mature deliberation deuise with themselues whether it be better for the man to submit or still to stand out as he doth If they aduise him to yeeld a submission we haue our harts desire and God the whole glorie If otherwise they will haue him standfast to his tackling Let then signifie the manner how with the time and place for our meeting and we will be readie from time to time to conferre with them to the full if they accept of our offer Lycanthropus This is in my simple conceite a Christian motion Pneumatomachus If they dislike they shall greatly discredit their cause Physiologus They are bound to praise God for your Christian care Orthodoxus Well then in the meane time we will pray vnto God to enlighten our iudgements to make vs wise to sobrietie and to giue vnto vs the spirit of discretion that we may be able to discerne the things that differ and to approoue only of those things which are pleasing to God in Iesus Christ and so I take my leaue for the present 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Soli Deo gloria 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 A summarie Table of all the principall points the speciall matters the seuerall syllogismes and the sundrie expositions of such places of Scripture as are any way pertinent to the maine purpose it selfe The first Dialogue pag. 1. CHristian conferences and their commendable vse pag. 2. Sommers his supposed passions put downe 4 Mans nature is euer desirous of Nouelties 6 Christian exercises must be begun with praier 7 Pneumatomachus what it properly signifieth 8 That there are essentiall spirits and diuels 9 Angels are celestiall creatures created of God ibid. Spirits and diuels supposed to be nothing else but the good or euill motions in men ibid. Angels supposed to be none other thing els but the sensible signes of Gods woonderfull power ibid. It is dangerous to denie the essentiall being of spirits and diuels 11 Man is endued with a spirituall and immortall soule ibid. The originall fountaines or grounds of all errors 12 Physiologus and what the same signifieth 13 Philosophie is not simplie forbidden Col. 2. 8. ibid. The true vse of Philosophie expressed ibid. The minde what
it is and the effects thereof ibid. The minde how it is corrupted naturally 14 The minde differeth from the will and how ibid. Phantasie what it is and how it worketh ibid. The naturall man vnable to comprehend spirituall things 14 15 Anthropomorphites errour and whence it sprang 17 Scriptures expounded hand ouer head doe procure a thousand absurdities 18 Reasons proouing Spirits and Diuels to be more then the good or euill motions of men 18 19 Angels not mentioned in the Worlds creation 21 Angels and Spirits not eternall or vncreated 22 Angels in what day they were created 23 24 Reasons to prooue the essentiall being of Angels ibid. Testimonies of Fathers for the essentiall being of Angels 24 Angels created on the second day 24 25 Reasons to prooue the essentiall being of Angels 26 Angels how they are saide to be euill 28 To be created good and still to retaine that selfesame goodnes are two distinct things 29 Boyling affections the causes of controuersies 30 Physiologus and what the same signifieth 31 Possessions doubted in these daies of the Gospell 32 Satans dominion ouer men what it is and how the same is limited 33 Possession and what it importeth ibid. The worde Possession is not peculiarly appropriated to the Diuel throughout the whole Bible ibid. If the Lord had euer entended an essentiall possession of Diuels he wanted not fit words to expresse it 34 Possession what it is in the Hebrue toong 35 Possession what it signifieth in the Greeke toong 37 Possession how the same is defined 40 Reall possession of Diuels what it is 41 Mentall possession what it is thought to be ibid. Reall possession whether in the minde alone or in the body alone or in the minde and bodie togither ibid. Satan needs no mentall possession for the actuall accomplishment of sinne in any 42 The maner of Satan his proceeding with men 43 44 Reasons against the reall mentall possession 45 46 Our iudgement concerning the reall mentall possession is mightily deceiued by relying too much on the bare letter 48 Satan being a Spirit doth principally affect mans spirit 49 After what manner the Diuell hath a mentall possession 50 Spirits and Diuels are substantiall creatures 51 Diuels are Spirits by nature and Angels by office ibid. Diuels are spirituall and finite substances 52 53 Whether mans minde be a receptacle or place circumscribing the Diuell 53 Whether mans minde be a common or proper place for the Diuell 54 Whether it be a corporall or an imaginarie place 55 Things are said to be in a place three maner of waies 56 Corporall substances are in a place dimensiuely ibid. Spirituall substances are in a place determinately 57 God is in a place indefinitiuely and repletiuely ibid. Angels and Diuels howsoeuer they propound diuers ends their maner of working is euer the same 58 Diuels how and by what meanes they torment men 60 God is the onely encliner of mans minde 61 Mans minde is inclined either by an interiour efficient or by an exterior agent 62 The third Dialogue pag. 64. COrporall possession what it is supposed to be of some 65 Reall corporall possession what it is ordinarily thought to be ibid. Entring in and dwelling there do imply no essentially inherency but an effectuall operation in the bodies of men 66 The Metaphor of entring in rightly expounded and fitly explicated by the example of Saul and Dauid 67 The word Tsalak verie truely expounded by conference with other places of scripture 68 A good rule for the right vnderstanding of such scriptures as doe any way concerne the extraordinarie operation of Spirits 69 Sundrie reasons against the reall corporall possession 70 Mans minde is an incorporall substance being simply considered 70 71 The proper operations of the minde are either organicall or animall ibid. The organicall operations of the minde what they are 72 The animall operations of the minde what they are ibid. Whether mans minde or the Diuell be answerable for the actions done by the bodie during the time of Satans possession 73 74 God in the first creation of bodies neuer purposed any such reall corporal possessions of Diuels 74 Gods image was not lost in Adam as touching the essence 76 A humane bodie is onely capable of an humane soule 77 Satan so possesseth as Christ inuadeth ibid. There is no one necessarie vse or end of such a possession ibid. If the Diuell be in the possessed mans bodie essentially then is he so either hypostatically or formally 78 How the reall corporall possession may be perceiued 78 79 Whether Diuels haue their proper or their assumed bodies or whether no bodies at all 80 Celestiall bodies haue onely their celestiall motions and elementarie bodies their elementarie motions 80 81 Grosse absurdities ensuing the opinion of corporall Diuels ibid. It is absurd to hold that Diuels haue airie bodies 82 Augustine is not sound concerning the supposed airie bodies of Spirits and Diuels 83 Though it were graunted that Diuels might adde vnto yet may they not diminish or alter their substantiall being 84 Fower seuerall sorts of Spirits found in the word ibid. Angels haue eftsoones their assumed bodies and why 85 The testimonie of fathers pretending corporall Diuels 86 Reasons directly concluding the incorporietie of Diuels 94 Testimonie of fathers concerning that point 95 The Grand Iuries verdict against corporall Diuels 96 The Laterane Councell concluding the same 97 The fourth Dialogue pag. 99. WHether Diuels can essentially assume true naturall bodies 9. Whether that bodie which the Diuels are supposed to assume be a true naturall or but a phantasticall bodie 100 The Diuell had neuer power to assume essentially any liuing mans bodie pag. 101 The Diuel had neuer power to assume essentially any dead mans body ibi It is absurd to hold the Diuell his assuming of dead mens bodies 101 102 Whether the Diuell can assume to himselfe an vncreated bodie 102 The Lord alone is the onely creator of bodies ibid. It is absurd to imagine that God should create bodies for Satan 103 Satan hath no power at all to create a bodie 104 Arguments pretending the Diuell his essentiall assuming of bodies 105 It is no good argument to hold that because good Angels haue therefore euill Angels may also assume to themselues true natural bodies 105 106 That place in the Psalme 78. 49. is verie truely expounded 107 The Diuell did not essentially assume to himselfe the serpents body 108 Whether it was the Diuell alone or the serpent alone or the Diuell and serpent together that tempted Euah 109 It is ordinarie in the scriptures to vse the names of other creatures in setting foorth vnto vs the intellectuall creatures 111 Reasons declaring why it was not the serpent but the Diuell himselfe set foorth by the name of a serpent that tempted Euah ibid. A verie good Canon for the faithfull expounding of scriptures 112 It is no absurditie or impietie at all to hold that Moses vnder the person of a poysoning serpent did metaphorically
The first ground of this as of all errours else whatsoeuer doth vndoubtedly arise as you heard from the naturall corruption of your proper minde And this may more plainely appeare if I first shew you what the Minde is and then tell you how the same is corrupted The Minde is that reasonable facultie or power of the soule whereby the naturall man perceiueth knoweth and discerneth all intelligible things By which wordes it is plaine that the proper ende and office of the Minde is especially to perceiue to know and discerne things And this office also it accomplisheth by the helpe of no bodily Organon but onely by it selfe alone vnlesse haply the senses doe sometime assist the intellectiue vertue therein The Minde therefore it differeth you see from the Will For the Minde onely perceiueth and knoweth a thing the Will it maketh free choice either to pursue or eschew the thing that is knowen Now then the Minde in a meere naturall man is easily corrupted by reason of the phantasie through whose onlie helpe the aforesaide knowledge of things intelligible is conueyed and offered vnto it For the phantasie it being that interiour sensitiue knowledge which by the middle ventricle of the braine receiueth into it selfe a verie deepe impression of the sundrie kinds of sensible things either present or absent and labouring also to draw foorth from those seuerall kinds of sensible things the like sensible kindes in conceit it cannot otherwise possibly be but that the said phantasie not being able to transcend beyond the seâ—sitiue knowledge of naturall and corporall substances must needes offer the minde such sensible notions as her speciall oâ—iect affoords And hereby also it commeth to passe that the minde eftsoones is deceiued in perceiuing knowing and discerning aright of euerie intelligible thing more especially if the said phantasie at any time endeuoureth to draw foorth from some sensible things an imaginarie conceit of some intelligiâ—le matter For then the vnderstanding or minde being mightily misled by the phantasie must needs be deceiued in perceiuing and discerning such a matter it being supernaturall spirituall and heauenly and surmounting the compasse of humane reason As for example The minde of a meere naturall man being at any time desirous to perceiue and discerne aright of God of Angels or Diuels it looketh foorthwith to receiue from the phantasie or interiour sensitiue knowledge some certaine notions concerning these matters Which said phantasie receiuing an impression onely of sensible things from the exteriour senses themselues and hauing in her naturally no impression at all of any the aforesaide supernaturall spirituall and heauenly matters therein shee affoordeth the minde either no notions at all or none other at least then onely such as she reeeiueth herselfe from corporall sensible and meere naturall obiects Whereupon the minde being still desirous to perceiue and discerne the aforesaid supernaturall matters and hauing thereof I say no notions at all or deceiueable notions at least shee foorthwith concludes either that there are neither God nor Angell nor Diuell or none other at least then such as shee hath notions of in an imaginarie conceite arising onely vpon a sensible knowledge from corporall sensible and naturall obiects That is the said phantasie receiuing some sensible knowledge from the sense of the eare that God is an almightie and magnificent Lord of hostes it imagineth foorthwith some sensible or corporal potentate and thereupon receiuing an impression of some such sensible thing in conceit the minde by and by from such sensible notions concludeth that God is some almightie supereminent and sensible potentate in deed hauing all princes and powers subiected vnto him Againe the said phantasie hauing receiued by the eare as before a like sensitiue knowledge that the Seraphims shadowing the throne of grace haue sixe wings apiece to flie and to couer themselues withall it foorthwith supposeth some sensible creature and thereupon receiuing as before a sensible impression of some such sensible thing in conceit the minde eftsoones resolueth that Angels if there be any are none other but firie and winged creatures To be short the phantasie hauing receiued by the eare as before that the Diuel is a terrible tormenting Termagant chayned vp vnder darkenes and taking an impression of some such sensible thing in conceit the minde straight way supposeth that infernall spirits if there be any at all are vndoubtedly some blacke grim griesly ghostes hauing goggled eies fearefull clawes with two clouen feete Thus then you see how the mind in a meere naturall man receiuing but bare phantasticall notions of sensible things in conceit is too too corrupted in iudgement and therfore hath naturally no power in it selfe to perceiue to know and discerne aright of any supernaturall spirituall or heauenly matters Pneumatomachus From hence you would seeme to inferre that the meere naturall man is vtterly vnable by naturall reason to conceiue foundly and rightly of spirituall causes Orthodoxus Verie true For as that wisedome which is from belowe is but earthly sensuall and diuellish so surely the naturall man he cannot possibly perceiue the things of the spirit of God for they are but foolishnes to him Neither can he know them at all for they are spiritually discerned And this spirituall discerning of things is no naturall but a supernaturall worke of faith which doth not arise from sensible notions but from a supernaturall knowledge infused spiritually into the enlightened soule and which also being grounded on things that are hoped for is an vndoubted true euidence of things vnseene Otherwaies faith could be no faith at all as one very fitly affirmeth saying The diuine operation if it may possibly be comprehended by reason is nothing admirable neither can that faith find any merite whereunto humane reason affoords an experiment Philologus How now Pneumatomachus what say you to these matters Pneumatomachus By that which is spoken I doe plainely perceiue the verie first ground of all grosse and palpable errours namely the grosse conceiuing of spirituall matters according to that natural knowledge which naturally ariseth from meere sensible and naturall notions Exorcistes You haue conceiued aright but how is your hart affected therewith Pneumatomachus It is affected I hope as it ought to be For surely this I must needs confesse to my shame that hetherto I haue adiudged nothing either possible in nature or credible in action which could not absolutely be comprehended by humane reason And this now I perceiue is that worldly wisedome which the word accompteth foolishnes with God But doe shewe me good Maister Orthodoxus the other ground also of these grosse opinions Orthodoxus With verie good will The other ground of your errors ariseth I assure you from a carelesse misconstruing of some such places of scripture as doe attribute to God and to spirits a corporall forme as eies eares hands feete bodies wings and such like Which said places your selfe vnderstanding them carnally do seeme to import vnto you at
catholike faith doe iointly auouch that spirits and diuels are of an Angelical nature and that howsoeuer by malice corrupted their naturall faculties doe still remaine absolute in them we may consequently conclude that therefore no sensible matter or corporall vertue is able of it selfe directly or indirectly to effect in them any such action they beeing properly of a spirituall substance So that the diuels themselues they cannot by any such created or corporall meanes be compelled to any thing much lesse may they be violently expelled from their actuall possessions in men Although yet I dare not deny but that by a diuine and supernaturall power whether immediate or mediate they may be dispossessed or driuen from their hold Exorcistes But the very text it selfe doth plainely auouch that when Dauid did play on his harpe the euill spirit of the Lord departed from Saul Physiologus My answere is this It is generally doubted and our selues do flatly deny that Saul was euer essentially possest with either spirit or diuel Howbeit because you labour with tooth and naile to prooue the dispossessing of Demoniakes by an onely created or meere naturall meanes and thereupon also would threape vpon vs a supposed essentiall possession in Saul go to let it for arguments sake be granted which will neuer be prooued that Saul in deed was so possest as your selfe do happely imagine what then infer you thereof Exorcistes I infer from thence his vndoubted dispossession and that also by the onely bare meanes of a melodious instrument For Dauid but plaid with his harpe and the euil spirit of the Lord departed from Saul Physiologus Howsoeuer your selfe may conceiue of the matter it is doubted of some whether the euil spirit did euer depart from Saul neither is any man bound to beleeue the same as a certeine truth For this is vndoubtedly true that a man may be alwaies actually possessed and yet not alwaies apprehend the violent or actuall outrage of satan Besides that if Saul had been dispossessed in deed yet that selfesame dispossession was effected neither by the inherent holinesse of Dauid himselfe nor by any supposed helpe of his harpe For a meere created nature it hath of it selfe no possible power to expel the possession of spirits or diuels as was shewed before no that is onely an extraordinary and supernaturall work of the Lord. Exorcistes Yea but the text it telleth vs plainely that when Dauid once handled his harpe the euil spirit of the Lord departed from Saul Physiologus That is the euill spirit he shewed not his outragious force as before in Saul Vnderstanding thereby that the torments of Saul through the melodious sound of Dauids harpe they might for the time be something abated though the euill spirit it selfe if any such there was not vtterly expelled from Saul himselfe and thus much also affirmeth the text Namely that when Dauid did handle his harpe king Saul was refreshed or eased Yea and the seruants also of Saul they accordingly aduised him a little before to procure to himselfe some excellent harper that when the euill spirit should vexe him the said harper might play with his harpe And wherefore I pray you to expell the diuell nay but to ease the king for the present Exorcistes How should the king be eased at all and the spirit not expelled out of his bodie Physiologus Verie well I assure you For this we may boldly auouch namely that by meanes of a melodious sound or some other like sensible matter such as are actually afflicted of Satan they may haue their afflictions for some season abated notwithstanding the actuall possession of Satan it selfe be not vtterly expelled and this also in a double respect First because the action of all actiues are euermore actuall in a predisposed patient in such a subiect I meane as is proportionably appliable and fitted before to the orderly apprehension of those selfesame intended actions For spirits or diuels they cannot essentially alter any one qualitie in a corporal matter when and so oft as it pleaseth themselues they onely may effect some such kinde of thing by meanes of some corporall actiues And for that selfe-same consideration when they would afflict any man with their actuall torments they doe eftsoones respect the naturall disposition of some corporal matter whereupon they may worke their intended effects Knowing this by experience that in euerie such matter as naturally hath in it the selfesame naturall qualities a transmutation of qualities may more easily be effected by much And hereof also it is that certaine Lunatike persons are eftsoones verie strangely and diuersly afflicted at some one time more then another according to the variable disposition of the Moone it selfe as was shewed before Because the Moone being predominant ouer all moist bodies and the braine also of man it being naturally more moist then any part else the said braine is therefore more apt at one time to receiue the actions of Satan then it is at another according to the variable dispositions of the Moone it selfe being then more effectuall in them â—uen as also we see by dayly experience that all shel-fish in the seas they are at the increase of the Moone verie full and eftsoones againe by the onely decrease thereof they become verie emptie So surely the diuell he obserueth those selfesame seasons wherein the bodies of men being weake are more subiect to sicknesses and abuseth those times to his pestilent purposes And therefore euen as by the onely obseruation of meere naturall causes the diuell he may aggrauate his actuall torments in men so surely on the other side by the onely bare meanes of a melodious harmonie or some other such sensible matter there may be procured in the bodies of men such an apt disposition as is lesse subiect by much to those the operations of Satan And so by consequence those sefesame afflictions or torments which were actually inflicted vpon them by Satan they may verie well be abated or lessened notwithstanding the diuell his actuall possession be not vtterly expelled Lycanthropus In what respect else may their said torments be abated Physiologus Secondly this said mitigation of satan his actuall torments inflicted on men it may very easily be effected also if we but consider aright as we ought that to the actuall afflicting of any there is required in the patient an apt apprehension of the intended affliction For euen as delectation or pleasure is none other thing els but the coniunction of some conuenient actiue to some conuenient passiue with an apt apprehension of the present delight in so much as where there is no such apprehension there is no delectation so surely in affliction or heauinesse which is the coniunction of some conuenient actiue to some conuenient passiue there must needs be an apt apprehension of the obiected affliction otherwise where such apprehension is wanting there the affliction is
appointed praier and fasting an onely effectuall meanes for the powerfull expelling of diuels he notwithstanding all this doth make a speciall choice of persons of places and times for the more orderly effecting of euerie such admirable enterprise Orthodoxus Your answeres without doubt are suddenly fallen to such deadly debate among themselues as the one is readie to pull out the throate of the other by reason of some bad disposition or present defect in your memorie For praier fasting ere while was the only appointed meanes to expel the power of the diuel and now the efficacie thereof is restrained to places times It was not long since a publike ordinance appointed generallie for all men and now it is imposed vpon some speciall persons Not long since it might well be effected by the partie himselfe and his parents but now the powerfull dispatch thereof is peculiar onely to preachers and pastours Not long since it was an ordinarie power incident to any godly Minister or others but no Minister now how godlie soeuer hath the good hap to hit on that matter saue onely your selfe Thus then you see that as the disease so also the cure it doth ebbe and flowe with the Moone Howbeit these doubtfull vncerteinties doe sauour verie shrewdly of some legerdemaine at the least And howsoeuer your selfe auouching that God maketh speciall choise of persons of places and times woulde cunningly shelter your cause vnder Augustines credite verie certeine I am that the same is onely a Iesuiticall iuggling deuise and therefore it deserueth the selfesame answere with theirs For be it that the Lord as Augustine saith doth make a speciall choice of persons of places and times for the orderly effecting of euery such admirable action this prooueth not that the power of working myracles continueth still to this present Onely it sheweth that whensoeuer the Lord worketh any woonderfull worke he is free to make choise of persons of places and times as seemeth best to his wisedome And therefore admitting all this for a truth do tell me withall by what meanes you are certeine that the Lord made speciall choise of your selfe for such speciall busines Exorcistes Why sir the verie effect it selfe doth fully declare the truth of the matter for I cast foorth the diuell Orthodoxus Be it that some such effect as your selfe surmizeth did forthwith succeed your saide enterprize yet forsomuch as your selfe did no more in the matter then was ordinarily incident you say to any godly preacher or others how comes it to passe that those other performing the very selfesame things you performed your selfe no such admirable effect should follow their labors Was it for that the rest of the Ministers were all but vngodly wretches in comparison of you Or was it so rather for that those Ministers fearing the Lord aright the Lord would not suffer their innocent soules to be falsly seduced by any such sleights or for that you your selfe being at that time more destitude of grace had for the present some power to effect such a false deceiueable signe to your greater condemnation without speedie repentance Exorcistes Howsoeuer I may not impure a lesse measure of godlinesse to others neither yet arrogate any more to my selfe then to any of the rest verie certeine it is that onely my selfe had then the speciall power to expell the diuell Physiologus Master Orthodoxus let me argue this point Come on Exorcistes If your owne selfe as you say had then a more speciall power to expell the diuell by prayer and fasting then any of the rest that your said power it must needs be a vocall or personall power at the least My meaning is that such a speciall power it proceeded either from your prayer or your person but not from your prayer at all for the others also they prayed and fasted as deuoutly as you did your selfe albeit in vaine and therefore your prayer of it selfe it could haue no more power then theirs vnlesse hapily you haue some speciall prayer for that speciall purpose beyond the rest of your brethren Yea and when all comes to all it was not your prayer but your preaching it should seeme that expelled the diuell Againe if such a speciall power proceeded from your person alone then surely that selfe same personall power it was either some naturall or supernaturall power at the least Howbeit a meere naturall power it might not possibly be because no created or meere naturall power may possibly extend foorth it selfe to any such supernaturall action as hath been sufficiently shewed before Exorcistes That followeth not For the body of Christ it was vndoubtedly a created or true naturall body and yet notwithstanding there went vertue or power from out of the same for the admirable curing of people And therefore if it so seemed good to the Lord for the glory of his name why might not some power in like manner proceed from my person for the timely expelling of that spirit or diuel Physiologus Besides your shamelesse pride in matching your body with the body of Christ you do monstrously mistake the very point of your purpose For do you imagine that there went any power essentially from out of the body of Christ for the admirable curing of any Exorcistes I make no question thereof And the scripture it telleth vs plainly that the whole multitude thronged to touch him for there proceeded vertue out of him and healed them all Physiologus Though it be said in the text that vertue proceeded out of Christ to the curing of many yet that must not be vnderstood as though any vertue essentially existing in the naturall body of Christ did passe foorth essentially from him vnto others in that selfesame absolute number no but this proceeding of vertue from the bodie of Christ vnto others is so farre foorth to be accounted a going foorth as the effect may be said to proceed from the cause Or it is to be interpreted according to the maner of a cause producing an effect The which are said to go foorth the one from the other in as much as the verie cause it selfe doth apparantly shine foorth in that selfesame effect which it worketh And euen after such a manner we must vnderstand this matter in question Because the Diuine vertue it selfe essentially existing in the person of Christ did effectually procure present health to the parties oppressed Otherwaies how must that text be vnderstood which telleth vs that the wisedome of God being but one the same can do all things it selfe that it renueth all and entreth eueh into the holie soules making them the friends and prophets of God Now sir because it is said he entreth into the holie soules must we therefore imagine the holie spiriâ— of God to be any where now where it was not before not so for the same of necessitie at all times and seasons is euerie where present Howbeit because the holie spirit of God doth then