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A18448 The oration of the most noble and reverende father in God the Lorde Cardinalles Grace of Lorrain made and pronounced in thassemblie [sic] at Poyssi, the kyng beyng present, the sixtene daye of Septembre, in the yeare of our Lorde 1561 / translated out of Frenche into Englishe by T.S. Guise, Charles de, Cardinal de Lorraine, 1525-1574. 1561 (1561) STC 5010.5; ESTC S283 23,800 31

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sundry ages because we shall fynde theym all to agree In the firste hundred yeares let vs appeale and calle for the apostelles and their successours as S. Clement s Ignatius and s Denis In the second hundred Alexander the firste Iustine Ireneus Tertullian Origene and Cyprian In the thirde hundred yeares Arnobius Lactantius Eusebius Athanasius sainct Hyllarie Emissene Isichius Nazianzene S. Ambrose S. Hierom S. Augustin S. Iohn Chrysostom In the fourth hundreth Leo the great Prosper Theodorite and Cyrill And in the .v. hundred let vs come to S. Gregorie further more if ye will let vs call Damascene and long after hym S. Bernard These shal be the iudges of our controuersies which be not to be suspected and of those which be most notable and ancient ye shal haue a brefe repetitiō or recital to thintent ye may acknowledge that by the cōmune vniuersal agreement of the holie Fathers there is no place or occasiō lefte vnto vs herein Hilla li. ● de trinitate to doubte of the veritie of this body blood For by the words of our lord by our faith It is verily flesh verily blood which beyng receiued Accepta ait hausta doo so worke and make that we be in hym and he in vs. Is not this tho truthe But this can not be true to them which wholly deny Iesus Christ to be very God and to be the same which hath alwaies been in the churche of God so generally in all mens mouthes that amonge the sacramentes of the cōmune faith the veritie of the body and blood of IESVS CHRIST was not had in silence no not by the mouthes of infantes Leo epi● 13 vnto whom as to all other for otherwise we shold not beleue it much lesse vnderstand the same it was and is daiely saied and shall be vttered by the moste graue authoritie of the Churche that the same which is taken of the fruites of the earth and in the celebration of this sacrament placed vpon thaltare receiued after the custome of religion consecrated by mysticall praier offred and geuen and after the celebration finished as it appertayneth receiued to spirituall saluation vsed or consumed in the remembrance of the passion is the body and bloode of Iesus Christ whiche we perfectely beleue hath appeared in the kynde of humaine fleshe and that this likour or drinke did runne downe and distill from the side of him that was perced vpon the crosse Augu. li. 3. de trinite 4. 10 These good Fathers I say did teache their Auditorie to doubte nothyng at all before they should communicate at this holie table of the veritie of the body and blood of IESVS CHRIST Iohn 19 Leo sermo 6. de Ieiu 7. mens Chrys hom 7. operis impfect 1. Cor. 1. Isychius Leui. 22 For that is by the mouthe receyued whyche by the harte is beleued And in vaine they answer Amen which disputeth against that whiche they receaue They made no difficultie to saie that by the hande of the priest there is geuen and receaued not onely that which is seen and sanctified by him that gaue it but also that whiche there is vnderstanded is that sanctification whiche sanctifieth the receauour euen the bodye without doubt of our Lorde whiche as Sainct Paule writeth was made a sanctification for vs by the Father Contrary wise doo they affirme that he which ignorantly or through ignorance receaueth this holy misterie there not withstandyng he knoweth not the vertue thereof yet the same is the true bodye and bloode of our Lorde IESVS CHRIST In this wise thus plainly did the holy doctors both Greke and Latine speake touching this matter now long sithens Whose words specially of som of them we haue repeted so faithfully as we coulde So plainly I say haue our ancient fathers writen that one of them beyng the first Berēgarius apud Gu. Malingberien lib. 3 de gestis Anglo which long time after thē did otherwise teach that is to say that the body blood of Iesus Christ was none otherwise in this sacramēt but as a token or signe And after he had therof wel aduised himselfe disputed reasoned did not only in his lyfe time chāge his opinion but also at the point of deth which is the time to confesse the truth or neuer in his last words affirmīg stedfastly spake as foloweth Truly we beleue these misteries after the benedictiō or ecclesiastical cōsecration to be the very body blood of our sauior being induced and perswaded to beleue the same by thauctoritie of thancient churche We thā beleue cōfesse acording to the saying of the scripture and of the holy fathers that the body blood of Iesus Christ by thunspeakable operation of the grace of god the power of his holy spirite is in these holy misteries present geuen receiued we passe ouer to speake of the greatnes therof Chrysoh●… i. 8● in Mat. Wherby we shold seme to make our lord to be here outwardly visible sensible or perceptible Nothing saieth a holy father is here geuen vnto vs sensible but vnder visible sygnes inuisible thinges are there deliuered vnto vs. Ho. 60 ad popu antioch We absteine also from such maner of speache whereby contrary wise we might here seme onely to represent oure said sauiour being absent as in a tragedy or comedy Truely the maner and facion wherby he doth here present him selfe to vs wherby he geueth himself The maner of Christhi being in the sacrament Iohn 1. Cy. li. 4. in l 3. ca 1 14. Cy. Lu. 22 citāte Tho. 3 parte que 25 articu 1. Ioan. 6 where by he is receiued and participated is secret not humaine or natural and yet not therfore the lesse true We comprehend it not by sence reason or nature but by faith By which as the holy counsel of Nice the first of the foure chiefest dooth teache vs not to basely respectinge the visible elementes but lifting vppe the spirit we consider by faith the lābe of god to be there set in this holy table taking away the sinne of the world and truly we there receaue his precious body and bloud Better it is to follow the councell of the auncientes firmely to beleue the wordes of oure lorde god leauing vnto god of this his worke the meane the way and knowledge then in so highe a matter to thinke or vtter this Iewish word Quamodo a worde I saye of incredulitie perdition to the Iewes such as follow them Beleue saith the holy fathers vpō these words so often repeted Hoc est corpus meum Make no doubte thereat whether they bee true but receaue by faith the saying of our sauiour For seing that he is the truth Bernat ser 2 de caena he cannot lye Greate meruelies my brethern and thinges to be wondered at are saide of this sacramēt faith is there necessary Reason superfluous knowledge doth builde her foundation vpon
his disciple They praied thus in the celebratiō of this sacramēt Thou which sittest aboue with the father art here conuersant inuisibly with vs vouche safe frō thy mighty hād Notable places of tha old fathers to proue Christ to be in heauen and here also in the sacrament 103. de sacerdo to geue vs thine immaculate body precious bloud O what a miracle is this they cried O the great goodnesse of God He whiche on highe sitteth with the father in the selfe same instant is betwene our hands be geueth himself to all which wil receiue him doth this in the open sight of al the assistāts wtout any deceit or illusiō Wherfore I se not but ther shold be here a faut if the things there represented wer not also present They said Our lord hath lifted vp into the diuine throne that which he giueth vs to eat the erth to be our heuē whē as yet we ar here remainīg this roial bodi in heuē which ther is wortht of souerain honor is set bifore vs in erth shewed to vs to see to touch to rate They introduced Sermo debreuitate vite ho. 55. ad popu 15. 〈◊〉 1. ad Timoth IESVS CHRIST speakyng in thys wise of this holy table to them which camthither to receue Eate me drinke me I haue lefte the in heauen aboue and here in earthe beneath I am ioyned and vnited vnto thee not simply or in suche sorte as I am receiued of the but I am distributed vnto thee eaten and drunke of thee in suche sorte that there is so great an vnitie and coniunction made betwene vs that beyng so vnited and ioined we are not seperated one from an other by any meane or distance but as of two made one In this wise they dyd comfort the chirch wandring here in earth like a most amiable spouse sayeng Thou haste here in earth thy husbande in the Sacramente whom thou shalte haue in heauen withoute couer or vaille and yet here verily but vnder cloke and vaille but there manifest They were bolde thus also to speake to the husbande Bernardus 2. sermons de caeodomin How chanceth this swete Iesus that we little wormes craulyng on the earth we I say duste and ashes haue thee before our handes and eyes and in the meane whyle thou art all wholly sittyng at the right hande of the Father who in one moment of an houre from the east to the weste from the north to the southe art present and assistant to all men one in many thy selfe in diuers places whence commeth this Amb. 1 precari ad missi Truely not by our meanes or desert but of thy will and good pleasure and of thy goodnesse They prepared the priest before he should celebrate to adresse hymselfe in this wise to our Lord with what contricion of hart abundance of teares reuerence chastitie of harte and puritie of spirite ought we to celebrate this celestiall and diuine sacrifice wherin thy fleshe is verily receiued wherein thy blood is verily drunke wherin the highest thynges are ioyned to the lowest the diuine thyngs to the humain Truely they that teache preache thus douteth not but that the body of our Lord so many hundreth yeres passed beyng receaued aboue in heauen is there and here also together to bee vnto vs in this sacrament present presented and exhibited If thou require the maner so often to repete it Da● li. 4. ca. 14. and neuer to attaine the knowledge how this is done let it be sufficient for the to vnderstand that it is the worke of the holy ghost And we knowe nothyng more than that the worde of God is true of great efficacie and almightie but the maner ther of is inscrutable They thought nothing lesse than affirme that the said body of our Lord came downe from heauen or dyd remoue or depart or that it was drawen out as one of them sayde very welle Non quod ipsum corpus assumptū ex coelo descendat c. With whome we agree and mynde with thē nothing lesse thā to make him com down to pluck him from his fathers righte hande or to assent to all other suche vnfitte and vnseemely termes For contrarywise more than euery day in this holy misterie we make profession of the faith which we beleue of those articles singyng Qui sedes ad dexterā patris miserere nobis Et Sursū corda Habemꝰ ad Dominū And yet not withstanding they lay to our charges suche and so vnworthy absurdities as though in this Sacrament Nos Christum Dominum coelo vel dimoueremus vel eliceremus vel etiam descendere faceremus Thom. 3. part quest ● artic 3. Epist 25. For euen oure schoole menne dooe teache the contrarie With like true meaning our aduersaries woulde make S. Augustine of their part alleagyng hym Ad Dardanum although they can not be ignorant if they reade the whole epistle as I doubte not but they doo that there is no mencion at all made in that place of this holye Sacrament And forasmuche as so often tymes this holie man Leuit. 13 hath in other places bothe preached written we ought to draw out his meanyng touchyng this point rather from al his other places then out of this epistle the meaning wherof we haue presently answered not wātyng other solucions in that behalfe Of like simplicitie and true dealing be our aduersaries here present that is to say being farre from Almaigne and as one would say contrary to the lawe slaunderynge the deaffe doo impugne that whiche we doe not defende that is to say the Consubstantiation whyche for that it is not receyued in our frenche churche we will leaue it to the princis and preachers of the holye Empire which be called Protestantes to mainteyne who at the least in this poynte doo agree with vs against them whome Germany together with vs calleth Sacramentaries Pref. 4. centur Magdeburgen And those Germains accordingly folowing the most plain most true most mighty words of our sauior do at this day constātly hold and mainteyn the presence cōmunication of the body blood of our Lorde IESVS CHRIST to be in this Sacrament But nowe I come to that point which you haue both here and els where written of this Sacrament ouer and besides that whiche is conteined in the confession presented by you in the name of you all If you doo not esteme Iesus Christ to be in this worlde touchyng the fleshe since his ascention more than he was before his incarnation If you do not beleue no other body then visible De consecr dis 2. can Nos aū● cā Hoc est Gala. 3. albeit S. Austen whom you would to be of your syde calleth it so often inuisible if you thinke it not to be otherwise although more effectual in the vsage of the Sacramentes thā in the preaching of his word or if you esteme theym thynges alyke to put on IESVS CHRIST