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A40523 The fall of a great visible idol by the coming of the invisible povver, and substance In this day and time of the lambs war which is come. Wherein Christ the true light is exalted at the right hand of God, who dwells and walkes in his people which are his temple. Which doth bring down the boasting baptists that hath highly exalted themselves upon the high and dark mountains of their own imaginations, as may be known by their own principles which are herein answered with something to the simple hearted that are among them, concerning water baptism and breaking of outward bread, which these baptists hath so much idolized in the night. From a true friend unto all that loves truth in the inward parts, in true love and pitty unto the lost sheep, that they may be of the house of Israel. Joseph Fuce. Fuce, Joseph. 1659 (1659) Wing F2257A; ESTC R221567 32,174 39

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is of Christ Colos 2. 16 17. Now they that do not go into the observation of the Sabbaths cannot be Judged in them by any man mark that but the Apostle Judged some among the Galatians saying Ye observe dayes and moneths I am afraid of you least I have bestowed my labour in vain Gal. 4. 1● for his labour was to bring them out of the observation of dayes and outward things to Christ within who is Lord of all days yea he is and shall be known Lord of all and therefore it is his right to Rule over all when he comes and therefore be not offended when he would arise to Rule and Reign in you for blessed are they that are not offended in him who hath born the iniquity of us all and he lighteth every man that cometh into the world and that light is the Law of the Spirit which is of him and this Law is their Teacher that love it and are guided by it out of darkness unto Christ which is the Law-giver that taketh away the sin and fulfills the righteousness of the Law in man and then man is at the end of the Law with Christ who brings in Grace and Peace and everlasting righteousness within them that first become obedient Gal. 3. 24. unto the Law which is light within which was our Schoolmaster and the Apostles Schoolmaster to bring them to Christ who fulfilled those visible things in which he was in and passed through for in the time of Circumcision when eight dayes were accomplished for the Circumcising of the Child they called his Name Jesus Luke 2. 21. and he was baptized of John in Jordan for so he came unto John to fulfill that Ministration as well as Circumcision but John would not a had it so yet Christ said suffer it to be so now for thus it becometh us to fulfill all righteousnes when he was baptized then was not that fulfilled mark straight way he went out of the water Mat. ● 16. then began Johns Baptism to decrease and Christs Baptism to increase which was more excellent and so after Christ ha● been in the Synagogues and Temple made with hands and in water Baptism he came Mat. 23. 38. out of them and said behold your house is left unto you desolate and he came straight way out of the water and left them there that would not leave that and follow him the fulfiller of all th●se things into the Kingdom of rest and peace Joh. 3. 15. Pet. 4. 7. for ever Mark then they that abode in the Temple-worship cryed the Temple of the Lord yet were in envy against Christ the Lord of all who left their Temple desolate and they that were baptized after a little time ran into contentions because Christ was not among them in the water to keep them out of the contention but then he had left both Temple and water and they that did not leave those things to follow him who is the Prince of peace they were and are in the contention in and about those things wch were fulfilled because 1 Cor. 1● 11. 1 Cor. 3. ● Christ the Prince of peace was not with them then to keep them out of the strife contention and envy which they were in that did not follow Christ who went straightway out of the water and out of the Temple and Synagogues and left them desolate But if any of you tender hearted ones should be ●u●stioning whether Christ did not command water Baptism afterwords unto his Disciples when he sent them forth to Preach and Teach Now be low with your minds turned in to the light waiting in the fear of the Lord that you may be the si●●er to understand my answer which shall be unto you according to the Scriptures and I hope shall be plain to satisfie all reasonable moderate people concerning water Baptism For verily I say unto you I had never any command from the Lord to be baptized with outward water neither to Baptize any creature in outward water but the Lord hath commanded me to do that which is far greater and much more harder to the creature but by the power of his Spirit in the light was I made able to do it yet of my self have I nothing to boast of because the work is the Lords and the power by which it is done and I his servant have said unto some of those Baptists Teachers if they could prove water Baptism to be a command of Christ in this day I should own it but they could never yet bring me any Scripture that would serve for a plain proof without wresting and also I have searched the Scriptures in which I find written how Christ sent forth many Disciples then as now also and I do not find any where in the Scriptures that he sent them to Baptize in water after Johns Baptism decreased there is in Matthew the 10. Mark 6. Luke ● and 10. Chapters how Christ sent forth many Disciples and commanded them what they should do in his Name but water Baptisme is not mentioned there but if any should say he baptized then himself for he was not crucified then I answer and say he did baptize but his Baptism was not with water but with the Holy Ghost and with fire Mat. 3. 11. and Christ said verily verily I say unto you he that believeth on me the works that I do shall he do also and greater works then these shall he do because I go unto my Father John 14. 12. and so it doth appear Johns Ministry of Baptism was with water but Christs with the Spirit for he both Circumcised the heart and ears and baptized with the Holy Ghost and with fire which were spiritual things and the Apostle said therefore seeing we have this Ministry as we have received mercy we faint not for they were believers 2 C●r ● 1. and were to do the same works that Christ did and so as he did so were they to do by the power of his Spirit in them and all those that believed and came to be of the body after Christ Ascended up on high they were all baptized by one spirit into one body the first of the Corinthians 12. 13. And the spirit was with them and they with the spirit did bring or baptize into the one body by the power and sword of the spirit which is the Word of God which they handled so it is plain their works were spiritual and their weapons were not carnal but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds 2 Cor. 10. 4. and they Ministred spiritual things 1 Cor 9. 11. and consider rightly that place of Scripture the 28. of Matthew which the Baptists so often hath brought to prove water Baptism to be a command of Christ to his Disciples but that Scripture doth not at all speak of water and they are not onely wrong in putting water in the room of the Name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost but also
in their not going forth into all the world to Preach the Gospel to every creature for so was that command Mark 16. 15. And it is said go ye therefore and teach all Nations Baptizing them in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost Mat. 28. ●9 Mark there is nothing spoken at all of water but there Christ commands them to teach and baptize in the Name of the Father Son Holy Ghost which Name saveth for his Name is exalted above evety name and is a strong Tower the righteous flee unto it and are safe and so they Pro 18. 10. Phil. 2. 9. were to bring into or baptize in that which saved and kept them safe that believed through the Preaching of the Gospel in the Name and power of God but the Baptists say they that believe should be baptized with water as if there were no difference between the Name that saveth and a little water which can do no more then the Hypocrites did which made clean the out-side but were as filthy within as the Baptists are that are against the spirit and life it self for it is not the putting away the filth of the flesh but the answer of a good conscience by the Resurrection of Jesus Christ 1 Pet. 3. 21. and the Apostle said there was one Lord one Faith Eph. 4. ●● one Baptism the spiritual Baptism is the onely Baptism wch by the power and the operation of the spirit that was in the Apostles they brought people into the one body which Christ was the head of they baptized them in the Name and there would Christ be in the midst of them that met in his Name to keep them in unity and peace for he is the Prince of Mat. 18. 2● Isa 9. 6. peace but those Baptists that are in contention among themselves and in confusion some for one thing and some for another some observing one day for a Sabbath and some observing another they may perhaps have been baptized in water but I am sure they are not baptized by the one spirit into one body and Name of Christ for then would Christ be in the midst of them to keep peace among them but there is bitterness strife and contention in the midst of them and Christ said unto them that were baptized in his Name and were to bapti●e in his Name whatsoever they ask of the Father in his Name they should receive it and now let all the tender hearted Baptists be awakened to search and examine themselves whether they be in the faith and have asked of God in the Name or out of the Name of Christ They sur●ly do know whether they have received that which they have asked for or not and so may they come to know whether they have been baptized as Christ commanded in Mat. 28. or as the Baptists teachers hath imagined and so they have wrested that Scripture as they do others to their own destruction and thereby hath deceived many others making them believe water is there included or that is a command for water when water is not so much as mentioned there but the Name which saves all that are in it mark how plain the Scriptures proveth a great difference between water Baptisme and the Baptism in the Name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost for there were some in the Apostles days that after they did believe were baptized into Johns Baptism but they had not heard of the holy Ghost mark how they might have bin deceived with Johns Baptism had not they come to Paul who examined them about the matter and found how they were led back into Johns Baptism and then he taught them and then they were baptized in the Name of the Lord Jesus for it is said concerning Paul when he came to Ephesus and finding certain Disciples he said unto them Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed and they said unto him we have not so much as heard whether there be any holy Ghost and Paul said unto them unto what then were you baptized and they said unto Johns Baptism then said Paul John verily baptized with the Baptism of repentance saying unto the people that they should believe on him that should come after him that is on Christ Jesus when they heard this they were baptized into the Name of the Lord Jesus Acts 19. from the first to the fifth verse and now see whether the chief Baptists have not need to be taught and baptized in the Name of the Lord Jesus for all their water Baptisme which was Johns Ministration and now concerning other Scriptures which hath been brought by the Baptists as the 10. of the Acts where Peter asked a question indeed about water but commanded them to be baptized in the Name of the Lord and Philip Baptized the Eunuch in water but the name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost is not mentioned there see Acts 8. 38. so it is plain there is a destinction and great difference between water Baptism and the Baptism of the spirit or in the name that saveth but some may say there was water spoken of and practised by some I say yes they did in their freedom use water baptism which was Johns Ministration and Paul who was not behinde the very chiefest Apostle for he said he laboured more then them all yet not I said he but the Grace of God which was in him and he did Baptize Crispus and Gains and also the houshold of Stephanus he baptized but yet he thanks God he baptized no more of them for he said Christ sent him not to baptize but to Preach the Gospel 1 Cor. 1. 17. and now it is plain if it could be proved that some of the Apostles were sent to Baptize with water that would be nothing to them now that speak of baptizing with water for what would that be to those Baptists which dippeth in water now seeing Paul who after them that Christ spake to in Mat. 28. was made an able Minister of the Gospel by the Revelation of Christ in him and Christ sent him among the Gentiles or heathen not to Preach up water Baptism and so to bring them into the water mark but to Preach the Name of Christ among the Gentiles and to bring them into the name which saved them and so all people that doth understand those things may see all that ever the Baptists have done is but by immetation according to their imaginations for if that which the Baptists bring for the proof of their command to Baptize did not reach unto Paul who was so eminent surely it doth not reach unto these Baptists but Paul did Circumcise and baptize by permission for a time as it doth appear that he might win the more out of those old things which was to passe away unto Christ that maketh old things away and then the new creature is witnessed which availeth for it is said neither Circumcision nor
uncircumci●ion availech but a new creature Gal. 6. 15. and so people may understand wherefore Paul as well as others did baptize although they might not be sent to Baptize nor Circumcise yet he did both for he became all things to all that he might win some out of all unto Christ the end of all things that was to stand but their time but when the Baptists were in strife one for Paul and others for Apollo and Cephas but then they were carnal 1 Cor. 3. 3. and then Paul told those Baptists plainly he was not sent to Baptize 1 Cor. 1. 17. and 1 Cor. 1. 12. some went to subvert those believers that were turned from among the Gent●les nnto God saying they must be Circumcised after the manner of Moses or else they could not be saved but when the Apostles and Elders and brethren and the whole Church was met together at Jerusalem and when they had conf●rred about the matter it seemed good unto the Holy Ghost and unto them to write letters and send them with chosen men unto An●ioch and this was the substance which is there mentioned of their letters to let them know they gave no such command for Circumcision or such things mark and how they laid no greater burden upon them then these necessary things saying that if ye abstain from meats offered to Idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication from which if you keep your selves ye shall do well fare ye well Acts 15. 25. and here you may see there was neither Circumcision nor observing the seventh day for a Sabbath neither water Baptism or any such things laid upon the Church that from among the Gentiles were turned unto God neither by the Holy Ghost nor the general Assembly of Saints at Jerusalem and therefore if any come among the people now to cry up Circumcision or water Baptism to be a command of Christ to us because there was Circumcision with hands and water Baptism practiced before Christs Resurrection and after by the Apostles yet the Scripture saith no greater burthen then these necessary things before mentioned in Acts 15. for we see now the Circumcision is that of the heart and the Baptism is with the spirit in the name which saves and so now there is no need of those old outward things because the end of them is come within which is Christ the better hope and his B●ptism is with the spirit into the one body and his Circumcision is of the heart and ears and so he sitteth the true worshippers to worship the Father in the spirit and in the truth and such are built upon the Rock which the gates of Hell cannot prevail against and therefore cannot be moved when the sects of the Baptists or Priests or they of the Circumcision comes like the troubled Seas foaming out their own Jude 1● shame against the Lamb and his followers who gets the victory over all through sufferings and blessed are all those that wa●teth in the patience faithful unto the end And now concerning outward bread and wine which the Papists and the several Sects of the Priests and likewise the Sects of the Baptists use concerning and pertaining to their worship some calling of it the Sacrament and some the Lords Supper and every one useth those good creatures according to their vain imaginations and every Sect of them counts their own way right to use bread and wine and Pro. 16. 2 water concerning their worship both Papists and Baptists and all the other Sects of Priests which cry up visible things to be Ordinances of Christ pertaining to their worship and such worships now is not the true worship of the true God the Father for he is and ought to be worshipped in the Spirit and in the truth and all that are out of the Spirit in the visible bread and wine water they are the false worshippers both Papists and other Sects as well as they for they are all subject to the creatures more then to the Creator who is worshipped in Spirit and in truth and all the Statutes and Ordinances after the fall into the transgression in reference to visible things pertaining to the Worship of God in those forms was ordained in time for to stand their time as shadows types figures of good things to come in due time and the end of all those things did come and those that did not know the end of all those things come to redeem the mind to God in due time mark they Idolized them and they were their Idols set up out of their time by the Idolatrous worshippers H●o 〈◊〉 2● 1 Cor. 12. 31. for in due time God sent forth his Son a more excellent way a new and living way and they that received him in due time he changed them out of the old things which had their time to be set up and to stand until fulfilled and then it was time for them to fall and have an end when Christ had been in them and fulfilled them and was come out of them again and then will-worshippers they sought to hold them up out of their time and thereby drew people from Christ into those things but Christ called out of those things to take up the Cross and follow him who fulfilled those things and he sent those that followed him forth to call others which were without ready to perish with those things and therefore to come into the Fathers house for all things were ready there they that would not forsake those things and come into Christ where all things was ready they should Luke 14. not taste of the Supper and it is said as they were eating Jesus took bread and blessed it and brake it and gave it unto his Disciples and said Take eat this is my body and he took the Cup and gave thanks and gave it to them saying Drink ye all of it for this is my blood of the New Testament which is shed for many for the remission of sins Matth. 26. 26. 1 Cor. 11. 24. And now both Papists and Baptists and many other carnal-minded people imagineth that bread and the cup of Blessing to be outward bread and wine and therefore they will be eating and drinking outward bread and wine and when they have been asked to prove their practice to be a Command of Christ by the Scripture then they have run to those Scriptures as if they would have proved something for them but we find those Scriptures to be against them for there it is said in Matth. ●6 1 Cor. 11. The Bread was his body which was broken for them and the Cup was his blood which was shed for the remission of sins but the natural man doth not know the things of God because they are spiritually discerned 1 Cor. 2 1● and so they eat visible creatures and do not dicern the Lords Body now the visible bread and drink is for the satisfying the hunger and thirst of
to be led by the spirit of errour and the spirit of Antichrist mark that preach up the Spirit of Christ apart from the body or flesh of Christ and as it is before set down Matthew Caffin did several times say and affirm that Christ and his Spirit was distinct one from the other and so the one of these proves the other to be a deceiver mark William Jeffery his words in the 68. page of that book called the deceiving Quakers discovered how plainly he proves his brother a deceiver and also himself and the rest of the Baptists who do generally believe and say that the body or flesh of Christ is above the skies in some place they call Heaven and his Spirit in them which hath been dipt in water this is generally held forth by them and so it is plain they do say the Spirit of Christ is in them a part from the body which they say is above the skies in Heaven but if it were as they say then hath William Jeffery overthrown their whole faith which is vain proved them all deceived and deceivers as well as himself and Matthew Caffin but with the light all moderate people may see these Baptists to be in the night and not to have a Vision that could not see how William Jeffery went to overthrow their whole faith before it came openly forth printed into the world but now it is manifested their form is dead and they in it appear nakedly for all their high-swelling words and to be all deceived and deceivers And for Zions sake I cannot hold my peace the love of God is so strong in me unto simple-hearted poor Souls but after the Fathers love is manifested unto them and they reject it then I may say as the Apostle said But if any be ignorant let him be ignorant 1 Cor 1● 38 At a Meeting at Covole the 28th of the 6th month 1659. the afore-mentioned Matthew Caffin Baptist Teacher affirmed That Christ doth not come in us that is in their bodies and he also said He d●nied that to be Christ that was in people and many words to that effect Answ These Baptists chief Principles are to deny the true Christ at the Meetings where they come and that exceeding boldly and impudently as all sober people may see that reads this with the least measure of light for that was the true Christ which all the true Prophets bore witness of and that Moses writ of to come amongst the people and h● did proceed from God and dwelt amongst Joh●● 14. his Disciples and they beheld his glory the glory as of the onely begotten of the Father full of grace and truth and he John 14. ● told his Disciples he dwelleth with you and shall be in you for said he I will not leave you comsortless I will come to you John 14. 17 18. and this was the true Christ the light of the world and the eye of the body who proceeded from the Father and went unto the Father and come again unto the Disciples which waited to know him that was to come and be in them and he did come to them within and the Antichrists came unto them without but greater was he that was in them then he that was in the world or they that were without them and so by his power in them they withstood the false prophets and Antichrists and then went they into the world 1 John 4. ● but Christ the Son whom the Father sent to be the Saviour of the world was then come again according to his former promise and was in them and they in him as it was said in John 14. 20. and if you that read this do not believe he did come again so soon to them see what John saith And we know the Son of God is come and hath given us an understanding that we may know him that is true and we are in him that is true even in his Son Jesus Christ this is the true God and Eternal life ● John 5. 20. and so the Scriptures testifie of him to come and be in his Disciples and they in him but the Baptists saith plainly he is not come in their bodies and that is the ground why they are so inraged like the troubled Sea because they have resisted him that said Behold I stand at the door and knock if any man hear my voice and open the door I will come into him Rev. 3. 20. but the Baptists hath kept him out and so are Reprobates concerning the Faith which he worketh in them that receive him at his coming and the Apostles bid the Corinthians examine themselves whether they were in the Faith Prove your own selves know you not your own s●lves how that Jesus Christ is in you except you be Reprobates 2 Cor. 13 5. and now all may see that they were Reprobates that d●d not know Jesus Christ in them and so are these Baptists now that do not know Jesus Christ in them and now is it seen and proved plainly that these Baptists are led by the spirit of Antichrist in a reprobate state not confessing Christ to be come in the flesh but denying him in themselves which is the very cause why they so wilfully resist and gainsay him in others where he is come up a swift witness against unrighteousness and so according to the Scriptures it is proved that the true Christ did come and dwell with his Disciples in the form of the flesh and did go away unto the Father and came again unto his Disciples according to his promise and they knew he was come in them to dwell but this was not after the flesh for they were to know him so no more but as he appeared they were to see him as he is 1 John 3. 2. and they did know him come in them a quickning Spirit for by him were they quickned who had been dead in trespasses and sins he that reads with the light may understand And now I shall prove again he doth not onely deny Christ to be come in their bodies or flesh but he also denieth that to be the Christ that was in people and now if you will at all regard the Scriptures of truth with the light you shall see how plainly ● shall prove out of the Scriptures that to be the true Christ the Son of the onely true God that was in people that you may all see how the Baptists hath denied both the Father and the Son and would go on deceiving and being deceived First see what Christ saith unto his Disciples At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father you in me and I in you Mark that John 4. 2. and so it is plain that Christ said they should know him in them which was the true Christ which lighteth every man that cometh into the world and Paul to Timothy said Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all long-suffering