is very plain I believed and therefore I have spoken Psal. 116.10 2 Cor. 4.13 And there were many true Believers before the Scriptures were writ who wanted not a true Foundation or Rule 'T is wonderful strange this old great Doctor should represent such Doctrins as these either Antichristian or Unchristian The Lord teach him better and humble him unto Repentance for his unchristian and uncharitable Opposition Charge 14. Against E.B. for saying All who go before the moving of the Spirit their Prayers Preaching and Ordinances I deny c. We own the immediate Spirit of God which was before the Scripture was written to be the Rule of our Conversation And against G. Keith viz. We are to wait for an immediate Call Motion c. to preach pray or give thanks and forbear till it be given Charge 15. Against being infallibly guided by the infallible Spirit that gave forth the Scriptures and speaking from the Mouth of the Lord. Charge 16. Against that which was spoken from the Spirit of God in any being of as great Authority as the Scriptures or greater and our Friends pretending to speak or write by one and the same Spirit according to measure by which Christ and the Apostles and Prophets spoke Obs. We do not perceive any Antichristianity or Unchristianity either justly chargeable upon these Passages but rather on this Doctor for so judging them all From which it naturally follows 1. That he is for praying and preaching before or without the moving of the Spirit of God and so runs when the Lord never sent him contrary to the true Prophets Christ and his Apostles Doctrin and Christians Practice Jer. 23.21 22. 1 Pet. 4.11 2. He does not own the immediate Spirit of God and Christ to be the rule or guide of his Conversation contrary to Christ and his Apostles Doctrin 3. Nor waiting for any immediate Call or Motion from God to preach pray or give thanks so that he promotes only a Will-Worship which God never accepts 4. Though we always confess the holy Scriptures of the old and new Testament to be given by divine Inspiration and prefer them before and above all other Writings or Books and in no wise question the Truth of them yet we must needs allow the holy Spirit from whence they came the preference and its immediate Teaching and Speaking in the Soul as of greater Efficacy Power and Authority to that Soul than the bare writing or Scripture without or only reading thereof though it contain the same Words immediately taught And so Christ and his Apostles living and powerful preaching in and from the powerful motion of the holy Spirit as being of greater Efficacy Power and Authority than the outward Writing or Scripture it self simply or abstractly considered as distinct from that Spirit tho' the Words preached and the Words written may be the same For the Gospel as livingly preach'd came not in Words only but also in Power and in the Holy Ghost 1 Thess. 1.5 For the real Authority Efficacy and Service the Holy Scripture has upon a Soul is from the holy Spirit or Word of Life giving the true Belief and right Understanding thereof But we may suppose that our Adversary's Charge in this Point is from his not owning the immediate teaching of God or preaching by the immediate motion and guidance of his blessed Spirit in these days but only by Tradition his Acquirement by reading and study of other Mens Works and Lines made ready to his Hand and therefore that he wants divine Power Authority and Efficacy in 's Ministry And then he might be more ingenuous to lay aside his Trade of Preaching and leave the People to read the Holy Scriptures without his meanings or private Interpretations upon them Charge 17. In this he accuses our Paper asserting our Christianity with a Tedious and Obscure Harangue under pretence of enjoying the spiritual Part of Baptism and the Lord's Supper but neither Refutes nor Answers what we have writ in that Case both of our Christian Experience and agreeableness to holy Scripture so the less notice need be taken of his Charge against our Friends for Asserting the Baptism of the Holy Ghost Charge ibid. And that the Bread and Wine being no other than a Figure of a spiritual Thing which is the Substance which being witnessed the Figure or Shadow is not obliging being ended i. e. In the New Covenant Charge 18. Against some of our Friends telling them That they set up their Carnal Ordinances in Christ's stead calling them their Means and not witnessing the immediate Appearance of Jesus Christ in their Souls drawing them in his Life and Testifying against the beggarly Rudâ—ments of the World and their Carnal Observances Obs. What more than a Figure does this Doctor suppose the Bread and Wine which they minister to be in the Sacrament so called Does he think them to be the Substance which is Christ If not then 't was very unadvisedly and uncharitably done to charge our Friends as Antichristian or Unchristian either in this Point for calling the outward Elements of Bread and Wine c. A Figure only as Protestant Martyrs esteemed them Vid. Dr. Cranmer Disp. at Oxford c. 3. v. Mar. In opposition to the Papists affirming them to be the Substance Christ. Let him therefore tell us what he esteems them if not a Figure For the Spiritual Substance is Christ he is that One Bread John 6. 1 Cor. 10. and his Spiritual Baptism is The one Baptism Ephes. 4. and in him the Shadows and Figures are ended Charge 19. About the Resurrection That W.P. said To assert the same Body that falls shall rise is inconsâ—stent with Scripture Reason c. And against another Friend for saying The Seed of God is hid in thee c. Obs. He having not wherewithal justly to charge us with denying the Resurrection it self for that we never did but always believed it of both the Just and Unjust and that they shall come to Judgement every Man for himself Now our Friends are charged because they believe a Spiritual Resurrection in opposition to their Adversary's asserting a Carnal or Sameness of Bodies to rise wherein this Adversary's Charge reflects upon the Apostle's Testimony in this Case as well as on our Friends as Unchristian For the Apostle answers such Fools Questions by way of Allusion plainly And that which thou sowest thou sowest not that Body that shall be c. God giveth it a Body as it pleaseth him and to every Seed his own Body There is a natural Body and there is a spiritual Body 1 Cor. 15. ch and 35 36 37 44 Verses c. Which is no other than what our Friends believe and hold Charge 20. Of Christ's second coming to Judgment against this Question i. e. Where proves he that Christ's second coming without Sin to Salvation is a Personal Coming Obs. And where proves he that it is Unchristian to ask such a Question to any that holds it Or that
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Shape or Figure of a Man See the difference in Crit. Sacr. and the Translation of the Church of England In Phil. 2.7 Of Christ its expresly said and found in Figure as a Man as Dr. Fulk against the Papists has it He was also said to be made of a Woman made under the Law to redeem them under it Gal. 4.4 He was Circumcised presented to the Lord with an Oblation Luke 2.21 24. He eat of the Passover c. and thus came under the Law to fulfill it in these Things which were figurative and shadowy yet was the Substance and End of them Charges 10 and 11. Against an Actual keeping of the Law of God so as to avoid all Sin though he grants such a Perfection as imports Sincerity Integrity and Constancy in our utmost endeavours perfectly to keep God's Law entirely to avoid all Sin c. which Perfection he confesses to be requisite to Salvation Yet contrariwise chargeth one of our Friends for saying He had proved by manifest Scriptures that some were perfect in this Life even without Sin and that our Sanctification is Christ himself 1 Cor. 1.30 And another Friend he charges for saying In your Vnbelief you judge that none can live without sinning Obs. Now take the Doctor as believing the contrary thus viz. Though 't is our Duty sincerely to use our utmost endeavours perfectly to keep God's Law and entirely to avoid all Sin yet none were ever so perfect in this Life without Sin and that our Sanctification is not Christ and that 't is our belief to judge that none can live without sinning Thus faithless is this great Doctor how contrary to the Faith of Christ and true Christians is his belief herein And such endeavours for such a Perfection as never attain it but still fall short are not in the true Faith nor so sincere as they should be for Christ said Whatsoever ye ask in my Name believe that ye shall receive it and the same shall be given you Mark 11.24 Luke 11.9 10 11 13. John 14.13 14. and 16 23. Mat. 7.7 And by Faith in Christ comes the Heart to be purified Acts 15.9 And Christ is of God made unto us Wisdom Righteousness Sanctification and Redemption 1 Cor. 1.30 And blessed are the undefiled in the way c. Psal. 119.1 2 3. And seeing the Son of God is manifest for this very purpose to destroy the Works of the Devil 1 John 3. Why then should Sin which is the Devil's Work be thus Preach'd up or contended for by any who profess Faith in Christ Jesus Their's must needs be a faithless Preaching who when they have told People 't is their Duty to use their utmost endeavours entirely to avoid all Sin yet contrarywise tell them That none can live without sining With what Faith or Sincerity can this Man or any of his Brethren engage Childrens God-Fathers and God-Mothers as they call them by Promise and Vow that they shall forsake the Devil and all his Works and yet endeavour to perswade them 't is impossible for them so to do i. e. to live without Sin or to avoid all sinning wherein they obey the Devil and do his Work And note that this Doctor S.F. has in this Point also contradicted the said Doctor Stillingfleet his now Bishop See his Sermon Preach'd before the King March 13. 1666 7. Wherein he does not only plead and argue it as our Duty to obey God's Laws and Commands but the Possibility thereof through the Assistance of his Grace and good Spirit against them who charge God with laying impossible Laws upon Mankind c. and puts the Question What then is wanting but only setting our selves with a serious obedience to them to make his Commands not only not impossible but easy to us Now that this Priest S.F. who styles himself D.D. has apparently contradicted his said Bishop the Contradiction being between the Impossibility and Possibility of living without sining or avoiding all Sin Charge 12. Against some of our ancient Friends for asserting that he calls main fundamental of all our Religion namely The Light and Christ within us and that this Light is in its own being no other than God himself the Christ of God and Saviour of the World the living Principle of God of the Divine Nature c. Obs. And we do not believe this to be either Unchristian or Antichristian as he has rendered it by his Title over it which is no Proof but his own bare Affirmation and Charge wherein he imposes still we preach no other Light but what is Divine of the divine Nature and Being and manifest by degrees in us God is Light and in him is no Darkness at all and hath shined in our Hearts 2 Cor. 4.6 1 John 1.5 And Christ saith I am the Light of the World he that followeth me shall not abide in Darkness John 8.12 and Chap. 12.46 And he saith Believe in the Light that ye may be the Children of the Light John 12.36 And his Apostles Preached not only Christ as without but also Christ as within in Spirit and so did Christ himself John 14.20 and 15.4 and 17.23 2 Cor. 13.5 And therefore our Adversary is far out and shews himself Unchristian in opposing such ancient Christian Doctrin as this of the divine Light and Christ within c. Rendring it both Unchristianity and Antichristianity The Lord deliver poor Souls from such ignorant dark and unchristian Preachers and Doctors who neither know the holy Scriptures nor Jesus Christ nor his divine Light or power of God within them Charge 13. Is about the Holy Scriptures that one said They are not the Word of God not the Rule and Guide of Faith and Life to the Saints but the Spirit of God that gave them forth the Covenant of Life and Peace That a Man may lawfully deny the Scriptures to be the Foundation of Faith and Rule of Life c. That another Friend said Faith is the Ground of the Scriptures and of the Scriptures the Ground of Faith c. With more of like Nature in his Charge elsewhere Answered and Explain'd in our Friends Books quoted by him Obs. Where any of our Friends have said or writ such things it was so far from undervaluing or slighting the Holy Scriptures that the matters here charged as unchristian are agreeable to the very Doctrin of Christ and his Holy Apostles as First That the Word of God is Christ. In the Beginning was the Word John 1. His Name is called The Word of God Rev. 19.13 Secondly That the Spirit of God and Christ is the Saints Guide and Rule of Faith to lead and guide them into all Truth as Christ Jesus promised John 16 â—3 Thirdly That Christ is the Foundation of the Saints Faith and not the Scriptures No other Foundation can any Man lay than that which is laid which is Christ. Fourthly That Faith is the Ground of the Scriptures and not the Scriptures the Ground of Faith
Presence are instrumental therein even in Spiritual Baptism as well as the Conversion of Sinners H.O. Other Christians sit under these Ordinances with great delight and they are sweet to their Taste Answ. The converted Souls great Delight and the Fruit that 's sweet unto the Taste thereof is in sitting under the Shadow of her Beloved and partaking of his Living and pleasant Fruit Cant. 2.3 H.O. You do not own Christ for your Lord and Law-giver and the Scriptures for his Law seems plain to us in that you Communicate not in the Body and Blood of Christ at the Table as other Christians do Answ. We both sincerely own Christ for our Lord and Law-giver and the holy Scriptures and do communicate with all spiritual Christians at the Table of the Lord where we livingly partake of Christ that one living Bread from Heaven and the Cup of Blessing which only can and doth comfort strengthen and nourish our Souls to eternal Life as we daily in his Light do wait upon him H.O. On Acts 4.8 and 13.9 These had then Christ within them and yet they sat down at the Supper Acts 2.4 Others fill'd with the Spirit of Christ yet came together to break Bread 1 Cor. 10.16 and 11.26 Paul gives them Directions c. Answ. It s not question'd that they who receiv'd the Word and believed mentioned in Acts 2. did continue in Fellowship and breaking of Bread and daily in the Temple and breaking Bread at home did eat their Meat together with gladness and singleness of Heart which we truly own but also they had all things common they sold their Possessions and Goods and parted them to all Men as every one had need And that the Disciples came together to break Bread Acts 20.7 But the Question is 1. Whether because these Things were done by Believers then they must be practised by the Church of Christ as long as the World lasts if so why are they not all Are all their Temporary Practices Commands If so why do not the present Priests and Professors sell their Possessions and divide them and have all things common 2 And whether Christ's Practice as to the Bread and Cup and Passover in his Supper Luke 22. was therefore an Institution injoyn'd by him to be observed and practised in his Church while the World lasts Christ took brake and gave them Bread and Fish likewise after he was risen Luke 24.30 John 21.13 But we find not that he imposes these as a Sacrament or perpetual Institution to be allways observed in his Church 3. And Paul having recited Christ's Practice says to the Corinthians As oft as ye eat this Bread and drink this Cup ye shew the Lord's Death till he come 1 Cor. 11.26 Was this an universal and perpetual Command to the Church Or was it not fulfilled in Christs COMING which those very Corinthians waited for 1 Cor. 1.7 and 4.5 and which coming of Christ they had then great need of to remove and end the Strifes Divisions Carnality Drunkenness Sleepiness and Disorders among them 1 Cor. 3.3 and 11.21 30 We farther seriously ask 1. If the outward Bread and Cup were not figurative visible Signs or Shadow of something more excellent 2. If outward Types Figutes and Shadows be not of a decreasing and vanishing Nature 3. What perpetual Command and Necessity is there of the Shadow to continue the Substance being come and manifest in Christ's Church 4. Is not Christ the Sum and Substance and end of all outward Shadows Types and Figures and the Bread of Life from Heaven the spiritual Meat and Drink of every sanctified Soul 5. Is not the inward Living and spiritual Enjoyment of Christ and our being truly partakers of Christ far more excellent than the outward Observation of the Shadow to put us only in remembrance of him 6. If the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ in Spirit and Power and his Members and Saints spiritual Communion with him their eating and drinking at his Table in his Kingdom Luke 22.16 30. and partaking with him of his spiritual Supper or supping with him Rev. 3 20. do not fully answer and fulfill the end of the Figures and Shadows as being a far more excellent Dispensation Shew us any Thing figurative or shadowish mentioned in Scripture that we cannot shew the substance thereof under the same Term or Title 7. Can any Bread Cup or Wine give Life unto or nourish the Soul unto Eternal Life then that which is spiritual the Bread of Life and Wine of the Kingdom of Christ even the same Bread and Wine in Wisdom's House Prov. 9.5 Pray seriously consider these Questions for they are serious and to us of concern H.O. Say they i. e. the Quakers That Christ enlightens every Man that comes into the World I told them that was with the Light of Nature Answ. Where proves he that Light of Christ in every Man John 1.9 is but the Light of Nature By what Scripture proves he this when 't is expresly said In him was Life and the Life was the Light of Men John 1.4 which rather proves it a divine and spiritual Light for that Life that was in Christ the Eternal Word was the Light of Men. Can this be the Light of Nature How great is the Darkness of such Preachers who so teach H.O. That you do not own Christ for your Lord and Teacher you do not own the Ministry of such men who are lawfully called set apart by such as have lawful Authority in the Church It is plain in Scripture Christ gave some Apostles some Prophets and some Evangelists c. for the perfecting of the Saints c. Answ. The first part charged against us is not true we do own Christ's Ministry and Ministers sent by him who are gifted and qualified for the Work of his Ministry but such Ministers as were never called gifted nor qualified by Christ but made and authorized only by Men and who deny any immediate Call or Revelation from Christ in these Days and who in their Preaching oppose Perfection and living without sinning in this Life such we do and shall deny and testifie against H.O. Are all Apostles are all Prophets What may every Man or Woman speak in the Church Oh no. Answ. Though all are not such yet if the Spirit of the Lord be upon them to speak or prophesie as he has promised Joâ—l 2. that 's not to be limited nor quenched Ye may all prophesie one by one 1 Cor. 14.31 And there were Women among them Chap. 11.5 Therefore the Prohibition to their Women 1 Cor. 14 34· was not General nor comprehending all States and Attainments of Christian Women nor yet to make void that Prophecy Joel 2.28 29. nor to hinder godly Women gifted and qualified from their Duty of being Teachers of good things Titus 2.3 H.O. Take heed to thy self and thy Doctrin continue in them 1 Tim. 4.15 16. That is be constant in Preaching noâ— in your Study one day and at Plow the next
Answ. There were better and more effectual Preachers who were Plow-men Shepherds Herds-men Fishermen c. 1 Kings 19.19 Amos 1.1 and 7.14 Mat. 4.18 19. John 21.7 1 Cor. 4.12 than you who by the help of your acquired Arts and Learning contrive and study Sermons and fill your Heads out of other Men's Books and Authors instead of waiting upon God for Light and Understanding in divine Matters The true God is not limited he teacheth the Plowman Discretion and is more felt and known by an honest Plowman at his Plow than by a corrupt Priest in his Study or Closet setting his Imaginations at work filling his Head with Notions out of other Mens Works and Lines made ready to his Hand H.O. Where is your Presbytery Who lays on Hand Who sets apart among you Who is set apart to the Work I know them not Answ. We have true and faithful Ministers among us called and set apart by Christ Jesus and owned and approved of by faithful Elders in Truth and the Church of Christ though they do not come under the Hands of your Presbytery H.O. Some say John Payton of Dudley speaks sometimes yea and the Women often talk in your Churches an hour together is this your Christianity Ans. Good Christian Women to whom God has made good his promise Joel 2.28 29. may be required of him sometime to speak among his People in Humility and Godly Fear and be no worse nor less Christians for that There were Prophetesses and Godly Women in the days of the Holy Prophets and among the Primitive Christians who were also Teachers of good things H.O. When you turn Quakers you forsake all Fellowship and Communion with all other People whatsoever Is this a part of your Christianity c. Is this Obedience to the Apostles Doctrin forsake not the assembling of your selves together Ans. Israel shall dwell alone and not be numbred among the Nations the Lord 's peculiar People are a chosen People called and chosen out of Kindreds Tongues and People and must be separate from the unclean God has called and gathered us by his Arm of Power out of all empty Professions and to turn away from all such as have a Form of Godliness but deny the Power from all the proud and covetous hireling oppressing Priests and Teachers made by the Will of Man And we are required to assemble our selves inwardly to wait upon and Worship God in Spirit and Truth distinct and separate from them who are But formal outside traditional Worshippers H.O. You will have no Communion with any other above ground or below you have in Stowerbridge a constant able ancient profitable Preacher able to divide the Word aright in the publick Assembly you have also others in the licensed House that preach Truth there frequently Ans. If this his able ancient Preacher at Stowerbridge be Dr. Ford who he pleads for and the same S.F. D.D. who has printed the perverse fallacious and abusive Scheme to prove our ancient Friends unchristian and antichristian And if the Preachers in the licensed House he talks of be such as H. Osland himself we have but very poor Encouragement to go to hear or learn of either because of the Envy and Abuse of the one and the Ignorance of the other H.O. But you have built you a Fabrick to binder from attending at either Ans. Our Meeting House or New Fabrick as he calls it is one Cause of Dr. Ford's and H.O. his present Envy and perverse Scribling against us they envy our Liberty and Prosperity and have now begun the Quarrel with us to misrepresent and defame us which shews a partial persecuting Spirit in them which is far from either a true Christian Spirit or State of Saints H.O. What are there no Christians no Saints in either Are ye the only called and chosen How went the Spirit and the Grace of God by the other Assemblies to sit down with you Ans. This Question is much like that of Zedekiah the false Prophet to Micaiah the true when he had smote him on the Oheek Which way went the Spirit of the Lord from me to speak unto thee 1 Kings 22.24 But this was no proof against the true Prophet nor for the false and as poor an Argument for H.O. against the Quakers H.O. Must you be Christians because you deny the Communion of Saints Ans. A false Charge the Communion of Saints which is Spiritual we never denied but are come in measure into it through the Power and Goodness of our God in Christ unto us H.O. Doth the Preaching of Dr. Ford and our hearing of him unfit us for Fellowship with you Or our hearing a young lively Non-conformist Ans. Which does he prefer here as better Preacher the Learned Dr. or Lively Non-conformist by this distinction His thus pleading for hearing Dr. Ford the Parish-Priest at the publick Assembly or Parish-Church so called or a young lively Non-conformist as he calls him at the licenced Meeting House does bespeak such an indifference between Conformity and Non-conformity as thereby he has at once given away and betrayed the Cause of all consciencious Non-conformists and Dissenters into the Hands of their Persecutors and Adversaries so as to give them occasion the more to insult and persecute if they have opportunity But we hope all that are conscientious and mean honestly will see and refuse such Indifferency such Insincerity such Medly such Neutrality and Hpocrisie as this Lukewarm Temporizer and Hypocrite has here pleaded for His zealous Brethren of the Presbytery of Scotland c. would not endure such his Indifferency and detestable Neutrality as being a Violation of their solemn League and Covenant which it seems he has dispensed with H.O. Doth the Preaching of John Payton and such as he make you only Saints or is it the Preaching of the Women Ans. These are but silly Scoffs and Flouts from a proud and scornful Spirit and prove nothing against us we are a Religious People who conscientiously dissent both from the Parish Priests and such Linsy-woolsey Temporizers as himself and doubt not but the Lord has inspired and rais'd up and made better and more powerful Preachers probably some poor industrious Men and Women than himself or his said Dr. ever were H.O. Nay you will have no fellowship with us in the Bowels of the Earth you will not sleep with us in the Dust for you have many Grave-Yards up and down Ans. What sad Complaint is this what Cause has he for it what great hurt do we do them in not burying our Dead with them surely none at all they have the more room then And 't is no new thing to purchase Burying Places some of the Holy Ancients have been presidential in that Case See Gen. 23.4 11. and 49.30 and 50.13 H.O. Now your Belief of God and Christ and other good things you express in your Paper prove you only Christians in part but not that you are compleat in him Ans. 'T is well he has