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A53665 Animadversions on a treatise intituled Fiat lux, or, A guide in differences of religion, between papist and Protestant, Presbyterian and independent by a Protestant. Owen, John, 1616-1683. 1662 (1662) Wing O713; ESTC R22534 169,648 656

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by his example he commends unto them But it will be said He only shews the uncertainties that are about Scripture that men may not expect by or from them deliverance from the darkness and ignorance before spoken of Suppose then they come to be perswaded of such an uncertainty What course shall they take Apply themselves to the Roman-Church and they are safe But seeing the being of a Church much less the Roman-Church hath no foundation in the light of Nature and men can never know any thing of it especially of its Prerogative but by and from the Scripture whose Authority you have taught them to question and made doubtful to them What remains for rational men but to renounce both Scripture and Church and betake themselves to your commendable piece of witty Atheism This is the old lurry The Scripture cannot be known believed understood but by the Church the Church cannot be proved to have Being Constitution or Authority but by the Scripture and then if you doubt of the Authority of that proof of the Church you must return to the Church again and so on until all Faith and Reason vanish or men make shipwrack of their Faith and become brutish in their Understanding pretending to believe they know neither what nor why And this imployment of raising surmises and stirring up jealousies about the Word of God it's Pen-men and their Authority do men put themselves upon I will not say to gratifie the Roman-Court but I will say in obedience to their prejudices lusts and darkness and saddest drudgery that any of the sons of men can be exercised withal And if he would be believed he professeth himself an Anti-Scripturist and in that profession which he puts upon himself an Atheist For my part I am amazed to think how men are able to hold their Pens in their hands that an horrour of the work they have before them doth not make them shake them out when they are thus traducing the holy Word of Christ and exciting evil surmises about it Should they deal with a man of any Power and Authority they might not expect to escape his indignation even to publish to all the World that he is indeed an honourable person but yet if men will question his Honour Truth Honesty Authority and affirm him to be a Cheat Thief Murderer Adulterer they cannot see how they can be disproved at least he would have a difficult task in hand that should endeavour to free him from objections of that nature Yet thus men dare to deal with the Scripture that Word which God hath magnified above all his Name If this be the Spirit that breathed in the Apostles the holy Army of Martyrs of old and all the Fathers of the Primitive Church I am much mistaken nay I am greatly so if with one consent they would not denounce an Anathema against such a defence of any Religion whatever But you will say The same person defends also the Scripture just as he in the Poet did Pelilius Me Capitolinus convictore usus amicoque A puero est causaque mea permulta rogatus Fecit incolumnis laetor quod vivit in urbe Sed tamem admiror quo pacto Judicium illud Fugerit A defence worse and more bitter then a down-right accusation I am not now to observe what prejudice this excuse brings to the cause of our Author with all intelligent persons having noted it once and again before nor what contentment Protestants take to see that the Truth they profess cannot be shaken without inducing men to question the Fundamental Principles of Christian Religion and if this course be persisted in for ought that I can understand the whole Controversie between us and the Romanists must needs be at last reduced unto this head Whether the Scripture of the Old and New-Testament was given by Divine Inspiration For the present having in the consideration of the general suppositions of this Treatise spoken before to this head I shall not need to answer particular Exceptions given in against its Authority nor do I think it incumbent on me so to do unless our Author own them for his sense which if he be pleased to do I promise him if God give me life to give him a distinct answer to every one of them and all that is contained in them Moreover these things will again occurre in his 15. Section where he expresly takes the Scripture to task as to its pleas for judging of and setling Men in the Truth Proceed we to his next Section p. 126. CHAP. VIII Use of Reason Sect. 11. THis Section is set apart for the cashiering of Reason from having any hand in the business we deal about and the truth is if our Author can perswade us first to throw away our Bibles and then to lay aside the use of our Reason I suppose there is no doubt but we shall become Roman-Catholicks This work it seems cannot be effected unless men are contented to part with Scripture and Reason all that whereby they are Christians and Men. But unless our Author have emptyed Circe's Box of Oyntment whereby she transformed Men into Swine he will confess it somewhat a difficult task that he hath undertaken Methinks one of these demands might suffice at once But he presumes he hath put his Countrey-men into a good humor and knowing them free and open-hearted he plyes them whilest they are warm We have indeed in this Section as fair a flourish of words as in any other but there can be but little reason in the words that men make use of to plead against Reason it self And yet I am perswaded most Readers think as well of this 〈◊〉 as any in the Book To whom the un●easonableness of this is evident that of the others is so also and those who willingly imbibe the other parts of his Discourse will little strain at this Nothing is to be trusted unto Prejudice Nor if we will learn are we to think strange of any thing Let us weigh then impartially what is of Reason in this Discourse against the use of Reason What ever he pretends he knows full well that he hath no difference with any sort of Protestants about finding out a Religion by Reason and adhereing only to its dictates in the Worship of God All the World of Protestants profess that they receive their Religion wholly by Revelation from God and no otherwise Nor is it about ascribing a Soveraignty to Reason to judge of the particulars of Religion so Revealed to accept or refuse them according as that shall judge them suitable or not to its principles and liking This is the Soveraign dictate of Reason That whatever God reveals to be believed is true and as such must be embraced though the bottom of it cannot be sounded by Reason's line and that because 〈◊〉 reason of a man is not absolutely reason but being the reason of a man is variously limitted bounded and made defective in its ratiocinations An objective
it alone and traditions they had good store whose original they pleaded from Moses himself directing them in that interpretation Christ and his Apostles whom they looked upon as poor ignorant contemptible persons came and preacht a doctrine which that Church determined utterly contrary to the Scripture and their Traditions what shall now be answered to their Authority which was unquestionably all that ever was or shall be entrusted with any Church on the earth Our Author tells us that this great argument of the Jews could not be any way warded or put by but by recourse unto the Churches infallibility pag. 146. Which sit verbo venia is so ridiculous a pretence as I wonder how any block in his way could cause him to stumble upon it What Church I pray the Church of Christians When that argument was first used by the Jews against Christ himself it was not yet founded and if an absolute infallibility be supposed in the Church without respect to her adherence to the rule of infallibility I dare boldly pronounce that argument indissoluble and that all Christian Religion must be therein discarded If the Jewish-Church which had at that day as great Church-power and prerogative as any Church hath or can have were infallible in her Judgment that she made of Christ and his Doctrin there remains nothing but that we renounce both him and it and turn either Jews or Pagans as we were of old Here then by our Authors confession lies a plain Judgment and Definition of the only Church of God in the world against Christ and his Doctrine and it is certainly incumbent on us to see how it may be wa●ed And this I suppose we cannot better be instructed in then by considering what was answered unto it by Christ himself his Apostles and those that succeeded them in the profession of the faith of the Gospel 1 For Christ himself its certain he pleaded his miracles the Works which he wrought and the Doctrine that he revealed but withall as to the Jews with whom he had to do he pleads the Scriptures Moses and the Prophets and offers himself and his Doctrine to be tryed to stand or fall by their verdict Joh. 5.39 46. Mat. 22.42 Luk. 24.27 I say besides the testimony of his Works and Doctrine to their authority of the Church he opposeth that of the Scripture which he knew the other ought to give place unto And it is most vainly pretended by our Author in the behalf of the Jews that the Messias or great Prophet to come was not in the Scripture specified by such Characteristicall Properties as made it evident that Jesus was the Messiah all the descriptions given of the one and they innumerable undeniably centring in the other The same course steered the Apostle Peter Act. 2. 3. And expresly in his second Epistle chap. 2. v. 17 18 19. And Paul Act. 13.16 17 c. And of Apollos who openly disputed with the Jews upon this Argument it is said that he mightily convinced the Jews publickly shewing by the Scripture that Jesus is the Christ Act. 18.28 And Paul perswaded the Jews concerning Jesus at Rome both out of the Law of Moses and out of the Prophets from morning until evening Act. 28.23 Concerning which labour and disputation the censure of our Author p. 149. is very remarkable There can be no hope saith he of satisfying a Querent or convincing an Opponent in any point of Christianity unless he will submit to the splendor of Christs Authority in his own Person and the Church descended from him which I take to be the Reason why some of the Jews in Rome when St. Paul laboured so much to perswade Christ out of Moses and the Prophets believed in him and some did not Both the coherence of the words and design of the Preface and his whole scope manifest his meaning to be That no more believed on him or that some disbelieved notwithstanding all the pains he took with them And what was the reason of this failure Why St. Paul fixed on an unsuitable means of perswading them namely Moses and the Prophets when he should have made use of the Authority of the Church Vain and bold man that dares oppose his prejudices to the Spirit and Wisdom of Christ in that great and holy Apostle and that in a way and work wherein he had the express pattern and example of his Master If this be the Spirit that rules in the Roman-Synagogue that so puffes up men in their fleshly minds as to make them think themselves wiser then Christ and his Apostles I doubt not but men will every day find cause to rejoyce that it is cast out of them and be watchful that it return to possess them no more But this is that which galls the man The difficulty which he proposeth as insoluble by any wayes but an acquiescing in the Authority of the present Church he finds assoyled in Scripture on other Principles This makes him fall soul on St. Paul whom he finds most frequent in answering it from Scripture not considering that at the same time he accuseth St. Peter of the like folly though he pretend for him a greater reverence However this may be said in defence of St. Paul that by his Arguments about Christ and the Gospel from Moses and the Prophets many thousands of Jews all the World over were converted to the Faith when it 's hard to meet with an instance of one in an age that will any way take notice of the Authority of the Roman-Church But to return this was the constant way used by the Apostles of answering that great difficulty pleaded by our Author from the Authority of the Hebrew-Church They called the Jews to the Scripture the plain Texts and Contexts of Moses and the Prophets opposing them to all their Churches real or pretended Authority and all her Interpretations pretended to be received by Tradition from of old so fixing this for a perpetual standing Rule to all Generations that the Doctrine of the Church is to be examined by the Scripture and where it is found contradictory of it her authority is of no value at all it being annexed unto her attendance on that Rule But it may be replyed That the Church in the dayes of the Apostles was not yet setled nor made firm enough to bear the weight that now may be laid upon it as our Author affirms pag. 149. So that now the great Resolve of all doubts must be immediately upon the Authority of the present Church after that was once well cleared the fathers of old pleaded that only in this case and removed the Objections of the Jews by that alone I am perswaded though our Author be a great admirer of the present Church he is not such a stranger to Antiquity as to believe any such thing Is the Authority of the Church pleaded by Justine Martyr in that famous dispute with Trypho the Jew wherein these very Objections instanced by our
Author are thoroughly canvassed Doth he not throughout his whole Disputation prove out of the Scriptures and them alone that Jesus was the Christ and his Doctrine agreeable unto them Is any such thing pleaded by Origen Tertullian Chrysostom or any one that had to deal with the Jews Do they not wholly persist in the way traced for them by Paul Peter and Apollos mightily convincing the Jews out of Scripture Let him consult their Answers he will not find them such poor empty jejune Discourses as that he supposes they might make use of pag. 148. and to the proofs whereof by Texts of Scripture he sayes the Rabbies could answer by another Interpretation of them He will find another Spirit breathing in their Writings another efficacy in their Arguments and other evidence in their Testimonies than it seems he is acquainted with and such as all the Rabbies in the World are not able to withstand And I know full well that these insinuations that Christians are not able justifiably to convince confute and stop the mouths of Jews from the Scripture would have been abhorred as the highest piece of blasphemy by the whole antient Church of Christ and it is meet it should be so still by all Christians Is there no way left to deny pretences of Light and Spirit but by proclaiming to the great scandal of Christianity that we cannot answer the Exceptions of Jews unto the Person and Doctrine of our Saviour out of the Scriptures And hath Rome need of these bold Sallyes against the vitals of Religion Is she no other way capable of a defence Better she perished 10000 times than that any such reproach should be justly cast on the Lord Jesus Christ and his Gospel But whatever our Author thinks of himself I have very good ground to conjecture that he hath very little acquaintance with Judaical Antiquity Learning or Arguments nor very much with the Scripture and may possibly deserve on that account some excuse if he thought those Exceptions insoluble which more learned men than himself know how to answer and remove without any considerable trouble This difficulty was fixed on by our Author that upon it there might be stated a certain retreat and assured way of establishment against al of the like nature This he assigns to be the Authority of the present Church Protestants the Scripture wherein as to the instance chosen out as most pressing we have the concurrent suffrage of Christ his Apostles and all the antient Christians so that we need not any further to consider the pretended pleas of Light and Spirit which he hath made use of as the Orator desired his Dialogist would have insisted on the Stories of Cerberus and Cocytus that he might have shewed his skill and activity in their Confutation For what he begs in the way as to the constitution of St. Peter and his Successors in the Rule of the Church as he produceth no other proof for it but that doughty one that It must needs be so so if it were granted him he may easily perceive by the Instance of the Judaical Church that himself thought good to insist upon that it will not avail him in his plea against the final resolution of our Faith into the Scripture as its senses are proposed by the Ministry of the Church and rationally conceived or understood CHAP. X. Protestant Pleas. HIs Sect. 13. p. 155. entituled Independent and Presbyterians Pleas is a merry one The whole design of it seems to be to make himself and others sport with the miscarriages of men in and about Religion Whether it be a good work or no that day that is coming will discover The Independents he divides into two parts Quakers and Anabaptists Quakers he begins withal and longest insists upon being as he saith well read in their Books and acquainted with their persons some commendation he gives them so farr as it may serve to the disparagement of others and then falls into a fit of Quaking so expresly imitating them in their Discourses that I fear he will confirm some in their surmises that such as he both set them on work and afterwards assisted them in it For my part having undertaken only the defence of Protestancy and Protestants I am altogether inconcerned in the entertainment he hath provided for his Readers in this personating of a Quaker which he hath better done and kept a better decorum in than in his personating of a Protestant a thing in the beginning of his Discourse he pretended unto The Anabaptists as farr as I can perceive he had not medled with unless it had been to get an advantage of venting his pretty Answer to an Argument against Infant-Baptism but the truth is if the Anabaptists had no other Objections against Infant-Baptism nor Protestants no better Answers to their Objections then what are mentioned here by our Author it were no great matter what become of the Controversie but it is Merriment not Disputation that he is designing and I shall leave him to the solace of his own fancies No otherwise in the next place doth he deal with the Presbyterians in personating of whom he pours out a long senseless rapsody of words many insignificant expressions vehement exclamations and uncouth terms such as to do them right I never heard uttered by them in preaching though I have heard many of them nor read written by them though I suppose I have perused at least as many of their Books as our Author hath done of the Quakers Any one with half an Eye may see what it is which galls the man and his Party which whether he hath done wisely to discover his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 will inform him that is the Preaching of all sorts of Protestants that he declares himself to be most perplexed with and therefore most labours to expose it to reproach and obloquy And herein he deals with us as in many of their Stories their Demoniacks do with their Exorcists discover which Relick or which Saints name or other Engine in that bufle most afflicts them that so they may be paid more to the purpose Somewhat we may learn from hence Fas est ab hoste doceri But he will make the Presbyterians amends for all the scorn he endeavours to expose them to by affirming when he hath assigned a senseless Harangue of words unto them that the Protestants are not able to answer their Objections Certainly if the Presbyterians are such pitiful souls as not to be able any beter to defend their cause than they are represented by him here to do those Protestants are beneath all consideration who are not able to deal and grapple with them And this is as it should be Roman-Catholicks are wise learned holy angelical seraphical persons all others ignorant dolts that can scarse say Boe to a Goose. These things considered in themselves are unserious trifles but seria ducunt We shall see presently whither all this lurry tends for the sting of this whole Discourseis
he be in good earnest indeed he calls us to an easie welcome imployment namely to defend the holy Word of God and the wisdom of God in it from such slight and trivial exceptions as those he layes against them This path is so trodden for us by the Antients in their Answers to the more weighty Objections of his Predecessors in this work the Pagans that we cannot well erre or faint in it If we are called to this task namely to prove that we can know and believe the Scriptrue to be the Word of God without any respect to the Authority or Testimony of the present Church of Rome that no man can believe it to be so with faith Divine and Supernatural upon that testimony alone that the whole counsel of God in all things to be believed or done in order to our last end is clearly delivered in it and that the composure of it is a work of infinite wisdom suited to the end designed to be accomplished by it that no difficulties in the interpretation of particular places hinder the whole from being a compleat and perfect rule of Faith and Obedience we shall most willingly undertake it as knowing it to be as honourable a service and employment as any of the sons of men can in this world be called unto If indeed himself be otherwise minded and believes not what he says but only intends to entangle men by his Sophistry so to render them plyable unto his further intention I must yet once more perswade him to desist from this course It doth not become an ingenious man much lesse a Christian and one that boasts of so much Mortification as he doth to juggle thus with the things of God In the mean time his Reader may take notice that so long as he is able to defend the Authority Excellency and Usefulness of the Scripture this man had nothing to say to him as to the change of his Religion from Protestancy to Popery And when men will be perswaded to let that go as a thing uncertain dubious useless it matters not much where they go themselves And for our Authour methinks if not for reverence to Christ whose book we know the Scriptures to be yet for the devotion he bears the Pope whose book he sayes it is he might learn to treat it with a little more respect or at least prevail with him to send out a book not liable to so many exceptions as this is pretended to be However this I know that though his pretence be to make men Papists the course he takes is the readyest in the world to make them Atheists and whether that will serve his turn or no as well as the other I know not 6. We have not yet done with the Scripture That the taking it for the only rule of faith the only determiner of differences is the only cause of all our differences and which keeps us in a condition of having them endless is also pretended and pleaded But how shall we know this to be so Christ and his Apostles were absolutely of another mind and so were Moses and the Prophets before them The antient Fathers of the Primitive Church walked in their steps and umpired all differences in Religion by the Scriptures opposing confuting and condemning Errors and Heresies by them preserving through their guidance the unity of the Spirit in the bond of Peace In these latter dayes of the world which surely are none of the best we have a few unknown persons come from Rome would perswade us that the Scripture and the use of it is the cause of all our differences and the means of making them endless But why so I pray Doth it teach us to differ and contend Doth it speak contradictions and set us at variance Is there any spirit of dissension breathing in it Doth it not deliver what it commands us to understand so as it may be understood Is there any thing needful for us to know in the things of God but what it reveales Who can tell us what that is But do we not see de facto what differences there are amongst you who pretend all of you to be guided by Scripture Yea and we see also what Surfeitings and drunkenness there is in the world but yet do not think bread meat and drink to be the causes of them and yet they are to the full as much so as the Scriptures are of our Differences Pray Sir do not think that sober men will cast away their Food and starve themse●●es because you tell them that some continually abuse and surfeit on that very kind of food which they use Nor will some mens abuse of it prevail with others to cast away the food of their souls if they have any design to live eternally 7. The great safety and security that there is in committing our selves as to all the concernments of Religion unto the guidance rule and conduct of the Pope is another great principle of this Discourse And here our Author falls into a deep admiration of the Popes dexterity in keeping all his Subjects in peace and unity and subjection to him there being no danger to any one for fors●king him but only that of Excommunication The contest is between the Scripture and the Pope Protestants say the safest way for men in reference to their eternal condition is to believe the Scripture and rest therein The Romanists say the same of the Pope Which will prove the best course methinks should not be hard to determine All Christians in the world ever did agree That the Scripture is the certain infallible word of God given by him on purpose to reveal his mind and will unto us About the Pope there were great Contests ever since he was first taken notice of in the world Nothing I confess little or low is spoken of him Some say he is the head and spouse of the Church the Vicar of Christ the successor of Peter the supreme Moderator of Christians the infallible judge of Controversies and the like others again that he is Antichrist the man of sin a cruel Tyrant and Persecutor the evill Servant Characterized Mat. 24.48 49 50 51. But all as far as I can gather agree that he is a Man I mean that almost all Popes have been so for about every individual there is not the like consent Now the question is Whether we shall rest in the Authority and Word of God or in the Authority and Word of a Man as the Pope is confessed to be and whether is like to yield us more security in our assiance This being such another difficult matter and case as that before mentioned about the Bibles being the Popes book shall not be by me decided but left to the Judgment of wiser men In the mean time for his feat of Government it is partly known what it is as also what an influence into the effects of peace mentioned that gentle means of Excommunication hath had I know one that
and in that manner you see me do it exercising before your eye my Priestly Function according to the order of Melchisedech with which power I do also invest you and appoint you to do the like even unto the Consummation of the world in commemoration of my Death and Passion exhibiting and shewing forth your Lords Death until he come This Protestants do not and we are mad-angry that the Papist does what his Redeemer injoyned him I fear his Readers which shall consider this odd medly will begin to think that they are not only Protestants who use to be mad-angry This kind of Writing argues I will not say both madness and anger but one of them it doth seem plainly to do For setting aside a far-fetched false notion or two about Melchisedech and the Doctrine of the Sacrament here expressed is that which the Pope with Fire and Sword hath laboured to exterminate out of the world burning hundreds I think in England for believing that our Lord instituting his blessed Supper commanded his Apostles to do the same that he then did and in the same manner even to the Consummation of the world in the commemoration of his Death and Passion exhibiting and shewing forth their Lord's death until he come a man would suppose that he had taken these words out of the Liturgie of the Church of England for therein are they expresly found and why then have not Protestants that which he speaks of Yea but Christ did this in the exercise of his Priestly Function and with the same power of Priesthood according to the order of Melchisedech invested his Apostles Both these may be granted and the Protestants Doctrine and Faith concerning this Sacrament not at all impeached but the truth is they are both false The Lord Christ exercised indeed his Priestly Function when on the Cross he offered himself to God through the Eternal Spirit a Sacrifice for the sins of the world but it was by vertue of his Kingly and Prophetical power that he instituted the Sacrament of his Body and Bloud and taught his Disciples the use of it commanding its Observation in all his Churches to the end of the world And as for any others being made Priests after the Order of Melchisedeck besides himself alone it 's a figment so expresly contrary to the words and reasoning of the Apostle that I wonder any man not mad or angry could once entertain any approving thoughts of it That our Author may no more mistake in this matter I desire he would give me leave to inform him that setting aside his proper Sacrificing of the Son of God and his hideous figment of Transubstanatition both utter strangers to the Scripture and Antiquity there is nothing can by him be named concerning this Sacrament as to its honour or efficacy but it is all admitted by Protestants He pretends after this loose Harangue to speak to the thing it self and tells us that the consecrated CHALICE is not ordinarily given to people by the Priest in private Communion as though in some cases it were given amongst them to the body of the people or that they had some publick communion wherein it was ordinarily so given both which he knows to be untrue So impossible it seems for him to speak plainly and directly to what he treats on But it is a thing which hath need of these artifices If one falsity be not covered with another it will quickly rain through all However he tells us that they should do so is neither expedient nor necessary as to any effects of the Sacrament I wish for his own sake some course might be found to take him off this confidence of setting himself against the Apostles and the whole primitive Church at once that he might apprehend the task too difficult for him to undertake and meddle with it no more All expediency in the administration of this great Ordinance and all the effects of it depend solely on the institution and blessing of Christ If he have appointed the use of both elements what are we poor worms that we should come now in the end of the world and say the use of one of them is not expedient nor necessary to any effects of Communion Are we wiser then he Have we more care of his Church then he had or Do we think that it becomes us thus arbitrarily to chuse and refuse in the institutions of our Lord and Master What is it to us what Cavils soever men can lay that it is not necessary in the way of Protestants nor in the way of Catholicks we know it is necessary in the way of Christ. And if either Protestants or Catholicks leave that way for me they shall walk in their own wayes by themselves But why is it not necessary in the way of Protestants Because they place the effect of the Communion in the operation of faith and therefore according to them one kind is enough nay if we have neither kind there is no loss but of a Ceremony which may be well enough supplyed at our ordinary Tables This is prety Logick which it seems our Author learned out of Smith and Seaton Protestants generally think that men see with their eyes and yet they think the light of the Sun necessary to the exercising of their sight and though they believe that all saving effects of the Sacrament depend on the operation of faith and Catholicks do so too at least I am sure they say so yet they believe also that the Sacrament which Christ appointed and the use of it as by him appointed is necessary in its own kind for the producing of those effects These things destroy not but mutually assist one another working effectually in their several kinds to the same end and purpose Nor can there be any operation of faith as to the special end of the Sacrament without the administration of it according to the mind and will of Christ. Besides Protestants know that the frequent distinct Proposals in the Scripture of the benefits of the death of Christ as arising sometimes from the suffering of the body sometimes from the effusion of the bloud of their Saviour leads them to such a distinct acting of faith upon him and receiving of him as must needs be hindred and disturbed in the administration of the Sacrament under one kind especially if that Symbol be taken from them which is peculiarly called his Testament and that bloud wherewith his Covenant with them was sealed So that according to the Principles of the Protestants the Participation of the Cup is of an indispensible necessity unto them that intend to use that Ordinance to their benefit and comfort and what he addes about drinking at our ordinary tables because we are now speaking plainly I must needs tell him is a prophane piece of scurrility which he may do well to abstain from for the future What is or is not necessary according to their Catholick Doctrine we shall not trouble our selves knowing that