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A19668 Fryer Iohn Frauncis of Nigeon in Fraunce A replication to that lewde aunswere, which Fryer Iohn Frauncis (of the Minimes order in Nigeon nigh vnto Paris in Fraunce) hath made to a letter, that his mother caused to be written, and sent to him out of England, in August. 1585. Wherevnto is annexed an aunswere, to that which the same fryer hath written to his father and mother: in defence, and to the prayse of that religion, which he dooth nowe professe: and to the disprayse and defacing of that religion, which is nowe professed in Englande. Whereof the fryer himselfe was a scholler and professor, vntill the yeere 1583. which was the 18. yeere of hys age. VVritten by Robert Crowley. Anno. 1586. Crowley, Robert, 1518?-1588.; Debnam, Samuel. 1586 (1586) STC 6091; ESTC S109119 122,478 144

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that they should stand in néede of greater mercy then Christ Jesus hath already shewed vnto them But more of this when I shall come to speake of these wordes of yours You say that we are fooles to pray for the deade Your Brother Aaron you say was liuing at that time when you did so vnduetifullie depart from your mother but he is nowe dead to whom as to your Father and mother you béeséeche Christ to giue life euerlasting A good and charitable petition I wysh the same to you and to all others whatsoeuer knowing that none can haue euerlasting life otherwise then by Gods frée gyft thorowe Jesus Christ our Lord. But your selfe and men of your sorte may not acknowledge anie such free gyft for that you doo by your often and long prayers your holines and austerity of life and your continuall fastinges and often scourging of your selues with your holie whyppes deserue this life euerlasting both for your selues and for others So that you are become sauiours of your selues of as many as doo or will beléeue as you doo teache others to beléeue And thus you conclude your answer to the Letter which your mother sent you written as you think by Master Kings man the Scriuner As touching y e writer of that Letter your coniecture is right You procéede and say Fryar I am now to certify you of my state welfare abyding how I am likely to liue First of al therfore I beseech Iesus Christ giue you the grace of his holie spirit vnto the intēt that this which I write may be to his honor to your cōuersiō your souls health Crowley Wee shall nowe bee certified of your estate welfare c. You beséeche Jesus Christe to giue the grace of his holye spirit to your mother c. I hope she hath already receiued so large a measure of that holy spirite y t whatsoeuer you haue or shall write shall not be able to remooue her from that foundation whereon shée is builded which is the Rocke Christ that notwithstanding anie assaults that you can make she shall remaine still setled vppon that Rocke to her soules health And that your writings and mine together shalbe to the honor of Christ Jesus either in your returning againe from your Apostacie or els in your vtter confusion Nowe you enter into your discourse concerning your departing your trauell and dangers that you endured and escaped before you were brought to this blessed rest wherein you nowe remaine the manner and holines of the life that you leade there and haue vowed and so purpose to leade so long as GOD shall giue you life vppon earth Last of all you vse an earnest and as you think a pithie Oration to mooue your mother to be at destance with that Religion that she nowe holdeth and with all the teachers thereof As Crowley and the rest to burne her Bookes of Sermons to vse the English Bible no more to goe no more to the Sermons of Protestants but to praie to our blessed Ladie and to hang her faith vpon her son Samuels sléeue And thus your discourse beginneth The Fryar My departure from you was vpon the Monday as I remember after Lowe Sundaie in the after noone That night I was lodged not farre from London Two or three nights after that I went by night a mile from London The Saterday before that I departed from you I went to shrift as wee call it in Englande or in other words I was at confession in a place where I confessed my sins to a Priest who gaue me absolution penaunce The Mondaie after that I departed from you vnder pretence of the Hebrewe Lesson which the mischieuous Hereticke Barber taught me The Fridaie after that I went by night a mile from London where I remained in great feare the space of two or three weekes There I heard the first masse that euer I hearde Crovvley Concerning the time of your departing from your mother your going to shrift the Saterdaie before your lodging so nighe London for the space of two or thrée nights after your departing your going by night a mile of from London your tarrying there for the space of thrée wéekes in great feare and hearing the first masse that euer you hearde the Fridaie after you were gon from your mother I must passe ouer as matter more to be mused at then to bee entreated of in this my discourse But this séemeth something straunge to me that your ghostlie father would absolue you before he had giuen you penance By like he was some vnskilfull penitancer or els you being yet but a Nouice in Popery haue vsed the Fygure Hysteron Proteron in making the report I perceiue that I my selfe was at your age a much more skilfull Papist then you bée and was much more able to defende Popery then you are or are like to bee In poprie Contrition and confession goe before satisfaction and both must be voluntarie full and vnfained and then the ghostly father the ghostly childe must agrée vpon penance For no Popishe ghostly father will or may enioyne his ghostlie childe any other or greater penance then himself will acknowledge y t he is centented to take and to do And this séemeth to me yet more strange that hauing confessed your sinnes and receiued absolution and penance béeing reconsiled on the Saterdaie you could be partaker of our Communion on the next daie in companie of your mother whose prayers as you haue said before are nothing worth because shée is not of that societie that you were by that ghostlie father receiued into Haue Papistes nowe such a priuiledge that they may simul●re dissimulare counterfait and dissemble at their pleasure Christ hath said thus Whosoeuer shall denie me before men I will deny him before my heauenlie father and before all his holie Angelles You haue not therefore taken vp your Crosse to followe Christ as you séeme to be perswaded that you haue doone but you haue dissembled with Christ and Christians that you might with lesse daunger of bodie ●●ippe from them and followe Antichrist If I might talke with you mouth to mouth I would desire to know of you what manner of sinnes they were that you confessed to that Prieste your ghostlie Father I suppose they were not the stubburnesses points of disobedience that you from time to time haue vsed in all your behauiour towards your father and mother and all other your Gouernors and betters Neither can I thinke that they were the subtill sleights that you haue vsed in deceiuing your father and mother me and your Godmother my wife others your Tutors freends and fellowes or the false lyes that you haue made and s●outlie faced out when due proofe of that which you had doone coulde not be made You know what I meane If you were present I woulde be more plaine and plentifull in spéeches then in writing I doo thinke if méete to bée To be briefe I
and founde them as he reporteth But when he shall awake out of hys dreame for as yet hee lyeth sno●ing and snorting in his déepe sléepe of wylfull ignorance then he shalbe that case that the poore begger was in which awaking out of hys sleepe sought after money but founde not one crosse of Coyne about him notwithstanding that in his sléepe he dreamed that he had more bagges of Golde then he was able to beare Hee vttered certayne spéeches amongst his companions whylst he was in my house before he tooke his iourney into Fraunce which wordes doo sauour of such a Dreame What wyll you say sayth this dreamer when you shall sée me preache at Paules Crosse And agayne I wyll sée Rome before I bee a yéere elder These spéeches agree with that desire that he had to creepe into the wéede of a Minime Fryer No man coulde diswade him from it By all likelihoode he had hearde that diuers Friers of S. Frauncis Order haue béene made Popes of Rome As Sabellicus the Hystorian noteth that before his time fiue Franciscane Fryers hadde beene made Popes Enneadis 9. Libro 6. And I knowe the courage of Fryer Iohn Frauncis to be such that though his personne be but little yet hys heade would holde vp the triple Crowne And although there haue béene many bloudy beasts that haue worne that crowne yet I thinke that amongst them all there hath not beene one more bloudy then thys little vermine woulde be if he myght once change his Minimes hoode for a triple Crowne But to returne to our matter He procéedeth with hys exhortation to hys Father and mother and thus he sayth The Fryar I haue hearde my mother say that in the olde tyme the people were more deuoute then nowe they be Nowe if so be that you be nowe gouerned by God and the Papists in olde time were gouerned by the deuill you must needes confesse that the deuill is better able to make men deuout then God is for because that by your owne confessyon the Papists were more deuout in the olde time then the Protestants are nowe Crowley Thys is a poynt of déepe Diuinity and of as cunning Sophistry Fryer Iohns Mother did once say so therefore of necessity it must needes be so But it may be that Fryers of your Order haue a Priuiledge whereby they may frame arguments that shall conclude neither in Mode nor in Figure and yet no man may denie either the argument or any part thereof I haue hearde it reported that once there was a Pope that would séeme to be a better Latinist then he was indéede and therfore he would nowe and then be talking a little Latine though hee did oftentimes reache Priscian a blowe But on a time there was one present that hearing him make default in not obseruing the Rules of Grammer in his spéeche thought good wyth due reuerence to admonish him saying It may please your holines to pardon my boldnes As I take it your holines hath broken Priscians heade The Pope answered and sayd As I haue spoken so shall it bée in despight of Priscian and all the Grammarians in the worlde Nowe if that holy Father or any other amongst your holy fathers of Rome haue graunted you as large a liberty in framing Arguments as that holy Father himselfe vsed in speaking Latine then you may maintayne your argument for good amongst Papistes but amongst Protestants it wyll neuer be allowed for good The meaning of your mothers wordes is as much as if shee should say thus The people were more addicted to Religion in the olde time then they be nowe but the Religion that then was in vre is a corrupted and vnpure Religion and the Religion that now is in vse is more sincere and pure The people therefore are more addicted to embrace a corrupted Religion then that which is more pure Thys argument hath some sence in it And this saying is according to that saying of our Sauiour Christ Iohn 3. Lyght is come into the worlde and men haue loued darknes more then light Nowe if you shoulde enforce these words against the Apostle and others that were the Schollers of Christ you shoulde doo them great wrong for they were not of that sorte of men that loued darknes more then light for they were chosen out of y e world and had theyr myndes renued and as they were renued they loued light and hated darknes that is ignoraunce and wickednes of lyfe which is the fruite of ignoraunce and darknes Euen so you doo open wrong to the Protestants in that you enforce your mothers spéeche agaynst them concluding that of necessity they must confesse that eyther they be gouerned by the deuill or els that the deuill is better able to worke deuotion in men the God himselfe is Thys conclusion followeth not vpon the Premisses For although men generally haue not so great deuotion to the true Religion that is nowe in vse as generally they had to that Religion that was in vse in the time of ignoraunce yet such as be now vnfayned Christians euen such as men of your sorte doo vse to call Protestants haue nowe as greate deuotion to the right Religion as euer the Papysts had to theyr vayne superstition or as you Master Fryer John haue nowe to that solery y t you haue nowe professed in Nigeon The ryght Protestant is the right Christian and hath receiued the spyrite of Christ as all that belong to Christ haue doone Rom. 8. and is gouerned and ledde by that spyrite which spirite worketh in him a feruent deuotion to serue God in spyrit in trueth that is in true holines and righteous●es The ryght Papyst is the ryght Antichristian and hath receiued the spirite of Antichrist and is gouerned and ledd● by that spyrite because he hath gyuen ouer himselfe to be ledde by that spyrite forsaking y e spirit of truth 2. Thes 2. I conclude therefore that your conclusion that you infer vpon those wordes that you haue hearde your mother speake concerning the deuotion of the people in the olde time is a fonde fryarlike conclusion and toucheth not vs any thing at all We know that our God is in heauen and that he can doo what hee wyll doo and hath doone what he woulde doo both in heauen in earth and in hell and in all deepe places As for the deuill we knowe hym to be but a sl●ue to our God And that of himselfe he hath no power at all For all power belongeth to God Psal 62 And we knowe that deuotion is a good gyft and therefore commeth from GOD who is the gyuer of all good gyfts and that no good gyft doth or can come from the deuill That therefore which you call deuotion and is wrought in you Papists by y e spyrit of Antichrist which is the deuill is no deuotion indeede but a méere superstition and a superstitious zeale to false Religion And thus much for aunswere to that matter You procéede and you say