Selected quad for the lemma: spirit_n
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A33252
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Truth with time, or, Certain reasons proving that none of the seven last plagues or vials are yet poured out neither will the time of their pouring out begin till after the rising of the two witnesses and the fourty months of the Beast's reign be expired : likewise an answer to the said reasons with a reply further the author hath here set down (in a brief exposition) his opinion of the first vial / by John Canne.
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Canne, John, d. 1667?
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1656
(1656)
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Wing C443A; ESTC R23893
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78,059
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119
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much in words as matter if well considered 4. In Chap. 16.4 the Angel poured out his Vial upon the waters and they became blood but Chap. 11. the Witnesses have power over the waters to turn them into blood It is not said they smote the waters or that the waters were turned into blood What may be gathered is one thing but the phrases are not alike 5. If the places are so alike in phrases why are they made so unlike in exposition The first Vial is applied to Waldo Wickliff Luther as smiting the Beast with their mouthes and pens the second and third to Souldiers and Armies and so killing men with their swords and guns Answ 3. Because the Egyptian plagues alluded to were begun by the two Witnesses Moses Aaron before the end of the Captivity or sojourning in Egypt and it is very evident this hath such an allusion Rev. 11.8 because the holy Ghost calls this fourty and two months Egypt also Repl. If the Egyptian plagues by Moses and Aaron the two Witnesses were all poured out before the end of the captivity then following the Allusion all the Vials should be poured out whilst the Witnesses are in sackcloth And to saythe truth to take it otherwise it destroys the life and light of the Argument For if the Vials begun before the rising of the Witnesses then must they be all poured out before the end of the fourty and two months as the ten plagues by the two Witnesses Moses and Aaron were before the end of their Captivity or sojourning in Egypt Thus you see by dividing the Vials as some to go before the rising and some after is contrary to the Allusion For if some were then were all but taking it that none were so there is in my opinion both reason and truth as to the Allusion viz. as Moses and Aaron the two risen Witnesses not in sackcloth neer or about the end of the four hundred and thirty years plagued the Egyptians so the forty and two months of the Beasts tyranny being going out the Spirit of life from God shall enter into his Witnesses for the pouring out of the last plagues upon the Beasts dominion Answ 4. For that the remnant I humbly conceive are to strike in and not to begin to succeed and follow not to direct and lead to execute not to prepare but your opinion makes 144000 or the remnant to begin and the two Witnesses to fall in with them which I see not Repl. Either you or I are here in some mistake both to the Remnant and Witnesses For 1. I do not take the Remnant as you do to be the one hundred fourty and four thousand but as I said before part of the womans seed which never fled into the wilderness against whom the dragon makes war Rev. 12.17 and this before the rising of the Witnesses and so in likelihood refers to the wars in France Holland Germany Britain c. 2. I take the one hundred fourty and four thousand and the risen Witnesses to be all one For as you said well it is a testimony or Witness not persons that is slain the which Testimony or Truth that is the glorious Cause and Interest of Christ riseth and lives again by a spirit of life from God entered into the one hundred fourty and four thousand Answ 5. For that all the hitherto-plagues upon the Beasts dominion do signifie nothing if they were not the matter of the Vials Repl. 1. The conclusion will not follow For whilst the Israelites were in Egypt no doubt the Lord plagued the Egyptians at several times yet they were none of the ten last plagues To come nearer when Abbeys and Monasteries were put down in Hen. 8. his Reign this was a plague upon the Beasts dominion and signified something So hath he been plagued in France Scotland Bohemia the Netherlands yet reckoned no Vials Besides what did the Goths Hunnes Vandals c. but pour out plagues upon the Beasts dominion 2. That they are said to be the last plagues it clearly shews that there were plagues upon the Beasts dominion before For the distinction between former and later must be understood of the Beasts dominion as the subject that is several plagues should be poured upon it before the seven last Plagues or Vials begin Answ 6. And lastly the subjects of the Vials Rev. 16.2 3 4 5 c. of the first the second and the third as the holy Ghost in Scripture opens them have been under the very same wrath mentioned in the first second and third Vials so that I am much perswaded that they are begun by a Scripture-clearness Repl. That which first gave me occasion to question the beginning of the Vials it was that I could not see neither the subjects nor the effects of the Vials as the holy Ghost opens them Rev. 16. under the same wrath as they are interpreted neither the first second nor third there being nothing yet done in my opinion that carries the character of VIAL-WORK upon it 1. That the earth should be taken for the grosser part of Popery where do we finde in Scripture a ground to raise such an Exposition 2. That the subject earth should be universal and yet in many places this gross earth never mov'd but to this day remains as much and as bad as ever 3. That Waldo Wickliff Armachan c. should be Vial-Angels a thing no way sutable to the description of the holy Ghost Rev. 15. So again for the second and third Vials I am not satisfied as they are applied First why the second to the Swedish war in Germany the third to ours in Britain Or 2. as others why the second to the Romish discipline or Hierarchy in England Anno Dom. 1641. the third to fall upon England the Low-Countries and France I do not see Scripture-clearness for these things Nor 3. do I understand what difference there is between the earth and sea as they are expounded for I think the Romish Hierarchy viz. Popes Cardinals Archbishops Bishops Monks Friers c. with all that rabble root and branch as gross earthly superstitions as their Mass their Crosses Purgatory Penance Pilgrimage c. And therefore to make a distinction between Romish doctrine and Romish discipline as two distinct subjects I am not of that opinion but as they rose together so they shall fall together inseparably under one and the same Vial. I confess in things to come as they are secret so we cannot well judge whether men hit or miss in their opinions till they come to pass But in things that are past and so visible here we can say a little more whether men speak pertinently and to purpose I thought to have forborn the Queries but not knowing how it might be taken I have set down the Answers to them A few words to your Queries To the first I answer The one of the living creatures for I like not the name of Beasts nor is it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉
frequent Rev. 4.5 8.5 belonging neither to one time nor signifying one thing Moreover for these lightnings thunders voices c. they belong to every Vial. Hence in Rev. 11.19 they are first mentioned as then beginning afterward Rev. 16.17 18 21. as the end signifying That all the time the Vials are pouring out these things will be as shewing thereby both the nature and effect of every Vial. Lastly If the 1000 yeers take their beginning as M. Till saith from the battel of Armageddon how should the Temple be opened at that time seeing John speaking of the blessed new Jerusalem-State saith and I saw no Temple therein Rev. 21.22 Answ 4. That is yet more amply expressed by the holy Ghost that the Vials are begun before the Temple is opened Rev. 11.19 because when the Witnesses arise the very same hour vers 13. is the earthquake that overthrows the tenth part of the Beasts dominion and seven thousand men are slain Now this must needs be a Vial or Plague but this is before the seventh Trumpet blows or the Temple he opened Repl. 1. How I take the order of things in Rev. 11. I shewed before But I much marvel why the Answerer should be so strict as not to admit some things to contemporize because they stand three or four verses distant one from another he knows it is usual with the Interpreters of this Book and himself doth it too to carry places back from Chap. 16. to Chap. 9. 10 11 12 c. Why then so often it must needs be as if that in v. 19. may not be joyned with the rising of the Witnesses and so the third Wo and sounding of the seventh trumpet fall in likewise with the same time 2. I am of your opinion that the earthquake in which the tenth part of the city fell is indeed a Vial and truly I think it is meant of the first Vial 1. Because it is presently upon the rising of the Witnesses and so no other seems to be between it and their rising 2. It is an earthquake or shaking of the earth that is earth is the subject of it the same with Rev. 16.2 Now howsoever I never finde the word earth to be taken for the grosser part of Popery yet often for worldly and earthly persons as Apostates Hypocrites men of corrupt minds who make gain their godliness and carry on a self-interest and base ends under a form of Religion Gen. 6.11 Zeph. 3.8 Mal. 4.6 Joh. 3.31 Rev. 12.16 1 Chron. 16.33 Psal 82.8 Isai 11.3 Rev. 13. and 14 15 19. This is that earth I verily think which Paul by the spirit of prophecie foretels This know also that in the last days perilous times shall come For men shall be lovers of their own selves covetous boasters proud blasphemers disobedient to parents unthankful unholy without natural affection truce-breakers false accusers incontinent fierce despisers of those that are good traytors heady high-minded lovers of pleasures more then lovers of God having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof 2 Tim. 3.1 2 3 4 5. There are two great Apostacies foretold in Scripture the first of things 1 Tim. 4.1 the later of persons Now this later I take to be the earth the subject of the first Vial viz. THE GRAND APOSTATES OF THE LAST TIMES And howsoever there be not in this subject of the first Vial as much sea rivers fountains of waters c as in the following Nevertheless what is wanting here in such particulars is made up in having the more earth For indeed it is nothing but earth an earthly and carnal interest 3. My opinion is where the Witnesses lie three days and a half unburied that place as earth shall be the subject of the first Vial. Now it is well observed by judicious Mede that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of the City which in Rev. 11.8 is translated street cannot be understood of a Market-place or any street or broader place within the walls of the city but without the city as no part of the great citie and he gives many Reasons for it So that it seems to me the place where the Witnesses lie slain being without the city and so no part of it cannot be meant of Germany Italy Spain France c. for these are either buildings or streets within the walls but this is without as bordering upon it being an inlet or thorow-fare whereby relief and provision is brought to the great Citie and a great helper and prop of the Beast's dominion 4. I cannot but take notice how it is said Rev. 11.13 The tenth part of the citie fell it is not said The great citie Now I do not finde in all that Book when the Beast's jurisdiction is mentioned by City but it is always 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that great citie which makes me think that the Tyranny and Idolatry of the Beast is not here so properly meant as that earth-State-apostacie mentioned before And in very deed the word GREAT here is not left out without cause as not worthy to have GREATNESS given to it Because 1. It will be illegitimate brought forth without law or conscience 2. It will have nothing of loveliness or beauty in it 3. Not desired but by a few temporizers and turn-coats such as were nam'd before 2 Tim. 3.2 3 4 5. 4. It will be scandalous to the whole world and cause that glorious and fearful Name Jehovah thy God everywhere to be blasphemed 5. It will be upheld by cruelty injustice arbitrary power c. 6. As it will have a sandy foundation so it shall soon fall and great will be the fall thereof 5. I think this earth-State-apostacie will be the subject of the first Vial because the Beast which ascendeth out of the bottomless pit and by whom the Testimony of Jesus in his servants is slain is that same Apostacie in 2 Tim. 3.1 2 c. and so not the Beast nor his image Rev. 13. but another distinct and more proper to the later Apostacy In the first Apostacy viz. under the Beast Rev. 13. the Faithful shall suffer in their Persons by burning hanging drowning c. but under the later Apostacy or Beast rather the WITNESS it self than the Persons for through the depths of Satan there shall be at this time such an eminent high and glorious WITNESS slain as the like before had not been from the rise of the first Beast Besides it seems to me that this Earth-State-Apostacy doth contemporize with the slaying of the Witnesses and their lying unburied 3 dayes and an half 1. Because that Apostacy is to be in the last days 2 Tim. 3.1 Now without doubt the last days are the 3 days and an half Rev. 11.8.11 for the Word of God doth not onely distinguish between times and times viz. as there is a set time to every purpose under heaven but shews that all Visions and Prophesies shall have their due accomplishment in their appointments Thus there is a time