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A09287 Rhemes against Rome: or, The remoouing of the gagg of the new Gospell, and rightly placing it in the mouthes of the Romists, by the Rhemists in their English translation of the Scriptures. Which counter-gagg is heere fitted by the industrious hand of Richard Bernard ... Bernard, Richard, 1568-1641. 1626 (1626) STC 1960; ESTC S101681 240,340 338

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Lo saith he how from those which he would haue esteemed the lesser he ascendeth to those whom he would haue esteemed the greater Answ 1. The mans wit went a grazing when he wrote this For if he so conclude from the order then Paul must be inferiour to Apollos when Paul was an Apostle and a Planter but Apollos no Apostle and onely a waterer 1. Cor. 3. 6. 2. In Mat. 10. 2. he would haue Peter the chiefe because hee was named first now here the chiefe because hee is named in a third place Saint Paul Gal. 2. 9. puts him in the second place betweene two and will not they hold him the chiefe for this too Doth not vertue consist in the midst for put him in the first place as in Mat. 10. in the third place as in 1. Cor. 3. 4 22. or in the second as in Gal. 2. 9. its with them a profound Reason to make him alwayes the chiefe for he may take what place he listeth Deepe Diuinitie and an inuincible Reason Though Saint Paul in Gal. 2. takes himselfe to be nothing inferiour to him or to other which seemed to bee Pillars and was inferiour to none of the great Apostles 1. Cor. 11. 5. 12. 11. vpon this Text Chrysostome shewes that S. Paul compared himselfe with the Apostles euen with Peter and the rest Luk. 22. 31. And the Lord said Simon c. When thou art conuerted strengthen thy Brethren Answ This place proueth not any Headship ouer the Apostles First hee is called Simon by his common name and not Peter which our Aduersaries stand vpon and make their chiefe argument Secondly this place is to forewarne him of his fearfull temptation and so of his fall thereby the vtter peril wherof he should escape not by himselfe or his owne power and grace but by Christs mediation What is this to haue a Headship Thirdly it teacheth him a duty when hee should be conuerted and be recouered from vnder the fall that hee should confirme others If by confirming the Gagger will hence conclude the practice and exercise of greatnesse ouer the Apostles then Saint Paul and Barnabas had this greatnesse too For they did confirme others Act. 14. 21. and Paul and Silas Act. 15. 41. 1. Thes 3. 2. yea it is a common Duty of euery Pastor Is euery one that confirmeth made thereby a Superiour in Rule and Gouernment Then a Priest confirming his Soueraigne is his Superiour And by this Saint Paul was Peters Superiour for he brought Peter backe from his by-path both by reproofe and publike teaching of the truth and so confirmed him who for feare did before goe astray Gal. 2. 11 17. Fourthly the Lord Iesus if they will here vnderstand the Apostles calleth them Simons Brethren and so giueth them equalitie Lastly where are the Gaggers expresse words for Peters Headship out of this place Is it in strengthening A poore strength to support such a Babylonish Tower Luk. 22. 26. He that is greatest among you let him be yonger and he that is Chiefe as he that doth serue Answ 1. The words in the beginning of this verse are against Chiefety for it is said It shall not be so with you when they were at strife for Superioritie Secondly the meaning of the Greatest and Chiefe on which the Gagger doth fasten his teeth doth not imply as hee pretendeth any Chiefety among them but Christ speaketh according to their aspiring minds not of them as any of them were but as some of them desired to be as is cleare by the speech and Petition of the Mother of Zebedees children Mat. 20. 20 27. Thirdly the occasion and the very scope of the place is against all Superioritie in the Apostles Fourthly it cannot be shewed that any of them all did either claime or practise any superioritie or taught in their writings any such thing Fiftly they did striue verse 24. for superioritie which of them should seeme the greater As yet therefore there was no such greatnesse settled among them 6. If any such thing had beene or had beene intended by Christ to be conferred vpon Peter he had vpon this iust occasion to haue decided the Controuersie as surely he would haue done in Peters behalfe in a matter of so great consequence as our Aduersaries make it as he did in the behalfe of Moses and Aaron to appease the contention against them Num. 16. 17. 10. But Christ telleth them all that no such thing should be among them in this text and giueth the rest authoritie to pull downe the spirit of him that would seeke to be Chiefe to make him as a Seruant as is euident in the words of the text Therefore here is nothing for any authoritie in Peter Nor indeed in any other Scripture XIX Proposition That S. Peter was Head of the Church THough the former Position ouerthrowne sufficiently confuteth this for if Peter be not Superiour ouer the Apostles who were the principall members of the Church he cannot be the Head of the Church yet seeing this Headship ouer the Church is so stiffely stood in I thought good to handle it also distinctly from the rest for more euidence of the truth to common Christians Confuted by their owne Bible I. By appropriation it giueth the title of Head of the Church onely to Christ Ephes 1. 22. 4. 15. 5. 23. Col. 1. 18. And no where doth it make a man the Head of the Church neither Peter nor any other either expressely or by any necessarie consequent II. It calleth the Church the bodie of Christ 1. Cor. 12. 27. Ephes 4. 12. 6. 23. No where is it called the body of S. Peter III. It telleth vs that Saint Peter himselfe giueth to Christ Headship Principalitie and Chieftie and to none other for he calleth him the Prince of Pastors 1. Pet. 5. 4. the Pastor and Bishop of our soules 1. Pet. 2. 25. as he is also called the high Priest of our confession Heb. 3. 1. IV. The Apostles did not know or acknowledge any such Primacy or Headship in Peter For first they sent Peter and Iohn to Samaria Act. 8. 14. which they neither would nor could haue done had he been their Gouernour and Head indeed Secondly Iames in the Councell at Ierusalem tooke no notice of Peters supremacy for Iames did then call him Simon his name before he was an Apostle without any title of preeminencie Acts 15. 14. Hee also said I iudge which word Peter there vsed not vers 19. to whose sentence and iudgement Peter and all the Apostles and Ancients did subscribe vers 22. Thirdly none of the other Apostles then did acknowledge any Headship in Peter for the Decree of the Councell went out vnder the conioynt authoritie of all without speciall mentioning of Peter Act. 15. 23. and 16. 4. Fourthly Saint Paul knew of no such Chieftie in Peter for first when he doth mention any word tending to set out any greatnesse in the Apostles hee applyeth it not singularly as to
praying to Angels answered 187. Saints pag. 189. Scriptures obiected 1. That Angels pray in particular for vs. p. 129. answered 2. That Saints departed know what is here done on earth p. 194. 3. That the Saints departed doe pray for vs particularly p. 179. 4. That we may pray to haue our petitions granted in fauour merits of the Saints departed p. 201. 26. That Confession commonly called Auricular or Sacramentall is of necessity p. 203. 27. That there is a place commonly called Purgatory into which soules after the dissolution of the body doe goe wherein as in a prison such as here haue not satisfied by temporall paine due for sinnes do make satisfaction in suffering hellish torment it is vncertaine how long p. 211. 28. That good workes do merit and are the cause of our saluation p. 231. Of free will and the strength thereof p. 245. 29. That mans will hath a naturall power in it selfe co-working with Gods grace in the very first instant act of a sinners Conuersion to which actiuity of the will such conuersion in part is to be attributed p. 247. 30. That some sinnes are in their owne nature veniall and doe not deserue eternall punishment p. 259. Of keeping Gods Commandements p. 269. 31. That a regenerate man by assistance of Gods grace is able to keepe all and euery Commandement of God in euery part at all times in thought word and deede perfectly as God in his Law requireth of him p. 270. Scriptures obiected for works of supererogation answered p. 279. Of Iustification by Faith only p. 284. 32. That a man is not iustified before God by faith onely p. 286. 33. That no true beleeuer particularly can in this life be certaine of his saluation without a miracle or extraordinary reuelation p. 293. That the faith of the Elect once had cannot be vtterly lost p. 310. Places of Scripture obiected that Iustifying faith once had may be lost a true beleeuer finally perish And therefore no certaine assurance of saluation The same places answered p. 317. CERTAINE POSITIONS CONCERNING THE RVLE OF FAITH as a Preface before the handling of the ensuing questions betweene vs and our Aduersaries the Papists I. Position There is one and but one onely rule of our Christian faith THis euen their owne Bible of Doway and Rhemes teacheth it doth not make mention of rules but speakes euer singularly as of one rule Rom. 12. 6. Gal. 6. 16. and of the same rule Phil. 3. 16. Seeing also that there is but one God one Lord one Spirit one body or Church one Faith one Hope one Baptisme Ephes 4. 4 5. 1. Cor. 12. 4 5 6. how can there be more then one Rule The ancient Fathers speake of no more then one as afterwards shall be shewed And reason may tell vs that a competent rule can be but only one to that whereof it is a rule the same also an entire and perfect rule and not partiall or a rule onely in part For if the rule be not one but two for one and the same thing then they must either agree and so are they but one entire or else they differ if so in any thing then cannot they be both rules for one and the same thing For then res regulata the thing ruled must differ from it selfe in being framed to the difference of the rules betweene themselues now the rules disagreeing what can accord them or what can they agreeingly measure when they are themselues at odds If any one say that the one may be a rule to the other then there should be a rule of a rule and so run in infinitum whereof there is no certain knowledge and so no sure rule for any thing If it be granted as needs it must that a rule is onely one and that there cannot be either two rules for one thing or a rule of a rule yet perhaps it will be said that one and the same rule may haue two parts whereof neither part is a perfit rule of it selfe but both together make a full rule But this cannot be For if it bee a rule in part then is it imperfect and needs a supply but an imperfit rule there is not be it neuer so short For suppose an inch or an halfe inch rule yet is it as true as full and as perfit a rule as truly measuring that to which it is laid as the rule of an ell long though it cannot measure so much at once Therefore say the learned that a rule is a ●av●●us Theo p●●lact in Phil. cap. 3. Phocius apud Occum●n in ● 〈◊〉 3. measure which doth not deceiue which admitteth neither of addition or detraction neither of putting to nor taking from For put any thing saith another to a rule or take from it the rule is corrupted and is denied indeed to be a rule As for the parts of the same rule if any such were these parts must agree in euery thing and if they doe so then is either part the other fully and so the one of them sufficient and the other superfluous or if they agree not how can they be one rule for the same thing which of them can giue the euen measure Neither of them indeede by reason of their disagreement The deuice therefore of a rule in part is absurd and vnreasonable A piece of a rule is not a rule and a rule if it be at all a rule must be one and the same euer infallible in it selfe which if the ignorant doe handle vntowardly the fault is in the men and not in the measure II. Position This one Rule of our faith is onely Gods Word 1. FOr by the Word of God commeth faith Rom. 10. 14. in that respect it is called the Word of faith which the Apostles preached Rom. 10. 8. Now without the Word of God no faith no pleasing of God Heb. 11. 6. and so no true Religion therefore must it needs be the ground and rule thereof and ●i 3. ca. 10. de Verbo Dei Bellarmine saith that the Word of God is the first foundation of our faith 2. We are commanded of God to doe as he commandeth Deut. 5. 32 33. and 12. 32. Numb 15. 39 40. Ezech. 20. 19. Iosh 1. 7. Prou. 4. 2. and that we may know how strictly we are tyed to this Word wee are charged not to adde to it Deut. 12. 32. and 28. 14. nor to take from it Deut. 4. 2. Iosh 1. 7 Reuel 22. 18. lest that God reprooue vs and we be found liers Prou. 3. 6. neither are we to turne aside from it either to the right hand or to the left Deut. 5. 32. and when at any time we are in danger of turning aside this must bee our director to preserue vs from erring Isai 30. 31. 3. God from heauen hath said of Iesus Christ his Sonne This is my beloued Sonne in whom I am well pleased heare him Matth. 17 5. binding vs to his Word which is
but he plainely expounded it afterwards vers 37. 43. and now it is written So that what at first was not vnderstood was after explained vnderstood and the same also written And therefore the Scripture is not obscure by this Parable but rather the more cleare because it is written and the interpretation thereof also Luk. 24. 45. Then he opened their vnderstandings that they might vnderstand the Scriptures Answ 1. This place is to be vnderstood of such things as concerned the Messiah touching Christ his suffering as afore in vers 25. 26. 2. This is nothing to the obscurity of the Scripture for the Scripture was cleare but their vnderstanding was not till hee opened it and what they then vnderstood not now euery ordinary Christian doth know and can finde it laid downe plainely in the Scriptures of the New Testament by the Apostles themselues Therefore if their ignorance at that time of those things may conclude obscurity of Scripture then the same after knowne of them and taught fully to vs in Scripture may make for the Scriptures clearenesse 3. We acknowledge that all need to haue their vnderstandings opened by Christ to read the Scriptures because the naturall man perceiues not the things of God but are spiritually discerned 1. Cor. 2. 14. But is the Sunne darke because God doth make a blind man to see it Yet thus our aduersaries reason The Scriptures are obscure because God opens mens vnderstanding to see the things therein deliuered 1. Cor. 12. 20. To another discerning of spirits to another kind of tongues to another interpretation of Languages Answ Here is not a word of the obscurity of holy Scriptures but of extraordinary gifts then by Gods Spirit bestowed vpon some for the Churches good to make the Scriptures easie Luk. 8. 10. To you it is giuen to know c. The answere to this is as to the place in Mat. 10. 11. but they alleadge moreouer Luk. 18. 34. And they vnderstood none of these things Answ 1. This place is not against the Word written For all those things then not vnderstood they after vnderstood and wrote them and wee plainely doe vnderstand them in Scriptures 2. This place speaketh of the Word deliuered by Christs mouth I hope they will not haue that Word obscute too what will then become of the Traditionall word which they so prattle of But the Gagger heapes vp any thing to make a shew though he speake at vnawares against themselues 3. Still here is of things and not of the Scriptures and of onely some things but not of all They cannot therefore conclude the generall that the Scriptures are obscure Luk. 2. 50. And they vnderstood not the Word hee spake vnto them Answ 1. The fault is laid vpon their vnderstanding 2. It is not of the Scripture but of a word then not written 3. Ioseph and Mary vnderstood not then that Word Ergo none now Is it not now written and doe not euery one now know that he spake of his heauenly Fathers businesse Belike if the blessed Virgin Mary were now vpon the earth the papists would not allow her to reade the Scriptures 2. Tim 3. 7. Alwaies learning and neuer attaining to the knowledge of truth Answ 1. Here is no Scripture mentioned 2. If they will haue this to be of their learning the Scriptures then this sheweth that women in those dayes meddled with Scriptures which the Papists now cannot abide to heare of 3. The fault is not laid vpon the truth but vpon those learners negligence or dulnesse 4. Consider what learners they were First silly women Secondly loaden with sinnes Thirdly led with diuers lusts Fourthly led captiue by false Teachers verse 6. It is no maruell that these could not come to the knowledge of the truth and because such could not attaine to it therefore is it hard to be attained to of all others This is an excellent Scripture to shew why the collapsing women and such Apostates as fall from vs now to them cannot attaine to the knowledge of the truth because indeede they are laden with sinnes led with diuers lusts and by false Teachers led captiue to their destruction because here they neuer had a true loue to the Truth 1. Ioh. 4. 6. Hee that knoweth God heareth vs he that is not of God heareth vs not in this we know the Spirit of Truth and the spirit of errour Answ What they can conclude hence touching the Scripture I see not The Spirit of Truth in man which teacheth him to know God teacheth him also to heare those which are sent of God and likewise where the spirit of error is and such as are not of God cannot listen and giue eare to such as are of God for the spirit of errour opposeth the true Teachers as Papists doe vs. Psal 119. 18 34. Open thou mine eyes c. and giue me vnderstanding c. Answ Wee teach that to come to knowledge all must pray to God to instruct them euen the best learned 2. Dauid that now prayed had a great deale of vnderstanding as he confesseth in vers 11. 54 97 98 99 100 104 105. therefore here he prayeth to be more and more acquainted with heauenly knowledge desiring the increase thereof for the godliest haue not al knowledge at once It is not the word of Scripture that Dauid desires vnderstanding in nor to haue his eyes open to see what the Words of Gods Lawes were but he would see the wonderous things thereof And trow wee when your infallible Doctour the Pope shall take vpon him to expound Scripture in Cathedra will hee not first pray to God to open his eyes and giue him vnderstanding Surely his eyes were not open that made this obiection 3. There is a litterall Historicall and outward knowledge of the holy Scriptures which Dauid was not ignorant of but there is also an internall a spirituall and heauenly vnderstanding thereof which God onely must open our eyes to see and this Dauid prayed for and these things so heauenly and spirituall he held to be maruailous and these prayed he to haue his eyes open to see also to increase in the vnderstanding of them IV. Proposition That the Scriptures doe not interpret themselues and that the true sense may not bee fetched out of themselues Confuted by their owne Bible 1. THeir Bble teacheth vs that the Scriptures are of God 2. Tim. 3. 16. that he himselfe wrote some Exod. 24. 4. Deut. 9. 10. Hos 8. 12. othersome his Prophets Exod. 24. 4. Deut. 31. 9 24. Esay 8. 1. and 30. 8. Ier. 29. 1. his Euangelists Luk. 1. 3. his Apostles 2. Cor. 10. 11. And these the Lords Scribes were so commanded to write Exod. 17. 14. and 34. 27. Deut. 27. 8. and 31. 9. Ier. 30. 2. Heb. 2. 2. Reu. 1. 11 19. The Scriptures therefore are called the Oracles of God Rom. 3. 3. Now thus then I reason All wise mens writings carry such a coherence and dependancie in them whether they
bee Wills Letters Histories or other learned speeches either of humane or diuine matters as the iudicious Readers may and doe collect the Authors true meaning out of them though the Authors themselues be not there to giue their owne meaning And shall wee thinke that the Writings and Scriptures of our God wherein is his Will his Lawes his Histories and other holy Instructions giuen of purpose to teach all in all ages to the worlds end will not afford vs the sense of them out of themselues especially if we doe consider him euer liuing and ayding his humble and godly Readers with his holy Spirit to vnderstand his minde To deny this to Gods Word were to make it herein inferiour to mens writings 2. Their owne Bible sheweth vs that the Scriptures do plainely interpret themselues expounding words Iud. 15. 17. Ramach lechi which is interpreted the lifting vp of the Iaw-bone Iud. 12. 6. Schibboleth which is interpreted an eare of corne So in Mat. 1. 23. Mark 5 4. Ioh. 1. 38 41 42. and 9. 7. Act. 4. 36. and 13. 8. Heb. 5. 4. Thus it expounds its owne words 3. Short sentences as Mark. 15. 34. Eloi Eloi Lamasabachtani which is being interpreted My God my God why hast thou forsaken me So in Dan. 5. 25 26 27. 4. Whole Speeches and Parables as Mat. 13. the Parable in vers 3. to the 9. is expounded in vers 18. to 23. so the Parable in vers 24. to 30. is expounded in vers 37. to 42. 5. Visions and Dreames Prophesies of things to come as in Gen. 40. 9 12 13. 16. 19. 41. 2 8. 25. 32. Ier. 24. 1 3. 5. 8. Dan. 4. 16. 27. so in the 8. Chapter and in other Prophets yea in the Reuelation the words and things in it are in many places interpreted verie plainely as in Chap. 1. 12 20. 17. 1 15. verse 3 9 10 18. and 4. 5. and 5. 6. and 19. 8. 6. Whole bookes For what is Deuteronomie but an explanation of Exodus and other places of Moses What are the Prophets but interpreters and appliers of Moses to the times places and persons What is the new Testament but a large and cleare Commentarie vpon the old In which was the Gospell Rom. 1. 2. and the mysterie kept secret in a manner but now made manifest by the Scriptures Rom. 16. 25 26. Lastly the Scripture euery where expounds it selfe either the See S. Austin de Verbo Dei ser 49. place considered by it selfe in the full circumstances thereof or by some other being conferred with it The places which might be produced for proofe are infinit Origin on Mat. chap. 13. concerning any necessarie point of controuersies in Christian Religion The Answers of our learned men to their obiected Scriptures against our Tenents may be instance for euidence of these things euen out of their owne Bible See these answers before and the rest following and consider thereof without partialitie Contraried by the Ancients Irenaeus lib. 4. aduers Haeres cap. 63. The most lawfull exposition of the Scriptures and without danger is that which is according to the Scriptures themselues In lib. 2. cap. 46. the Scripture expounds it selfe and suffereth none to erre Hillar lib. 1. de Trinit saith God is a sufficient witnesse for himselfe and who is not to be knowne but by himselfe and further he saith It is vnlawfull to impose a meaning but wee must rather receiue a meaning from holy Scriptures S. August de doct lib. 2. cap. 6. There is almost nothing in these obscurities but in other places one may find it most plainly deliuered And in Ser. 2. de Verb. Dom. he saith that the words of the Gospell carrie their exposition with them Basil Regul contract qu. 267. The things which are doubtfull and seeme to be spoken obscurely are made plaine by those things which are euident in other places Chrysost Hom. 13. in Gen. The holy Scripture expounds it selfe And in Hom. 9. 2. Cor. The Scripture euery where when it speaketh any thing obscurely interpreteth it selfe againe in another place Hieron Com. in Esa cap. 19. It is the manner of Scripture after things obscure to set downe things manifest Ambros in Psal 118. Ser. 8. If thou knocke at the gate of the Scriptures with the hand of thy mind thou shalt gather the reason of the sayings and the gate shall be opened vnto thee and that by none other but by the Word of God And the self-same saith Aug. lib. 2. contra Donatist cap. 6. What can be more fully spoken against this their false Tenent then here is vttered by these Fathers Gainesaid by the learned on their owne side Gerson tract contra assertiones Mag. Ioan. parui The sacred Scripture doth expound her rules by themselues according to the diuers passages of the Scripture Steuchius in Gen. 2. God was neuer so inhumane as to suffer the world in all ages to be tormented with the ignorance of the sense of the Scripture but if we consider it well we may interpret it and for this he citeth Theodoret who saith that the Scripture vseth when it teacheth any high matter to expound it selfe and not to suffer vs to runne into error Iansenius Episc Gandau on Mat. pag. 413. part 2. Christ hath taught to conferre Scripture with Scripture if we will not erre in reading of the Scriptures Acosta the Iesuite lib. 3. de Chro Reuel cap. 21. pag. 479. There is nothing seemeth to me so to open the Scripture as the Scripture it selfe Canus loc Theol. lib. 7. cap. 3. num 13. citeth out of Pope Clement Epist 5. ad discipulos Hier. these words You must not from without seeke a foraine and strange sense but out of the Scriptures themselues receiue the meaning of the truth What Scriptures our Aduersaries haue to obiect against vs and to defend this their falsitie by I find not in the Gagger 1. I know they babble much against a mans priuate spirit and a mans priuate interpretation which we also disallow but Gods Spirit is not any priuate spirit but the publike spirit and the same also in euery member of the Church 1. Cor. 12. neither is the Scriptures interpretation any priuate interpretation though shewed out of a priuate mans mouth according to that of Panormitan in cap. signif Extra de electis In things concerning faith the saying of one priuate man is to be preferred before the words of the Lord Pope if he bring better reasons out of the new and old Testament To which agreeth that of Gerson part 1. de examin doct More credit is to be giuen to a priuate simple man alledging the Gospell then either to the Pope or Councill 2 Also that they alledge how Moses did iudge causes the Priests also and the Leuites and that the people ought to learne of them But this is to be vnderstood as Moses spake from God and as the Priests and Leuites iudged and taught according to the Law
formall obiect of Faith and of infinit force and abilitie to perswade immediately by it selfe without the helpe of any formall inducement whatsoeuer Stapleton saith That all the former writings of the Bible may Defens Eccl. Autho. lib. 1. cap 9. Tripl incoat Aduers W●itak in admonit be assured to vs by the latter the old Testament by the new and the inward Testimonie of the Spirit is so effectual for the beleeuing of any point of faith that by it alone any part may be beleeued though the Church hold her peace and neuer be heard Note this saying well you Papists that perswade your selues that the Scripture is not Scripture to you but because the Church tels you so They haue no Scripture for defence of this their Position to S. N. Guide of Faith chap. 7. num 2. and 3. obiect against vs. Atheisticall obiections some haue made as if they would vphold the Turkish Alcoran vnworthy any Christian and no more worthy any answer then the blasphemie of Rabshekah 2. King 18 36. against which King Hezekias commandement was Answer him not a word Esa 36. 21. VIII Proposition That traditions which they call the vnwritten word are the Rule of Faith Confuted by their owne Bible I. IT hath beene proued before that the word deliuered by mouth both before and vnder the Law and after till the new Testament was written in all substantiall and necessarie points of faith is now either expresly set downe or by a necessarie conclusion comprehended in the Scriptures II. That therefore the Scriptures are the onely Rule of Faith which before also is fully proued III. Their owne Bible in many places diuers wayes doth condemne traditions 1. In calling them traditions of men Col. 2. 8. of Fathers 1. Pet. 1. 18. your traditions that is the traditions of Scribes and Pharises Mat. 15. 1 3. commandements and doctrine of men Mat. 15. 9. Rudiments of the world Col. 2. 8 20. not calling them the tradition doctrines and commandements of God or his Word or the word of his Prophets any where 2. In declaring to vs that the worship which is after such traditions is a vaine worship Mat. 15. 9. and but a shew of wisedome in superstition Col. 2. 23. and that the conuersation also which is after Fathers tradition is but vaine 1. Pet. 1. 18. So as we see traditions may not be either a Rule of worship or of conuersation of life 3. In setting downe the euils which haue come to the Church and true Religion of God by such traditions Their Bible telleth vs that for traditions the Commandements of God were left transgressed made frustrate and his Word defeated Mat. 15. 3. Mar. 7. 8 9 13. It was tradition by which the Scribes and Pharises had diminished the integritie of the Law taken from it added to it and corrupted the meaning thereof which Christ freed it from Mat. 5. 18 20 22 23 28 29 34 35. It was a pretended Apostolicall word which first greatly troubled the Church of Antioch and was the cause of gathering the Councell at Ierusalem to confute and condemne the same Act. 15. 1 2 5 6 23 24. The decrees thereof were written the Epistle sent abroad vers 30. 31. and so they had a written Word to strengthen them against that traditionall corrupt and counterfeit Word Lastly it was a pretended Apostolicall word which troubled the Thessalonians 2. Thess 2. 2. which by his Epistle and so by the written Word was confuted If I should adde out of Storie to this out of Scripture what euils haue hereby happened to the Church in and among Hereticks who vsed traditions to defend their Heresies in and Irenaeus l. 5. c. 66. l. c. 13. ●ert de praescript Epiphan de Haeres l. 1. c. 23. 24 38. among the Fathers misse-led and misleading others by false traditions whereby some of them became Chiliasts and now in and among the Papists who vnder the colour of traditions fill the world full of their inuentions superstitions and Idolatries I should be ouer-long and so proue tedious But let the desirous Reader peruse D. Whitakers De traditionibus 4. In teaching vs that the Apostle giueth the Church warning not to be deceiued by word by Philosophie by vaine fallacie according to mens traditions 2. Thess 2. 1 2 3. Col. 2. 8. Contraried by Antiquitie Iustine in Triphonem If we will be safe in all things we must flie to the Scriptures we must beleeue God onely and rest only vpon his institutions and not on mens traditions Irenaeus li. 3. ca. 13. saith of the Apostles that what they preached by mouth they left vs in writing to bee the pillar and ground-worke of our Faith Tertul. de praescrip It were a folly to thinke that the Apostles knew all things but reuealed the same to few deliuering some things openly to all reseruing some other things to be spoken in secret to some What can more plainely be deliuered contradictorie to Papists and to taxe them of folly and falshood in this point Theoph. Alexand. in 2. Paschali It is a diuelish spirit to thinke any thing diuine besides the Authoritie of the holy Scriptures Basil in serm de fide It is a manifest defection from the faith to bring in any thing that is not written When he vttered this did he dreame of a traditionall word Ierome in Hag. cap. 1. All traditions pretended to be Apostolike if they haue not their authoritie from the Scriptures are cut off by the Sword of God Nazianzen in Epimedio Athanasij calleth this vnwritten word An inuocation and opposite to written Pietie See further Tertul. Origen Hippolytus Athanasius Ambrose Basil Greg. Nissene Ierome Augustine Cyril of Alexan. S. Antonie and Theodoret cited by Bishop Vsher in his last booke in the Controuersie of traditions Gainesaid by some of themselues This is to be seene in the words of Gregory Gerson Petrus See question the first before de Aliaco Clemangis Durandus Picus-Mirandula Aquinas Ferus and other auouching the whole Scriptures to bee the Rule of faith Also of Antoninus Scotus Gerson Trithemius Villa-Vincentius Caictan Lyra and other who maintaine that the the Scriptures be perfect and sufficient euery way their words See question the second before are cyted before and so doe gainesay this traditionall word Obiections out of the Scriptures answered 2. Thes 2. 15. Stand fast and hold the traditions which ye haue beene taught whether by word or by our Epistle Answ This place though in shew at the first sight may seeme to helpe them yet considering well what they in the Question vnderstand by traditions it helpes them nothing at all 1. Traditions here are such as all the Thessalonians receiued and which the Apostles had taught to them all but traditions which the Papists maintain are certaine secret traditions deliuered not to all but to some sorts of men for the better guiding of the Church Therefore these traditions here are not those these being common to all
whom these words were spoken should teach and the people heare from them should be taken as Christ speaking in them but with condition as they should teach what he charged them to teach For the Apostles had their lesson giuen them to teach whatsoeuer Christ commanded them Mat. 28. 20. And these seuenty were taught what to doe and say Luk. 10. 3 12. which they obseruing Christ was heard in them So the meaning is Hee that heareth you deliuering my message and teaching what I command heareth me as if I were there in very person and he that shall despise you so discharging your duty despiseth mee and him that sent mee euen God himselfe as also Saint Paul speaketh 1. Thes 4. 8. For albeit the Apostles had an vn●rring Spirit assisting them in the Ministery Mat. 10. 20. Mar. 13. 11. Iohn 16. 13. of whom these words may bee taken absolutely yet of all other succeeding they are to be vnderstood with the former limitation Else why are we allowed yea charged not to beleeue euery spirit but to trie the spirits 1. Ioh. 4. 1. to trie all things 1. Thes 5 And why are the Bereans who not knowing Pauls Apostolicall function but taking him as a Teacher as other were commended as Bellarmine confesseth l. 1. de Verbo Dei for searching the Scriptures and left as an example for vs to follow Act. 17. 11. if the Teacher were to be credited in euery thing he should speake Mat. 16. 19. Whatsoeuer thou shalt binde in earth shall be bound in heauen c. Answ This is to be done by the Keyes which Christ gaue him as the words before going shew I will giue thee the keyes of the Kingdome of Heauen then followeth whatsoeuer thou shalt binde c. to wit by these keyes of Christ Not then by his owne power and will as himselfe pleaseth but as those keyes doe helpe him to open and shut to bind and loose by and with the authority of these keyes must hee proceede and not otherwise Now let vs see what these keyes be by which hee openeth and shutteth byndeth and looseth forgiueth and retaineth sins These Keyes are these two Christs Word and Christs Spirit Mat 18. 18. Ioh. 20. 23. which I thus proue 1. For that in this Text is a promise of giuing the keyes I will giue the keyes c. Now seeing that here they are not giuen but promised let vs see what Christ gaue to Peter and other the Apostles and we shall finde that he gaue them two things his Word which hee calleth the words of his Father and the Word of reconciliation which he put in them and they receiued Ioh. 17. 8. 2. Cor. 5. 19. and his Spirit Ioh. 20. 22. which they also receiued when he said Receiue ye the holy Ghost breathing on them These are the two things which we finde that he gaue them therefore they are either the keyes or inseparable companions of the keyes 2. Christ in Ioh. 20. 21. saith As my Father hath sent me so I also send you so in Chap. 17. 18. But with these two did his Father send him with his Word Ioh. 7. 16. and 8. 26 28 38. and with his Spirit Luk. 4. 18. Mat. 3. 16. Esay 11. 2. and 42. 1. and 61. 1 2. Therefore these two are the keyes Keyes are by Bellarmines interpretation here taken for great authoritie and power as in Esay 22. 22. in Eliakim shadowing the great power and authoritie in Christ Reuel 3. 7. exercised in his Church But what greater power and authority then his Word and Spirit can there be in Christ his Church whatsoeuer it be it is comprehended in these two Therefore these be the keyes 4. He speakes of keyes as of moe then one linked together so that they are giuen as inseparable and so these two be For the Spirit teacheth the Word of Christ Ioh. 16. 13. and 14. 26. and the Word is with the Spirit Esay 59. 21. these two keyes are tyed together and giuen by Christ 5. The keyes promised here are the keyes of the Kingdome of Heauen In this spirituall Kingdome by these to beare rule by these to bind and loose in earth is so verily and as surely done in heauen For what in this Kingdome here can beare Rule but his Word and his Spirit What truly can bind and loose in heauen but these We may be assured that what the Word and Spirit of God bindeth they are bound indeed and what these loose remit and forgiue they are loosed remitted and forgiuen of God in heauen of no other keyes can we be so assured hereof These then are the keyes here promised to Peter and were giuen to all the Apostles and to the true Church of God This place therefore helpeth nothing our Aduersaries who boast of an vnerring spirit leading the Pope and his Prelates into all truth if they bragge of this key let them shew vs the other the Word of God and the same written now in the Scriptures or else their boasting is in vaine and their binding and loosing of no force Deut. 17. 8. If there arise a matter c. Answ This place is for vs and against them for here iudgement must be giuen not as men thinke out of their own braine but saith the text according to their owne translation Thou See also Ezec. 44. 24. shalt doe whatsoeuer they that are Presidents of the place which our Lord shall choose shall say and teach thee according to his Law now that Law was written 2. Chro. 17. 9. This is it then we desire that the truth of iudgement may be from the written Word of God which this place approueth yet though they produce it and vrge it so often neuerthelesse it speakes not of the necessary points of faith but of controuersies in matters of another nature as the eighth verse plainely sheweth Hag. 2. 12. Thus saith the Lord of hostes Aske the Priests the Law Answ This place is also for vs and against themselues for what were the Priests to be asked what their owne opinion and iudgement No but they were to bee asked the Law that is the Law written and according to which they did answere in vers 13. 4. We teach that Pastors are to bee heard speaking to vs out of the Word written and accordingly as it teacheth them to speake wee must obey with all reuerence 2. Chro. 19. 8 18. Moreouer in Ierusalem did Iehosaphat set of the Leuites c. Answ It is one with that in Deut. 17. 8. and here contrary to the Popish practice the Priests and Leuites were subiect to Iehosaphat the King who had an inspection ouer them and gaue them a charge so 2. Chron. 17. 7 8. 2. Thes 2 15. Stand fast and hold the tradition c. This place is answered fully and at large before in handling the former question Mal. 2. 7. For the lips of the Priest shall keepe knowledge and the Law shall they require of his mouth Answ 1.
Mal. 2. 11. In the second of Machabees we may reade of horrible corruptions in the high Priests Iason got the office by money brought his Country-men to the Heathen rites the Priests were not occupied about the offices of the Altar but the Temple and Sacrifices were neglected 2. Machab. 4. 7 11 14. And when our Sauiour was come he found many sects false Teachers corrupting the truth Matth. 6. and 16. 6 12. and 23. 16 22. was by the outward pretending domineering Church then in Councell condemned and put to death To conclude of the chiefe Rulers in this Church the saying of Steuen that they were stiffe-necked and vncircumcised in heart and eares alwaies resisting the holy Ghost Act. 7. Who can reade these things and thinke yet that the Church cannot erre if withall they would consider how this Church of Israel had the most excellent meanes for direction and confirmation I. They had the written Word and ordinary Teachers the Priests and Leuites daily instructing them Deut. 33. 10. Acts 15. 21. II. They had extraordinary teaching 1. By God himselfe from Heauen Exod. 20. By Vrim and Thummim by Vision and Dreames 2. By Prophets Moses Samuel Eliah Elisha and very many moe 3. By Kings endued with a Propheticall Spirit as Dauid and Salomon 4. At length by Iesus Christ himselfe personally 5. By the twelue Apostles Mat. 10. 6. By the 70. disciples Luk. 10. 1. Neuer such nor so many in any Church since God had a Church III. They had Miracles and wonders in bringing them out of Egypt in the fearefull giuing of the Law in carrying them thorow the Woldernesse in planting them in Canaan and in strange Miracles wrought in Eliah and Elisha's time and in some of the Kings of Iudah Christ confirmed his doctrine and so did the Apostles and Disciples their teaching by Miracles Luk. 10. 17. No Church vnder the Heauen had euer the like IV. They had great mercies and vnheard of deliuerances from their Enemies from Pharaoh and his Host drowned in the Red Sea from the Amalekites discomfited by Moses prayer from the innumerable multitude of Enemies the Kings of Canaan of Midian Philistims Syrians Assyrians from the Host of Sennacherib nine score thousand slaine by an Angell in one night Kings thirtie two besides Benhadad with an infinite Hoste defeated by onely 7000. and odde Ionathan and his Armour-bearer did terrifie an whole Campe Gideon and three hundred men made an innumerable multitude to she away and with a few other of Ephraim did slay of them in one day one hundred and twenty thousand Asa vanquished the Army of the Ethiopians ten hundred thousand besides three hundred Charets Iehosaphat gathered the spoile of his enemies three Kings comming with their Hosts against him whom God set one against another to destroy vtterly one another for his safetie and enriching What shall I speake of Hostes flying for feare without any pursuing of them For other blessings and mercies they are not to be numbred V. They had strange and most terrible punishments vpon them to keep them in the feare of God to make them to know him and to walke in his waies fire from Heauen deuouring vp some the earth swallowing vp quicke other-some the giuing of them often into the hands of Heathen Kings to oppresse them that they might turne from Idolatry yea at length sent them all into captiuitie for 70. yeeres Thus we see for Teachers for Wonders and Miracles for Mercies and Iudgements none euer to be compared to them Papists may fame Legends to parallel these but these are truths hauing witnesse from Gods Word it selfe And yet this Church erred and as Esay saith chap. 48 4 8. was stubborne had a neck as an Iron sinew and her forehead as brasse and was a transgressour from the wombe If the Papists make little account of these reasons as nothing to keepe a Church from erring yet is it much more then their Romish Church can say for her selfe Let them say what they can for the Churches not erring and we will see whether this Church of Israel cannot say the same also Will they pleade 1. A Couenant Israel had so Deut. 29. 10 15. 2 Or a Couenant written in the heart So was it then Ier. 31. 33. Esay 5. 7. 3. Or a Couenant with their Priests So had the Priests then Ier. 33. 20. 4. Or that the Priests lips should preserue knowledge and the people learne of them and they teach the people So the verie same might Israel alledge Mal. 2 7. Deut. 33. 10. Neh. 8. 7 8 9. Leui. 10. 11. Ezech. 44 23. yea and did boast of Ier. 18. 18. 5. Or succession of persons from time to time in the same Chaire or Seate This could she plead to the full from Aaron the first appointed immediatly by God himselfe with his office place seruice ornaments and maintenance his next successor to be also named by God himselfe Num. 20. 28. 6. Or the Continuance of this Couenant to vphold succession This had it in plaine words and therefore was for euer the Priest-hood appointed to him and his seed Num. 25. 12 13. 7. Or the presence of God with them So could and did Israel M●ch 3. 11. 8. Or the name of the Church So they Ier. 7. 4. 9. Or that it is called holy the Ground and Pillar of truth So was Ierusalem the holy Citie Esay 48. 2. the Citie of truth the sanctified Mount Zach. 8. 3. 10. Or that the Word did go out from them to conuert other Nations So could they as they were taught by Esay Chap. 2. 3. of making Proselytes could the Pharises boast Mat. 23. 11. Or the Spirit to be in them to keepe their Teachers from erring Who could thus speake as Israel might Nehe. 9. 20. Esay 6. 3 11. Zach. 7. 12. as Peter witnesseth 2. Pet. 1. 21. 12. Or that they are called the Church and are come from the Apostles Church at Ierusalem So they by Stephen Act 7. 38. also saith Isaiah Esay 48. 1. Heare ye ô House of Iacob which art called by the name of Israel and are come out of the waters of Iudah So could the Scribes and Pharises boast of their Originall Ioh. 8. 33. 13. Or that they are Catholicks and the world spred ouer with them And could not the Iewish Church say so Of their Religion were some of euerie Nation vnder heauen Act. 2. 5 9 10 11. they were dispersed in all the Persian Monarchy Este● 3. 8. Chap. 1. there were many Proselytes made such was the Eunuch of Ethiopia and to make them they trauailed Sea and Land Mat. 23. 14. Or that they haue euer had the holy Scriptures in their custodie So to the Iewes were committed the Oracles of God Rom. 3. 2. 15. Or y● the Church now hath many excellent promises What more then Israel had to be their God they to him a peculiar treasure aboue all people a kingdome of Priests an holy Nation Exod. 19. 5 6. to
Bishops with the Councell at Chalcedon of 630. Bishops gaue to the See of Constantinople equall priuiledge with Rome But in these things say the Papists the Councels erred therefore in some things generall Councels may erre euen in that point which to the Papists is most fundamentall being the very soule and essence of Popery in that part which consisteth in vsurpation and tyrannous dominion ouer all other Churches The Scriptures obiected answered Esay 59. 21. This is my Couenant with them My Spirit that is vpon thee and my words which I haue put into thy mouth shall not depart out of thy mouth nor out of the mouth of thy seed nor out of the mouth of thy seedes seede saith the Lord from henceforth and for euer Answ 1. I answere that the Prophet speakes here of Gods Couenant with them that is with those that turne from transgression in Iacob and so of the faithfull and elect and not of the Church visible of which we speake II. Here is no promise that the Church shall not erre but that he will bestow on them which exercise the Ministery his Spirit and his Word continually for the Churches good III. If he will needs hence conclude that the Church cannot erre 1. He must proue that the Teachers doe euer teach the truth by Gods Spirit and by Gods Word which are to go together Ioh. 14. 26. and 16. 13. Mat. 18. 19 20. 2. That the hearers the members of the Church doe euer receiue beleeue and follow their Teachers thus teaching by the Word and holy Spirit which two things rest for him to make good ad Graecas Calendas IV. This promise made must needs be vnderstood conditionally of the visible Church and of an ordinary Ministery for Esay tells vs afterwords how they vexed Gods Spirit chap. 63. 10. We see how the Church of the Israelites and that at Ierusalem hath been cast off of God and hath now neither Word nor Spirit of God to direct it Christ found her Teachers in his time full of errors as they grieuously erred before 2. King 16. 11. 2. Chron. 36. 14 16. Esay 56. 10. Ier. 5. 1. Mal. 2. 8. And we know by experience in our times and by faithfull relation aforetimes that Teachers haue erred and people haue not euer embraced the truth when sound Teachers haue deliuered it let Christs hearers be instance for all and those in Iury which heard the Apostles V. If this were a good argument where Gods Spirit and his Word is there can be no errour then would it follow that no ordinary member of Christ should euer erre for such a one hath Gods Spirit 1. Ioh. 2. 20 27. Rom. 8. 9. 2. Cor. 1. 21. and his Word Deut. 33. 3. by which they become beleeuers Ioh. 17. 20. But this I hope a Papist will not grant and yet the argument is the same Ioh. 14. 16. I will pray the Father and he shall giue you another Comforter that he may abide with you for euer euen the Spirit of truth Answ 1. This place is primarily to be vnderstood of the Apostles to whom the promise of guiding into all truth was a speciall priuiledge Mat. 10. 20. Ioh. 14. 26. and 16. 13. 2. Of the succeeding Teachers but with no such speciall priuiledge for first there are no such promises made to them Secondly experience teacheth that they haue wanted this priuiledge Thirdly the hearers haue libertie to search and trie that which is deliuered if they doubt 1. Thes 5. 21. 1. Ioh. 4. 1. Ioh. 5. 39. Act. 17. 11. Waldensis one of their owne side saith Li. 2. ca. 19. de Doct. sid of particular Pastors and Bishops We know that these haue often erred 3. Neither the abiding of the Spirit for euer where it is nor the title of Spirit of truth will enforce euer an infallibility in teaching for it is called the Spirit of sanctification or holinesse Rom. 1. 4. for that he worketh in vs holinesse and is euer abiding in the godly who are the Temple of the holy Ghost and yet are they not so sanctified but they often offend in life So is it the Spirit of truth because it enlightneth the minds of men with onely that which is truth and guideth them in the truth if they follow their guide but if they doe not they may yea and doe erre from the truth Mat. 18. 17. If he neglect to heare the Church let him be to thee as an Heathen and a Publican Answ 1. This is meant of an euident case proued by witnesses before the Church in matters of offence betweene one priuate man and another wherein the Church may giue right sentence if she will yet we see such as meddle in the Churches censures doe not euer proceede aright This place therefore is not to the matter of doctrine and determination of faith the point in question neither doth it proue that in her censure the Church cannot erre for saith their owne Panormitan as before is cited A generall Councell representing the whole Church may erre in excommunicating him that should not be excommunicate These words speake not of the Churches either not erring or erring but of other hearing the Church and how they should carry themselues towards such as will not in so cleare a case heare the Churches admonition 3. It s not here commanded that he should be held as a Heathen and Publican that would not heare the Church in whatsoeuer she saith for Christ here speakes of the Iewish Church then as appeareth by the name Heathen and Publican which were abhorred of the Iewish Church Now that Church wee reade did excommunicate a blind man which receiued sight for his professing of Christ Ioh. 9. 34. and had agreed to put any man out of the Synagogue which should confesse Iesus to bee Christ v 22. and did also forbid to teach in his name Act. 4. 18. 4. This place is spoken of some Ecclesiasticall Gouernours if it be extended to vs hauing the power of censures in a particular Church which the Learned in their Church doe confesse may erre and therefore this helpes not to proue that the Church cannot erre Esay 35. 8. And a high way shall be there and away and it shall be called The way of holinesse the vncleane shall not passe ouer it but it shall be for those the way-faring men though fooles shall not erre therein Answ I. This verse is wholly allegoricall and therfore cannot so well be inforced for dogmaticall proofe without a full explanation of the words which the Gagger should haue done II. It is altogether against himselfe in the exposition if hee either durst or had been able to haue set it downe for by high-way may be vnderstood the common profession or points of Religion for good and bad as the high-way is for all then the way of holinesse is taken for a more strict profession or more straight Rules of Religion If so then consider the persons who they bee that shall not
Nationall or Prouinciall or Diocesan Synod much lesse a generall Councell but Church-officers or Gouernours in a particular Congregation to iudge of priuate offences as is cleare from the text verses 15 16 17 18 19. II. Will they say that the number of two or three assembled is of an vnerring spirit Is this such a Councell as on which men may rest assured that the iudgement thereof is infallible Neuer any yet durst affirme so much And yet this text speakes but of two or three gathered together III. Here is not a word of not erring nor of infallibilitie in doctrine but of Christ his presence with them But from this it followes not that they cannot erre For the Apostle saith We 1. Cor. 13. 9 10. know in part But with those which the Apostle comprehendeth vnder the word Wee was Christ present And if they knew but in part perfection of knowledge not being to be attained vnto here as the Apostle there teacheth seeing imperfect knowledge may erre it is euident that they might erre though Christ be present with them for he is with his Saints but he doth not perfectly sanctifie them his Spouse hath imperfections in this life neither doth hee perfectly illuminate them but they haue their mistakes Christ was with his before his death yet had they errors and before his Ascension yet he found them ignorant of his spirituall Kingdome Luk. 24. Act. 1. And after his Ascension and comming of the holy Ghost euen Peter was mistaken Act. 10. and other of the Church Act. 11. as before is proued IV. What is this text to proue Popish Councels not to erre For this Scripture speakes of such as are gathered in Christs name whereas those Councels are gathered in the Popes name Christ promiseth to bee with those that are gathered in his name but will it necessarily follow that hee will therefore bee with those that are gathered in the Popes name This stands in neede of proofe especially seeing the Pope is proued to be Antichrist with whom we may be sure Christ will keepe no company Ioh. 6. 13. The Spirit of truth will guide you into all truth Answ I. This is a promise vnto the Apostles whose prerogatiue in their Ministery was not to erre because they were the chiefe builders and planters of Christian Religion All other Ministers are but watere● II. It is one thing for a Guide to leade aright another for those that should follow to follow aright It therefore will not be necessarily concluded that because a perfect Guide leadeth the way such as come after cannot or doe not goe out of the way For they may not strictly follow the Guide but now and then may slip out of the way through want of eie-sight or dimnesse of sight or through carelesnesse looking some other way not minding the Guide 3. How can our Aduersaries proue that this promise is made to their Popish Councels which are ruled and * See the History of the Councell of Trent and Brocard on Reuel 17. who was at that Councell guided by their Popes and not by Gods Spirit Acts 15 25 28. This Councell erred not Ans 1. This was a Councell gathered of all the 12. Apostles of the Elders at Ierusalem and of the whole Church 2. This had the guiding of the holy Ghost as the text witnesseth 3. This laid the Scriptures for their ground vers 15. and the manifest euidence of the worke of the holy Ghost vers 8 which they tooke for direction in their decrees 4. Here was free libertie of disputation without interruption one attentiuely hearing another without by-respect that the truth might take place What is this to Popish Councels Are there any Apostles Admit they freely the whole Church Are they guided by the holy Ghost and by the verity of holy Scriptures Is libertie there granted to euery one to speake freely If they cannot proue these this text serues not their turne Other Scriptures are obiected as Mat. 16. 18. Luk. 10. 16. 1. Tim. 3. 15. All which are fully answered before As for the place in Heb. 13. 17. it is to be vnderstood not simply but that Teachers are to be obeyed as farre-forth as they doe teach the truth and command what God prescribeth XVI Proposition Whether the Church of Rome be the Catholike Church Confuted by their owne Bible I. IT is so farre from making it the Catholike Church as it no where doth giue it the name of a Church as it doth Corinth chap. 1. Gal. chap. 1. Ephesus Reu. 2. 1. Acts 20. 28. 1. Tim. 3. 15. and so other Churches But no where is this title giuen to Rome Note it well II. It telleth vs that the Faith of Saints at Rome was renowned in the whole World Rom. 1. 8. but not that their Church was spred into all the World Neither saith it that the Faith so commended came out from thence into the World or that it was any other then that which was then in all the World For Rom 1. 5 12 their Bible telleth vs that not from Rome but from Ierusalem it came both to Rome and into other places of the World Ierusalem was the Mother and Head Church and not Rome And of those in Rome it saith Among whom ye are called Rom. 1. 6. so were they not the Vniuersall Church but one particular among the rest which together made vp the whole Church III. Their Bible telleth vs that the Church at Ierusalem was planted by Christ and by his twelue Apostles with whom were the 70. Disciples such Teachers as no other Church euer had at once The Church of Antioch Corinth Ephesus and other moe were planted by the Apostles as we learne from their owne Bible But who first taught at Rome it shewes vs not not Peter I am sure IIII. Their Bible doth at least equall other Churches with it if not preferre them before it 1. In giuing the name of Church to other and not to it for there is mention of Saints at Rome but not of the Church at Rome The title they had not giuen to them 2. It plainely telleth vs that other Churches were first planted by the Apostles but mentioneth not the planting of it by any of them 3. In highly praising of other Churches as the Corinthians for being enriched with all vtterance and all knowledge for comming behind in no gift 1. Cor. 1. 5 7. and for being partakers of the sufferings of Christ 2. Cor. 1. 7. So the Ephesians which Church he calleth the Church of the liuing God the Pillar and ground of truth 1. Tim. 3. 15. and the beleeuers there to be fellow-Citizens with the Saints and of the houshold of God built vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets Iesus Christ himselfe being the chiefe Corner-stone in whom they wer builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit Eph. 2. 19 20 22. If our Romanists had any such testimony how would they boast Great commendations are giuen to
other concerning the Popes not erring and his Authority ouer Councels Not in authorizing the Latine Translation For Pope Sixtus 5. set out his Edition with his fullest power as not to bee amended yet comes Clement 8. with his corrected Edition in many hundred places afterwards Not in Decrees for Formosus his Decrees were disannulled by Stephanus and this Popes by another Not in affection as is euident by the so many and so long continued Schismes Onuphrius reckons vp aboue thirtie notorious schismes Not in life for though bad inough all of them after they became Popes especially from the time of Boniface yet some were Necromancers some Mortherers some Atheisticall contempers of the Gospell some bloudy Warriers how many of them filthy Fornicators and Adulterers it is not to be told III. Not betweene Pope and Councels for these haue deposed Popes As the Councell of Constance did Iohn the 22 that of Basil Eugenius the 4. that of Pisa Gregory 12 and Bennet the 13. IV. Not betweene Pope and his Cardinals For of them he hath put out the eyes of some and caused other to be thrattled and some of them haue opposed him in their Writings V. Not betweene the Pope and the learned in that Church such were beside many others Marsilius of Padua Dante 's Aleigerius Occham the Doctors of Paris the state and Diuines of Venice of late dayes in an opposition did not regard the Popes iudgement VI. Not betweene the parts of the Popes Lawes for the See Rainolds against Hart. pag. ● 33. Decrees and Decretals are often at odds VII Not betweene Councell and Councell for Constance and Basil were against Ferrara and Florence VIII Not betweene the Canonists and Glossaries for they iarre and are at difference one with another IX Not betweene the Schoolemen for among them are particular Sect-Masters whose Schollers are called after their names Thomists Scotists Albertists Occhamists opposing one another X. Not betweene the Friers for the Dominicans and Franciscans spent whole ages in Controuersies one holding one thing and another another opinion about the Conception of the Virgin Mary which bred other differences also XI Not betweene the Priests and the Iesuites let herein beare witnesse The Iesuits Catechisme The sparing Discourse and other bookes with all virulencie written one against another in the English tongue XII Not betweene the Learned of what sort soeuer for in their writings they crosse one another in many points of their Religion and namely in all those which maintaine the truth with vs against others of that Romish Faction as in many particulars is already before and afterwards shall be further shewed And farther for this let the Reader reade Pappus concerning the discord among Papists Doctor Hall Deane of Worcester his Booke called the Peace of Rome and Doctor White his Way pa. 154. 155. to 161. XIII Not betweene the Inquisitors for they differ in their iudgement about the purging of Bookes some allowing for orthodoxe that which other will not let passe for sound as may be seene in the Indices expurgatorij of Spaine Antwerpe and Rome varying one from another See for this Doctor Iames his Mysterie of the Indices expurgatorij pag. 15. XIV Not betweene the People for euen among them be differing opinions As Master Moulin in his Buckler of Faith sheweth from his owne experience pag. 279. and as wee may finde among Papists with vs when they are conferred withall apart one from another Gainsaid by their owne men From the Papists themselues may the discord of the Romish Church be noted from their owne Historians from such as haue written the Popes liues and from such as in their writings doe acknowledge the differences among them as Bellarmine himselfe doth confesse very many and so Nauarre For which reade Doctor Hals forenamed booke intituled The Peace of Rome in hundreds of differences Many Scriptures are alledged to proue that vnitie ought to be in the Church which we acknowledge and pray for But yet they proue not their Churches vnitie XVIII Proposition That Saint Peter was Prince of the Apostles and had a primacie of Power and Authoritie aboue all the other Apostles Confuted by their owne Bible 1. IT telleth vs how Iesus Christ reproued the contention which arose about their vaine conceit of Superioritie one aboue another This hee plainely condemned and as plainely told them that there should bee no such Superioritie among them as they did dreame of and therefore hee exhorted them to humilitie yea in such a sort as that hee keepeth him downe as the inferiour Minister and Seruant of the rest that would be greatest among them Mat. 20. 24 25 26 27. Mar. 10. 42 43 44. Luke 22. 24 25 26. 2. By their Bible wee are giuen to vnderstand that all the Apostles are euery way made equall in the like chusing and manner of calling Math. 4. 18. 21. In the like Commission giuen to all at once Mat. 28. 19 20. 10. 5. Mar. 16. the like power Mat. 10. 1. the same authoritie Ioh. 20. 21 23. the same benediction Luk. 24. 50 51. In breathing on them with one and the same breath his holy Spirit Ioh. 20. 22. In making them all Apostles in office the same and in title Luk. 6. 13. For the Apostles were the chiefest of all appointed in the Church Eph. 4. 11. 1. Cor. 12. 28. All therefore being Apostles they were equall for a higher dignity amongst them there was not They were all called foundations Reuel 21. 14. They were all installed into their Apostleship by one and the same meanes Act. 2 1 2 3 4. They were all ordained to one and the same end to bee with him to goe and preach Mar. 3. 14 15. 16. 15. to be witnesses of him to the vtmost parts of the Earth Act. 1. 8. and all of them at the length to sit and iudge the twelue Tribes of Israel Mat. 19. 28. The Lord made no difference among them If any had been it may seeme to haue been in Iohn 1. For he with his brother was Christs neerest kinsman 2. He was called the Disciple whom Christ loued 3. Hee and his Brother were called Boanerges Mar. 3. 17. sonnes of thunder 4. He was euer one with Christ as in his transfiguration Math. 17. 1. and in other places Mat. 26. 37. Mar. 5. 37. 5. Hee was the onely Disciple after whom Peter made enquirie what he should doe and of whom a saying went abroad that he should not dye 6. He was the onely Disciple that went boldly in with Christ and when he was in the High Priests house hee brought in Peter 7. He was the onely Disciple that stood by Christ when he was vpon the Crosse 8. He was the onely Apostle to whom Christ committed his Mother to take care of her 9. Hee was the onely Apostle which Christ would haue to call his Mother Mother and she to hold him as her sonne 10. He with Matthew was the onely Apostle that did write a Gospell
adding thereto three Epistles 11. He was the onely Apostle that was rapt in Spirit on the Lords day to receiue the Reuelation of Iesus Christ by an Angell foretelling the Churches estate to the worlds end 12. Lastly hee was of all the rest that liued the longest and alone after them all In these was hee farre beyond Peter He neuer denied his Master as Peter did Hee was neuer called Satan as Peter was Yet for all these excellencies in Iohn the Papists will not haue any Chiefty in him And surely if these eminencies wil not afford him the Headship among them it cannot be found in Peter who attained not to such excellencies Contraried by Antiquitie Cyprian de vnitat Eccles Verily the rest of the Apostles were the same that Peter was endued with equall fellowship both of honour and authoritie Ierome aduers Iouin lib. 1. All the Apostles receiued the Keyes of the Kingdome of Heauen and the strength of the Church was established equally vpon them all Origen on Math. 16. tract 1. saith of the Keyes that they were not giuen to Peter alone but to all alike and that which Christ said was spoken in common to them all Ambrose de incarnat cap. 4. saith that Peter receiued the Primacie of confession not of honour the primacie of Faith not of Degree Rabanus Maurus de institut Clericorum lib. 1. cap. 4. saith That the rest of the Apostles were fellowlike with Peter in Honour and Authoritie Gainesaid by some of their owne side Aquinas id opuse 20. calleth all the Apostles the Vicars of Christ Cusanus lib. 1. de concord Cathol cap. 13. Wee know that S. Peter hath not receiued more authoritie of Christ then the rest of the Apostles In the Masse they singing to Christ pray that he would keepe his flocke by the holy Apostles who are there called Vicars of his worke Gratian dist 21. in Nouo 24. 4. c. loquitur Nothing was said to Peter that was not said to the rest of the other Apostles who according to S. Ierome are all the Fundamentall stones of the Church Reuel 21. Leo first Bishop of Rome in Aniuers die assump suae ad Pontificatum Ser. 3. saith I giue thee the Keyes was a power transferred to all the Apostles Scriptures obiected answered Mat. 10. 20. Now the names of the twelue Apostles are these the first Simon who is called Peter c. Because he is first named therefore they will conclude a Headship ouer the rest Answ Here is no expresse word of Headship but in numbering the Twelue the first beginneth with Peter So he is onely first here in reckoning in order of numbring but not of commanding superioritie Saint Marke chap. 3. 16. Luke 6. 14. leaue out the word first in naming of the Apostles And Saint Paul in naming the Apostles with Peter giueth him not the first place Gal. 2. 9. He is first reckoned for that hee was first called by Christ Mat. 4. 18. Andrew knew Christ before him and Ioh. 1. 41 42. brought him to Christ but when Christ called them to follow him and to be his Disciples Peter is first in that place of Matthew For when Andrew brought him to Christ neither of them were as yet called by him to follow him for that was not till Iohn the Baptist was imprisoned Andrew was Iohns Disciple and his knowing of Christ was this by Iohns teaching Ioh. 1. 35 36 40. and he brought Peter to Christ vers 41 42. but Andrew abode with Christ but that day verse 39. neither did hee as yet leaue his Master Iohn but when Iohn was imprisoned both Andrew and Peter returned to their calling Mar. 1. 14 16. In which vocation Christ found them and then called them and the first of them was Simon Math. 4. 18. And hereupon being first named when he was called and the first called of all the Cyprian Ep 71. ad Quint. Greg. in Ezech. hom 18. are of this iudgement that Peter was first called Apostles by Mathews relation chap. 4. he is in the reckoning of the 12. first named by him in chap. 10. 21. and so by the other Euangelists For it is the Rhemists errour to say that Andrew was first called and a common mistake to yeeld them so much whereby they seeme to take more hold from this place and from the rest where Peter is first named then there is iust cause although the argument is of it selfe very weake as by the former Reasons is euident and as before hath beene proued For Reuben was first in the numbring but Iudah for all that was chiefe in gouernment Math. 16. 19. I will giue vnto thee the Keyes c. The Gagger will haue Peter chiefe for that he supposeth the Keyes were giuen to him onely Answ 1. The question which Christ propounded was to all the Apostles verse 13. 15. though Peter readiest euer to speake made the answer yet not onely for himselfe but for all the rest as appeareth in verse 20 where our Sauiour commandeth them all not Peter alone not to tell that he was Christ which sheweth that they all knowing it would haue professed as much if Peter had not preuented them Therefore his answer beeing for all Christs power giuen thereupon was generall to all Secondly the Keyes giuen are no such things as belong onely to Peter but are common to all See before an answer to this place Thirdly the words following in this Text Whatsoeuer thou shalt binde vpon earth c. containing the action or office of the Keyes belong to all Math. 18. 18. which power here was giuen not onely to Peter but also to the other Apostles by the Rhemists owne confession Fourthly Iesus Christ when hee breathed on them the Holy Ghost Ioh. 21. 22 23. which with one bredth he gaue to all saying As my Father sent me so I send you and gaue them all power of forgiuing and retaining of sinnes which is the power of the Keyes here spoken of Christ sent all his Apostles as his Father sent him Therefore Peter cannot haue more authoritie then the rest vnlesse they can proue that Peter was sent by Christ otherwise then Christ himselfe was sent by his Father Fiftly the words are a promise of giuing the Keyes and power to bind and loose to remit and retain sinnes afterwards and not the giuing of them now but this promise wee see was not performed to Peter alone but to all the Apostles Ioh. 20. 23. not then naming Peter and therefore this promise was made vnto all and so intended to be performed as the fulfilling sheweth Lastly the Fathers are of the same opinion with vs touching the meaning of this Text See before Origen Ambrose and the same on Psal 39. Austin in Iohan. tract 118. Theophylact on Mathew 16. Beda on this Text. 1. Cor. 3. 4 22. One saith I am of Paul I am of Apollos I am of Cephas I of Christ The Gagger here from the order would proue Peter chiefe next Christ
a Noune appellatiue and the other a proper name 3. The present alteration of the speech from Peters person to some other thing will not admit him to be the Rocke For it is not said as it in plainenesse of speech should be if indeed the Rocke had been Peter Thou art Peter and vpon thee will I build my Church but Thou art Peter and vpon this Rocke c. Where the Pronoune this hath Relation to some other thing then to Peter euen to his confession that Iesus was Christ the Sonne of the liuing God vpon which Rocke Christ would build his Church For no where the Scriptures thus vary in a Relatiue if the intendment of the speech be to one and the same person neither doe any thus vse to speake nor may wee thinke that Iesus Christ would haue thus doubtfully spoken if he had purposed to haue had Peter held to be the Rocke III. The words following I will build my Church remoueth Peter from being the Rocke First Church here is to be vnderstood the whole Church militant and Triumphant How can Peter be the Rocke on which it is built Could he be the Rocke of the Church Triumphant when he was here militant Or can he be the Rocke now of the Militant and he a Saint in Heauen Triumphant Or how the Rocke of both then and now as hee that is the Rocke must be For on the Rocke is the Church built not a part of it but the whole and not for a time but euen for euer For will all or any part of the Church once built vpon the Rocke bee remoued off from the Rocke Or will the Rocke cease to bee the bearer vp of the Church Then either is Peter now the Rocke or he neuer was the Rocke at all But how can he now be whose bodie is turned to dust Can his Soule be the Rocke As for a Rocke by succession it is but a fantasie Christ speakes of an euerlasting sustaining Rocke and but of one Rocke and not of one Rocke after another dying and decaying Secondly the Church and this Rocke are two things for Christ saith he will build his Church vpon this Rocke Now Peter was one in and of the Church here a principall member militant and now a Saint triumphant He must therefore bee one built with the Church vpon the Rocke he cannot therefore himselfe be the Rocke for so himselfe should be built vpon himselfe Thirdly Christ speakes of his Church and saith my Church Had he no Church but that which was built vpon Peter Had not he at this very time when he spake these words a Church Was Zachary and Elizabeth Iohn Baptist Ioseph and Mary Simeon and Annah the other Apostles the 70. Disciples and many others following him not of his Church If they were were they built on Peter Did they know Peter to be the Rock Or were they of the Church not built as yet vpon the Rock For as yet Peter was not the Rocke by Bellarmines confession Fourthly Christ here made himselfe a Builder I will build saith he my Church He built while he did liue by his Word and Spirit But did his Word and Spirit gather any to Peter Did his Word and Spirit build his followers vpon Peter Christ built his Church by his Apostles for they are said to build and Paul speaketh of himselfe as of a wise Master-builder 1. Cor. 3. 10. But vpon what did they build Euen vpon Christ alone 1. Cor. 3. 11. Ephes 2. 20. in whom all the building is knit together verse 21. They built not vpon Peter nor he on himselfe but vpon Christ 1. Pet. 2. 4 5 6. Did any of the Apostles preach Peter Paul saith he preached not men but God Gal. 1. 10. Or did Peter preach himselfe to be the Rocke If he was the Rocke why did they not preach him If they did not who can beleeue it Fiftly if Peter now was made the Rock and Head as Aquinas Turrecremata and many other Papists auerre though Bellarmine saith it was but here promised how came this Rocke by and by after in Mathew to be called Satan Mat. 16. 23 Is it like that Christ would call the Rock on which he will so firmely build his Church Satan Lastly if it were granted that Christ built his Church on Peter yet is it not spoken exclusiuely as on him alone secluding the rest of the Apostles for elsewhere he conioynes them with him Ioh. 23. 23. Ephes 20. 20. Reu. 21. 14. Mat. 28. 19. IV. These words and the gates of Hell shall not preuaile against it will ouerthrow Peters being the Rocke For this Rock beareth vp so powerfully the Church that Hell gates shall not preuaile against it Whence followeth that this Rocke must needs be stronger then Satans power and policies But what power can that be but the power of Christ and of God For who but God can resist Hell gates Therefore from all the words of this Text it is cleare that Peter cannot by it bee the Head of the Church nor the Rocke on which it is built and yet this place is one of the chiefest for his Headship The words in the next verse 19. I will giue thee the Keyes are answered before Ioh. 21. 15 17. Iesus said to Simon Peter Simon sonne of Ionas louest thou me more then these Feed my Lambes Answ 1. Here are no expresse words of Headship neither can any such thing be concluded out of this place by any well framed argument and yet this is the very principall place which they alledge to vphold it Secondly Christ here calleth him not Peter for that name is vttered by the Euangelist but onely Simon the sonne of Ionas as thereby preuenting the conceit of Headship which our Aduersaries dreame of from the name of Peter Which our Sauiour here mentioneth not nor the name Cephas because of his fearfull deniall of him so lately as now therefore vnworthy of that name Thirdly he is here questioned concerning his loue which he so much boasted of before Christs taking and soone after seemed to haue lost by forswearing Christ And three times hee is asked to remember him of his three times deniall of Christ it being now also the third time of Christs appearing to them verse 14. Also the question is with a comparison Louest thou me more then these What if hee meant it of the 153. great Fishes with the Ship Nets and other things therein for he leaped into the Sea hearing of Christ and cast off all respect to the ship and Fishes verse 7. till Christ willed them to bring of the fishes ver 10. 11. And therefore might Christ demand thereupon this question neither is any thing in the Text against this For Christ was by the fishes and the question was after dinner But conceiue it of the rest of the Apostles as it is commonly vnderstood for Peter had preferred his owne loue before all of them before Mat. 26. 33. Luk. 22. 23. Which here Christ by
the Church at Colosse Col. 1. 4 6. for their stedfast faith loue and fruit of the Gospell and for their order which the Apostle ioyed to behold cha 2. 5. What shal I speak of the praises of the 1. Thes 1. 3 6. 2. 13 14. 3. 6. 4. 10. 2. Thes 1. 3 4. 2. 13. Thessalonians for their worke of Faith growing exceedingly their labour of loue their patience of hope their abounding in charitie being followers of the Apostles and the Churches of God in Iury receiuing the Word of God as the Word of God in much tribulation with ioy of the holy Ghost To which prayses the beleeuers at Rome did not then attaine though they had their prayses and those great too Rom. 15. 14. but not comparable with those Churches Lastly in shewing how the Apostles honoured some other Churches by their writings As Corinth by two Epistles so Ephesus by one from Saint Paul by another from Saint Iohn Reuel 2. 1. who wrote to that Church in the first place the heauenly booke of the Reuelation in like sort were two written to the Thessalonians and but one to Rome 5. It is cleare by their own Bible that Peter whō they claime falsely for their first Pope wrote two Epistles which are called Catholike but neither of them was written to Rome as the Catholike Church neither maketh he any mention of it And S. Paul writeth to the Saints at Rome as to a particular company and not as any Head-Church before and aboue other The Thessalonians are commended for being followers of the Churches of God in Iudea but not for following those at Rome to whom when Saint Paul wrote hee saith Rom. 1. 6. that they were called among others that in other Nations were called but it is not said aboue other Nations 6. Their Bible telleth vs that S. Paul wrote his Epistle to them that were in Rome called Saints and beloued of God so that they were within that City or there-about but the Catholike Church was then dispersed for the Gospell at that time had gone into all the World and was preached to euery creature vnder Heauen Col. 1. 6 23. In their Bible is mention Acts 2. made of thirtie Kingdomes and Countries ten Ilands and almost three score famous Cities out of Iury in and amongst the Gentiles where the Gospell had been preached among whom Rome was but one and had obteined at the most praises common with other Churches Their titles were Saints Rom. 1. 7. beloued of God also brethren Rom. 10. 1. and 12. 1. and 15. 14 30. Their faith the same that was among all Nations Rom. 1. 5. called the common Faith vers 12. and therefore spoken of throughout the whole World vers 8. Their obedience was published to euery place Rom. 16. 19. Not for that their Faith and obedience did surpasse others for the words are deliuered barely your faith your obedience not with prayses as the Faith and obedience of the Colossians and Thessalonians accompanied with loue and aboundant charity with patience and ioy of the holy Ghost in great afflictions and so forth but for that Rome was the sease of the Empire and the publishing of their faith and obedience might bee a meanes to draw on others which dwelt in other places Contraried by Antiquitie We may reade that the chiefe of the Church of Rome was but at first a Bishop and his Church but a Drocesan Church Then hee became an Archbishop and so his Church but a Prouinciall Church After he got to be a Patriarch and so his Church but Patriarchall as some other were then equall with him as that of Antioch Alexandria Ierusalem and Constantinople All this time he was no Vniuersall Bishop till bloody Phocas gaue him that title and so his Church not Vniuersall till she also became the great whore and so might well be common the kings of the earth committing fornication with her as was foretold Reuel 17. It is said that Athanasius as Liberius confesseth was separated Epist ad Vrsac Valent. in Baron Annal. to 3. Ann. 357. n● 44. from the communion of the Church of Rome But may we iudge so holy a man and so valiant a Champion for the truth to be therefore separated from the Catholicke Church Polycrates and the Easterne Churches did not condiscend to the Church of Rome in the keeping of Easter did they therefore dissent from the Catholicke Church who was he in those dayes that had so much as a dreame thereof S. Ierome in Catal. Fortunat. reproueth the custome of the Church of Rome and Epist ad Euagr. he preferreth the custome of the Catholicke Church he held not Rome then the Catholicke Church but distinguisheth them asunder one from another The title of Catholicke was long before it came to be added to the Church and when it was vsed many Churches were so called The Romane Church then was not the Catholicke Church Gainesayd by some of their owne Aeneas Syluius who was Pope writeth That before the Epist 30 1. Councell of Nice small respect was had to the Church of Rome Now it cannot be imagined that all the time before the learned Fathers and holy Martyrs should be said to haue had small respect to the Catholicke Church the mother of euery particular Church because they had small respect to the Church of Rome If Aeneas Syluius saith true then was not Rome held the Catholike Church of those who so smally respected her Pighius lib. 6. ca. 3. de Eccl. Hierarch saith Who did euer yet by the Church of Rome vnderstand the Vniuersall Church He then at that time had not learned this point to hold the Church of Rome for the Catholicke Church Francisc Picus Theorem 13. saith The Church of Rome is a particular Church The obiected Scriptures answered Psal 2. 8. Aske of me and I will giue thee the heathen for thine inheritance c. Luk. 1 33 He shall reigne ouer the house of Iacob for euer and of his kingdome there shall be no end Answ Who is read in Scripture but knoweth these to be spoken of Christs Kingdome and not of the Popes iurisdiction Where is here Pope or Rome expressed But the Gagger proueth hereby the Church of Christ Catholicke which we acknowledge But saith he None of these promises haue beene so much verified as they haue beene in the Church of Rome and therefore is she onely the Catholicke Church In that he saith Not so much verified as of Rome he grants it to haue beene verified of other Churches though not so much he cannot therefore from a higher degree conclude that she is onely the Church whereof the promises are made The words are spoken of Christs Kingdom in plain termes expressed And is his Kingdome now become the Romish Iurisdiction onely His Kingdome after he assumed our nature began before the Church of Rome had a being And can any thinke that Dauid in the Psalme or the Angell speaking the words