Selected quad for the lemma: sin_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
sin_n	david_n	lord_n	nathan_n	4,238	5	12.7447	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A77726	An answer, or confutation of divers errors broached, and maintained by the seven churches of Anabaptists contained in those articles of their confession of faith propounded to the Parliament, and other grosse opinions held by them against the cleare light of the gospell. By Thomas Bakewell. Imprimatur John Downham.	Bakewell, Thomas, b. 1618 or 19.	1646 (1646)	Wing B526; Thomason E336_10; ESTC R200810	49,330	53

stand to their courtesie whether any will bee saved or not what miserable arguing is this Seventhly They say Christ dyed for all and yet all not saved because His Father made him Iudge of all John 5.27 28 29. I answer as before by this Argument he dyed for Devills and Angels that never sinned for he is the judge of all but if Christ shall slay those that will not have him to rule over them and cast unprofitable servants into utter darknesse Luke 19.22 27. and render vengeance on these that obey not the Gospel 1 Thes 1.7 8 9. Is this sufficient to prove that Christ hath bought them with his heart bloud when hee shall thus condemne nhem let all wise men judge But then they say if Christ should condemne these that he dyed not for in that he would be unjust I Answer as before If this were so then Christ were unjust to condemne the Devills or else they must prove that Christ dyed for Devills but men and Angels were all condemned for their sin against the Covenant of works and hee was not bound to send men a Saviour to redeem them and to establish those Angels that did not sin This may suffice to prove that Christ did not die for all and every man in the world CHAP. IV. They hold it unlawlull to use that Prayer of Christ Matthew 6.9 at a Prayer both by the godly and ungodly THey say the godly must not use this Prayer of Christ because the fift petition is forgive us our trespasses when as they are forgiven already and therefore ought not to pray for pardon of sin being pardoned already I Answer David a man after Gods own heart when Nathan the Prophet told him that the Lord had put away his sin yet he prayed the Lord to deliver him from bloud guiltinesse 2 Sam 12.13 Psal 51.14 and in his old age he prayed the Lord not to remember the sins of his youth and to pardon his iniquity for it is great Psal 25.7 11. And although the Lord will cleanse the house of Israel from all their uncleannesse yet for this he will be enquired of by them Ezek. 36.25 26 29 97. And they must take up words and say take away all our iniquity Hos 14.2 and the Apostles by Christ were taught daily to say forgive us our sins because we sin daily and our assurance is but for the time present and who knows how soone he may lose it and say with David and Jeremiah I am cut off Psal 31.22 Lam. 3.54 and with Iob Though thou holdest me for thine enemy and settest me as a mark for thine arrow Iob 7.20.13 24. But they say if any man lack assurance of Gods favour let him pray for it rather then for pardon of sin being done already I answer assurance of Gods favour is employed in that prayer for pardon of sin for it is sin onely that separates betweene us and our God Esay 59 2. and we should more desire the pardon of sin being an offence to God then our own comfort that comes by that pardon again the way to get assurance and to keepe it is by praying for the forgivenesse of sins for suppose we have at the present our comfortable assurance that all our sins past are forgiven yet we sin continually and every new sin is as a cloud betweene God and us and darkens our assurance of it now by this prayer we disperse and dispell these clouds which would soon deprive us of all our comfortable assurance of Gods favour therefore David prays to be clensed from all his secret sins although unknown Psal 19.12 for all sinnes will cause the Lord to hide his face from us more or lesse Esay 54.2 but they say Christ taught his Disciples to pray for pardon of sin before hee suffered because hee had then appeased the wrath of his Father yet afterward hee required no such thing but if Christ had not satisfied the wrath of God before he came in the flesh and suffered in it then I would know what became of all the Patriarks and Prophets that died before but I have often said that God made a Covenant with Christ from all Eternity to give him all the Elect as they fall in the severall ages of the World upon condition that he should give his life a ransome for them and so the Father set him a day and trusted the Son for the payment of it and gave him all the elect according to their Covenant that fell in those ages before the day of payment for the purchase and then in the fulnesse of time he paid for the purchase and now the Son trusts the Father to give him all the Elect that fall in those ages since the purchase was paid so then the death of Christ was vertuall to save those before his comming as well as those after for God was in Christ reconciling the World or multitude of the Elect in every age of the World from the first to the last to give them to Christ and so by vertue of the Covenant he was slaine from the foundation of the World Revel 13.8 Therefore it is said by Isaiah unto us a child is born Esay 6.9 And Abraham saw his day and was glad Joh. 8.58 And Christ was as pleasing to his Father before he came in the flesh as after for sayth he I was set up from everlasting then I was by him as one brought up with him and I was daily his delight Prov. 22.23 30. Therefore if Christ say in Jobs time I have found a ransome then he will deliver his soule from going into the pit and his life shall see the light Iob 33.24 28. so then in every age when the Father gave any to Christ his death did vertually satisfie for them they being in Christ by faith with whom the Covenant was made but they say before Christ suffered all power to forgive sins was in the Father and afterward given to him Mat. 28.18 And then and not before he got the keyes of hell and death Revel 1.18 I Answer Christ had power to forgive sin before he suffered Mat. 9.5 6. for he was King of his Church ever since that promise was made to Adam Gen. 3.15 and had the keyes of hell and death ever since although he never made it known to the world till then Rom. 16.25 and if that covenant had not been made before the covenant of works was broken by Adam all creatures had perished eternally but they say although Christ taught remission of sins after his death yet then he did not teach to pray for pardon of sinne I Answer that prayer which he had taught before was to remain to the worlds end for sayth he When you pray say forgive us our sins and to denie this were to renounce all those truths taught by him before his death and to confine our selves onely to what hee taught afterwards Again then the Doctrine of resurrection was most in question to be resolved on

praised Psal 40.16 this doth allow us to use the same words or the same for substance in other words so here the Lords prayer may be used as the same for substance and both ways his command is fulfilled but they stand much upon this word when you pray as if it were always to be used when we pray but they are mistaken for sayth Christ When thou makest a feast call not thy friends and when thou makest a feast call the poor and mamed Luke 12.12 13. But doth this tie us never to feast our friends and always to feast the poor and the maimed when the devill is cast out he saith I will return Luke 11.24 but when the devill was cast out did he likewise returne seven devils was cast out of Mary Magdelen and a legion of Devils out of another but did they return if not then this word when you pray doth extend it selfe to all our prayers but then they say if we be tyed to these words it will exclude inward desires to be prayers but I say again we are not always tyed to say those words although we may somtimes use them and yet we may pray acceptably without any words or voices at all as Moses and Hannah did Exod. 14.15 1 Sam. 1.13 7 They say that forme of prayer doth plainly and fully direct and restrain our ignorant and inordinate desires unto certain heads in which whatsoever is needfull and lawfull to be asked I answer although all things needfull to be asked be contained in the words of this prayer and thousands of petitions more may be derived from it by Gods people according to their severall occasions yet it will not follow that the words of this Prayer may not be used as a prayer Again to say the heads are so generall that no man can rightly apply them to his particular occasions itselfe for in generall respect and love to Gods name and Kingdom and will we may lawfully use these words in prayer although for the present our thoughts doe not settle upon that particular way and means by which his name may be sanctified and his will accomplished so the Angels wait with reverence and with a general respect to Gods wil before they have any particular special comand how to do it Mat. 18.10 Dan. 7.10 Psal 102.20 so Gods 〈…〉 a generall respect of our selves to bee forgiven and with a generall respect of temptations and afflictions to bee delivered from although for the present wee think of no particular sins or temptations if this were not so it were unlawful for Paul to pray at all when as hee knew nothing by himselfe yet sayth hee I am not hereby justified 2 Cor. 4.4 and David prayed to be clensed from secret sins Psal 19. and although those words be generall yet they may have relation to particular sins and temptations and to particular meanes to glorifie God but neither man nor Church can be in such condition as to reach all things needfull for all persons and all occasions as those heads comprehend I answer suppose no man nor churches case can reach unto all things comprehended in this prayer yet these words concerne every Christian then they may use it as a prayer and if we should reject this prayer because our condition cannot reach all things contained in it by this argument we may cast away all prayers blessings and salutations in the Scriptures for if we say Peace be unto you Luke 10.5 The Lord blesse you Ruth 2.4 Who can reach all things comprehended in these sentences for they contain the whole covenant of grace with all the fruits and benefits of it then we may use it as a prayer although wee cannot reach all things that are comprehended in it 8 They say if these words of Christ be used as a prayer as well may Ministers at the end of their Sermons and Magistrates at the end of their Instructions and Exhortations say over the ten Commandements because they doe fully comprise all duties I Answer our question onely about the lawfulnesse and not about the necessity of using it as a prayer we doe not say that Ministers are bound to say over the Lords Prayer at the end of every Sermon nor Magistrates at the end of every instruction or exhortation but suppose Ministers at the end of every Sermon should say over the ten Cmmandements as formerly they have done upon the Lords day before Catechising and that Magistrates at the end of solemne exhortations should repeat the ten Commandements this would rather bee a testimony of their obedience to Gods Laws rather then to be any transgression of it again there is no equality in this comparison for the Lord in his wisdom hath in his word taught us short forms of prayer for salutation in two or three words because we have every day many occasions to use them and so wee have of mutuall exhortations then what an absurd thing would it be to conclude every salutation and exhortation with the Lords Prayer and ten Commandements it may be a hundred times in a week yet this will not prove it to be unlawfull to begin or conclude a solemne exercise in a Church o● family with the Lords Prayer or ten Commandements 9 They say this Prayer of Christ is a most perfect forme wherein is no want or superfluity then if this be the meaning of Christ to say over those words in prayer to God then we ought only to use this and no other For say they if we do it is babling and presumption to put any other words in steed of this prayer that is so absolute perfect and sufficient and the Lord will be worshipped with the best we have and he is accursed that hath a male in his flocke and yet doth offer to the Lord a corrupt thing Malachie 1.14 I answer God doth not denounce that curse upon those that do not offer the best they have in sacrifice but against those that offered corrupt things contrary to the Law Levit. 1.3.10 But this chiefly crosteth Hypocrites who pretend that they love God when they doe not but for a man that had a Kow and two sheep Esay 7.22 He was not required to offer his Kow because she was the best that he had or if a man had ten sheep hee was not bound to offer the best of them onely the Law required it should be without blemish and then he might take the tenth as they passe under the rod Levit. 27.32 33. Then if this Text prove any thing to cast away all other Prayers but this of Christ then they must prove them all but this to be corrupt things like the torne and lame sacrifice for although this prayer of Christ be more excellent then any of ours yet this will not nullifie and make ours void no more then the excellency of one sacrifice will make void another that hath not the same degree of goodnesse in it yet this is beside our controversie for hitherto they have argued