this meanes it came to passe that Christ was free from all spot Concil Trid. Sess 5. Cap. 1. â—peccato originali And so herein they do altogether ouerthroâ— this Article of Christs conception by the Holy Ghost 〈◊〉 whose onely power the Scripture doth impute Christs holinesse and not the Virgin Marie which was no lesse then all others conceiued and borne in sinne did need Christ to be her Mediator as wel as the rest of mankind There was a long time a foule stirre in the Church of Rome betweene the Dominicans and the Franciscans about this point Acts and Monuments pa. 732. It was the common opinion of Fathers and Writers vntill Lumbards time which was about the yeere 1150. that she was conceiued in Original sinne Perkins 2. Vol. 596. In the fourth Article wee professe that Christ suffered c. by which he hath made a full and perfect satisfaction for the sinnes of his elect and for the whole punishment thereof both eternall and temporall The Papists teach that Christ hath satisfied for sinnes going before Baptisme but concerning sinnes following Baptisme the fault is remitted by the Passion of Christ and the punishment which of infinite is made finite is to be satisfied for by men themselues either heere or in Purgatorie that is men themselues must satisfie the iustice of God for the temporall punishment of their offences either on earth or in Purgatorie There is say they a certaine infernall place in the earth called Purgatory in the which as in a prison-house the soules which were not fully purged in this life are there clensed and purged by fire before they can be receiued into heauen Bell. de Purgat lib. 1. cap. 1. and cap. 3. lib. 2. cap. 6. Rhem. on 1. Cor. 3. Sect. 4. They say also that it is an Article of faith to beleeue that there is a Purgatorie and that he which beleeues it not is â—â—re to goe to hell Bellar. ibid. l. 1. c. 15. But this is so farre from â—eing an Article of faith as that it is a meere fable and conâ—rarie to an Article of faith The bloud of Christ is the Purâ—atory of our sinnes 1. Ioh. 1.7 Afflictions are called the fieâ— tryall 1. Pet. 1.7.4.12 whereby wee are clensed from our â—orruption as gold is froÌ„ the drosse by fire No other Purgaâ—â—rie is to be found in Scriptures The Scriptures mentioÌ„ but two sorts of men beleeuers and vnbeleeuers and but two places after this for them heauen for the one and hell for the other Luke 16.25 26. Iohn 3.36 Reuelation 20.14 15.21.7 8. They that dye in the Lord rest from their labours which cannot be true if any of them goe to Purgatorie Their workes follow them that is the reward of their workes Reuel 14.13 If any man should haue gone to Purgatorie then the thiefe vpon the Crosse had gone thither who repenting at his end wanted time to make satisfaction for the temporall punishment of his sinnes but Christ said to him To day shalt thou bee with me in Paradise The doctrine of Purgatorie came into the Church out of the Heathen writers for the Philosophers and Poets were the first that euer wrote of it and Popish Purgatorie was vnknowne to the Fathers many hundred yeeres after Christ Perkins 2. Vol 568.569 C. If Purgatorie be but a fable contrary to an Article of faith then what is the cause that the Church of Rome so stifty maintaines it M. There is great cause why they should so doe for it keepes in the fire in the Popes Kitchin for if the fire of Purgatorie were not great the fire in the Popes Kitchin would be but small for by this meanes they haue store of money for Pardons Masses Diriges and other such like trumperies DIALOGVE 5. C. Doe they teach any thing else contrary to the Creede M. Yes The sixth Article saith that Christ ascended into Heauen c. and the Scriptures say that the Heauens must containe him c. Acts. 1.11.3.21 They teach contrarie hereunto namely that Christ is corporally present in thâ— Sacrament and that in many places at once The which 〈◊〉 contrary to the nature of a true body and contrarie to thâ— nature of the Sacrament which is a remembrance 〈◊〉 Christ Virgilius against Eutyches lib. 4. saith thus When 〈◊〉 that is the flesh of Christ was on earth it was not in heâ—uen and because it is now in Heauen it is not on eartâ— This is the Catholike faith and confession It is an Artiâ— of faith to beleeue the Catholike Church and faith is the euidence of things not seene Heb. 11.1 Therefore the Catholike Church is alwaies vnto the world inuisible and not to be espied but by the eyes of faith because things seene are not beleeued The Papists teach that the Catholike Church is and hath bin alwaies visible Rhem. on Mat. 5. Sect. 3. The Church is said to be Catholike that is vniuersall because it is not tyed to any one speciall place but is spred abroad ouer the face of the earth They tye it to Rome alone which can be but a particular Church not vniuersall In the Church there is a Communion of Saints and these are they that are sanctified by the bloud and Spirit of Christ hauing the perfect holines of Christ put vpon them by imputation of faith and the quality of imperfect holines powred into their heart by the Spirit of sanctification And such are the Faithfull here on earth 1. Cor. 1.2 Psal 16.2 The Papists acknowledge none to bee Saints but such as are in heauen They teach that the Pope can canonize Saints whereas to make one a Saint is onely the worke of God 1. Cor. 11. The Pope hath canonized many that indeede were neuer true Saints of God but wicked men and ranke Traitours to their Princes as Becket with many others This canonizing of Saints was neuer heard of with the Fathers vntill the yeere 880. and then Adrian tooke vp this authoritie And Alexander the Third after him confirmed it in his decrees In the Creede we professe to beleeue the forgiuenesse of sinnes that is I beleeue that God for Christ his sake doth freely forgiue the sinnes of his Elect and my sinnes also And herein consisteth our iustification namely in the free forgiuenes of our sinnes and the imputation of Christs righteousnes to vs. The Papists teach many things contrary to this Article First that men are to make satisfaction for their sinnes Now satisfaction for sinnes and forgiuenes of sinnes are contraries If we satisfie in our own person wee are not iustified freely if we be iustified freely as most certainely we are Rom. 3.23 then we make no satisfaction at all If a man can satisfie and pay a debt then he needes no forgiuenesse but if the debt bee forgiuen him then it is plaine that there is no satisfaction made The satisfaction for our sinnes was made by Christ and not by vs. C. Did not the ancient Fathers teach men to make
Supper we offered our selues vnto God to be consecrated vnto him and serue him in body and soule C. What is then your opinion of the Popish Masse M. It is an abbridgement of all superstition and idolatry there is in it adoration directed to bread there is as they say the body of Christ offered really in a sacrifice of propitiation which was neuer offered but once with shedding of bloud There is adoration of stocks stones inuocation of dead men saying of Masses to the honour of Saints Angels worshipping of dead mens bones such like abominations C. If the Masse be such an idoll and so contrarie to Christs sacrifice whence had it then its first beginning M. The Masse had this originall First the Lords Supper was celebrated in most simple plaine manner Secondly it â—egan to admit some increase of ceremonies especially the offrings for the dead which was but a thanksgiuing for them vntill more then two hundred yeeres after Christ Thirdly prayers for the dead got entrance into the Lords Supper about the yeere foure hundred and then came in Purgatory and the redemption of soules from thence by Masses M. Perkins 2. Vol. 554. 1. D. Againe you are to know that the Masse is like a beggers cloake patcht vp with many pieces whereof some were put in at one time some at another One Pope puts in one patch another Pope puts in another and it was not fully patcht vp as now it is till twelue hundred yeeres after Christ Acts and Monuments pag. 1274. c. And in the Canon of the Masse there are to bee found a full halfe hundred of errours and blasphemies Synopsis Papismi the 13. generall controuersie quest 8. C. But how can the Masse bee so late and now seeing that the Fathers in their writings make mention of it M. The word Missa which is now called the Masse in the Fathers signifieth a publike meeting to the communion and to prayers or the solemne dismission of that meeting or euen the forme of their religious worship And the Phrase Missam facere vsed in some of the Fathers doth not signifie to say the Popish Masse but to dismisse some out of the assembly After the Sermon the Catechumenists that is such as learned the Catechisme and were not yet admitted to the Lords Supper are dismissed And hereupon the Communion was called Missa figuratiuely because when it began there was a dismission of some Perkins 2. Vol. 552. 2. D. 553. Synopsis Papismi the 13. generall Controuersie Quest 2. C. I am satisfied touching the Sacrifice of the Masse by which as I doe now plainely perceiue they doe euen deny the Priesthood and the onely sacrifice of Christ I pray you now to shew me wherein else they deny his Priesthood M. Christs Priesthood consisteth of two parts Satisfaction and Intercession As by his owne Sacrifice once offered he hath made a perfect satisfaction for our sinnes so he now continually maketh intercession to God for vs Rom. 8.34 Heb. 7.25 The Papists teach that the Saints in Heauen doâ— make intercession to God for particular men according to their seuerall wants and that hauing receiued particular mens prayers they present them vnto God And so herein they doe also deny the Office of Christs Priest hood Rhem. on Luke 16. Sect. 4. on 2. Cor. 1. Sect. 3. on 2. Pet. 1. Sect. 3. and in many other places C. They say that Christ indeed is the onely Mediator of Redemptions but the Saints are also Mediatours of Intercession M. This is but an idle distinction for Christ onely is the Mediatour as well of the one as the other For in a true and sufficient Mediatour there must be these properties first of all the Word of God must reueale and propound him vnto the Church Secondly he must be perfectly iust and such a one as in whom was no sinne euer found Thirdly hee must be a Propitiator that is bring some thing to God that may appease and satisfie his wrath iustice for our sinnes Now these three properties are not to be found in any creature but in Christ alone and therefore he is the onely Mediator of Intercession as well as of Redemption Perkins 1. Volume 603. 604. C. Do they teach any thing contrary to the Kingly office of Christ M. Yes they teach that the Pope is Christs Vicar head of the Church that hee can make Lawes to binde the Conscience that he can make new Articles and abolish the old that he can dispense with al the precepts both of the old and new Testament And so herein and in many other such like things they deny the Kingly Office of Christ C. It seemeth then to me by this which you haue said that though in words they confesse Christ yet in deed and in truth they deny him M. They doe so indeed for whosoeuer denyeth the office of Christ for the performance whereof he came in the flesh denyeth in effect Christ to be come in the flesh but the Papists deny his office therefore they deny him to be come in â—he flesh so they are no good Catholikes but rather Hereâ—ikes C. What should mooue the Church of Rome in words to acknowledge CHRIST and yet to deny his office M. It makes much for her profit and by this meanes they doe the more easily deceiue people That their profit and aduantage is the onely end they aime at appeareth by a most blasphemous speech of a Pope of Rome Leo the 10 who being somewhat moued against one of his Cardinals for alleadging a place against him out of the Gospell concerning Christ answered him thus Quantum nobis profuit ista fabula de Christo O what aduantage hath this fable of Christ brought vs Sleydan de statu Relig. c. Reip. lib. 1. They are herein much like to a Fowler who spreading his net to catch Larkes hath tyed to his net an artificiall Larke a Larke in shew but not indeede This hee causeth to moue and stirre the which the Larkes perceiuing and thinking it to be a Larke indeede they fall downe by him and so are caught in the net So they haue a Christ in their mouthes to draw people to them but it is a counterfeit Chirst Or if it be the true Christ yet they doe it but as the Larke-catcher doth who many times hath in his net a true and liuing Larke indeede but it is to deceiue the Larkes and the more easily to catch them in his net So they professe Christ haue his Word and Sacraments among them but it is onely to deceiue simple people and to make a prey of them DIALOGVE 4. C. Doe they teach any other thing contrary to any other article of the Creede M. Yes diuers things In the Article we professe to beleeue that Christ was conceiued by the Holy Ghost and so he and he onely was conceiued without originall sinneâ— They teach that the Virgin Mary was also conceiued withouâ— origin all sinne and that by
satisfaction for their sinnes M. The satisfaction which they maintained was an ecclesiasticall and publike mulct or penalty imposed vpon notorious offenders thereby to testifie their repentance and to satisfie the Church whom they had offended Perkins 1. V. 577 c 2 vol. 165. 2 D. 166. The efficient causâ— of our iustification is God alone It is God onely that forgiueth our sinnes Esa 43.25 Mar. 2.7 Ro. 8.33 They teach that the Pope can forgiue sinnes and we know that he giues pardons not only for the time past but also for the time to come yea they teach that priests haue right to remit sinnes and they alleadge these places to proue it Math. 16.19 Ioh. 20.23 Now we are to note this that as none can forgiue a debt but the party to whom the debt is due so none can forgiue sinnes but God onely against whom the sinne is committed Ps 51.4 The power of binding and loosing committed to the Apostles Ministers of the Word is by declaring the will and pleasure of GOD out of his Word both to pronounce forgiuenes of sinnes to all that are truely penitent and the retayning of them to the impenitent The Pope and his Clergie are neuer able to proue themselues to bee the true Ministers of Christ and they cannot so much as challenge this latter authoritie and power to themselues much lesse the former which is proper to God onely The motiue or impulsiue cause which moued God to iustifie vs was not any thing in vs but onely the grace of God that is the free good will and pleasure of God Rom. 3.24 Eph. 2.8 Tit. 3.5 7. They teach that wee are not iustified by grace onely but by workes also that is by the merit of our works And to this end they haue of late yeeres deuised a first second Iustification The first is when a sinner of an euill man is made a good man and this they say commeth onely of Gods mercy by the merit of Christ The second is when one of a good or iust man is made better and more iust and this proceedeth from workes But we are to know that there are not two kinds of iustification a first and second but one and the same iustification considered in different respects In respect of Gods actuall acceptation of a mans person iustification is absolute but in respect of the actuall application and manifestation of Gods acceptation vnto a mans conscience iustification is by parts and degrees M. Scudder on the Lords Prayer pag. 303. to 309. And further we are to note that the Papists second iustification is no other then sanctification which is an effect fruit of iustification the which is imperfect not able to iustifie vs before God The materiall cause of our iustification is the actiue and passiue righteousnesse and obedience of Iesus Christ his inherent holinesse his fulfilling of the Law his death sacrifice and full satisfaction The formall cause or the forme of iustification is the righteousnesse of Christ imputed of God vnto vs Rom. 5.19 Rom. 4 5 6 7 8. 1. Cor. 1.30 2. Cor. 5.19 21. Phil. 3.9 The Papists deride this doctrine that Men are iustified by the imputation of the righteousnesse of Christ which righteousnesse is not in vs but in Christ The Rhemists call it a new no-iustice a phantasticall apprehension of that which is not Rhem. on Ro. 3. Sect 7. They hold them accursed that so affirme and teach And they teach that the onely formall cause of our iustificaâ—ion is the iustice of God whereby wee are not reputed and â—ccounted iust but are made iust indeed and this iustice is â—hat which euery man hath within himselfe and is inherent â—n him Concil Trid. Sess 6. can 10 11. Rhem. on Phil. cha 3. Sect. 3. â—he instrumentall cause of iustification on our part is a true â—nd liuely faith whereby wee receiue and apply vnto our selues the mercy of God Christ Iesus and all his benefits resting vpon him alone for saluation They teach that faith doth not iustifie as an instrument in apprehending the righteousnesse of Christ but as a proper and true cause it actually iustifieth by the dignity worthinesse and meritorious worke thereof Bellar. l. 1. de iustificat cap. 17. They teach also that faith is not the onely cause of our iustification but that there are other also as hope charity almes-deeds and other vertues yea they say that workes are more principall then faith in the matter of iustification and pronounce him accursed that shall say a man is iustified onely by faith Rhem. on Rom. 8. Sect. 6. and on Iâ—m 2. Sect. 7. Bellar. l. 1 de iustif c. 13. Concil Trid. Sess 6 Can. 9. These and other such like things they teach contrary to the doctrine of iustification which is a maine ground of Religion And if there were no more points of difference betweene vs these were sufficient to keepe vs from vniting of our Religions for heereby the Church of Rome doth raze the very foundation C. You said before that we are iustified freely I would know how this can be if we be iustified by the righteousnes and for the merit of Christ M. Because the Decree of God the Father for our Redemption is free and we pay nothing againe to God of our owne And therefore by the word freely our merits are excluded but not Christs By which it appeareth that in respect of our selues we are iustified freely of Gods meere mercy and grace without any respect of our owne righteousneâ— or worthinesse but yet through Christ and for his righteouâ—nesse and obedience imputed to vs both which are signifieâ— by the Apostle Rom. 3.23 24. C. Shew me I pray you what is meant by Merit what the dectâ—â— of the Papists is concerning merit and whether that our workes be mâ—â—â—orious or no. M. By Merit wee vnderstand any thing or any workeâ— whereby Gods fauour and life euerlasting is procured 〈◊〉 that for the dignitie and excellency of the worke or thiâ— done Now the true merit whereby wee looke to attaine the fauour of God and life euerlasting is to be found in the person of Christ alone in whom God is well pleased The Papists make two kindes of merit the merit of the person and the merit of the worke The merit of the person is as they say a dignitie in the person whereby it is worthy of life euerlasting The merit of the worke is a dignitie or excellency in the worke whereby it is made fit and inabled to deserue life euerlasting for the doer of the worke See Rhem. on Rom. 8. Sect. 5. We now doe renounce our owne personall merits and all merit of our owne workes and rely onely vpon the merits of Christ and we hold that no workes of ours can merit That no man by any workes of his can merit may bee proued by the properties and conditions that must bee in a worke meritorious and they are fiue First the worke must be absolutely perfect