humâ—_n have_v be_v leave_v out_o see_v both_o epiphanius_n and_o the_o council_n of_o eliberis_n in_o spain_n &_o diverse_a other_o father_n have_v condemn_v image_n before_o but_o why_o have_v not_o o._n e._n cite_v the_o place_n out_o of_o epiphanius_n &_o those_o other_o father_n which_o condemn_v paintinge_v of_o image_n that_o we_o may_v have_v read_v they_o 170._o the_o b._n of_o eureux_fw-fr do_v cyte_a both_o in_o the_o conference_n itself_o and_o in_o his_o refutation_n of_o plessis_n discourse_n many_o ancient_a father_n express_v word_n both_o before_o and_o after_o this_o law_n be_v make_v of_o theodosius_n and_o valenâ—inian_n name_v here_o again_o ignorant_o by_o o._n e._n as_o the_o law_n of_o theodosius_n and_o valens_n to_o wit_n the_o authoritye_n of_o eusebius_n chrysostome_n hierome_n cyrill_n prudentius_n paulinus_n s._n gregory_n nissen_n s._n gregory_n nazianzen_n and_o other_o all_o allowinge_v the_o pious_a use_n of_o image_n in_o their_o day_n yea_o and_o a_o other_o express_a law_n of_o the_o same_o emperor_n theodosius_n and_o valentinian_n 10._o be_v also_o of_o he_o allege_v command_v the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n to_o be_v put_v in_o church_n &_o how_o chance_v it_o that_o the_o minister_n here_o also_o pull_v down_o his_o hat_n over_o his_o eye_n and_o will_v not_o see_v nor_o answer_v any_o one_o of_o these_o authoritye_n you_o may_v easy_o gheasse_v the_o reason_n and_o as_o for_o the_o council_n of_o eliberis_n in_o spain_n it_o be_v a_o provincial_a council_n of_o 19_o bishop_n only_o about_o the_o year_n 305._o they_o prohibit_v nothing_o but_o that_o image_n shall_v not_o be_v paint_v in_o those_o day_n upon_o wall_n both_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o indecency_n &_o corruption_n that_o come_v thereby_o unto_o they_o aâ—â—â—â—red_v by_o the_o moisture_n of_o the_o say_a wall_n somewhat_o contemptible_a to_o the_o pagan_n and_o heretic_n yet_o live_v among_o they_o as_o also_o to_o the_o end_n that_o be_v paint_v in_o table_n rather_o than_o upon_o the_o say_a wall_n christian_n may_v carry_v they_o away_o as_o they_o do_v other_o ecclesiastical_a ornament_n when_o persecution_n fall_v out_o and_o not_o leave_v they_o to_o the_o spoil_n and_o derision_n of_o the_o persecutor_n and_o this_o reason_n be_v gather_v out_o of_o the_o word_n of_o the_o constitution_n itself_o confirm_v by_o the_o practice_n both_o of_o that_o tâ—me_n &_o after_o and_o so_o much_o of_o this_o place_n o._n e._n have_v borrow_v this_o objection_n of_o the_o council_n of_o eliberis_n out_o of_o plessis_n reply_n in_o his_o discourse_n upon_o the_o place_n though_o in_o the_o conference_n he_o come_v out_o with_o it_o 55._o and_o have_v his_o full_a answer_n upon_o the_o 9_o place_n out_o of_o theodorete_n which_o o._n e._n here_o dissemble_v and_o reply_v no_o one_o word_n as_o have_v be_v say_v to_o this_o or_o to_o any_o of_o the_o authoritye_n allege_v there_o by_o the_o bishop_n for_o the_o ancient_a use_n and_o honour_n of_o image_n the_o eight_o place_n out_o of_o s._n bernard_n first_o it_o be_v to_o be_v note_v that_o this_o 8._o passage_n be_v by_o error_n of_o the_o aforesaid_a french_a write_v copy_n send_v from_o paris_n place_v in_o the_o 9_o room_n by_o he_o that_o set_v forth_o the_o say_a passage_n be_v restore_v here_o by_o we_o again_o unto_o his_o proper_a place_n accord_v to_o the_o act_n of_o the_o conference_n and_o plessis_n reply_n which_o o._n e._n also_o follow_v without_o mencioninge_v the_o error_n which_o be_v a_o argument_n that_o he_o have_v read_v all_o and_o so_o much_o great_a be_v his_o shame_n that_o he_o come_v so_o bare_a &_o weak_a to_o play_v the_o advocate_n after_o much_o better_a matter_n utter_v before_o by_o plessis_n himself_o who_o be_v accuse_v upon_o this_o place_n as_o before_o you_o have_v see_v for_o tyinge_v together_o fraudulent_o two_o different_a place_n of_o s._n bernard_n as_o make_v against_o the_o honour_n of_o our_o bless_a lady_n and_o persidious_o leave_v out_o in_o the_o midst_n that_o clause_n of_o the_o father_n â—3_n which_o be_v in_o the_o text_n annex_v to_o the_o former_a of_o the_o two_o sentence_n make_v all_o clear_a if_o it_o have_v be_v leave_v in_o and_o overthrow_v the_o whole_a drift_n of_o plessis_n cavil_n the_o clause_n be_v magnify_v the_o inventrix_fw-la of_o grace_n 174._o the_o mediatrix_fw-la of_o salvation_n and_o the_o restorer_n of_o the_o world_n upon_o which_o deceytfull_a deal_n after_o many_o corner_n seek_v in_o vain_a to_o run_v out_o and_o escape_n plessis_n have_v sentence_n against_o he_o but_o let_v we_o see_v what_o relief_n the_o new_a attorney_n bring_v as_o if_o it_o be_v necessary_a say_v he_o where_o diverse_a place_n be_v allege_v out_o of_o one_o author_n 16._o to_o write_v out_o all_o that_o come_v betwixt_o one_o &_o the_o other_o lo_o a_o quick_a dispatch_n of_o the_o matter_n but_o i_o will_v ask_v o._n e._n a_o case_n of_o conscience_n as_o professinge_v also_o divinity_n which_o be_v this_o if_o when_o that_o which_o go_v between_o contain_v the_o very_a substance_n &_o soul_n of_o the_o matter_n or_o controversy_n as_o here_o it_o do_v whether_o in_o such_o a_o case_n it_o be_v lawful_a to_o leave_v it_o out_o or_o no_o or_o whether_o this_o be_v proper_o falsehood_n and_o falsification_n for_o if_o it_o be_v not_o than_o we_o may_v pervert_v the_o pater_fw-la noster_fw-la or_o any_o prayer_n or_o piece_n of_o scripture_n and_o make_v it_o seem_v blasphemous_a and_o let_v the_o reader_n mark_v that_o o._n e._n have_v no_o evasion_n here_o but_o most_o absure_v yet_o let_v we_o hear_v he_o further_o for_o plessis_n excuse_n he_o allege_v bernard_n say_v he_o not_o as_o a_o authentical_a witness_n ibid._n but_o as_o a_o man_n favouringe_v his_o adverse_a party_n be_v nourish_v in_o monastical_a error_n and_o superstition_n well_o sir_n and_o for_o that_o s._n bernard_n do_v not_o favour_v he_o in_o religion_n as_o no_o saint_n ever_o do_v be_v it_o therefore_o lawful_a to_o falsify_v and_o corrupt_v his_o word_n and_o sense_n we_o know_v well_o that_o both_o you_o and_o he_o do_v allege_v the_o word_n of_o s._n bernard_n and_o other_o catholic_a writer_n as_o the_o devil_n do_v scripture_n which_o bind_v not_o he_o but_o other_o against_o who_o he_o allege_v they_o author_n and_o so_o plessis_n allege_v scotus_n and_o durandus_fw-la before_o but_o as_o the_o proverb_n be_v a_o man_n shall_v not_o bely_v the_o devil_n and_o no_o less_o falsehood_n and_o corruption_n of_o mind_n be_v discover_v in_o falsifyinge_v author_n who_o they_o credit_n not_o as_o other_o who_o they_o credit_v wherefore_o let_v we_o hear_v his_o conclusion_n upon_o this_o place_n he_o say_v that_o s._n bernard_n and_o we_o do_v not_o agree_v about_o honour_n to_o be_v give_v to_o our_o lady_n as_o in_o the_o feast_n of_o her_o conception_n in_o call_n her_o mediatricem_fw-la salutis_fw-la and_o that_o both_o he_o and_o epiphanius_n write_v against_o the_o heretic_n call_v collyridian_n do_v much_o mislike_v the_o honour_n which_o we_o give_v to_o the_o bless_a virgin_n all_o which_o be_v toy_n &_o answer_v before_o in_o the_o examen_fw-la of_o this_o place_n for_o so_o much_o as_o concern_v s._n bernard_n agreement_n and_o we_o but_o for_o the_o foolish_a woman_n call_v collyridian_n condemn_v by_o epiphanius_n and_o by_o the_o whole_a church_n for_o offer_v sacrifice_n to_o our_o lady_n this_o caviller_n have_v be_v answer_v 22._o so_o often_o to_o wit_n that_o it_o appertain_v nothing_o to_o our_o controversy_n and_o this_o in_o diverse_a book_n now_o out_o against_o he_o as_o only_o lack_v of_o judgement_n &_o matter_n as_o it_o seem_v have_v induce_v he_o to_o object_v it_o here_o again_o he_o have_v be_v foil_v therein_o and_o make_v to_o see_v that_o epiphanius_n express_o in_o that_o place_n honour_v highe_o our_o el._n lady_n and_o deny_v only_o divine_a honour_n unto_o she_o and_o not_o that_o which_o the_o catholic_a church_n do_v give_v unto_o she_o the_o 9_o and_o last_o place_n out_o of_o theodorete_n the_o charge_n of_o falsify_v lay_v to_o plessis_n upon_o this_o passage_n of_o theodorete_n 90._o be_v that_o he_o cite_v a_o place_n of_o this_o author_n in_o his_o commentary_n upon_o the_o psalm_n 113._o against_o pagan_a idol_n plessis_n do_v fraudulent_o so_o allege_v the_o same_o as_o if_o he_o have_v speak_v it_o of_o christian_a image_n for_o which_o purpose_n he_o use_v two_o sleight_n the_o first_o in_o translate_n the_o greek_a word_n idol_n by_o the_o latyn_n word_n image_n the_o second_o by_o cut_v of_o these_o word_n idol_n adore_v by_o pagan_n and_o adore_v for_o god_n for_o excuse_n of_o which_o two_o faâ—sifications_n when_o plessis_n have_v use_v diverse_a shift_n as_o well_o by_o some_o show_n of_o proof_n that_o idol_n and_o image_n may_v
which_o be_v a_o most_o absurd_a imposture_n for_o so_o he_o may_v say_v also_o that_o they_o doubt_v whether_o god_n be_v god_n or_o whether_o god_n can_v create_v any_o thing_n for_o that_o they_o put_v this_o question_n 2._o utrum_fw-la sit_fw-la possibile_fw-la deum_fw-la aliquid_fw-la creare_fw-la whether_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o god_n to_o create_v any_o thing_n of_o nothing_o and_o present_o it_o ensue_v by_o way_n of_o objection_n videtur_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la it_o seem_v that_o it_o can_v be_v but_o after_o all_o argument_n end_v they_o resolve_v that_o it_o be_v so_o to_o wit_n that_o there_o be_v a_o god_n and_o can_v create_v thing_n of_o nothing_o and_o do_v solve_v all_o the_o argument_n allege_v by_o themselves_o to_o the_o contrary_n and_o so_o do_v scotus_n in_o this_o matter_n set_v down_o his_o full_a determination_n in_o these_o word_n dicâ—_n quod_fw-la corpus_fw-la christi_fw-la esse_fw-la ibi_fw-la verè_fw-la realiter_fw-la 1._o est_fw-la simpliciter_fw-la de_fw-fr substantia_fw-la fidei_fw-la i_o do_v say_v that_o it_o be_v simple_o a_o substantial_a article_n of_o our_o faith_n to_o believe_v that_o christ_n body_n be_v true_o &_o real_o there_o under_o these_o accident_n and_o he_o prove_v the_o same_o by_o two_o place_n of_o scripture_n to_o wit_n math._n 26._o where_o christ_n say_v this_o be_v my_o body_n and_o john_n 6._o where_o he_o say_v my_o flesh_n be_v true_o food_n this_o then_o be_v the_o first_o imposture_n which_o plessis_n be_v prove_v to_o have_v use_v in_o alleadginge_v scotus_n against_o his_o own_o meaning_n discourse_n and_o resolution_n the_o second_o be_v for_o that_o he_o say_v that_o scotus_n argument_n against_o the_o real_a presence_n be_v the_o quantity_n locality_n and_o circumscription_n annex_v to_o a_o true_a body_n whereas_o these_o be_v not_o argument_n of_o scotus_n but_o of_o heretic_n refute_v by_o scotus_n as_o appear_v by_o himself_o in_o the_o same_o place_n where_o he_o add_v also_o these_o word_n if_o heretic_n will_v expound_v the_o foresaid_a word_n of_o christ_n ibid._n this_o be_v my_o body_n to_o be_v understand_v figurative_o it_o be_v quite_o against_o the_o intention_n of_o our_o saviour_n these_o 2._o corruption_n then_o be_v so_o manifest_o lay_v forth_o out_o of_o this_o first_o place_n of_o scotus_n and_o show_v that_o they_o can_v not_o be_v of_o ignorance_n but_o of_o wilful_a malice_n to_o deceive_v the_o reader_n imposture_n plessis_n be_v sore_o press_v but_o yet_o have_v divise_v a_o certain_a way_n of_o some_o kind_n of_o escape_n if_o it_o may_v be_v call_v a_o escape_n and_o not_o rather_o a_o great_a entanglement_n which_o be_v to_o say_v that_o he_o affirm_v not_o simple_o that_o scotus_n doubt_v of_o the_o real_a presence_n but_o rather_o of_o the_o manner_n of_o christ_n body_n be_v there_o to_o wit_n by_o transubstantiation_n and_o for_o that_o respect_n he_o name_v the_o council_n of_o lateran_v in_o his_o speech_n which_o council_n first_o of_o all_o have_v determine_v the_o say_a article_n of_o transubstantiation_n but_o the_o bishop_n show_v this_o to_o be_v a_o very_a sleight_n evasion_n 1._o for_o that_o the_o council_n of_o lateran_n determine_v as_o well_o the_o article_n of_o the_o real_a presence_n as_o of_o transubstantiation_n as_o appear_v in_o the_o say_a council_n and_o that_o scotus_n be_v as_o resolute_a in_o the_o one_o as_o in_o the_o other_o and_o final_o that_o plessis_n word_n before_o recite_v be_v plain_a enough_o without_o a_o commentary_n that_o scotus_n dare_v to_o call_v into_o question_n whether_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n be_v real_o in_o the_o sacrament_n or_o no_o under_o the_o â—ormes_n of_o bread_n &_o wine_n yea_o &_o to_o dispute_v that_o it_o be_v not_o which_o word_n do_v speak_v plain_o as_o you_o see_v of_o the_o reality_n so_o as_o these_o shift_n be_v but_o a_o new_a abuse_n of_o the_o reader_n and_o as_o for_o the_o place_n he_o will_v seem_v to_o allege_v out_o of_o scotus_n as_o somewhat_o soundinge_a against_o transubstantiation_n it_o be_v tell_v he_o first_o that_o it_o be_v from_o the_o purpose_n for_o so_o much_o as_o his_o citation_n of_o scotus_n be_v against_o the_o real_a presence_n and_o second_o that_o these_o other_o place_n make_v no_o more_o for_o he_o than_o the_o former_a but_o whole_o against_o he_o and_o so_o it_o be_v prove_v by_o read_n and_o examininge_v public_o the_o say_a place_n wherein_o there_o be_v a_o hour_n spend_v and_o the_o bishop_n perceavinge_v that_o plessis_n desire_v to_o draw_v out_o the_o time_n urge_v the_o deputye_n to_o give_v sentence_n upon_o the_o falsisication_n of_o the_o place_n allege_v which_o they_o differ_v to_o do_v until_o the_o next_o place_n of_o durand_n be_v examine_v for_o that_o they_o understand_v the_o case_n be_v in_o a_o manner_n all_o one_o or_o much_o like_a in_o both_o schoolman_n and_o so_o it_o be_v in_o deed_n plessis_n for_o that_o in_o both_o of_o they_o you_o shall_v hear_v the_o sentence_n give_v afterward_o that_o plessis_n have_v take_v the_o objection_n for_o the_o resolution_n which_o be_v a_o great_a a_o disgrace_n 52._o if_o you_o mark_v it_o as_o can_v be_v to_o such_o a_o man_n that_o presume_v to_o understand_v what_o he_o read_v the_o second_o place_n examine_v out_o of_o durandus_fw-la about_o transubstantiation_n the_o next_o place_n of_o the_o 19_o choose_v by_o monsieur_n plessis_n to_o be_v examine_v be_v out_o of_o durandus_fw-la plessis_n his_o word_n as_o they_o lie_v in_o his_o book_n pag._n 870._o be_v rhese_n durandus_fw-la call_v by_o our_o sorbonist_n the_o mostre_fw-fr solute_a doctor_n 46._o have_v these_o word_n in_o his_o 4._o book_n upon_o the_o sentence_n do_v 11._o to_o the_o contrary_n say_v he_o suppose_v the_o substance_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n after_o the_o consecration_n do_v remain_v there_o ensucth_v thereof_o but_o one_o difficulty_n and_o this_o neither_o very_a great_a nor_o indissoluble_a to_o wit_n that_o two_o body_n remain_v together_o under_o the_o same_o accident_n but_o if_o you_o put_v the_o contrary_n to_o wit_n that_o there_o be_v transubstantiation_n there_o ensue_v more_o difficultye_n that_o be_v to_o say_v how_o those_o species_n or_o accident_n without_o their_o substance_n can_v nourish_v or_o be_v corrupt_v and_o how_o any_o thing_n can_v be_v generate_v thereof_o see_v all_o generation_n be_v of_o matter_n or_o substance_n &_o therefore_o it_o seem_v that_o we_o ought_v to_o stick_v rather_o to_o the_o first_o way_n to_o wit_n against_o transubstantiation_n etc._n etc._n so_o he_o out_o of_o this_o place_n the_o b._n of_o eureux_fw-fr do_v argue_v plessis_n of_o the_o same_o falsity_n and_o deceytfull_a dealing_v as_o before_o in_o scotus_n imposture_n or_o rather_o more_o plain_a and_o evident_a and_o consequent_o more_o wicked_a and_o dishonourable_a to_o he_o for_o that_o all_o these_o word_n here_o allege_v out_o of_o durandus_fw-la be_v not_o his_o own_o but_o the_o word_n of_o other_o that_o do_v object_v the_o same_o which_o he_o dissolve_v afterward_o when_o he_o have_v put_v down_o his_o own_o sentence_n in_o these_o word_n primum_fw-la est_fw-la dicendum_fw-la 1._o quod_fw-la substantia_fw-la panis_fw-la &_o vini_fw-la convertuntur_fw-la in_o substantiam_fw-la corporis_fw-la christi_fw-la first_o we_o must_v say_v and_o hold_v notwithstanding_o the_o former_a objection_n &_o argument_n to_o the_o contrary_a that_o the_o substance_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n be_v turn_v into_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ._n this_o be_v his_o resolution_n quite_o contrary_a to_o that_o which_o plessis_n will_v have_v he_o seem_v to_o hold_v and_o then_o have_v set_v down_o this_o resolution_n accord_v to_o the_o common_a faith_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n he_o pass_v to_o answer_v the_o former_a objection_n say_v to_o the_o former_a argument_n to_o the_o contrary_n about_o difficultye_n we_o must_v answer_v that_o in_o those_o thing_n that_o appertain_v unto_o faith_n we_o must_v not_o alway_n choose_v that_o which_o seem_v to_o human_a sense_n to_o have_v less_o difficultye_n ibid._n but_o we_o must_v hold_v that_o which_o be_v consonant_n to_o the_o say_n of_o holy_a father_n and_o to_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o church_n so_o durand_n which_o word_n be_v recite_v in_o the_o hear_n of_o all_o you_o must_v imagine_v in_o what_o a_o pitiful_a plight_n poor_a plessis_n be_v to_o see_v one_o man_n look_v upon_o another_o and_o either_o smile_n or_o bite_v their_o lip_n at_o such_o manifest_a gross_a trumpery_n but_o yet_o necessity_n make_v he_o take_v hart_n &_o to_o adventure_v a_o new_a evasion_n say_v that_o albeit_o this_o be_v but_o a_o objection_n in_o durand_n yet_o it_o seem_v to_o he_o such_o a_o objection_n as_o may_v hold_v the_o place_n of_o a_o resolution_n if_o the_o authority_n &_o decision_n of_o the_o church_n have_v not_o withhold_v he_o and_o for_o
these_o clause_n that_o contain_v the_o principal_a point_n of_o all_o the_o speech_n be_v wilful_a fraud_n and_o falsification_n endeavouringe_v to_o make_v saint_n hierome_n to_o speak_v against_o himself_o about_o prayinge_v to_o saint_n which_o he_o never_o mean_v here_o now_o plessis_n be_v strain_a as_o before_o run_v to_o his_o ordinary_a shift_n of_o say_v that_o s._n hierome_n speak_v not_o of_o dead_a saint_n but_o of_o live_v only_o which_o though_o it_o be_v evident_o false_a as_o the_o bishop_n show_v by_o other_o plain_a word_n of_o s._n hierome_n in_o the_o same_o place_n and_o by_o plessis_n himself_o hierome_n that_o cite_v this_o place_n as_o a_o antiâ—otum_n to_o other_o place_n of_o he_o against_o vigilantius_n where_o plessis_n himself_o confess_v that_o he_o talk_v of_o prayer_n to_o saint_n decease_v beside_o all_o this_o i_o say_v whereby_o this_o refuge_n be_v evident_o know_v to_o be_v but_o a_o shift_n the_o bishop_n press_v he_o most_o with_o this_o that_o of_o what_o sort_n of_o saint_n soever_o s._n hierome_n speak_v here_o quick_a or_o dead_a he_o speak_v not_o simple_o or_o absolute_o that_o they_o can_v save_v we_o by_o their_o prayer_n but_o with_o this_o express_a condition_n twice_o repeat_v by_o he_o and_o leave_v out_o by_o plessis_n if_o we_o be_v negligent_a of_o our_o own_o part_n or_o as_o s._n chrysostome_n say_v before_o if_o we_o rely_v whole_o upon_o they_o and_o do_v nothing_o of_o ourselves_o wherefore_o he_o pray_v the_o judge_n to_o give_v sentence_n concern_v this_o place_n as_o of_o the_o former_a whereupon_o plessis_n begin_v to_o cavil_n again_o 69._o and_o to_o say_v as_o he_o do_v in_o the_o former_a passage_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n that_o he_o allege_v not_o this_o place_n of_o saint_n hierome_n direct_o against_o saint_n decease_v but_o indirect_o but_o the_o b._n prove_v that_o neither_o direct_o nor_o indirect_o this_o place_n of_o s._n hierome_n make_v any_o thing_n against_o prayer_n to_o saint_n but_o rather_o for_o the_o same_o for_o he_o that_o say_v that_o prayinge_v to_o saint_n avail_v not_o he_o that_o be_v negligent_a of_o his_o own_o part_n signify_v in_o effect_n that_o if_o he_o be_v diligent_a he_o may_v be_v holpen_v thereby_o which_o be_v s._n hieromes_n doctrine_n against_o vigilantius_n as_o plessey_n confess_v though_o he_o say_v that_o he_o be_v then_o in_o choler_n but_o now_o out_o of_o choler_n when_o he_o speak_v the_o contrary_a as_o he_o will_v have_v he_o to_o seem_v after_o this_o plessis_n leap_v to_o another_o place_n of_o s._n hierome_n in_o his_o commentary_n upon_o s._n paul_n epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n plessis_n where_o he_o say_v that_o saint_n shall_v not_o be_v able_a to_o help_v at_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n etc._n etc._n which_o the_o bishop_n expound_v and_o grant_v for_o that_o then_o there_o shall_v be_v no_o more_o place_n for_o prayer_n or_o intercession_n but_o every_o one_o to_o receive_v his_o reward_n yet_o he_o add_v further_o that_o this_o place_n of_o s._n hierome_n be_v bring_v into_o examination_n out_o of_o the_o order_n of_o those_o 19_o that_o plessis_n have_v choose_v and_o that_o if_o he_o will_v be_v content_a to_o continue_v the_o examination_n of_o this_o one_o page_n of_o saint_n hierome_n page_n whence_o this_o place_n be_v draw_v the_o b._n offer_v to_o bind_v himself_o to_o show_v 4._o notorious_a falsitye_n commit_v by_o he_o in_o this_o one_o page_n but_o plessis_n refuse_v this_o combat_n &_o say_v that_o he_o will_v not_o interrupt_v the_o order_n set_v down_o already_o for_o examination_n of_o his_o 19_o place_n aforesaid_a but_o yet_o both_o the_o king_n and_o rest_n of_o the_o auditory_a do_v well_o mark_n and_o note_v this_o offer_n make_v by_o the_o bishop_n and_o diverse_a time_n repeat_v by_o he_o and_o that_o the_o other_o dare_v not_o accept_v thereof_o wherefore_o the_o judge_n be_v call_v upon_o again_o to_o give_v sentence_n confer_v together_o and_o with_o one_o consent_n give_v this_o verdict_n 97._o que_fw-fr le_fw-fr passage_n avoit_v deu_fw-mi estre_fw-fr mis_fw-fr entier_fw-fr that_o this_o place_n or_o passage_n on_o s._n hierome_n ought_v to_o have_v be_v set_v down_o by_o mounseur_fw-fr plessis_n whole_o and_o entire_a as_o it_o lay_v in_o the_o author_n and_o not_o mangle_v or_o dismember_v as_o it_o be_v find_v to_o be_v and_o you_o may_v imagine_v how_o plessis_n blush_v at_o this_o sentence_n the_o six_o place_n examine_v out_o of_o s._n cyrill_n about_o honour_v the_o holy_a crosse._n the_o six_o place_n be_v out_o of_o s._n cyrill_n cite_v by_o monsieur_n plessis_n pag._n 223._o of_o his_o book_n in_o these_o word_n s._n cyrill_n apostate_n answer_v the_o emperor_n julian_n when_o he_o reproach_v christian_n for_o honour_n do_v unto_o the_o cross_n that_o christian_n do_v not_o give_v adoration_n nor_o reverence_n to_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o crosse._n so_o say_v plessis_n but_o the_o bishop_n charge_v he_o that_o the_o last_o word_n of_o this_o sentence_n to_o wit_n that_o christian_n do_v not_o give_v adoration_n nor_o reverence_n to_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n be_v not_o in_o s._n cyrill_n and_o will_v he_o to_o show_v they_o plessis_n answer_v that_o in_o deed_n they_o be_v not_o s._n cyrills_n own_o word_n and_o therefore_o he_o do_v not_o put_v they_o in_o a_o different_a letter_n of_o quotation_n but_o yet_o that_o the_o sense_n of_o they_o be_v to_o be_v find_v in_o s._n cyrill_n the_o b._n reply_v that_o neither_o the_o word_n nor_o sense_n be_v there_o and_o yet_o that_o plessis_n pag._n 89._o plessis_n of_o his_o book_n against_o the_o mass_n have_v set_v down_o the_o same_o thing_n as_o of_o s._n cyrills_n own_o word_n in_o a_o different_a letter_n of_o quotation_n thus_o cyrill_n likewise_o reproach_v by_o julian_n the_o emperor_n do_v answer_v flatt_o that_o the_o christian_n do_v neither_o adore_v nor_o honour_v the_o sign_n of_o the_o crosse._n so_o as_o heerâ—_n you_o see_v not_o only_o these_o word_n allege_v as_o s._n cyrills_n in_o a_o different_a letter_n but_o also_o often_o urge_v by_o plessis_n that_o for_o so_o much_o as_o he_o can_v not_o bring_v forth_o the_o word_n at_o least_o he_o shall_v show_v the_o sense_n thereof_o in_o s._n cyrill_n plessis_n answer_v that_o the_o sense_n may_v be_v gather_v out_o of_o cyrill_n himself_o in_o that_o julian_n the_o apostata_fw-la against_o who_o he_o write_v obiectinge_v unto_o he_o that_o the_o christian_n adore_v the_o cross_n of_o christ_n cyrill_n do_v not_o answer_v that_o it_o be_v true_a which_o of_o likelihood_n he_o will_v have_v do_v if_o in_o those_o day_n christian_n in_o deed_n have_v worship_v the_o crosse._n but_o to_o this_o the_o bishop_n reply_v that_o the_o consequence_n be_v not_o good_a for_o so_o much_o as_o christian_a writer_n of_o that_o time_n be_v wont_a to_o go_v very_o reserued_o in_o utter_v the_o point_n &_o misterye_n of_o our_o faith_n unto_o pagan_n though_o here_o in_o effect_n cyrill_n do_v confess_v it_o as_o present_o shall_v be_v show_v for_o that_o he_o yield_v the_o reason_n why_o they_o do_v it_o but_o on_o the_o other_o side_n it_o be_v a_o far_o better_a argument_n to_o say_v julian_n the_o apostata_fw-la object_v that_o christian_n adore_v the_o cross_n of_o christ_n and_o paint_v the_o image_n thereof_o upon_o their_o forehead_n &_o upon_o their_o door_n and_o s._n cyrill_n deny_v it_o not_o but_o endeavour_v to_o give_v a_o reason_n why_o they_o do_v so_o ergo_fw-la it_o be_v more_o probable_a that_o christian_n do_v worship_v the_o cross_n of_o christ_n indeed_o in_o those_o day_n and_o here_o the_o king_n take_v up_o the_o argument_n again_o say_v plessis_n that_o it_o be_v very_o probable_a that_o julian_n will_v never_o have_v object_v this_o to_o the_o christian_n if_o they_o have_v not_o do_v so_o indeed_o for_o otherwise_o he_o shall_v have_v be_v laugh_v at_o by_o all_o which_o speech_n of_o his_o majesty_n the_o b._n confirm_v by_o show_v how_o learned_a a_o emperor_n julian_n the_o apostata_fw-la be_v and_o how_o he_o have_v be_v bring_v up_o from_o his_o youth_n in_o christian_a religion_n and_o can_v not_o be_v ignorant_a in_o so_o public_a a_o matter_n as_o this_o and_o moreover_o say_v the_o bishop_n if_o it_o be_v true_a that_o s._n cyrill_n do_v reprehend_v the_o emperor_n julian_n for_o charginge_v false_o christian_n to_o worship_v the_o cross_n it_o be_v not_o likely_a that_o other_o christian_a emperor_n follow_v soon_o after_o as_o justinian_n and_o other_o will_v in_o their_o law_n have_v call_v the_o same_o adorandam_fw-la &_o honorandam_fw-la verè_fw-la crucem_fw-la aediâ—icari_fw-la the_o cross_n that_o be_v true_o to_o be_v honour_v &_o adore_v which_o mention_n of_o emperor_n be_v hear_v by_o the_o king_n he_o require_v present_o that_o the_o book_n shall_v
of_o the_o same_o code_n or_o else_o he_o be_v a_o very_a superficial_a fellow_n and_o if_o he_o see_v it_o and_o yet_o allege_v it_o as_o he_o do_v his_o falsehood_n be_v intolerable_a but_o he_o persist_v in_o denial_n that_o he_o be_v bind_v to_o look_v the_o law_n itself_o in_o the_o code_n but_o that_o it_o be_v sufficient_a to_o follow_v crinitus_n his_o allegation_n thereof_o the_o judge_n for_o compassion_n as_o it_o seem_v after_o consultation_n among_o themselves_o give_v this_o sentence_n que_fw-fr il_fw-fr avoit_v veritablement_n allegué_fw-fr crinitus_n mais_fw-fr que_fw-fr crinitus_n â—'estoit_fw-fr abusé_fw-fr that_o mounseur_fw-fr plessis_n have_v true_o allege_v crinitus_n but_o that_o crinitus_n be_v abuse_v which_o have_v be_v some_o excuse_n if_o plessis_n have_v be_v a_o simple_a young_a scholar_n but_o be_v the_o man_n he_o be_v and_o take_v himself_o to_o be_v it_o be_v hard_o to_o say_v where_o the_o abuse_n be_v great_a either_o in_o he_o or_o crinitus_n for_o so_o much_o as_o in_o his_o text_n he_o allege_v not_o crinitus_n but_o the_o emperor_n themselves_o and_o insult_v thereby_o over_o catholic_n as_o you_o have_v hear_v though_o in_o his_o margin_n he_o quote_v crinitus_n which_o be_v little_a to_o the_o purpose_n know_v that_o he_o lie_v as_o must_v be_v presume_v that_o he_o do_v and_o can_v well_o be_v avoid_v the_o eight_o place_n examine_v out_o of_o s._n bernard_n about_o honour_v our_o lady_n the_o l._n plessis_n be_v desirous_a to_o make_v a_o flourish_n against_o catholic_n for_o geve_v to_o much_o honour_n as_o he_o say_v to_o our_o lady_n he_o allege_v a_o sentence_n out_o of_o s._n bernard_n in_o the_o 604._o page_n of_o his_o book_n in_o these_o word_n 83._o s._n bernard_n say_v he_o write_v of_o the_o virgin_n herself_o in_o his_o 174._o epistle_n that_o she_o have_v no_o need_n of_o false_a honour_n for_o so_o much_o as_o she_o be_v full_a of_o true_a and_o this_o be_v not_o to_o honour_v she_o but_o to_o take_v away_o her_o honour_n the_o feast_n of_o her_o conception_n be_v not_o well_o invent_v so_o he_o in_o which_o word_n the_o b._n accuse_v plessis_n to_o have_v use_v as_o great_a falsehood_n as_o in_o the_o former_a passage_n for_o that_o he_o have_v guilful_o patch_v together_o two_o different_a sentence_n of_o that_o epistle_n write_v in_o several_a place_n to_o make_v one_o to_o his_o purpose_n after_o the_o fashion_n of_o centons_n of_o homer_n virgil_n and_o other_o poet_n and_o have_v so_o recite_v they_o as_o they_o may_v seem_v but_o one_o and_o moreover_o have_v cut_n of_o the_o sentence_n that_o go_v between_o they_o &_o be_v immediate_o annex_v to_o the_o former_a &_o contain_v the_o decision_n of_o the_o whole_a question_n to_o wit_n inventrix_fw-la of_o grace_n plessis_n mediatrix_fw-la of_o salvation_n etc._n etc._n for_o better_a understanding_n whereof_o must_v be_v note_v that_o mensieur_n plessis_n a_o little_a before_o have_v accuse_v s._n anselm_n of_o impiety_n for_o call_v the_o bless_a virgin_n inuentricem_fw-la gratiae_fw-la mediatricem_fw-la salutis_fw-la restauratricem_fw-la saeculorum_fw-la say_v that_o these_o praise_n and_o honour_n be_v false_a and_o immoderate_a for_o proof_n whereof_o he_o allege_v saint_n bernard_n as_o though_o he_o have_v be_v of_o a_o contrary_a opinion_n to_o anselmus_n and_o to_o the_o catholic_n of_o these_o day_n in_o that_o he_o disallow_v false_a honour_n give_v to_o our_o lady_n for_o which_o he_o cite_v the_o passage_n before_o mention_v bernard_n make_v of_o 2._o several_a sentence_n tie_v together_o &_o cut_v out_o from_o the_o middle_n thereof_o these_o word_n of_o s._n bernard_n magnifica_fw-la gratiae_fw-la inventricem_fw-la mediatricem_fw-la salutis_fw-la restauratricem_fw-la saeculorum_fw-la etc._n etc._n do_v thou_o magnify_v this_o inventrix_fw-la of_o grace_n this_o mediatrix_fw-la of_o salvation_n and_o restorer_n of_o the_o world_n etc._n etc._n which_o be_v the_o very_a same_o word_n that_o anselmus_n do_v use_v before_o he_o and_o for_o reprove_v whereof_o s._n bernard_n be_v allege_v so_o as_o two_o or_o 3._o falsehood_n be_v urge_v out_o of_o this_o place_n against_o he_o first_o that_o of_o two_o sentence_n be_v guilful_o make_v one_o second_o that_o the_o principal_a clause_n be_v leave_v out_o of_o purpose_n and_o three_o that_o s._n bernard_n be_v allege_v to_o overthrow_v that_o which_o express_o he_o confirm_v to_o the_o first_o plessis_n answer_v that_o in_o leave_v out_o that_o sentence_n he_o do_v no_o more_o than_o the_o apostle_n do_v who_o allege_v some_o time_n several_a sentence_n of_o the_o old_a testament_n together_o as_o one_o text_n b._n but_o the_o bishop_n reply_v that_o the_o apostle_n may_v do_v it_o for_o that_o they_o have_v the_o self_n same_o spirit_n which_o the_o writer_n of_o the_o old_a testament_n have_v and_o therefore_o can_v not_o go_v from_o their_o true_a meaning_n but_o that_o we_o shall_v never_o find_v the_o apostle_n to_o allege_v two_o place_n of_o scripture_n contrary_n to_o the_o writer_n mind_n and_o to_o leave_v out_o in_o the_o midst_n that_o which_o make_v most_o to_o the_o purpose_n for_o declare_v their_o meaning_n as_o plessis_n have_v do_v here_o in_o s._n bernard_n to_o the_o second_o &_o three_o point_n about_o clippinge_v of_o the_o sentence_n in_o the_o middle_n and_o alleaginge_v s._n bernard_n against_o his_o own_o meaning_n plessis_n endeavour_v to_o make_v certain_a answer_n &_o to_o show_v that_o the_o sentence_n which_o he_o have_v leave_v out_o make_v nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n which_o he_o have_v in_o hand_n which_o the_o bishop_n grant_v if_o his_o purpose_n be_v to_o deceive_v his_o reader_n as_o no_o doubt_n but_o it_o be_v but_o otherwise_o if_o he_o have_v mean_v truth_n it_o must_v needs_o be_v much_o to_o the_o purpose_n to_o put_v it_o in_o for_o that_o it_o overthrow_v direct_o as_o you_o see_v all_o that_o which_o plessis_n will_v have_v prove_v by_o s._n bernard_n authority_n against_o s._n anselm_n and_o final_o the_o bishop_n after_o diverse_a other_o cavil_n answer_v return_v to_o the_o first_o matter_n again_o and_o to_o affirm_v as_o at_o the_o beginning_n that_o monsieur_n plessis_n have_v not_o deal_v true_o and_o sincere_o in_o this_o allegation_n of_o saint_n bernard_n but_o that_o he_o shall_v have_v allege_v the_o sentence_n several_o as_o they_o lie_v in_o the_o book_n and_o not_o have_v leave_v out_o the_o principal_a clause_n that_o go_v between_o they_o if_o he_o have_v deal_v true_o wherefore_o he_o desyringe_n judgement_n upon_o this_o passage_n plessis_n the_o act_n do_v set_v it_o down_o in_o these_o word_n mounseur_fw-fr le_fw-fr chancely_o avec_fw-la l'aduis_fw-la des_fw-fr deputés_fw-fr prononâ—a_fw-fr qu'il_fw-fr eust_fw-fr esté_fw-fr bon_fw-fr que_fw-fr il_fw-fr eust_fw-fr fait_fw-fr 96._o the_o l._n chancellor_n with_o the_o advice_n of_o the_o deputye_n do_v pronounce_v that_o it_o have_v be_v good_a that_o 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like_a unto_o they_o here_o the_o bishop_n object_v two_o manifest_a and_o wilful_a falsification_n 92._o first_o for_o that_o he_o have_v against_o the_o express_a meaning_n of_o theodorete_n translate_v the_o greek_a word_n idol_n for_o image_n which_o theodorete_n do_v clear_o distinguish_v and_o second_o for_o that_o he_o cut_v of_o a_o plain_a clause_n in_o the_o midst_n whereby_o the_o author_n of_o purpose_n do_v expound_v himself_o to_o wit_n these_o word_n adore_v by_o pagan_n and_o adore_v for_o god_n so_o as_o this_o declare_v evident_o that_o he_o have_v no_o true_a meaning_n to_o this_o plessis_n answer_v that_o as_o for_o the_o word_n idol_n and_o image_n they_o be_v all_o one_o image_n which_o he_o say_v he_o can_v show_v both_o out_o of_o scripture_n and_o father_n the_o other_o reply_v that_o albeit_o accord_v to_o their_o etymologye_n in_o grammar_n the_o greek_a word_n eicoon_n and_o eidoolon_n do_v sometime_o signify_v the_o same_o and_o
discourse_n plessis_n say_v talk_v of_o the_o same_o place_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n depravation_n that_o the_o andience_n hear_v chrysostome_n to_o speak_v of_o preach_v to_o saint_n imagine_v that_o he_o have_v speak_v of_o dead_a saint_n and_o upon_o this_o ignorance_n say_v he_o for_o so_o he_o qualifi_v the_o judgement_n of_o all_o that_o be_v present_a they_o give_v a_o applause_n etc._n etc._n which_o be_v altogether_o false_a for_o that_o the_o applause_n give_v be_v not_o upon_o this_o first_o place_n of_o s._n chrisostome_n upon_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o thessalonian_n but_o another_o out_o of_o his_o homily_n upon_o the_o second_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n bring_v in_o upon_o the_o examen_fw-la of_o the_o four_o place_n of_o the_o nine_o before_o examine_v and_o the_o cause_n of_o thisâ—_n say_v applause_n of_o laughter_n of_o the_o auditory_a be_v this_o that_o plessis_n pretend_v to_o bring_v two_o place_n out_o of_o saint_n chrysostome_n against_o prayinge_v to_o saint_n which_o be_v the_o three_o and_o four_o before_o examine_v and_o then_o it_o be_v prove_v by_o the_o bishop_n that_o both_o those_o place_n be_v falsify_v by_o he_o and_o that_o they_o make_v express_o for_o prayer_n to_o saint_n if_o he_o have_v put_v they_o down_o whole_o and_o true_o he_o have_v no_o other_o refuge_n if_o you_o remember_v but_o to_o say_v that_o he_o have_v put_v down_o the_o true_a sense_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n though_o not_o his_o word_n &_o then_o be_v beat_v from_o that_o with_o other_o place_n of_o saint_n chrysostome_n declare_v his_o own_o meaning_n for_o prayer_n to_o saint_n plessis_n be_v force_v to_o confess_v against_o himself_o that_o have_v allege_v he_o for_o impugn_v prayer_n to_o saint_n that_o indeed_o chrysostome_n allow_v prayer_n to_o saint_n but_o it_o be_v to_o live_v saint_n only_o and_o not_o to_o dead_a against_o which_o shift_n the_o bishop_n recite_v this_o place_n follow_v out_o of_o his_o 26._o homily_n upon_o the_o second_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n talk_v of_o the_o pious_a devotion_n of_o the_o emperor_n of_o his_o time_n in_o prayinge_v to_o s._n peter_n and_o s._n paul_n &_o high_o praise_v the_o same_o in_o these_o word_n he_o that_o be_v apparel_v in_o purple_a do_v make_v supplication_n to_o saint_n antiochen_n that_o they_o will_v be_v his_o intercessor_n to_o god_n and_o he_o that_o wear_v a_o diadem_n do_v pray_v to_o a_o tentmaker_n and_o to_o a_o fisherman_n now_o dead_a to_o be_v his_o protector_n and_o will_v you_o dare_v then_o to_o say_v that_o their_o master_n be_v dead_a who_o servant_n now_o after_o their_o death_n be_v the_o protector_n of_o emperor_n live_v upon_o earth_n which_o place_n be_v recite_v out_o of_o s._n chrysostome_n plessis_n that_o confirm_v so_o evident_o both_o prayer_n to_o saint_n and_o to_o dead_a saint_n some_o laughter_n there_o be_v and_o strangewonder_v at_o the_o impudence_n of_o plessis_n in_o run_v so_o often_o to_o his_o refuge_n of_o dead_a and_o live_v saint_n and_o he_o can_v not_o but_o blush_v to_o see_v himself_o so_o evident_o take_v and_o this_o be_v the_o applause_n which_o he_o complain_v of_o though_o wrongful_o and_o fraudulent_o allege_v as_o you_o have_v hear_v furthermore_o the_o same_o plessis_n pass_v on_o to_o handle_v the_o decision_n and_o sentence_n give_v upon_o the_o foresay_a four_o place_n tell_v his_o reader_n for_o certain_a that_o the_o judge_n do_v not_o determine_v that_o there_o be_v any_o omission_n use_v therein_o in_o cytinge_v saint_n chrysostom_n word_n which_o be_v such_o a_o impudence_n depravation_n as_o not_o only_o the_o record_n of_o all_o the_o four_o secretarye_n do_v uniformal_o convince_v 36._o who_o have_v the_o sentence_n of_o the_o deputye_n thus_o register_v that_o monsieur_n plessis_n have_v leave_v out_o that_o which_o he_o shall_v have_v put_v in_o but_o the_o very_o layinge_v open_a of_o the_o text_n of_o saint_n chrysostome_n do_v convince_v the_o same_o to_o he_o that_o have_v eye_n and_o skill_n to_o read_v it_o follow_v upon_o the_o examination_n of_o the_o same_o four_o place_n before_o mencyon_v depravation_n that_o he_o charge_v the_o deputye_n of_o ignorance_n in_o gevinge_v sentence_n as_o he_o say_v that_o the_o word_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n there_o cite_v out_o of_o his_o homily_n upon_o s._n mathewes_n gospel_n aught_o to_o be_v understand_v of_o saint_n decease_v whereas_o they_o give_v no_o such_o sentence_n at_o all_o as_o the_o record_n of_o all_o four_o secretarye_n do_v testify_v 46._o but_o only_o the_o very_a same_o sentence_n which_o be_v give_v before_o upon_o the_o three_o place_n to_o wit_n that_o plessis_n have_v leave_v out_o that_o which_o he_o shall_v have_v put_v in_o and_o the_o bishop_n grauntinge_v in_o that_o place_n that_o those_o word_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n 59_o be_v indifferent_a to_o be_v understand_v either_o of_o dead_a or_o live_v saint_n do_v urge_v that_o if_o plessis_n will_v understand_v they_o only_o of_o live_v saint_n they_o make_v most_o against_o himself_o who_o have_v bring_v that_o place_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n to_o impugn_v prayer_n to_o dead_a saint_n so_o as_o this_o do_v only_o show_v a_o mind_n in_o plessis_n to_o lie_v cavil_v and_o calumniate_v without_o relieve_v himself_o thereby_o but_o rather_o increase_a his_o dishonour_n and_o shame_n about_o the_o five_o place_n examine_v out_o of_o s._n hierome_n upon_o ezechiell_n depravation_n he_o accuse_v great_o the_o b._n for_o that_o he_o will_v not_o as_o he_o say_v harken_v to_o he_o when_o he_o allege_v another_o place_n of_o s._n hierome_n upon_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o galatian_n where_o he_o have_v these_o word_n 48._o at_o that_o day_n when_o we_o shall_v be_v before_o the_o tribunal_n of_o christ_n neither_o no_o job_n nor_o daniel_n can_v pray_v any_o more_o for_o any_o man_n etc._n etc._n which_o charge_n be_v evident_o false_a as_o before_o 4._o you_o have_v hear_v declare_v in_o the_o examination_n of_o this_o place_n and_o may_v see_v in_o the_o act_n themselves_o for_o that_o albeit_o the_o bishop_n tell_v he_o that_o this_o place_n be_v bring_v in_o against_o order_n beside_o the_o number_n of_o those_o 19_o which_o plessis_n have_v choose_v to_o be_v first_o examine_v yet_o he_o be_v content_a to_o stand_v upon_o the_o examination_n thereof_o if_o plessis_n will_v &_o of_o other_o place_n cite_v in_o his_o book_n and_o to_o bind_v himself_o to_o prove_v that_o in_o that_o only_a one_o page_n he_o have_v commit_v 4._o notorious_a falsification_n but_o plessis_n refuse_v to_o join_v with_o he_o in_o that_o point_n 69._o and_o so_o the_o bishop_n expound_v the_o place_n allege_v of_o s._n hierome_n that_o it_o be_v mean_v of_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n when_o no_o more_o pray_v to_o saint_n shall_v be_v nor_o of_o saint_n for_o we_o which_o do_v not_o impugn_v our_o present_a prayinge_v to_o they_o but_o rather_o confirm_v the_o same_o for_o that_o s._n hierome_n affirm_v here_o that_o there_o shall_v be_v no_o more_o prayinge_v to_o saint_n or_o of_o saint_n for_o we_o at_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n do_v evident_o signify_v that_o before_o that_o time_n both_o may_v be_v use_v about_o the_o examen_fw-la of_o the_o six_o place_n depravation_n out_o of_o s._n cyrill_n concern_v the_o honour_n of_o the_o cross_n plessis_n deceive_v notable_o his_o reader_n in_o tell_v he_o that_o falsity_n be_v object_v unto_o he_o by_o the_o bishop_n 49._o the_o king_n speak_v in_o his_o behalf_n pronounce_v with_o a_o loud_a voice_n that_o both_o party_n have_v reason_n which_o all_o man_n there_o present_a know_v to_o be_v false_a for_o that_o the_o king_n do_v rather_o the_o quite_o contrary_a say_v that_o whereas_o plessis_n have_v bring_v that_o place_n of_o cyrills_n word_n to_o julian_n to_o prove_v that_o christian_n in_o his_o time_n do_v not_o adore_v the_o cross_n it_o seem_v to_o he_o that_o they_o prove_v neither_o the_o one_o nor_o the_o other_o which_o be_v a_o condemnation_n of_o plessis_n that_o have_v allege_v the_o same_o against_o honour_v the_o cross_n &_o then_o his_o majesty_n add_v further_o that_o by_o the_o objection_n of_o julian_n exprobratinge_v unto_o they_o that_o they_o do_v honour_v the_o cross_n it_o seem_v to_o he_o evident_a that_o he_o will_v never_o have_v make_v such_o a_o objection_n if_o it_o have_v be_v altogether_o false_a which_o speech_n of_o his_o majesty_n be_v public_a and_o register_v in_o the_o ear_n of_o all_o man_n a_o man_n may_v see_v the_o modesty_n of_o plessis_n that_o dare_v so_o open_o and_o in_o print_n to_o pervert_v the_o same_o upon_o the_o very_a same_o place_n he_o falsify_v also_o depravation_n in_o like_a manner_n the_o sentence_n give_v by_o the_o deputye_n 50._o say_v that_o the_o chancellor_n pronounce_v simple_o that_o the_o word_n allege_v out_o of_o
cyrill_n be_v not_o find_v in_o he_o leave_v it_o easy_a to_o the_o hearer_n say_v he_o to_o infer_v that_o the_o sense_n notwithstanding_o be_v to_o be_v find_v in_o he_o which_o be_v a_o great_a untruth_n for_o that_o the_o sentence_n register_v by_o all_o 4._o secretarye_n comprehend_v the_o whole_a passage_n in_o these_o word_n 72._o the_o passage_n cite_v by_o mounseur_fw-fr plessis_n out_o of_o cyrill_n be_v not_o find_v in_o cyrill_n which_o sentence_n contain_v as_o you_o see_v both_o sense_n and_o word_n and_o it_o be_v a_o poor_a shift_n of_o plessis_n to_o go_v about_o to_o help_v himself_o by_o so_o childish_a a_o inference_n as_o for_o that_o they_o give_v sentence_n that_o the_o word_n allege_v by_o he_o be_v not_o in_o cyrill_n it_o may_v be_v infer_v that_o the_o sense_n be_v after_o this_o the_o bishop_n show_v diverse_a other_o gross_a untruth_n in_o this_o kind_n as_o namely_o that_o in_o reportinge_v the_o sentence_n of_o the_o chancellor_n depravation_n and_o deputye_n upon_o the_o last_o place_n examine_v out_o of_o theodorete_n about_o idol_n he_o false_o pervert_v the_o same_o leave_v out_o the_o principal_a important_a word_n of_o the_o say_a sentence_n to_o wit_n adore_v by_o paynim_n and_o adore_v for_o god_n contrary_a to_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o record_n themselves_o uniformal_o take_v by_o all_o 4._o secretarye_n &_o then_o again_o to_o excuse_v himself_o from_o a_o foul_a disgrace_n happen_v in_o the_o examination_n of_o the_o first_o place_n about_o the_o real_a presence_n out_o of_o scotus_n 65._o who_o text_n plessis_n can_v not_o read_v he_o tell_v in_o his_o discourse_n this_o notable_a lie_n that_o the_o b._n of_o eureux_fw-fr have_v use_v a_o certain_a fraudulent_a sleight_n to_o disgrace_v he_o which_o be_v to_o bring_v two_o edition_n of_o scotus_n the_o one_o fair_a to_o be_v read_v which_o he_o send_v he_o overnight_o with_o the_o 60._o place_n to_o prepare_v himself_o the_o other_o he_o retain_v with_o he_o of_o a_o evil_a print_n which_o he_o obtrude_v to_o he_o in_o the_o conference_n but_o this_o shameless_a fiction_n the_o bishop_n refute_v first_o by_o the_o testimony_n of_o they_o that_o bring_v back_o again_o the_o book_n from_o plessis_n house_n to_o the_o conference_n and_o then_o by_o the_o witness_n of_o 4._o several_a french_a gentleman_n refute_v to_o wit_n mounseur_fw-fr du_fw-fr bertant_fw-la du_fw-fr beaulien_n du_fw-fr berulle_n and_o du_fw-fr salettes_n that_o come_v with_o he_o from_o paris_n &_o know_v that_o he_o bring_v but_o one_o only_a edition_n of_o scotus_n with_o he_o which_o be_v in_o folio_n of_o the_o print_n of_o badius_n ascensius_n in_o the_o year_n 1519._o and_o lend_v unto_o he_o by_o the_o college_n of_o sorbone_n in_o paris_n for_o this_o conference_n which_o book_n be_v give_v to_o plessis_n to_o verify_v his_o place_n allege_v out_o of_o he_o he_o can_v not_o so_o much_o as_o read_v nor_o turn_v the_o book_n for_o that_o there_o be_v some_o abreviation_n 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down_o the_o state_n of_o this_o controversy_n so_o dark_o for_o if_o i_o have_v not_o explain_v the_o matter_n somewhat_o before_o who_o will_v here_o have_v understand_v wherein_o the_o difficulty_n lie_v for_o what_o sense_n do_v make_v those_o word_n in_o latyn_n and_o not_o english_v bonum_fw-la est_fw-la confidere_fw-la in_o domino_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o si_fw-la negligentes_fw-la fuerint_fw-la but_o all_o this_o be_v of_o art_n and_o fraud_n to_o dazzle_v the_o reader_n eye_n that_o he_o understand_v not_o the_o falsity_n wherein_o plessis_n be_v take_v for_o if_o his_o proctor_n o._n e._n have_v set_v down_o the_o true_a word_n of_o the_o controversy_a as_o i_o do_v before_o his_o question_n have_v be_v answer_v of_o itself_o for_o who_o but_o a_o simple_a fellow_n will_v put_v in_o doubt_n but_o that_o the_o word_n before_o rehearse_v if_o their_o child_n be_v negligent_a be_v of_o chief_a importance_n to_o be_v put_v in_o or_o leave_v out_o see_v they_o do_v solve_v all_o 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then_o the_o l._n plessis_n quote_v they_o who_o i_o think_v the_o mathureux_fw-fr bishop_n of_o eureux_fw-fr will_v not_o charge_v with_o falsification_n 148._o this_o supply_n be_v take_v out_o of_o plessis_n own_o discourse_n send_v from_o saumur_n after_o his_o flight_n from_o paris_n and_o it_o show_v that_o o._n e._n have_v read_v the_o same_o and_o thereby_o be_v inexcusable_a when_o he_o dissemble_v it_o as_o before_o in_o voluntary_a mistakinge_v the_o second_o place_n out_o of_o durand_n and_o upon_o diverse_a other_o occasion_n but_o to_o the_o point_n if_o the_o gloss_n upon_o ezechiel_n do_v cyte_v the_o word_n of_o s._n hierome_n dismember_v as_o plessis_n do_v it_o be_v in_o no_o wise_a a_o just_a excuse_n for_o he_o first_o for_o that_o the_o gloss_n use_v to_o cyte_v short_a piece_n of_o sentence_n as_o it_o serve_v to_o purpose_n for_o explication_n of_o word_n in_o the_o text_n but_o plessis_n take_v upon_o he_o to_o set_v down_o a_o whole_a place_n out_o of_o s._n hierome_n for_o impugn_v prayer_n to_o saint_n desceased_a and_o so_o cite_v they_o verbatim_o and_o at_o large_a until_o he_o come_v to_o the_o word_n that_o make_v against_o he_o ezech._n to_o wit_n that_o saint_n prayer_n will_v not_o help_v their_o child_n if_o they_o be_v negligent_a which_o condition_n yet_o the_o gloss_n omit_v not_o but_o express_v it_o in_o other_o equivalent_a word_n thus_o if_o they_o follow_v not_o the_o faith_n and_o work_v of_o their_o parent_n wherefore_o this_o shift_n help_v neither_o plessis_n nor_o his_o proctor_n any_o thing_n at_o all_o and_o as_o for_o the_o malheureux_fw-fr b._n of_o eureux_fw-fr hugonot_n he_o may_v perchance_o be_v call_v malheureux_fw-fr that_o be_v to_o say_v unlucky_a to_o the_o hugonot_n of_o france_n for_o that_o have_v be_v once_o so_o chief_a a_o man_n of_o their_o party_n have_v since_o his_o conversion_n so_o learned_o &_o lucky_o batter_v their_o sect_n as_o no_o man_n more_o in_o france_n nor_o perhaps_o in_o europe_n and_o they_o do_v well_o feel_v the_o blow_n but_o otherwise_o the_o reproach_n be_v foolish_a to_o call_v he_o unlucky_a and_o this_o be_v all_o which_o o._n e._n can_v divise_v to_o bring_v forth_o for_o defence_n or_o excuse_n of_o the_o falsification_n object_v in_o leave_v out_o s._n hieroms_n restriction_n if_o child_n be_v negligent_a but_o now_o let_v we_o hear_v another_o objection_n make_v by_o the_o bishop_n &_o answer_v by_o o._n e._n it_o be_v also_o here_o object_v say_v he_o that_o hieromes_n word_n in_o ezechiel_n make_v nothing_o against_o prayer_n to_o saint_n ibid._n but_o it_o must_v be_v remembredâ—_n that_o the_o controversy_n here_o be_v not_o whetherâ—_n m._n plessis_n have_v well_o conclude_v out_o of_o that_o place_n but_o whether_o he_o have_v right_o allege_v it_o etc._n etc._n well_o sir_n and_o we_o have_v show_v now_o that_o he_o allege_v it_o not_o right_o have_v leave_v out_o the_o principal_a clause_n that_o he_o shall_v have_v put_v in_o and_o if_o you_o grant_v also_o as_o you_o seem_v thereunto_o incline_v that_o he_o have_v not_o right_o conclude_v then_o be_v he_o double_a false_a to_o wit_n both_o in_o alleagation_n &_o conclusion_n but_o somewhat_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v divise_v to_o excuse_v his_o collection_n and_o conclusion_n though_o the_o author_n word_n themselves_o be_v against_o it_o let_v we_o see_v then_o what_o it_o be_v absurdity_n beside_o that_o say_v he_o we_o answer_v that_o it_o be_v no_o weak_a argument_n to_o conclude_v thus_o as_o plessis_n do_v out_o of_o s._n hierome_n we_o must_v not_o trust_v in_o the_o prayer_n of_o man_n and_o therefore_o be_v not_o to_o rely_v upon_o the_o prayer_n of_o man_n depart_v this_o life_n but_o i_o say_v to_o the_o contrary_a that_o it_o be_v a_o weak_a and_o wicked_a argument_n to_o conclude_v thus_o as_o the_o word_n lie_v in_o s._n hierome_n we_o must_v not_o rely_v upon_o the_o prayer_n of_o man_n though_o never_o so_o holy_a if_o we_o be_v negligent_a of_o our_o own_o part_n ergo_fw-la we_o must_v not_o trust_v in_o the_o prayer_n of_o saint_n depart_v though_o we_o be_v never_o so_o diligent_a to_o live_v virtuous_o ourselves_o this_o i_o say_v be_v a_o absurd_a manner_n of_o argument_n and_o conclusion_n inceps_fw-la and_o yet_o this_o be_v the_o argument_n and_o conclusion_n of_o plessis_n and_o of_o o._n e._n for_o impugn_v prayer_n to_o saint_n decease_v against_o which_o false_a conclusion_n the_o bishop_n in_o his_o refutation_n of_o plessis_n reply_n do_v allege_v above_o a_o dozen_o most_o plain_a and_o effectual_a place_n out_o of_o s._n hierome_n s._n chrysostome_n and_o other_o father_n which_o plain_o and_o perspicious_o do_v approve_v the_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n of_o prayer_n to_o saint_n decease_v in_o their_o day_n and_o o._n e._n dare_v not_o take_v upon_o he_o to_o answer_v any_o one_o of_o they_o but_o pullinge_v down_o his_o hat_n over_o his_o eye_n pass_v by_o they_o as_o he_o have_v not_o see_v they_o but_o let_v we_o hear_v his_o last_o conclusion_n gala._n final_o say_v he_o hierome_n write_v upon_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o galatian_n do_v flat_o demne_v prayer_n make_v to_o saint_n depart_v and_o for_o dead_a man_n say_v dum_fw-la in_o hoc_fw-la saeculo_fw-la sumus_fw-la etc._n etc._n while_o we_o be_v in_o this_o world_n we_o may_v help_v one_o another_o by_o prayer_n or_o counsel_n but_o when_o we_o come_v before_o the_o trihunall_n of_o christ_n neither_o job_n nor_o daniel_n nor_o nâ—â—_n can_v pray_v for_o any_o man_n but_o every_o one_o shall_v bear_v his_o own_o burden_n and_o do_v you_o see_v what_o plain_a place_n these_o fellow_n bring_v forth_o and_o how_o flat_o they_o conclude_v this_o place_n if_o you_o remember_v be_v allege_v by_o plessis_n in_o the_o conference_n &_o answer_v by_o the_o bishop_n that_o be_v mean_v evident_o of_o the_o day_n of_o judgement_n make_v nothing_o against_o prayer_n before_o that_o day_n nor_o can_v he_o reply_v any_o thing_n at_o that_o time_n nor_o do_v he_o afterward_o in_o his_o discourse_n as_o appear_v by_o the_o bishop_n refutation_n fol._n 146._o 147._o and_o 147._o but_o only_a stand_v upon_o his_o vain_a distinction_n and_o refuge_n of_o lyvinge_v and_o dead_a saint_n which_o shift_n to_o avoid_v most_o evident_a authoritye_n of_o the_o father_n the_o bishop_n refute_v die_v diverse_a place_n allege_v out_o of_o s._n hierome_n himself_o &_o one_o namely_o against_o vigilantius_n where_o he_o object_v to_o that_o heretic_n the_o very_a same_o word_n use_v here_o by_o his_o scholar_n o._n e._n time_n dicis_fw-la in_o libello_fw-la tuo_fw-la quod_fw-la dum_fw-la vivimus_fw-la etc._n etc._n thou_o say_v say_v he_o in_o thy_o book_n that_o while_o we_o be_v in_o this_o life_n we_o may_v pray_v one_o for_o another_o but_o that_o after_o death_n no_o man_n prayer_n shall_v be_v hear_v
base_a and_o unworthy_a adversaries_n pleasure_n be_v say_v he_o to_o contend_v with_o i_o about_o certain_a small_a quyrk_n and_o question_n about_o certain_a pretend_a untruth_n and_o falsification_n etc._n etc._n and_o again_o your_o honour_n shall_v perceive_v the_o great_a weakness_n of_o our_o adversaries_n and_o the_o poverty_n of_o the_o principal_a actor_n in_o the_o same_o who_o abandoninge_v the_o main_n point_v in_o controversy_n begin_v now_o to_o pick_v quarrel_n at_o word_n allegation_n point_n quotation_n and_o other_o by-matter_n and_o cease_v to_o join_v with_o we_o and_o like_o divine_n to_o argue_v and_o dispute_v fall_v to_o plain_a calumniation_n and_o rail_n thus_o he_o and_o here_o again_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o the_o lord_n umpire_n will_v laugh_v to_o hear_v sutcliffe_n account_n the_o falsification_n of_o father_n doctor_n and_o ancient_a writer_n and_o this_o both_o in_o word_n &_o sense_n allege_v they_o express_o against_o their_o own_o meaning_n to_o be_v but_o quirk_n quarrel_n and_o question_n about_o word_n point_n quotation_n and_o other_o such_o by-matter_n as_o if_o two_o contend_v about_o some_o great_a inheritance_n and_o the_o one_o obiectinge_v that_o his_o adversary_n have_v falsify_v the_o evidence_n whereby_o the_o whole_a controversy_n must_v be_v try_v the_o other_o shall_v answer_v that_o these_o be_v but_o quirk_n and_o by-matter_n and_o this_o be_v the_o account_n which_o master_n sutcliffe_n and_o his_o people_n do_v make_v of_o false_a or_o true_a dealing_v or_o changinge_v choppinge_v alter_v or_o pervertinge_v the_o author_n who_o they_o allege_v as_o it_o make_v best_a for_o their_o purpose_n but_o we_o on_o the_o contrary_a side_n must_v here_o profess_v as_o man_n bind_v to_o strict_a truth_n be_v that_o we_o esteem_v high_o of_o these_o matter_n not_o only_o in_o chief_a point_n of_o controversy_n the_o belief_n whereof_o concern_v our_o soul_n but_o even_o in_o less_o matter_n also_o for_o that_o they_o discover_v a_o bad_a mind_n &_o wicked_a conscience_n whersoever_o they_o be_v find_v witting_o and_o willing_o comit_v and_o yet_o be_v not_o we_o so_o rigorous_a in_o this_o point_n but_o that_o we_o do_v easy_o allow_v unto_o master_n sutcliffe_n that_o which_o in_o this_o epistle_n to_o sir_n robert_n he_o demand_v for_o himself_o say_v do_v what_o a_o man_n can_v yet_o may_v â—ther_o marginal_a note_n be_v misplace_v or_o word_n stand-disorder_o or_o thing_n be_v mistake_v this_o i_o say_v we_o easy_o grant_v neither_o be_v there_o ever_o i_o think_v any_o controversy_n hitherto_o between_o we_o about_o misplacinge_n of_o marginal_a note_n or_o disorderly_a stand_a of_o word_n so_o they_o alter_v not_o the_o true_a sense_n of_o the_o author_n which_o yet_o it_o have_v please_v master_n sutcliffe_n disorderly_a to_o bring_v in_o to_o the_o end_n he_o may_v seem_v that_o the_o accusation_n lay_v against_o he_o be_v for_o such_o trifle_n but_o neither_o these_o trifle_n nor_o the_o mistakinge_a of_o matter_n themselves_o so_o it_o be_v without_o fraud_n be_v urge_v by_o we_o against_o they_o but_o only_o where_o wilful_a deceit_n be_v evident_a and_o where_o the_o deceaver_n can_v moral_o be_v think_v to_o have_v be_v ignorant_a of_o his_o deceit_n these_o i_o say_v be_v the_o fault_n which_o we_o object_n unto_o master_n sutcliffe_n and_o his_o fellow_n and_o not_o misplace_v of_o marginal_a note_n or_o mistandinge_v of_o word_n point_n or_o quotaetion_n nay_o we_o may_v add_v a_o further_a degree_n of_o false_a dealing_v that_o have_v no_o excuse_n in_o the_o world_n which_o be_v falsification_n that_o where_o the_o falsehood_n be_v evident_a and_o can_v be_v deny_v nor_o by_o any_o probable_a mean_n defend_v yet_o not_o to_o confess_v the_o same_o nor_o to_o excuse_v it_o by_o ignorance_n forgetfulness_n trust_v upon_o other_o man_n or_o by_o any_o like_a error_n but_o to_o continue_v and_o bolster_v out_o the_o same_o by_o other_o sleight_n and_o new_a fraud_n this_o i_o say_v be_v the_o high_a degree_n of_o all_o falsehood_n and_o impudence_n &_o use_v as_o now_o you_o have_v see_v both_o by_o master_n plessis_n in_o his_o reply_n after_o his_o first_o confutation_n and_o much_o more_o by_o master_n sutcliffe_n his_o advocate_n in_o his_o break_a defence_n and_o the_o like_a we_o shall_v see_v practise_v again_o by_o he_o afterward_o in_o this_o chapter_n upon_o like_a occasion_n of_o defendinge_v himself_o and_o his_o own_o write_n concern_v which_o write_n he_o demand_v in_o his_o say_a epistle_n to_o sir_n robert_n cecil_n as_o also_o in_o his_o preface_n to_o the_o reader_n a_o certain_a privilege_n from_o the_o civil_a law_n which_o be_v that_o when_o diverse_a case_n be_v propose_v by_o one_o party_n in_o law_n to_o be_v admit_v or_o except_v against_o by_o the_o other_o and_o that_o the_o other_o except_v only_o against_o some_o and_o let_v pass_v the_o rest_n than_o it_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v say_v the_o law_n that_o those_o which_o be_v not_o except_v against_o be_v admit_v which_o benefitt_a master_n sutcliffe_n will_v have_v allow_v to_o his_o challenge_n that_o be_v whereas_o e._n o._n have_v except_v only_o against_o some_o 26._o place_n of_o father_n and_o doctor_n corrupt_v and_o falsify_v by_o he_o all_o the_o rest_n beside_o these_o 26._o may_v be_v hold_v as_o free_v from_o corruption_n iur_fw-fr if_o lawyer_n say_v true_a say_v he_o that_o exception_n confirm_v the_o rule_n in_o case_n not_o except_v then_o have_v my_o adversary_n confirm_v the_o main_n discourse_n against_o person_n and_o his_o adherent_n have_v not_o say_v any_o thing_n unto_o it_o but_o only_o except_v against_o a_o few_o place_n whereof_o he_o take_v 13._o to_o be_v untrue_o allege_v and_o 13._o to_o be_v falsify_v and_o again_o in_o his_o preface_n to_o the_o reader_n if_o he_o be_v not_o able_a to_o except_v against_o more_o place_n than_o 26._o or_o there_o about_o it_o be_v clear_a that_o i_o have_v say_v true_a in_o the_o rest_n and_o that_o i_o have_v argue_v and_o allege_v authoritye_n to_o good_a purpose_n law_n so_o he_o and_o will_v not_o here_o our_o judge_n laugh_v again_o think_v you_o to_o see_v this_o poor_a man_n endeavour_v so_o diligent_o to_o authorise_v his_o book_n by_o the_o accusation_n of_o his_o adversary_n and_o by_o a_o privilege_n draw_v from_o the_o civil_a law_n the_o rule_n allege_v of_o exception_n do_v hold_v only_o where_o some_o few_o case_n be_v propose_v to_o be_v except_v against_o by_o the_o adverse_a party_n but_o it_o hold_v not_o in_o a_o main_n book_n where_o the_o point_n be_v many_o and_o almost_o infinite_a that_o be_v handle_v and_o propose_v and_o out_o of_o which_o be_v lawful_a for_o any_o accuser_n to_o take_v his_o accusation_n where_o he_o will_v without_o authorizinge_v or_o ratifyinge_v the_o rest_n and_o in_o our_o common_a law_n of_o england_n no_o man_n can_v be_v ignorant_a but_o that_o if_o one_o shall_v be_v accuse_v for_o example_n for_o stealinge_v of_o 5._o sheep_n and_o shall_v acquitte_v himself_o thereof_o yet_o this_o will_v not_o bar_v any_o other_o accuser_n that_o will_v afterward_o call_v he_o into_o trial_n for_o have_v steal_v fiftye_a more_o wherefore_o master_n sutcliffe_n can_v not_o shroud_v himself_o by_o this_o but_o that_o other_o man_n also_o may_v examine_v his_o challenge_n 9_o beside_o e._n o._n as_o we_o have_v see_v that_o vv._n r._n have_v do_v and_o gather_v out_o a_o infinite_a huge_a heap_n of_o untruth_n and_o if_o i_o guess_v not_o amiss_o not_o much_o less_o than_o a_o hundred_o in_o one_o chapter_n wherefore_o see_v sutcliffe_n be_v so_o earnest_a to_o provoke_v &_o entreat_v adversaries_n to_z write_v against_o he_o it_o be_v reason_n he_o prepare_v himself_o to_o answer_v all_o comer_n &_o not_o to_o slip_n away_o under_o the_o shadow_n of_o a_o civilian_n rule_n or_o privilege_n for_o so_o much_o as_o he_o be_v a_o englishman_n &_o consequent_o must_v be_v try_v by_o the_o common_a law_n of_o the_o land_n and_o this_o may_v suffice_v for_o this_o first_o part_n of_o his_o new_a work_n stand_a in_o epistle_n &_o preface_n except_o you_o will_v have_v a_o brief_a example_n represent_v you_o here_o at_o this_o very_a beginning_n of_o the_o manner_n of_o answer_v and_o shiftinge_v which_o he_o mean_v to_o use_v afterward_o in_o his_o whole_a discourse_n and_o thereby_o know_v the_o man_n &_o his_o talon_n even_o at_o his_o first_o entrance_n hear_v then_o how_o he_o answer_v a_o speech_n of_o his_o adversary_n touch_v the_o continuance_n of_o catholic_a religion_n reader_n my_o adversary_n say_v he_o call_v popish_a religion_n catholic_a &_o affirm_v it_o be_v plant_v here_o by_o gregory_n the_o great_a etc._n etc._n and_o that_o it_o be_v always_o visible_a since_o christ_n etc._n etc._n but_o he_o shall_v do_v well_o to_o show_v how_o true_a
s._n augustine_n be_v present_a and_o upon_o both_o the_o say_a counsel_n earnest_a request_n the_o same_o be_v accurse_v also_o by_o pope_n innocentius_n the_o first_o as_o testify_v s._n augustine_n epist_n 90._o 92._o &_o 93._o and_o this_o be_v the_o first_o shift_n second_o of_o all_o the_o father_n that_o speak_v of_o this_o matter_n against_o he_o and_o s._n augustine_n by_o name_n in_o almost_o infinite_a place_n he_o make_v his_o adversary_n to_o allege_v only_o one_o text_n out_o of_o the_o say_a father_n and_o we_o must_v believe_v he_o for_o that_o we_o have_v not_o his_o adversaries_n treatise_n s._n augustine_n place_n be_v lib._n 3._o de_fw-la anima_fw-la cap._n 9_o 9_o but_o cite_v not_o his_o word_n yet_o answer_v they_o thus_o to_o s._n augustine_n i_o answer_v that_o he_o speak_v of_o such_o as_o die_v in_o original_a sin_n and_o seem_v to_o contemn_v baptism_n father_n this_o be_v the_o most_o blockish_a refuge_n that_o possible_o can_v be_v imagine_v for_o first_o all_o man_n before_o baptism_n die_v in_o original_a sin_n and_o second_o s._n austen_n speak_v of_o infant_n that_o have_v not_o capacity_n to_o contemn_v baptism_n his_o word_n be_v these_o noli_fw-la credere_fw-la noli_fw-la dicere_fw-la noli_fw-la docere_fw-la etc._n etc._n do_v not_o thou_o believe_v do_v thou_o not_o say_v do_v thou_o not_o teach_v if_o thou_o will_v be_v a_o catholic_a that_o infant_n prevent_v by_o death_n before_o they_o be_v baptize_v can_v come_v to_o receive_v pardon_n of_o original_a sin_n behold_v then_o the_o forehead_n of_o sutcliffe_n that_o will_v wipe_v of_o both_o this_o and_o infinite_a place_n of_o s._n augustine_n more_o express_o avouchinge_v the_o same_o doctrine_n by_o such_o a_o senseless_a sleight_n damnari_fw-la animasâ—_n say_v he_o write_v to_o s._n hierome_n â—_o hieron_n si_fw-mi sine_fw-la baptismo_fw-la de_fw-la corpore_fw-la exierint_fw-la &_o sancta_fw-la scriptura_fw-la &_o sancta_fw-la testis_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la that_o the_o soul_n be_v damn_v that_o pass_v out_o of_o this_o world_n without_o baptism_n both_o holy_a scripture_n and_o holy_a church_n be_v witness_v now_o will_v i_o demand_v of_o sutcliffe_n whether_o ever_o he_o read_v these_o place_n or_o not_o if_o he_o do_v not_o then_o must_v he_o confess_v himself_o to_o be_v ignorant_a or_o wilful_a in_o that_o he_o will_v answer_v s._n augustine_n without_o look_v upon_o he_o if_o he_o do_v and_o answer_v as_o he_o do_v then_o be_v he_o both_o malicious_a and_o shameless_a but_o now_o three_o to_o the_o authority_n of_o their_o communion-booke_n bring_v against_o he_o by_o e._n o._n say_v that_o none_o be_v save_v shift_n that_o be_v not_o regenerate_v by_o baptism_n he_o answer_v thus_o it_o be_v impious_a to_o tie_v god_n grace_n to_o sacrament_n etc._n etc._n we_o exclude_v not_o extraordinary_a course_n wherein_o first_o as_o you_o see_v he_o reject_v plain_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o say_a communion-booke_n that_o tie_v salvation_n to_o regeneration_n by_o baptism_n &_o second_o you_o must_v remember_v that_o the_o question_n whether_o this_o doctrine_n of_o sutcliffe_n of_o extraordinary_a course_n and_o savinge_v man_n without_o baptism_n be_v catholic_a &_o conform_v to_o the_o universal_a doctrine_n of_o ancient_a father_n or_o no_o whereof_o he_o speak_v not_o one_o word_n nor_o allege_v any_o one_o testimony_n to_o prove_v his_o opinion_n catholic_a that_o be_v to_o say_v general_a and_o universal_a but_o only_o say_v we_o exclude_v not_o extroordinary_a course_n and_o tell_v we_o not_o who_o these_o we_o be_v for_o that_o it_o can_v be_v the_o church_n of_o england_n which_o set_v forth_o the_o say_a communion_n book_n and_o consequent_o have_v neither_o the_o ancient_a church_n nor_o our_o church_n at_o this_o day_n nor_o the_o church_n of_o england_n to_o stand_v with_o he_o i_o will_v glad_o know_v how_o he_o will_v make_v his_o opinion_n catholic_a that_o be_v universal_a and_o thus_o much_o of_o the_o three_o shift_n the_o four_o be_v in_o his_o answer_n to_o his_o own_o word_n allege_v against_o he_o by_o e._n o._n whereunto_o he_o answer_v thus_o cozenage_n i_o do_v confess_v that_o infant_n die_v in_o original_a sin_n be_v damn_v to_o hell_n fire_n but_o i_o hope_v no_o man_n will_v say_v that_o all_o that_o die_v before_o baptism_n albeit_o they_o much_o desire_v it_o and_o believe_v in_o christ_n jesus_n die_v in_o original_a sin_n o_o slippery_a evasion_n our_o question_n here_o be_v sir_n matthew_n of_o infant_n that_o can_v desire_v baptism_n for_o as_o for_o other_o that_o be_v of_o age_n and_o do_v desire_v it_o they_o may_v be_v save_v by_o baptism_n in_o desire_n as_o before_o be_v grant_v again_o your_o immediate_a word_n before_o in_o this_o very_a sentence_n do_v speak_v of_o infant_n for_o you_o say_v i_o do_v confess_v that_o infant_n be_v damn_v to_o hell_n fire_n and_o what_o a_o fellow_n be_v you_o then_o which_o say_v in_o the_o second_o part_n of_o the_o same_o sentence_n albeit_o they_o much_o desire_v it_o and_o believe_v in_o christ_n jesus_n three_o you_o say_v a_o little_a before_o that_o want_n of_o baptism_n do_v soud_v infant_n to_o hell_n and_o now_o you_o say_v that_o infant_n die_v in_o original_a sin_n be_v damn_v to_o hell_n fire_n which_o though_o in_o our_o sense_n be_v all_o one_o that_o hold_v infant_n die_v without_o baptism_n do_v die_v in_o original_a sin_n yet_o in_o your_o sense_n that_o hold_v that_o infant_n may_v die_v before_o baptism_n &_o yet_o free_v from_o original_a sin_n be_v altogether_o different_a &_o consequent_o a_o mere_a consenage_n so_o to_o alter_v your_o word_n for_o deceive_a your_o reader_n but_o now_o we_o come_v to_o the_o last_o shift_a answer_n of_o all_o which_o be_v such_o and_o so_o unintelligible_a as_o no_o man_n read_v &_o consider_v the_o same_o can_v otherwise_o think_v but_o that_o the_o author_n be_v either_o distemper_v or_o bereave_v of_o his_o sense_n when_o he_o frame_v it_o i_o shall_v relate_v it_o in_o his_o own_o word_n &_o let_v the_o reader_n judge_v of_o it_o place_n he_o conclude_v final_o say_v he_o to_o wit_n e._n o._n that_o see_v the_o want_n of_o baptism_n do_v send_v infant_n to_o hell_n these_o be_v sutcliffes_n own_o word_n before_o recite_v ergo_fw-la baptism_n be_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n but_o his_o consequent_a be_v weak_a and_o of_o no_o value_n 13._o for_o many_o thy_fw-mi for_o want_n of_o knowledge_n and_o for_o want_v of_o small_a matter_n and_o not_o only_o of_o baptism_n and_o yet_o god_n be_v not_o necessary_o tie_v to_o save_v none_o but_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v sick_a man_n dody_a for_o want_v of_o physic_n and_o yet_o be_v not_o physic_n absolute_o necessary_a in_o this_o place_n therefore_o the_o detector_n wander_v out_o of_o his_o way_n &_o yet_o effect_v nothing_o thus_o he_o and_o heerwith_o end_v his_o whole_a defence_n upon_o this_o second_o charge_n give_v he_o by_o e._n o._n and_o sure_o if_o he_o write_v it_o not_o more_o than_o half_a a_o sliepe_a or_o when_o he_o be_v great_o distract_v in_o other_o matter_n i_o know_v not_o what_o to_o think_v or_o say_v of_o it_o many_o say_v he_o die_v for_o want_v of_o knowledge_n &_o for_o want_n of_o small_a matter_n &_o not_o only_o of_o baptism_n either_o he_o mean_v here_o of_o eternal_a or_o temporal_a death_n if_o of_o eternal_a how_o can_v it_o be_v cause_v by_o the_o want_n of_o small_a matter_n if_o of_o temporal_a how_o be_v it_o cause_v by_o want_n of_o knowledge_n or_o how_o agree_v it_o with_o the_o death_n cause_v by_o want_n of_o baptism_n which_o be_v eternal_a how_o agree_v it_o also_o with_o sendinge_v to_o hell_n which_o be_v to_o endure_v everlasting_o again_o if_o a_o man_n die_v precise_o or_o only_o for_o want_v of_o physic_n than_o be_v physic_n absolute_o necessary_a to_o save_v that_o man_n life_n otherways_o he_o do_v not_o die_v absolute_o for_o want_n of_o physic_n &_o so_o whereas_o he_o accuse_v the_o detector_n for_o wandringe_v out_o of_o the_o way_n and_o effectinge_v nothing_o this_o man_n reel_v up_o and_o down_o in_o the_o way_n and_o effect_v his_o own_o disgrace_n and_o shame_n with_o all_o reader_n and_o looker_n on_o and_o now_o by_o the_o examination_n of_o these_o 2._o place_n you_o may_v see_v the_o fashion_n of_o this_o man_n answer_v and_o how_o easy_a a_o matter_n it_o be_v and_o may_v be_v for_o any_o man_n to_o take_v upon_o he_o the_o answer_v of_o all_o adversaries_n whatsoever_o in_o this_o manner_n and_o by_o these_o two_o example_n you_o may_v guess_v at_o all_o the_o rest_n and_o albeit_o i_o will_v glad_o end_v here_o have_v be_v long_a than_o i_o purpose_v yet_o can_v i_o not_o without_o examine_v one_o place_n more_o which_o be_v the_o four_o in_o order_n concern_v prayer_n &_o