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sense_n father_n scripture_n tradition_n 1,582 5 9.3519 5 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A67103 Truth will out, or, A discovery of some untruths smoothly, told by Dr. Ieremy Taylor in his Disswasive from popery with an answer to such arguments as deserve answer / by his friendly adversary E. Worsley. E. W. (Edward Worsley), 1605-1676. 1665 (1665) Wing W3618; ESTC R39189 128,350 226

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〈◊〉_d ut_fw-la dicitur_fw-la cane_n incomparabiliter_fw-la enim_fw-la pulchrior_fw-la est_fw-la veritas_fw-la christianorum_fw-la quam_fw-la helena_n graecorum_n etc._n etc._n such_o i_o say_v be_v my_o petition_n present_v to_o our_o doctor_n and_o if_o the_o love_n of_o truth_n bear_v sway_n in_o his_o breast_n yield_v he_o needs_o must_v to_o a_o speedy_a retractation_n nothing_o can_v retard_v he_o from_o so_o generous_a a_o resolution_n but_o either_o motive_n of_o interest_n draw_v from_o a_o naughty_a world_n or_o his_o own_o once_o vent_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d so_o forsooth_o he_o have_v say_v in_o his_o dissuasive_a and_o so_o it_o must_v stand_v though_o all_o run_v to_o ruin_n and_o christianity_n suffer_v the_o doctor_n i_o confess_v have_v be_v most_o unlucky_o in_o broach_v heresy_n and_o want_v grace_n to_o retract_v they_o some_o year_n be_v now_o past_a since_o he_o be_v so_o unfortunate_a as_o to_o become_v a_o patron_n of_o the_o pelagian_a heresy_n when_o 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interdicat_fw-la ne_fw-la quid_fw-la corum_fw-la quae_fw-la in_o divinis_fw-la literis_fw-la habeantur_fw-la dematur_fw-la aut_fw-la quod_fw-la absit_fw-la addatur_fw-la which_o be_v in_o plain_a english_a to_o say_v add_v we_o must_v not_o nor_o diminish_v any_o thing_n in_o scripture_n no_o catholic_n pretend_v to_o make_v that_o scripture_n which_o be_v not_o scripture_n nor_o to_o diminish_v so_o much_o as_o one_o jot_n in_o that_o sacred_a book_n you_o see_v therefore_o so_o forceless_a this_o authority_n be_v to_o gainsay_v receive_v tradition_n that_o it_o do_v not_o so_o much_o as_o touch_v upon_o the_o very_a question_n as_o proofless_a also_o be_v those_o other_o two_o quotation_n in_o the_o doctor_n margin_n out_o of_o st._n basil_n moral_n for_o regula_fw-la 72._o c._n 1._o in_o the_o same_o edition_n page_n 372._o he_o only_o speak_v as_o the_o apostle_n do_v though_o a_o angel_n preach_v another_o gospel_n then_o what_o be_v preach_v let_v he_o be_v anathematise_v and_o 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essence_n baptise_v child_n etc._n etc._n but_o every_o tenet_n of_o protestant_a religion_n as_o protestanism_n e._n g._n the_o belief_n of_o two_o sacrament_n only_o which_o be_v not_o at_o all_o contain_v in_o scripture_n nor_o can_v it_o be_v draw_v from_o scripture_n by_o any_o probable_a discourse_n or_o gloss_n of_o protestant_a testant_n though_o these_o be_v worse_o and_o less_o able_a to_o derive_v unto_o we_o a_o true_a belief_n than_o the_o poor_a tradition_n be_v any_o such_o that_o the_o doctor_n can_v except_v against_o in_o the_o catholic_n church_n when_o the_o doctor_n please_v i_o be_o ready_a to_o discuss_v this_o sole_a point_n with_o he_o of_o prove_v protestant_n tenet_n by_o scripture_n only_o i_o believe_v he_o will_v not_o accept_v the_o challenge_n against_o the_o worship_v of_o image_n he_o cite_v lactantius_n lib._n 2_o cap._n de_fw-fr orig._n error_n observe_v i_o beseech_v you_o lactantius_n have_v seven_o book_n de_fw-fr divin_n instit_fw-la 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whereas_o it_o be_v more_o than_o evident_a that_o he_o only_o speak_v against_o simulacra_fw-la not_o image_n against_o the_o idol_n and_o god_n of_o the_o gentile_n non_fw-la sub_fw-la pedibus_fw-la quaerat_fw-la deum_fw-la say_v he_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o eighteen_o chapter_n none_o be_v to_o seek_v for_o his_o god_n under_o his_o foot_n nec_fw-la a_o vestigijs_fw-la suis_fw-la eruat_fw-la quod_fw-la adoret_fw-la nor_o pull_v from_o under_o his_o footstep_n what_o he_o be_v to_o adore_v sed_fw-la quaerat_fw-la in_o sublimi_fw-la quaerat_fw-la in_o summo_fw-la let_v he_o look_v for_o god_n above_o in_o heaven_n etc._n etc._n the_o worship_n therefore_o of_o one_o supreme_a god_n lactantius_n chief_o press_v in_o this_o whole_a second_o book_n in_o his_o first_o chapter_n he_o tell_v we_o that_o he_o have_v above_o demonstrate_v the_o false_a religion_n of_o many_o god_n and_o that_o in_o this_o second_o book_n he_o declare_v against_o the_o gentile_n the_o cause_n or_o 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no_o more_o against_o the_o catholic_n use_n of_o image_n than_o i_o do_v now_o while_o i_o defend_v they_o yet_o hear_v we_o must_v the_o doctor_n talk_v and_o without_o
all_o peradventure_o as_o if_o he_o have_v read_v where_o a_o image_n be_v there_o be_v no_o religion_n without_o all_o peradventure_o the_o good_a man_n be_v deceive_v i_o say_v no_o more_o to_o what_o he_o next_o cite_v out_o of_o origen_n we_o shall_v answer_v hereafter_o now_o to_o the_o doctor_n chapter_n and_o section_n chap._n i._n of_o the_o doctor_n ungrounded_a discourse_n to_o the_o wrongful_a charge_n on_o catholic_n for_o make_v new_a article_n in_o faith_n tough_a my_o task_n be_v chief_o to_o follow_v the_o doctor_n in_o his_o quotation_n and_o note_n as_o he_o go_v along_o some_o few_o of_o his_o many_o error_n yet_o touch_v i_o must_v a_o little_a on_o a_o discourse_n he_o be_v please_v to_o begin_v with_o chapter_n the_o first_o it_o seem_v to_o enervate_a much_o our_o christian_a faith_n and_o weaken_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o most_o ancient_a council_n page_z then_o the_o four_o and_o first_o section_n he_o hold_v the_o two_o testament_n the_o word_n of_o 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or_o otherwise_o find_v necessary_n etc._n etc._n thus_o diana_n far_o of_o from_o that_o high_a sense_n the_o doctor_n set_v down_o read_v he_o in_o his_o compendium_n rhoan_n print_n 1644._o verbo_fw-la furtum_fw-la pag._n 335._o n._n 18._o page_n 155._o the_o doctor_n say_v that_o it_o be_v affirm_v and_o be_v practise_v by_o a_o whole_a council_n of_o bishop_n at_o constance_n that_o faith_n be_v not_o to_o be_v keep_v with_o heretic_n and_o john_n hus_n and_o hierom_n of_o prague_n feel_v the_o mischief_n of_o violation_n of_o public_a faith_n etc._n etc._n answ_n a_o old_a story_n and_o as_o false_a as_o old_a for_o first_o the_o council_n never_o determine_v that_o faith_n give_v by_o ecclesiastical_a power_n to_o a_o heretic_n be_v not_o to_o be_v keep_v nay_o it_o hold_v itself_o oblige_v to_o stand_v to_o such_o a_o promise_n faithful_o also_o comply_v with_o it_o in_o the_o after_o council_n of_o basil_n and_o trent_n yet_o more_o this_o council_n hold_v that_o a_o secular_a 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indices_fw-la mention_v in_o the_o same_o page_n of_o our_o doctor_n deserve_a correction_n whole_o contrary_a to_o the_o original_n chap._n iii_o the_o doctor_n quotation_n not_o right_a prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a prove_v a_o purgatory_n to_o what_o the_o doctor_n have_v in_o his_o 2d_o section_n page_n the_o 14_o concern_v the_o power_n of_o make_v new_a article_n we_o have_v answer_v already_o and_o say_v that_o the_o church_n coin_v no_o novelty_n yet_o may_v explicit_o declare_v what_o ancient_o be_v believe_v implicit_o the_o declaration_n be_v new_a the_o substance_n of_o the_o article_n as_o old_a as_o christianity_n in_o the_o next_o page_n after_o he_o have_v a_o fling_n at_o a_o new_a article_n ready_a for_o stamp_n concern_v the_o immaculate_a conception_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n which_o be_v more_o than_o he_o know_v he_o pass_v to_o his_o three_o section_n of_o indulgence_n page_n 16._o where_o he_o cite_v st._n antoninus_n archbishop_n of_o florence_n part_n 1._o summae_fw-la cap._n 3._o say_v we_o have_v nothing_o express_o for_o indulgence_n in_o scripture_n etc._n etc._n the_o doctor_n omit_v what_o follow_v immediate_o quamvis_fw-la ad_fw-la hoc_fw-la inducatur_fw-la illud_fw-la apostoli_fw-la 2._o cor_fw-la 2._o si_fw-la quid_fw-la donavi_fw-la vobis_fw-la propter_fw-la vos_fw-la in_o persona_fw-la christi_fw-la although_o say_v antoninus_n that_o of_o the_o apostle_n be_v allege_v si_fw-la quid_fw-la etc._n etc._n he_o cite_v again_o our_o bishop_n fisher_n in_o art_n 18._o lutheri_fw-la to_o this_o sense_n at_o the_o beginning_n of_o the_o church_n there_o be_v no_o use_n of_o indulgence_n answer_v he_o say_v it_o not_o so_o absolute_o but_o with_o this_o interrogation_n quis_fw-la jam_fw-la de_fw-la indulgentjis_fw-la mirari_fw-la potest_fw-la and_o express_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o that_o article_n have_v these_o word_n fuit_fw-la tamen_fw-la non_fw-la nullus_fw-la earum_fw-la usus_fw-la ut_fw-la aiunt_fw-la apud_fw-la romanos_fw-la 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say_v he_o the_o father_n do_v pray_v for_o the_o dead_a but_o how_o that_o god_n will_v show_v they_o mercy_n and_o hasten_v their_o resurrection_n etc._n etc._n mark_v well_o that_o god_n will_v show_v they_o mercy_n whence_o i_o argue_v if_o the_o soul_n pray_v for_o be_v in_o heaven_n they_o have_v mercy_n the_o sentence_n be_v give_v for_o their_o eternal_a happiness_n if_o in_o hell_n they_o be_v whole_o destitute_a of_o mercy_n vain_a therefore_o be_v the_o prayer_n of_o the_o father_n for_o mercy_n unless_o there_o be_v a_o three_o place_n where_o mercy_n can_v be_v show_v they_o i_o will_v willing_o know_v of_o the_o doctor_n if_o he_o will_v deal_v candid_o what_o st._n augustine_n ingenious_a meaning_n be_v when_o he_o pray_v thus_o for_o his_o mother_n monica_n lib._n 9_o confess_v cap._n 13._o dimitte_v illi_fw-la &_o tu_fw-la debita_fw-la sva_fw-la si_fw-la qua_fw-la etiam_fw-la contraxerit_fw-la post_fw-la tot_fw-la annos_fw-la post_fw-la aquam_fw-la salutis_fw-la forgive_v my_o mother_n her_o debt_n if_o she_o have_v after_o so_o many_o year_n contract_v any_o since_o baptism_n what_o be_v these_o debt_n again_o
st._n cyprian_a and_o st._n hierom_n now_o cite_v hoc_fw-la erant_fw-la utique_fw-la say_v the_o first_o caeteri_fw-la apostoli_fw-la quod_fw-la fuit_fw-la petrus_n pari_fw-la consortio_fw-la praediti_fw-la that_o be_v equal_a in_o this_o fellowship_n and_o office_n of_o be_v apostle_n sed_fw-la primatus_fw-la petro_n datur_fw-la but_o the_o primacy_n be_v give_v to_o peter_n where_o you_o see_v that_o cyprian_a clear_o grant_v a_o equality_n common_a to_o the_o whole_a college_n of_o apostle_n and_o withal_o establish_v a_o superiority_n proper_a to_o st._n peter_n only_o either_o the_o word_n of_o this_o saint_n be_v senseless_a or_o the_o distinction_n of_o equality_n in_o many_o and_o supremacy_n in_o one_o must_v stand_v and_o in_o this_o sense_n st._n hieroms_n doctrine_n be_v most_o significant_a without_o gloss_n or_o wrest_v one_o syllable_n exit_fw-la aequo_fw-la super_fw-la eos_fw-la etc._n etc._n the_o strength_n of_o the_o church_n be_v equal_o build_v upon_o the_o apostle_n viz._n as_o master_n as_o doctor_n and_o teacher_n illuminate_v by_o the_o holy_a ghost_n yet_o therefore_o among_o twelve_o one_o be_v choose_v that_o a_o head_n or_o governer_n be_v constitute_v all_o occasion_n of_o schism_n may_v be_v prevent_v here_o be_v certain_o more_o than_o that_o dimunitive_a orderly_a precedency_n our_o doctor_n allow_v good_a st._n peter_n ut_fw-la schismatis_fw-la tollatur_fw-la occasio_fw-la be_v significant_a word_n and_o point_n at_o what_o be_v most_o essential_a to_o the_o church_n the_o unity_n of_o it_o see_v the_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o this_o head_n in_o order_n to_o unity_n most_o solid_o lay_v out_o by_o s._n g._n and_o remember_v well_o what_o i_o be_v to_o show_v that_o st._n hierom_n acknowledge_v a_o equality_n among_o many_o and_o a_o supremacy_n in_o one._n once_o more_o i_o repeat_v it_o equality_n relate_v to_o their_o apostolical_a dignity_n supremacy_n to_o the_o head_n and_o governor_n 2._o i_o draw_v this_o distinction_n of_o apostles-ship_n in_o all_o and_o head-ship_n in_o one_o from_o st._n gregory_n the_o great_a lib._n 2._o epist_n 38._o indictione_n 13._o so_o it_o be_v with_o i_o in_o his_o work_n print_v at_o antwerp_n anno_fw-la 1572._o though_o other_o cite_v lib._n 4._o certain_o say_v the_o saint_n petrus_n apostolus_fw-la primum_fw-la membrum_fw-la sanctae_fw-la &_o universalis_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la est_fw-la paulus_n joannes_n andreas_n quid_fw-la aliud_fw-la quam_fw-la singularium_fw-la sant_z capita_fw-la &_o tamen_fw-la sub_fw-la uno_fw-la capite_fw-la omnes_fw-la membra_fw-la sunt_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la st._n peter_n be_v the_o first_o member_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n the_o other_o apostle_n not_o so_o nor_o in_o like_a manner_n universal_a yet_o with_o this_o supremacy_n in_o peter_n our_o opponent_n must_v acknowledge_v a_o equality_n of_o their_o apostle-ship_n i_o will_v add_v one_o word_n more_o and_o tell_v you_o though_o the_o doctor_n shall_v allege_v out_o of_o some_o father_n that_o st._n paul_n may_v be_v right_o style_v the_o head_n of_o nation_n and_o be_v say_v to_o have_v have_v a_o principality_n over_o the_o church_n yet_o the_o difference_n between_o he_o and_o st._n peter_n be_v most_o remarkable_a st._n paul_n and_o the_o other_o apostle_n have_v this_o principality_n as_o legate_n by_o extraordinary_a concession_n st._n peter_n have_v it_o over_o the_o whole_a church_n in_o solidum_fw-la yes_o over_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o as_o pastor_n ordinary_a i_o say_v over_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o so_o anacletus_fw-la scholar_n to_o st._n prter_v cite_v by_o remumdus_n rufus_n in_o molinaeum_n pag._n 86._o inter_fw-la beatos_fw-la apostolos_fw-la say_v he_o fuit_fw-la quaedam_fw-la discretio_fw-la &_o licet_fw-la omnes_fw-la essent_fw-la apostoli_fw-la petro_n tamen_fw-la a_o domino_fw-la est_fw-la consessum_fw-la &_o ipsi_fw-la inter_fw-la se_fw-la voluerunt_fw-la id_fw-la ipsum_fw-la ut_fw-la reliquis_fw-la praeesset_fw-la apostolis_n &_o cephas_n id_fw-la est_fw-la caput_fw-la &_o principium_fw-la teneret_fw-la apostolatus_fw-la there_o be_v a_o difference_n a_o distinction_n among_o the_o bless_a apostle_n and_o although_o all_o be_v apostle_n yet_o our_o lord_n give_v to_o peter_n and_o the_o other_o apostle_n among_o themselves_o will_v the_o same_o thing_n that_o peter_n shall_v be_v superior_a to_o the_o rest_n and_o cephas_n that_o be_v head_n and_o chief_a of_o apostleship_n see_v this_o authority_n more_o large_o in_o the_o cannon_n law_n decreti_fw-la prima_fw-la par_fw-fr distinct_a 22._o cap._n 2._o and_o never_o leave●_n of_o to_o wonder_v at_o the_o bold_a assertion_n of_o our_o doctor_n pag._n 65._o viz._n that_o by_o the_o law_n of_o christ_n one_o bishop_n be_v not_o superior_a to_o another_o christ_n give_v the_o power_n to_o all_o alike_o he_o make_v no_o head_n of_o the_o bishop_n he_o give_v to_o none_o a_o supremacy_n of_o power_n etc._n etc._n so_o the_o doctor_n in_o the_o same_o pag._n 65._o he_o fill_v his_o margin_n with_o a_o cluster_n of_o author_n but_o to_o what_o purpose_n god_n only_o know_v if_o they_o be_v to_o prove_v that_o apostolical_a power_n be_v and_o shall_v be_v ever_o in_o the_o church_n we_o grant_v it_o to_o the_o pope_n of_o rome_n if_o to_o prove_v that_o bishop_n succeed_v the_o apostle_n in_o all_o privilege_n and_o ample_a power_n they_o have_v in_o the_o church_n not_o one_o father_n in_o the_o doctor_n margin_n assert_n it_o though_o in_o a_o real_a sense_n bishop_n that_o have_v a_o true_a mission_n may_v be_v call_v the_o apostle_n successor_n by_o reason_n of_o their_o duty_n which_o be_v to_o uphold_v the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n teach_v by_o the_o apostle_n by_o reason_n of_o their_o spiritual_a power_n and_o princely_a and_o priestly_a dignity_n and_o this_o be_v all_o st._n irenaeus_n say_v in_o the_o place_n cite_v by_o the_o doctor_n lib._n 4._o cap._n 43._o quapropter_fw-la eye_n qui_fw-la in_o ecclesia_fw-la sunt_fw-la praesbiteris_fw-la obaudire_fw-la oportet_fw-la he_o qui_fw-la successionem_fw-la habent_fw-la ab_fw-la apostolis_n wherefore_o we_o ought_v to_o obey_v those_o who_o be_v priest_n in_o the_o church_n those_o who_o have_v succession_n from_o the_o apostle_n thus_o st._n irenaeus_n and_o the_o other_o father_n say_v no_o more_o i_o see_v not_o to_o what_o purpose_n the_o doctor_n cite_v those_o word_n of_o st._n paul_n we_o be_v ambassador_n or_o legate_n for_o christ_n unless_o it_o be_v to_o prove_v what_o i_o assert_v above_o that_o the_o other_o apostle_n though_o prince_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o pastor_n ordinary_a as_o st._n peter_n be_v less_o do_v i_o know_v why_o the_o preface_n of_o the_o mass_n quos_fw-la operis_fw-la tui_fw-la vicarios_fw-la etc._n etc._n be_v bring_v in_o pastor_n they_o be_v but_o all_o subordinate_a to_o st._n peter_n as_o i_o have_v show_v in_o his_o pag._n 66._o he_o jerk_n the_o jesuit_n monk_n and_o cajetane_a for_o defend_v the_o pope_n authority_n over_o bishop_n but_o frivolous_a story_n be_v but_o weak_a argument_n yet_o the_o best_a the_o doctor_n have_v at_o hand_n next_o he_o cite_v pope_n elutherius_n say_v that_o christ_n commit_v the_o universal_a church_n to_o bishop_n how_o good_a doctor_n that_o every_o bishop_n have_v jurisdiction_n over_o the_o universal_a church_n it_o be_v very_o strange_a the_o bishop_n of_o down_n and_o connor_n will_v not_o pretend_v to_o such_o a_o power_n christ_n indeed_o commit_v the_o universal_a church_n to_o bishop_n by_o part_n or_o portion_n whereof_o the_o whole_a church_n be_v make_v yet_o ever_o with_o subordination_n to_o one_o head_n which_o prevent_v schism_n and_o conserves_n unity_n page_n 67._o he_o cite_v the_o famous_a word_n of_o st._n cyprian_n the_o church_n of_o christ_n be_v one_o through_o the_o whole_a world_n divide_v by_o he_o into_o many_o member_n and_o the_o bishopric_n be_v but_o one_o etc._n etc._n no_o hurt_n in_o this_o which_o make_v against_o the_o doctor_n for_o if_o the_o whole_a church_n of_o christ_n be_v right_o call_v one_o bishopric_n there_o must_v be_v certain_o one_o head_n over_o so_o vast_a a_o bishopric_n no_o other_o can_v be_v but_o the_o pope_n who_o govern_v in_o ecclesiastical_a affair_n other_o bishop_n have_v only_o a_o portion_n in_o the_o flock_n he_o next_o cite_v you_o pope_n symmachus_n his_o word_n apud_fw-la baronium_n tomo_fw-la 6._o anno_fw-la d._n 499._o num_fw-la 36._o but_o false_o for_o symmachus_n write_v to_o eonius_n speak_v thus_o nam_fw-la dum_fw-la ad_fw-la trinitatis_fw-la instar_fw-la cujus_fw-la una_fw-la est_fw-la atque_fw-la individua_fw-la potestas_fw-la unum_fw-la sit_fw-la per_fw-la diversos_fw-la antistites_fw-la sacerdotium_fw-la as_o in_o the_o bless_a trinity_n who_o power_n be_v one_o and_o individual_a so_o their_o be_v one_o priesthood_n our_o doctor_n read_v one_o bishopric_n among_o divers_a bishop_n and_o thus_o he_o read_v after_o he_o have_v thrust_v in_o a_o parenthesis_n of_o his_o own_o head_n not_o in_o symmachus_n his_o letter_n but_o the_o worst_a be_v the_o inference_n he_o draw_v from_o symmachus_n his_o word_n they_o be_v speak_v say_v he_o
god_n in_o the_o operation_n of_o sacrament_n be_v the_o prime_n efficient_a cause_n of_o grace_n christ_n the_o meritorious_a sacrament_n the_o instrumental_a now_o whether_o they_o work_v by_o a_o intrinsical_a virtue_n imprint_v as_o it_o be_v on_o they_o or_o be_v otherwise_o effectual_a concern_v nothing_o catholic_n religion_n supernatural_a inherent_a grace_n we_o receive_v by_o they_o when_o a_o soul_n be_v fit_o dispose_v this_o be_v our_o doctrine_n yet_o we_o have_v more_o obscure_a divinity_n for_o he_o tell_v we_o we_o teach_v that_o sacrament_n be_v not_o so_o much_o to_o increase_v grace_n as_o to_o make_v amends_o for_o the_o want_n of_o grace_n god_n only_o know_v what_o he_o mean_v by_o this_o make_n amends_o for_o the_o want_n of_o grace_n i_o do_v not_o qui_fw-la potest_fw-la capere_fw-la capiat_fw-la we_o say_v without_o this_o make_n amends_o that_o grace_n be_v effectual_o give_v in_o every_o sacrament_n to_o that_o soul_n that_o come_v worthy_o dispose_v the_o doctor_n in_o his_o 12._o section_n page_n 144._o talk_v of_o idolatry_n but_o not_o understand_v what_o idolatry_n be_v nor_o our_o divine_n tenet_n concern_v the_o worship_n he_o speak_v of_o fight_v against_o shadow_n i_o will_v only_o leave_v he_o to_o mr._n thorndike_n a_o great_a divine_a of_o his_o own_o to_o learn_v of_o he_o what_o idolatry_n be_v and_o how_o far_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v to_o be_v charge_v with_o it_o and_o what_o the_o consequence_n of_o such_o a_o charge_n will_v be_v mr._n thorndike_n in_o his_o just_a weight_n and_o measure_n chap._n 1._o discourse_v it_o at_o large_a he_o say_v pag._n 2._o if_o the_o pope_n be_v antichrist_n and_o the_o papist_n idolater_n we_o need_v not_o seek_v far_o for_o the_o reason_n of_o the_o distance_n we_o be_v to_o own_o the_o separation_n for_o our_o own_o act_n and_o glory_n in_o it_o he_o say_v again_o pag._n 7._o if_o it_o be_v true_a viz._n that_o the_o papist_n be_v guilty_a of_o idolatry_n we_o can_v without_o renounce_v our_o christianity_n hold_v communion_n with_o those_o who_o we_o charge_v with_o it_o so_o that_o if_o this_o section_n of_o our_o doctor_n which_o charge_v we_o with_o idolatry_n be_v true_a mr._n thorndike_n tell_v he_o there_o be_v no_o need_n of_o seek_v far_o for_o the_o reason_n of_o the_o distance_n this_o must_v be_v it_o viz._n that_o they_o can_v not_o hold_v communion_n with_o idolater_n without_o renounce_v their_o christianity_n and_o therefore_o they_o part_v which_o separation_n they_o own_o for_o their_o own_o act_n and_o glory_n in_o it_o yet_o mr._n thorndike_n say_v that_o if_o this_o be_v the_o best_a reason_n they_o can_v give_v for_o their_o separation_n they_o must_v acknowledge_v themselves_o to_o be_v the_o schismatic_n his_o own_o word_n be_v cap._n 1._o pag._n 7._o line_n 14._o for_o in_o plain_a term_n we_o make_v ourselves_o schismatic_n by_o ground_v our_o reformation_n upon_o this_o pretence_n and_o again_o in_o the_o same_o page_n line_n 29._o so_o that_o say_v he_o shall_v this_o church_n declare_v that_o the_o charge_n which_o we_o call_v reformation_n be_v ground_v upon_o this_o supposition_n i_o must_v then_o acknowledge_v that_o we_o be_v the_o schismatic_n now_o that_o this_o pretence_n and_o this_o supposition_n be_v the_o same_o which_o our_o doctor_n in_o his_o section_n pretend_v and_o suppose_v we_o to_o be_v guilty_a of_o viz._n idolatry_n be_v evident_a by_o the_o whole_a chapter_n now_o quote_v and_o by_o the_o content_n of_o it_o print_v before_o the_o chapter_n which_o end_n thus_o they_o that_o separate_v from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n as_o idolater_n be_v thereby_o schismatic_n before_o god_n how_o the_o doctor_n will_v answer_v this_o to_o his_o own_o brother_n i_o neither_o know_v nor_o care_n nor_o can_v i_o see_v how_o he_o can_v possible_o avoid_v the_o imputation_n of_o schism_n in_o mr._n thorndik_n judgement_n for_o he_o believe_v or_o else_o he_o cheat_v his_o charge_n that_o we_o be_v idolater_n if_o he_o do_v he_o must_v in_o mr._n thorndikes_n opinion_n and_o in_o all_o reason_n make_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o his_o separation_n and_o if_o he_o do_v do_v so_o he_o be_v a_o schismatic_a before_o god_n say_v mr._n thorndike_n this_o may_v serve_v for_o answer_v to_o his_o charge_n in_o general_a his_o particular_a instance_n in_o what_o we_o be_v idolater_n be_v worship_v of_o image_n say_v he_o be_v a_o direct_a breach_n of_o the_o second_o commandment_n a_o act_n of_o idolatry_n as_o much_o as_o the_o heathen_n themselves_o be_v guilty_a of_o etc._n etc._n mr._n thorndike_n shall_v answer_v for_o we_o again_o in_o the_o book_n before_o cite_v cap._n 19_o in_o the_o content_n whereof_o you_o may_v read_v this_o proposition_n reverence_v of_o image_n in_o church_n be_v not_o idolatry_n in_o this_o chapter_n page_n 126._o towards_o the_o bottom_n he_o have_v these_o word_n whether_o or_o no_o have_v image_n in_o church_n be_v a_o breach_n of_o the_o second_o commandment_n can_v be_v no_o more_o question_n then_o whither_o or_o not_o to_o have_v any_o image_n be_v a_o breach_n of_o it_o for_o it_o must_v forbid_v image_n in_o church_n because_o it_o forbid_v all_o image_n etc._n etc._n this_o and_o what_o follow_v in_o that_o chap._n clear_v the_o have_v of_o image_n in_o church_n from_o be_v a_o breach_n of_o the_o second_o commandment_n now_o to_o clear_v the_o reverence_v or_o worship_v of_o they_o from_o be_v idolatry_n read_v the_o same_o chapter_n on_o and_z page_z 127._o line_n 31._o you_o shall_v find_v these_o word_n but_o to_o the_o image_n of_o saint_n there_o can_v be_v no_o idolatry_n so_o long_o as_o man_n take_v they_o sore_a saint_n that_o be_v god_n creature_n much_o less_o to_o the_o image_n of_o our_o lord_n for_o it_o be_v the_o honour_n of_o our_o lord_n and_o not_o of_o his_o image_n and_o again_o line_n the_o last_o of_o this_o page_n and_z page_z 128._o nay_o the_o council_n itself_o mean_v the_o 2._o of_o nice_a though_o it_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o image_n itself_o be_v honour_v by_o the_o honour_n give_v to_o that_o which_o it_o signify_v before_o the_o image_n yet_o it_o distinguish_v this_o honour_n from_o the_o honour_n of_o our_o lord_n and_o therefore_o teach_v not_o idolatry_n by_o teach_v to_o honour_v image_n though_o it_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o image_n itself_o be_v honour_v when_o it_o need_v not_o this_o be_v quite_o contrary_a to_o our_o doctor_n divinity_n the_o pious_a child_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n may_v believe_v which_o they_o please_v of_o these_o two_o great_a divine_n the_o one_o be_v a_o bishop_n but_o the_o other_o seem_v the_o more_o wary_a man_n for_o he_o make_v a_o cautious_a proposal_n in_o the_o 1_o chap._n of_o his_o book_n quote_v before_o page_n 2._o line_n 14._o it_o be_v good_a say_v he_o that_o we_o do_v understand_v one_o another_o and_o line_n 30._o yet_o it_o be_v necessary_a to_o provide_v that_o we_o contradict_v not_o ourselves_o 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consecrate_a bread_n and_o wine_n mr._n thorndike_n shall_v once_o more_o answer_v for_o we_o who_o by_o good_a luck_n have_v the_o very_a instance_n of_o the_o pagan_n worship_v the_o sun_n which_o our_o doctor_n say_v be_v all_o one_o with_o our_o worship_v the_o consecrate_a bread_n and_o wine_n but_o mr._n thorndike_n i_o dare_v say_v will_v not_o believe_v he_o until_o he_o answer_v the_o beginning_n of_o his_o 19_o chap._n quote_v before_o page_n 125._o the_o content_n of_o which_o at_o the_o very_a beginning_n have_v this_o proposition_n the_o worship_n of_o the_o host_n in_o the_o papacy_n be_v not_o idolatry_n if_o our_o doctor_n will_v undertake_v to_o satisfy_v mr._n thorndike_n that_o he_o be_v mistake_v in_o what_o he_o here_o profess_v to_o teach_v i_o presume_v he_o will_v oblige_v he_o high_o for_o he_o ask_v pag._n 5._o line_n 22._o