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sense_n doctrine_n scripture_n tradition_n 1,725 5 9.4842 5 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A64146 An answer to a book entituled An account of the Church Catholike where it was before the Reformation; and whether Rome were or be the Church Catholike. Wherein is proved, that the Catholike Church never was, nor can be distinct from that which is now called, the Church of Rome. By R.T. Esquire. R. T. 1654 (1654) Wing T42; ESTC R221978 68,689 169

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successor_n for_o no_o particular_a church_n or_o person_n ever_o be_v or_o can_v be_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n that_o deny_v or_o question_v this_o doctrine_n or_o that_o refuse_v to_o yield_v obedience_n to_o the_o sea_n of_o rome_n as_o the_o head_n and_o mother_n of_o all_o church_n and_o to_o the_o bishop_n thereof_o as_o christ_n vicar_n general_n on_o earth_n how_o then_o come_v you_o in_o england_n to_o find_v out_o that_o at_o last_o which_o your_o ancestor_n for_o almost_o 1000_o year_n can_v not_o discover_v they_o all_o even_a from_o the_o first_o conversion_n of_o this_o nation_n to_o the_o christian_a faith_n by_o st._n augustine_n to_o k._n hen._n eight_o defection_n be_v subject_a to_o the_o sea_n of_o rome_n and_o to_o the_o bishop_n thereof_o as_o christ_n immediate_a vicar_n and_o under_o he_o the_o supreme_a head_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n how_o come_v you_o to_o be_v wise_a than_o all_o your_o forefather_n and_o the_o whole_a world_n 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act._n 16._o 18._o but_o the_o doctor_n be_v much_o scandalize_v at_o the_o maim_v of_o the_o lord_n supper_n so_o that_o if_o there_o be_v no_o other_o cause_n then_o that_o he_o can_v not_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n sect._n 11._o it_o seem_v doctor_n boughen_n can_v content_v himself_o with_o that_o wherewith_o the_o good_a primitive_a christian_n be_v all_o satisfy_v they_o can_v be_v content_v to_o carry_v the_o bless_a sacrament_n to_o their_o house_n and_o reserve_v it_o there_o for_o time_n of_o necessity_n under_o one_o species_n they_o think_v it_o sufficient_a to_o minister_v it_o to_o their_o sick_a under_o the_o species_n of_o bread_n only_o to_o their_o child_n when_o that_o by_o some_o be_v think_v necessary_a under_o the_o species_n of_o wine_n only_o but_o the_o doctor_n will_v have_v both_o or_o none_o none_o of_o the_o ancient_a father_n nor_o the_o most_o learned_a of_o all_o the_o primitive_a christian_n can_v ever_o find_v it_o in_o 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this_o vigilius_n or_o of_o any_o other_o pope_n whatsoever_o only_o in_o general_a term_n he_o say_v that_o some_o pope_n have_v apostatise_v which_o be_v nothing_o to_o this_o purpose_n 28._o to_o the_o question_n where_o your_o church_n be_v before_o the_o reformation_n sect._n 19_o i_o suppose_v mr._n t._n b._n use_v not_o the_o word_n reformation_n but_o by_o it_o i_o conceive_v youmean_v your_o separation_n from_o the_o roman_a church_n to_o this_o question_n you_o say_v it_o be_v answer_v in_o the_o catholic_a answ_n i_o confess_v the_o answer_n be_v most_o true_a when_o you_o be_v a_o church_n you_o be_v in_o the_o catholic_a church_n so_o also_o be_v former_o the_o arrian_n macedonian_n pelagian_o nestorian_n entychian_o donatist_n etc._n etc._n all_o these_o before_o their_o respective_a reformation_n that_o be_v before_o they_o fall_v into_o heresy_n and_o schism_n be_v within_o the_o wall_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n before_o their_o separation_n they_o be_v all_o in_o 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the_o same_o nay_o i_o will_v go_v further_o can_v you_o produce_v any_o one_o man_n in_o any_o age_n from_o christ_n passion_n to_o luther_n apostasia_fw-la let_v he_o be_v of_o the_o clergy_n or_o laity_n either_o catholic_a or_o heretic_n that_o agree_v with_o you_o in_o all_o point_n of_o your_o faith_n and_o doctrine_n wherein_o you_o now_o dissent_v from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n if_o you_o can_v methinks_v yourselves_o shall_v condemn_v yourselves_o for_o separate_v from_o that_o church_n in_o who_o faith_n and_o communion_n all_o your_o ancestor_n for_o so_o many_o age_n live_v and_o die_v and_o embrace_v a_o new_a doctrine_n and_o that_o out_o of_o your_o own_o judgement_n and_o fancy_n only_o for_o which_o you_o have_v neither_o precedent_n nor_o authority_n 30._o and_o yet_o i_o must_v confess_v that_o your_o religion_n be_v not_o altogether_o now_o it_o be_v a_o religion_n for_o the_o most_o part_n patch_v up_o of_o old_a condemn_a heresy_n though_o there_o be_v never_o 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and_o interpretation_n of_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n you_o confess_v that_o before_o your_o reformation_n as_o you_o call_v it_o you_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n how_o come_v you_o to_o find_v that_o the_o church_n want_v a_o reformation_n and_o that_o in_o doctrine_n for_o in_o matter_n of_o discipline_n and_o manner_n you_o may_v have_v reform_v yourselves_o and_o yet_o still_o have_v be_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n how_o come_v you_o to_o discover_v those_o error_n which_o none_o in_o the_o whole_a christian_a world_n beside_o yourselves_o can_v perceive_v before_o your_o separation_n there_o be_v no_o particular_a branch_n or_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n but_o be_v in_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n how_o then_o come_v you_o to_o see_v that_o light_n which_o none_o beside_o yourselves_o can_v see_v be_v all_o the_o world_n beside_o you_o blind_a have_v you_o only_o the_o scripture_n or_o can_v you_o only_o interpret_v they_o but_o why_o do_v i_o speak_v of_o you_o as_o of_o a_o company_n or_o multitude_n for_o though_o time_n have_v now_o make_v the_o difference_n to_o be_v between_o the_o protestant_n and_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n yet_o original_o it_o be_v between_o luther_n and_o the_o whole_a church_n you_o in_o england_n as_o all_o other_o protestant_n be_v but_o luther_n follower_n the_o church_n then_o go_v one_o way_n and_o luther_n another_o and_o you_o very_o wise_o have_v forsake_v the_o whole_a church_n and_o follow_v luther_n do_v but_o examine_v this_o according_a to_o the_o principle_n of_o common_a prudence_n and_o then_o tell_v i_o doctor_z whether_o you_o have_v do_v discreet_o you_o have_v forsake_v the_o whole_a christian_a world_n and_o follow_v one_o man_n who_o neither_o have_v nor_o pretend_v to_o any_o extraordinary_a call_n he_o never_o wrought_v miracle_n in_o confirmation_n of_o his_o new_a doctrine_n or_o to_o manifest_v to_o the_o world_n that_o god_n have_v reveal_v that_o truth_n unto_o he_o which_o for_o many_o age_n have_v be_v total_o obscure_v and_o unknown_a to_o the_o world_n it_o be_v then_o your_o fault_n now_o that_o you_o communicate_v not_o with_o the_o catholic_a church_n since_o it_o be_v your_o fault_n former_o that_o you_o forsake_v she_o to_o follow_v one_o man_n if_o you_o will_v forsake_v that_o single_a apostate_n and_o return_v to_o your_o faith_n and_o obedience_n you_o shall_v soon_o be_v receive_v the_o church_n arm_n be_v always_o open_a to_o embrace_v you_o before_o your_o pretend_a reformation_n according_a to_o your_o own_o confession_n sect._n 19_o you_o communicate_v with_o rome_n that_o be_v you_o acknowledge_v your_o subjection_n to_o the_o apostolic_a sea_n of_o rome_n you_o confess_v the_o bishop_n thereof_o to_o be_v the_o supreme_a visible_a head_n of_o christ_n church_n appoint_v by_o christ_n himself_o to_o be_v so_o as_o st._n peter_n
unanimiter_fw-la &_o nobiscum_fw-la conspirat_fw-la basil_n epist_n 293._o here_o you_o see_v the_o whole_a western_a church_n vindicate_v from_o that_o heresy_n which_o doubtless_o s._n hilary_n well_o know_v those_o then_o in_o france_n that_o retain_v their_o ancient_a faith_n keep_v themselves_o within_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o roman_a catholic_a church_n from_o who_o communion_n never_o yet_o any_o separate_v but_o schismatic_n and_o heretic_n 34._o the_o n●x●_n father_n of_o the_o church_n that_o i_o m●et_v with_o be_v archbishop_n lawd_n as_o you_o be_v please_v to_o call_v he_o who_o authority_n you_o have_v often_o cite_v which_o i_o can_v but_o wonder_v at_o since_o he_o be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v a_o father_n that_o he_o neither_o liu●d_v nor_o die_v a_o son_n of_o the_o church_n but_o the_o doctor_n out_o of_o that_o pretend_a arch-bishop_n book_n charge_v ●h●_n church_n of_o rome_n with_o four_o opinion_n ●●pugnant_a to_o th●_n pl●in_a word_n of_o scripture_n viz._n 1._o transubstantiation_n 2_o administration_n of_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n to_o the_o laity_n in_o one_o kind_n 3._o invocation_n of_o saint_n 4._o adoration_n of_o image_n answ_n though_o it_o be_v not_o much_o pertinent_a to_o our_o present_a purpose_n to_o examine_v these_o doctrine_n according_a to_o scripture_n since_o the_o doctor_n conf●ss●s_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n notwithstanding_o her_o error_n be_v a_o tr●●_n church_n and_o a_o member_n of_o the_o one_o catholic_n sect._n 12._o yet_o because_o he_o believe_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v just_o charge_v with_o th●se_a ●nsound_a and_o un-catholike_a doctrine_n as_o ●●_o be_v please_v to_o ca●●_n they_o i_o can_v not_o pass_v they_o by_o but_o shall_v endeavour_v as_o brief_o as_o may_v be_v to_o vindicate_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n from_o that_o foul_a and_o false_a calumny_n 35_o first_n then_o transubstantiation_n according_a to_o the_o roman_a catholic_a doctrine_n be_v a_o true_a and_o real_a change_n of_o the_o total_a substance_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n after_z and_o by_o virtue_n of_o the_o word_n of_o consecration_n pronounce_v by_o the_o priest_n into_o the_o true_a real_a and_o substantial_a body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n let_v we_o now_o examine_v how_o this_o doctrine_n be_v repugnant_a to_o the_o plain_a word_n of_o scripture_n our_o bless_a saviour_n say_v matth._n 26._o 26_o and_o ma●_n 14._o 22._o this_o be_v my_o body_n and_o this_o be_v my_o blood_n the_o word_n be_v plain_a and_o be_v take_v literal_o must_v necessary_o import_v a_o change_n for_o that_o which_o be_v before_o bread_n and_o wine_n after_o our_o saviour_n consecration_n be_v according_a to_o the_o proper_a and_o literal_a sense_n of_o the_o word_n the_o very_a body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n where_o be_v then_o the_o repugnancy_n between_o this_o doctrine_n and_o the_o plain_a word_n of_o scripture_n christ_n say_v of_o that_o which_o be_v bread_n and_o wine_n this_o be_v my_o body_n and_o this_o be_v my_o blood_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n say_v so_o ●oo_o instead_o then_o of_o a_o repugnancy_n here_o be_v a_o ful●_n consent_n and_o agreement_n between_o the_o plain_a word●_n of_o our_o saviour_n and_o th●_n doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n well_o but_o the_o word_n be_v not_o to_o be_v take_v literal_o but_o figurative_o be_v it_o so_o then_o be_v this_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n repugnant_a at_o the_o most_o but_o to_o the_o figurative_a sense_n not_o to_o the_o plain_a word_n or_o literal_a sense_n of_o scripture_n but_o to_o come_v close_o if_o the_o doctor_n can_v produce_v any_o one_o text_n of_o scripture_n that_o shall_v be_v but_o half_a as_o plain_a for_o the_o metaphorical_a or_o figurative_a sense_n or_o that_o the_o creature_n of_o '_o bread_n and_o wine_n be_v not_o real_o and_o substantial_o change_v into_o the_o very_a body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n after_o consecration_n but_o retain_v their_o former_a nature_n and_o substance_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n as_o these_o word_n of_o christ_n be_v for_o such_o a_o change_n i_o will_v then_o for_o my_o part_n give_v the_o cause_n and_o turn_v protesiant_a too_o or_o any_o thing_n else_o that_o doctor_n boughen_n shall_v command_v i_o to_o be_v but_o if_o he_o can_v produce_v any_o such_o text_n as_o most_o certain_o he_o can_v then_o be_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o protestant_n and_o not_o that_o of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n repugnant_a to_o the_o plain_a word_n of_o scripture_n 36_o but_o to_o justify_v yourselves_o and_o to_o avoid_v the_o catholic_a doctrine_n of_o the_o real_a presence_n and_o transubstatiation_n you_o thus_o interpret_v those_o word_n this_o be_v my_o body_n etc._n etc._n viz._n this_o be_v a_o sign_n or_o figure_n of_o my_o body_n but_o what_o scripture_n have_v you_o for_o it_o what_o authority_n what_o catholic_a father_n what_o council_n do_v ever_o give_v that_o interpetation_n of_o those_o word_n i_o confess_v if_o there_o be_v no_o true_a and_o real_a change_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n into_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n in_o the_o bless_a sacrament_n then_o will_v i_o also_o admit_v of_o that_o interpretation_n for_o if_o there_o be_v no_o such_o change_n then_o of_o necessity_n those_o creature_n of_o br●ad_n and_o wine_n can_v be_v but_o bare_a sign_n and_o figure_n only_o of_o christ_n body_n and_o blood_n but_o behold_v god_n providence_n over_o his_o church_n the_o holy_a ghost_n before_o see_v the_o evasion_n and_o shift_n that_o some_o man_n will_v use_v to_o delude_v the_o world_n and_o to_o poison_v the_o church_n with_o their_o heretical_a doctrine_n in_o opposition_n to_o god_n sacred_a truth_n have_v in_o st._n luke_n gospel_n 22._o 19_o 20_o utter_o cut_v you_o off_o even_o from_o that_o very_a gloss_n and_o interpretation_n the_o word_n of_o the_o evangelist_n be_v these_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d this_o be_v the_o cup_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n in_o my_o blood_n which_o cup_n be_v shed_v for_o you_o these_o be_v the_o word_n in_o the_o original_a language_n of_o st._n luke_n gospel_n and_o though_o both_o in_o the_o latin_a and_o english_a translation_n the_o relative_n which_v may_v seem_v to_o refer_v to_o blood_n as_o well_o as_o to_o cup_n yet_o in_o the_o greek_a it_o be_v very_o plain_a that_o it_o must_v refer_v to_o cup._n if_o then_o that_o which_o be_v c●●●ained_v in_o the_o cup_n be_v that_o which_o be_v sh●d_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n how_o can_v it_o be_v wine_n o●_n a_o sign_n or_o figure_n ●●ly_o of_o christ_n blood_n or_o any_o thing_n else_o but_o the_o true_a and_o real_a blood_n of_o christ_n for_o no_o sign_n o●_n sigure_n of_o blood_n but_o christ_n true_a and_o real_a precious_a blood_n be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n i_o will_v endeavour_v to_o make_v this_o doctrine_n appear_v more_o plain_a by_o this_o syllogism_n that_o which_o be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n be_v the_o true_a and_o real_a precious_a blood_n of_o christ_n but_o that_o which_o be_v in_o the_o cup_n be_v that_o which_o be_v shed_v for_o the_o fin_n of_o the_o world_n ergo._n that_o which_o be_v in_o the_o cup_n be_v the_o true_a and_o real_a precious_a blood_n of_o christ_n the_o major_a proposition_n can_v be_v deny_v without_o blasphemy_n the_o minor_a be_v most_o plain_a by_o the_o word_n of_o the_o text_n and_o therefore_o the_o conclusion_n must_v necessary_o follow_v here_o be_v no_o fallacy_n doctor_n in_o this_o syllogism_n no_o more_o term_n than_o ought_v to_o be_v in_o a_o syllogism_n but_o to_o utter_o debar_v you_o of_o your_o sign_n or_o figure_n i_o argue_v thus_o that_o which_o be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n be_v not_o a_o sign_n or_o figure_n only_o of_o christ_n blood_n but_o that_o which_o be_v in_o the_o cup_n be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n ergo._n that_o which_o be_v in_o the_o cup_n be_v not_o a_o sign_n or_o figure_n only_o of_o christ_n blood_n those_o word_n then_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d this_o be_v the_o cup_n the_o new_a testament_n in_o my_o blood_n can_v admit_v of_o this_o interpretation_n this_o cup_n be_v a_o sign_n of_o my_o blood_n unless_o you_o will_v grant_v that_o a_o bare_a sign_n of_o christ_n blood_n be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n which_o be_v high_a blasphemy_n for_o it_o be_v very_o plain_a by_o the_o express_a word_n of_o the_o text_n that_o the_o very_a cup_n which_o be_v the_o new_a testament_n in_o christ_n blood_n be_v shed_v for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n wherefore_o that_o cup_n can_v not_o be_v a_o sign_n only_o but_o the_o true_a precious_a blood_n of_o our_o saviour_n wh●t_v say_v you_o doctor_n who_o now_o