rr._n in_o christo_n p._n ac_fw-la d._n d._n wilhelmo_n archiep._n cant._n a_o sac._n dom._n exit_fw-la aedib_n lambeth_n feb._n 4._o 1686._o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o trinity_n and_o transubstantiation_n compare_v as_o to_o scripture_n reason_n and_o tradition_n in_o a_o new_a dialogue_n between_o a_o protestant_n and_o a_o papist_n the_o second_o part_n wherein_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o trinity_n be_v show_v to_o be_v agreeable_a to_o scripture_n and_o reason_n and_o transubstantiation_n repugnant_a to_o both_o london_n print_v for_o william_n rogers_n at_o the_o sun_n in_o fleetstreet_n over_o against_o st._n dunstan_n church_n mdc_o lxxx_o vii_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o trinity_n and_o transubstantiation_n compare_v etc._n etc._n pr._n i_o hope_v you_o be_v now_o at_o leisure_n to_o proceed_v with_o your_o parallel_n between_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o trinity_n and_o transubstantiation_n as_o to_o scripture_n and_o reason_n p._n yes_o and_o be_o resolve_v to_o make_v 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augustin_n who_o make_v it_o impossible_a for_o a_o body_n to_o be_v without_o its_o dimension_n and_o extension_n of_o part_n but_o you_o assert_v a_o body_n may_v be_v without_o they_o or_o else_o it_o can_v be_v after_o the_o manner_n of_o a_o spirit_n as_o you_o say_v it_o be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n p._n i_o pray_v show_v that_o st._n augustin_n make_v it_o inconsistent_a with_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o body_n to_o be_v otherwise_o pr._n he_o say_v that_o all_o body_n how_o gross_a or_o subtle_a soever_o they_o be_v can_v never_o be_v all_o every_o where_o i._n e._n can_v volusian_n be_v indivisible_o present_a after_o the_o manner_n of_o a_o spirit_n but_o must_v be_v extend_v according_a to_o their_o several_a part_n and_o whether_o great_a or_o little_a must_v take_v up_o a_o space_n and_o so_o fill_v the_o place_n that_o it_o can_v be_v all_o in_o any_o one_o part._n be_v this_o possible_a to_o be_v reconcile_v with_o your_o notion_n of_o a_o body_n be_v present_a after_o the_o 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extend_v in_o it_o 51._o p._n but_o he_o do_v not_o speak_v this_o of_o the_o sacrament_n pr._n but_o he_o speak_v it_o of_o all_o body_n wheresoever_o present_a and_o he_o do_v not_o except_o the_o sacrament_n which_o he_o will_v certain_o have_v do_v if_o he_o have_v believe_v as_o you_o do_v concern_v it_o p._n st._n augustin_n may_v have_v particular_a opinion_n in_o this_o as_o he_o have_v in_o other_o thing_n pr._n so_o far_o from_o it_o that_o i_o shall_v make_v it_o appear_v that_o this_o be_v the_o general_a sense_n of_o the_o father_n st._n gregory_n nazianzen_n say_v that_o the_o nature_n of_o body_n require_v that_o they_o have_v figure_n and_o shape_n and_o may_v be_v touch_v and_o see_v and_o circumscribe_v trin._n st._n cyril_n of_o alexandria_n say_v that_o if_o god_n himself_o be_v a_o body_n he_o must_v be_v liable_a to_o the_o property_n of_o body_n and_o he_o must_v be_v in_o a_o place_n as_o body_n be_v and_o all_o those_o father_n who_o prove_v that_o god_n can_v be_v a_o body_n do_v it_o from_o such_o argument_n as_o show_v that_o they_o know_v nothing_o of_o a_o body_n be_v after_o the_o manner_n of_o a_o spirit_n for_o then_o the_o force_n of_o their_o argument_n be_v lose_v which_o be_v take_v from_o the_o essential_a property_n of_o a_o body_n such_o as_o extension_n divisibility_n and_o circumscription_n but_o if_o a_o body_n may_v be_v without_o these_o than_o god_n may_v be_v a_o body_n after_o the_o manner_n of_o a_o spirit_n and_o so_o the_o spirituality_n of_o the_o divine_a nature_n will_v be_v take_v away_o p._n i_o never_o hear_v these_o argument_n before_o and_o must_v take_v some_o time_n to_o consider_v pr._n the_o soon_o the_o better_a and_o i_o be_o sure_a if_o you_o do_v you_o will_v repent_v be_v a_o new_a convert_n but_o i_o have_v yet_o something_o to_o add_v to_o this_o argument_n viz._n that_o those_o who_o have_v state_v the_o difference_n between_o body_n and_o spirit_n have_v make_v extension_n and_o take_v up_o a_o place_n and_o divisibility_n necessary_a 14._o to_o the_o very_o be_v of_o a_o body_n and_o that_o what_o be_v not_o circumscribe_v be_v incorporeal_a p._n methinks_v your_o argument_n run_v out_o to_o a_o great_a length_n i_o pray_v bring_v they_o into_o a_o less_o compass_n pr._n i_o proceed_v to_o a_o three_o argument_n from_o the_o father_n which_o will_v not_o take_v up_o much_o time_n and_o that_o be_v that_o the_o father_n know_v nothing_o of_o the_o subsistence_n of_o accident_n without_o their_o substance_n without_o which_o transubstantiation_n can_v be_v maintain_v and_o therefore_o in_o the_o roman_a school_n the_o possibility_n of_o accident_n subsist_v without_o their_o subject_n be_v defend_v but_o on_o the_o contrary_a maximus_n one_o of_o the_o elder_a 22._o of_o the_o father_n who_o live_v in_o the_o second_o century_n affirm_v it_o to_o be_v of_o the_o essence_n of_o accident_n to_o be_v in_o their_o substance_n st._n basil_n say_v nature_n do_v not_o bear_v a_o distinction_n between_o body_n and_o figure_n although_o reason_n make_v one_o 43._o isidore_n pâ—lusiota_n say_v that_o quality_n can_v be_v without_o substance_n 72._o gregory_n nyssen_n that_o figure_n can_v be_v without_o body_n and_o 24._o that_o a_o body_n can_v be_v conceive_v without_o quality_n and_o that_o if_o we_o take_v away_o colour_n and_o quantity_n and_o resistance_n the_o whole_a notion_n of_o a_o body_n be_v destroy_v take_v away_o space_n from_o body_n say_v st._n augustin_n and_o they_o can_v be_v no_o where_o and_o if_o they_o can_v be_v no_o where_o they_o can_v be_v and_o so_o he_o say_v if_o we_o 9_o take_v away_o body_n from_o their_o quality_n and_o in_o plain_a term_n that_o no_o quality_n as_o colour_n or_o form_n can_v remain_v without_o their_o subject_n and_o that_o no_o accident_n can_v be_v without_o their_o subject_n be_v in_o 12._o general_n affirm_v by_o isidore_n hispalensis_n boethius_n damascen_n and_o other_o who_o give_v a_o account_n of_o the_o philosophy_n of_o the_o ancient_n p._n all_o this_o proceed_v upon_o the_o old_a philosophy_n of_o accident_n what_o if_o there_o be_v none_o at_o all_o pr._n what_o then_o make_v the_o same_o impression_n on_o our_o sense_n when_o the_o substance_n be_v go_v as_o when_o it_o be_v there_o be_v there_o a_o perpetual_a miracle_n to_o deceive_v our_o sense_n but_o it_o be_v impossible_a to_o maintain_v transubstantiation_n as_o it_o be_v define_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n without_o accident_n they_o may_v hold_v some_o other_o doctrine_n in_o the_o place_n of_o it_o but_o they_o can_v hold_v that_o and_o that_o other_o doctrine_n will_v be_v as_o impossible_a to_o be_v understand_v for_o if_o once_o we_o suppose_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n to_o be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n in_o place_n of_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n which_o appear_v to_o our_o sense_n to_o be_v bread_n still_o then_o suppose_v there_o be_v no_o accident_n the_o body_n of_o a_o man_n must_v make_v the_o same_o impression_n on_o our_o sense_n which_o the_o substance_n of_o bread_n do_v which_o be_v so_o horrible_a a_o absurdity_n that_o the_o philosophy_n of_o accident_n can_v imply_v any_o great_a than_o it_o so_o that_o the_o new_a transubstantiator_n have_v as_o good_a return_n to_o the_o old_a mumpsimus_n of_o accident_n p._n i_o suppose_v you_o have_v now_o do_v with_o this_o argument_n pr._n no_o i_o have_v something_o far_a to_o say_v about_o it_o which_o be_v that_o the_o father_n do_v not_o only_o assert_v that_o accident_n can_v be_v without_o their_o subject_n but_o they_o confute_v heretic_n on_o that_o supposition_n which_o show_v their_o assurance_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o it_o irenoeus_n overthrow_v the_o valentinian_n conjugation_n because_o truth_n can_v no_o
be_v do_v to_o god_n only_o on_o the_o account_n of_o his_o incommunicable_a perfection_n and_o therefore_o the_o reason_n of_o divine_a worship_n can_v reach_v to_o any_o creature_n p._n not_o without_o god_n will_v and_o pleasure_n but_o may_v not_o god_n advance_v a_o mere_a creature_n to_o that_o dignity_n as_o to_o require_v divine_a worship_n to_o be_v give_v to_o he_o by_o his_o fellow-creature_n pr._n wherein_o lie_v the_o nature_n of_o that_o which_o you_o call_v proper_a divine_a worship_n p._n in_o a_o due_a esteem_n of_o god_n in_o our_o mind_n as_o the_o first_o cause_n and_o last_o end_n of_o his_o creature_n and_o such_o act_n as_o be_v agreeable_a thereto_o pr._n then_o proper_a divine_a worship_n do_v suppose_v a_o esteem_n of_o god_n as_o infinite_o above_o his_o creature_n and_o how_o then_o be_v it_o possible_a for_o we_o to_o give_v the_o same_o worship_n to_o god_n and_o to_o a_o creature_n for_o if_o the_o distance_n be_v infinite_a between_o god_n and_o his_o creature_n and_o we_o must_v judge_n of_o thing_n as_o they_o be_v than_o we_o must_v in_o our_o mind_n suppose_v a_o creature_n to_o be_v infinite_o distant_a srom_n god_n and_o if_o we_o do_v so_o how_o be_v it_o possible_a to_o give_v the_o same_o divine_a worship_n in_o this_o sense_n to_o god_n and_o to_o any_o creature_n p._n and_o what_o now_o will_v you_o infer_v from_o hence_o pr._n do_v not_o you_o see_v already_o viz._n that_o god_n can_v be_v suppose_v to_o allow_v divine_a worship_n to_o be_v give_v to_o christ_n if_o he_o be_v a_o mere_a creature_n and_o therefore_o since_o such_o divine_a worship_n be_v require_v by_o the_o christian_a doctrine_n it_o follow_v that_o those_o expression_n which_o speak_v of_o his_o be_v one_o with_o the_o father_n can_v be_v figurative_o understand_v p._n but_o where_o be_v it_o that_o such_o divine_a worship_n be_v require_v to_o be_v give_v to_o christ_n in_o scripture_n for_o according_a to_o my_o principle_n the_o church_n be_v to_o set_v the_o bound_n and_o measure_n of_o divine_a worship_n and_o to_o declare_v what_o worship_n be_v due_a to_o god_n what_o to_o christ_n what_o to_o saint_n and_o angel_n what_o to_o man_n upon_o earth_n what_o to_o image_n sacrament_n etc._n etc._n and_o if_o we_o depart_v from_o this_o rule_n i_o know_v not_o where_o we_o shall_v fix_v pr._n i_o pray_v tell_v i_o do_v the_o difference_n between_o god_n and_o his_o creature_n depend_v on_o the_o will_n of_o the_o church_n p._n no._n pr._n be_v it_o then_o in_o the_o church_n power_n to_o give_v that_o to_o a_o creature_n which_o belong_v only_o to_o god_n p._n i_o think_v not_o pr._n who_o then_o be_v to_o be_v judge_n what_o belong_v to_o god_n and_o what_o not_o god_n or_o the_o church_n p._n god_n himself_o if_o he_o please_v pr._n then_o our_o business_n be_v to_o search_v what_o his_o will_n and_o pleasure_n be_v in_o this_o matter_n by_o read_v the_o scripture_n wherein_o his_o will_n be_v contain_v and_o there_o we_o find_v it_o express_v that_o all_o man_n shall_v honour_v the_o son_n even_o as_o they_o honour_v the_o father_n john_n 5._o 23._o let_v all_o the_o angel_n of_o god_n worship_v he_o heb._n 1._o 6._o blessing_n and_o honour_n and_o glory_n and_o power_n be_v unto_o he_o that_o sit_v on_o the_o throne_n and_o to_o the_o lamb_n for_o ever_o and_o ever_o revel_v 4._o 13._o that_o at_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n every_o knee_n shall_v bow_v of_o thing_n in_o heaven_n and_o thing_n in_o earth_n etc._n etc._n phil._n 2._o 9_o if_o it_o be_v god_n great_a design_n by_o the_o christian_a doctrine_n to_o restore_v in_o the_o world_n a_o due_a sense_n of_o the_o infinite_a distance_n between_o god_n and_o his_o creature_n can_v any_o thing_n be_v more_o repugnant_a to_o it_o than_o in_o the_o same_o doctrine_n to_o advance_v a_o creature_n to_o a_o participation_n of_o the_o same_o divine_a honour_n with_o himself_o so_o that_o in_o plain_a truth_n the_o idolatry_n of_o the_o world_n lie_v only_o in_o a_o bad_a choice_n of_o the_o creature_n they_o be_v to_o worship_n and_o not_o in_o give_v proper_a divine_a worship_n to_o a_o creature_n for_o that_o christianity_n itself_o not_o only_o allow_v but_o require_v on_o supposition_n that_o christ_n be_v god_n mere_o by_o office_n and_o be_v original_o a_o creature_n as_o we_o be_v but_o i_o pray_v observe_v the_o force_n of_o the_o apostle_n argument_n speak_v of_o the_o gentile_a idolatry_n he_o say_v it_o lay_v in_o this_o that_o they_o do_v service_n unto_o they_o which_o by_o nature_n be_v no_o god_n gal._n 4._o 8._o p._n you_o know_v i_o must_v now_o personate_v the_o anti-trinitarian_a and_o he_o answer_v that_o by_o nature_n no_o more_o be_v imply_v than_o true_o and_o real_o i._n e._n god_n do_v not_o advance_v those_o creature_n among_o the_o gentile_n to_o that_o worship_n and_o honour_n which_o he_o have_v do_v christ._n pr._n then_o you_o make_v it_o lawful_a by_o the_o gospel_n to_o believe_v christ_n to_o be_v a_o mere_a creature_n and_o at_o the_o same_o time_n to_o give_v he_o divine_a worship_n which_o suppose_v he_o not_o to_o be_v a_o creature_n and_o so_o you_o must_v believe_v he_o to_o be_v a_o creature_n and_o not_o to_o be_v a_o creature_n at_o the_o same_o time_n p._n how_o do_v you_o make_v that_o appear_v pr._n from_o your_o own_o word_n for_o you_o say_v proper_a divine_a worship_n lie_v in_o a_o due_a esteem_n of_o god_n in_o our_o mind_n as_o the_o first_o cause_n and_o last_o end_n and_o in_o action_n agreeable_a thereto_o then_o to_o give_v divine_a worship_n to_o god_n we_o must_v believe_v he_o to_o be_v above_o all_o creature_n as_o to_o his_o nature_n and_o be_v and_o theresore_n to_o give_v christ_n divine_a worship_n must_v imply_v our_o believe_v he_o not_o to_o be_v a_o creature_n and_o to_o be_v a_o creature_n at_o the_o same_o time_n p._n but_o the_o meaning_n of_o divine_a worship_n here_o must_v not_o then_o relate_v to_o act_n of_o the_o mind_n but_o to_o outward_a act_n of_o adoration_n in_o the_o church_n pr._n be_v the_o gentile_n guilty_a of_o idolatry_n in_o that_o respect_n or_o not_o p._n yes_o but_o not_o those_o who_o god_n require_v to_o worship_n in_o such_o a_o manner_n pr._n then_o the_o sin_n of_o gentile-idolatry_n lie_v only_o in_o give_v divine_a worship_n to_o a_o creature_n without_o god_n command_n which_o lessen_v it_o to_o that_o degree_n as_o to_o make_v will-worship_n and_o idolatry_n the_o same_o and_o to_o blame_v the_o apostle_n for_o make_v such_o a_o dreadful_a sin_n of_o it_o and_o dissuade_v christian_n so_o much_o from_o return_v to_o the_o practice_n of_o it_o 21._o for_o they_o have_v the_o privilege_n of_o give_v divine_a worship_n to_o a_o creature_n by_o god_n command_n which_o other_o be_v damn_v for_o do_v without_o a_o command_n which_o make_v the_o christian_a religion_n not_o to_o appear_v so_o reasonable_a as_o the_o anti-trinitarians_a contend_v it_o be_v but_o here_o be_v four_o foul_a mistake_n in_o point_n of_o reason_n which_o they_o be_v guilty_a of_o 1._o in_o make_v the_o sin_n of_o idolatry_n so_o arbitrary_a a_o thing_n which_o depend_v not_o on_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o object_n which_o be_v worship_v but_o on_o the_o will_n and_o pleasure_n of_o god._n 2._o in_o make_v the_o gentile_n guilty_a of_o a_o great_a sin_n mere_o in_o want_v a_o divine_a command_n which_o be_v out_o of_o their_o power_n 3._o in_o make_v the_o christian_a religion_n to_o set_v up_o the_o worship_n of_o a_o creature_n when_o its_o design_n be_v to_o root_v out_o idolatry_n 4._o in_o make_v a_o fictitious_a god_n or_o a_o creature_n to_o be_v advance_v to_o the_o throne_n of_o god._n which_o i_o think_v be_v far_o more_o contradictious_a to_o reason_n than_o a_o trinity_n of_o person_n in_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o same_o nature_n for_o nothing_o can_v be_v more_o absurd_a than_o to_o make_v that_o to_o be_v god_n which_o want_v all_o the_o essential_a attribute_n and_o perfection_n of_o god_n as_o every_o creature_n must_v do_v such_o as_o self-existence_n eternity_n independency_n immensity_n omnipotency_n etc._n etc._n what_o a_o contradiction_n be_v it_o to_o suppose_v a_o weak_a impotent_a depend_v confine_v create_v god_n and_o such_o every_o creature_n must_v be_v in_o its_o nature_n or_o else_o it_o be_v no_o creature_n i_o do_v not_o at_o all_o wonder_n to_o find_v the_o socinian_o after_o this_o to_o lessen_v the_o natural_a knowledge_n of_o god_n and_o his_o infinite_a perfection_n both_o as_o to_o power_n and_o knowledge_n for_o it_o be_v their_o concernment_n to_o bring_v the_o notion_n of_o god_n as_o low_a as_o possible_a that_o a_o creature_n may_v be_v in_o the_o near_a capacity_n of_o be_v make_v
interpretation_n for_o they_o pr._n no_o such_o matter_n it_o be_v the_o proper_a and_o genuine_a sense_n of_o their_o word_n as_o will_v appear_v from_o hence_o 1._o they_o assert_v the_o very_a same_o as_o to_o the_o chrism_n and_o baptism_n which_o they_o do_v as_o to_o the_o eucharist_n 9_o 2._o that_o which_o they_o say_v our_o sense_n can_v reach_v be_v something_o of_o a_o spiritual_a nature_n and_o not_o a_o body_n and_o here_o the_o case_n be_v extreme_o different_a from_o the_o judgement_n of_o sense_n as_o to_o a_o material_a substance_n and_o if_o you_o please_v i_o will_v evident_o prove_v from_o the_o father_n that_o that_o wherein_o they_o exclude_v the_o judgement_n of_o sense_n in_o the_o eucharist_n be_v something_o whole_o spiritual_a and_o immaterial_a p._n no_o no_o we_o have_v be_v long_o enough_o upon_o the_o father_n unless_o their_o evidence_n be_v more_o certain_a one_o way_n or_o other_o for_o my_o part_n i_o believe_v on_o the_o account_n of_o divine_a revelation_n in_o this_o matter_n this_o be_v my_o body_n here_o i_o stick_v and_o the_o father_n agree_v with_o we_o herein_o that_o christ_n word_n be_v not_o to_o be_v take_v in_o a_o figurative_a sense_n pr._n the_o contrary_n have_v be_v so_o plain_o prove_v in_o a_o late_a excellent_a discourse_n of_o transubstantiation_n that_o i_o wonder_v none_o of_o your_o party_n have_v yet_o undertake_v to_o answer_v it_o but_o they_o write_v on_o as_o if_o no_o such_o treatise_n have_v appear_v i_o shall_v therefore_o wave_v all_o the_o proof_n that_o be_v there_o produce_v till_o some_o tolerable_a answer_n be_v give_v to_o they_o p._n methinks_v you_o have_v take_v a_o great_a liberty_n of_o talk_v about_o the_o father_n as_o though_o they_o be_v all_o on_o your_o side_n but_o our_o late_a author_n assure_v we_o to_o the_o contrary_a and_o i_o hope_v i_o may_v now_o make_v use_n of_o they_o to_o show_v that_o transubstantiation_n be_v the_o faith_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n pr._n with_o all_o my_o heart_n i_o even_o long_o to_o hear_v what_o they_o can_v say_v in_o a_o matter_n i_o think_v so_o clear_a on_o our_o side_n p._n well_o sir_n i_o begin_v with_o the_o consensus_fw-la veterum_fw-la write_v by_o one_o that_o profess_v himself_o a_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n pr._n make_v what_o you_o can_v of_o he_o now_o you_o have_v he_o but_o i_o will_v meddle_v with_o no_o personal_a thing_n i_o desire_v to_o hear_v his_o argument_n p._n what_o say_v you_o to_o r._n selomo_n interpret_n the_o 72._o psal._n v._n 16._o of_o wafer_n in_o the_o day_n of_o the_o messiah_n to_o r._n moses_n 23._o haddarsan_n on_o gen._n 39_o 1._o and_o on_o psal._n 136._o 25_o to_o r._n cahana_n on_o gen._n 49._o 1._o who_o be_v long_o before_o the_o nativity_n of_o christ_n r._n johai_n on_o numb_a 28._o 2._o and_o to_o r._n judas_n who_o be_v many_o year_n before_o christ_n come_v pr._n can_v you_o hold_v your_o countenance_n when_o you_o repeat_v these_o thing_n but_o any_o thing_n must_v pass_v from_o a_o new_a convert_n what_o think_v you_o of_o r._n cahana_n and_o r._n judas_n who_o live_v so_o long_o before_o our_o saviour_n when_o we_o know_v that_o the_o jew_n have_v no_o write_n preserve_v near_o to_o our_o saviour_n time_n beside_o the_o bible_n and_o some_o say_v the_o paraphrast_n upon_o it_o i_o will_v have_v be_v glad_a to_o have_v see_v these_o testimony_n take_v from_o their_o original_a author_n and_o not_o from_o galatinus_n who_o be_v know_v to_o have_v be_v a_o notorious_a plagiary_n as_o to_o the_o main_a of_o his_o book_n and_o of_o little_a or_o no_o credit_n as_o to_o the_o rest_n but_o it_o be_v ridieulous_a to_o produce_v the_o testimony_n of_o jewish_a rabbin_n for_o transubstantiation_n when_o it_o be_v so_o well_o know_v that_o it_o be_v one_o of_o their_o great_a objection_n against_o christianity_n as_o teach_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o may_v be_v see_v in_o joseph_n albo_n and_o other_o but_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o christian_a father_n p._n will_v not_o you_o let_v a_o man_n show_v a_o little_a jewish_a learning_n upon_o occasion_n but_o if_o you_o have_v a_o mind_n to_o the_o father_n you_o shall_v have_v enough_o of_o they_o for_o i_o have_v a_o large_a catalogue_n of_o they_o to_o produce_v from_o the_o consensus_fw-la veterum_fw-la nubes_fw-la testium_fw-la and_o the_o single_a sheet_n which_o general_o agree_v pr._n with_o coccius_n or_o bellarmin_n you_o mean_v but_o before_o you_o produce_v they_o i_o pray_v tell_v i_o what_o you_o intend_v to_o prove_v by_o they_o p._n the_o doctrine_n of_o our_o church_n pr._n as_o to_o what_o p._n what_o have_v we_o be_v about_o all_o this_o while_n pr._n transubstantiation_n will_v you_o prove_v that_o p._n why_o do_v you_o suspect_v i_o before_o i_o begin_v pr._n i_o have_v some_o reason_n for_o it_o let_v we_o first_o agree_v what_o we_o mean_v by_o it_o do_v you_o mean_v the_o same_o which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n do_v by_o it_o in_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n p._n what_o can_v we_o mean_v else_o pr._n let_v we_o first_o see_v what_o that_o be_v the_o council_n of_o trent_n declare_v that_o the_o same_o body_n of_o christ_n which_o be_v in_o heaven_n be_v real_o true_o and_o substantial_o present_a in_o the_o eucharist_n after_o consecration_n under_o the_o species_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n and_o the_o roman_a catechism_n say_v it_o be_v the_o very_a body_n which_o be_v bear_v of_o the_o virgin_n and_o sit_v at_o the_o right_a hand_n of_o god._n 2._o that_o the_o bread_n and_o wine_n after_o consecration_n lose_v their_o proper_a substance_n and_o be_v change_v into_o that_o very_a substance_n of_o the_o body_n of_o christ._n and_o a_o anathema_n be_v denounce_v against_o those_o who_o affirm_v the_o contrary_n now_o if_o you_o please_v proceed_v to_o your_o proof_n p._n i_o begin_v with_o the_o ancient_a liturgy_n of_o st._n peter_n st._n 27._o james_n and_o st._n matthew_n pr._n be_v you_o in_o earnest_n p._n why_o what_o be_v the_o matter_n pr._n do_v not_o you_o know_v that_o these_o be_v reject_v as_o supposititious_a by_o your_o own_o writer_n and_o a_o very_a late_a and_o learned_a dr._n of_o the_o sorbon_n have_v give_v full_a and_o clear_a evidence_n 1686._o of_o it_o p._n suppose_v they_o be_v yet_o they_o may_v be_v of_o antiquity_n enough_o to_o give_v some_o competent_a testimony_n as_o to_o tradition_n pr._n no_o such_o matter_n for_o he_o prove_v st._n peter_n be_v liturgy_n to_o be_v late_a than_o the_o sacramentary_a of_o st._n gregory_n and_o so_o can_v prove_v nothing_o for_o the_o first_o 600_o year_n and_o the_o aethiopic_a 22._o liturgy_n or_o st._n matthew'_v he_o show_v to_o be_v very_o late_o that_o of_o st._n james_n he_o think_v to_o have_v be_v some_o time_n before_o the_o five_o general_a council_n but_o by_o no_o mean_n to_o have_v be_v st._n 23._o james_n p._n what_o think_v you_o of_o the_o act_n of_o st._n andrew_n and_o what_o he_o say_v therein_o about_o eat_v the_o flesh_n of_o christ_n 30._o pr._n i_o think_v he_o say_v nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n but_o i_o be_o ashamed_a to_o find_v one_o who_o have_v so_o long_o be_v a_o minister_n in_o this_o church_n so_o extreme_o ignorant_a as_o to_o bring_v these_o for_o good_a authority_n which_o be_v reject_v with_o scorn_n by_o all_o man_n of_o learning_n and_o ingenuity_n among_o you_o p._n i_o be_o afraid_a you_o grow_v angry_a pr._n i_o confess_v ignorance_n and_o confidence_n together_o be_v very_a provoke_a thing_n especial_o when_o a_o man_n in_o year_n pretend_v to_o leave_v our_o church_n on_o such_o pitiful_a ground_n p._n but_o he_o do_v produce_v better_a authority_n pr._n if_o he_o do_v they_o be_v not_o to_o his_o purpose_n p._n that_o must_v be_v try_v what_o say_v you_o to_o ignatius_n i_o hope_v you_o allow_v his_o epistle_n pr._n i_o see_v no_o reason_n to_o the_o contrary_n but_o what_o say_v he_o p._n he_o say_v that_o some_o heretic_n than_o will_v not_o receive_v the_o eucharist_n and_o oblation_n because_o they_o will_v not_o confess_v the_o eucharist_n to_o be_v the_o flesh_n of_o our_o saviour_n christ._n and_o this_o be_v 109._o produce_v by_o both_o author_n pr._n the_o person_n ignatius_n speak_v of_o be_v such_o as_o deny_v christ_n to_o have_v any_o true_a body_n and_o therefore_o do_v forbear_v the_o eucharist_n because_o it_o be_v say_v to_o be_v his_o body_n and_o in_o what_o ever_o sense_n it_o be_v take_v it_o still_o suppose_a that_o which_o they_o deny_v viz._n that_o he_o have_v a_o true_a body_n for_o if_o it_o be_v figurative_o understand_v it_o be_v as_o contrary_a to_o their_o doctrine_n as_o if_o it_o be_v literal_o for_o a_o figure_n must_v
relate_v to_o a_o real_a body_n as_o tertullian_n argue_v in_o this_o case_n and_o ignatius_n in_o the_o 40._o same_o epistle_n mention_n the_o trial_n christ_n make_v of_o his_o true_a body_n by_o the_o sense_n of_o his_o disciple_n take_v hold_v of_o i_o and_o handle_v i_o and_o see_v for_o i_o be_o no_o incorporeal_a doemon_n and_o immediate_o they_o touch_v he_o and_o be_v convince_v which_o happen_v but_o a_o few_o day_n after_o christ_n have_v say_v this_o be_v my_o body_n and_o our_o saviour_n give_v a_o rule_n for_o judge_v a_o true_a body_n from_o a_o appearance_n or_o spiritual_a substance_n a_o spirit_n have_v not_o flesh_n and_o bone_n as_o you_o see_v i_o have_v therefore_o it_o be_v very_o improbable_a that_o ignatius_n so_o soon_o after_o shall_v assert_v that_o christ_n true_a and_o real_a body_n be_v in_o the_o eucharist_n where_o it_o can_v be_v neither_o see_v nor_o feel_v for_o than_o he_o must_v overthrow_v the_o force_n of_o his_o former_a argument_n and_o to_o what_o purpose_n do_v christ_n say_v that_o a_o spirit_n have_v not_o flesh_n and_o bone_n as_o they_o see_v he_o to_o have_v if_o a_o body_n of_o christ_n may_v be_v so_o much_o after_o the_o manner_n of_o a_o spirit_n as_o though_o it_o have_v flesh_n and_o bone_n yet_o they_o can_v not_o possible_o be_v discern_v but_o after_o all_o suppose_v ignatius_n do_v speak_v of_o the_o substance_n of_o christ_n flesh_n as_o present_v in_o the_o eucharist_n yet_o he_o say_v not_o a_o word_n of_o the_o change_n of_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n into_o the_o substance_n of_o christ_n body_n which_o be_v the_o thing_n to_o be_v prove_v p._n but_o justin_n martyr_n do_v speak_v of_o the_o change_n and_o his_o word_n be_v produce_v by_o all_o three_o and_o they_o be_v thus_o render_v in_o the_o single_a sheet_n for_o we_o do_v not_o receive_v this_o as_o common_a bread_n or_o common_a drink_n but_o as_o by_o the_o word_n of_o god_n 2._o jesus_n christ_n our_o redeemer_n be_v make_v man_n 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as_o the_o body_n in_o the_o womb_n become_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n by_o the_o power_n of_o the_o holy_a spirit_n so_o the_o holy_a spirit_n after_o consecration_n make_v the_o element_n to_o become_v the_o flesh_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n not_o by_o a_o hypostatical_a union_n but_o by_o divine_a influence_n as_o the_o church_n be_v the_o body_n of_o christ._n and_o this_o be_v the_o true_a notion_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n as_o to_o this_o matter_n and_o the_o expression_n in_o the_o greek_a liturgy_n to_o this_o day_n confirm_v the_o same_o 2._o he_o do_v not_o in_o the_o least_o imply_v that_o the_o element_n by_o this_o change_n do_v lose_v their_o substance_n for_o he_o mention_n the_o nourishment_n of_o our_o body_n by_o it_o but_o he_o affirm_v that_o notwithstanding_o their_o substance_n remain_v yet_o the_o divine_a spirit_n of_o christ_n by_o its_o operation_n do_v make_v they_o become_v his_o body_n for_o we_o must_v observe_v that_o he_o attribute_n the_o body_n in_o the_o womb_n and_o on_o the_o altar_n to_o the_o same_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o divine_a word_n for_o he_o do_v not_o think_v hypostatical_a union_n necessary_a to_o make_v the_o element_n become_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n but_o a_o divine_a energy_n be_v sufficient_a as_o the_o body_n assume_v by_o angel_n be_v their_o body_n though_o there_o be_v no_o such_o vital_a union_n as_o there_o be_v between_o the_o soul_n and_o body_n of_o a_o man._n p._n i_o go_v on_o to_o irenoeus_n from_o who_o two_o place_n be_v produce_v one_o by_o the_o consensus_fw-la veterum_fw-la where_o he_o say_v that_o which_o 34._o be_v bread_n from_o the_o earth_n perceive_v the_o call_n of_o god_n now_o be_v not_o common_a bread_n but_o the_o eucharist_n consist_v of_o two_o thing_n one_o earthly_a and_o the_o other_o spiritual_a pr._n very_o well_o then_o there_o be_v a_o earthly_a as_o well_o as_o a_o spiritual_a thing_n in_o the_o eucharist_n i._n e._n a_o bodily_a substance_n and_o divine_a grace_n p._n no_o he_o say_v the_o earthly_a be_v the_o accident_n pr._n do_v irenoeus_n say_v so_o p._n no_o but_o he_o mean_v so_o pr._n there_o be_v not_o a_o word_n to_o that_o purpose_n in_o irenoeus_n and_o therefore_o this_o be_v downright_a prevarication_n i_o grant_v irenoeus_n do_v suppose_v a_o change_n make_v by_o divine_a grace_n but_o not_o by_o destroy_v the_o element_n but_o by_o super-adding_a divine_a grace_n to_o they_o and_o so_o the_o bread_n become_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n and_o the_o wine_n his_o blood._n p._n the_o other_o place_n in_o irenoeus_n be_v where_o he_o say_v that_o 11._o as_o the_o bread_n receive_v the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v make_v the_o eucharist_n which_o be_v the_o body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n so_o also_o our_o body_n be_v nourish_v by_o it_o and_o lay_v in_o the_o earth_n and_o there_o dissolve_v will_v arise_v at_o their_o time_n etc._n etc._n pr._n what_o do_v you_o prove_v from_o this_o place_n p._n that_o the_o same_o divine_a power_n be_v see_v in_o make_v the_o eucharist_n the_o body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ_n which_o be_v to_o be_v in_o the_o resurrection_n of_o the_o body_n pr._n but_o do_v this_o prove_v that_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o bread_n be_v change_v into_o the_o substance_n of_o christ_n body_n p._n why_o not_o pr._n i_o will_v give_v you_o a_o plain_a argument_n against_o it_o for_o he_o say_v our_o body_n be_v nourish_v by_o the_o body_n and_o blood_n of_o christ._n do_v you_o think_v that_o irenoeus_n believe_v the_o substance_n of_o christ_n body_n be_v turn_v into_o the_o substance_n of_o our_o body_n in_o order_n to_o their_o nourishment_n no_o he_o explain_v himself_o just_a before_o in_o the_o same_o place_n de_fw-fr calais_n qui_fw-la est_fw-la sanguis_fw-la ejus_fw-la nutritur_fw-la &_o the_o pane_n qui_fw-la est_fw-la corpus_fw-la ejus_fw-la augetur_fw-la so_o that_o he_o attribute_n the_o nourishment_n to_o the_o bread_n and_o wine_n and_o therefore_o must_v suppose_v the_o substance_n of_o they_o to_o remain_v since_o it_o be_v impossible_a a_o substantial_a nourishment_n shall_v be_v make_v by_o mere_a accident_n and_o withal_o observe_v he_o say_v express_o that_o the_o bread_n be_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n which_o your_o best_a writer_n such_o as_o bellarmin_n suarez_n and_o vasquez_n say_v be_v inconsistent_a with_o transubstantiation_n p._n my_o next_o author_n be_v tertullian_n who_o be_v produce_v by_o the_o consensus_fw-la veterum_fw-la and_o the_o single_a sheet_n but_o omit_v by_o the_o nubes_fw-la testium_fw-la but_o the_o other_o prove_v that_o bread_n which_o be_v the_o figure_n of_o christ_n body_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n now_o in_o the_o new_a be_v change_v into_o the_o real_a and_o true_a body_n of_o christ._n pr._n this_o be_v a_o bold_a attempt_n upon_o tertullian_n to_o prove_v that_o by_o the_o figure_n of_o christ_n body_n he_o mean_v his_o true_a and_o real_a body_n for_o his_o word_n be_v acceptum_fw-la panem_fw-la &_o distributum_fw-la 40._o discipulis_fw-la corpus_fw-la illum_fw-la suum_fw-la fecit_fw-la hoc_fw-la est_fw-la corpus_fw-la meum_fw-la dicendo_fw-la id_fw-la est_fw-la figura_fw-la corporis_fw-la mei_fw-la he_o take_v the_o bread_n and_o give_v it_o to_o his_o disciple_n and_o make_v it_o his_o body_n say_v this_o be_v my_o body_n i._n e._n this_o be_v the_o figure_n of_o my_o body_n how_o can_v those_o man_n want_v proof_n that_o can_v draw_v transubstantiation_n from_o these_o word_n which_o be_v so_o plain_a against_o it_o p._n you_o be_v mistake_v tertullian_n by_o figure_n mean_v it_o be_v a_o figure_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n but_o it_o be_v now_o his_o real_a body_n pr._n you_o put_v very_o odd_a figure_n upon_o tertullian_n i_o appeal_v to_o any_o reasonable_a man_n whether_o by_o the_o latter_a word_n