Selected quad for the lemma: sense_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
sense_n	doctrine_n	scripture_n	tradition_n	1,725	5	9.4842	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A40227	The papists strength, principles, and doctrines (which they are sworn to preach, from the Councel of Trent, by the Popes authority, and after confirmed by the last General Assembly at Rouen, 1571, all which they have sworn to perform) answered and confuted furthermore their principles and doctrines answered and confuted, as they were laid down in two or three severall papers, by R.W. papist, lately sent from Holland : also a challenge to the pope and all his adherents to choose out of all his dominions some cardinals, fryers, or Jesuits to try their bread and wine, after consecration (by watching on their side and on our side) to prove that if afterward they have consecrated it, whether the bread and wine doth not loose its taste and savour, and so not the body and blood of Christ : also a paper to all them that fast and afflict themselves who are in the will-worship and voluntary humility : also some quæries to all the papists upon earth to be answered in writing and sent to them, which all sects upon the earth call Quakers / by George Fox.	Fox, George, 1624-1691.; Howgill, Francis, 1618-1669.	1658 (1658)	Wing F1877; ESTC R3577	83,037	105

the life of the world to come 6 Prin. I admit and embrace most firmely the traditions Apostolique and Ecclesiastick and all the other observations and ordinances of the same Church Answ. Your traditions your word Catholique your sprinkling Infants which you call your baptisme does not remit your sins for there is no Scripture for it so Church traditions sprinkling Infants all have got up since the dayes of the Apostles and so the unholy Catholique and Apostolique Church traditions is got up since the dayes of the Apostles and your fruits declare it in the Apostacy from the true Church of the Saints and Apostles and the resurrection Christ you be ignorant of and the power of the world to come that be gone out of the faith that the Apostles were in 7 Prin. I admit also the holy Scripture according to the sense that hath been given by the holy mother Church to the which it appertaineth to judge of the true sense and interpretations of the holy Scripture and shall never take in hand to interpret them then according to the common consent of the Fathers Answ. Your mother which you call the holy Church which gives the sense is the whore from the spirit of God which the Apostles was in and Christ and the Prophets for that is it that knows the Scripture and that was in the Saints that gave it forth and all must have it in them before they know the words again and come into unity with God again of whom they learned that gave it forth and unity with the Scripture and one with another and this both Papists and Protestants are out of the spirit and falling out about the sense of Scripture and your Father and Mother sons which ravened from the spirit of God and so thou and you all teachers from others inventions and your teaching is traditions for Doctrine which are the commands of men but now to the Lord be glory ye are all discovered by his life 8 Prin. More I professe that there is seven truly and properly said Sacraments of the new Law instituted by our Lord Jesus Christ and necessary for the salvation of humane people but not all to every one viz. Baptism Confirmation Eucharist penitence the extream unction the Order and Marriage and that they confirme the grace and that among them the baptisme the confirmation and the order cannot be rejected without sacriledge Answ. In this you have shewed your Apostacy again from the Apostles and Christs doctrine which sayes Go preach the Gospell to all nations baptizing them without any limit and Marriage they that forbid that is the doctrine of Devils which is honourable the Bed undefiled in all And the Apostles doth not call them Sacraments neither Baptisme nor Marriage nor the visiting of the sick nor the Lords Supper Your confirmation and order and your penitence whipping and beating your selves for your sins is your own invention a sacrament of your owne making which the Apostle does not call repentance a sacrament or confessing of sin or sorrowing for sin the nature within should be afflicted and circumcised in the spirit which puts off the body of sin and that brought down and not to strike the creature and beat the creature that is as you wrestle with flesh and blood the power of darknesse causes you to do that which guides you within that strikes at the creature which power of darknesse should be struck at that the creature might come into the liberty of the sons of God 9 Prin. I receive also and admit the Ceremonies of the Church Catholique receive and approve in the administration solemnly of all the abovesaid sacraments 10 Prin. I embrace and receive all and every of the things which hath been defined and declared by the sacred holy Councel of Trent touching the sin originall and the justification 11 Prin. I protest likewise that in the masse is offered to God true proper and propitiatory sacrifice for the living and for the dead and that in the most holy Sacrament of the Eucharist is truly really and substantially the body the blood with the soule and the divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ and that there is made a conversion of all the substance of the bread into the body and of all the substance of the wine into the blood and the which conversion the Church Catholique calls Transubstantiation 12 Prin. I confess also that under one of these one receiveth Jesus Christ all entire and one true sacrament Answ. In these four Principles which ye teach for Doctrine is but your owne traditions and commandements which are learned of one another of men at the Council of T●ent and at your Fathers which is your sin in the apostacy from the Apostles who was not of man nor by man And as concerning Justification ye are ignorant of for where that is known the sin is done away which came by the first Adam And they that believe are passed from death to life And there are some children of believers which is holy yet all by nature children of wrath in the unbelief and your Church is held up by tradition and traditions and vows and oaths which is all in the Apostacy from the spirit where it seems the root of the word protesting is come from your selves who are Apostates and not ftom the Scriptures but you have thrust it in your offering and mass it is but a dead thing it is neither good for the dead nor the living the living do not accept of it but as Cains sacrifice for are not you murtherers and destroyers of one another about Religion sacrifice and traditions as Cain did whom God did not accept his sacrifice And as the Jewes did without the life which gave forth the Scriptures turn against the just and all the Apostates since the dayes of the Apostles which are inwardly ravened from the spirit of God who set up all your lying signes and wonders and traditions and deceive people with them that dwell upon the earth who be from the spirit of God inwardly ravened from it in which spirit God is worshipped which spirit brings to offer living sacrifice And the bread and wine after they have consecrated it which you say is the very body and blood of Christ and soule and it 's divine and that ye call Transubstantiation and he that receives either bread or wine receives Christ Now seeing that this Doctrine and Principle is laid down by you the Council of Trent and tollerated by the great Bishop of Rome the Pope and taught by the Jesuites I shall demand one thing of you out of every Nation and from every Dominion and Island belonging to the Bishop of Rome the Pope Let there come forth a Bishop and a Jesuite and consecrate bread and wine and after consecration and conversion which you call transubstantiation which you say then is the very body blood and soul of Christ which is divine Let that then be set by and kept and let us take of

and hath showed himself and hath put on strength who treads the wine press of the wrath who travels in the greatness of his strength out of whose mouth goes a sharp two-eged Sword which shall dash all to pieces Consuming fire is before him ten thousands of his Saints is vvith him and he in them they go on in his strength Conquering and to Conquer Arme your selves cast up your Batteries come all to the battel of the great day of God and see if you be able to stand against the Lord for he hath manifest his wisdome from above which will confound all your deceit For we esteem no more of your Arguments then straw nor of your devised Fables no more then rotten wood For you are all rounded as with a hoop and measured as with a line your beginning is in the Apostacy your rise in the night of darkness your strength lies in ignorance and your end will be utter darkn●sse and this shall stand true when your place shall be no more found nor one stone left upon another which shall not be thrown down And now I come to the answer of the substance of thy Arguments and Principles First thou says This is good Catholique Doctrine that a man may have the true faith and yet lead a sinfull life And further that a wicked man and a godly hath true faith and it doth not differ a whit in matter or substance in the godly and ungodly Now to say one hath faith and not the other is against all sence and reason thou saith Answ. I do believe thee that this is thy Catholique doctrine but I cannot call it good for then I should erre like thy selfe for this Doctrine is contrary to the doctrine of the Gospel for true faith is that which the just lives by Hab. 2.4 And that which the just lives by is pure the matter of it by it he is cleansed and the faith of the godly stands in the power of God and that is a pure thing And he that hath the true faith hath the faith of Christ who is truth from whence it comes and it leads out of sin and a sinfull life gives victory over sin This is the victory even your faith By faith the godly stands 2 Cor. 1.24 And by faith the godly walks 2 Cor. 5.7 But on the contrary a wicked mans faith if thou call it faith is called a feigned faith and a dead faith and is centred in him who hath the power of death which is the D●vill and this is another thing for matter and substance and is a distinct thing and by the fruits and effects the true faith is ●nown from the reprobates in the different operations and so this is a devillish doctrine thou hast laid down to wit that they are one in matter for this is contrary to Scripture sense and reason and is an unreasonable position laid downe and ●●●firmed from thy unreasonable minde which is erred from the true faith And again the faith of the godly and ungodly differs in effe●ts but not in regard of the faith it self thou saith and here is thy confusion manifest and thou saist all the five senses will teach you That a man may be chaste in his minde and yet be angry and he may be temperate and yet want patience Thou that hath no other thing to teach thee but the five S●nses art sensual and knows not the spirit For a man to be chaste and yet angry is a false thing he that is angry and intemperate is not chast but joyned to that which adulterates for these are the Devils conceptions and works they and in whom these are brought forth is not chast but is in Cains way and in Dives way and thou saist if you can conceive this that a man may have true faith and yet want godlinesse of life and conversation thy conception is false For he that is temperate and chaste and lives in that which makes him so wants not charity nor patience for the true faith of Gods elect purges from all sin and that faith is reprobate where ungodlinesse is brought forth and contrariwise thou saith a man may be of an honest and godly conversation and yet want faith utter darknesse is thy dwelling place and thou speaks out of thick darknesse Is there a conversation godly or like God lived in where there is no faith or honesty where there is no faith that 's utterly false for these are the fruits of faith of a lively faith for honesty and a godly conversation is the works which proceeds from a true and living faith as the Scriptures witnesse and these things thou saith thou thought good to commend to consideration Thou that thought these things good cals evill good and good evill and art in blindnesse and I have considered of the things and I never heard of so much blindnesse uttered by one who would seem to be a teacher of others And now I come to that which follows 2 P●●n That the people or Church of Christ hath been alwayes visible not only in the beginning or in the Apostles dayes But also since the Apostles dayes even untill now and shall be to the end of the world And for this thou saist Christ hath promised that the gates 〈…〉 shall not prevail against it but that he will be with them till 〈◊〉 end of the world and for this end thou saist the Apostle said Ephes. 4. That he hath given some to be Apostles some Evangelists for the worke of the Ministry till we all come to the unity of faith and unto the stature and fulnesse of Christ Answ. The Church of God in the beginning in the Prophets dayes Christs dayes the Apostles dayes and since the Apostles hath always been in God and hath always been invisible as to the eye of the world which could never discern them nor wherein their communion stood with God yet notwithstanding there hath always been men and people who feared God and believed in the invisible God whom the world never knew to be such but always did persecute and they that did persecute have named themselves to be the Church of God Yet notwithstanding all this there hath been in all ages some that hath born a visible testimony against the world that lyes in wickedness and against the false Prophets Seducers Deceivers and Antichrists and these that bore their testimony against all these before mentioned they were in the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ and declared against their Idolatry in all ages and these Christ promised that the gates of hell should not prevail against them And although the gates of Hell did not prevail against their bodies or outward man yet never prevailed against the rock Christ upon which they were builded but hath always been with them in the deepest suffering and greatest ffli●ction and hath preserved them faithfull unto death so that they have not denyed his testimony nor the word of his patience for they have not loved their