they_o keep_v within_o the_o bound_n of_o that_o latitude_n which_o the_o communion_n of_o parish-church_n and_o the_o custom_n of_o the_o place_n as_o in_o london_n if_o it_o be_v so_o there_o as_o our_o answerer_n affirm_v will_v warrant_n as_o i_o say_v before_o but_o that_o general_o the_o people_n be_v of_o the_o parish_n church_n and_o ordinary_o aught_o to_o communicate_v with_o they_o there_o be_v hardly_o any_o thing_n more_o evident_a in_o reason_n or_o sense_n and_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o nonconformists_a for_o they_o be_v baptize_v into_o these_o particular_a church_n as_o well_o as_o into_o the_o universal_a and_o the_o know_a law_n both_o of_o church_n and_o state_n oblige_v their_o conscience_n to_o communion_n with_o they_o beside_o if_o they_o be_v not_o of_o the_o particular_a church_n wherein_o they_o live_v they_o be_v of_o none_o but_o their_o ordinary_a attend_v upon_o the_o public_a worship_n as_o they_o general_o do_v or_o have_v do_v conclude_v they_o by_o their_o own_o consent_n to_o say_v nothing_o now_o of_o the_o inconvenience_n that_o follow_v separation_n from_o they_o a_o argument_n not_o to_o be_v despise_v till_o it_o be_v better_o consider_v and_o censure_v mr._n baxter_n speak_v very_o well_o and_o home_o to_o the_o point_n thus_o he_o that_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n be_v fit_a to_o be_v receive_v into_o a_o particular_a 89._o cure_v of_o ch._n div_o p._n 89._o church_n and_o there_o want_v no_o more_o but_o mutual_a consent_n and_o if_o he_o have_v stated_o join_v with_o a_o particular_a church_n in_o ordinary_a communion_n consent_n have_v be_v manifest_v and_o he_o be_v a_o member_n of_o that_o particular_a church_n thus_o in_o thesi_fw-la then_o he_o subjoine_v this_o be_v the_o common_a case_n in_o england_n the_o person_n who_o be_v baptize_v in_o infancy_n be_v at_o once_o receive_v into_o the_o universal_a church_n and_o into_o some_o particular_a church_n and_o have_v hold_v communion_n at_o age_n with_o both_o etc._n etc._n in_o a_o case_n so_o plain_a in_o the_o writing_n of_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n i_o shall_v only_o give_v you_o mr._n baxters_n testimony_n for_o they_o all_o especial_o find_v a_o emphasis_n in_o his_o word_n which_o be_v these_o speak_v to_o his_o brethren_n say_v he_o much_o more_o shall_v you_o have_v endure_v 14._o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 14._o such_o as_o the_o nonconformist_n of_o that_o age_n who_o use_v parish_n communion_n and_o plead_v for_o it_o against_o the_o separatist_n fâ—r_o sharp_a language_n than_o ever_o i_o use_v as_o their_o book_n against_o johnson_n and_o cann_n and_o brown_n and_o ainsworth_n do_v yet_o visible_o declare_v hence_o it_o be_v that_o worthy_a non_fw-fr conformist_n mr_n hildersham_n do_v not_o only_a judge_n it_o lawful_a and_o a_o duty_n to_o attend_v upon_o the_o parish_n congregation_n but_o use_v many_o argument_n against_o the_o ordinary_a leave_v our_o own_o minister_n to_o hear_v more_o able_a man_n in_o other_o parish_n and_o for_o john_n upon_o the_o four_o of_o john_n our_o come_n reverent_o and_o at_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o service_n and_o mr._n baâ—ter_n persuade_v with_o many_o argument_n to_o communion_n with_o the_o parish_n church_n which_o he_o will_v not_o have_v do_v if_o he_o have_v not_o think_v it_o not_o only_o to_o bâ—_n lawful_a but_o a_o duty_n yea_o he_o say_v express_o that_o to_o sâ—me_v it_o be_v a_o duty_n to_o join_v with_o some_o parish_n church_n in_o the_o lord_n supper_n three_o time_n a_o year_n defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 38._o which_o he_o say_v he_o prove_v by_o twenty_o reason_n and_o by_o his_o own_o example_n avow_v in_o public_a and_o his_o constant_a resolution_n so_o to_o do_v he_o add_v much_o weight_n to_o his_o say_a reason_n and_o to_o give_v my_o answerer_n his_o due_a in_o this_o as_o he_o do_v not_o deny_v the_o truth_n of_o most_o of_o our_o church_n so_o he_o do_v much_o persuade_v both_o by_o reason_n and_o his_o own_o example_n to_o communion_n with_o they_o and_o therefore_o he_o believe_v as_o i_o believe_v of_o he_o that_o it_o be_v a_o duty_n but_o for_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o their_o judgement_n in_o the_o point_n before_o 143._o ind._n schys_n pag._n 143._o 1660_o let_v mr._n cawdrey_n be_v hear_v at_o large_a speak_v against_o the_o independent_n separation_n say_v he_o if_o they_o do_v not_o suppose_v themselves_o to_o be_v of_o some_o particular_a church_n it_o be_v their_o error_n and_o their_o fault_n their_o error_n because_o all_o the_o people_n of_o the_o nation_n be_v confine_v to_o that_o church_n where_o they_o live_v and_o liable_a to_o censure_v for_o leave_v that_o church_n for_o partake_v of_o ordinance_n and_o the_o minister_n for_o admit_v they_o their_o fault_n because_o they_o be_v bind_v by_o way_n of_o duty_n both_o by_o the_o law_n of_o the_o nation_n and_o also_o by_o the_o law_n of_o god_n to_o be_v of_o one_o or_o other_o particular_a congregation_n mean_v parochial_a object_n but_o what_o say_v our_o answerer_n against_o all_o this_o he_o yield_v much_o no_o doubt_n pag._n 41._o where_o he_o say_v the_o old_a nonconformist_n hold_n lay_v communion_n with_o parish_n church_n lawful_a and_o so_o do_v we_o answ_n but_o do_v not_o they_o also_o hold_v it_o a_o duty_n prove_v the_o contrary_a if_o you_o can_v i_o challenge_v he_o to_o show_v in_o any_o of_o they_o one_o word_n signify_v it_o lawful_a to_o hold_v communion_n with_o any_o other_o state_v church_n in_o england_n beside_o the_o parochial_a or_o that_o ever_o they_o preach_v in_o house_n as_o you_o unfair_o intimate_v when_o the_o people_n shall_v be_v in_o the_o parish_n church_n or_o that_o any_o learned_a presbyterian_a say_v so_o before_o 1660_o if_o not_o what_o signify_v all_o your_o new-coined_a distinction_n pag._n 34_o 35._o object_n but_o in_o some_o place_n we_o can_v profit_v by_o the_o minister_n aâ—sw_n you_o may_v profit_v by_o the_o prayer_n and_o sacrament_n the_o old_a nonconformist_n will_v not_o endure_v the_o objection_n against_o all_o or_o against_o airy_a weak_a if_o honest_a minister_n let_v mr._n hildersham_n reason_n against_o it_o be_v examine_v say_v he_o our_o shame_n our_o sin_n and_o just_a cause_n of_o humble_v to_o we_o if_o we_o can_v profit_v by_o the_o mean_a minister_n 226._o on_o john_n 4._o p_o 225_o 226._o that_o god_n have_v send_v and_o the_o power_n of_o the_o ministry_n depend_v not_o on_o the_o excellency_n of_o the_o teacher_n gift_n but_o upon_o god_n blessing_n though_o sometime_o he_o think_v people_n may_v go_v to_o hear_v other_o minister_n of_o better_a gift_n object_n but_o some_o minister_n be_v intolerable_a answ_n i_o grant_v the_o nonconformist_n and_o particular_o mr._n hildersham_n do_v allow_v the_o people_n in_o such_o case_n to_o go_v from_o their_o own_o parish_n yet_o he_o put_v in_o three_o rule_n to_o the_o case_n that_o it_o be_v do_v without_o open_a breach_n or_o contempt_n to_o the_o church_n order_n without_o contempt_n of_o their_o own_o pastor_n and_o without_o scandal_n and_o offence_n to_o they_o and_o their_o people_n but_o if_o no_o minister_n be_v intolerable_a but_o such_o as_o our_o answerer_n describe_v to_o be_v so_o i_o hope_v there_o be_v but_o few_o such_o in_o our_o day_n what_o ever_o there_o be_v in_o mr._n hildershams_n time_n by_o intolerable_a say_v he_o i_o mean_v 1._o such_o as_o be_v ignorant_a of_o or_o erroneous_a advice_n advice_n against_o the_o essential_o of_o christianity_n 2._o such_o as_o be_v unable_a to_o teach_v they_o other_o 3._o such_o as_o malignant_o preach_v down_o the_o practice_n of_o a_o holy_a life_n or_o in_o a_o word_n such_o who_o ministry_n real_o tend_v to_o do_v more_o hurt_n than_o good_n these_o be_v intolerable_a indeed_o and_o if_o there_o shall_v chance_v to_o be_v find_v one_o or_o two_o such_o within_o a_o province_n i_o hope_v not_o so_o many_o sure_o some_o duty_n we_o owe_v concern_v they_o but_o what_o be_v that_o in_o the_o first_o place_n we_o be_v certain_o bind_v to_o endeavour_v his_o amendment_n if_o that_o be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v but_o he_o be_v find_v incurable_a he_o be_v the_o more_o intolerable_a and_o our_o next_o duty_n to_o endeavour_v to_o remove_v he_o so_o far_o mr._n baxters_n advice_n be_v wholesome_a and_o apposite_a use_v all_o your_o diligence_n 106._o cure_v of_o ch._n div_o p_o 106._o to_o amend_v he_o and_o if_o you_o can_v do_v that_o use_v all_o your_o interest_n to_o get_v he_o out_o and_o get_v a_o better_a indeed_o he_o add_v if_o you_o can_v do_v that_o deliver_v your_o own_o soul_n from_o he_o by_o remove_v to_o a_o better_a if_o you_o be_v free_a he_o mean_v if_o you_o be_v not_o under_o the_o command_n of_o other_o remove_z to_z another_o parish_n which_o
the_o doctrine_n of_o schism_n full_o open_v and_o apply_v to_o gather_v church_n occasion_v by_o a_o book_n entitle_v sacrilegious_a dissertion_n of_o the_o holy_a ministry_n rebuke_v and_o tolerate_v preach_v of_o the_o gospel_n vindicated_n by_o the_o author_n of_o toleration_n not_o to_o be_v abuse_v by_o the_o presbyterian_o when_o once_o party_n be_v engage_v by_o their_o opinion_n in_o anti-churche_n and_o fierce_a dispute_v the_o flesh_n and_o satan_n will_v be_v work_v in_o they_o against_o all_o that_o be_v holy_a sweet_a and_o safe_a baxter_n def._n p._n 57_o london_n print_v by_o s._n g._n and_o b._n g._n for_o james_n collins_n and_o sell_v by_o abisha_n brocas_n in_o exon._n 1672._o to_o the_o reader_n good_a reader_n thou_o be_v make_v the_o judge_n betwixt_o we_o examine_v our_o argument_n and_o observe_v the_o manner_n how_o we_o handle_v they_o and_o one_o another_o impartial_o and_o then_o if_o thou_o have_v no_o favour_n yet_o judge_v righteous_o and_o i_o submit_v or_o if_o thou_o have_v any_o favour_n i_o entreat_v thou_o to_o bestow_v it_o in_o read_v those_o few_o first_o chapter_n that_o be_v spend_v in_o altercation_n there_o thou_o will_v come_v to_o argument_n and_o be_v there_o as_o severe_a as_o thou_o will_v i_o confess_v i_o have_v take_v the_o liberty_n sometime_o to_o use_v a_o little_a pleasantness_n rather_o than_o be_v angry_a with_o a_o severe_a adversary_n that_o perhaps_o may_v incur_v thy_o â—ensure_n yet_o consider_v my_o provocation_n thereunto_o and_o thou_o will_v either_o pardon_v i_o or_o condemn_v i_o with_o pity_n to_o trouble_v the_o reader_n with_o personal_a altercation_n or_o to_o use_v any_o thing_n like_o drollery_n in_o a_o serious_a argument_n i_o like_v not_o very_o well_o myself_o and_o though_o i_o know_v not_o why_o my_o own_o heart_n shall_v condemn_v i_o for_o either_o yet_o i_o fear_v he_o that_o be_v great_a than_o my_o heart_n and_o know_v all_o thing_n and_o judge_v it_o safe_a to_o say_v that_o as_o i_o never_o write_v in_o this_o manner_n before_o so_o i_o hope_v i_o shall_v not_o be_v provoke_v to_o do_v so_o again_o may_v my_o adverse_a brother_n have_v the_o same_o mind_n yea_o i_o hope_v he_o be_v so_o good_a a_o man_n that_o by_o his_o own_o better_a principle_n if_o not_o by_o my_o argument_n as_o also_o by_o experience_n the_o grosseness_n of_o his_o brethren_n separation_n be_v far_o beyond_o what_o he_o seem_v to_o suspect_v he_o have_v already_o suffer_v himself_o to_o be_v satisfy_v of_o the_o evil_a and_o danger_n of_o our_o gather_a church_n both_o by_o reason_n and_o sense_n the_o god_n of_o peace_n and_o truth_n be_v with_o thou_o and_o with_o his_o poor_a church_n farewell_o some_o single_a sermon_n and_o other_o discourse_n touch_v the_o present_a difference_n in_o the_o church_n print_v for_o james_n collins_n 1._o catholic_a charity_n recommend_v in_o a_o sermon_n to_o the_o right_n honourable_a the_o lord_n mayor_n of_o london_n in_o order_n to_o the_o abate_v the_o animosity_n among_o christian_n that_o have_v be_v occasion_v by_o difference_n in_o religion_n by_o jos_n glanvil_n rector_n of_o bath_n price_n 6._o d._n 2._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o a_o seasonable_a recommendation_n and_o defence_n of_o reason_n in_o the_o affair_n of_o religion_n against_o infidelity_n scepticism_n and_o phanaticisme_n of_o all_o sort_n by_o jos_n glanvil_n price_n 6_o d._n 3._o the_o christian_n victory_n over_o death_n a_o sermon_n preach_v at_o the_o funeral_n of_o the_o most_o honourable_a george_n duke_n of_o albemarle_n by_o seth_n lord_n bishop_n of_o sarum_n price_n 6_o d._n 4._o a_o mirour_n of_o christianity_n and_o a_o miracle_n of_o charity_n or_o a_o exact_a narration_n of_o the_o life_n and_o death_n of_o the_o lady_n alice_n duchess_n dudley_n by_o r._n boreman_n d._n d._n price_n 6_o d._n 5._o the_o general_a assembly_n or_o the_o necessity_n of_o the_o receive_v the_o communion_n in_o our_o public_a congregation_n evince_v from_o the_o nature_n of_o the_o church_n the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o presbyterian_a principle_n in_o a_o sermon_n by_o francis_n fulwood_n d._n d._n prâ—ce_n 6_o d._n 6._o miserere_fw-la cleri_fw-la a_o sermon_n represent_v the_o misery_n of_o the_o clergy_n and_o assign_v their_o true_a cause_n in_o order_n to_o a_o redress_n by_o edw._n wetenhal_n bd._n price_n 6d_o 7._o vrim_fw-he and_o thumin_fw-la or_o the_o clergy_n dignity_n and_o duty_n recommend_v in_o a_o visitation_n sermon_n by_o mal._n connant_n b._n d._n price_n 6_o d._n a_o discourse_n of_o toleration_n in_o answer_n to_o a_o late_a book_n entitle_v a_o discourse_n of_o the_o religion_n of_o england_n price_n 6_o d._n indulgence_n not_o justify_v be_v a_o continuation_n of_o the_o discourse_n of_o toleration_n in_o answer_n to_o the_o argument_n of_o a_o late_a book_n entitle_v a_o peace-offering_a or_o plea_n for_o indulgence_n and_o to_o another_o call_v the_o second_o discourse_n of_o the_o religion_n england_n price_n 6_o d._n toleration_n not_o to_o be_v abuse_v or_o a_o serious_a question_n sober_o debate_v and_o resolve_v upon_o presbyterian_a principle_n viz._n whether_o it_o be_v adviseable_a especial_o for_o the_o presbyterian_o either_o in_o conscience_n or_o prudence_n to_o take_v advantage_n from_o his_o majesty_n late_a declaration_n to_o deny_v or_o rebate_v their_o communion_n with_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n and_o to_o gather_v themselves_o into_o dictinct_n and_o separate_a church_n price_n 6_o d._n the_o judgement_n of_o the_o learned_a and_o pious_a st._n augustine_n concern_v penal_a law_n against_o conventicle_n and_o for_o unity_n in_o religion_n deliver_v in_o his_o 48._o ep._n to_o vincentius_n price_n 4_o d._n nonconformist_n new-churches_a sinful_a chap._n i._n the_o introduction_n the_o answer_n title_n and_o the_o impertinency_n of_o it_o the_o confident_a questionist_n as_o his_o answerer_n call_v he_o in_o this_o will_v yet_o be_v confident_a that_o not_o many_o will_v not_o take_v the_o task_n and_o burden_n upon_o they_o to_o read_v the_o answer_n and_o that_o but_o few_o of_o they_o that_o read_v it_o will_v be_v able_a to_o understand_v it_o and_o that_o few_o or_o none_o of_o that_o small_a number_n that_o shall_v think_v they_o understand_v it_o will_v be_v able_a to_o see_v the_o consequence_n of_o it_o or_o last_o if_o any_o shall_v chance_v to_o be_v so_o lucky_a they_o must_v be_v exceed_o kind_a as_o well_o as_o wise_a if_o they_o can_v endure_v without_o very_a much_o patience_n and_o some_o indignation_n its_o undertake_n method_n and_o manner_n of_o reason_v in_o all_o which_o it_o pity_v i_o to_o observe_v the_o author_n so_o like_o himself_o and_o so_o deserve_v the_o title_n of_o the_o episcopal_a patron_n of_o presbytery_n and_o the_o independent_a catholic_n prelate_n of_o nonconformity_n the_o modest_a dress_n of_o the_o body_n of_o the_o book_n may_v answer_v for_o itself_o but_o it_o be_v confess_v the_o mouth_n of_o it_o speak_v great_a swell_a word_n the_o title_n be_v sacrilegious_a desertion_n of_o the_o holy_a ministry_n rebuke_v and_o tolerate_v preach_v of_o the_o gospel_n vindicated_n what_o conjure_v be_v here_o i_o be_o afraid_a the_o spirit_n be_v disturb_v sacrilegious_a desertion_n of_o the_o holy_a ministry_n rebuke_v the_o holy_a ministry_n sacrilegious_o desert_v what_o impiety_n be_v this_o a_o heinous_a crime_n indeed_o and_o worthy_a a_o very_a severe_a rebuke_n but_o where_o be_v the_o criminal_n who_o be_v they_o that_o have_v wrought_v this_o abominable_a thing_n sure_o the_o answerer_n himself_o be_v in_o no_o wise_a guilty_a no_o he_o present_o assure_v you_o that_o he_o be_v firm_o resolve_v to_o the_o contrary_a and_o in_o this_o point_n i_o believe_v he_o will_v as_o easy_o answer_v for_o the_o questionist_n who_o then_o do_v he_o mean_v to_o rebuke_n not_o the_o conformist_n they_o have_v no_o liberty_n to_o be_v silent_a though_o other_o have_v to_o preach_v beside_o if_o they_o shall_v especial_o the_o usurper_n among_o they_o i_o presume_v if_o way_n may_v thus_o be_v make_v for_o the_o right_a owner_n our_o author_n will_v not_o be_v much_o trouble_v without_o controversy_n then_o he_o mean_v his_o brethren_n the_o nonconformist_n and_o have_v you_o indeed_o desert_v your_o holy_a ministry_n you_o be_v too_o too_o blame_v and_o must_v be_v rebuke_v or_o have_v you_o not_o already_o do_v it_o yet_o it_o be_v to_o be_v fear_v you_o may_v chance_v to_o do_v it_o or_o though_o at_o present_v you_o be_v every_o where_o find_v rather_o too_o busy_a in_o the_o exercise_n of_o your_o gift_n and_o be_v not_o unlikely_a so_o to_o continue_v yet_o this_o questionist_n have_v say_v something_o that_o in_o the_o consequence_n of_o it_o seem_v to_o persuade_v you_o to_o desert_n your_o office_n or_o at_o least_o hereafter_o you_o may_v possible_o be_v urge_v thereunto_o by_o some_o silly_a reason_n
or_o congregation_n and_o who_o know_v not_o too_o well_o what_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v by_o gathering-churche_n by_o the_o former_a practice_n of_o the_o independent_o but_o more_o especial_o by_o these_o presbyterian_o since_o the_o indulgence_n but_o to_o talk_v of_o gather_v church_n and_o yet_o of_o hold_v communion_n with_o we_o be_v a_o juggle_v unworthy_a our_o author_n who_o either_o do_v or_o shall_v know_v that_o it_o be_v protestatio_fw-la contra_fw-la factum_fw-la &_o questionem_fw-la i_o mean_v it_o be_v general_o so_o i_o have_v as_o you_o can_v but_o see_v both_o in_o the_o question_n as_o propose_v and_o as_o state_v and_o as_o prosecute_v set_v gather_v of_o church_n in_o opposition_n to_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n and_o what_o you_o say_v to_o any_o thing_n else_o be_v not_o to_o the_o point_n and_o the_o general_a practice_n of_o church-gatherers_a too_o well_o satisfy_v the_o world_n what_o they_o intend_v and_o also_o that_o the_o question_n be_v right_o propound_v and_o clear_o state_v to_o any_o unbiased_a and_o unprejudiced_a reader_n what_o ever_o you_o say_v to_o confound_v it_o and_o with_o your_o wont_a elaborateness_n to_o render_v it_o unintelligible_a p._n 40._o and_o then_o complain_v that_o it_o be_v so_o but_o the_o learning_n of_o some_o man_n be_v not_o ill_o compare_v to_o a_o pedlar_n pack_v though_o not_o so_o much_o for_o that_o there_o be_v many_o thing_n that_o be_v difficult_a to_o be_v find_v but_o rather_o because_o if_o they_o look_v for_o any_o thing_n every_o thing_n come_v to_o hand_n but_o this_o be_v far_o from_o our_o author_n to_o who_o we_o must_v now_o hearken_v diligent_o he_o first_o set_v down_o my_o question_n very_a honest_o and_o entire_o p._n 26_o 27._o then_o he_o nibles_fw-fr a_o little_a at_o it_o and_o at_o length_n bite_v and_o tell_v the_o world_n that_o i_o join_v two_o question_n in_o one_o which_o we_o must_v look_v to_o have_v distinct_o answer_v but_o what_o those_o two_o question_n be_v and_o where_o they_o be_v distinct_o answer_v i_o have_v look_v and_o find_v not_o will_v he_o not_o speak_v distinct_o to_o they_o because_o he_o hate_v division_n or_o be_v it_o his_o prudence_n to_o leave_v out_o conscience_n for_o he_o have_v tell_v we_o p._n 21._o that_o to_o decide_v this_o case_n be_v a_o work_n of_o mere_a christian_a prudence_n but_o where_o be_v conscience_n then_o exclude_v by_o what_o law_n that_o shall_v be_v try_v anon_o for_o i_o shall_v now_o address_v myself_o in_o earnest_a to_o review_v the_o whole_a question_n not_o in_o two_o only_a but_o in_o the_o several_a case_n depend_v upon_o it_o a_o just_a examine_v whereof_o will_v give_v i_o occasion_n sufficient_a to_o consider_v all_o that_o he_o have_v say_v to_o the_o purpose_n against_o i_o as_o i_o find_v it_o scatter_v up_o and_o down_o his_o book_n chap._n vii_o gathering-churche_n charge_v with_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o prove_v to_o be_v so_o from_o the_o definition_n of_o this_o church_n wherein_o he_o be_v tell_v what_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o schism_n from_o it_o be_v the_o general_a question_n betwixt_o we_o be_v this_o whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a for_o the_o presbyterian_o to_o refuse_v communion_n with_o our_o parish_n church_n and_o to_o gather_v themselves_o into_o distinct_a and_o separate_a church_n and_o upon_o a_o serious_a review_n of_o it_o and_o consideration_n of_o all_o that_o the_o answerer_n have_v say_v against_o i_o and_o my_o discourse_n upon_o it_o i_o do_v renew_v my_o charge_n and_o positive_o affirm_v that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a and_o as_o it_o be_v general_o practise_v it_o be_v a_o great_a and_o dangerous_a schism_n both_o against_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o particular_a church_n it_o be_v a_o schism_n in_o its_o own_o nature_n and_o sinful_a in_o itself_o it_o be_v a_o schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n call_v puritan_n and_o also_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o before_o 1660._o and_o last_o that_o both_o in_o conscience_n and_o prudence_n it_o ought_v at_o present_a to_o be_v avoid_v or_o desert_v by_o all_o such_o especial_o as_o be_v call_v presbyterian_o and_o all_o this_o in_o in_o its_o several_a part_n and_o in_o their_o order_n as_o here_o set_v down_o i_o undertake_v to_o make_v good_a 1._o thus_o to_o separate_a and_o to_o gather_v church_n be_v a_o schism_n with_o respect_n to_o the_o church_n of_o england_n now_o as_o divine_n speak_v of_o a_o schism_n in_o a_o church_n and_o a_o shism_n from_o a_o church_n so_o in_o a_o diverse_a respect_n this_o practice_n be_v guilty_a of_o both_o for_o if_o you_o consider_v the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o particular_a organise_v church_n it_o be_v a_o schism_n from_o but_o if_o as_o part_v of_o the_o universal_a visibe_n church_n only_o as_o the_o nonconformist_n use_v to_o term_v it_o then_o it_o be_v schism_n in_o it_o it_o be_v a_o shism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o such_o by_o divide_v from_o its_o governor_n member_n worship_n and_o assembly_n as_o i_o more_o than_o intimate_v in_o my_o book_n p._n 8._o and_o this_o aught_o to_o have_v be_v distinct_o observe_v at_o least_o by_o my_o answerer_n but_o instead_o thereof_o how_o he_o stumble_v and_o blunder_v look_v careful_o and_o make_v great_a outcry_n after_o that_o which_o i_o lay_v just_a before_o he_o you_o charge_v we_o say_v he_o p._n 37._o with_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n again_o p._n 38._o tell_v we_o what_o you_o mean_v by_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n again_o p._n 35._o we_o be_v tell_v of_o schism_n from_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o if_o it_o be_v a_o monstrous_a and_o unheard_a of_o thing_n and_o then_o puzzle_v pitiful_o puzzle_v himself_o and_o his_o reader_n in_o a_o impertinent_a pursuit_n of_o the_o head_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o if_o without_o a_o certain_a and_o infallible_a knowledge_n of_o that_o there_o can_v be_v no_o such_o thing_n as_o a_o church_n of_o england_n or_o schism_n from_o it_o weary_v himself_o for_o five_o or_o six_o page_n at_o his_o old_a game_n of_o nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n but_o methinks_v he_o labour_v with_o a_o very_a vehement_a desire_n after_o this_o great_a truth_n and_o can_v he_o be_v sure_a to_o have_v it_o he_o will_v not_o say_v how_o much_o money_n as_o well_o as_o pain_n he_o will_v give_v for_o it_o yea_o he_o roundly_o offer_v i_o how_o consistent_a with_o his_o gravity_n i_o do_v not_o observe_v but_o he_o roundly_o offer_v i_o all_o the_o money_n in_o his_o purse_n to_o make_v he_o understand_v but_o what_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v p._n 35._o well_o if_o you_o will_v promise_v i_o to_o be_v humble_a and_o teachable_a and_o that_o you_o be_v not_o too_o old_a to_o learn_v though_o i_o have_v no_o mind_n to_o your_o money_n i_o will_v show_v my_o readiness_n and_o charity_n at_o least_o to_o relieve_v you_o in_o so_o great_a a_o straight_a though_o my_o judgement_n may_v fail_v and_o my_o definition_n be_v as_o despicable_a as_o my_o silly_a argument_n the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o community_n consist_v of_o profess_a christian_n unite_v in_o the_o same_o government_n doctrine_n and_o worship_n according_a to_o the_o 39_o article_n and_o homily_n her_o liturgy_n and_o canon_n and_o law_n and_o divide_v into_o parochial_a assembly_n for_o the_o more_o convenient_a worship_v of_o god_n may_v such_o a_o notion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n have_v supercede_v all_o his_o finesse_n of_o wit_n and_o distinction_n about_o the_o constitutive_a ecclesiastical_a head_n as_o he_o speak_v how_o learned_o i_o leave_v to_o his_o friend_n mr._n bagshaw_n i_o think_v his_o labour_n may_v have_v be_v well_o enough_o spare_v for_o he_o may_v consider_v we_o be_v unite_v in_o the_o same_o government_n and_o the_o pars_fw-la regens_fw-la be_v the_o only_a part_n he_o himself_o require_v to_o be_v add_v to_o the_o pars_fw-la subdita_fw-la to_o constitute_v a_o church_n organise_v in_o a_o proper_a political_a sense_n p._n 38._o now_o you_o will_v not_o deny_v either_o of_o these_o part_n and_o consequent_o you_o have_v find_v the_o whole_a of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n as_o you_o say_v organise_v in_o a_o proper_a political_a sense_n and_o it_o hence_o follow_v that_o it_o be_v material_a to_o our_o point_n to_o determine_v certain_o what_o be_v the_o ecclesiastical_a head_n of_o this_o church_n whether_o we_o that_o be_v member_n of_o it_o be_v all_o unite_a in_o the_o king_n as_o persona_fw-la mixta_fw-la cum_fw-la sacerdote_fw-la and_o not_o mere_o a_o civil_a head_n as_o you_o insinuate_v he_o be_v supreme_a in_o all_o cause_n and_o over_o all_o person_n as_o well_o ecclesiastical_a as_o civil_a or_o whether_o
be_v only_o schis_fw-la cameron_n de_fw-fr schis_fw-la simplex_fw-la secessio_fw-la when_o man_n do_v peaceable_o and_o quiet_o withdraw_v their_o communion_n from_o the_o church_n in_o part_n or_o in_o whole_a to_o enjoy_v their_o conscience_n in_o a_o private_a way_n the_o other_o call_v positive_a separation_n be_v when_o person_n thus_o withdraw_v do_v gather_v into_o a_o distinct_a and_o opposite_a body_n set_v up_o a_o church_n against_o a_o church_n to_o worship_n god_n in_o a_o separate_a way_n themselves_o which_o st._n augustine_n call_v a_o set_n up_o altar_n against_o altar_n allude_v to_o that_o act_n of_o king_n 16._o 2_o king_n 16._o ahaz_n in_o set_v up_o a_o altar_n of_o his_o own_o make_n after_o the_o fashion_n of_o that_o which_o he_o see_v at_o damascus_n beside_o the_o lord_n altar_n and_o this_o be_v it_o say_v cameron_n and_o most_o that_o write_v upon_o the_o point_n which_o in_o a_o peculiar_a manner_n and_o by_o way_n of_o eminency_n be_v and_o deserve_v to_o be_v call_v by_o the_o name_n of_o schism_n thus_o we_o see_v that_o gather_v ourselves_o into_o new_a church_n be_v the_o compliment_n and_o perfection_n of_o schism_n the_o very_a apex_n &_o extrema_fw-la schismatis_fw-la linea_fw-la as_o cameron_n speak_v this_o evil_a as_o i_o late_o hint_v have_v its_o beginning_n and_o usual_o go_v on_o by_o degree_n to_o this_o perfection_n in_o the_o church_n of_o corinth_n it_o first_o begin_v with_o a_o factious_a esteem_v of_o one_o minister_n above_o another_o one_o say_v i_o 2._o his_o def._n of_o prinâ—_n of_o con._n p._n 2._o be_o of_o paul_n etc._n etc._n at_o length_n it_o come_v to_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d which_o mr._n baxter_n render_v emulation_n strife_n and_o separation_n or_o faction_n or_o divide_v into_o several_a party_n this_o appear_v somewhat_o high_a chap._n 11._o for_o they_o will_v not_o eat_v their_o love-feast_n and_o pareus_n think_v they_o will_v not_o eat_v the_o lord_n supper_n together_o but_o those_o that_o be_v for_o paul_n will_v communicate_v among_o themselves_o so_o those_o that_o be_v for_o apollo_n and_o those_o that_o be_v for_o peter_n and_o though_o they_o do_v not_o gather_v themselves_o into_o state_v congregation_n or_o absolute_o separate_v into_o several_a church_n for_o they_o come_v together_o though_o to_o little_a 11._o chap._n 11._o purpose_n yet_o their_o division_n be_v not_o only_o call_v schism_n but_o a_o despise_v the_o church_n of_o god_n but_o if_o this_o progress_n of_o schism_n be_v so_o smart_o rebuke_v we_o may_v the_o less_o wonder_n to_o find_v the_o apostle_n so_o very_o severe_a against_o the_o gnostic_n and_o those_o more_o perfect_v schismatic_n that_o afterward_o draw_v disciple_n after_o they_o whole_o from_o the_o church_n and_o make_v false_a apostle_n and_o anti-churche_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d extra_fw-la terminos_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la educentes_fw-la oecumenius_n oecumenius_n segregantes_fw-la fideles_fw-la a_o fidelibus_fw-la and_o alex._n clem._n alex._n make_v distinct_a and_o separate_a and_o opposite_a party_n and_o meeting_n for_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n mr._n hale_n observe_v these_o two_o thing_n make_v schism_n complete_a the_o choose_n of_o a_o bishop_n in_o opposition_n to_o the_o 3._o tract_n of_o schism_n p._n 3._o former_a a_o thing_n very_o frequent_a among_o the_o ancient_n and_o which_o many_o time_n be_v the_o cause_n and_o effect_n of_o schism_n and_o then_o the_o erect_n of_o a_o new_a church_n for_o the_o divide_v part_n to_o meet_v in_o public_o and_o this_o he_o call_v ecclesiastical_a sedition_n and_o ames_n peccatum_fw-la gravissimum_fw-la a_o most_o grievous_a sin_n both_o in_o its_o nature_n and_o effect_n for_o division_n so_o far_o as_o it_o proceed_v whether_o in_o natural_a civil_a or_o ecclesiastical_a body_n be_v the_o dissolution_n and_o destruction_n of_o it_o chap._n x._o the_o difference_v nature_n of_o schism_n the_o answerers_n objection_n answer_v especial_o the_o preach_v of_o the_o eject_v minister_n i_o will_v suppose_v we_o be_v agree_v that_o the_o general_a nature_n of_o schism_n be_v such_o a_o separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n as_o we_o have_v show_v but_o to_o make_v it_o unlawful_a and_o to_o merit_v the_o evil_a and_o usual_a sense_n of_o the_o word_n it_o must_v be_v causeless_a unwarrantable_a and_o as_o mr._n hales_n term_n be_v unnecessary_a when_o it_o be_v so_o be_v to_o be_v careful_o state_v for_o this_o indeed_o be_v the_o punctum_fw-la difficultatis_fw-la and_o the_o very_a hinge_n upon_o which_o this_o controversy_n turn_v herein_o that_o i_o may_v prepare_v to_o argue_v with_o due_a closeness_n i_o shall_v continue_v to_o aim_v at_o the_o sense_n of_o presbyterian_o and_o as_o i_o have_v before_o i_o shall_v here_o also_o follow_v the_o step_n of_o mr._n brinsley_n late_a minister_n of_o yarmouth_n not_o only_o because_o his_o book_n of_o schism_n seem_v to_o i_o judicious_a and_o exact_a as_o to_o our_o point_n and_o he_o therein_o follow_v so_o excellent_a a_o person_n as_o cameron_n but_o likewise_o for_o that_o he_o be_v a_o eminent_a nonconformist_a as_o a_o minister_n only_o for_o i_o have_v be_v well_o inform_v that_o though_o he_o cease_v preach_v at_o bartholomew_n 1662._o yet_o he_o keep_v no_o private_a meeting_n but_o ordinary_o attend_v on_o the_o public_a worship_n in_o the_o place_n where_o he_o live_v beside_o his_o book_n be_v license_v by_o mr._n cranford_n with_o a_o sufficient_a commendation_n and_o be_v preach_v and_o print_v in_o the_o presbyterian_a service_n against_o the_o sectary_n and_o no_o doubt_n his_o brethren_n of_o that_o persuasion_n do_v then_o hearty_o concur_v with_o he_o in_o the_o point_n this_o mr._n brinsley_n p._n 34_o 35._o state_n the_o matter_n thus_o separation_n be_v unwarrantable_a either_o for_o the_o ground_n or_o manner_n the_o former_a a_o unjust_a the_o latter_a a_o rash_a separation_n each_o a_o schism_n wherein_o he_o follow_v cameron_n i_o shall_v vary_v his_o method_n a_o little_a but_o keep_v close_o to_o his_o sense_n and_o then_o a_o unjust_a separation_n be_v twofold_a either_o when_o there_o be_v no_o cause_n and_o it_o be_v absolute_o causeless_a or_o when_o the_o cause_n be_v light_a and_o not_o sufficient_a to_o warrant_v it_o separation_n be_v rash_a when_o there_o be_v cause_n suppose_v sufficient_a yet_o it_o be_v do_v in_o a_o undue_a manner_n 1._o separation_n be_v unjust_a when_o it_o be_v without_o cause_n give_v by_o the_o church_n and_o as_o he_o enlarge_v when_o there_o be_v no_o persecution_n no_o spread_a error_n or_o heresy_n no_o idolatry_n no_o superstition_n maintain_v or_o practise_v but_o the_o church_n be_v peaceable_a and_o pure_a and_o that_o both_o for_o doctrine_n and_o worship_n and_o in_o a_o good_a measure_n free_a from_o scandal_n which_o no_o church_n ever_o whole_o be_v now_o in_o such_o a_o case_n to_o separate_v be_v a_o unjust_a separation_n and_o schism_n if_o this_o be_v indeed_o the_o state_n of_o the_o case_n whether_o the_o party_n think_v they_o have_v cause_n to_o separate_v or_o not_o i_o think_v it_o be_v not_o much_o material_a except_o to_o aggravate_v their_o crime_n for_o if_o they_o think_v they_o have_v cause_n they_o be_v plain_a separatist_n and_o if_o they_o do_v not_o think_v so_o and_o yet_o divide_v the_o church_n by_o a_o separation_n causeless_a in_o their_o own_o opinion_n as_o well_o as_o truth_n they_o be_v far_o worse_o neither_o will_v any_o wantonness_n of_o spirit_n of_o this_o kind_n though_o buoy_v up_o by_o a_o distaste_n take_v at_o our_o guide_n or_o a_o high_a esteem_n of_o other_o teacher_n or_o pretence_n of_o great_a purity_n much_o less_o a_o ill_a will_n to_o the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n from_o which_o we_o shall_v thus_o separate_v admit_v a_o excuse_n from_o any_o sober_a and_o wise_a man_n 2._o there_o may_v be_v some_o cause_n of_o offence_n give_v we_o by_o our_o church_n but_o they_o such_o as_o may_v by_o no_o mean_n warrant_v a_o separation_n cause_n of_o offence_n be_v not_o always_o cause_n of_o separation_n which_o our_o author_n call_v a_o light_a cause_n he_o enlarge_v possible_o some_o sleight_n opposition_n or_o persecution_n it_o may_v be_v by_o some_o small_a pecuniary_a mulct_n some_o lesser_a error_n in_o doctrine_n not_o fundamental_a nor_o near_o the_o foundation_n some_o corruption_n in_o or_o about_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n but_o those_o not_o destructive_a to_o the_o ordinance_n be_v not_o in_o substance_n but_o in_o ceremony_n and_o those_o such_o as_o the_o person_n offend_v be_v not_o enforce_v to_o be_v active_a in_o scandal_v few_o and_o those_o only_o tolerate_v not_o allow_v all_o tolerable_a evil_n such_o as_o charity_n may_v well_o bear_v with_o this_o ground_n be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o bear_v a_o separation_n you_o see_v he_o be_v full_a and_o particular_a and_o in_o all_o this_o i_o believe_v he_o refer_v in_o
his_o thought_n to_o the_o state_n of_o our_o church_n heretofore_o as_o in_o the_o former_a he_o strike_v at_o the_o popish_a the_o learned_a amesius_n who_o principle_n be_v somewhat_o congregational_a have_v say_v much_o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n in_o a_o few_o word_n separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n schism_n case_n dâ—_n schism_n be_v sometime_o lawful_a if_o one_o can_v remain_v in_o its_o communion_n sine_fw-la communicatione_n in_fw-la peccatis_fw-la without_o communicate_v in_o her_o sin_n if_o there_o be_v manifest_a danger_n of_o seduction_n and_o if_o we_o be_v compel_v to_o depart_v by_o oppression_n and_o persecution_n thus_o he_o and_o we_o may_v suppose_v he_o think_v he_o make_v a_o full_a enumeration_n of_o all_o the_o just_a cause_n of_o depart_v from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o that_o in_o any_o other_o case_n separation_n be_v unlawful_a other_o indeed_o have_v more_o compendious_o and_o full_o draw_v all_o the_o rule_n in_o this_o case_n into_o one_o point_n separation_n be_v unwarrantable_a if_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n may_v be_v without_o sin_n and_o indeed_o what_o can_v justify_v a_o practice_n so_o contrary_a to_o love_v and_o peace_n and_o of_o so_o dangerous_a consequence_n but_o the_o avoid_n of_o sin_n our_o general_a answer_n to_o the_o charge_n of_o schism_n by_o the_o papist_n be_v we_o must_v not_o partake_v with_o your_o sin_n and_o i_o think_v all_o party_n consent_v in_o this_o common_a proposition_n where_o the_o condition_n of_o communion_n with_o a_o church_n be_v sinful_a we_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o that_o communion_n for_o we_o must_v obey_v god_n rather_o then_o man_n i_o be_o sure_a this_o be_v current_a doctrine_n with_o the_o nonconformist_n 22._o his_o â—â—fence_n 2._o par._n 22._o call_v puritan_n heretofore_o in_o the_o defence_n of_o communion_n with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n let_v the_o abuse_n say_v mr._n ball_n be_v many_o or_o great_a yet_o if_o i_o may_v be_v present_a at_o the_o true_a worship_n of_o god_n without_o sin_n consent_n unto_o or_o approbation_n of_o such_o abuse_n or_o corruption_n in_o voluntary_a separation_n i_o sin_n against_o god_n his_o church_n and_o my_o own_o soul_n this_o be_v also_o undoubted_a by_o the_o late_a presbyterian_o in_o stead_n of_o many_o let_v mr._n cawdrey_n against_o dr._n owen_n schism_n independ_v a_o great_a schism_n be_v hear_v for_o methinks_v he_o speak_v to_o the_o purpose_n it_o be_v say_v he_o no_o duty_n of_o christ_n impose_v no_o privilege_n of_o his_o purchase_n either_o to_o deprive_v a_o man_n self_n of_o his_o ordinance_n for_o other_o man_n sin_n or_o to_o set_v up_o a_o new_a church_n in_o opposition_n to_o a_o true_a church_n as_o no_o church_n right_o constitute_v for_o want_n of_o some_o reformation_n in_o lesser_a matter_n and_o mr._n corbet_n and_o the_o author_n of_o evangelical_n peace_n and_o unity_n if_o i_o understand_v he_o put_v the_o whole_a debate_n upon_o the_o same_o issue_n with_o we_o so_o bagshaw_n also_o etc._n etc._n among_o these_o light_a cause_n which_o will_v by_o no_o mean_n warrant_v a_o separation_n mr._n baxter_n have_v labour_v to_o 291._o cure_v of_o church_n division_n 291._o throw_v down_o these_o four_o superstitious_a as_o he_o call_v they_o which_o some_o religious_a people_n have_v bring_v up_o 1._o that_o we_o be_v guilty_a of_o the_o sin_n of_o all_o unworthy_a communicant_n if_o we_o communicate_v with_o they_o though_o their_o admission_n be_v not_o by_o our_o fault_n 2._o that_o he_o who_o judgement_n be_v against_o a_o diocesan_n church_n may_v not_o lawful_o join_v with_o a_o parish_n church_n if_o the_o minister_n be_v but_o subject_a to_o the_o diocesan_n 3._o that_o whatsoever_o be_v unlawful_o command_v be_v 194._o see_v cure_n of_o church_n division_n p._n 194._o not_o lawful_a to_o be_v obey_v 4._o that_o it_o be_v unlawful_a to_o do_v any_o thing_n in_o the_o worship_n of_o god_n which_o be_v impose_v by_o man_n and_o be_v not_o command_v itself_o in_o the_o scripture_n but_o enough_o of_o the_o false_a ground_n of_o separation_n that_o render_v it_o causeless_o for_o that_o they_o be_v either_o real_o none_o or_o else_o light_a or_o insufficient_a the_o second_o exception_n against_o separation_n be_v take_v from_o the_o undue_a manner_n of_o proceed_v in_o it_o for_o which_o it_o be_v term_v rash_a and_o therefore_o schismatical_a though_o the_o ground_n be_v just._n that_o be_v as_o mr._n brinsly_n explain_v himself_o p_o 25._o when_o it_o be_v sudden_a and_o heady_a without_o due_a endeavour_n and_o expectance_n of_o reformation_n in_o the_o church_n it_o be_v then_o rash_a and_o consequent_o a_o unwarrantable_a separation_n in_o as_o much_o as_o it_o be_v opposite_a to_o charity_n mr._n baxter_n advice_n be_v excellent_a here_o if_o corruption_n blemish_n and_o dishonour_v the_o congregation_n do_v not_o 80._o cure_v of_o church_n diu._n p._n 80._o say_v let_v sin_n alone_o i_o must_v not_o oppose_v it_o for_o fear_n of_o division_n but_o be_v the_o forward_a to_o reduce_v all_o to_o the_o will_n of_o god_n and_o yet_o if_o you_o can_v prevail_v as_o you_o desire_v be_v the_o backwarde_a to_o divide_v and_o separate_a and_o do_v it_o not_o without_o a_o certain_a warrant_n and_o extreme_a necessity_n resolve_v with_o austin_n i_o will_v not_o be_v the_o chaff_n and_o yet_o i_o will_v not_o go_v out_o of_o the_o floor_n though_o the_o chaff_n be_v there_o never_o give_v over_o your_o just_a desire_n and_o endeavour_v of_o reformation_n and_o yet_o as_o long_o as_o you_o can_v possible_o avoid_v it_o forsake_v not_o the_o church_n which_o you_o desire_v to_o reform_v as_o paul_n say_v to_o they_o that_o be_v to_o forsake_v a_o sea-wracked_a vessel_n if_o these_o abide_v not_o in_o the_o ship_n you_o can_v be_v save_v many_o a_o one_o by_o unlawful_a fly_n and_o shift_v for_o his_o own_o great_a peace_n and_o safety_n do_v much_o more_o hazard_v his_o own_o and_o other_o 3._o ames_n give_v i_o occasion_n to_o hint_n one_o thing_n more_o secessio_fw-la vero_fw-la totalis_fw-la etc._n etc._n a_o total_a secession_n or_o separation_n with_o absolute_a renounce_n or_o reject_v all_o communion_n can_v be_v lawful_o practise_v towards_o a_o true_a church_n but_o partial_a only_o quatenus_fw-la communio_fw-la so_o far_o as_o communion_n can_v be_v exercise_v without_o sin_n case_n de_fw-fr schis_fw-la 307._o i_o wish_v hearty_o my_o brethren_n will_v consider_v whether_o not_o only_o renounce_v all_o communion_n with_o but_o set_v up_o other_o church_n against_o our_o church_n be_v not_o in_o his_o sense_n a_o total_a separation_n and_o consequent_o sinful_a or_o whether_o you_o that_o so_o use_v we_o do_v yet_o retain_v communion_n with_o our_o parish-church_n so_o far_o as_o you_o know_v you_o may_v without_o sin_n but_o this_o by_o the_o way_n the_o sum_n be_v when_o the_o church_n give_v no_o such_o cause_n of_o offence_n as_o may_v justify_v separation_n when_o the_o condition_n of_o her_o communion_n require_v nothing_o of_o her_o member_n whereby_o if_o they_o communicate_v they_o shall_v be_v actual_a sinner_n when_o person_n let_v the_o cause_n be_v never_o so_o just_a shall_v unadvised_o without_o due_a endeavour_n and_o patient_a expectance_n of_o a_o reformation_n last_o when_o they_o shall_v for_o some_o few_o thing_n at_o which_o they_o take_v offence_n total_o forsake_v communion_n with_o a_o true_a church_n and_o gather_v themselves_o into_o anti-churche_n they_o be_v in_o all_o these_o case_n guilty_a of_o schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o most_o nonconformist_n of_o all_o sort_n and_o indeed_o of_o all_o man_n that_o have_v consider_v the_o point_n and_o the_o nature_n of_o schism_n the_o assumption_n we_o shall_v make_v hereafter_o and_o at_o present_a only_o take_v notice_n of_o what_o the_o answerer_n have_v say_v to_o prevent_v it_o he_o give_v we_o p._n 16_o 17._o eight_o difference_n betwixt_o the_o old_a separatist_n and_o the_o present_a nonconformist_n and_o then_o conclude_v in_o all_o these_o they_o differ_v from_o separatist_n though_o they_o gather_v church_n these_o difference_n be_v particular_o consider_v hereafter_o the_o first_o three_o of_o these_o difference_n be_v a_o compliment_n to_o we_o and_o our_o parish_n the_o four_o next_o be_v a_o compliment_n to_o themselves_o in_o the_o last_o i_o think_v he_o be_v in_o earnest_n for_o himself_o but_o he_o have_v to_o do_v with_o a_o headstrong_a party_n that_o will_v not_o obey_v either_o his_o word_n or_o example_n in_o desire_v nothing_o more_o than_o with_o love_n and_o concord_n to_o carry_v on_o with_o we_o the_o same_o work_n of_o christ_n but_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o excuse_v they_o from_o be_v separatist_n that_o run_v away_o from_o we_o and_o draw_v desciple_n after_o they_o that_o refuse_v i_o be_o sure_a in_o fact_n what_o ever_o some_o may_v say_v the_o least_o communion_n
with_o we_o in_o our_o public_a assembly_n and_o gather_v new_a church_n for_o themselves_o out_o of_o they_o this_o they_o do_v though_o you_o know_v we_o general_o have_v not_o give_v they_o cause_n to_o do_v it_o and_o they_o do_v it_o rash_o and_o total_o and_o all_o your_o little_a device_n will_v never_o alter_v the_o nature_n of_o thing_n or_o excuse_v it_o from_o gross_a schism_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o that_o be_v not_o separatist_n and_o speak_v their_o mind_n before_o the_o present_a temptation_n dazzle_v man_n eye_n it_o be_v in_o vain_a to_o fly_v to_o your_o common_a refuge_n the_o strength_n of_o this_o argument_n will_v not_o suffer_v you_o to_o be_v quiet_a in_o it_o who_o ever_o before_o you_o make_v this_o a_o warrantable_a ground_n of_o separation_n that_o they_o may_v serve_v god_n better_o if_o find_v positive_a fault_n in_o our_o worship_n will_v not_o excuse_v they_o heretofore_o much_o less_o will_v negative_a one_o excuse_v you_o from_o separation_n but_o they_o think_v those_o be_v fault_n and_o just_a cause_n of_o separation_n which_o be_v not_o true_a and_o they_o be_v mistake_v but_o yet_o they_o have_v more_o to_o say_v for_o themselves_o it_o seem_v than_o you_o have_v who_o do_v the_o same_o thing_n without_o allege_v so_o much_o ground_n and_o think_v to_o be_v whole_o free_a from_o the_o same_o charge_n sir_n schism_n consist_v in_o practice_n and_o whatever_o you_o think_v on_o it_o or_o however_o you_o will_v palliate_v the_o matter_n where_o that_o practice_n that_o true_o answer_v the_o definition_n of_o schism_n be_v find_v it_o will_v be_v schism_n do_v what_o you_o can_v be_v there_o any_o institution_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o must_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o true_a church_n to_o make_v a_o pure_a church_n ans_fw-fr mr._n cawdrey_n indep_n p._n 198._o but_o i_o prevent_v my_o design_n shism_n we_o have_v show_v be_v a_o causeless_a unwarrantable_a separation_n and_o it_o be_v true_a and_o so_o my_o answerer_n may_v have_v understand_v i_o and_o his_o brethren_n in_o my_o last_o i_o speak_v in_o the_o language_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o a_o little_a candour_n will_v have_v suppose_v that_o both_o i_o and_o they_o intend_v by_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o church_n such_o as_o be_v causeless_a unwarrantable_a and_o unnecessary_a for_o that_o they_o be_v still_o ready_a if_o need_v require_v to_o prove_v the_o independent_a separation_n such_o as_o i_o shall_v be_v anon_o to_o do_v you_o it_o be_v therefore_o some_o trouble_n to_o i_o to_o hear_v you_o ask_v as_o if_o something_o of_o argument_n be_v lodge_v in_o it_o whether_o a_o person_n removal_n from_o one_o parish_n to_o another_o to_o inhabit_v there_o be_v schism_n p._n 48._o and_o yet_o i_o conceive_v you_o have_v it_o more_o than_o twice_o over_o in_o your_o book_n you_o ask_v again_o must_v no_o church_n be_v gather_v out_o of_o rome_n i_o fear_v not_o many_o for_o you_o but_o for_o a_o full_a and_o plain_a answer_n to_o this_o i_o remit_v you_o to_o mr._n baxters_n cure_n of_o church_n division_n p._n 81_o 82_o 83._o which_o if_o it_o seem_v not_o plain_a and_o full_a to_o you_o it_o be_v because_o you_o understand_v not_o christian_a sense_n and_o reason_n again_o p._n 44._o do_v not_o the_o parliament_n take_v a_o church_n out_o of_o a_o church_n when_o they_o separate_v covent-garden_n from_o martin_n parish_n doubtless_o it_o be_v either_o with_o cause_n or_o not_o it_o be_v warrantable_a or_o not_o it_o be_v necessary_a or_o not_o but_o the_o jest_n be_v spoil_v if_o it_o be_v a_o church_n of_o the_o same_o constitution_n with_o consent_n of_o the_o person_n concern_v &_o by_o lawful_a authority_n have_v you_o no_o place_n to_o argue_v schismatical_a but_o coventgarden_n i_o will_v advise_v you_o as_o a_o friend_n to_o take_v a_o little_a more_o heed_n what_o you_o say_v about_o that_o place_n for_o fear_v of_o one_o of_o those_o schismatic_n which_o in_o other_o place_n you_o honour_n as_o usurper_n concern_v in_o your_o next_o section_n but_o behold_v the_o man_n at_o arm_n full_o accoutre_v without_o all_o fear_n but_o a_o great_a deal_n of_o wit_n and_o courage_n make_v a_o challenge_n to_o the_o faction_n disputer_n as_o his_o catholic_n language_n be_v and_o it_o be_v this_o as_o you_o may_v read_v it_o under_o his_o own_o hand_n obj._n i_o undertake_v say_v he_o to_o prove_v that_o dr._n manton_n dr._n seaman_n etc._n etc._n with_o the_o people_n subject_n to_o they_o as_o pastor_n be_v true_a church_n prove_v you_o if_o you_o can_v that_o on_o aug._n 24_o 62._o they_o be_v degrade_v and_o these_o church_n be_v dissolve_v in_o any_o reason_n which_o any_o church_n for_o 600._o year_n after_o christ_n will_v if_o not_o you_o seem_v yourself_o to_o accuse_v their_o successor_n of_o schism_n for_o draw_v part_n of_o the_o people_n from_o they_o mere_o by_o the_o advantage_n of_o have_v the_o temple_n and_o tithe_n and_o so_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o true_a church_n ans_fw-fr a_o marvellous_a undertaker_n he_o will_v undertake_v to_o prove_v one_o proposition_n and_o let_v the_o rest_n shift_n for_o themselves_o dr._n manton_n and_o dr._n seaman_n and_o their_o people_n be_v true_a church_n and_o this_o he_o will_v prove_v but_o what_o if_o a_o man_n shall_v venture_v to_o disappoint_v he_o and_o not_o deny_v it_o again_o prove_v if_o you_o can_v that_o these_o pastor_n be_v degrade_v and_o these_o church_n dissolve_v aug._n 24._o 62._o but_o what_o if_o a_o man_n have_v a_o mind_n to_o be_v friend_n with_o he_o here_o too_o and_o shall_v grant_v that_o those_o minister_n be_v not_o degrade_v then_o but_o only_o eject_v and_o inhibit_v the_o exercise_n of_o their_o ministry_n within_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o that_o those_o church_n be_v not_o dissolve_v by_o have_v new_a pastor_n no_o more_o than_o the_o kingdom_n when_o the_o king_n die_v and_o yet_o certain_o the_o king_n and_o people_n be_v as_o much_o the_o constitutive_a part_n of_o a_o kingdom_n as_o pastor_n and_o people_n of_o a_o church_n who_o will_v say_v that_o consider_v what_o he_o say_v that_o a_o particular_a church_n be_v dissolve_v by_o the_o death_n or_o removal_n of_o the_o pastor_n the_o river_n be_v the_o same_o though_o the_o land_n on_o each_o side_n change_v their_o proprietor_n but_o what_o then_o suppose_v all_o this_o be_v quiet_o grant_v he_o what_o then_o then_o those_o that_o succeed_v they_o be_v schismatic_n or_o you_o seem_v to_o accuse_v they_o of_o schism_n how_o so_o for_o draw_v away_o part_n of_o the_o people_n from_o they_o whither_o to_o another_o manner_n of_o worship_n which_o the_o law_n require_v and_o which_o the_o eject_v refuse_v but_o how_o do_v they_o draw_v the_o people_n by_o do_v their_o duty_n in_o the_o temple_n as_o by_o good_a authority_n institute_v and_o induct_v thereunto_o institute_v as_o pastor_n to_o have_v the_o cure_n of_o soul_n and_o induct_v into_o the_o temple_n and_o tithe_n but_o last_o why_o do_v you_o say_v they_o draw_v a_o part_n of_o the_o people_n only_o and_o not_o the_o whole_a ought_v not_o the_o whole_a worship_n god_n undivided_a and_o with_o one_o accord_n in_o the_o temple_n or_o must_v the_o place_n be_v remove_v with_o the_o pastor_n i_o choir_n not_o who_o make_v the_o difference_n but_o i_o know_v who_o make_v the_o division_n let_v they_o answer_v it_o how_o they_o can_v to_o god_n and_o the_o king_n the_o church_n and_o their_o successor_n those_o pastor_n be_v eject_v out_o of_o the_o temple_n by_o lawful_a authority_n the_o people_n be_v bind_v to_o worship_n god_n in_o the_o temple_n as_o they_o have_v opportunity_n and_o no_o where_o else_o in_o opposition_n to_o the_o public_a worship_n the_o consequence_n here_o i_o think_v may_v vie_v with_o you_o above_o therefore_o these_o pastor_n have_v no_o opportunity_n to_o exercise_v their_o pastoral_n office_n to_o those_o people_n and_o where_o there_o be_v no_o opportunity_n there_o be_v no_o duty_n in_o mr._n baxters_n divinity_n second_o admon_n to_o bagsh_n 96._o but_o you_o say_v you_o must_v preach_v the_o reverend_a dr._n gouge_n say_v no._n the_o inhibition_n of_o idolator_n and_o infidel_n make_v simple_o against_o preach_v of_o the_o gospel_n because_o they_o 570._o whole_a armour_n of_o god_n 570._o will_v have_v it_o utter_o suppress_v in_o this_o case_n he_o say_v no_o sufficient_a inhibition_n to_o bind_v the_o conscience_n it_o be_v direct_o and_o apparent_o contrary_a to_o god_n word_n but_o when_o christian_a magistrate_n inhibit_v minister_n to_o preach_v it_o be_v because_o they_o think_v they_o unfit_a and_o unmeet_a either_o for_o some_o notorious_a crime_n or_o for_o some_o erroneous_a opinion_n to_o exercise_v their_o ministerial_a function_n in_o these_o case_n such_o as_o be_v so_o inhibit_v
whit_n behind_o he_o there_o be_v nothing_o do_v say_v he_o in_o god_n public_a 3_o on_o john_n 4._o p._n 3_o warship_n among_o we_o but_o it_o be_v do_v by_o the_o institution_n and_o ordinance_n and_o commandment_n of_o the_o lord_n as_o he_o very_o industrious_o and_o learned_o prove_v by_o a_o enumeration_n of_o the_o particular_n of_o our_o worship_n and_o thence_o press_v the_o people_n not_o only_o to_o attend_v it_o but_o to_o come_v to_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o mr._n bagshaw_n himself_o acknowledge_v the_o same_o and_o therefore_o plead_v that_o they_o do_v not_o separate_v but_o forbear_v 6._o antidote_n p._n 6._o communion_n because_o of_o some_o conditim_n require_v and_o so_o indeed_o do_v doctor_n owen_n and_o all_o sober_a independent_o and_o therefore_o i_o need_v not_o observe_v that_o those_o eminent_a presbyterian_o that_o write_v the_o epistle_n before_o mr._n ball_n answer_v to_o cann_n do_v own_o or_o that_o mr._n cawdry_n and_o other_o presbyterian_o have_v make_v it_o the_o foundation_n of_o all_o their_o argument_n against_o independent_a gather_a church_n that_o our_o church_n be_v true_a church_n our_o author_n do_v not_o so_o much_o as_o question_v the_o truth_n of_o our_o church_n in_o general_n what_o exception_n notwithstanding_o he_o have_v scatter_v about_o it_o we_o shall_v brief_o examine_v object_n 1._o page_n 10._o he_o tell_v we_o like_o a_o oracle_n among_o the_o rest_n of_o their_o purpose_n and_o desire_n which_o be_v not_o a_o few_o and_o they_o none_o of_o the_o best_a that_o the_o nonconformist_n think_v that_o a_o parish_n quatenus_fw-la a_o parish_n be_v not_o a_o church_n nor_o a_o parishioner_n as_o such_o a_o church-member_n well_o and_o who_o ever_o say_v they_o think_v otherwise_o in_o some_o thing_n it_o seem_v they_o think_v as_o other_o do_v yet_o we_o know_v and_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v at_o least_o that_o a_o company_n of_o christian_n live_v within_o parish_n bound_n and_o ordinary_o attend_v upon_o god_n public_a worship_n in_o the_o place_n set_v a_o part_n to_o that_o end_n be_v a_o church_n object_n 2._o but_o they_o think_v also_o that_o parish_n bound_n of_o church_n be_v of_o humane_a prudential_a constitution_n and_o not_o of_o divine_a institution_n or_o unchangeable_a but_o pray_v think_v again_o for_o you_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o co-habitation_n of_o the_o member_n of_o a_o parochial_a church_n be_v according_a to_o the_o law_n of_o nature_n and_o so_o divine_a and_o that_o person_n who_o providence_n have_v so_o place_v together_o be_v bind_v to_o worship_n god_n together_o in_o some_o public_a way_n by_o virtue_n of_o the_o law_n of_o natural_a religion_n as_o much_o as_o family_n among_o themselves_o be_v there_o no_o other_o institution_n of_o god_n or_o man_n in_o the_o case_n moreover_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o co-habitation_n of_o church_n member_n be_v so_o far_o of_o divine_a institution_n as_o the_o example_n of_o church_n in_o scripture_n always_o so_o bound_v amount_v to_o divine_a institution_n which_o be_v almost_o as_o much_o as_o be_v usual_o urge_v for_o the_o divine_a institution_n of_o the_o lord_n day_n this_o be_v the_o current_a argument_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o heretofore_o against_o the_o attempt_n of_o independent_o to_o break_v these_o bound_n and_o to_o glean_v up_o member_n in_o other_o field_n no_o matter_n what_o distance_n to_o make_v up_o their_o church_n church_n and_o city_n in_o the_o scripture_n be_v commensurate_a be_v not_o pag._n cawdrey_n schys_n pag._n the_o church_n of_o jerusalem_n and_o corinth_n so_o call_v from_o the_o place_n they_o ought_v further_o to_o think_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o suâ—h_n parochial_a church_n be_v lay_v in_o reason_n and_o scripture_n example_n though_o we_o be_v actual_o divide_v long_o since_o and_o that_o our_o parish_n bound_n in_o the_o general_a intention_n and_o scope_n of_o those_o that_o first_o appoint_v they_o notwithstanding_o some_o error_n which_o will_v always_o happen_v in_o such_o public_a case_n be_v make_v upon_o the_o say_v reasonable_a and_o scripture_n ground_n of_o co-habitation_n they_o ought_v also_o to_o think_v that_o though_o prudence_n at_o first_o discern_v these_o ground_n and_o according_o set_v these_o bound_n of_o parish_n church_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o the_o prudence_n of_o the_o people_n but_o their_o governor_n who_o have_v not_o now_o leave_v it_o in_o the_o people_n liberty_n or_o prudence_n whether_o they_o will_v ordinary_o keep_v these_o bound_n or_o not_o but_o have_v also_o bound_v that_o vulgar_a extravagancy_n by_o the_o law_n both_o of_o church_n and_o state_n to_o the_o contrary_a yet_o again_o they_o ought_v to_o think_v that_o they_o owe_v obedience_n to_o their_o governor_n in_o these_o law_n which_o obedience_n be_v certain_o of_o divine_a institution_n though_o i_o can_v hardly_o find_v it_o in_o all_o your_o book_n you_o ought_v last_o to_o think_v of_o the_o fearful_a consequence_n of_o tear_v these_o hedge_n and_o ancient_a bound_n and_o thereby_o make_v inlet_n or_o outlet_n or_o both_o to_o all_o kind_n of_o licentiousness_n in_o religion_n and_o confusion_n in_o the_o church_n while_o you_o thus_o expose_v parochial_a congregation_n to_o the_o direct_v mean_n of_o their_o dissolution_n o_o that_o you_o will_v lay_v to_o heart_n those_o serious_a word_n of_o mr._n baxter_n the_o interest_n of_o the_o christian_n protestant_n religion_n in_o england_n must_v be_v keep_v up_o by_o keep_v up_o as_o much_o of_o truth_n piety_n and_o reputation_n as_o be_v possible_a in_o the_o parish_n church_n his_o defence_n of_o his_o cure_n p._n 36._o for_o the_o last_o word_n that_o parish_n bound_n be_v not_o unchangeable_a it_o be_v acknowledge_v if_o the_o cause_n be_v just_a and_o coventgarden_n be_v not_o schysmatical_a yet_o still_o the_o rule_n of_o co-habitation_n ought_v to_o be_v observe_v and_o then_o our_o design_n be_v half_o spoil_v especial_o if_o we_o add_v as_o we_o needs_o must_v that_o this_o change_n or_o alter_v of_o parish_n bound_n lie_v not_o in_o the_o pleasure_n of_o private_a person_n be_v not_o to_o be_v attempt_v without_o the_o order_n of_o superior_n nor_o to_o the_o prejudice_n of_o god_n public_a worship_n wherein_o if_o all_o order_n be_v not_o quite_o forget_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o people_n shall_v not_o ordinary_o excee_v that_o which_o the_o know_a union_n and_o communion_n of_o parish_n in_o the_o same_o worship_n and_o government_n and_o the_o common_a custom_n and_o consequent_o allowance_n of_o the_o place_n intend_v will_v warrant_v wherein_o london_n perhaps_o if_o what_o you_o say_v be_v true_a may_v claim_v some_o privilege_n he_o say_v he_o do_v allow_v our_o parochial_a church_n to_o be_v true_a church_n viâ—_n 35._o p._n 35._o those_o of_o they_o that_o have_v true_a minister_n other_o wise_a not_o so_o that_o where_o there_o be_v no_o minister_n and_o where_o their_o minister_n be_v not_o true_a there_o the_o parish_n be_v not_o church_n it_o be_v likely_a some_o few_o small_a place_n especial_o cure_n have_v no_o settle_a minister_n but_o the_o law_n require_v their_o communion_n with_o their_o mother-church_n of_o which_o in_o a_o sense_n they_o be_v reckon_v member_n if_o they_o be_v curacy_n and_o i_o hope_v there_o be_v few_o false_a minister_n than_o your_o charity_n suppose_v how_o far_o the_o people_n be_v bind_v to_o communicate_v with_o such_o as_o you_o call_v intolerable_a shall_v be_v examine_v in_o the_o next_o chapter_n but_o if_o this_o be_v all_o to_o be_v find_v at_o the_o bottom_n of_o your_o exception_n as_o it_o seem_v to_o be_v why_o do_v not_o your_o brethren_n confine_v their_o labour_n to_o such_o destitute_a place_n especial_o if_o this_o be_v the_o great_a reason_n why_o they_o must_v preach_v at_o least_o their_o charity_n shall_v see_v they_o first_o provide_v for_o sure_o their_o voice_n will_v hardly_o reach_v to_o they_o from_o â—ities_n and_o corporation_n and_o place_n usual_o furnish_v well_o enough_o without_o they_o though_o here_o they_o general_o pitch_v their_o tabernacle_n you_o and_o they_o must_v think_v again_o and_o again_o before_o you_o will_v be_v able_a to_o defend_v these_o practice_n upon_o such_o principle_n chap._n xiii_o the_o people_n of_o england_n member_n of_o parochial_a church_n objection_n answer_v especial_o that_o from_o serve_v god_n better_a the_o people_n of_o england_n general_o be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n or_o minister_n of_o our_o parochial_a church_n and_o consequent_o be_v bind_v to_o atttend_v upon_o the_o public_a worship_n of_o god_n in_o our_o temple_n ordinary_o i_o mean_v i_o be_o not_o so_o strict_a to_o think_v that_o they_o ought_v never_o to_o be_v absent_a if_o they_o have_v reason_n as_o the_o statute_n intimate_v or_o that_o they_o may_v never_o go_v out_o of_o their_o own_o parish_n to_o hear_v a_o seâ—mon_a provide_v always_o
this_o be_v matter_n of_o fact_n evident_a in_o itself_o and_o to_o the_o sense_n of_o too_o many_o ocular_a witness_n 1._o they_o dislike_v or_o distaste_n our_o parochial_a communion_n some_o as_o antichristian_a some_o as_o corrupt_v some_o as_o defective_a and_o not_o so_o good_a as_o they_o will_v have_v it_o and_o some_o perhaps_o because_o they_o like_v not_o our_o minister_n and_o some_o as_o he_o intimate_v for_o communion_n with_o their_o old_a eject_v pastor_n what_o their_o several_a reason_n be_v for_o they_o be_v far_o from_o be_v all_o of_o a_o mind_n as_o he_o acknowledge_v we_o can_v but_o guess_v but_o they_o do_v all_o dislike_v our_o communion_n at_o least_o comparative_o none_o can_v deny_v or_o doubt_v this_o 2._o upon_o this_o dislike_n whatever_o the_o cause_n of_o it_o be_v they_o do_v plain_o forsake_v our_o parish-church_n and_o public_a worship_n now_o we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o non-actual_a communion_n be_v proper_o separation_n yet_o all_o man_n say_v that_o a_o renounce_v communion_n or_o deny_v to_o communicate_v with_o any_o church_n much_o more_o our_o own_o upon_o any_o dislike_n or_o for_o any_o cause_n except_o sin_n be_v proper_o separation_n and_o schysm_n it_o be_v not_o actual_o not_o communicate_v with_o a_o true_a church_n but_o renounce_v communion_n that_o we_o think_v make_v the_o shysmatick_n 188._o inâ—_n schys_n p._n 188._o it_o be_v this_o in_o which_o amesius_n himself_o place_v the_o very_a formality_n schys_n am._n de_fw-fr schys_n of_o schysm_n schysm_n be_v direct_o a_o breach_n of_o unity_n as_o that_o be_v a_o breach_n of_o charity_n refuse_v to_o communicate_v with_o a_o true_a church_n when_o i_o have_v opportunity_n especial_o my_o own_o church_n be_v a_o plain_a breach_n of_o both_o what_o ever_o my_o reason_n be_v short_a of_o sin_n 3._o but_o three_o they_o perfect_v their_o schysm_n and_o separation_n by_o gather_v themselves_o into_o other_o congregation_n under_o other_o minister_n and_o for_o another_o mode_n of_o worship_n than_o be_v allow_v by_o our_o church_n and_o law_n and_o thus_o become_v anti-churche_n and_o to_o make_v this_o new_a church-state_n as_o opposite_a to_o we_o as_o may_v be_v they_o general_o meet_v at_o the_o same_o time_n that_o we_o do_v &_o that_o not_o only_a where_o the_o parish_n be_v suspect_v defective_a in_o part_n gift_n grace_n or_o administration_n much_o less_o intolerable_a or_o where_o there_o be_v none_o at_o all_o as_o be_v note_v before_o and_o in_o such_o place_n as_o they_o suppose_v to_o be_v so_o ill_o provide_v for_o we_o hear_v nothing_o of_o their_o charity_n but_o in_o place_n where_o neither_o these_o minister_n nor_o their_o follower_n have_v the_o least_o exception_n to_o the_o parish-minister_n and_o thus_o they_o separate_v not_o for_o sometime_o and_o for_o some_o ordinance_n but_o constant_o &_o for_o all_o ordinance_n the_o word_n prayer_n and_o both_o sacrament_n and_o that_o general_o in_o all_o place_n near_o we_o without_o any_o such_o distinction_n of_o minister_n or_o any_o thing_n else_o so_o that_o though_o i_o have_v inquire_v i_o can_v hear_v but_o of_o one_o minister_n within_o a_o very_a large_a compass_n that_o take_v the_o liberty_n of_o indulgence_n and_o do_v not_o so_o abuse_v it_o and_o i_o fear_v they_o do_v so_o general_o throughout_o england_n if_o we_o may_v guess_v at_o other_o place_n by_o the_o practice_n of_o these_o except_o your_o good_a example_n and_o advice_n have_v a_o better_a influence_n there_o than_o here_o for_o i_o can_v but_o let_v you_o know_v that_o your_o canon_n be_v so_o contrary_a to_o their_o purpose_n and_o practice_n that_o i_o have_v some_o reason_n to_o believe_v that_o our_o new_a church_n gatherer_n here_o about_o be_v general_o as_o much_o displease_v with_o the_o rule_n whereby_o you_o will_v bound_v their_o ex_fw-la ravagant_a practice_n as_o they_o seem_v to_o be_v please_v with_o your_o magisterialness_n over_o i_o and_o by_o the_o way_n give_v i_o leave_v to_o tell_v you_o that_o two_o thing_n especial_o i_o can_v take_v well_o at_o your_o hand_n 1._o that_o you_o will_v insinuate_v that_o such_o as_o call_v themselves_o presbyterian_o which_o you_o say_v be_v not_o so_o you_o shuffle_v they_o among_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o sect_n which_o be_v for_o gather_v of_o church_n 2._o that_o you_o intimate_v you_o know_v their_o mind_n and_o that_o they_o will_v not_o separate_v and_o gather_v church_n in_o the_o manner_n we_o see_v by_o sad_a experience_n they_o general_o do_v for_o i_o do_v acknowledge_v you_o sufficient_o discover_v your_o own_o inclination_n hope_n and_o desire_n be_v otherwise_o than_o we_o find_v their_o practice_n yea_o you_o seem_v to_o intimate_v their_o practice_n to_o be_v otherwise_o they_o have_v deceive_v you_o as_o indeed_o you_o do_v i_o who_o be_o sorry_a to_o find_v your_o pen_n employ_v for_o the_o countenance_n to_o say_v no_o more_o of_o separation_n and_o schysm_n in_o the_o high_a measure_n that_o this_o poor_a church_n ever_o yet_o experiment_v why_o do_v i_o hear_v word_n to_o excuse_v and_o alleviate_v the_o matter_n when_o their_o deed_n declare_v the_o quite_o contrary_a to_o what_o you_o hope_v and_o intimate_v all_o your_o proposition_n and_o purpose_n can_v never_o make_v they_o either_o not_o presbiterian_o or_o separatist_n unless_o by_o their_o quit_v their_o former_a principle_n they_o be_v sink_v into_o the_o number_n of_o independent_o for_o it_o be_v hard_o to_o say_v which_o of_o the_o congregation_n be_v most_o congregational_a obj._n you_o seem_v to_o wonder_v p._n 40._o that_o i_o charge_v not_o your_o preach_n before_o your_o indulgence_n with_o schysm_n as_o well_o as_o now_o answ_n no_o doubt_n if_o it_o be_v so_o before_o as_o we_o see_v it_o be_v since_o i_o may_v yet_o venture_v to_o do_v it_o but_z sir_n let_v i_o tell_v you_o something_o that_o i_o know_v will_v not_o be_v easy_a to_o you_o in_o the_o city_n where_o i_o be_o a_o preacher_n there_o may_v perhaps_o thirty_o or_o forty_o ordinary_o meet_v by_o stealth_n and_o perhaps_o not_o at_o the_o same_o time_n of_o our_o public_a worship_n whereas_o there_o be_v now_o six_o or_o seven_o allow_a place_n and_o perhaps_o they_o may_v share_v three_o thousand_o of_o our_o member_n among_o they_o that_o now_o so_o far_o as_o we_o can_v judge_v total_o separate_v yet_o i_o think_v never_o any_o one_o of_o they_o complain_v of_o the_o inability_n infidelity_n or_o scandal_n of_o the_o parish-minister_n now_o when_o we_o see_v such_o a_o torrent_n prepare_v to_o bear_v down_o all_o our_o church_n i_o think_v it_o be_v time_n to_o speak_v i_o will_v deliver_v my_o own_o soul_n if_o i_o can_v save_v the_o church_n from_o the_o evil_n begin_v speak_v in_o earnest_n sir_n if_o the_o matter_n be_v thus_o indeed_o be_v it_o not_o separation_n with_o a_o witness_n if_o you_o will_v not_o let_v other_o speak_v the_o old_a rule_n be_v the_o sincere_a 162._o cawd_z indep_n p._n 161._o 162._o preach_n of_o the_o word_n and_o right_a administration_n of_o sacrament_n be_v the_o character_n of_o a_o true_a church_n which_o we_o have_v and_o they_o separate_v from_o we_o how_o shall_v this_o crime_n be_v name_v but_o by_o schysm_n in_o the_o high_a degree_n and_o the_o rather_o do_v this_o relate_v to_o schysm_n in_o gather_v church_n p._n 180._o because_o they_o do_v not_o only_o depart_v themselves_o but_o draw_v off_o other_o also_o into_o a_o form_a faction_n chap._n xv._o the_o present_a practice_n of_o separation_n and_o gather_a church_n be_v causeless_a and_o unwarantable_a objection_n of_o the_o answerer_n consider_v because_o it_o be_v separation_n from_o true_a church_n by_o such_o as_o be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n of_o those_o true_a church_n both_o negative_o and_o positive_o and_o total_o so_o and_o last_o which_o only_o remain_v to_o be_v prove_v because_o it_o be_v both_o rash_a and_o unjust_a and_o without_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o offence_n give_v by_o these_o church_n for_o it_o have_v already_o appear_v that_o such_o separation_n be_v sinful_a and_o schysm_n in_o the_o worst_a sense_n of_o the_o word_n when_o it_o be_v rash_a or_o unjust_a without_o such_o ground_n it_o only_o remain_v to_o be_v show_v that_o the_o present_a practice_n aforesaid_a be_v both_o rash_a and_o unjust_a 1._o first_o it_o be_v apparent_o a_o rash_a separation_n for_o those_o that_o go_v from_o we_o to_o these_o new_a church_n can_v not_o foresee_v or_o reasonable_o imagine_v this_o liberty_n now_o indulge_v a_o week_n if_o a_o day_n before_o the_o declaration_n be_v publish_v and_o how_o sudden_o they_o do_v upon_o it_o prepare_v for_o the_o work_n and_o separate_v to_o their_o new_a congregation_n and_o guide_n it_o be_v too_o well_o know_v to_o insist_v on_o and_o where_o be_v the_o man_n if_o one_o such_o
acknowledge_v that_o our_o worship_n be_v not_o such_o as_o no_o man_n may_v lawful_o communicate_v in_o then_o certain_o you_o believe_v that_o there_o be_v nothing_o in_o it_o that_o be_v real_o and_o material_o evil_a or_o evil_a in_o itself_o for_o than_o no_o man_n may_v lawful_o join_v in_o it_o but_o if_o it_o shall_v become_v evil_a accidental_o from_o the_o particular_a condition_n of_o any_o private_a man_n let_v he_o remove_v that_o evil_a and_o not_o commit_v a_o great_a by_o separation_n but_o pray_v sir_n why_o do_v you_o seem_v thus_o to_o limit_v your_o kindness_n and_o charity_n to_o our_o communion_n if_o it_o be_v not_o such_o as_o no_o man_n why_o be_v it_o not_o such_o as_o all_o man_n may_v lawful_o communicate_v in_o if_o you_o may_v lawful_o communicate_v in_o some_o of_o our_o church_n as_o in_o another_o place_n you_o speak_v why_o not_o in_o all_o or_o why_o do_v you_o leave_v the_o people_n in_o such_o distraction_n have_v not_o all_o our_o church_n the_o same_o ordinance_n our_o minister_n the_o same_o order_n have_v they_o not_o all_o the_o same_o matter_n and_o the_o weary_a same_o mode_n of_o worship_n you_o do_v not_o think_v the_o worth_n of_o the_o minister_n go_v into_o the_o lawfulness_n of_o our_o prayer_n and_o sacrament_n or_o that_o we_o may_v not_o join_v with_o the_o liturgy_n that_o be_v not_o second_v with_o a_o good_a sermon_n i_o be_o sure_a you_o lay_v not_o the_o weight_n of_o your_o limitation_n upon_o the_o manner_n of_o the_o people_n that_o be_v a_o principle_n you_o seem_v to_o abhor_v neither_o can_v you_o make_v use_n of_o any_o exception_n against_o the_o diocesan_n church_n where_o in_o all_o our_o church_n be_v equal_o concern_v except_o a_o few_o peculiar_o i_o be_o sorry_a to_o say_v i_o know_v not_o what_o you_o mean_v until_o you_o better_o explain_v yourself_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o understand_v you_o indefinite_o especial_o while_o you_o say_v you_o do_v &_o will_v hold_v communion_n with_o our_o own_o parish-church_n yourself_o and_o that_o you_o make_v it_o your_o business_n to_o advise_v and_o persuade_v other_o also_o thereunto_o which_o i_o be_o very_o certain_a you_o will_v not_o do_v if_o you_o do_v not_o believe_v not_o only_o that_o our_o way_n of_o worship_n be_v lawful_a i._n e._n not_o sinful_a but_o also_o good_a and_o that_o they_o in_o duty_n ought_v to_o attend_v it_o and_o communicate_v with_o we_o in_o it_o but_o pray_v sir_n why_o then_o do_v you_o p._n 34._o intimate_v as_o if_o some_o parish-church_n do_v impose_v some_o thing_n which_o god_n forbid_v indeed_o when_o you_o speak_v serious_o you_o seem_v to_o reduce_v all_o the_o people_n exception_n in_o this_o kind_n to_o the_o two_o know_a head_n kneel_v at_o the_o communion_n and_o the_o cross_n at_o baptism_n 1._o for_o kneel_v you_o yourself_o seem_v not_o only_o to_o allow_v but_o to_o approve_v it_o you_o also_o practice_v it_o and_o you_o know_v mr._n baxter_n speak_v handsome_o for_o it_o in_o his_o dispute_n p_o 411._o 2._o for_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n make_v at_o baptism_n this_o indeed_o be_v require_v of_o the_o minister_n and_o it_o be_v his_o peculiar_a part_n to_o do_v it_o and_o for_o aught_o i_o know_v it_o be_v no_o more_o to_o the_o people_n than_o his_o wear_n the_o surpluss_n and_o if_o he_o know_v it_o to_o be_v his_o duty_n why_o will_v you_o deny_v he_o his_o liberty_n to_o do_v it_o mr._n baxter_n teach_v we_o that_o in_o such_o thing_n we_o ought_v to_o be_v guide_v by_o our_o pastor_n which_o be_v certain_o require_v while_o they_o be_v only_o suspect_v or_o at_o least_o they_o be_v not_o so_o certain_a that_o they_o be_v sinful_a as_o we_o be_v 484._o disput_fw-la 484._o certain_a that_o we_o ought_v to_o obey_v as_o he_o reason_n well_o especial_o sign_v with_o this_o sign_n be_v the_o minister_n own_o act_n you_o may_v venture_v to_o give_v he_o so_o much_o power_n as_o to_o do_v it_o without_o offence_n to_o you_o or_o so_o great_a offence_n as_o to_o cause_v you_o to_o separate_v beside_o if_o you_o can_v be_v persuade_v to_o like_v this_o one_o action_n yet_o you_o must_v remember_v the_o rule_n of_o ames_n and_o separate_v for_o this_o in_o nothing_o else_o but_o what_o need_v all_o this_o trouble_n you_o have_v know_v a_o way_n this_o ten_o year_n to_o answer_v this_o scruple_n by_o private_a baptism_n and_o you_o will_v know_v how_o to_o serve_v yourselves_o in_o this_o of_o the_o king_n declaration_n without_o my_o advice_n but_o then_o why_o shall_v you_o separate_v or_o gather_v into_o new_a church_n for_o that_o which_o the_o declaration_n remove_v without_o such_o do_n why_o do_v you_o stun_v and_o distract_v the_o church_n by_o kill_v a_o gnat_n upon_o her_o forehead_n with_o so_o great_a a_o stroke_n sir_n you_o intimate_v p._n 35._o the_o case_n be_v alter_v but_o sure_o not_o much_o as_o to_o this_o point_n betwixt_o we_o and_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n yet_o you_o well_o know_v all_o conform_a with_o the_o people_n in_o and_o contend_v for_o lay_v communion_n against_o the_o brownist_n yea_o it_o be_v a_o worthy_a observation_n of_o mr._n baxter_n that_o if_o there_o be_v any_o alteration_n it_o be_v for_o the_o better_a for_o the_o people_n as_o he_o ingenious_o confess_v and_o account_n take_v his_o word_n at_o large_a though_o say_v he_o ministerial_a conformity_n be_v to_o we_o another_o thing_n 55._o defence_n of_o cure_n of_o ch_n div_o p._n 55._o by_o reason_n of_o the_o new_a imposition_n than_o it_o be_v to_o our_o predecessor_n yet_o to_o the_o people_n conformity_n be_v the_o same_o if_o not_o easy_o especial_o to_o they_o that_o i_o now_o speak_v to_o for_o it_o be_v the_o lyturgy_n ceremony_n and_o ministry_n that_o most_o alienate_v they_o and_o the_o lyturgy_n be_v a_o little_a amend_v as_o to_o they_o by_o the_o change_n of_o the_o translation_n and_o some_o little_a word_n and_o by_o some_o long_a prayer_n and_o the_o ceremony_n be_v the_o same_o and_o thirty_o year_n ago_o there_o be_v many_o bare_a read_n not_o preach_v minister_n for_o one_o that_o there_o be_v now_o therefore_o our_o case_n of_o separation_n be_v the_o same_o with_o that_o it_o be_v of_o old_a i_o take_v it_o to_o be_v full_o confute_v by_o the_o ancient_a nonconformist_n and_o i_o have_v so_o great_a a_o veneration_n for_o the_o worthy_a name_n much_o more_o a_o estimation_n of_o the_o reason_n of_o mr._n cartwright_n egerton_n hildersham_n dod_n amesius_n parker_n bains_n brightman_n ball_n bradshaw_n paget_n langley_n nicols_n hear_a and_o many_o other_o such_o that_o i_o shall_v not_o think_v they_o know_v not_o why_o they_o choose_v this_o subject_n and_o write_v more_o against_o separation_n than_o the_o conformist_n do_v thus_o he_o have_v give_v you_o a_o full_a jury_n of_o old_a nonconformist_n and_o their_o verdict_n against_o separation_n from_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n and_o our_o present_a way_n of_o worship_v god_n and_o save_v i_o much_o labour_n in_o that_o particular_a chap._n xvi_o further_a proof_n that_o the_o practice_n be_v schysm_n by_o way_n of_o reply_n to_o his_o objection_n against_o it_o but_o for_o all_o this_o gather_v church_n be_v not_o separation_n who_o will_v say_v so_o beside_o refuse_v our_o communion_n and_o gather_v themselves_o into_o distinct_a congregation_n i_o be_o sure_o be_v that_o which_o the_o old_a nonconformist_n write_v against_o and_o call_v it_o separation_n and_o though_o other_o thing_n occur_v by_o way_n of_o argument_n this_o be_v the_o main_a scope_n and_o bear_v the_o burden_n of_o their_o disputation_n beside_o you_o can_v in_o earnest_n accuse_v our_o communion_n with_o sin_n and_o what_o then_o can_v excuse_v your_o leave_v we_o and_o gather_v new_a church_n from_o separation_n according_a to_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o but_o yourselves_o the_o separatist_n themselves_o not_o except_v who_o never_o that_o i_o ever_o hear_v of_o venture_v to_o question_v the_o major_a proposition_n of_o this_o argument_n but_o deny_v the_o minor_a those_o which_o separate_a from_o a_o true_a church_n in_o who_o communion_n be_v nothing_o sinful_a be_v guilty_a of_o schysâ—_n but_o you_o separate_v from_o a_o true_a church_n in_o who_o communion_n there_o be_v nothing_o sinful_a therefore_o you_o be_v guilty_a of_o schysm_n for_o all_o this_o we_o may_v gather_v church_n and_o be_v neither_o shysmaticks_n nor_o separatist_n and_o we_o have_v eight_o reason_n to_o prove_v it_o a_o whole_a cluster_n of_o they_o we_o shall_v try_v their_o weight_n especial_o see_v they_o will_v bear_v we_o down_o in_o a_o point_n contrary_a to_o the_o sense_n of_o all_o mankind_n for_o new_a reason_n be_v not_o always_o best_o but_o they_o be_v cling_v together_o so_o that_o we_o take_v seven_o of_o they_o at_o
with_o they_o say_v what_o they_o please_v or_o can_v to_o the_o contrary_n be_v schysmaticks_n quod_fw-la erat_fw-la demonstrandum_fw-la i_o only_o assume_v that_o general_o the_o nonconformist_n make_v difference_n in_o our_o church_n draw_v disciple_n from_o they_o and_o renounce_v communion_n with_o they_o quod_fw-la est_fw-la demonstratum_fw-la and_o now_o i_o beg_v leave_n of_o my_o answerer_n to_o conclude_v with_o the_o word_n in_o my_o last_o that_o so_o much_o offend_v he_o that_o i_o be_o sure_a the_o presbyterian_o if_o they_o walk_v by_o the_o principle_n of_o their_o father_n before_o the_o king_n return_n i_o be_o sure_a i_o say_v that_o they_o have_v no_o reason_n to_o engage_v in_o a_o way_n of_o public_a worship_n contradistinct_a to_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n the_o issue_n of_o the_o travers_n say_v mr._n brinsley_n be_v no_o more_o but_o 53._o of_o schysm_n p._n 53._o this_o if_o there_o be_v among_o we_o a_o separation_n from_o a_o true_a church_n and_o that_o both_o voluntary_a and_o unwarrantable_a as_o the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n by_o the_o presbyterian_o be_v which_o i_o suppose_v the_o evidence_n give_v in_o have_v sufficient_o evict_v then_o must_v we_o give_v sentence_n that_o there_o be_v more_o than_o either_o crimen_fw-la nominis_fw-la or_o nomen_fw-la criminis_fw-la no_o less_o than_o a_o schysm_n formal_o and_o proper_o so_o call_v chap._n xxi_o gather_v of_o church_n ought_v not_o to_o be_v practise_v as_o now_o it_o be_v either_o in_o conscience_n or_o prudence_n objection_n answer_v yet_o we_o be_v not_o at_o a_o full_a agreement_n he_o seem_v every_o where_o to_o take_v it_o for_o grant_v that_o we_o be_v now_o at_o perfect_a liberty_n to_o gather_v new_a church_n or_o not_o which_o by_o no_o mean_n i_o allow_v while_o my_o principle_n stand_v undemolish_v such_o as_o these_o that_o our_o church_n of_o england_n be_v a_o true_a church_n that_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n be_v true_a church_n that_o the_o people_n of_o england_n be_v general_o member_n of_o this_o church_n and_o church_n or_o at_o least_o ought_v so_o to_o be_v that_o they_o lawful_o may_v and_o consequent_o be_v in_o duty_n and_o conscience_n bind_v to_o communicate_v with_o they_o and_o therefore_o for_o they_o to_o separate_a and_o to_o gather_v themselves_o into_o new_a congregation_n of_o another_o constitution_n be_v plain_o sinful_a and_o schysmatical_a upon_o the_o premise_n i_o do_v conclude_v that_o conscience_n ought_v first_o to_o be_v consult_v in_o the_o case_n and_o the_o many_o obligation_n thereof_o effectual_o and_o total_o remove_v before_o you_o can_v make_v it_o a_o matter_n of_o indifferency_n in_o itself_o and_o of_o more_o christian_a prudence_n pro_fw-la hic_fw-la &_o nunc_fw-la as_o you_o seem_v to_o affirm_v our_o obligation_n to_o this_o communion_n fall_v many_o way_n upon_o we_o from_o our_o relation_n to_o the_o church_n the_o law_n of_o cohabitation_n of_o church-member_n the_o law_n of_o the_o kingdom_n and_o the_o long_o continue_a practice_n of_o this_o church_n none_o of_o all_o which_o be_v in_o the_o least_o touch_v much_o less_o alter_a or_o repeal_v by_o the_o declaration_n of_o indulgence_n beside_o the_o many_o express_a scripture_n against_o our_o forsake_v our_o wont_a assembly_n separate_v ourselves_o make_v party_n and_o division_n in_o the_o church_n have_v our_o teacher_n in_o too_o much_o admiration_n and_o heap_v they_o up_o to_o ourselves_o and_o receive_v the_o faith_n with_o respect_n of_o person_n and_o draw_v disciple_n after_o we_o in_o all_o which_o both_o the_o present_a case_n and_o the_o several_a conscience_n of_o the_o nonconfomists_a whether_o preacher_n or_o people_n be_v in_o my_o opinion_n not_o light_o concern_v shake_v of_o the_o burden_n as_o well_o as_o you_o can_v until_o these_o thing_n be_v better_a answer_v i_o must_v add_v here_o that_o the_o case_n be_v of_o weight_n in_o pâ—int_n of_o conscience_n as_o well_o as_o prudence_n and_o that_o gather_a church_n as_o now_o you_o do_v be_v a_o breach_n of_o the_o law_n both_o of_o god_n and_o man_n a_o sin_n against_o our_o church_n in_o she_o right_o in_o our_o person_n and_o fellowship_n both_o with_o respect_n to_o our_o pastor_n and_o brethren_n and_o a_o plain_a breach_n of_o our_o covenant_n with_o they_o all_o a_o breach_n of_o the_o church_n unity_n and_o order_n and_o ancient_a bound_n and_o custom_n and_o in_o the_o teacher_n that_o draw_v away_o our_o people_n beside_o all_o that_o have_v be_v say_v a_o plain_a rob_n of_o god_n the_o church_n and_o our_o brother_n to_o conclude_v if_o the_o law_n of_o piety_n justice_n temperance_n or_o charity_n can_v reach_v the_o conscience_n every_o one_o of_o which_o be_v violate_v by_o this_o gather_n of_o church_n the_o case_n be_v not_o a_o work_n of_o mere_a christian_a prudence_n and_o to_o be_v determine_v only_o compare_v the_o good_a and_o evil_a consequent_n together_o as_o you_o say_v p._n 21._o but_o suppose_v my_o foundation_n to_o stand_v firm_a and_o conscience_n in_o the_o point_n well_o secure_v we_o may_v parley_v a_o little_a upon_o it_o in_o point_n of_o prudence_n especial_o see_v you_o affirm_v p._n 21._o that_o he_o that_o through_o imprudence_n mijsudge_v either_o wâ—y_n do_v sin_n moreover_o you_o confess_v that_o the_o case_n be_v now_o of_o so_o great_a moment_n that_o no_o minister_n shall_v rash'y_a determine_v it_o for_o himself_o p._n 20._o nor_o upon_o the_o desire_n of_o some_o of_o the_o people_n only_o but_o shall_v consult_v with_o wise_a and_o sober_a man_n that_o be_v impartial_a but_o if_o the_o case_n be_v so_o difficult_a for_o the_o reader_n who_o you_o say_v must_v preach_v how_o difficult_a be_v the_o case_n for_o the_o people_n for_o it_o be_v no_o where_o say_v they_o must_v separate_v and_o leave_v we_o to_o hear_v you_o yea_o yourself_o teach_v the_o contrary_n you_o state_n your_o nice_a case_n thus_o p._n 17_o 18._o whether_o in_o competent_a parish_n which_o have_v able_a and_o godly_a conformable_a minister_n the_o obligation_n to_o hold_v union_n and_o communion_n with_o the_o parish-church_n or_o the_o obligation_n to_o exercise_v a_o more_o regular_a way_n of_o church_n discipline_n and_o worship_n than_o the_o parish-church_n do_v or_o will_v do_v shall_v be_v judge_v the_o more_o prevalent_a and_o consequent_o whether_o they_o shall_v gather_v church_n out_o of_o church_n in_o this_o a_o case_n not_o so_o difficult_a as_o you_o seem_v to_o make_v it_o if_o there_o be_v as_o you_o have_v hear_v so_o much_o obligation_n upon_o conscience_n to_o the_o former_a part_n of_o it_o touch_v communion_n with_o we_o and_o none_o at_o all_o left_a for_o their_o gathering-churche_n for_o the_o end_v assign_v by_o you_o for_o they_o can_v neither_o leave_v we_o without_o sin_n nor_o gather_v church_n without_o sin_n as_o we_o hope_v it_o have_v appear_v your_o opinion_n be_v give_v upon_o a_o double_a supposition_n and_o both_o of_o they_o false_a 1._o that_o the_o case_n be_v indifferent_a or_o at_o least_o the_o obligation_n to_o both_o so_o equal_a as_o that_o it_o be_v to_o be_v weigh_v only_o by_o prudence_n 2._o that_o it_o be_v lawful_a and_o a_o duty_n to_o be_v a_o member_n of_o such_o a_o parish-church_n only_o when_o we_o can_v have_v and_o do_v no_o better_o i._n e._n in_o our_o own_o opinion_n and_o that_o when_o we_o can_v we_o have_v liberty_n to_o forsake_v our_o own_o church_n though_o i_o confess_v your_o explication_n of_o have_v or_o do_v better_a have_v some_o tendency_n to_o a_o right_a determination_n of_o this_o great_a point_n viz_o you_o say_v we_o can_v have_v or_o dâ—_n better_o when_o it_o can_v be_v without_o a_o great_a hurt_n to_o the_o public_a interest_n of_o the_o gospel_n the_o church_n and_o the_o soul_n of_o man_n than_o the_o benefit_n to_o we_o and_o other_o be_v like_a to_o countervail_v but_o i_o must_v add_v as_o the_o case_n require_v especial_o when_o that_o benefit_n can_v be_v have_v without_o sin_v ourselves_o and_o draw_v other_o to_o sin_v with_o we_o by_o our_o endeavour_n scandal_n and_o example_n which_o i_o think_v we_o too_o plain_o and_o manifest_o do_v by_o gather_v church_n now_o give_v i_o leave_v to_o make_v a_o supposition_n and_o i_o shall_v immediate_o take_v the_o scale_n and_o weigh_v the_o consequent_n as_o you_o say_v on_o both_o side_n my_o supposition_n be_v that_o this_o case_n which_o you_o call_v the_o difficult_a one_o be_v the_o very_a case_n with_o most_o nonconformist_n who_o do_v now_o gather_v church_n for_o as_o our_o parish-minister_n be_v general_o more_o tolerable_a than_o you_o seem_v to_o allow_v they_o so_o especial_o be_v they_o of_o the_o better_a sort_n and_o true_o able_a and_o godly_a and_o our_o parish_n in_o your_o own_o sense_n competent_a enough_o where_o for_o the_o most_o part_n
none_o can_v except_v against_o but_o all_o this_o while_n there_o be_v no_o room_n make_v for_o separation_n the_o nonconformist_n never_o allow_v this_o the_o holy_a scripture_n as_o mr._n baxter_n tell_v we_o have_v not_o a_o word_n to_o that_o purpose_n obj._n but_o we_o be_v trouble_v again_o with_o his_o last_o refuge_n which_o attempt_v we_o every_o where_o your_o church_n be_v allow_v and_o communion_n with_o they_o when_o we_o have_v no_o opportunity_n to_o do_v better_o but_o to_o serve_v god_n better_o we_o may_v leave_v your_o church_n and_o gather_v other_o answ_n this_o have_v pirkt_v up_o to_o my_o trouble_n two_o or_o three_o time_n already_o i_o will_v now_o give_v it_o such_o a_o blow_n as_o i_o hope_v to_o hear_v on_o it_o no_o more_o 1._o if_o we_o may_v not_o refuse_v communion_n with_o our_o own_o particular_a church_n while_o we_o can_v do_v it_o without_o sin_n the_o only_a condition_n allow_v by_o all_o that_o be_v pure_a nonconformist_n yea_o and_o by_o the_o very_a brownist_n themselves_o than_o this_o pretence_n be_v vain_a but_o you_o grant_v you_o may_v continue_v such_o communion_n with_o the_o parish_n without_o sin_n by_o the_o tenor_n of_o the_o objection_n 2._o this_o objection_n extend_v not_o only_o to_o the_o change_n of_o the_o minister_n but_o of_o the_o very_a worship_n the_o public_a place_n of_o assemble_v and_o the_o parochial_a bound_n of_o church_n which_o as_o in_o the_o nature_n and_o consequence_n of_o the_o thing_n themselves_o be_v very_o dangerous_a so_o they_o be_v all_o quite_o contrary_a to_o the_o reason_n and_o practice_v of_o former_a nonconformist_n they_o may_v think_v they_o have_v reason_n sometime_o to_o do_v better_o but_o they_o never_o mean_v it_o in_o any_o way_n contrary_a to_o the_o public_a worship_n and_o assembly_n but_o only_o in_o some_o other_o parish_n church_n 3._o it_o be_v in_o effect_v the_o same_o excuse_n that_o the_o brownist_n have_v for_o their_o separation_n only_o not_o quite_o so_o considerable_a they_o complain_v thing_n be_v bad_a and_o you_o will_v have_v they_o better_o and_o therefore_o separate_v as_o they_o do_v 3._o the_o very_a same_o plea_n that_o the_o independent_o use_v in_o other_o word_n more_o plausable_a to_o their_o purpose_n namely_o pretence_n of_o disorder_n in_o the_o church_n and_o pretence_n of_o reformation_n and_o yet_o more_o near_o to_o the_o present_a pretence_n that_o they_o may_v worship_v with_o pure_a worship_n all_o which_o mr._n cawdry_n the_o patron_n of_o presbytery_n have_v take_v notice_n of_o and_o answer_v to_o dr._n owen_n bold_o appeal_n the_o dr._n in_o the_o point_n as_o i_o do_v my_o answerer_n in_o his_o word_n i_o leave_v it_o to_o his_o own_o consideration_n whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a for_o 142._o in_o dep_v further_o p_o 142._o people_n that_o be_v member_n of_o true_a church_n as_o we_o be_v acknowledge_v to_o be_v 〈◊〉_d upon_o some_o disorder_n in_o a_o church_n or_o pretence_n of_o reform_v themselves_o to_o separate_v from_o that_o church_n and_o to_o erect_v another_o when_o as_o they_o have_v do_v their_o duty_n to_o reform_v it_o in_o those_o disorder_n notwithstanding_o which_o they_o may_v without_o sin_n communicate_v with_o that_o church_n but_o rather_o to_o break_v true_a church_n into_o piece_n than_o to_o bear_v with_o some_o inconvenience_n and_o i_o desire_v a_o precedent_n of_o such_o a_o practice_n in_o scripture_n or_o story_n and_o as_o he_o say_v so_o do_v i_o but_o the_o pretence_n of_o worship_v god_n better_a and_o therefore_o they_o may_v gather_v a_o pure_a church_n out_o of_o a_o true_a church_n the_o presbyterian_a seem_v to_o deride_v it_o as_o not_o worthy_a 198._o ind_n schy_n p._n 198._o a_o serious_a consideration_n or_o answer_n be_v there_o say_v he_o any_o institution_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o must_v gather_v member_n out_o of_o true_a church_n to_o make_v a_o pure_a church_n if_o so_o it_o be_v 4._o but_o the_o sting_n be_v in_o the_o tail_n gather_v church_n out_o of_o our_o parish_n that_o they_o may_v serve_v god_n better_o be_v a_o intolerable_a principle_n and_o practice_n it_o plain_o put_v raines_n into_o the_o people_n hand_n to_o govern_v and_o reform_v themselves_o without_o their_o bishop_n or_o pastor_n which_o methinks_v mr._n baxter_n shall_v not_o like_v very_o well_o and_o without_o the_o civil-magistrate_n which_o the_o presbyterian_o can_v not_o endure_v to_o reform_v themselves_o i_o say_v without_o the_o order_n of_o any_o kind_n of_o governor_n not_o only_o in_o one_o single_a parish_n but_o throughout_o the_o kingdom_n nor_o only_a to_o reform_v abuse_n in_o administration_n but_o in_o the_o worship_n and_o government_n yea_o even_o to_o the_o utter_a dissolution_n of_o our_o church-state_n and_o the_o bound_n and_o place_n of_o our_o parochial_a congregation_n &_o the_o set_n up_o of_o other_o church_n other_o minister_n and_o another_o worship_n and_o government_n throughout_o the_o kingdom_n so_o far_o as_o this_o rule_n take_v for_o the_o rule_n in_o its_o practical_a nature_n and_o use_n be_v general_a and_o if_o it_o be_v the_o duty_n of_o one_o it_o be_v the_o duty_n of_o another_o and_o of_o all_o to_o worship_n god_n better_o in_o this_o new_a way_n and_o consequent_o all_o be_v bind_v to_o worship_n god_n better_o and_o all_o must_v join_v in_o these_o new_a congregation_n while_o the_o bishop_n and_o minister_n and_o temple_n be_v leave_v useless_a and_o there_o be_v no_o way_n which_o our_o author_n can_v think_v of_o to_o prevent_v &_o stop_v this_o deluge_n but_o the_o people_n prudence_n and_o how_o likely_a that_o be_v to_o do_v it_o let_v the_o wise_a consider_v be_v ever_o nonconformist_a or_o presbyterian_a before_o of_o this_o opinion_n or_o any_o one_o that_o be_v not_o a_o downright_a separatist_n dr._n owen_n have_v say_v that_o if_o a_o man_n can_v prevail_v to_o have_v the_o church_n reform_v he_o may_v dispose_v of_o himself_o as_o to_o particular_a church_n communion_n to_o his_o best_a advantage_n one_o will_v think_v this_o be_v modest_o speak_v in_o comparison_n yet_o observe_v how_o the_o presbyterian_a take_v he_o up_o this_o be_v liberality_n enough_o and_o dictator-like_a speak_v do_v not_o 190._o ind._n schys_n p_o 189_o 190._o this_o open_a a_o door_n to_o all_o confusion_n in_o church_n and_o state_n and_o give_v every_o man_n as_o well_o as_o any_o liberty_n if_o they_o judge_v any_o thing_n amiss_o in_o church_n or_o state_n to_o turn_v reformer_n if_o superior_n can_v or_o will_v not_o reform_v it_o in_o a_o state_n or_o natiâ—nal_n church_n as_o that_o of_o the_o jew_n be_v it_o lawful_a for_o a_o few_o man_n when_o state_n and_o church_n be_v all_o corrupt_a to_o go_v and_o reform_v both_o because_o they_o that_o have_v the_o power_n in_o their_o hand_n either_o can_v not_o or_o will_v not_o reform_v i_o think_v i_o may_v safe_o say_v this_o be_v a_o anabaptistical_n munster_n principle_n at_o the_o bottom_n so_o he_o beside_o the_o rule_n have_v run_v equal_o in_o it_o against_o the_o reformer_n themselves_o every_o sect_n will_v plead_v the_o same_o liberty_n to_o serve_v god_n better_o and_z as_o mr._n baxter_n have_v well_o item_v you_o separation_n will_v ruin_v the_o separate_a church_n themselves_o 50_o defence_n of_o cure_n p._n 50_o and_o not_o at_o all_o vary_v from_o their_o own_o light_n by_o which_o they_o ascend_v unto_o separation_n it_o will_v admit_v of_o no_o consistency_n party_n will_v arise_v in_o the_o separate_a church_n and_o separate_v again_o from_o they_o till_o they_o be_v dissolve_v as_o experience_n witness_v but_o because_o my_o author_n speak_v of_o gather_v church_n for_o the_o first_o three_o hundred_n year_n after_o christ_n i_o shall_v not_o disturb_v he_o by_o inquire_v out_o of_o what_o church_n they_o be_v gather_v only_o shall_v give_v he_o a_o presbiterian_o expostulation_n and_o conclude_v this_o chapter_n will_v he_o call_v that_o a_o peaceable_a proceed_n which_o be_v do_v without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o christian_a civil_a magistrate_n 1â—1_n cawd_z indep_n further_o p._n 1â—1_n and_o to_o the_o disturbance_n of_o all_o the_o church_n of_o the_o nation_n be_v it_o grant_v that_o in_o the_o first_o constitution_n of_o a_o church_n people_n may_v by_o their_o own_o free_a consent_n join_v to_o walk_v together_o &c_n &c_n be_v this_o course_n tolerable_a in_o settle_a church_n to_o the_o confusion_n and_o overthrow_n of_o the_o very_a constitution_n of_o our_o church_n chap._n fourteen_o the_o present_a practice_n plain_a separation_n objection_n by_o the_o answerer_n consider_v the_o present_a practice_n of_o gather_v church_n out_o of_o our_o church_n be_v separation_n though_o our_o church_n be_v true_a church_n and_o the_o person_n concern_v be_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v member_n of_o they_o yet_o do_v they_o proper_o separate_v from_o they_o