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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A88943	Church-government and church-covenant discussed, in an answer of the elders of the severall churches in New-England to two and thirty questions, sent over to them by divers ministers in England, to declare their judgments therein. Together with an apologie of the said elders in New-England for church-covenant, sent over in answer to Master Bernard in the yeare 1639. As also in an answer to nine positions about church-government. And now published for the satisfaction of all who desire resolution in those points.	Mather, Richard, 1596-1669.; Mather, Richard, 1596-1669. Apologie of the churches in New-England for church-covenant.; Peters, Hugh, 1598-1660.; Davenport, John, 1597-1670.	1643 (1643)	Wing M1270; Thomason E106_8; Thomason E106_9; ESTC R18913	104,756	140

the lesser Now ordination is lesse then election and depends upon it as a necessary Antecedent by divine Institution by vertue of which it is justly administred being indeed nothing else but the admission of a person lawfully elected into his Office or a putting of him into possession thereof whereunto he had right before by election as was said before in answer to the precedent Question 3. If a Church have Ministers or Elders before then this ordination is to be performed by the Elders of the Church and in their Assemblie 1 Tim. 4. 14. as also many other acts are to be performed by them 4. This Ordination thus performed by the Elders for the Church may fitly be called the Act of the whole Church as it is the whole man that seeth that heareth that speaketh when these acts are instrumentally performed by the eye the eare and the tongue in which sense Master Parker saith Ecclesia per alios docet baptisa●que Polit. Eccles l. 3. c. 7. p. 26. 5. But when a Church hath no Officers but the first Officers themselves are to be ordained then this Ordination by the Rite of imposing of hands may be performed for the Church by the most prime grave and able men from among themselves as the Church shall depute hereunto as the children of Israel did lay their hands upon the Levites Numb 8. 10. Now all the Congregation could not impose all their hands upon them together all their hands could not possibly reach them together and therefore it must needs be that some of the Congregation in the name of the whole body performed this Rite And as this Scripture sheweth that the people may in some cases lay their hands upon Church Officers for the Levites were such upon whom the children of Israel did lay their hands so let it be considered whether these reasons doe not further make it manifest 1. Men that are in no Office may elect therefore they may ordaine because ordination is nothing else but the execution of Election 2. If it were not so then one of these would follow either that the Officers must minister without any Ordination at all or else by vertue of some former Ordination received in some other Church or else they must be ordained by some other Minister or Ministers of some other Church that were ordained afore them and so the Ministery to be by succession But the first of these is against the Scripture 1 Tim. 4. 14. Heb. 6. 2. And the second were to establish the Popish opinion of the indeleble Character imprinted as they imagine in their Sacrament of holy Orders Whereas for ought we can discerne If when they are called to Office in any Church they have need of a new Election notwithstanding their former election into another Church then they have by the same ground need of a new Ordination for Ordination depends upon Election If their former Election be ceased their former Ordination is ceased also and they can no more minister by vertue of a former Ordination unto another Church then by vertue of a former Election And for the third we doe not understand what authority ordinary Officers can have to ordaine Ministers to such a Church of which themselves are not so much as Members Besides at some times namely at the first Reformation after the times of Popery there were no others to be had but from the Pope and his Bishops and Priests Now it were a pittifull case if the Sheep must have no Shepherd but such as are appointed to them by the wolves That is if Gods people might not have Ministers but onely from the popish Bishops This were to say either that the Ministers of Antichrist must or may ordaine Ministers to the Church of Christ or else that the popish Bishops are true Ministers of Christ And if Protestants thinke it necessary that their first Ministers should be ordained by the popish Bishops it is no marvell if the Papists do thereupon believe that their Church is the true Church and their Bishops true Ministers Such a scandall is it unto them to maintaine this personall succession of the Ministery But God doth so much abhorre Antichrist that hee would not have his people to seek to him nor his Priests to ordaine Christs Ministers as he would not take of Babilon a stone for a Corner nor a stone for a foundation Ier. 51. 26. 3. It is thus in civill Corporations and Cities the Major Bayliffe or other chiefe Officer elect is at his entrance and inauguration to receive at the hands of his Predecessors the Sword or Keyes of the City or to have some other solemne Ceremonie by him performed unto him yet if either there be no former as at the first or that the former be dead or upon necessity absent when his Successor entreth then is this Ceremony and worke performed by some other the fittest Instrument neither need that City borrow any Officer of another City neither could he entermeddle there without usurpation though both the Corporations have the same Charter under the same King And so it is in this spirituall Corporation or City the Church of God 4. That this point may seeme the lesse strange to you we pray you consider with us a little further the nature of this Ordination and then wee will adde the Testimonies of some eminent Protestant Writers in this case that you may see this is not any singular opinion of ours For the former some indeed have so highly advanced this Ordination that they have preferred it farre above preaching the Word ministring the Sacraments and Prayer making it and the power of Excommunication the two incommunicable Prerogatives of a Bishop above an ordinary Minister yet the Scripture teacheth no such thing but rather the contrary for when the Apostles were sent out by Christ there was no mention of Ordination in that Commission of theirs but only of teaching preaching baptising Mat. 28. 19 20. Mark 16. 15 16. If Ordination of Ministers had bin such a speciall worke there would belike have bin some mention of it in their Commission And certaine it is the Apostles counted preaching the Word their principall worke and after it Prayer and the ministring of the Sacraments Act. 6. 4. 1 Cor. 1. 17. If ordaining of Ministers had bin in their account so prime a worke it may seem Paul would rather have tarried in Creete to have ordained Elders there then have gone himselfe about preaching seaving Titus for the other Tit. 1 5. By all which it appeares that ordaining of Ministers is not such an eminent work as that it is to be preferred above preaching the Word and ministring the Sacraments and therefore to be performed by them that are superiours unto ordinary Ministers preaching and ministring the Sacraments being left as inferiour workes unto Ministers of an inferiour ranke as they would have it that stand for the superiority of Docesan Bishops neither is it equall unto those other workes afore

conversion of sinners argues that the man is sent of God Wee answer that we must distinguish of sending according to the divers degrees thereof For sometimes it imports no more but such an Act of Gods disposing providence whereby men are gifted and enabled for such or such a worke and permitted thereunto though they have no command from him for the doing thereof nor doe it not with a sincere minde in any obedience to God but for corrupt and sinister ends of their owne Thus God sent the King of Assyria against the Iewes Isa 10. 6. And bands of the Caldees and bands of other Nations against Jehojakim and against Iudah to destroy it 2 King 24. 2. And yet they had no command from him to doe this but sinned grievously in so doing Thus they that preached Christ not sincerely but of envie and strife to adde affliction to Pauls bands yet inasmuch as they preached Christ might be said to be sent of God and therefore the Apostle joyed at their preaching Phil. 1. 15 16. Thus Baalam in his Prophecies against the enemies of Israel and for the happy state of Gods people might be said to be sent of God though his heart and ends were corrupt and sinfull But if men be not onely enabled with gifts for such or such a worke but besides this have a sincere minde and desire in the using thereof to seeke the glory of God and the good of soules such men may much more be said to be sent of God Iohn 7. 18. For these men have not onely abilities and gifts from God and permission to imploy them as the former had but also his spirit within them which doth set their hearts on right and holy ends which the other wanted And yet if men doe want a lawfull office of Ministery wherein to exercise those gifts or a lawfull calling to that office or exercise they may in that respect be said not to be sent of God or not to be called of him though sent of him in the first or second respect Thus in the Scriptures it is said of some they ran and I sent them not Ier. 23. 21. I perceived that God had not sent him but he pronounced his Prophecies because Sanballat and Tobiah had hired him Neh. 6. 12. And yet doubtlesse in respect of Gods disposing providence he had sent them as the Scripture witnesseth that God sends strong delusions and lying Prophets and unfaithfull Shepherds 2 Thes 2. 11. 1 King 22. 22 23. Zech. 11. 16. to be a plague unto the Sons of men and for tryall to his servants Deut. 13. 3. 1 Cor. 11. 19. Now let these distinctions be applyed to the case in hand and we may perceive how if a man convert sinners certainly God sends him and yet some that are not called to any office in the Ministery may through his blessing convert sinners A man converts none unlesse God send him in the first or second sence and yet he may convert and not bee sent if sending be taken in the third sence that is for a lawfull calling into some office in the Church And wee may adde further a man may be sent in this third sence and yet convert none if he be not also sent in the first and second respect that is a man may have a lawfull calling outwardly unto a lawfull office in the Church and yet not convert sinners if he want gifts or sincerity of heart which might be the case of Iudas and of many wicked Priests in the old Testament Yea happily convert none though he be truly sent in all three respects as was said before in the beginning of the Answer to this Quaere But if comparison be made we doubt not but whilest the Ministery remaines uncorrupt God is wont to follow with a greater blessing the labours of those who have gifts and an office of Ministery also then of those who have gifts alone without office He is willing and wonted to honour himselfe most where most of his wayes are observed Master Parker Polit. Eccles l. 2. c. 39. c. 41. observes a difference between the Substantialls in Church Politie and the accessaries or accidentalls and circumstantialls And againe that of circumstances some are generall and some particular and individuall and so sheweth that the Church Politie in regard of the substantialls thereof is prescribed in the Word and therefore immutable According to which distinction wee Answer that if those words precisely the same course mentioned in this Question be not meant of particular and individuall circumstances but only of the substantialls or generall circumstances then for ought we know there is no materiall point either in constitution or government wherein the Churches in N. E. viz. In the bay in the jurisdiction of Plymouth at Connectacute and Quilipiake do not observe the same course And sure it is if they doe not they ought because Christ hath left but one way for all Churches and the same to be observed to the Worlds end 1 Tim. 6. 13 14. Onely that conformity to the Lyturgie and Ceremonies in some places to the Northward that Anabaptisme at Providence and Familisme at Aquidneck hinders that we cannot say the same of them nor of any other in N. E. that concurre with them in their unwarrantable wayes if there be any such though thankes be to God there is none within this Jurisdiction Who must have liberty to sit downe in this Common-wealth and enjoy the liberties thereof is not our place to determine but the Magistrates who are the rulers and governours of the Common-wealth and of all persons within the same And as for acknowledging a company to be a sister Church that shall set up and practise another forme of Church Discipline being otherwise in some measure as you say approveable we conceive the companie that shall so doe shall not be approveable therein For the Discipline appointed by Jesus Christ for his Churches is not arbitrary that one Church may set up and practice one forme and another another forme as each one shall please but is one and the same for all Churches and in all the Essentialls and Substantialls of it unchangable and to be kept till the appearing of Jesus Christ 1 Tim. 6. 13 14. from which place Master Cartwright observes the perpetuity of Church Government taught by the Apostles unto the end of the World and is plain and large in this point 1 Rep. p. 177. as is likewise Mr. Parker Polit. Eccles l. 2. c. 42. and so forward to the end of that Book unto whom we refer you herein And if that Discipline which we here practise be as we are perswaded of it the same which Christ hath appointed and therefore unalterable we see not how another can be lawfull and therefore if a company of people shall come hither and here set up and practise another we pray you thinke not much if we cannot promise to approve of them in so doing especially untill wee see

when themselves are Alients and Strangers Cyrus Darius and Artaxerxes gave great countenance and incouragement to the Jewes to build the House of God that they might offer sacrifices of sweet savour to the God of Heaven and pray for the life of the King and of his Sonnes Ezra 6. 8 9 10. I● which case good Ezra blesseth the Lord that had put such a thing into the Kings heart to beautifie the House of the God of Heaven Ezra 7. 27. And therefore Kings and all in Authority should be prayed for that we may lead a godly and peaceable life in Godlinesse and honesty 1 Tim. 2. 1 2. Neverthelesse the things that are ordained and commanded of GOD the observing of them in a peaceable way yeilding out reverence to all that are in Authority and praying for them this observing of the Ordinances of God cannot be unlawfull for lack of the Commandement of Man as appeares by the doctrine and pract●ce of the Apostles Act. 4. 19. 5. 29. and the approved practise of Believers in their times if they had neglected the Ordinances of God and namely Church Ordinances till they had had the commandement of Magistrate therein such neglect would have beene their grievous sinne and for ought we know they might have lived and died without them the Magistrates at that time be●ng all either Heathens or Jewes yet enemies and if Church Communion and the exercise of such Ordinances as Christ hath appointed for his Churches was lawfull and needfull and profitable when Magistrates were enemies to the Gospell and bee not so when Magistrates doe professe the Gospell we doe not see but Christians may sometimes be losers by having Christian Magistrates and in worse condition then if they had none but professed E●emies Besides this if Superiors should neglect to provide bodily sustenance for them that are under their charge we doe not thinke that any Mans Conscience would be so scrupulous but hee would thinke it lawfull b●y all good meanes to provide for himself in such case rather then to sit still and say if I perish for hunger it is the sinne of them that have Authority over mee and they must answer for It Neither can we tell how the Conscience of any Christian can excuse himself if he thinks no● the Ordinances of Christ as necessary for the good of his soule as food is necessary for his temporall life or doe not willingly in this spirituall hunger break through stone Walls as the Proverbe i● and runne from Sea to Sea to seeke God in his owne way rather then to perish without spirituall food because others provide not for him And this is our Answer to this eleventh Quere concerning your standing in the Parish Assemblies which Answer of ours and the exhortation therein as we pray the Father of mercies to make effectuall by his blessing for those good ends which wee intend therein so wee cannot in the same but reflect upon our selves and our owne wayes in times past as seeing not a little cause to judge our selves before the Lord as long as wee live for our sinfull ignorance and negligence when wee were in England ●o observe and walke according to those Rules of the Word which now upon occasion given by this Qu. wee doe commend to your selves and other Christians The Lord in mercy pardon our offences and direct your selves and his servants in ●ur deare Native Countrey both in remaining and removing to doe that which is pleasing in his sight Whereas this Qu. in the first clause and last but one compared together speakes of Believers out of the Kingdome of GOD and possibility of salvation we conceive it is a contradiction for those that are true Believers cannot be out of possibility of salva●on but possibly may yea most undoubtedly shall bee saved Joh. 3. 16. and 5. 24. the contrary whereof is to overthrow all the promises of the Gospell and with the Papists and Arminians to establish falling from grace 2. For that saying Extra Ecclesiam non est salus wee conceive it cannot be universally true if it be meant of the visible Church which in the New-Testament is a particular Congregation but onely being taken for the Church invisible or the Vniversall Church which is the whole company of the elect in Heaven in Earth and not yet borne Ioh. 10. 16. and 17. 20. out of which elected Company there is not one that shall be saved nor any of the elect neither but in the way of Regeneration Ioh 3. 3. but as for the Visible we believe the old saying is true there are many Wolves within and many Sheepe without Joh. 10. 16. and therefore it cannot be universally true that out of the Visible Church there is no salvation Inasmuch as all Christs Sheepe shall be saved Ioh. 10. 28. of whom yet notwithstanding there are some not joyned to the Visible Church If the Thiefe that repented on the Crosse was a Gentile as it was possible he was then hee was uncircumcised and then it will trouble a Man to tell of what Visible Church he was and yet there is no doubt but he was saved The like may be said of Iob and of his friends of whose salvation we make no question and yet it is a great question whether they were of any Visible Church or no inasmuch as the Visible Church in those times seemed to be appropriated to the House and posterity of Abraham Isaac and Iacob of which line race it cannot easily be proved that all these men did come nor that they joined themselves in Visible fellowship with that Church The Centurion Mat. 8. 10. and the Woman of Canaan Mat. 15. were both of them believers and saved and yet it doth not appeare that they were members of the Visible Church of the Iews which was the only visible Church of God in those times Men of yeares ought to be believers and so in the state of Salvation afore they be joyned to the Visible Church and therefore there may be salvation out of that Church For it is possible that such an one as being a Believer is fit to bee joyned to the Church m●y di● and depart this life afore hee can bee joyned as that good Emperour Valenti●ian 2. died before hee could bee baptize● And for your selves if you should thinke that Baptisme makes men members of the Visible Church as is intimated in your fourth Question you may not then deny but there may be salvation out of the visible Church unlesse you will say that there is no salvation without Baptisme which we believe is farre from you to imagine 3. We doe hold that so oft and so long as a believer doth not joyne himselfe as a Member to some particular Congregation or other so oft and so long he is without the Church in the Apostles sence 1 Cor. 5. for the Church in the Apostles sence is a particular Congregation for he writeth to and of the Church at Corinth which Church was a

particular Congregation 1 Cor. 5 4 14. 23. 11. 17. 20. and having power of judgeing her own Members as all visible Churches have yet had no power of Judgeing any but such as were within that particular Congregation as all them they had power to judge whether they were believers in Christ or no. Mr. B●i●● as we said before is very large and cleare in proving this Position that the Churches instituted by Christ and the Apostles were only such as might meet in one Congregation ordinarily and answers many objections to the contrary Di●ces tryal Q. 1. 4. For the Question it selfe we hold that every believer if possibly he can is alwayes bound to joyne himselfe as a Member to some particular Congregation or other and yet not because else he is a Heathen and Publican or out of possibilitie of salvation as this Question suggests but upon other grounds 1. Because of the Commandment of God Cant. 1. 8. Math. 6. 10. 33. 2. Because willingly not to doe this is a secret disparagement to the wisdome of God that hath ordained Churches with giving power and privilegdes therunto Mat. 18. 17. 1 Cor. 5. 4. and promises of his gracions presence to be with them and amongst them Mat. 18. 20. Rev. 2. 1. Exod. 20. 24. Now to what end were all these if believers should live and no● joyne themselves to some Church These priviledges and promises would in such case be all in vain and the mercy of God offered therin unthankfully neglected Thirdly voluntarily abstaining from joyning to the Church is noted and condemned as a sinne Heb. 10. 25. and a signe of fearefull unbelievers Act. 5. 13. of the rest durst no man joyne unto them Fourthly good men in Scripture have been forward in practise this way Isay 2. 2 3. Zach. 8. 23. Act. 2. 41 42. and 9. 26. and have mourned with much bitternesse when they have been deprived of Liberty so to doe Isay 56. 3. and Ps 42. and 63. and 84. Fiftly this joyning is a part of that Order and orderly walking which is required of believers Col. 2. 5. 1 Cor. 14. 40. Sixtly If Believers doe neglect this joyning it is not onely a wrong to themselves but also a great unkindnesse to God for if one believer may doe this why not another and if two why not three foure c. and if all believers should doe thus God should have no visible Churches upon Earth unles he will acknowledge the Assemblies to be of unbelievers Churches foras stones in the Mountains are not an house untill they be joyned together though they be digged up out of the Quarry and squared hewn and hereby are made fit to be joyned together and so to become an house so believers are not a Church till they be joyned in holy Covenant in some Congregation though the worke of Grace and Faith in their soules have made them fit and meete to be a Church of God which is the House of the living God or as the humane soule and body are not a man unlesse they be united so Christian or believers are not a visible Church without visible union into some particular Congregation Mr. Perkins having said that forth of the militant Church there are no meanes of salvation no preaching of Gods word no invocation of Gods Name no Sacraments and therefore no Salvation concludes with these words For this cause every man must be admonished evermore to joyn himselfe to some particular Church being a sound Member of the Catholick Church Expos of Creed in the Article of the Church and Doctor Ames gives 6. Reasons why every Christian should ioyne himselfe to some particular Church or other Cas Cons● L. 4. c. 24. Q. 1. and in another place he hath these words Illi igitur qui occasion●● habent adjungendi sese Ecclesiae ●am negligunt gravissimè peccant non tantum in Deum ratione Institutionis sed etiam in suas proprias animas ratione benedictionis adjunctae etsi obstinatè persistant in ipsa incu●ia quicquid alias profitentur vix possunt haberi pro fidelibus Regnum Dei verè quaerentibus Medul Theol. l. 1. c. 32. Sect. 28. First whereas this 13th Question speakes of private and illiterate persons into a Church Body combined wee looke at this as an incongruous expression if not a contradiction For a company so combined as to make a Church are not fitly called private though they be illiterate in respect of humane learning in as much as a Church or a Church-body especially in times and places of peace and liberty is a publike Congregation and society and the acts of Communion which they have among themselves such as is the election and deposing of Ministers whereof the Question makes mention are not private acts but publike or people-like Neither are literate or learned men therefore publike because they are indued with humane learning unlesse withall they be called to publike office or imployment in Church or Common-wealth and therefore if illiterate be an exegesis of private we conceive that exegesis is not good Secondly whereas this Question asketh Whether it be lawfull and convenient that such a company should themselvs ordinarily examine elect ordain and depose their owne Ministers if ordinarily be as much as frequently we answer three things First that if one Church doe frequently come to such actions that is to take in and put out the same men this is not without suspition of much levity and rashnesse in the people or unfaithfulnesse or unworthy walking in the Ministers or both and therefore ordinar●ly that is frequent taking in and putting out againe in this manner is as much as may be to be avoided Secondly when such things doe often and frequently fall out it is doubtlesse a Judgement of God upon such a people to have so many changes in their Ministers as was that of which it was said three shepheards have I cut off in one moneth Zach. 11. 8. that People should be so oft as sheep having no Shepheard for the transgression of a land many are the Princes thereof Pro. 28. 2. So in like sort for the transgressions of a Church many are the Ministers thereof we meane when they have many Ministers by the comming in and going out of the same men or the removing of some and the taking in of others in their roome for otherwise it is a blessing of God when a Church is furnished with variety of Ministers at the same time Acts 13. 1. 21. 18. Phil. 1. 1. Thirdly yet this word ordinarily doth seeme to imply that in your judgement sometimes this may be lawfull and convenient to be done Now upon the same ground on which it may be done sometimes upon the same it may be done at other times if there be just occasion Thirdly for the assistance of the Ministers of other Churches of which this Question maketh mention if this be onely by way of counsell or advice we know nothing unlawfull or