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sense_n believe_v faith_n scripture_n 7,006 5 6.5705 4 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A41781 The infants advocate against the cruel doctrine of those Presbyterians who hold, that the greatest part of dying infants shall be damned : in answer to a book of Mr. Giles Firmin's entituled, Scripture warrant, &c. / by Tho. Grantham. Grantham, Thomas, 1634-1692. 1688 (1688) Wing G1538; ESTC R43209 26,760 32

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so_o fierce_a against_o we_o for_o extend_v the_o grace_n of_o god_n to_o all_o man_n as_o be_v therein_o no_o respecter_n of_o person_n and_o yet_o show_v to_o sinner_n the_o necessity_n of_o actual_a repentance_n towards_o god_n and_o faith_n towards_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n as_o necessary_a to_o their_o membership_n in_o the_o church_n militant_a by_o the_o baptism_n of_o repentance_n for_o remission_n of_o sin_n i_o say_v none_o so_o fierce_a against_o we_o as_o those_o who_o boast_v they_o be_v abraham_n seed_n because_o descend_v from_o gentile_n who_o they_o suppose_v to_o be_v believer_n but_o let_v i_o have_v a_o care_n i_o must_v now_o answer_v for_o myself_o for_o mr._n firmin_n demand_v of_o i_o page_z 21._o by_o what_o scripture-warrant_a do_v you_o reduce_v our_o child_n into_o the_o state_n of_o the_o child_n of_o adam_n or_o noah_n etc._n etc._n since_o we_o be_v never_o call_v their_o child_n but_o only_o abraham_n abraham_n s_z who_o seed_n differ_v from_o they_o by_o a_o special_a covenant_n make_v with_o they_o and_o seal_v with_o them._n to_o which_o of_o they_o do_v god_n say_v i_o will_v be_v the_o god_n of_o thy_o seed_n and_o i_o will_v seal_v it_o but_o i_o reply_v these_o seem_v to_o i_o to_o be_v great_a swell_a word_n of_o vanity_n much_o worse_o in_o a_o gentile_a than_o in_o a_o jew_n and_o i_o will_v know_v what_o special_a covenant_n have_v god_n make_v with_o mr._n f._n and_o his_o seed_n which_o he_o have_v deny_v to_o tho._n grantham_n and_o his_o seed_n but_o to_o the_o question_n 1._o i_o be_o far_o from_o deny_v abraham_n fatherhood_n over_o the_o faithful_a christian_n but_o i_o deny_v that_o every_o believer_n that_o have_v a_o infant_n be_v the_o father_n of_o the_o faithful_a and_o i_o deny_v many_o to_o have_v any_o right_n to_o that_o title_n who_o boast_v much_o of_o it_o because_o they_o do_v not_o the_o work_n of_o abraham_n but_o despise_v those_o that_o worship_n god_n according_a to_o his_o will._n thus_o 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original_a the_o chaldee_n paraphra_v junius_n etc._n etc._n which_o show_v that_o it_o must_v be_v understand_v of_o they_o that_o be_v adulti_fw-la and_o not_o of_o infant_n if_o infant_n be_v not_o circumcise_v it_o be_v the_o parent_n fault_n as_o may_v appear_v in_o the_o example_n of_o moses_n who_o the_o lord_n punish_v and_o not_o the_o child_n for_o neglect_v it_o 3._o concern_v baptism_n i_o do_v believe_v it_o to_o be_v a_o very_a solemn_a ordinance_n and_o also_o very_o useful_a in_o the_o church_n of_o god_n yet_o i_o do_v not_o find_v that_o it_o be_v the_o hand_n of_o the_o spirit_n to_o convey_v grace_n to_o the_o heart_n of_o any_o infant_n see_v what_o it_o convey_v it_o do_v it_o by_o faith_n and_o by_o its_o figure_n represent_v the_o death_n burial_n and_o resurrection_n of_o christ_n and_o we_o with_o he_o etc._n etc._n of_o all_o which_o infant_n know_v nothing_o be_v sprinkle_v as_o i_o former_o show_v very_o often_o when_o they_o be_v fast_o asleep_a and_o if_o 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the_o body_n for_o i_o express_o say_v he_o have_v power_n to_o do_v whatsoever_o he_o please_v and_o so_o to_o raise_v we_o up_o etc._n etc._n but_o if_o i_o be_v short_a or_o obscure_a this_o be_v my_o meaning_n the_o faith_n of_o christian_n be_v agreeable_a to_o the_o power_n which_o god_n show_v in_o christ_n when_o he_o raise_v he_o from_o the_o dead_a and_o i_o think_v 1_o pet._n 1._o 3._o do_v very_o well_o explain_v ephes_n 1._o 19_o 20._o bless_a be_v the_o god_n and_o father_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n which_o according_a to_o his_o abundant_a mercy_n have_v beget_v we_o again_o to_o a_o lively_a hope_n by_o the_o resurrection_n of_o christ_n from_o the_o dead_a mr._n
all_o die_a infant_n against_o those_o who_o will_v thus_o damn_v they_o be_v especial_o my_o present_a undertake_n and_o if_o mr._n f._n be_v dispose_v to_o urge_v i_o further_o it_o be_v a_o subject_a i_o be_o willing_a to_o debate_v with_o he_o when_o and_o how_o he_o please_v so_o that_o we_o may_v discourse_v in_o love_n as_o become_v christian_n and_o as_o to_o the_o question_n about_o sacred_a baptism_n that_o work_n may_v perhaps_o be_v undertake_v in_o a_o particular_a treatise_n by_o itself_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n let_v it_o be_v consider_v that_o it_o have_v be_v grant_v both_o by_o papist_n and_o protestant_n and_o those_o of_o the_o more_o learned_a sort_n too_o that_o there_o be_v no_o scripture_n for_o infant-baptism_n that_o the_o scripture_n show_v we_o no_o other_o way_n of_o baptise_v but_o by_o dip_v yea_o i_o late_o ask_v a_o page_n doctor_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n very_o serious_o whether_o he_o hold_v infant-baptism_n to_o be_v of_o divine_a institution_n who_o very_o free_o give_v i_o this_o answer_n no_o true_o i_o only_o look_v upon_o it_o as_o a_o church-rite_n but_o then_o whether_o the_o church_n have_v such_o power_n as_o to_o make_v rite_n and_o ceremony_n in_o religion_n and_o particular_o thus_o to_o alter_v the_o subject_n and_o manner_n of_o baptism_n as_o have_v confess_o be_v do_v by_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o in_o part_n by_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v the_o business_n for_o this_o present_a age_n to_o take_v into_o their_o most_o serious_a consideration_n t._n g._n the_o infant_n advocate_n against_o the_o cruel_a doctrine_n of_o those_o presbyterian_o who_o hold_v that_o the_o great_a part_n of_o die_v infant_n be_v damn_v division_n 1._o mr_n giles_n firmin_n be_v please_v to_o print_v two_o question_n and_o desire_v those_o who_o he_o call_v anabaptist_n to_o answer_v they_o and_o at_o the_o request_n of_o some_o of_o his_o neighbour_n i_o write_v a_o brief_a and_o i_o hope_v a_o modest_a answer_n to_o they_o not_o for_o contention_n but_o for_o satisfaction_n to_o such_o as_o desire_v to_o know_v the_o truth_n in_o the_o matter_n thereby_o put_v to_o the_o question_n by_o mr._n f._n who_o find_v himself_o aggrieve_v though_o nothing_o be_v do_v but_o what_o he_o desire_v that_o be_v his_o question_n answer_v and_o though_o he_o say_v they_o be_v not_o yet_o that_o shall_v not_o provoke_v i_o to_o say_v much_o to_o he_o concern_v they_o but_o see_v by_o this_o occasion_n we_o be_v unavoidable_o fall_v upon_o the_o business_n of_o infants-salvation_n whether_o god_n almighty_a ordain_v baptism_n or_o any_o other_o rite_n to_o be_v necessary_a to_o their_o salvation_n or_o whether_o the_o great_a or_o any_o part_n of_o die_v infant_n shall_v be_v damn_v in_o hellish_a torment_n a_o question_n of_o great_a weight_n and_o importance_n i_o find_v myself_o concern_v to_o proceed_v in_o oppose_v that_o cruel_a doctrine_n which_o will_v send_v million_o of_o die_a infant_n to_o hell_n torment_v it_o be_v the_o judgement_n of_o austin_n and_o many_o other_o that_o unless_o infant_n be_v baptize_v and_o receive_v the_o lord_n supper_n they_o can_v not_o be_v save_v and_o mr._n firmin_n seem_v to_o be_v of_o the_o same_o mind_n with_o respect_n to_o their_o baptism_n and_o moreover_o he_o hold_v that_o infant_n must_v have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n as_o necessary_a to_o their_o salvation_n or_o they_o must_v all_o perish_v i_o will_v set_v down_o his_o own_o word_n in_o pag._n 90._o of_o his_o plea_n he_o speak_v thus_o to_o return_v to_o infant_n they_o must_v be_v regenerate_v and_o have_v faith_n some_o way_n else_o they_o must_v perish_v and_o in_o his_o book_n entitle_v scripture_n warrant_v etc._n etc._n he_o speak_v thus_o pag._n 76._o they_o who_o be_v regenerate_v have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n but_o all_o infant_n save_v be_v regenerate_v therefore_o all_o infant_n save_v have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n and_o in_o pag._n 21._o he_o count_v it_o a_o error_n in_o i_o for_o suppose_v if_o isaac_n have_v die_v before_o he_o be_v eight_o day_n old_a he_o may_v have_v be_v save_v so_o say_v he_o this_o covenant_n mean_v the_o covenant_n of_o circumcision_n may_v have_v be_v spare_v and_o in_o pag._n 40._o the_o same_o say_v he_o i_o may_v say_v for_o baptism_n be_v christ_n own_o institution_n this_o be_v the_o hand_n of_o the_o spirit_n accompany_v it_o when_o and_o where_o he_o please_v shall_v be_v the_o mean_n to_o convey_v spiritual_a blessing_n to_o the_o heart_n of_o some_o infant_n and_o prove_v to_o they_o the_o wash_n of_o regeneration_n so_o that_o i_o think_v i_o have_v do_v he_o no_o wrong_n in_o the_o account_n i_o have_v give_v of_o his_o opinion_n to_o all_o which_o i_o answer_v to_o intermit_v a_o little_a the_o business_n of_o infant_n faith_n and_o repentance_n we_o will_v consider_v what_o he_o say_v of_o circumcision_n and_o baptism_n he_o tell_v we_o pag._n 39_o that_o he_o can_v conceive_v how_o it_o can_v consist_v with_o the_o wisdom_n holiness_n and_o goodness_n of_o god_n to_o institute_v a_o ordinance_n in_o his_o church_n for_o spiritual_a and_o save_a end_n and_o strict_o to_o command_v this_o ordinance_n to_o be_v administer_v to_o such_o subject_n as_o child_n of_o eight_o day_n old_a and_o he_o himself_o not_o work_v with_o his_o own_o institution_n when_o and_o where_o he_o please_v to_o the_o good_a and_o benefit_n of_o that_o subject_a to_o who_o it_o be_v administer_v this_o subject_a have_v need_n of_o the_o spiritual_a good_a signify_v and_o seal_v thereby_o it_o do_v implicit_o charge_v the_o institution_n with_o vanity_n to_o which_o i_o reply_v 1._o consider_v what_o mr._n f._n say_v of_o isaac_n die_v before_o the_o eight_o day_n which_o i_o note_v before_o his_o sense_n be_v this_o that_o from_o the_o time_n that_o circumcision_n be_v institute_v it_o make_v that_o covenant_n of_o circumcision_n a_o vanity_n to_o think_v any_o of_o abraham_n seed_n though_o but_o infant_n of_o eight_o day_n old_a can_v be_v save_v if_o not_o circumcise_v and_o then_o i_o pray_v what_o be_v like_a to_o become_v of_o all_o the_o world_n beside_o who_o have_v no_o interest_n in_o the_o covenant_n of_o circumcision_n must_v they_o not_o all_o perish_v we_o shall_v hear_v more_o of_o that_o anon_o 2._o and_o beside_o this_o though_o he_o make_v circumcision_n thus_o necessary_a to_o the_o salvation_n of_o infant_n yet_o he_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o all_o infant_n that_o be_v circumcise_v be_v save_v for_o these_o word_n of_o his_o when_o and_o where_o he_o please_v carry_v this_o sense_n in_o a_o presbyterian_a breast_n that_o though_o circumcision_n do_v by_o express_a order_n belong_v to_o all_o the_o male_n of_o abraham_n seed_n be_v eight_o day_n old_a yet_o perhaps_o but_o few_o of_o many_o of_o they_o shall_v be_v save_v which_o i_o evident_o show_v in_o my_o answer_n to_o mr._n f_n question_n and_o to_o mr._n petto_n now_o here_o i_o do_v profess_v to_o believe_v that_o almighty_a god_n do_v not_o thus_o ordain_v circumcision_n to_o be_v absolute_o necessary_a because_o they_o to_o wit_n infant_n can_v neither_o understand_v his_o will_n herein_o nor_o desire_v it_o neither_o hinder_v it_o it_o whole_o depend_v on_o other_o to_o do_v it_o for_o they_o and_o why_o then_o they_o shall_v perish_v if_o it_o be_v not_o do_v no_o reason_n can_v be_v show_v but_o that_o which_o be_v the_o hard_a thing_n of_o all_o be_v that_o if_o isaac_n have_v die_v before_o the_o eight_o day_n he_o shall_v not_o be_v save_v when_o yet_o it_o be_v not_o lawful_a to_o circumcise_v he_o what_o be_v this_o do_v god_n damn_v infant_n for_o die_v before_o they_o be_v eight_o day_n old_a or_o for_o not_o have_v that_o do_v to_o they_o which_o by_o god_n law_n ought_v not_o to_o be_v do_v before_o the_o eight_o day_n this_o be_v the_o cruel_a doctrine_n that_o can_v be_v and_o i_o will_v show_v how_o contrary_a it_o be_v to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o learned_a protestant_n one_o say_v thus_o upon_o gen._n 17._o 14._o it_o be_v no_o good_a read_n to_o say_v the_o uncircumcised_a manchild_n but_o zachar_n the_o male_a etc._n etc._n shall_v be_v etc._n cut_v off_o for_o the_o infant_n of_o eight_o day_n old_a mention_v ver_n 12._o be_v of_o purpose_n omit_v here_o hence_o than_o it_o be_v infer_v that_o there_o be_v no_o such_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o circumcision_n that_o child_n want_v it_o shall_v be_v damn_v again_o this_o place_n can_v be_v understand_v of_o infant_n that_o be_v uncircumcised_a 1._o that_o addition_n the_o eight_o day_n be_v use_v only_o by_o the_o septuagint_n it_o be_v not_o in_o the_o hebrew_n 2._o the_o word_n be_v qui_fw-la non_fw-la circumciderit_fw-la he_o which_o shall_v not_o circumcise_v so_o read_v the_o
firmin_n argue_v thus_o they_o who_o be_v regenerate_v have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n but_o all_o infant_n save_v be_v regenerate_v therefore_o all_o infant_n save_v have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n answ_n 1._o here_o be_v a_o fault_n in_o your_o logic_n yourself_o your_o major_n shall_v have_v be_v universal_a or_o else_o you_o conclude_v nothing_o rational_o 2._o therefore_o i_o deny_v the_o major_n and_o say_v some_o may_v be_v regenerate_v i_o mean_v cleanse_v from_o sin_n renew_v by_o christ_n and_o make_v fit_a for_o heaven_n without_o faith_n and_o repenuance_n namely_o infant_n and_o sure_o i_o be_o mr._n f._n shall_v never_o be_v able_a to_o prove_v his_o major_n be_v take_v universal_o and_o if_o he_o like_v not_o to_o mend_v his_o major_n i_o reject_v his_o argument_n and_o retort_v it_o thus_o 3._o they_o that_o be_v regenerate_v do_v continue_v in_o the_o apostle_n doctrine_n and_o fellowship_n and_o in_o break_v of_o bread_n and_o in_o prayer_n but_o all_o infant_n save_v be_v regenerate_v ergo_fw-la all_o infant_n save_v continue_v steadfast_o in_o the_o apostle_n doctrine_n and_o fellowship_n and_o in_o break_v of_o bread_n and_o in_o prayer_n now_o as_o this_o argument_n be_v fallacious_a so_o certain_o be_v you_o again_o 4._o you_o that_o make_v all_o conversion_n miraculous_a how_o can_v you_o tie_v regeneration_n to_o faith_n and_o repentance_n as_o it_o respect_v infant_n do_v not_o you_o contradict_v yourself_o mr._n firmin_n in_o this_o may_v not_o god_n sanctify_v infant_n what_o way_n he_o please_v but_o must_v be_v limit_v to_o your_o method_n sir_n what_o he_o do_v in_o the_o regeneration_n of_o infant_n be_v a_o secret_a let_v it_o alone_o to_o he_o 5._o but_o let_v we_o hear_v dr._n taylor_n one_o of_o your_o own_o mind_n as_o to_o poedo-baptism_n yet_o he_o say_v let_v infant_n be_v press_v with_o all_o the_o inconvenience_n which_o be_v consequent_a to_o original_a sin_n yet_o it_o will_v not_o be_v lay_v to_o their_o charge_n so_o as_o to_o condemn_v they_o or_o if_o it_o can_v yet_o the_o mercy_n and_o absolute_a goodness_n of_o god_n will_v secure_v they_o if_o he_o take_v they_o away_o before_o they_o can_v glorify_v he_o by_o a_o free_a obedience_n for_o as_o infant_n without_o their_o own_o consent_n contract_v the_o gild_n of_o adam_n adam_n s_o sin_n and_o be_v liable_a to_o all_o the_o punishment_n which_o can_v with_o justice_n descend_v upon_o his_o posterity_n who_o be_v personal_o innocent_a so_o infant_n shall_v be_v restore_v by_o the_o second_o adam_n by_o the_o redemption_n of_o jesus_n christ_n by_o his_o righteousness_n and_o mercy_n apply_v either_o immediate_o or_o how_o or_o when_o he_o please_v to_o appoint_v and_o here_o mr._n f._n may_v learn_v from_o dr._n taylor_n how_o infant_n may_v be_v guilty_a of_o sin_n and_o yet_o innocent_a which_o he_o will_v make_v a_o contradiction_n in_o i_o mr._n f._n tell_v we_o his_o major_n last_o deny_v be_v clear_a from_o our_o own_o confession_n in_o that_o we_o say_v faith_n and_o repentance_n be_v the_o two_o part_n of_o regeneration_n but_o he_o that_o grant_v this_o extend_v it_o only_o to_o the_o adult_n of_o who_o these_o be_v thing_n require_v and_o not_o to_o infant_n of_o who_o they_o be_v not_o require_v so_o that_o this_o be_v a_o mere_a caption_n unbecoming_a a_o grave_a disputant_n but_o let_v we_o hear_v how_o he_o prove_v his_o minor._n they_o say_v he_o who_o be_v bear_v unclean_a that_o be_v sinful_a and_o corrupt_a by_o nature_n must_v be_v regenerate_v before_o they_o can_v be_v save_v but_o so_o be_v infant_n bear_v therefore_o etc._n etc._n answ_n it_o be_v not_o deny_v by_o we_o that_o infant_n be_v bear_v unclean_a and_o we_o grant_v that_o before_o they_o come_v to_o heaven_n they_o must_v be_v cleanse_v so_o that_o you_o may_v have_v spare_v this_o argument_n the_o thing_n you_o be_v to_o prove_v be_v that_o infant_n can_v be_v cleanse_v without_o faith_n and_o repentance_n but_o this_o you_o cunning_o slide_v over_o and_o you_o will_v find_v it_o to_o be_v a_o undertake_n too_o hard_o for_o you_o and_o i_o think_v you_o be_v the_o first_o man_n that_o ever_o attempt_v it_o it_o be_v not_o your_o tell_v we_o again_o of_o your_o seminal_a faith_n that_o will_v do_v it_o which_o as_o you_o refer_v it_o to_o infant_n be_v a_o mere_a chimaera_n of_o your_o own_o brain_n but_o when_o you_o speak_v of_o the_o adult_n you_o seem_v to_o speak_v sense_n in_o these_o word_n when_o god_n regenerate_v a_o adult_n person_n he_o do_v first_o infuse_v the_o principle_n seed_n habit_n of_o all_o the_o grace_n of_o the_o spirit_n when_o the_o sower_n go_v out_o to_o sow_v mat_n 13._o 3._o it_o be_v but_o the_o seed_n of_o faith_n and_o repentance_n which_o he_o do_v sow_v which_o be_v first_o receive_v and_o these_o seed_n grow_v up_o mark_v 4._o 27._o now_o sir_n if_o you_o will_v stand_v to_o this_o and_o these_o text_n to_o govern_v your_o speech_n we_o may_v very_o well_o come_v to_o agree_v what_o then_o be_v the_o seed_n here_o speak_v of_o our_o saviour_n tell_v we_o it_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n which_o man_n hear_v preach_v unto_o they_o be_v this_o the_o seminal_a faith_n and_o repentance_n which_o you_o talk_v on_o then_o this_o seminal_a faith_n be_v not_o in_o infant_n for_o as_o they_o can_v hear_v the_o word_n so_o no_o sour_a or_o preacher_n be_v send_v to_o they_o and_o i_o suppose_v you_o will_v not_o baptize_v a_o adult_n person_n though_o he_o have_v hear_v the_o word_n unless_o you_o see_v some_o effect_n of_o it_o at_o least_o that_o the_o tender_a blade_n appear_v for_o person_n be_v not_o make_v disciple_n or_o christian_n by_o be_v baptize_v but_o they_o be_v baptize_v because_o they_o be_v make_v disciple_n john_n 4._o 1._o mat._n 28._o 19_o mathetusate_fw-it panta_fw-it ta_fw-la ethne_fw-la baptizantes_fw-la autous_a and_o disciple_n may_v be_v call_v christian_n act_n 11._o now_o with_o what_o conscience_n then_o can_v you_o baptize_v a_o infant_n that_o never_o to_o your_o knowledge_n receive_v this_o seed_n at_o all_o but_o mr._n f._n bid_v we_o twy-fallow_a and_o try-fallow_a our_o ground_n and_o sow_v no_o seed_n for_o according_a to_o your_o doctrine_n say_v he_o you_o may_v have_v a_o crop_n without_o it_o but_o by_o his_o favour_n this_o be_v not_o our_o case_n but_o his_o own_o for_o he_o sow_v no_o seed_n to_o infant_n and_o yet_o he_o will_v have_v a_o crop_n of_o they_o for_o he_o will_v have_v they_o baptize_v asleep_a or_o awake_a by_o force_n now_o baptism_n be_v a_o act_n of_o obedience_n spring_v from_o the_o word_n the_o seed_n sow_v act_v 2._o 38_o 40._o act._n 8._o 12._o nay_o more_o he_o exact_v this_o crop_n of_o infant_n not_o only_o before_o he_o sow_v any_o seed_n or_o before_o any_o be_v sow_v by_o any_o other_o that_o he_o know_v of_o but_o also_o before_o he_o so_o much_o as_o twy-fallow_a or_o plough_v at_o all_o and_o thus_o whilst_o he_o think_v to_o kick_v the_o husbandman_n on_o the_o breech_n he_o have_v kick_v up_o his_o own_o heel_n mr._n f._n quote_v 1_o john_n 3._o 9_o it_o be_v the_o seed_n which_o remain_v peter_n peter_n s_o faith_n fail_v sad_o say_v he_o as_o to_o the_o act_n but_o the_o seed_n remain_v this_o will_v lead_v we_o to_o another_o question_n as_o it_o be_v his_o manner_n to_o confound_v his_o discourse_n with_o diversity_n but_o i_o shall_v hold_v he_o to_o the_o parable_n of_o the_o sour_a allege_v by_o himself_o mat._n 13._o and_o then_o i_o may_v tell_v he_o the_o seed_n only_o remain_v in_o good_a and_o honest_a heart_n but_o not_o in_o every_o place_n where_o it_o be_v sow_v nor_o in_o every_o place_n where_o it_o be_v receive_v remember_v the_o highway_n and_o the_o stony_a and_o thorny_a ground_n mr._n f_n arg._n 2._o no_o unclean_a person_n shall_v see_v god_n heb._n 12._o 14._o but_o infant_n by_o nature_n be_v unclean_a if_o the_o scripture_n be_v believe_v they_o must_v bear_v the_o image_n in_o which_o they_o be_v create_v by_o god_n that_o ever_o see_v the_o face_n of_o god._n answ_n shall_v i_o retort_v this_o argument_n i_o may_v show_v the_o infirmity_n of_o its_o form_n but_o i_o shall_v take_v your_o sense_n i_o suppose_v by_o the_o major_a you_o mean_v no_o unclean_a or_o wicked_a person_n as_o such_o shall_v see_v god._n and_o by_o the_o minor_a you_o mean_v that_o infant_n be_v bear_v of_o sinful_a parent_n pollute_v by_o original_a sin_n and_o so_o under_o condemnation_n and_o therefore_o before_o they_o can_v come_v to_o heaven_n they_o must_v be_v cleanse_v from_o these_o pollution_n etc._n etc._n if_o this_o be_v your_o sense_n i_o agree_v with_o you_o but_o then_o your_o argument_n touch_v not_o the_o question_n which_o be_v whether_o
be_v able_a to_o prove_v they_o viz._n that_o some_o infant_n have_v faith_n and_o repentance_n seminal_o and_o other_o have_v unbelief_n and_o impenitency_n seminal_o and_o which_o be_v another_o impossibility_n no_o man_n can_v distinguish_v the_o infant_n one_o from_o another_o nor_o can_v it_o ever_o be_v prove_v that_o seminal_a faith_n and_o repentance_n if_o yet_o any_o body_n can_v tell_v what_o it_o be_v do_v give_v we_o any_o ground_n to_o baptize_v any_o body_n for_o suppose_v we_o take_v this_o seminal_a faith_n and_o repentance_n to_o be_v the_o faculty_n of_o credence_n and_o sorrow_n or_o suppose_v some_o take_v they_o to_o be_v some_o secret_a inspiration_n of_o the_o spirit_n yet_o since_o they_o appear_v not_o to_o we_o it_o be_v as_o if_o they_o be_v not_o for_o that_o rule_n be_v good_a in_o this_o case_n de●_n non_fw-la apparentibus_fw-la &_o non_fw-la existantibus_fw-la eidem_fw-la est_fw-la ratio_fw-la it_o be_v the_o profession_n of_o faith_n and_o repentance_n that_o qualify_v a_o person_n in_o respect_n of_o we_o for_o sacred_a baptism_n the_o church_n be_v not_o judge_n of_o of_o heart_n they_o be_v only_o know_v to_o god_n infallible_o division_n 4._o concern_v original_a sin._n it_o will_v even_o grieve_v a_o sober_a christian_a to_o read_v the_o strange_a imagination_n which_o man_n have_v publish_v about_o original_a sin_n and_o the_o extreme_n they_o have_v run_v into_o on_o the_o right_a hand_n and_o on_o the_o left_a censure_v one_o another_o very_o severe_o for_o their_o differ_a apprehension_n in_o this_o matter_n and_o it_o be_v remarkable_a how_o cruel_o censarious_a mr._n firmin_n be_v against_o myself_o in_o particular_a represent_v i_o as_o a_o master_n among_o the_o worst_a sort_n of_o anabaptist_n who_o he_o say_v deny_v original_a sin._n concern_v which_o he_o tell_v you_o we_o be_v rot_a that_o the_o foundation_n of_o anabaptism_n lie_v in_o deny_v original_a sin._n that_o in_o this_o we_o be_v give_v up_o to_o more_o blindness_n than_o the_o heathen_n etc._n etc._n to_o all_o which_o i_o answer_v 1._o if_o i_o be_v one_o of_o the_o worst_a of_o my_o brethren_n in_o this_o point_n i_o hope_v the_o rest_n will_v be_v better_o think_v of_o by_o man_n of_o moderation_n for_o my_o sake_n when_o they_o have_v have_v what_o violent_a mr._n firmin_n have_v not_o patience_n to_o consider_v what_o i_o have_v publish_v upon_o the_o account_n of_o original_a sin_n and_o that_o long_o before_o i_o hear_v there_o be_v such_o a_o man_n in_o the_o world_n as_o mr._n firmin_n in_o my_o christianismus_fw-la primitivus_fw-la book_n 2._o pag._n 77_o 78._o thus_o you_o read_v i_o 2._o for_o the_o better_a attain_n to_o a_o powerful_a conviction_n of_o sin_n and_o a_o sense_n of_o man_n wretchedness_n by_o reason_n of_o sin_n it_o be_v necessary_a to_o understate_v the_o general_a state_n of_o transgression_n into_o which_o mankind_n be_v involve_v concern_v which_o we_o find_v the_o scripture_n give_v this_o testimony_n that_o all_o have_v sin_v and_o come_v short_a of_o the_o glory_n of_o god_n rom._n 3._o 23._o and_o that_o by_o one_o man_n sin_n enter_v into_o the_o world_n for_o that_o all_o have_v sin_v and_o that_o the_o whole_a world_n lie_v in_o wickedness_n which_o be_v also_o evident_a by_o common_a experience_n every_o nation_n be_v great_o corrupt_v through_o the_o abound_a of_o iniquity_n and_o the_o universality_n of_o the_o way_n of_o sin_n do_v evince_v the_o same_o that_o the_o apostle_n may_v well_o say_v both_o jew_n and_o gentile_n be_v all_o under_o sin._n 3._o the_o sin_n of_o mankind_n be_v either_o original_a or_o actual_a the_o first_o be_v come_v upon_o all_o even_o the_o very_a infant-state_n of_o mankind_n lie_v under_o it_o of_o who_o that_o say_n be_v true_a they_o have_v not_o sin_v after_o the_o similitude_n of_o adam_n adam_n s_o transgression_n yet_o death_n reign_v over_o they_o prove_v the_o transgression_n of_o adam_n to_o be_v upon_o they_o this_o be_v that_o root-sin_n call_v the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n john_n 1._o 29._o whereof_o none_o be_v free_a nor_o be_v it_o convenient_a to_o extenuate_v or_o lessen_v this_o sin_n either_o in_o its_o nature_n or_o the_o punishment_n it_o bring_v with_o it_o it_o be_v indeed_o the_o filum_fw-la certissimum_fw-la or_o leading-thred_n to_o all_o other_o iniquity_n mankind_n be_v hereby_o corrupt_v ab_fw-la origine_fw-la and_o whole_o deprive_v of_o the_o glory_n of_o god_n without_o the_o intervening_a mercy_n of_o a_o saviour_n and_o hence_o we_o find_v david_n when_o complain_v of_o his_o sinful_a state_n look_v back_o to_o his_o corrupt_a original_a among_o the_o rest_n of_o his_o iniquity_n complain_v psal_n 51._o 5._o behold_v i_o be_v shape_v in_o iniquity_n and_o in_o sin_n do_v my_o mother_n conceive_v i_o know_v as_o job_n say_v none_o can_v bring_v a_o clean_a thing_n out_o of_o a_o unclean_a one_o so_o that_o they_o be_v not_o to_o be_v despise_v who_o say_v that_o in_o our_o humiliation_n for_o sin_n we_o ought_v to_o bewail_v this_o our_o sinful_a original_a which_o have_v be_v to_o adam_n posterity_n like_o the_o sin_n of_o traitor_n which_o bring_v with_o it_o corruption_n of_o blood_n to_o their_o offspring_n for_o which_o they_o must_v bear_v the_o shame_n of_o such_o transgression_n how_o do_v we_o find_v that_o the_o sin_n of_o progenitor_n be_v wont_a to_o be_v lament_v by_o their_o offspring_n among_o the_o israelite_n and_o be_v there_o not_o the_o same_o reason_n adam_n child_n shall_v do_v the_o like_a as_o be_v sensible_a of_o the_o evil_a consequence_n thereof_o we_o also_o may_v say_v our_o father_n have_v sin_v and_o we_o have_v bear_v his_o iniquity_n 4._o and_o hence_o i_o like_v the_o say_n of_o irenaeus_n well_o which_o i_o will_v give_v in_o english_a because_o mr._n f._n be_v please_v to_o lock_v it_o up_o in_o latin_a omnes_fw-la enim_fw-la venit_fw-la etc._n etc._n christ_n come_v to_o save_v all_o by_o himself_o all_o i_o say_v who_o be_v bear_v again_o in_o god_n infant_n little_a one_o boy_n and_o young_a man_n and_o old_a man_n but_o as_o for_o his_o ideo_fw-la per_fw-la omnem_fw-la venit_fw-la aetatem_fw-la i_o let_v that_o alone_a for_o i_o do_v not_o find_v that_o christ_n pass_v through_o the_o age_n of_o old_a man_n yet_o i_o say_v he_o come_v to_o sanctify_v every_o age_n and_o therefore_o every_o age_n who_o do_v not_o profane_v the_o blood_n of_o christ_n by_o which_o they_o be_v sanctify_v as_o i_o be_o sure_a no_o infant_n do_v they_o shall_v certain_o be_v save_v by_o he_o and_o hence_o the_o salvation_n of_o all_o die_a infant_n be_v apparent_a enough_o but_o how_o infant_n be_v bear_v again_o in_o god_n be_v a_o secret_a and_o not_o to_o be_v demonstrate_v by_o mr._n firmin_n nor_o any_o other_o sure_o have_v i_o write_v as_o irenaeus_n do_v he_o will_v have_v say_v i_o exclude_v the_o operation_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n for_o irenaeus_n say_v he_o come_v to_o save_v all_o by_o himself_o yet_o as_o it_o be_v certain_a that_o the_o holy_a spirit_n be_v not_o want_v to_o the_o age_a sinner_n there_o be_v no_o ground_n to_o doubt_v of_o his_o care_n of_o poor_a infant_n division_n 5._o of_o freewill_n concern_v freewill_n mr._n f._n call_v it_o our_o diana_n and_o a_o imperial_a majesty_n represent_v we_o to_o deny_v god_n to_o be_v most_o bless_a because_o if_o his_o will_v be_v resist_v he_o fail_v of_o his_o end_n be_v to_o want_v a_o degree_n of_o blessedness_n etc._n etc._n i_o answer_v 1._o then_o it_o seem_v according_a to_o mr._n f._n all_o that_o god_n will_v to_o be_v save_v must_v and_o therefore_o shall_v be_v save_v and_o the_o rest_n he_o will_v to_o be_v damn_v and_o they_o shall_v therefore_o be_v damn_v but_o how_o he_o can_v reconcile_v his_o doctrine_n to_o these_o scripture_n i_o can_v tell_v which_o say_v i_o live_v i_o will_v not_o the_o death_n of_o the_o wicked_a and_o that_o this_o be_v good_a in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n etc._n etc._n who_o will_v have_v all_o man_n to_o be_v save_v 2._o be_v it_o god_n will_n that_o when_o he_o bring_v israel_n out_o of_o egypt_n that_o their_o carcase_n shall_v fall_v in_o the_o wilderness_n if_o it_o be_v not_o than_o he_o want_v a_o degree_n of_o blessedness_n be_v it_o god_n will_n that_o adam_n shall_v fall_v and_o bring_v himself_o and_o his_o posterity_n into_o so_o many_o misery_n if_o not_o god_n be_v not_o most_o bless_a because_o he_o fail_v of_o his_o end._n if_o you_o say_v it_o be_v god_n will_n that_o adam_n shall_v fall_v and_o that_o israel_n must_v fall_v in_o the_o wilderness_n you_o have_v as_o good_a tell_v we_o that_o god_n have_v decree_v all_o the_o evil_a action_n that_o man_n do_v and_o that_o they_o must_v do_v they_o else_o god_n can_v be_v most_o