Selected quad for the lemma: sense_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
sense_n	apostle_n	speak_v	word_n	3,803	5	4.2444	3	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A14656	Fishers folly unfolded: or The vaunting Iesuites vanity discovered in a challenge of his (by him proudly made, but on his part poorely performed.) Vndertaken and answered by George Walker pastor of S. Iohn Euangelist in Watlingstreet London	Walker, George, 1581?-1651.; Fisher, John, 1569-1641. aut	1624 (1624)	STC 24959; ESTC S101731	26,612	52

the paper and under the first assertion which hee had before granted viz. That they who teach doctrines contrarie to Gods word are not lawfull successors of the Apostles hee writes an ambiguous answer in these words I grant but Catholikes doe not so Mr. Walker Against this answer Master Walker excepted that it was an equivocation and might bee vnderstood two waies either thus I Fisher out of my private opinion or for some purpose grant this proposition to bee true but it is not granted by Catholikes generally or else thus I grant that they who teach doctrines contrarie to Gods word are not true successors of the Apostles but Catholikes doe not so teach If you meane the first way and in the first sense you doe but mocke us But if you speake in the latter sense your answer is more than needs and is a denying of an assumption which I have not yet expressed viz. That Catholikes doe teach doctrines contrarie to the Scriptures If by Catholikes you understand all such as hold the true Catholike faith I doe not neither will charge them with that which you denie before hand But if by Catholikes you understand Papists your conscience doth accuse you before hand and I will prove that supposed assumption which you denie to wit That the Papists teach doctrines contrarie to the Scriptures Mr. Fisher. I pray you be not so hastie let us come fairely and easily to another chiefe thing unto which I labour to bring you which will bee more materiall as you shall see presently then taking the paper hee writes a fourth proposition in these words This companie of Doctors and Pastors succeeding one another appointed to instruct people in all ages and to confirme them in faith could not performe their duties without being so knowne in the world that all men of all ages might haue recourse to them and might learne from them all truth neither could they be so secret that all stories should bee silent of the Doctors and doctrines taught by them in all ages Mr. Walker This proposition when Master Walker had read with an audible voice hee asked the Iesuit whether it were his purpose to dispute upon it which hee affirming hee answered that it was not a fit proposition to be disputed because it contained a great number of questions and equivocations and being urged by the Iesuit to shew his exceptions against it hee noted downe these particulars First that it is absurd to hold that all Pastors and Doctors lawfully succeeding the Apostles were knowne in the world to all men of all ages for there be many thousands of such Pastors who were knowne to none but to the men of the ages in which they lived Secondly it is an error to hold that all the men of the ages in which they lived had recourse unto them and learned of them the truth for it is sufficient that their owne flocks even the sheepe of Christ did know them and heare their voice Thirdly men may bee true Pastors lawfully succeeding the Apostles though they teach not all truth but onely the maine points of faith necessarie to salvation Fourthly such true Pastors may bee so secret that all stories may bee silent of them and of their teaching and doctrine Fifthly though their names and doctrines were recorded in the stories of those ages yet the stories now extant may be silent of them because some Popes by name Gregorie the 7. did corrupt and deface all sorts of records and writings both civill and ecclesiasticall which made against their forged primacie pride and corrupt doctrine as Aventine testifies lib. 5. Annal. Boiorum By which meanes many ecclesiasticall stories perished and others are corrupted untill this day Mr. Fisher. To the first of these exceptions the Iesuit yeelded and limited his long speech by adding immediatly after the word ages this clause in which they lived Concerning the second exception he asked this question Whether none but the sheepe of Christ did know the true Pastors and heare them It was answered That it was enough that they were knowne and heard by the sheepe of Christ To which Fisher replied That their persecutors must needs know them and heare of their doctrine or else how coula they actually persecute them and their doctrine Master Walker answered That their persecutors did not know Christ to be the Lord of life nor them to bee his seruants nor the truth of their doctrine for then they would not have persecuted them onely such as in persecuting them did sinne against the light of the holy Ghost if there were any such persecutors they did know them and their doctrine To the third exception Fisher first yeelded and inserted after these words to learne from them all truth this clause in all the maine points necessary to salvation and then he asked what he did understand by a maine point Master Walker answered That by a maine point he understood that which the infallible Scriptures of the old and new Testament doe teach to bee necessary to salvation and require that we should so beleeve it To the fourth and fifth exceptions he gave no answer but labouring to decline the mention of them takes the paper and writes down● a cavilling demand concerning the maine points necessary to salvation in these words Name what particular points these are or give a generall definition by which all sorts even of Protestants shall agree to be such Which when Master Walker had read he answered to this effect Mr. Walker Now Mr. Fisher you doe shew your selfe in your colours what you are indeed and what I have ever since I first knew you suspected you to be even a very idle wrangling Sophister unskilfull in the art of Logicke and ignorant in the rules of disputation First if you demand a generall definition of a maine point necessary to salvation that I have given already when I wrote downe that it was that which the infallible Scriptures doe teach to be necessary to salvation But your words are senslesse in themselues and I cannot tell what you meane by this clause a definition by which all sorts of Protestants shall agree to be such This speech savours of distraction For no sorts of Protestants doe goe about to make themselves to agree to be maine points of truth necessarie to salvation we desire only to know beleeve and teach such points Mr. Fisher. Fisher thus caught in his owne net had no other way to winde out himselfe but onely urged Master Walker to name all the particular points which the Scriptures doe teach for maine points necessarie to salvation To which Master Walker thus answered Mr. Walker Indeed I commend your wit and wise providence for if you could perswade me to undertake the naming of all such particular points you know it would require more time than till to morrow night and by this meanes you should escape without disputation and sleepe quietly in a whole skinne this night But you shall not so escape For I