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sense_n	according_a	construction_n	great_a	38	3	2.0729	3	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A35827	The journals of all the Parliaments during the reign of Queen Elizabeth both of the House of Lords and House of Commons / collected by Sir Simonds D'Ewes ... Knight and Baronet ; revised and published by Paul Bowes ..., Esq.	D'Ewes, Simonds, Sir, 1602-1650.; Bowes, Paul, d. 1702.	1682 (1682)	Wing D1250; ESTC R303	1,345,519	734

the Loan money it is not mine And the Law is that Mutuum must ever be free And here he shewed the difference between Location and Mutuum the one implying a contract the other none He remembred out of Ezechiel and other the Prophets sundry places of Scripture and vouched S t Augustines saying that to take but a Cup of Wine is Usury and Damnable This he seemed to say in Answer to that which had been before pronounced that it was not Usury except it were Morsus He shewed that loss may grow by Usury First to the Queen then to the Common-Wealth To the Queen in this that men not using their own money but finding great gain in Usury do imploy the same that way so that her Customs must decrease To the Common-Wealth for that who so shall give hire for money is to raise the same in the sale of his Commodity All Trades shall be taken away all occupations lost for most men seeking most ease and greatest gain without hazard or venture will forthwith imploy their money to such use He shewed it to be so hateful in the Judgment of the Common Law that an Usurer was not admitted to be a Witness nor after his Death to the common Sepulchre of Christians And for that his Discourse had been long he inserted as he said this Tale for recreation of the Hearers In Italy Quoth he a great known Usurer being Dead the Curate denied him the common place of Burial his Friends made Suit the Priest would not hear in fine the Suitors bethought them of a Policy to bring it to pass that he might be Buried in the Church which was this The Parson of the Church did accustomably use to carry his Books daily from his House to the Church on his Ass and the Ass by often going needed not to be driven but knowing his Journey as soon as he was laden would of himself go to the Church Door they desired the Parson his Ass might carry the dead Body and where it should stay the Body to be Buried To so fond a request the Priest agreed the Body was laid on the Ass who feeling a greater burthen than he was used to bear did run towards the Town never staying until he came to the common place of Execution This Tale merrily told he again entred to his matter and proved the Condemnation of Usury and Usurers by the Authority of the Nicene and divers other Councils He shewed that the Divines do call Usury a Spider a Canker an Aspis a Serpent and a Devil he shewed how in nature the offences of Homicide and Usury are to be compared and by Examples proved the ruins of divers Common-Wealths when such practices for gain are suffered as that of the Common-Wealth of Rome c. The manner of Exchange now used in London and how much abuse he shewed a thing in old time not practised but by the King as in Ed. 3. time when thereby the King obtained such Treasure and such excessive Wealth that it was first wondred at then guessed that it grew by the Science of Alchymy He here shewed the practice of the Low-Countries of Germany and namely the doings of Fulchers to the very beggering of great and mighty Princes he vouched the authority of Sir John Cheek in that place concerning that matter and the mind of the ancient English Law-Writers who say that the offence of Usury in Life the Bishop is to punish but after his Death his Executors shall not have his goods but they appertain ad Fiscum He concluded that the offence in his Conscience should be judged Felony M r Bell said This matter being so ample had occasioned much Speech and was for cunning men a fit Theme to shew their Wits and skills upon Yet saith he it standeth doubtful what Usury 〈◊〉 we have no true definition of it And in our Laws we have little written thereon but this Usura non currat super Infantem And not much more but to Answer the Objections where it is pretended that the not punishing of it by the temporal Judge may seem to be an approbation of it or to leave it to the Church may seem as if we had no care concerning it for that to put over an offence to another Judge may not be so said if to the Church it may appertain and they may well correct it He further shewed that the priviledge of the Church is by Statute upon this point to be expressed namely in the Statute de Articulis Cleri He said we must not curiously search Cicero's Paradoxes and pronounce that Peccata sunt aequalia hoc est quod omne peccatum est peccatum and no further but be every man according to his transgressions to make a reasonable pain though he who stealeth two pence doth as well steal as he who stealeth an hundred pounds yet there are degrees we have Petit Larceny and that which is greater both faults both to be punished both to be hated but difference there is in punishing even according to the greatness and smallness of the offence for the one there is Death for the other not so In the Statute for punishing of Perjury 5 o of this Queen there are sundry degrees of Perjury not for that there is less Perjury in the one than in the other but that there is greater hurt occasioned in the one than in the other In Answer of the Scripture he said the Law of God is If thou be stricken on the one Cheek to turn the other or if thy Cloak be taken away to give also thy Gown The literal sence is not to be taken and as there is cause a reasonable construction must be So he concluded that though it were a sin yet it was to be punished here on Earth according to the good or bad or rather according to the greater or lesser hurt which groweth thereby After which one whose name is not expressed in the said Anonymous Journal endeavour'd the Answer of M r Wilson but with a Protestation of his insufficiency and then he shewed how the Divines have not agreed what is Usury but for his own part he was to incline to the opinion of the Learned of these days whose interpretation of litteral sence and skill of the Tongues do appear which took that for no Usury which is without grievance He made a difference of the Law of God concerning the Divine Majesty contained in the first Table and what is concerning man in the second Table saying that nothing is to be said in that degree sin in it self but by the circumstances for so it is known whether it be good or bad To kill is prohibited yet sometimes not to kill is evil Phineas killed and was therefore commended And Thefts at times have been in Scriptures approved So likewise Usury is allowed of in the Scriptures but that it might be used to Strangers only Albeit the Chosen Children of God amongst themselves might not use it But let be whether

other to be offered to this House at some other more convenient time Nota That there is no other Speech touching this business particularly and fully set down in the Original Journal-Book of the House of Commons and therefore those Speeches which follow are supplied out of that Anonymous Journal of the same House of which there is more particular mention made in the very beginning of this present Journal M r Dalton stood up and spake with much earnestness against it saying It is hard upon a sudden for me to Answer a long premeditated Speech but as I am able I will say and shew what I think of the Bill Exhibited It pretends great things in shew tending to the hindrance of Gods service and the derogation of her Majesties Prerogative to the overthrow of our Laws and violating of our Liberties Things I say great in shew but no such things to be found in the matter spoke against It is easy to make of a Mole-Hill a Mountain in words so by a well compiled Speech to make a great and dangerous thing of nothing nay a thing indeed needless for that the State hath hitherto always stood upon this Government And so shewed how Ecclesiastical Government was distinct from the Temporal The Reasons he gave were few or none only his great dislike was that having received strait Commandment from her Majesty not to meddle with things concerning the Reformation of the Church and State of this Realm therefore in his opinion the Bill ought to be suppressed Sir John Woolley spake also against the Bill disallowing the matters in it And taking it as too busy a medling in such a thing so forbidden by her Majesty so he thought it not fit that it should be read Then spake Sir Francis Knowles allowing the Bill and Answered That whereas it was condemned as seeking the overthrow of a Member of the State and so against the Law it tended in his opinion but to the reforming of abuses and restraining of the Prelates That if they meddle against the Laws they shall incur a praemunire So that he thought the Bill to be good and fit to be read Then spake Doctor Lewen driving his Speech to a full Answer of M r Morris his Speech And first he shewed that as the natural Body was delighted in Change so was it also in the politick Body greedy of alteration That this Eversion of Bishops had long been sought for and in shooting at their Jurisdiction their aim was at their places as being no more able to stand the one without the other than a House without a Foundation Then he entred into a Discourse of Government as Monarchies Aristocracies and Democracies He allowed the Monarchies and in the most famous Monarchies in the World shewed this Government now exercised by the Bishops to have been used He endeavoured to prove the Bishops to be such a part of the Body politick as without them it could be no Body And in comparing it with the state of the Natural Body he termed the Prince and the Counsellors of State to be as the Senses and as the Head The Bishops and Ministers as the Shoulders and Arms the common people the Legs Now to take away the Shoulders from the Body were as great a blemish and prejudice as to have the Fingers tied unto the Shoulders Then came he to three parts of M r Morris his Speech Inquisition Subscription and binding absolution Inquisition he proved lawful First because it had been so long used and in the greatest Monarchies allowed For before Inquisition came in the manner of Tryal was by Accusation and then the party accusing was to suffer the penalty that the Law inflicted upon the party accused if he failed in his accusation Then it might be that the party accused if the Accuser failed in his accusation might sollicite two Witnesses to Answer for him which was sufficient to acquit him So the guilty escaped and the guiltless accuser was punished This seeming grievous they changed their Tryals into Inquisitions And whosoever reads Demosthenes and Tully shall see how unwillingly they were hired to accuse And if we look into the Laws of this Realm it is altogether by Inquisitions in Courts Baron Leets and in the Kings Courts and in the Star-Chamber So that this course is as lawful in the Ecclesiastical as in the Temporal Law Subscription was a thing we were bound unto by Statute The like was used in our Churches as at Geneva so as allowable here Absolution termed binding is no other than in the Common Law for in the Writ de Excommunicato capiendo the party absolved is to be sworn ad servandum jus and his Oath to perform the Law in this absolution is not grievous Whereas otherwise the party accused was to find pledges for the same Nay it is a liberty to him when upon his Oath he may be freed And so as to the Bill he thought it fittest that it should be first considered of by the Bishops and Judges of the Realm before it were read After this Mr. Henry Finch as may be conjectured out of the Original Journal-Book of the House of Commons where though his Speech be omitted yet he is set down and nominated to have spoken next after Doctor Lewen spake also against the Bill much to that effect which the said Doctor Lewen had spoken But neither was his name expressed in the aforesaid Anonymous Journal out of which these several Speeches are transcribed nor yet any more particulars of that which he spake Then stood up Mr. Oliver S t John as may be collected out of the aforesaid Original Journal-Book of the House of Commons where he is said to have spoken next after Mr. Henry Finch although his Speech be wholly omitted as is his name in the said Anonymous Journal out of which the said Speech and the rest are inserted and speaking for the Bill said it is and hath been the manner of this House to allow a mixture in speaking and after the Grave Honourable and Wisest then to hear the meanest also For my self I am but young yet will I shew unto you matter which is old In Answer to them that spake last the Ancient Charter of this Realm says Nullus liber homo c. which is flatly violated by Bishops Jurisdiction You know what things Thomas Becket stood upon against the King which things are now also crept in And for more full Answer of one that spake before his Antiquity and prescription cannot be allowed in this Government for any reason for so were the Official prestitute to take and exact Fees because time out of mind they had done so And set it down that it was Answered in the Parliament House That Thieves may prescribe to take Purses on Shooters-Hill because time out of mind they had done so For that of Inquisition it seems to him specially that spake last to be allowed before that tryal by accusation First by reason of the Antiquity of the