his Testimony is true saying And there are also many other things which Jesus did the which if they should be written every one I suppose that even the World it self could not contain the Books which should be written John 21.25 So that all is not written which was revealed wrote and spoken which if much more were written which was made mâ—nifest by it with that which is written could they not know the Lord their mindes being from the light of Christ which doth reveale and make manifest that which may be known of God in them And many who have the Letter and are Ministers of it are sensual having not the spirit nor the word of God nor the testimony of Jesus and their Ministry is but as Chaffe to the Wheate and the Lord is against them For what is the chaffe to the wheat saith the Lord Jeremiah 23. Is not my word like a fire saith the Lord and like a hammer breaketh the rock in pieces Now many have the letter and know not the word of the Lord as a fire neither is the rock broken with the letter and such use their tongue for it is their own and the power of the Lord is not come over it such cause the People to err and doth not profit them being not sent nor commanded of the Lord for who are sent and commanded of the Lord the Lord useth their tongueâ— to speak his words which he puts into their mouthes and such words doth profite the people and not cause them to err being spoken according to the law which is light And the testimony of Jesus which is the Spirit of Prophesie and such do witnesse the Scriptures that as they cannot be broken so they cannot be denied by the Spirit which gave them forth to be a Declaration of those things which was revealed known and believed But they are not that which they are a declaration of the letter testifies of the eternal life but it is not it neither gives it It testifies of the light of the glorious Gospel shining in the heart whih gives the light of the knowledg of the glory of God but it is not that light which gives that knowledge It testifies of the Way but Christ is the Way of the Word but God is the Word and of Redemption but Christ is the Redemption not the Letter though it testifies of Justification Sanctification but they are wrought by the Word in the grace and power of Christ and so every one who wil own the Scriptures as they were given sorth to be owned must first own that of God in them which is manifest to work in the Creature that which they testifie of that Christ the power of God they may witness working all their works in them and for them according to the Scripture But contrary to the Scripture J.S. from the root of Errour saith That the written letter is a Spirituall Arm and Sword of the Spirit and that the very power of the written letter puts Satan to flight And in the same Page saith That the Devil hath Scripture in his mouth Answ. Let the People take notice and read the Scriptures and see if there be any such thing that the Sword of the spirit was ever in the Divels Mouth for the spiritual Armour which is said to be the Word of God But the Word of God which is the sword of the Spirit is that by which he is to be destroyed and is the mystery bid from him and all that follow his lusts But though the Divell which did not abide in the truth and his Ministers who are out of the truth may take the letter in their mouthes as they have done and say it s written so but the word of the Lord is not in their moutheâ— which is the sword of the Spirit and such will use the letter in their mouthes which cannot sease from sin whose eyes are full of Adultery beguiling unstable Souls their heart being exercised with coveteous practises cursed children which have forsaken the right way and are in the Error of Baalan loving the wages of unrighteousnesse and taking them and such have the letter in their mouthes but knows not the Word of God whâ—ch who comes but know it restraines them from all such practises Again J.S. from his blindnesse and root of Error and lying heart wherein dwells no truth but much confusion saith that the letter i. e. the Scripture is the true ground of the believers Faith and again in the same page saith That Christ in the Scripture is the true Ground of Faith And to prove the former he brings Prov. 22.19 20 21. That thy trust may be in the Lord I have made known to thee this day even to thee have not I written to thee â—xcellent things in Councels and Knowledg that I might make thee know the certainty of the words of truth that thou mightest answer the words of truth to them that send unto thee An. By this scripture the Lord is made the ground of Faith not the Letter And therefore did the Prophet make known excellent things in writing in counsel and knowledge for this end did the Apostles both preach and write that the Faith of those which heard them read their writings might not stand in the wisdom of words nor in the letter as its ground but in Christ the power of God and Christ who preached the true doctrine that in it every one might believe said to the World the Pharisees While ye have the light believe in the light that ye may be the Children of light and these had the letter but did not believe in the light which light is Christ and which light is the foundation of Faith and is the foundation of many generations in which many did believe before this letter which declares of it was written And that Faith which stands in the light and in the power of God is the ground of the Scripture letter from whence it did proceed after they believed they spoke and wrote that which now is declared in Chapters And every one which coms to the true ground of Faith must come co the light to believe in it that they may be the Children of it and then the Scriptures will be profitable unto them they with the light having the understanding opened to see for what end they were given forth and how they come to be fulfilled and witnessed in that which gave them forth for the ground of Faith to believers is but one both before and since the Scripture was written which is Christ in whom whosoever believeth shall be saved let Christ be in what he will for he was the ground of Faith when the letter was not and he is the ground of Faith when it is and no other foundation for Faith can any man lay than that which is laid Jesus Christ who is the true light and enlighteneth every man that cometh into the Word that all men in him might
he hath gathered from Scripture or his own imaginations and let him chuse to say whether he will And in the next he will be proved a false Prophet and that E. B. compiled a Book out of Scripture Collections is false for having the same Spirit which gave forth the Scripture which brings the Scripture to remembrance is not compiling a Book out of Scriptures and J. S. is found a false Accuser and E.B. neither a self-Contradictor nor self-Curser and these are true words to this Generation and owned with the Spirit of God though J. S. in his scornfull spirit abuse them he that hath the Word of the Lord from the mouth of the Lord to declare he is reviled and mocked But he that speaks the imagination of his own heart from the Saints conditions he is heard and owned and this is neither Scripture contradiction nor self contradiction let J. S. judg out of his own heart what he will neither is this self-contradiction to ask Which of the Saints had the witnesse of their souls union to seek in the Letter and yet to affirm the Spirit opens and brings that which is spoken in Scripture to remembrance Let J. S. first answer the Query in plainnesse which is an honest query and not to imply from it his own conceptions to make appear self-Contradictâ—ons let the sober Reader judg where the contradiction lies and he saith the Spirit is in the leâ—ter and goes about to prove it if he could if the Spirit be in the letter then all must have the spirit that hath the letter and the Spirit is whereever the Bible is which I do deny for many have the Letter and profâ—sse it which knows not the spirit and many have the Bible in their pocket which have not the spirit there and this will be confessed by J. S. and all his fellows and so he must revoke who saith the Spirit is in the letter and the spirit gives life but the letter kills In his proof he saith The written Word viz. the Letter is of greater authority then the writer Mark here Christ was one of them which gave forth Scripture and he was a greater authority than what was written and I say as it is plain to all honest men who can believe truth that the holy men of God who had the spirit were of greater authority than the Scriptures since have been which they left behinde them But J. S. hath set Christ and all them that gave forth scripture to be lesse in authority than the scriptures Let wise men judg of this matter he saith They were imperfectly holy that wrote forth the Scriptures and this is an absolute lye for the scrâ—ptures give â—his testimony of many of them that wrote it that they were perfect men and he hath also slaundered Christ to be imperfectly holy and in his next let him prove what this imperfect holinesse is and till then we deny that there is any Holinesse imperfect Further he saith The promises of the scripture are his â—hariot to convey him spirit whither he pleases to go But where is his proof for such a Doctrine but all that he saith doth not prove that the spirit is in the letter though he say to make up the sum of his matter Daily experiences do demonstrate that the spirit is in the letter but where is the man let him answer that thus hath experienced that alwayes when he hath seen the letter and handled the letter hath seen and handled the spirit the testimony of an honest man I will believe but not J. S. assertion out of his own heart In his 2 d Head of self-contradiction Concerning hearing the Word this is not contradiction to say they who are of God hear his Word and yet to deny the hearing of such as J. S. who is not a Minister of the Word but a Professor of the Letter for proud men and covetous men and false Accusers such as J. S. is we are exhorted to turn away from by Paul and this is not a denying our selves to be of God as J. S. would charge us withall because we deny to hear Hirelings for we hear Gods Word and his Voice and therefore do we deny to hear Dâ—ceivers and this is no self-contradiction nor saying nor unsaying let J.S. judge what he will the Saints shall be my witnâ—sse and though we say that the Saints Teacher cannot be removed into a corner as saith the scripture and that the saints will finde theiâ— teachers as they lie in their beds both these are true and not self-contradiction let a sober Reader judg whether he can find contradiction in those words but fain would J. S have his lies believed for truth that he might have praise of men for his works have gained no praise of God and he saith R F. hath not proved lyes yet against him if it were so let the Reader search whether there be none proved against him now but let him not say like a Pharisee I am no lyar but rather let him repent of his lyes and wickedness His 3 d. Head concerning the Light within Wherein much ado he makes as to prove the light of Christ spoken of Ioh. 1.9 to be a natural light and he saith the light given to all men even that light spoken of Ioh. 1.9 is a dim light and is cold and insufficient to Salvation and unable to make true discovery of the true Saviour such like contemptible undervaluing words of the pure light of Christ by whom the world was made who lighteth every man in the World by this it is known more evidently what Spirit J. S. is of but there is none of us who have received the knowledge of God by the very light of Christ which shines in our hearts can believe him and this is no contradiction to say that every man is lightned by Christ with the true light and yet to say some men are living in a natural condition both these are true for some hates the light of Christ and their deeds are evil and such are in a natural condition but this doth not prove that Christ hath not given them light though they be in a natural condition I leavit to spiritual men to judge though they say it seems strange that some should live a natural condition and yet have the light of Christ given them saith he as if every man brought a Saviour with him into the world This last is his false conception but he is mans saviour by whose power every man is brought in to the World and if J. S. did but understand as we do that some love the light and some hates it such as hate it denyes Christ he that loves it receives Christ who knows this stranges not I.S. wondring shews his Ignorance who would secretly charge us to be bewitched with a Notion of accounting nature grace which we do not and it is his own condition he that conceives Lyes believes them and tells them is the
Rep. Here I charge thee to be a lyar and a blasphemer in the presence of the lâ—ving God let all people read these Scriptures and see if there be any such thing in them and whether thou hast not misapplied thâ—se scriptures when the spirit saith It câ—ucifieth the deeds of the flesh and walking in the spirit the lusts of the flesh iâ— not fulfilled and here I charge thee to be a lyar and of the Devil who was a lyar from the beginning and in his generation thou art Qu. 17. Whether they do not bewitch the people who withdraw them from the spirit within to observe the ordinances of the world and traditions of men without as the Galatians were bewitched Gal. 3.1 Pr. I must tell you that there is not onely a holy and good spirit within and that in too few but there is also an evil and seducing spirit within and that in too many even the spirit that doth bewitch men and draw them aside from the doctrines and commands of the spirit of truth and to strive by all means to draw the people off from giving heed to seducing spirits it is not to observe the ordinances of the world and traditions of men as you pervert the Text but to obey the command of Gods true spirit who foretelling of false Prophets and false Spirits often in the word commands exhorts and admonishes to beware of such not to give heed to such and not to believe every spirit but to trie them Rep. Here in this answer thy spirit is tried which I have given to all people to read with a single eye that all may see what confusion here is in it First thou sayest that the seducing spirit draws from the seducing spirit and in the seducing spirit thou art and from the spirit of life with the spirit of life thou art judged to be out of the doctrine of Christ nor is not guided by the holy spirit Qu. 18. Whether they be not seducers which tell people these are the ordinances of God which God never commanded as sprinkling Infants telling people of a sacrament which there is no scripture for and draw them from the spirit within to follow your imaginations and inventions Pr. But for sprinkling Infants I have already given you the grounds of it out of Scripture Rep. Here again I charge thee in the presence of the living God to be a lyar theâ—e is not such a word in the scripture to bear it out nor a word of a sacrament which there is no scripture for let all read the scripture throughout and see if they can find such a word in the scripture so let all people judge thee to be a lyar and a seducer and in the Devils invention which calls that an ordinance of God which is invention and imagination Pr. We are not blind-folded to follow the dictates of the spirit within Rep. Here I charge thee in the presence of the Lord to be in the flesh and to follow the flesh for who are led by the spirit of God are the sons of God and thou that dost not follow the dictates of the spirit thou dost not follow the commands of God and what hast thou to do to talk of clearing it by the Scripture when there is no Scripture for it and when the Scripture witnesses against the works of the flesh which thy spirit stirs up Que. 19. Whether you have the same spirit which was in Christ the Apostles and Prophets which gave forth the scripture seeing you act contrary to the scriptures and follow your own inventions and traditions and so err from them Pr. Our Ministerial actions are agreeable to the Scripture Rep. Here I charge thee to be a liar for in thy answer to the former Querie thou sayest you do not follow the dictates of the spirit within and art holding up sprinkling infants which there is no scripture for and so walk contrary to the scripture and to them that were led by the spirit which gave them forth Que. 20. Whether ever Christ and his Apostles did first baptize and then preach faith and repentance twenty or thirty years afterwards Pr. Christ himself was not capable of faith and repentance Rep. Here I charge thee to be a liar and a slanderer for he was capable of faith and repentance and the baptism which the Apostles baptised withal what hast thou to do with it who art holding up sprinkling infants which there is no example for in the scriptures nor in all the Apostles practice Therefore silence flesh for thou knowest nothing of the wisdom of God which the Apostle speaks of but art in the state of Simon Magus who art buying and selling the letter worse then he for he would have bought the spirit which the Apostles denied so thou art denied with the same spirit but the Saints baptism we own and the believers and the promises which is to the seed thou hast cleared thy self from who saist Christ was not capable of faith how could he be above it and not capable of it and the life that I live is by faith of the Son of God â—â—ith the Apostle which thou hast cleared thy self from Que. 21. Whether ever Christ and his Apostles received 100. or 200. pounds a year for preaching the Gospel Pr. Many of the Apostles converts sold their estates and brought it and laid it down at the Apostles feet Rep. Here I challenge all the Oxford and Cambridge Teachers in England how many of their Converts have sold their estates and laid it down at your feet but you Teachers and they are so earthly minded you are fit to sue them at the law and imprison them as Lancaster and Kendal Goals may witness where many suffer now because they will not pay tithes and so you shew you preach another Gospel so let Christ and the Apostles judge you all to be without their doctrine and your converts as thou callest them to be without the Apostles and Christ let their example judge you all and so you shew that you never sowed spiritual things but only as a custom and a cloak thou bringest these words for the Apostle did reap carnal things where he sowed spiritual things Que. 22. What scripture is there to limit God to a place calling it a Church when as the Church is in God 1 Thess. 1.1 Pr. You cry down all distinctions as savouring of humane â—earning whereby the naked truth might be clearly and distinctly seen aâ— it is in it self Rep. Here let all people take notice whether humane learning can open the naked truth Here thou wouldest make people believe that humane learning was before the naked truth and again let all people take notice and see if the meeting in a steeple-house in England be a Church when so many hath been moved of the Lord to come into meeting places among them and something hath been revealed to them and they have spoken and he that was the pretended Teacher which was in the chiefest
because he said that all strife and contention and revenge was of the flesh and of the Divel and to be condemned with the light which testimony is also true and this testimony can we never deny nor change from And whereas thou bringest his salutation to contradict that where he saith Make war in righteousnesse against Gog and Magog and prepare for the Lord. Herein thou hast manifested thy blindness which cannot see the war which stands in righteousnesse from that which proceeds from the lust but as thou hast imagined carnally of all the things of God which was spoken from the same spirit and so as well may thou make lyes and pervert our words as thou dost the Scriptures and now having published many lyes against us thou makest a profession of thy own condition that all people may see froâ— what thou judgest us to be in delusion thy words are these Now forasmuch as I have not an infallâ—ble spirit infallibly to interpret what may be intended in these revengfull expositions notwithstanding my imaginary faculty might find ground enough of bad consequence in them yet I shall leave them to better judgments as in the ninth page of thy book Ans. Thy now leaving of us to better judgments or to them that have the spirit of truth will not excuse thee for what thou hast done already that hath had nothing to judge us by all this while that thou hast spoken and written against us but evill consequences out of thy imaginary faculty How art thou fallen from what thou seemedst to pretend against us in thy books as if thou hadst known that we had held forth false Doctrine or intended a carnall war because we spake of a war in righteousnesse But now thou speakest plainly that thou hast not the spirit of Truth truly to interpret what we intend in our expressions but leeves it to better judgments Here thou hast manifested thy self a foolish builder it had been lesse shame for thee if thou hadst not begun then having begun in thy imaginary faculties and bad consequences and now confessest thou wantest the spirit of Truth here thou hast proved thy selfe to be the Harlot and fit to be chased out of the Citie who doth raise strife accusations and lyes against the truth of God from thy imaginary faculties and bad consequence being without the spirit of truth Again in thy answer to E. B. salutation thou boasts from thy imaginary faculty and sayst in thy 11. page O thou proud presumptuous ambitious Quaker whence is thy originall thou art not yet seven yeares old and art thou the only people of the whole creation in the favour of the Almighty therefore woe be to them that live to see thee prosperous to a manly age Answ. Our original is before all ages or the number of years and before any imaginary faculties which is thy rule was and this in time being brought forth which before all times was they who are found in their imaginary faculties as thou art the woe comes upon them and thy woe and torment will increase as the truth increaseth as it was from Christ to the Jewes Scribes and Pharises in the dayes of his flesh who questioned the truth of his word from the youngnesse of his yeares as thou dost his truth now having nothing to judg with but thy imaginary faculties having nothing of infallible spirit and yet thou goes on accusing us that we deny all matter and form of worship I say where the spirit of truth is which thou sayst thou hast not there is both the matter and form of the true worship owned and not denied which spirit we have and know both the matter and form but in thy imaginary faculties there is neither And whereas thou sayest that we deny actuall obedience and the authority of the Scriptures that is false for by that authority that gave forth the Scriptures are we daily in actuall obedience to the Lord. Again thou bringest several particulars which thou callest the markes of the Harlot by which she may be known as first in her language which is to speak the word Thou to a particular person in stead of You thou wouldest make the language of the Harlot then all the Prophets Christ and the Apostles did speak the language of the Harlot and then the Scripture is translated in the language of the Harlot which doth not use the word You to any particular person But here thou hast made it more manifest to be without the spirit and to speak from thy imaginary faculties The second mark is her weapons which is saying that people is carnall and in the flesh and that they know not the light of Christ but stumble at the stumbling-stone and are in the cursed ground and that they cannot believe though the truth be declared unto them they having not the spirit but are in their sins And this thou sayest is the weapon of the Harlot Answ. Now these words were all used by the Ministers of the most high God against the Harlot as thou art manifest to be who stumbles at the stumbling-stone as it is written Romans 9.32 John 11.9 10. Here thou may see they which were no harlots told them they stumble at the stumbling-stone and told some that they were carnall 1 Corinthians 3.3 and the Prophets told them they had eyes and could not see eares and could not hear and hearts and could not understand Isaiah 44.18 and this was no marke of a Harlot in the Prophet but they whom he said was so was Harlotted from the Lord and Christ told them that they were yet in their sins and told them they should die in their sins John 8.24 if they belâ—eved not and told them they were of their father the Divell and had not known God but was from beneath John 8. And these thing in Christ was no marke of a harlot but they were harlots whom he so Judged and so thy marks discover thee The third mark Her presumption attempting to share with the Almighty And this which thou calls presumption is to be guided by God and hereby thou doth accuse all the Saints of God for they all did so far presume as to be guided by God and by his spirit and to say that all the children of the Lord should be taught of the Lord and this was no presumption nor no mark of the harlot and they said as he is so are wee in this present World and this was no presumption nor the marke of the harlot but humility if thou were not blind thou would see it The fourth mark is pretending to own the Scriptures and speak much of Religion and yet have nothing in matter form or essence Answ. This hath marked out thy condition that pretends to owne the Scriptures and professeth them and hath not that Spirit which gave them forth being guided by the imaginary faculties and so without the power and effect of that which thou professeth but we by that spirit which gave them forth
of things as they are made manifest by the Lord to the Light in you I speak that in it you may be able to understand truth in what I say and by the truth to judge of things that differ for such as the Tree is such is the fruit an evil tree cannot bring forth good fruit neither can one Fountain send forth sweet water and bitter Now as concerning a Book given forth by John Stelham Priest at Terling in Essex who having an evil eye because God is good and being filled with indignation because God hath mercy on his own Seed whom he hath blessed hath out of the abundance of his heart spoken it forth Now the way to know that which is spoken in darkness is to read it in the light and if his Testimony in any thing as coming from him is to be believed it is that which is concerning his own condition and if his estate and condition be such that in it he can receive the things of God and minister them to others then they may be received but if his condition be such that in it he cannot receive the things of the Spirit of God then that which cannot receive cannot minister and so he is to be silents and none to expect the things of God from him being neither fit to reprove nor to rebuke but to be reproved and rebuked as will appear as followeth The ground in him and the heart out of which this abundance of words in his Book proceeds in it as he declares is yet the root of all error and of all sin is in him and seen by him not mortified and that he hath an old lying heart and flesh wherein there dwells no truth no good thing a sinful wretch and worm subscribing himself the sinful John Stelham as in his Introduction in pag. 80. and p. 117. Now therefore we having found out the root and the ground to be a root of Errror and the ground of Deceit and a heart wherein dwells no truth nor no good thing therefore from that which is unclean shall we not expect that which is clean to proceed nor truth from that wherein dwells no truth but from the lying heart and deceitful tongue hath the Lord delivered us so that if we be called revilers and be rebuked and a charge laid against us as to contradict the Scriptures of God and be called Antiscriptural Antichristian and Antispiritual we have now learned to know whence it doth proceed even from the lying heart and flesh wherein there dwells no truth and we can bear it because we know that til that heart be taken away and a new heart known wherein is truth we must be reproached and spoken evil of falsly for his sake who hath taken away the old lying heart and hath given us a new heart wherein truth dwelleth and where truth proceeds out from and herein are we manifest from the children of this generation and herein are the two states known and the two conditions of men according to the testimony of Scripture and the parable which Jesus spoke Luke 6.39 Can the blind lead the blind shall they not both fall into the ditch And ver 45. A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good And an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil for out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh And hereby is the Tree known by his fruits and the heart of the wicked was ever filled with lying and vanity and understanding was hid from them the Lord was grieved with such that did err in their hearts and had not known his wayes Psal. 119 70. Psal. 140.2 and this was an evil which was under the sun that the hearts of the sons of men were full of evil and madnesse while they live Eccles. 9.3 And such a heart was in the Scribes and Pharisees a lying heart wherein dwelt no truth filled with evil thoughts as Christ said Wherefore think you evil in your hearts Mat. 9.4 and out of the heart did arise all false accusations calling the truth blasphemy and the way of it heresie and such who be in the state as John Stelham confesseth he is was never appointed by the Lord to watch over souls But such where Christ did dwell in their hearts and because they were sons God sent forth the Spirit of his Son into their hearts Eph. 3.17 Gal. 4.6 and such had truth in their hearts doing the Will of God from the heart and did draw near unto God with a true heart in full assurance of Faith having their hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and their bodies washed with pure water these did not profess the things of God in an old lying heart wherein dwelt no truth but called upon the name of the Lord with a pure heart and said that the end of the commandment was charity out of a pure heart and of a good conscience and of faith unfeigned from which some swerved in the Apostles dayes having turned aside unto vain jangling and such desired to be teachers of others but the doctrine is corrupt and the Mysterie of Faith is not held where the heart and conscience is not pure and the Lord is good unto such who be of a clean heart Now as concerning the Scriptures John Stelham's Testimony from the old lying heart wherein dwelleth no truth is this That the Scriptures are the Word of God and truly so called and the Letter and Scripture is all one as p. 3.4 but to contradict that himself he saith in p. 5. the Letter taken strictly is but legal administration using these words The Letter killeth i.e. the bare legal command without a promise of power or pardon as a bare Letter void of strength life and spirit it leaveth all men under a killing sentence and curse Let them that have understanding judge Again as concerning the Letter in page 6. he expresseth himself thus The Spirit is given by it And in the next words saith the Scripture is but instrumental to the Spirit Now mark the Letter taken strictly being legal without a promise of power or pardon void of strength life and spirit the Spirit to be given by this which he confesseth is void of strength life and spirit and is but instrumental to the Spirit whether this be not contradiction and confusion let them that read judge For in reading these things which he hath published many may seal to the confession of his own condition to be truth but that which he hath declared of the things of God to be false for now the Light being broken forth such doctrine cannot be received nor believed that thâ— Spirit is given by the Letter but that which is declared in the Letter was given forth from the Spirit vvhich vvas in them which spoke it forth but people may long have the Letter and think in it to find God and eternal life and may dye in
their sins though J.S. say that not one man in the world knows God to be God till he finds him in the Scripture But I say unto him as Christ said unto the Pharises Who had neither heard his voice at any time nor seen his shape had not his word abiding in them nor did not believe in the Light and that he was the Light vvhich did enlighten every man that cometh into the World search the Scriptures for in them ye think ye have Eternal life and they are they which testifie of me saith Christ the Life but those thought that they had the life in the Scriptures deceived them for they vvanted the Life when they thought they had it And so I. S. thoughts that he hath the Spirit by the Letter deceâ—ves him for vvhen he finds the Spirit and Eternal Life then his old lying heart in which is no truth but the root of error will be taken away and so the Light vvhich cometh from Christ the Life in vvhich the Spirit is received condemneth all such thoughts for they proceed out of that heart which is not upright before the Lord neither is it set to seek the Lord in that way in vvhich he and his Spirit is found Again I. S. talking of the Scriptures intrudes into things which he hath not seen comparing it with that which he hath seen and so in what he saith he is blind saying The Scripture is a more standing Rule than Visions To which I ansvver The night is upon him that he hath no vision and therefore doth not know vvhat a Vision is a rule unto nor the continuance of it as those in Israel which said that every vision faileth and so vvould not have them a standing Rule and that Reproach of the Visions of God were so common that it vvas become a proverb amongst them but the Prophet vvho vvas in the Light and had the vision of the Lord had the Word of the Lord he was to reprove that proverb and to tell them that they should no more use it as a proverb in Israel and said The dayes are at hand and the effect of every vision and so with the Light who be in it do now reprove all such proverbs and preachings against the visions of God for from the visions was the Scriptures spoken forth and that which they had seen they declared so that which gives forth words is greater than the words and without vision the people perish and they may perish while they have the Letter but they cannot perish while they have the vision and although there be vain visions they do not make the true of none effect And although there be Sorceries and Enchantment that doth not make the true resurrection of the dead of none effect but the blind must stumble at the things they do not see Again J.S. sâ—ith That the Authority of the Scriptures is owned ed among the Jews to this day Ans. No Christ is not owned amongst them who is the Authority and Power unto which the Scriptures give testimony that he is so neither are they yet converted as thou thy self confessest and they who be in the unconverted estate do not own the Authority of the Scriptures though such may talk of them as thou dost speaking that of them which they never spoke of themselves Again I.S. saith in the 17. page As deep things as the Spirit hath revealed they are all in the Scripture Ans. Nay There were things revealed which were unutterable and many things which were revealed and also written which are not in the Scripture as the Book of Nathan the Prophet and the Prophesie of Ahijah the Shilomite and the Visions of Iddo the Seer which was against Jeroboam the son of Nebat 2 Chron. 9.29 And the Book of Shemath the Prophet 2 Chron. 1.2 15. And the Book of Jehu 2 Chron 20.34 and the Book of Gad the Seer 1 Chron. 29.29 and the Book of Jaser 2 Sam. 1.18 and the Prophesie of Enoch who prophesied of the coming of Christ in his Saints to execute Judgement upon all and to convince all that are ungodly of their ungodly deeds hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him as Jude beareth witness And he also saw and prophesied of Israel according to the flesh that they should do wickedly and slâ—y him vvho was the light of the world And much more which is not written in the Bible And that which is manifest unto Paul which he wrote to the Corinthians in an Epistle not to company with fornicators that whole Epistle is not in the Bible 1 Cor. 5â—9 And likewise that which was revealed unto Paul in the dispensation of the grace of God given unto him how that by revelation God made known unto him the mystry which he wrote unto the Ephesians in a few words whereby they when they read they might understand his knowledg in the mystery of Christ which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men as it was revealed unto his holy Angels and Prophets by the Spirit which Epistle in which that mystry was written is not in the Bible Ephesians 3.3 And the Epistle which Paul wrote to the Laodiceans which he charged the Colossians to read amongst them and that theirs should be read in the Church of the Laodiceans wherein his thanks prayers to God was for their stedfastnesse in the truth wherein he made manifest the unprofitable talkers who went about to draw them from the truth of the Gospel and from their diligence in good works of eternall life as many vain and unprofitable talkers are in the world now doing the same work And whereas J. S. saith That the Epistle of Paul to the Colossians was read as the Word of the Lord in the Church of the Laodiceans Why doth he not bear witnesse that Paul's Epistle to the Laodiceans was read as the word of the Lord amongst the Colossians Collossians 4.16 And if he read in his Church the Epistle to the Collossians as the Word of the Lord why doth not he read to his people that which was written to the Laodiceans they both being given forth from one Spirit So let him consider of those things above mentioned and try whether his words will stand unreproveable 67. page saying God might have revealed more than is in the Scripture but he pleased not so to doe In that page mentioning Samuel Moses and the Prophets Christ and the Apostles saying All that they have spoken is written both according tâ— what was written before and for substance the same Answ. What I have spoken and shall here speak may sufficiently make manifest that his words proceed from the old lying heart in which dwells no truth for I have shewed out of the Prophets and out of the Apostles many things which was both revealed and declared which is not in the Bible written And likewise I shall shew farther of the things concerning Christ testified by John and we know that
believe and they that believe not that he is so shall die in their sins as Christ saith John 8.24 But J.S. going on in his own devised Fables would pervert the words of truth both in our writings and in the Apostles as it is manifest in his writings of this reviling Rebuke concerning R.F. and J.N. E.B. and F.H. and others which whosoever read their words and his they may discern truth from devised fables without much Reply upon it as in places he is mingling his own words with theirs joyning a lye to the truth that he may contradict it as false as every one that reades with understanding will see which when they have spoken plain truths which he himself hath often in his Book confessed unto to be truth will afterwards give his meaning to 〈◊〉 words as he hath done unto the Apostles words saying If they meane thus c. Then he goes about to contradict his own meaning and when he hath contradicted his owne meaning then he saith he hath contradicted their words though he have before confessed the truth of their words so he hath not contradicted the words as they were spoken but because they spoke not his meaning with the words therefore the true words must be false in his judgment and bear his rebuke as his Book doth make manifest and adding his lye to the words of truth these two things are his greatest proofs to resist the truth In page 77. he hath mingled his own words with the words of R.F. in wâ—ich page he acknowledgeth a former addition and yet reneweth another R.F. having been speaking of the light which hath enlightened every man which cometh into the World he adds which where it is and it is in every man it reneweth the judgment c he here adding his own and then rebuking it would make people believe lyes that all might be damned who believ not the truth But on the contrary for we never have said that every mans judgment is renewed with the ligbt though they be enlightened for they are enlightened who haâ—e it and who are void of true judgement because they hate the light which they be enlightened withal And also the Apostles words he perverts and gives meaning unto which if he did not they would be a plain testimony with that which he hath set himself to oppose so giving meanings both to their wordâ— and our words his meanings must be the ground of his Believers Faith and not the Scriptures as he said before The Apostle Peter speaking of a more sure Word of Prophesie wherein they did well to take heed as unto a light that shineth in a darke place till the day dawn and the day-star arise in their hearts 2 Pet 1.19 knowing this first that no Prophesie of the Scriptures is of any private interpretation for the Prophesie came not in old time by the will of man but holy men of God spake as they were moved of the holy Ghost To this J.S. adds not heart-prophesie no breast-prophesie but written down in Books c. which is contrary to the Apostls words for he doth not exclude heart-prophesie for there was never any prophesie but did proceed out of the heart before it was written in any Book And the Apostle saith Untill the day dawn and the day-star arise in your hearts and that holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the holy Ghost and that vvhich moved them to speak Prophesies was in their hearts and the Apostle did not bid them wait till the day star did arise in the Scriptuâ—es but till it did rise in their hearts and then he told them how the Prophesies of the Scriptures came Peter saying Untill the day dawn and the day-star arise in our hearts J.S. saith That is untill by the study of the Scriptures more light he cleered up c. Now let all them of understanding read and compare his words the Apostles and they may well conclude with his confession that he hath an old lying heart and flesh in which dwells no truth but the root of errour and gainsaying of the truth and as for many others of his devised fables and false meanings though I let them passe here unanswered yet they may be seen with the mind informed in the truth and all who are of God and of the truth may know that it is a small matter for us to be rebuked or judged to be in confusion who so evidently hath confounded both our words and the Apostles into his owne false meanings and so contradicts them both but that remaineth sure which gaves forth the Scriptures and abideth in us and we know that they cannot be broken but must be fulfilled as they were given forth by the Word which they were given forth from by taking heed unto which the young mans way is cleansed by which the old lying heart is reproved that which was given forth from that Spirit cannot be by it denyed but that which would darken words without knowledg is denyed that which would set up devised fables above Christ the Spirit and Scriptures that by the Spirit is denyed without contradiction and as we shall by the Spirit and by the Scriptures trye John Stelhams Doctrinâ— which if he deny them both then by his owne Argument we shall prove him and see whether he will own himself to be judged by that with which he would judge others whether they be Messengers sent by Gods Spirit His Assertion laid down Page 60. to try withall is this Such Messengers as speak more than is in the Scripture are not sent by GOD'S Spirit nor guided by him to what they say By this then is all that of him before mentioned cast out being both more and contrary to what is in the Scripture as also that which is to be declared as followeth in his second head as he calls it of Scripture Contradiction he is speaking concerning a Trinity and three Persons which words are not spoken in the Scriptures he meaning the Father Son and Spirit by such nameâ— as the Scripture never did so about words names which the Scripture doth not mention arsing out of the Divination of his heart doth he multiply words to hide the truth and shuâ— the Kingdom from men and so hath no ground for the word three persons from the Scripture but the Scripture in one translation speaking of Christ being the express Image of the Fathers Peâ—son and in another â—ranslation saith that he is the expresse Figure of the Fathers substance as he is witnessed to be by those that know him and so till he find the word three persons and Trinity in the Scriptures let him owne his own rule to judg him to be no Messenger sent by Godâ— Spirit because he speakes more than is in the Scripture who saith the holy Ghost is a Person and this person dwells in Saints though not personally mark this A Person dwell in the Saints not personally all this confusion is as
these things there was Christ held out and mentioned in the shadows and figures and so that Covenant which promiseth no salvation nor mentioneth any thing of a Saviour that we deny for there is no such Covenant in the Scriptureâ— For that which said Do this and live promised life and mentioned Christ who is the life and by Christ who is the Life and Light of men is that Covenant fulfilled and by his Power both the obedience and life is brought forth of which that Covenant speaketh and the new Covenant being come that God hath promised wherein he hath put his Law in their hearts and his Spirit in their inward parts and all such need not to come to such Priests to be taught who tel of a Covenant which promiseth no salvation nor mentioneth any thing of a Saviour for we who be in the second know the first fulfilled which Christ was held forth in under Ordinances of Divine service and a Worldly Sanctuary and divers washings and carnal Ordinances which never made the comers thereunto perfect as pertaining to the Conscience But now is Christ the Covenant of God and Covenant of Light come and preached and with his Light shineth in mens Consciences that he may make perfect as pertaining to the Conscience which Covenant is now witnessed among thousands and such denyed who speak of a Covenant that mentions nothing of a Saviour and that to be the Rule of true believers Again in John Stelham's fifth head of Scripture-contradiction he speaks concerning sin saying That the more a soul is sanctified the more he sees his moats to be beams and that Paul was groaning and sighing all his life-time under the body of sin and death Both these are false for the more a soul is sanctified he is not the more taught to lye or to see falsly but the more he is taught to see clearly and discern a moat to be a moat and a beam to be a beam and knows the difference And Paul thanks God who had given him the victory over sin and death which he had not while he groaned under the body of it and so both the Saints and the Work of sanctification is falsly accused by such and such are to be denied as Enemies to God and to his Work In the reading of this let all people take notice that in the several and particular heads of J. S. Book where he saith he hath contradicted us he is proved himself to contradict the Scritures and so far as he contradicts the Scriptures in those particulars so far he may say he contradicts us our testimony being one with the Scriptures in those things Pr. For in his sixth head as concerning Justification he saith He that is justified is justified by God not under the aspect or notion of a Saint and as such but of a sinner and as a sinner believing in Jesus not as he loveth God or overcometh the world by Faith c. but as believing on Christ dying c. Now this testimony of J. S. is contrary to the Scripture for God never justified any as hating of him nor as a sinner but as made obedient through faith according to the Scriptures as the Apostle witnesseth Gal. 2.16 Even by the faith of Jesus Christ even we have believed in Jesus Christ that we might be justified by the faith of Christ c. so they believed that they might be justified and the ungodly they were first called out of their ungodliness and whom he called them he also justified and they whom he justified them he also glorified and by him all that believe are justified from all things from which they could not be justified by the Law of Moses Acts 13.39 And so all who are justified by the Lord are justified from their sins and not in them as all shall witness who come to be justified by Christ from their iniquity And whereas J.S. vvould set the Law and Justice of God at a difference with the Gospel and as contrary in saying The Law and Justice finds and leaves us sinners Gospel and Mercy declareth and pronounceth us righteous Now the one pronouncing a man to be righâ—eous and the other pronouncing the same to be a sinner these two are contrary But the Scripture hath another testimony saying Mercy and Truth are met together Righteousness and Peace have kissed each other Psal. 85.10 Now here is unity here is not Righteousness pronouncâ—ng one thing and Mercy another for the righteousnesse of God is revealed from Heaven against the disobedient and this vvill not leave them disobedient nor sinners if ever they come to mercy for it doth not leave them as it finds them And so that Doctrine is accurst from God which saith That Justice finds them sinners and leaves them so and to say that Justice pronounceth them sinners and Mercy pronounceth them righteous But to satisfie all people a few vvords may serve to answer the volume of that darknesse and blindnesse given forth by him before-mentioned should a man full of vvords be justified Job 11.2 Again concerning J.S. in his seventh head concerning Regeneration he saith That the Word of God that is preached was never without or besides Scripture c. And as in other places he hath said That the Spirit is given by the Letter so here he vvould make Regeneration to proceed from it which this being denied he concludes it had been better the Scripture had not been known nor written An. The Word and Gospel were preached unto Abraham without Scriptures and before the Scriptures were written and they who are regenerated and born again it is by the immortal Word which is able to save their souls which Word was before the Letter was written and who be begotten again and born by that Word it is profitable for such that the Scriptures were written given forth and the Scripture by such is honored but such who call the Letter the Light and the Word and that which begets again into the new birth by such both the Work of God is despised and the Scriptures perverted and denied Again J. S. in his 8. Head of Contradiction speaking of perfection uttereth forth more confusion and contradiction to himself in his speaking of the Communion of the Saints in Heaven and doth lye concerning the Saints on earth saying the Saints in Heaven hoped for the perfection of their bodies at the Resurrection c. And again contradicts that in saying that at death they have a final perfection and a full harvest and reward of peace c. Ans. Now this is the issue that all people may take notice he hath so envied perfection and Christ's Doctrine which saith Be ye perfect as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect And them who now preach that Doctrine that he hath set out a Volume to declare against the Saints being perfect here yea and his envy hath reached to Heaven to prove that the Saints in Heaven are not perfect but wait for the redemption
his folly but our judgement in this is known he that can receive it let him and the belief of the wicked we shall not beg In these things we are approved of God and in the denial of all false imitations and who is he that shall condemn In the 14 th Head concerning Prayer Concerning prayer we do not contradict the scripture in our practâ—ce J.S. is the lyar herein who hath made it a subject to treat two leafs upon for praying in the spirit and by the spirit and in publick and private too we own and do practice as is known to thousands our Enemies can witness for us and according to the scriptures too and not contradicting to it any way But this is the offence against him at which he is troubled that we should deny the prayers of the Pharisees or of such who are in the steps of the prayers of the Pharisees viz. who for a pretence make long prayers and stand praying in the synagogues who are out of Christs and the Apostles Doctrine and the prayers and practices of such we do not deny according to the scripture which saith the sacrifices of the wicked are abomination to the Lord and they shall receive greater condemnation who make long prayers for a pretence as it is manifest concerning many in this genetation and against the praying of the Hypocrites and of Hirelings who pretend to pray in love to souls when as if they had not a great sum of money from the people would not pray among them but seek a place to pray at among such who would give them money and hire and this praying is for a pretence and we do deny it in publick and do not offend God herein though we vex J. S. hereby because some wil not worship the Beast and bow a hat off while he is praying in an idols Temple which he complains of in J.P. though he himself that prayâ— hath a cap on and he confesses himself not wicked mens prayers are accepted publick or private and here he hath condemned all his own praying who confesses he is wicked and sinful and his heart is old and lying let all take notice of this which if he had not confessed it it is sufficiently proved Then why shall he ever hereafter be offended seeing his prayers are not accepted according to his own confession if any tell him so or declare against his praying and before any can truly pray they must receive the Spirit of the Father and them we know who are not led by the Spirit of the Father them and their prayers are to be declared against by the Saints and are condemned in the sight of God And J. S. saith If this counsel be followed viz waiting in the Light till the Spirits leadings be known it makes known nothing of publick Ministers Church-Officers Baptism Lords Supper publick order of prayer nor of Christ as Mediator nor of the Spirit of promise c. The Light that every man hath makes manifest nothing of this he saith he in this is a lyar and as landerer of the people of God who are led by the moving of the Spirit in the Light of the Word Christ Jesus that lighteth every man and owneth the publick Ministry of Christ which is received by the Holy Ghost and Church and Baptism and Christ as Mediator and the Spirit of promise and all these things all the Saints upon earth who have the spirit of Christ shall witness against J.S. herein to be a lyar of the Light and Spirit of God and so is a transgressor and his wickedness may largely be laid open but the least of the children of Light may see his folly and madness who also lyingly saith that Quakers they nourish up people in the Light that every man hath which is the Light of Christ Jesus in opposition to Scripture-Light This is also utterly false and a lye and the Author proved to be of the Devil for the Light of Christ leads up in the fulfilling of the Scripture and not in opposition to it but by his lightness and lyes he is made manifest to be a deceiver of the people and so take thy own words in thy conclusion to thy self thou art he that is alienated from the Scripture and from the Spirit of God also by thy lying spirit of contradiction which is manifest in thy Writings In his 15. Head concerning singing We do not contradict the Scripture herein again thou art a lyar but singing with the spirit and with understanding we own of such as are redeemed out of the World and are not of the World but singing of David's experiences sung in the World by such who are of the World this singing we do deny as it is practised in this generation in Rhime and Meeter in a vain multitude of people where all or most of them do dishonor God in singing Davids words which themselves are out of the life of and in a life quite contrary singing the Law of God is dear to them and that they exercise themselves in it when every moment of time they are exercised in wickedness and cast the Law of God behind them and thus singing lyes and that which is not true to them yet in the Name of the Lord. Other Reasons many may be given why we deny singing in this form and manner and way as singing is practised in this generation but this instance is sufficient to all honest people but cavillers mouths are not soon stopped not by the truth And all J. S. professes as to maintain this manner and practice of singing are all impertinent he proves that the saints sang and were exhorted to it but what is this to the purpose to prove the World must sing who are unconverted which singing we oppose onely and not the saints singing in 〈◊〉 spirit who are moved to it by the spirit O thou lyar Wherâ—fore dost thou say To be against singing Davids words by the World in Rhime and Meeter as we do is contrary to Eph. 5. Col. 3. doth these scriptures hold forth any such thing let the Reader try as that Davids experiences may be sang in the World in Rhime and Meeter nay they do not and so thou art a lyar on the scriptures to be taken notice of and marked for a wrester of the scriptures and in this we have often declared our minds by words and writings that poetry and J. Hopkins and T. Sternolds brain-invention we have denied yet Davids Psalms wâ— have owned and do own them as they were given forth by the spirit of God and not as they are perverted and added and diminished to such a compass of syllables as they are now in practice and thus I have given you a further testimony for and against singing wherein we deny it and wherein we own it and so leaves his muddy stuff and so counts it not worth raking in onely a lye or two or more he is proved in as the Reader may take notice also of
it fall into Scripture contradiction but R.F. nor others wil therefore c. This is unfound and laid down but not proved at all neither maâ—or nor minor and hereby he hath concluded wickedly the Apostle Iames and Christ himself to be fallen into Scâ—ipâ—ure contradictions who did exprâ—sly forbid all swearing and did not compare the precepts and examples for Swearing with the prohibition against it and thus J. S. is taken uttering folly with his tongue hath drawn a conclusion upon Christ and the Apostle Iames to be contradictors of Scripture let shame cover his impudent forehead And they that charge Christ and the Apostle James with contradicting Scripture are enemies to God and of the Devil and for eternall vengeance but Iohn Stelham hath done so and therefore he is an enemy to God and of the Devil and for eternal vengeance But further at large as concerning Swearing our testimony thereof is laâ—d down at large in a Book called The glory of the Lord arising And whereas further I. S. as a man not weary of iniquity goes on after his false charging of us with contradicting to scripture â—harges us again that we contradict our selves in many things which accusation we bear with as much patience as we do his former seeing they are all out of one heart and to the same end for it is a small thing for us to be judged by man and so that wherein he charges us with self-contradictions I passe lightly over having cleared the truth That we do not contradict the Scriptures but if this man J. S. had been in Generations past what would he have said of Isaiah who was sent to tell Hezekiah from the Lord That he should die and not live 2 King 20.1 At the same instant of time the word of the Lord came again to Isaiah that Hezekiah should be healed and that he should go up to the house of the Lord These were both the words of the Lord to Hezekiah and yet no contradiction in Isaiah though such a Spirit as J. S. would so have judged And what would he have judged betwixt David and Ieremiah Psal. 119. and the 103. and Jer. 23.29 David saith The Words of the Lord are sweet unto his taste yea sweeter than the honey to his mouth And Jer. saith Thè Word of the Lord is as a fire and like a hâ—mmer which breaks the Rock to pieces Now there is no contradiction in these two not to that Spirit by which they are guided though so it might seem to such as J.S. whose mindes are dark And what would he have judged of Christs words Matth. 12.30 and Mark 9.40 where Christ said He that is not with me is against me and he that is not against us is with us â—nd yet in these words there is not contradiction to him that hath an ear to hear But if J.S. had been in those dayes out of his evil heart would he have charged the holy men of God to be contradictions to themselves it is very like that he would and these things I leave with the Reader to be considered of for we who have the same Spirit do clear Christ and the holy men of God from contradictions and knows J.S. and such as he to be seekers of occasions against the Just and would make offâ—nces where there is none for as I have said we do not allow J.S. to be the Interpreter of our words for then no question but he would have his own end and meaning and J. S. saith We deny the letter of the Scripture to be Scripture this is charged upon him to be a lye as it is well known through this Nation both in Doctrine and conversation we own the Scriptures and to deny Matthew Mark and Johns Declarations of the Gospel is no denyal of the Scripture for the Gospel was preached to Abraham which Gospel was and is the power of God before these four men did declare it though we deny their Writings to be the very Gospel which is the power of God yet we do not deny but they truly declared of the Gospel and this is to own the Scripture as it speaks of it self to be Let J. S. judg what he will of us and whereas he speaks of Gospel-letters and Scripture Gospel the Scripture gives no such names to it but saith the Gospel is the power of God and that is the Gospel which we preach even the power of God unto all people let J. S. judge by consequence what he will And further he would plead for the Title of Master from the Example of Abrahams Servant but this is nothing to prove the lawfulnesse of a Minister of Christ that they may be called Master for Christ saith to his Ministers Be ye not called Masters and the Spirit of Christ being our rule that leads us in the fulfilling of Christs words let J. S. shuffle as he will Also he lyes of J.N. to say he denyes and grants the same thing to be in the letter for though he say He that believes hath the witnesse in himself which is truth yet he doth not say The Letter is the Belivers witnesse which he seems falsly to be charged withall and he saith the Spirit of God must give the spiritual understanding of the Scriptures But this he doth in another way than that whereby he inspired the Pen-men of the Scriptures Now this is false Doctrine For Christ the way the same to us as to them and not another way of understanding Scriptures nor by another Spirit than that which gave them forth and he saith Christ directed to himself John 5.39 as revealed in the Scriptures and more than that as conveyed by the Scriptures to a Soul Now let the Reader take notice and search that Scripture Whether he hath not added to it yea or nay or where any ever had any Christ conveyed to them by Scriptures It doth say the Scriptures testifie of him but it doth not say that he is revealed in the Scriptures nor conveyed by them to a Soul and this is his additional gloss to corrupt the Text to undervalue the eternal Spirit of the Father by which Christ is only revealed and received and not by the Scriptures And for E. B. to say That he came not to them with enticing words neither what he had gathered from the Scripture without him but to declare the Word of the Lord and not to speak his own conceivings and imaginations this is true and no contradiction in it though J. S. say these cannot both be true to say That he neither came with what he had gathered from Scripture nor his own imaginations For the Apostâ—es of Christ did not preach what they had gathered from Scripture neither their own imaginations but preached the Worâ— and Gospel of God which they had received from God and not gathered from Scripture nor in their own imaginations and because he saith both these negatives cannot be true then it is concluded that himself preaches either what
declared to be the light of the world and the true light which lightneth every one that cometh into the world Joh. 1.9 Joh. 8. Now seeing that this Author hath set up another thing to be the light which hath enlightned every man then Christ viz. the spirit of 〈◊〉 I shall trie this testimony according to the Scriptures whether it be a testimony of the Lords Christ or a testimony against him in these things following which are the Heads of his Doctrine concerning the Light Concerning the LIGHT what it is It is the spirit of every man which is in him and without which he cannot be a man and is the candle of the Lord Prov. 20 27. This spirit of a man is the Reason of a man or tht Understanding of a man What this Light doth it gives him to know his Creator and the end of his creation viz. who made him and why he was made also how he â—â—ould answer the end of him that made him and that God set up this light in man to see by both whom he is to serve and how he is to serve him together with the reason thereof because God made him And with this light God hath set up a Law which Law is called Light Prov. 6.23 whereby the will and mind of his Creator is made known unto him and he sufficiently qualified to see it understand it c. p. 7. It searcheth the inward parts of the belly At first it moved upward and it could look God in the face and serve him But now since the fall the Thief is got into this candle and hath dim'd the light covered the aspiring ascendent quality now it burns downward and discovers the things beneath p 6. That it is all eye it sees all that is done but doth nothing it neither likes nor dislikes approves nor disproves but as it is in conjunction with a Law p. 10. Thae it is the property of Light to make manifest Eph. 5 13. pag 29. That it is not in the power of the Light as it is in every man so much as to call any thing that is done either good or evil p. 32. That the Light did drive Adam from the voice and presence of God so far is the Light from leading up to God that it drives the soul from God and keeps him in the fall p. 53. That it doth not lead into all truth such as love it and obey it p. 54. Nor doth it reveal all truth to them that love it and obey it And that neither the Light nor the Law doth convince of the sin of unbelief That the Lamp and the Light are convertible terms Thy word is as a Lamp Psal. 119.105 and that the Light and the Law is one p. 30. So by this the Light which is the spirit of man or mans Reason and the Law and the Word which of that which is called a testimony of the Lords Christ we shall trie it with the former Testimony of the Lords Christ as it is written in the Scriptures which was given forth from those which were true witnesses First as in answer to these things there is not one Testimony in the Scriptures neither from Prophet nor Apostle that ever said the spirit of man or mans reason and understanding was the Light which every one that cometh into the world is enlightned withal but the testimony of truth concerning those which followed their own spirits is this The Lord sent his Prophet Ezekiel to cry Wâ— unto the foolish Prophets that followed their own spirits and had seen nothing Ezek. 13 3. Now they were not without the spirit of a man for then they could not be a man as he saith now if they had the spirit of man and reason and if this was all eye how was it that they saw nothing when he saith It sees all things so it is not a true testimony of the Light nor of the Lords Christ But the spirit of man is the candle of the Lord and the Lord having lighted it then it searcheth the inward parts of the belly And David who knew whâ—t the spirit of man was and what a candle was without light and what it was when it was lighted he said For thou wilt light my candle the Lord my God will enlighten my darkness Psal. 18.28 So if the spirit of man be the candle of the Lord then whether doth not Christ enlighten every man which cometh into the world and whether is not that light Christ seeing the spirit is but the candle and that it must be lighted Another testimony of his is this That it is the property of light to make manifest Eph. 5.13 but all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light for whaâ—soever doth make manifest is light p. 29. And again in p. 32 he saith that it is not in the power of the light as it is in every man so much as to call any thing which is done good or evil Answ. Whether of these two contraries must men believe whether the light is able to make manifest whatsoever is reprovable or that there is not power in it to call any thing good or evil But by this all men may see that this is not a true testimony to the Lords Christ nor to his Light Never was there any such doctrine preached by any that cried Hosannah to the Son of David nor that did give testimony to the Lords Christ That there is not power in the light to call any thing done good or evil Now let all who have received the measuring-line and the equal ballance weigh and consider seeing the Scripture saith Whatsoever thing is approvable is made manifest by the light Is evil deeds reprovable then they are made manifest then you see them to be evil deeds lying to be an evil deed swearing to be an evil deed drunkenness to be an evil deed covetousness to be an evil deed pride to be an evil deed whoredom to be an evil deed false accusing to be an evil deed gain-saying the truth to be an evil deed anger and wrath to be evil deeds and these things are reprovable as the light doth make them manifest so it reproveâ— them and such are convinced of sin because they believe not in Christ so that unbelief is reprovable and is made manifest by the light And whereas some say That the light doth not reprove for the sin of unbelief that is false for unbelief is reprovable and whatsoever things are reprovable is made manifest by the light but he that doâ—th evil hateth the light and will not bring his deeds to the light lest the light should reprove him Joh. 3.20 And Jesus said unto certain Greeks people which stood by him which objected against his words which was no Saints nor Believers While ye have the light believe in the light that ye may be the children of light Joh. 13.36 Now he did not bid them believe in that which could not reprove unbelief
them unto whom he wrote his Epistle for unto him no Word of prophesie was more sure then that which he had seen and heard when he was with Christ in the holy Mount So this may inform your understandings who may have more desire to know the truth then to oppose it and may put to silence the vain disputings by men of corrupt minds who are destitute of the truth always corrupting the words of truth to oppose the life of it as many such there are in these days which the Lord hath and will rebuke sharply that they may be ashamed but all vvho are led and guided by the light of Christ shall knovv the anointing in them and the vvord of faith yea the Son of God He that can receive it vvithout offence let him 5. Object But he that hath opposed us saith in pag. 25. of his Book in the second part That the dawning of the day is rather an evening then a morning Answ. Novv let all vvhich have but knovvn a day and a night in the Creation judge whether the evening or the morning be the dawning of the day or whether the day-star be a fore-runner of the day or of the night then it will not be incredible which I have said before that he calls darkness light and light darknest but in such things our opposers will not receive a good report from those which can give true judgment and to such it is left to judge of those things Obj. Again he saith in page 35. That the spirit of truth was not a Comforter to the Apostles nor a reprover to the world before Christ was ascended and yet himself to contradict himself saith that he was in them before and dwelt in them the same spirit but not in the same measure Ans. Here is Babylon at the height fit to be pul'd down but needs little answering seeing that it answereth it self and for such reasons as these he might well conceal his name And if he could have put this off by hiding his Name for an Hosanna to the Son of Daiud or A Testimony to the Lords Christ then he might well have baosted have gloryed in his shame as if there had been no spirit of discerning in those he calls Quakers nor others but the eye of truth is not yet so blind but we know an evening from a morning a night from a day and a lye from truth and we know also that the disciples had a measure of the spirit of truth while he was with them upon earth and this spirit did both comfort them and did carry them on in obedience to his will and in the power of this spirit went forth into the world and reproved the world of sin because they did not believe in Christ and the devils was subject unto them by the spirit of truth that was in them before Christ ascended and to this there is a Cloud of witnesses So that this from him filling his Book with such things as these is as if a man should fill a Barn with Chaff instead of Corn and deceive others with selling it for Corn. Another contradiction of the same nature is this That the manifestation of the spirit is given to no man for himself buâ— to every man to profit withal to edifie and build up and do service in the body as an hand foot or eye or some other member of the body c. and to contradict this in the next words he saith Not that the spirit or the manifestation of the spirit is given to every man i e. to every individual person forasmuch as some men are sensual having not the spirit therefore no manefestation thereof pag 17. Ans. This is like the former and so to be cast out with it for his distinction of words between every man and every individual person will not cover him for where the Scripture saith every man without distinction that is every individual man and women And the Apostle saith But the manifestation of the spirit is given to every man to profit withall he doth not say not to every individuall person And this also I say and affirm That to every man is given a manifestation of the spirit to profiâ— withal and he that profits with it by it shall be justified and he that doth not profit with it by it shal be condemned because he is an unprofitable servant this truth shal stand when all confusion shal have an end yet some are sensual having not the spirit Obj. Again in despising the testimony from the mâ—asure of the gift of the spirit of God when they have spoken according to the measure and could not boast themselves above their measure but in their measure witnessing the work of God as it was fulfilled in them such he scornfully reproacheth saying What means those cracks and crannes in their knowedge knowing but in part there is no pieces nor parts nor measures nor degrees in absolute perfection whosoever saith he knoweth perfectly he knows not how perfect his knowledge is and the first of those is called a vain man boasting of that which is not and of a false gift and is like clouds and wind without rain Ans. Herein is Pauls Doctrine as well as ours declared against to be but as cracks and crâ—nnes and a vain boasting of a false gift for Paul saith We dare not make our selves of the number or compare our selves with some that commend themselves but they measuring themselves by themselves and comparing themselves with themselves are not wise But we will not boast of things without our measure but according to the Measure of the Rule which God hath distributed unto us a measure to teach even unto you for we stretch not our selves beyond our measure not boasting of things without our measure that is of other mens labours Now this measure of which he thus spoke was in Christ so in perfection and there is parts and degrees in Christ and so in absolute perfection so far as every man is in the measure of the gift of God so far he is in Christ so far his knowledge is perfect and abiding in this he abideth in that which is perfect and as he gloriâ—yes in this he glorys in a true gift and none shall make this glorying void Obj. And whereas John Jackson saith of those that say they have but attained in measure he calleth that the bleating of the sheep and the lowing of the Oxen which declares plainly that they are not at home they are not in the City but have certain miles to travel before they arrive Answ. This is a false interpretation as I shall leave it unto all of understanding to judge for the bleating of the Sheep and the lowing of the Oxen dâ—d signifie Sauls disobâ—dience unto the commandment of God for which the Lord did reject him But when Paul said he knew in part and prophesied in part and would not boast above his measure this did not signâ—fie his disobedience
elected Ans. There he hath belyed the Ministers of the gospel for they could discern the elect from the World as it is written Ye shall discern between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not and Paul and Peter vvrote to the Elect So these Teachers vvho knovv not the Elect and yet exhort all their hearers to believe and lay hold on Christ their preaching is in vain for if God hath but intended a certain number to be saved and the rest to be condemned then they set their Hearers on work in vain and many to expect that vvhich they are never like to have So these people are in a miserable state And note that these Priests though they take sums of money and tythes of their Hearers in many parishes in the Nation yet they know not vvho are elected among them according to this mans words Pr. That the Sword of the Spirit is ineffectual without the Letter Ans. The Svvord of the Spirit is the Word of God vvhich vvas effectual before the Letter vvas to Enoch to Isaac to Jacob to Abraham and others and from the Word vvas the Letter given forth and the Letter is not effectual without it Pr. That there was no Scripture written but what is extaut and in the Bible Ans. Yes against that shall the Scripture bear witness the Book of Nathan the prophet the Book of Ahijah the Book of Iddâ— 2 Chron. 9.29 the Book of Shemaia 2 Chron. 20.15 the Book of Gad 1 Chron. 29.29 the Book of Jehu 2 Chron. 34. the Book of Jasher 2 Sam. 1.18 the prophesie of Enoch Jude 2. one Epipistle of the Corinthians 1 Cor. 5.9 one Epistle to the Ephesians Eph. 3.3 one Epistle to the Laodiceans Col. 4. All these Scriptures vvere given forth from the same spirit and to the same end and use as those are which are bound up in the Scriptures although these be left out Pr. That there was no Scripture â—or Writings appointed of God to be a Rule of Faith and Manners but what is bound up in the Bible Ans. Those Scriptures which are not bound up in the Bible were given forth from the same spirit and by the motion of the Holy Ghost and so for the same ends and uses that the other Scripture was given forth for and as he appointed the one so the other Pr. That the Letter doth antecede and go before the spirit in all that walk in the spirit Ans. This is false for the spirit did antecede the Letter in all that walked in the spirit who gave forth the Letter from the spirit Pr. That the works of Christ in some respect are not perfect Ans. That is false for every gift of God is perfect and every work of Christ is perfect in all his children but that spirit in thee which is fallible makes nothing perfect and therefore judgeth all things yea Christ and his Works to be fallible and deceivable like it self Pr. That the Law requires more strict and exact obedience than the Gospel Ans. Nay The Law saith Thou shalt not commit adultery but the Gospel saith Thou shalt not lust The Law saith Thou shalt not kill but the Gospel saith Thou shalt not be angry The Law saith Thou shalt not forswear thy self but the Gospel saith Swear not at all Matth. 5. And so the Gospel requires more exact obedience then the Law contrary to this affirmation Pr. That God chose a Devil to be one of his Ministers in chusing Judas and his proof for it is this That the Divine Natuâ—e did not see it good to communicate the knowledge of all things unto the humane nature and therefore though he was a Devil when he chose him yet he knew it not Ans. This is a charging of Christ with ignorance contrary unto John 2.24.25 which saith That Jesus did not commit himself unto them because he knew all men and needed not that any should testifie of man for he knew what was in man And though Judas by transgression became a Devil and the Devil abode not in the Truth doth it therefore follow that he was never in the truth But Christ speaks of him and to him as well as to the rest that they had power to cast out unclean spirits Matth. 10.1 and that the Spirit of the Father spoke in them Matth. 10.20 So that there was no difference while the Spirit of the Father led him and taught till the Devil entered into his heart to betray that Lord of Life So that is a false charge to say That Christ sent out a Devil to minister the Gospel Pr. That the Spirit of God may accompany a Ministry and the Minister not have the Spirit Ans. This is another Doctrine than ever the Prophets or Apostles preached for I never read in the Scripture that ever any did minister for God which had not the Spirit or that ever any was converted unto God by such a Minister as had not the Spirit Therefore prove this assertion to the people where or when the Spirit of God did accompany that Ministry when the Minister had not the Spirit so that thou mâ—ist as well as thou hast said not pretend unto any infallibility nor unto any truth in thy ministry for if thou didst people would see that thou didst pretend unto that which thou art far from So that if thou wouldst not pretend to minister neither no more than to have the Spirit it were better for thee Pr. That the power that went forth in the Apostles Ministry was in God and not in them but as they have it communicated to them by the exercise of Faith Ans. Here thou hast confounded thy self for if they had it communicated to them by their exercise of Faith then it was in them for the exercise of Faith is within in the pure Conscience and so the power was in them from which they ministred and they did not abuse their power but from the power ministred forth their gift as they had received it Thomas Ramsay said That we preach a Doctrine of Devils in saying that men may be free from sin in this life Ans. Then the Apostle Paul preached a Doctrine of Devils For he said Rom. 6 2. How shall we that are dead to sin live any longer therein And in the 7 th verse saith He that is dead is free from sin And in the 18 th verse he saith to the Believers being then made free from sin Ye became the servants of righteousness in ver 22. he again tells them That now being made free from sin and become servants to God you have your fruits unto holiness and the end everlasting life And this was spoken to the Romans while they were in this life and it was not a Doctrine of Devils but the Doctrine of the Gospel and Christ preached the Doctrine of perfection in this life Matth. 5.48 saying Be ye perfect as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect and also it is written Be ye holy for I am
thee withall to guide thy mind into the fear of God to the Light of Christ in thy conscience I speak which if thou hearken unto it it will lead thee out of pride and lust and envy and will bring condemnation upon that nature thou hast lived and acted in that is out of the fear of God and hearkening to this Light in thy conscience it will direct thy mind to God and draw thy mind and affections out of earthly things and the pollutions of the world by which thou art defiled thy mind and conscience is defiled by lust and unâ—leanness lusting after earthly things and the flesh is defiled by that mind â—hat wallows in the Earth Now minding the Light in thy conscience Christ hath enlightned thee withall thy understanding will come to be enâ—ightned to see the deceipts and the blind Guides which have led thee â—rom this Light in thy Conscience which should exercise it and lead thee â—o go to fear him and to be taught of him and will lead thee from the â—eachings of man which keeps thee in thy sins and draws thee from this Light in thy Conscience which convinceth thee of sin and lets thee see sin â—nd evil and all ungodliness and will bring thee to deny it and lead thee 〈◊〉 repentance and so thou wilt come to know Jesus Christ which gives â—epentance and remission of sins and then thou wilt deny Priest Sherlock â—nd all that generation of Priests who saith in thâ— 32. page of his Book â—hat Christ was a person not capable of Faith and Repentance And here I â—o charge him in the presence of the living God to be a lyar for he is â—he author and finisher of faith and he preached repentance and gives repentance to his people And he denies the knowledge and understanding the Apostles had and yet saith he preaches the same Gospel pag. 10. And saith That external Tongues Arts and Sciences gives them to understand the meaning of the Gospel p. 11. And saith That the spirit causeth fleshly fruits p. 22. and saith That to understand the Doctrine of God they must use the light of distinctions p. 54. and saith That Religion is the Art of Arts p 86. And saith That Prayer in all the parts and species thereof is a means to fetch down the holy spirit of God p. 144. When as the Saints said the Spirit taught them to pray and that they prayed with the spirit and with understanding Now to the Light in your consciences I speak which will let you see these lying Priests and blind guides which have deceived you so long and kept you blind and ignorant So all people cease from them and wait upon the Lord for teaching A lover of the Truth and a witness against the deceit and deceivers and a lover of the souls of all people and that righteousness might be established was I moved tâ— write this Richard Hubberthorn Quest. 1. WHether your Gospel be the same which the Apostles preached And if it be why go you to Oxford and Cambridge when the Apostle saith the Gospel that he preached was not after man neither was he taught it by man Pr. Thy answer is You preach the same Gospel the Apostles preached but do not attain the knowledge and understanding of this Gospel by the same means Rep. Here let all people see what wooden stuff this is How can you preach the same Gospel and have not the same knoâ—ledge and understanding If it be not by the sâ—â—e knowledge and understanding it is not the same Gospel for the spirit oâ— understanding is but one and from this Spirit of underâ—tanding thou hast cleared thy self Pr. And thou sayest You ought not to depend upon any such immâ—diate Revelations from Heaven as the Apostles had Rep. Here again thou hast cleared thy self from the Spirit thâ—â— gave forth the Scriptures who deniest immediate Revelation from Heaven And here thou hast denied thy self to be anâ— Minister of Jesus Christ for no man knows the Son but the Father and he to whom he is revealed And thou that deniest immediate revelation thou hast denied the Son of God and hast shewed that thou hast not life for he that hath not the Son of God hath not life And therefore we deny such Schools as Oxford and Cambridge where the rudiments of the world are invented And abundance of filthy words are in the Answer to this Query that are not worth mentioning Qu. 2. Whether you can give another meaning to the Scriptures than they are Or whether the Apostles did give the meaning to them when they spoke them forth yea or nay And if they did what need learned men give the meaning of them Pr. And in thy answer thou sayest The sence and meaning of the Scripture is involved in it Rep. Here thou wouldest make people believe Christ were in the Letter who is the substance that gave it forth and was in them that spoke it forth for the Scripture doth declare another thing of God and Christ it doth not declare God and Christ is in the Letter but here it is that fools might appear blind and such as thou sayest learned men must give the meaning to the Scripture Pr. And thou sayest That Christ took a Text and that Philip took a Text. Rep. O thou enemy and slanderer of Christ and the Apostle Did they take Texts to get money with them and to lie a quarter of a year or half a year in a Text Christ came to fulfil the Scripture and the Apostle shewed how Christ fulfilled the Scripture and came to fulfil that which the Prophet spoke The Scribes and Pharisees were learned men and they could not open the Scriptures Peter an unlearned man he opened the Scriptures Pr. And thou speakest of standing up in a Pulpit of wood Rep. In the time of the Law when they read it there was a Pulpit of wood to a particular people to whom the Law was given but Christ said Go preach the Gospel to every creature And Christ cryed wo against them that had the chiefest place in the Assemblies And here thou art one of them that would be under the Law and would have a Pulpit of wood and pleadest for thy learning that the Scribes and Pharisees were in which is to no purpose who saith the kernel of the Nut is in the shell and that comparison thou bringest to make people believe that the Life is in the Sâ—riptures and so the poor people are groping in the Letter to find life there when the life was in them that gave it forth Pr. Thou speakest of flying to God by prayer Rep. Yet thou deniest the Revelation from Heaven which the Saints were to wait for the Revelation of Jesus from Heaven and this makes all you blind guides to stumble because you have not the life which gave forth the Scripture which now is made manifest to the children of God Qu. 3. Shew me by the Scriptures who ever was made a Minister of
and the praying with the Spirit is witnessed among the Saints Qu. 8. Shew me by the Scripture when the Apostles went into the World and gave the people of the World David's Psalms to be sung in meeter the things that you practise answer them by the Scriptures or the Apostles practise without consequence or imagination And in thy answer to this Query thou perverts the Scripture as in the Acts as Paul and Silas sung Psalms in the prison with them of the World they did not go into the World to give them a psalm to sing men that were not come to repentance for saith David The dead cannot praise God there I charge thee to be a lyar that puttest no difference betwixt the Saints singing with grace and understanding and the World which have gotten the form where thou art The Apostle did not speak to such as were in thy condition to be filled with the spâ—rit who were not come to repentance but he spoke to them who were turned from the World and such sung praises to God But for such as thee to go and give to the World Davids psalms in a meeter and say O Lord I am not puft iâ— mind I have no scornful eye O you prophane ones and scornful ones how can you sing this but lye who have scornful eyes to sing all your bones quake and you tremble and you water your bed with your tears and you lie roaring all the night and day when as you scorn Quakers and hate them and speak all manner of evil of them how can you speak this but lye But Davids condition and the Saints is witnessed among them whom the World scornfully call Quakers which power makes all to tremble though you scorn it a while and have gotten the outside the Letter David's condition in a form of words scorning his life and the power of God where it is made manifest Take warning all you scoffers and scorners what came to be the end of all your Fathers that passed before you but destruction You lofty ones fear tremble before the mighty God for all your songs must be turned into howling but singing with the spirit we own the grace which hath appeared to all men teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts And here I charge thee again to be blind that puts no difference betwixt the worlds singing and the Saints Qu. 9. Whether a man shall overcome the body of sin while hâ— is upon the Earth yea or no Pr. And in thy answer to this ninth Query thou sayest It is not possible to subdue the body of sin altogether while we are in this world and thy comparison is A tree while there is life in it will bring forth fruit Rep. Here I charge thee in the presence of the living God to be the corrupt tree for by thy fruit thou art known for a good Tree cannot bring forth evil fruit and here thou art proved to be thaâ— corrupt tree who confesseth you do not attain to the same knowledge and understanding the Apostles did as thou speakest in thy Book whose harvest is ripe and now is reaping down Pr. And whereas thou sayest they shall not overcome the body of sin while in this world Rep. And here I charge thee again for say the Saints As he is so are we in this present world and thou sayest not there is the lying spirit and the Apostles said they had put off the body of sin and thou sayest it is not possible and there thy spirit is found contrary to the Scripture and the Apostle saith in Rom. 6. they were made free from sin and thou sayest not it cannot be possible and here thy spirit is tryed Let all the children of the light judge thee and that thou speakest to be contrary to the Apostles words in the Romans and all you that cannot witness these things that the body of sin is not put off wait upon God through Christ for it Qu. 10. Whether the curse be not upon him that preacheth another Gospel then Christ and the Apostles preached yea or no Pr. And in thy answer to this Query thou speakest of receiving the Gospel from Christ and the Apostles Rep. In this I charge thee to be a lyar as I said to thee before who deniest immediate Revelation from Heaven how canst thou be a Preacher of the gospel and deny revelatioâ— What a grosâ— darkness are people in that believe thee For under the curse and wo thou art that the Scripture speaks of and he that hath received the end of his prophesie is made from the curse but this is without thy understanding and knowledge Thou confessest in thy answer to the first query you preach the same gospel but do not attain the same knowledge and understanding Let all people see who are in the Light if it be not the same knowledge and understanding it is not the same Gospel but another and there the curse is upon thee Qu. 11. Whether any natural man can preach the Gospel yea or no Pr. In thy answer to this eleventh query thou speakest of understanding and of studying and of the Gospel and of a natural man and sayest he cannot preach the Gospel and thou saist Your understanding knowledg is not the same as the Apostles was Rep. Here let all who are in the Light see if it be not natural then and if thou be not him that studies a divination of thy own brain and instead of the blessing the curse of God comes upon it for how many are there that were Priests as you are that now cry against you which are come out of your generation and see the curse of God upon all your practises Pr. And thou sayest The flesh which is quickened with the Spirit of Life brings forth some kind of fleshly fruit or other Rep. Here thou hast shewed thy self to be death indeed doth the spirit cause fruits of the flesh Or are the fruits of the spirit the fruits of the flesh O thou lyar and high blasphemer which thou sayest is clear from manifold texts of Scripture all the Scriptures will witness thee to be a lyar and these Scriptutes thou bringest to maintain the spirit of life to bring forth some kind of fleshly fruits and the fruits of the spirit to be the fruits of the flesh Here all who are in the spirit will judge thee to be a blasphemer of the holy Spirit of God for the Spirit brings forth no fruits of the flesh Pr. And thou sayest in thy answer to the first query you do not go to Oxford and Cambridge to learn the Gospel you preach but to learn the knowledge of Tongues and Languages Arts and Sciences Rep. O for shame stop thy mouth here thou hast shamed thy self and all your schools with an external means to open the Gospel People are blind indeed that do follow thee but thy bottle is open and what is within pours out and the Fountain runs and thy
God to be a lyar for the word was in the beginning before any tongue was and your Hebrew and Greek is natural and the natural man knows not the things of God and the world by wisdom knows not God Pilate was a worldly man and he had this original and the wisdome of the world and there thou art and there the curse is upon thee so here thou preachest another original then the Apostles did they preached Christ the fountain and thou preachest Hebrew and Greek that is thy original and thy father Pilate had that original which crucified Christ and set it over him and the scripture came not by the will of man Therefore it is not the knowing of it by Hebrew and Greek but by the spirit that gave it forth therefore all people take warning and cease from such deceivers and take heed to the light in your conscience which is the light of Christ to guide your minds up to God the Father of light and be not deceived nor wander not up and down after such who know not the truth but put Hebrew and Greek for the original which Pilate had which crucified Christ Jesus as you may read in Luke 23. All people may see thou art brought no further yet then thy father Pilate so all thy prayers we deny for there is nothing of truth born up in thy understanding who art led with a seducing spirit into delusions who saist the spiriâ— of life stirs up the flesh to bring forth fruits and thou that art in the flesh canst not please God And there thy spirit is tryed to be the spirit of error And a great deal of such stuff thou hast in thy answers to the queries which is not worth mentioning And this thou hast written to publish thy self that them that have a love to Christ their hearts may be turned from thee to God to see how thou hast uttered forth thy solly though with many fair glosses thou and such as thou art deceive the simple But all who are in the light do see thee and comprehend thee Something in Reply to the Epistle thou wrotest to the Lady BINDLOSSE TO her thou speakest of the doctrine and spirit and the holy Ghost Here I charge thee to be a lyar who knows nothing of them who deniest immediate revelation for thou who deniest that deniest the Father and the Son as in Matth. 11.27 Wherein goest thou about to exhort others who art in the condition thy self but art as Martha that would be serving If she do but take heed to the light which Christ hath enlightened her withall she will quickly see thy folly for the light which Christ hath enlightened her withall shall be her condemnation if she hate it and if she love it it will guide her into the way of righteousness up to Christ And there O woman is thy teacher and his condemnation And the Work which is brought forth in the North doth tâ—rment thee R. Sherlock and such as the Lord doth move to exhort or to speak such thou slanderest and dost accuse as tempting for thy slanders and reproaches the wo wil turn upon thee from God who is the Justifier of his children and with such Priests as thou art the righteous seed was ever hated as you may read throught the Scriptures If she that thou callest a Lady be grounded upon thy doctrine be a member with thee of thy body let her read thy answers to the queries the replies to them to the light in her I speak which is of Christ which will witness me and let her see thee and if her mind be guided by it it will condemn all her former practises of worship and let her see thy delusions And again thou art flattering the Lady and tells her of a discourse of the Spirit and these are thy unsavoury words who art discoursing of the Spirit but deniest it for thou that deniest immediate Revelation denies the Spirit In the Corinthians the Apostle said things were revealed to him by the spirit and all thy doctrines to be denied and all that thou speakest and thou art seen to be one of the evil beasts and slow-bellies whose mouth must be stopt And what dost thou tell her of growing up in the knowledge of God and stop the way for her to pass who deniest immediate revelation which the Apostle exhorted to And the Saints were to have the loins of their minds girded up as in 1 Pet. 1.13 And what hast thou to do to talk of Heaven or happiness who art a Beast in thy colours And so this is the intent that I have written this Reply to the Epistle which thou wrote to her thou callest Lady that she might with the Light of Christ in her see thy folly for to that I speak which is the Light of Christ which if she hate it it will be her eternal condemnation Something in Reply to thy Introduction Pr. NO age hath brought forth more pretenders to the Spirit of God than this wherein we live Rep. Let all people take notice if thou be not he that pretends the Spirit who hath not the same understanding and knowledge that the Apostles had and there thou art in the pretence who art blind and thy worship as thou callest it is thou dost not know what worse than it was at Samaria who art in the pride of heart And as thou sayest the Devil hath sown his crop and reapt his harvest and there thou art one of his servants sowing his seed and amongst the delusions as thou calst them for that is in thy generation which comes out of thy own bottle which now flows out what is within issues forth this is thy own condition who seducest the people The fire is kindling and the tares are burning which makes you wicked ones to cry out And so all Impostors and Blasphemers are in thy generation and you are ignorantly worshipping and your gross Idolatry which thou speakest of is your own and thou art a Murderer and understandest not what thou speakest of them and God thou knowest not who deniest immediate revelation from Heaven but onely what thou knowest thou knowest naturally as a bruit Beast which Jude speaks of And a great deal of stuff thou hast in this Introduction which is not worth mentioning If the Reader doth but read with a single eye he may see all thy confused stuff which is not worth naming And a great deal of stuff thou hast written in discourse of the Spirit and the Holy Ghost which thou knowest not what thou speakest of and of the Trinity which there is no Scripture for A Reply to an Epistle that thou wrotest to him whom thou callest Sir Robert Bindlosse THe Queries being sent to his house from Rich. Hubberthorn being his desire that they should be made publike and we do praise the Lord that deceit is brought to light And thou saist Perhaps some satisfaction might be given to those seduced wavering souls amongst you Truly I do
Son of God and immediate miraculous revelation and sayest there is no need of any such qualifications now therefore doth all your Teachers shew forth your railing and slanders but these things we wave for God will give you you lyars your portion who hath not the same knowledge and understanding that the Apostles had and here thou hast shamed thy mother that is adulterated from the Apostles life Pr. Our gifts are from the spirit of God though studied for with these means that are outward and moral c. Rep. Here I charge thee to be a Lyar in the presence of God the gift of God is a free gift it is not studyed for nor is it gotten by moral means and if it were studied for and found in outward means then it were not a free gift and here thou hast made it manifest that thou knowest not the gift of God for it is not him that wills nor him that runs but God that shews mercy So thou blasphemer for shame blush Pr. No man can be wise without the spirit of wisdom nor knowing without the spirit of knowledge so no man can pray as he ought without the spirit of prayer p. 71. Rep. In thy answer to the first query thou sayest you do not attain the same koowledge and understanding of the Gospel as the Apostles did then if thou have not the same knowledge and understanding it is all deceit for in thy own words thou sayest you cannot not pray without the spirit knowledge and understanding and thou sayest you do not attain the same knowledge and understanding the Apostles had then thou hast not the same spirit of love to pray withall and thou sayest you cannot pray without the spirit yet thou goes and tells people of a Gospel and hath not the same knowledge and understanding the Apostles had therefore thy knowledge is bruitish Jer. 10.14 Psal. 92.6 Psal â—9 8 Pr. That we may according to the Catholick Faith worship one God in Trinity Rep. For these things which thou tells people of there is no Scripture as Catholick Faith and Trinity and of three persons Pr. The second kind of the holy Spirits impressions on humane souls page 78. Rep. There is no Scripture which speaks of humane souls for the soul thou knows not who art a murtherer with thy Deity stuff who would dit up the way from God but praises be to the living God who hath given his sons and daughters eyes to see thee and all your Deity stuff which you imitate who are whoredomed from God but the Saints of the most high God do sing over it and you halelujah to God who witness their souls redeemed And there is abundance of stuff in that Book which thou calls the discourse of the Spirit which is not worth mentioning and abundance of lyes and slanders but them we pass as knowing the author of lyes from whence they come is for destruction And in page 95 thou speaks of Timothy studying for his gift Did he study for his gift or for the proving of it and dividing of the word aright but he did not study for it for the gift of God is a free-gift And in another place thou speaks of the blessing of God being upon your studies but I say the curse of God is upon your studies who have not the same knowledge and understanding that the Apostles had and so preaches another gospel Pr. And most blasphemously to profess and boast of an equality with God p. 66. Rep. Thy boasting is excluded without in thy generation and thou art excluded from the life and mind of the Apostle who said Let the same mind be in you that was also in Christ Jesus who being in the form of God thought it no robbery to be equal with God Phil. 2.5 6. and this thou calls blasphemy and so thou hast shewed what spirit thou art of contrary to the Apostle Pr. And for our new sect of Enthusiasts had they the spirit of God as they pretend abiding in them and speaking in them c. Rep. All pretences and sects are denyed where the Spirit of God dwells though with thy generation such was ever called so And that is thy own who hath made a discourse of the Spirit and here thou art clearly from them that the Spirit of God spoke in and did abide in them which Spirit of God did descend into their hearts which Spirit God hath given to every one to profit withall and the Spirit of the Father speaketh in you saith Christ Mat. 10.20 take no thought and in many places thou art speaking of a study and blessing a study Here thou art contrary to Christ who saith Take no thought and art of the Devil And here I charge thee to be one of them that Jeremy speaks of who speaks a vain divination of thine own heart Pr. As here Angels are Spirits and the souls of men are Spirits but God is not a Spirit as they are Spirits pag 57. Rep. This is confusion for Christ said God is a Spirit and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and there thou art raced out to be without the doctrine of Christ. Pr. 'T is the very ground whereupon this last upstart crew of Quakers build all their resolutions and strange fanatick opinions and heresies even that which they call the light within us whereunto we must only give ear pag. 112. Rep. O thou impudent God will make the an example thou lying spirit Is the Light which Christ hath enlighned every one withall that comes into the world a strange fanatick opinion which one he loves it and the other he hates it and he that hates it it is condemnation Here thou art against Christ and the Apostles for the Apostle did exhort the Saints to take heed unto the light within them untill the day dawn and the day-star arise in their hearts O thou Lyar did the Prophet cal the truel light a deceit of the heart or is the light of God a false vision Christ Jesus which doth enlighten every one that comes into the world which is witnessed among the Quakers and he that walks in the Light shall have the Light of Life and thou that hates this light speaks a divination of thy own brain and a lying imagination and with this Light of Christ thou shalt be condemned thou blasphemer who calls the Light of Christ heresie and fanatick opinions but here thou dost but fill up the measure of thy Fathers who calls this Light which is Christ in us Heresie p. 113. To all you Readers of his Book I speak to the Light of Christ in you which if you love it it will bring you to weigh and comprehend his words and if you walk in it you shal have the light of life and you that hate it it shal be your Condemnation when the book of Conscience is opened you shal witness that I speak the truth to every one of your souls R. Sherlock thou bids them beware
was and the place of her abode and answer was made to both then they asked What their business was to Oxford they answered They were commanded of the Lord to come thither they asked What to do they answered To declare against sin and ungodliness which they lived in as pride covetousness lust and all uncleanness self-righteousness and all false worship which both Priest and people lived in contrary to the commands of God Then they asked them How they knew they were called of God they said They knew the voice of God and that they were called of God And this is to be observed as a true testimony of these two servants of the Lord that they did neither beg nor steal neither did they wrong nor violence to any man they coveted no mans silver gold nor apparel but because they obeyed the word of the Lord and did his work faithfully speaking the word of the Lord in boldness against the deceits of the Priests and people in the Streets in the Market-place in the Synagogues and in the Colledges clearing and discharging their consciences in the Lords work and service freely administring that which they had freely received from the Lord of whom they do receive their reward for their reward is with them and the presence of the Lord God doth accompany them and for their obedience to the Lord they receive the shame of the world as ever the servants of the Lord did who were mocked buffâ—tted and shamefully used being tied together at Johns Colledge and pumped and kicked and buffetted and thrust into a pool called Giles's pool so that they went into a remote place to wash the dirt off their cloathes And here both Magistrates and Schollers and they who pretend to be Ministers of the Gospel are the chiefest actors in this persecution and so do make themselves manifest to be in the same generation of the Scribes and Pharisees and Hypocrites who were ever persecutors of the righteous seed whomever it hath brought forth and so they fill up the measure of their fathers iniquities Again as concerning the Justices being assembled the Vice-chancellor being the chief actor in this persecution said That they blasphemed the name of God and did abuse the Spirit of God and dishonour the grace of Christ and asked the women Whether they did read the Scriptures they answered Yea they did then they asked them Whether they were not to be obedient to the power of the Magistrate they answered They were obedient to the power of God and to the power as it was of God their souls were subject unto it for consâ—ience sake Well said the Vice-chancellor you prophane the word of God and I fear you know not God though you so much speak of him And then they concluded that there was matter enough for their commitment and punishment and wished the women to withdraw consenting that a paper should be drawn up for their being whipped out of the City And when the paper was drawn up it was presented to the Major to set his hand to it but the said Major refused and said He was not willing to do it but one of the Justices said That it was the privilâ—â—ge of the City that if any vagrant were taken within the Franchises and liberties of the City the paper must be drawn up That I such a one Major have committed such and such persons and then it is to be sealed with the Office seal but the Major answered That he would refuse both then others said who were zealous and thought that they had done God good service That if he would not it should be done by them and it was agreed upon that they should be soundly whipped and that for the present because of the tumult be put into the cage And the next morning their wills was performed though with much unwillingness in the executioner Many other particulars might be mentioned of their sufferings afflictions and patience under reproachings revilings slanders and false accusations cast upon them which is the portion of the righteous in the world as Christ said Blessed are you when men shall revile you and persecute and speak all manner of evil against you falsly for my names sake rejoyce and be exceeding glad for great is your reward in heaven for so persecuted they the Prophets that were before you Mat. 5.11 12. and saith Christ They shall put you out of the synagogues yea the time cometh that whosoever killeth you will think that he doth God service and these râ—â—â—gs will â—hey do unto you because they know not the Father nor me Joh. 16.2 3 4. Aâ—â— nâ—w both sons and daughters of the Lord comes to witness these â—hings fulfilled and you Magistrates Priests and people do fulfil the Scriptures against the servants of the living God as you have done against these And herein is made manifest your tyranny and persecution the chief Priest being the chief actor in it yet there was many in the City that have so much of the light of Christ made manifest in them as to acknowledge them to be servants of the living God and to own them in their sufferings and to confess the appearance of Christ in them before men and in love did accompany them out of the City and did own them in their persecution And this testimony is true to testifie to all people and to all the world the cruelty of unreasonable men and that the Major had no hand in any of this cruel usage and persecution The names of the two women who suffered persecution for righteousness sake is Elizabeth Heavens and Elizabeth Fletcher R.H. Two Letters written by R. H. during his imprisonment in Norwich Castle From Norwich Castle TO all my dear friends whom the Lord by his eternal spirit is gathering out of the World into the covenant of Life to be of one heart and mind and soul. Wait all in that which is pure and invisible that the pure teachings of Christ you may know every one in particular which is without form and beauty to the visible that nothing you may receive but that which speaks from the eternal moving of the living God have salt in your selves to savour with all words you may discern which is without life and power and standing single in that which is pure of God all such deny to be your teachers which have the words of truth but live not in the life and power of what they say so in the power of the living God wait in silence of all flesh and here comes that which hath been fed to be famisht and that which hungers after God comes to receive living nurture and nourishment from God So in the invisible comes to feed upon the bread of life which comes from heaven and the tender plants will come to grow up unto eternal life and fruit will be brought forth unto God dwelling in that which is invisible and all untimely fruit will wither and fade away but keeping low in the light
the Truth against Christ against the Saints and against the Scriptures they may see which hath been long hid but now is made manifest in the Light unto all who are come to know the free teachings of God who will no more give thee money for speaking a divination of thy own brain and not from the mouth of the Lord. Priest Who knows not that Tythes and Glebes were under that dispensation by Divine Law ordained for the maintenance of the Priests Ans. Here thou wouldst make people believe that thou denies tythes which was for the maintenance of the Priests under the Law But as for the glebes which thou speaks of there was never any such thing ordained in the Law here thou hast made it appear that thou art ignorant of that which was ordained for the Priests maintenance under that dispensation for they had no inheritance nor glebe lands to maintain them as some of the priests of England have and yet those priests in England which do receive tythes and so upholds that which thou seems to deny yet thou owns them as thy brethren and to be Ministers of the gospel And here your deceit is so plainly made manifest that you accuse one another and condemn one another all your hearts being exercised with covetous practices preaching for filthy lucre all being agreed together to persecute revile and slander the pure truth of God where it is made manifest in his servants to declare against all your deceits that out of your snares the righteous seed of God may be delivered to testifie against you and your Ministry under which the Seed of God is kept in bondage Priest Reader I have done our Heavenly Father taketh sleeping Disciples at the best Matth. 26.40 Ans. Here thou hast uttered forth a lye that all may plainly see who saith thou hast done and in the next words saith Our Heavenly Father taketh sleeping Disciples at the best Now from this Scripture in Matth. 26.40 thy words are proved to be false for in that condition the Disciples were then in they were not at the best who could not watch with Christ one hour and the Comforter was not then come which afterwards they did witness by travel and labour and fasting and prayer and watching day and night they did witness and we who do witness the same condition now do testifie against thee and all who make lyes of the Apostles who did witness Jesus Christ in truth and uprightness of heart and the same Christ do we witness and do freely preach him to every Nation being made manifest to that of God in every ones conscience to be witnessed Now as my first Query is printed in thy paper the latter part of it I deny which was not given forth nor spoken so by me· In thine it is written thus How can that be said to be a natural Light which witnesseth unto God against the things of the Spirit of God Which is false But in mine it is written thus How can that be said to be a natural Light which witnesses unto God in that which is holy against the natural inclinations of fallen man seeing the Scripture saith the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God 1 Cor. 2.14 Now as every one hath a desire to knovv the truth of these things that the occasion of stumbling may be taken avvay they may read the Query as it was given forth from me in pag. 16. of that printed paper called David's Enemies discovered which was put forth in print to be seen as it vvas there vvritten before Woodals paper vvhich is novv in print vvas given forth And this I have given forth that the truth may be cleared ovvning that vvhich did proceed from me and denying that vvhich is not mine And as for Frederick Woodals Ansvvers to the Queries they are replied unto in the paper above-mentioned and to the rest of his printed paper an ansvver is herein returned that he may not boast in his folly but be ashamed and repent Novv as in ansvver to that in the latter end of thy book vvhich thou directs the Reader unto thou seeing that thou hast holden forth these things vvhich thou canst not prove as the first Adam to be the Fountain of all natural good and so to blind the eyes of people that they may not see thy lye and saith thou means not primitively and here thou speaks one thing and means another but this covering is too nâ—rrow for thee and under it thou canst not hide thy self but thy nakedness and shame appears to all whose eyes are opened and by them thou art seen And whereas thou wouldâ—â— cover over thy shame of that thou hast formerly spoken in telling of two Images the Image of God and the Image of Christ and that the first was natural and the second spiritual and here thou speaks contrary to the Scriptures which saith he is the express Image of the Father And herein all who do witness the Scriptures to be true must witness against thee who speaks contrary to the Scrâ—ptures and now to blind peoples eyes thou tells them thou understands it thus Adam was made after the Image of God God the Father Son and the Holy Spirit Come let us make man not after our not my Image To this I answer Here thou hast added to the Scripture for God did not say Not my Image as thou dost charge him to say for the Scripture saith God created man in his own image in the image of God created he him as Gen. 1.27 And thou calls the image in which Adam was created the essential image and the image of Christ thou calls a personal image and hereby them who dwell in the Light thou art seen out of the substance in the images making to thy self images and likenesses from thy imaginations but in them thou canst not know God and Christ nor the image of God in which Adam was created in innocency and there is no such word in Scripture as Essential image and here thou goest about to make three images and so amongst the image-makers thou art who art out of Gods commands and there thou may read thy self But now the Lord God is gathering his own seed by his eternal light out of all images and likenesses to be conformed to the image of the Son to bear his image who is invisible which all the imaginers cannot enter into who stumble at the Light but all such are seen by the children of the Light and denyed for now do they witness from the Lord the day of Redemption yea plenteous Redemption is now witnessed by them who dwell in the Light which comprehends the World out of the World and out of the Worlds teachings and out of the Worlds wayes and out of the Worlds Worships into the pure teachings of God and into the Covenant where they know God and are taught of him and no more can they be led by the blind guides for their eyes are
opened which were blind and now in the Light of Christ the Way is seen which leads unto God the Father of Light and in it all false Prophets and false Teachers they do see and by them cannot be deceived who come in sheeps cloathing and are beautiful outwardly decked with the Saints words but inwardly ravening Wolves And now their covering comes to be taken of which was none of their own and now the Wolf appears ravening against the Lambs of God for the day hath made them manifest and of them the Lambs of God are aware and in innocency are preserved and in the pure Wisdom which is not of this World in it they see and comprehend the Serpents Wisdom subtilty craftiness and snares which for the righteous seed are laid but in the Eternal Light made manifest to the seed a way is seen out of them all and by the Eternal Power of the pure living God of life deliverance out of them all is witnessed Eternal pure living praises to him for evermore Given forth from the love of God to the souls of those who desire to know the truth to take away all stumblings and cut off all occasions from all minds that in the Light of Gheist the truth they may see to be clear from all slanders and false accusations which from the unclean spirits proceeds which goeth out of the mouth of the Dragon to devour the innocent but from the Dragon and all his Floods the innocent are preserved Given forth from him who a witness stands for the truth of God against all deceit R. H. Written from Mondlesham in Suffolk the 29. of the 3. Month 1655. The distance between Flesh and Spirit c. THis is the Word of the Lord to all people as I am moved of the Lord to clear the scandals and false accusations cast upon the righteous seed and as the seed of God in all generations have suffered reproaches from the World so now the same seed where it is brought forth suffers by this generation of evil doers and is afflicted and tormented and shamefully accused now in England whom you call Quakers And you say we deny all the Ordinances of Christ and you say we do not honor the Magistrâ—tes nor are subject unto Authority but are disturbers and breakers of the peace which is false The first accusation You say we deny Repentance Ans. And this is false for Repentance is the gift of God and this gift we have received and his free grace which teacheth us to deny all ungodliness and worldly lusts Tit. 2.12 by repentance we have forsaken sin as it was discover'd to us by the Light of Christ which he hath enlightned us withall and so the mercies of God we have found according to his promise and are sent of the Lord to preach Repentance to all people who would have all men come to repentance and to the acknowledgement of the truth that they might be saved 2 Tim. 2.25 And with the Word of the Lord as they are moved of the Lord do many go now with this Doctrine into your streets into your markets into your synagogues and into your cities to call you to repentance before the wrath of the Lord come upon you and both sons and daughters now are sent to preach this Doctrine amongst you from the Lord and for obeying the Lord herein are they reviled by you and persecuted and falsly accused And thâ—s is left for a Testimony against you from the Lord and shall bear witness against you The second Accusation is That we deny Baptism Ans. The Baptism of Christ we own which all the Saints were baptized into which was by one spirit into one body as in 1 Cor. 12.13 and by this baptism we do witness the washing away of sin not onely the washing avvay the filth of the flesh but the answer of a good conscience towards God But sprinkling of Infants vve deny which there is no Scripture for And all you who from your imagination do imitate Johns Baptism and so go into the vvater and say you are believers and have right to the Ordinances of Christ but you to be believers we deny vvho are not yet come to repentance and your Water-baptism vvhich is but an imitation from the letter for the Lord never sent you forth nor commanded you either to preach or baptize as they did vvhom you go about to imitate vvho are not yet come to repentance nor to the first principle of the doctrine of Christ nor to ovvn the light of Christ in your consciences which should exercise them and lead you to vvait upon God and lead you to repentance And the Faith of believers you know not for the mysterie of Faith is held in a pure conscience 1 Tim. 3.9 vvhich you cannot vvitness which hates the Light of Christ vvhich should exercise your consciences and so your minds and consciences are defiled and vvith that mind you talk of faith and of the Ordinances of Christ and of Water-baptism vvhich serveth unto us for a figure as the Apostle saith 1 Pet. 3 21. And Jesus Christ was baptized by John by water that he might fulfil all righteousness Mat. 3.15 And John was a Prophet and Christ is the end of the Prophets and Johns baptism was but a figure for he said he did but baptize with water but Christ is the end of all figures types and shadows and did fulfil them for he fulfilled all righteousness and Johns Ministry and Johns baptism and he that fulfilled all righteousness the same baptizeth which John did bear witness unto and all men came unto him Joh. 3 16 but he baptized none with water But this is a mysterie to thy dark mind which knows not the baptism of Christ nor Johns doctrine nor Jesus Christ the true Light which enlighteneth every one that cometh into the world vvhich John bore witness unto John 1.9 but goes to hold up the types and figures which Christ came to fulfil and so deniest Christ to be come in the flesh to fulfil all righteousness and so thou art an Antichrist who holds up the figures which Christ came to fulfil and so thou denies the Scriptures and Christ who said he came to fulfil all righteousness and the Saints baptism thou art ignorant of which is by one Spirit into one body 1 Cor. 12.13 And Paul who was a Minister of Christ and preached the Gospel did bring many into this baptism and he was not sent to baptize with water but to preach the Gospel and all the Churches which he preached unto came to witness Christs baptism with the Holy Ghost and with fire by one Spirit into one body and were baptized into Christ who was the head of the body Rom. 6.3 and by this baptism we are thus washed from all filthiness of flesh and Spirit but your imitated baptism of water we deny who live in your filthiness of flesh and spirit whose minds and consciences are defiled but the baptism of Christ we
which did not abide in the Truth he is separated and distinguished from the Father eternally but so is not the eternal Son of God for he is in him John 17.11 John 17.21 22. And again I say False Prophets and Hirelings are from the beginning and from Eternity distinguished from the Father and the Son but so is not the Spirit of Truth So I leave it to that of God in all people that with it they may see and know which to believe for Christ saith I and my Father are one and he is not Christ without God Therefore that damnable doctrine is denied which saith That Christ the Eternal Son of God is distinguished from the Father eternally For few in this Nation are so blind besides Priest Clapham as either to affirm or believe such a thing or that there is three Subsistences and but one being Is not a Subsistence a Being Therefore if any other of the Priesthood in Norfolk have joined with Clapham in his Book or do own him in these things cover your faces together and be ashamed that your impudency and blindnesse do not lead you any more to blaspheme Again Clapham saith concerning the soul in pag. 21 That the soul came indeed from God but was not of the Being of God and that the soul is humane And when I asked him Whether the soul was not immortal He said Yea Humane and Immortal were both one To this I answer Ans. Wo is unto that people whose Leader is a fool blind and ignorant of God of the Son of God and of the soul of man of the Scriptures what they speak concerning these things Now if humane and immortal be both one then every man that is come into the World hath a humane body then the bodies of all men that are come into the World are immortal as well as the soul. But for your sakes who are led by such I say The first Adam was made a living soul the second Adam was made a quickening spirit 1 Cor 15.45 And you all have a Light from the second Adam with it to see what the soul is which was made living and how again by Christ the quickening Spirit it comes to be restored into the same Life and with the Light of Christ you will see the soul and see the Life which from Christ is manifest to quicken it up to the living God and so then you will know the Scriptures and the power of God and that the Scriptures speak not of a humane soul. Now the Ministers of Christ which are sent to turn people from darkness to lâ—ght and from the power of a Satan unto God they are to watch over the souls of those who are turned to the Light therefore you all in the Light wait to knovv the soul and know the power of God which raiseth it up out of the death and then you will be wiser than your Teachers as David was and then you wil not come short of the promises which the Father hath promised even the sure mercies of David So in the Light all who wait upon God come to the knowledge of the Son of God and of the Soul which is to be watched over and then you come to that which is sure even to the knowledge as David did over all your Teachers and so you wil come to know the key of David which will open unto you that which is sealed up from your Teachers and so come to know the one shepherd and the one sheepfold and the green pastures as David fed in and then you wil not need the Priests meanings being wiser then they you having the key of knowledg which they and the Lawyers have lost as Christ hath said Matth. 23 13. shutting up the Kingdom of Heaven against men and from men now as the Pharisees did then so that you need not say there were such then but where are there now any such I shall shew you one as John Clapham in the 37. page of his Book saith That Heaven is not to be enjoyed vvhile vve be in the flesh here Novv see vvhether he hath not shut it up from all men vvhile they are here But Christ vvho vvas annointed of the Father to preach the Gospel to the poor said not so for he said unto his Disciples Blessed are ye poor in spirit for yours is the Kingdom of Heaven Luke 6.20 Mat. 5 3. it was theirs and they did enjoy it neither did Christ shut it from the Pharises but said unto them The Kingdom of Heaven is within you Luke 17.21 And if they had believed his words they might have enjoyed and been Heirs of it as the believers were And the Ministers of Christ were to preach as they went saying The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand and so they were not to shut it up from men as the Hypocrites did and false Teachers which say It cannot be enjoyed while men are here And here it appears that they shut up the Kingdom against men and neither enter in themselves nor suffer others Matth. 23.13 for if they entered in themselves then they could not deny but that it might be enjoyed And here is the Scripture fulfilled Matt. 13.19 they shut up the Kingdom of Heaven against men saying None can enjoy it here but Heaven is God's Throne and the Kingdom of Heaven is within you and so here as God hath said I will dwell in them and walk in them and they shall be my people and I will be their God And the Seed of the Kingdom was sown and was reaped amongst the Churches and it was in them that would not enter in it themselves nor suffer others as a grain of Mustard-seed and in others it was as Leaven hid in three measures of Meal And so the Kingdom was preached and the Gospel in every creature and there were parables of the Kingdom and the World had it in the Parables in them but they that did believe had it in them in the power in the power out of the parable He that hath an ear let him hear what the power speaks then shall be witnessed that vvhich is written both of the Povver and of the Kingdom Again the said Clapham hath charged God and Christ falsly in his Book as that Christ dwells in his people tvvo vvays first by his special spiritual presence Secondly By mystical union and that is more than the former bringing this comparison That one may dwell in a House and have no union with it and saith That God dvvells in the Heavens but hath no union vvith them and that the union betvven God and believers cannot be comprehended by the Saints here as in the 24 â—h page of his Book Ans. Now let all take notice and with the measure that God hath given you to judge whether Christ can dwell in his people by his special presence and have no unity with them as he hath affirmed And again judge wheâ—her a mystical union be more then his special presence as
he hath affiâ—med And again consider that Heaven is God's Throne and the place of his rest And whether God can dwell in the Heavens and have no unity with them with his own Throne and with the place of his rest And consider whether there was ever such a doctrine preached or believed among the sons of men from Abel unto this day there is no record of such a Doctrine neither in the Scriptures Histories Heathens Pagans nor others therefore it is now fit to be recorded or put in Chronicle that all may see what a doctrine is crept into the World and that all may see that Night is come upon all such Prophets that they have no vision nor knowledge of God nor his wayes And this is the man that hath set himself to oppose and gainsay the truth and is a daily reproacher of those that walk in it yet professeth himself to be a Minister of Christ and those whose hearts are upright towards God is he reviling comparing them to Papists Hereticks Scribes and Pharises Indians and such like but to none of those in these things before-mentioned neither to Scribe Pharisee Pope Turk Indian or Alcaron can he be compared for they have been all restrained by something of God in them from writing so blasphemously against God and Christ and the Holy Ghost the Soul Heaven and Union and the Saints as he hath done And so this is another Gospel than that which was preached by Christ and his Apostles and so by the Spirit of God to be accursed for ever And whereas he saith That the union between God and believers cannot be comprehended by the Saints here he charges a lye upon the Saints and speaks contrary to the Scriptures 1 Joh. 1.7 1 Joh. 4.15 1 Joh. 5.20 for the Saints did witnesse union with God here for he that sanctified and they that are sanctified were one they said they were of God and the whole World lyeth in wickedness as he is so are we in this present World they comprehend with all Saints the heighth and length and the breadth of the love of God while they are in the world Now whoever would have believed it that the teachers in England had been so blind or durst have spoken so contrary to the Scriptures they professing them so much to be their rule and learning so long and studying so much to get the Letter of them but now is found both out of the Letter and Life but now the day of God is risen in his peoples hearts and they are seen to be such before their books come forth and now that which they were judged to be before they published themselves in print comes forth that all the world may see that the judgment of God is true from his servants upon them and that all the Rulers of the Nation may see that such are not fit to be held up but be cried against and if any should by a Law give such the tenth parts of mens estates they may expect that by the righteous Law of God ten parts of theirs may be taken away and given to strangers so if any people maintain this doctrine they maintain that which the curse of God comes upon and if they come not out from it will be partakers of the plague And again as concerning Hell Clapham saith that men are not in Hell while they are upon earth And here is another lye Answ. The Prophet said while he was upon earth thou hast redeemed my soul out of hell and Jonah said Out of the belly of hell cryed I unto thee and so the believers doctrine was contrary to Claphams for they knew both heaven and hell while they were upon earth and a redeeming out of the one into the other by Jesus Christ. Again he accuseth Peter saying that he speaks of the divine Nature being communicated to the Saints but understands divine graces Answ. The Apostle doth not speak one thing and understand another as the Priests do for he speaks with the Spirit and with understanding and knows how to divide the word of God aright who spoke unto them that had escaped the corruption which is in the world through lust and knew what it was to be partakers of the divine nature but herein the wickedness of this Priest is manifest who would keep people from being made partakers of the divine Nature and would shut up the kingdom of heaven from men while they are upon earth Again he accuseth the Corinthians in the 33. page of his book to be the ancient Hereticks who were baptized for the dead Ans. Those who were baptized for the dead was no Hereticks neither did they deny the resurrection of the dead though Paul said How say some among you that there is no Resurrection of the dead yet he did not call those that were baptised for the dead Hereticks for those that were baptised for the dead and stood in jeopardy every hour did believe the resurrection of the dead and did wait for it and did not deny it as Clapham saith who hath proceeded on in his book with many of the like false accusations against us also but it is a small matter for us to be judged by such a one for herein is but Christs words fulfilled As they have done unto me so shall they do unto you for neither Christ nor the Apostles nor the Church of God hath escaped his accusation for Luk. 6.26 Wo unto you saith Christ when all men speak well of you for so did they of the false Prophets but blessed are you when men shall speak all manner of evil against you falsly for my names sake for great shall your reward be in heaven now though against us all manner of evil be spoken falsly in the Book before mentioned yet in truth do we stand out of it all and over it all and our accuser is found in the evil and vve clear And as for the 13. Sect. wherein he hath wearied himself for very vanity hath he proved nothing against us but against himself in which he hath said that we are enemies to the holy Scriptures and deny Christ come in the flesh also his death and resurrection and that we have said that Christs flesh perished and that we own not the man Christ in the Heavens as pag. 11. and chargeth us to say that he did not ascend into heaven is not at the right hand of God shall not come to judge the world pag. 12. Again Whereas Clapham saith we deny prayer the Lords Supper and Water-baptism and giving of thanks at meals and singing of Psalms Ans. This is false as his own writing and confession will witness against him which in a former Letter said that I prayed three times at one Meeting and now in this book saith we deny prayer Here confusion is grown into impudency and lyes are made his proofs Again he saith we deny the â—ords Supper yet confesseth we own eding on Christs flesh Now Christ saith
Except ye eat my flesh and drink my blood ye have no life in you And this is his Supper in eating of which the creature hath life in himself Therefore fly from idolatry I speak unto wise men judge what I say the cup of blessing which we bless is the Communion of the blood of Christ and the bread which we break is the Communion of the body of Christ For we being many are one bread and one body for we are all partakers of that one bread 1 Cor. 10.14 15 16 17. For the bread of God is he that came down from Heaven and giveth life unto the World John 6.33 Then said they unto him Lord evermore give us this bread and Jesus said unto them I am the bread of life he that cometh to me shall never hunger and he that believeth on me shall never thirst John 6.34 35. I am the living bread which came down from heaven if any man eat of this bread he shall live for ever and the bread that I will give is my flesh which I will give for the life of the world v. 51. But the Jews could not belive this neither can this Priest but saith we own feâ—ding on Christs flesh but deny his Supper and so as blind as they But by the life which we receive in eating of his flesh and drinking of his bloud are we manifest to be of those that feed at his Table and cannot have communion at the Table of Devils as the Church of God could not 1 Cor. 10.21 Again He saith that we own baptism with the spirit but deny baptism with water I answer Who come to the baptism with the spirit into one body they are come to the one baptism which the Saints witnessed not laying again the doctrine of baptism which waâ— several but witnessing the one the substance of the other which was necessary to salvation so all those things in which the substance was signified whether circumcision or water is not denied in their time and place when the obedience in them was from the command of the spirit and not from tradition but people now in the ignorance of God and his ways take up things by tradition being both out of the command and out of the substance and such deny the substance where it is witnessed as for this Priest Clapham he hath never ministred water baptism as it was ministred when it was a doctrine from heaven for there is not one in all his Congregation that had first received the holy Ghost nor believed in Christ before he baptised them with water and so both the substance and the figure is denied in him so that in that in which he would accuse another without ground is he upon good ground found guilty And as for denying to give thanks that is false for we are bound in spirit to give thanks always to the Father who hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the Saints in light and whether we eat or eat not we give God thanks and this we are come to witness to pray without ceasing and in all things give thanks for so is the will of God concerning us and in us is it fulfilled and we sing with the Spirit and with understanding also but such take Davids conditions which waâ— made manifest unto him in the sure mercies of the Lord to him and sing his deliverances whose soul is yet in the pit and sing his prophesies who never knew the spirit of prophesie in themselves and say they have roared all the day long by reason of their sins when as they have roared all the day long in fulfilling their sins and iniquities and for the scorners to say they have no scornful eye and for the proud to say they are not puft in mind such singing we deny which is without the Spirit and without understanding also For light is sown for the righteous and joy for the upright in heart so to the light with which Christ hath enlightned every one that cometh into the world I speak which tends to uprightness of heart and unto holiness without which no man can see the Lord those things which are reprovable are made manifest in the Liâ—ht and that which doth make manifâ—st is light which all who be out of it is in darkness and know not whether they go nor what they profit as many now in these days being kept from the light and gate of truth by the doctrines of men and so never come to read in the Lambs book of life which first all must come to know the vials poured forth upon the earth upon the Beast and his works and his sear which is found standing in all them who be from the light they be enlightned withal But the hour is coming and now is when all they that be upon the face of the earth may see the appearance of the Son of God and may receive his power in the measure which his Father hath given them to receive him in therefore every one who comes to see with the light of the Son of God enter into thaâ— which you see to be of him and out of that which you see to be of the World that so the everlasting righteousness and peace you may possess in your obedience to what is made manifest that you may come to see and favour the things of God from those things that be of the World and as every one walks in the light you will be as a sweet smelling sacrâ—fice unto the Lord and knowing and feeling the power of â—he Lord with it the everlasting door vvill be opened and the vvell-springs of life to the feeding of the plants of God with the uncorruptible food which is every word which proceedeth out of the mouth of the Lord vvhich vvill be received as that of God in every particular is kept single Again The Priest in his 3 4 5. Section saith That we deny the doctrine of the Trinity and that we hold equality with God and the soul be â—ne being with God and corrupt the doctrine of justification Answ. For a Trinity of persons there is no such docâ—â—â—ne in the Scriptures neither the vvord three Persons nor Trinity and so three distinct one from another eternally as he hath held forth saying Christ is the eternal Son of God distinct from the Father eternally and the Spirit is distinguished from the Father and the Son eternally This is a Tradition of men taught for a doctrine but no doctrine and in denying of that vve do but deny Claphams tradition but as for the Father Word and Spirit which bear record in heaven these three are one and vvas never separated eternally for Christ in the days of his flesh vvhen he vvas in the vvorld said I and my Father are one and said I in them and they in me that they may be one as we are one John 17.11 22. and so this doctrine of the unity of the Father Word and Spirit
vve ovvn and vvitness and as for our equality or unity vvith God vve that believe in him are one vvith him as the Scripture saith and as Christ prayed for us that believe John 17.21 that we might be one in him and in the Father and unity vve must confess for that is a doctrine â—ffirmed by the Apostles of Christ that as he is so are vve in the vvorld and he that sanctifieth and they that are sanctified are both one and so vve deny no doctrine but vvhatsoever is a doctrine vve vvitness it And to say that vve corrupt the doctrine of justification that is false for vve are freely justified by his grace and so do vvitness the doctrine of justification and vvho are true vvitnesses of it do not corrupt it but if vvhile vve seek to be justified by Christ vve our selves be found sinners is Christ therefore the Minister of sin God forbid Gal. 2.17 but herein doth the Priests of the World corrupt the doctrine of Justification professing to be justified by Christ while they themselves are found sinners and say that God doth account them righteous in Christ but unrighteous in themselves and so would make Christ the minister of sin and to justifie or save his people in their sins and not from them and so by them the doctrine of justification is corrupted and the Scripture perverted and the grace of God by which the Saints are freely justified is turned into wantonness and so by their faigned words in hypocrisie they cast thick clouds and vails of darkness over the peoples mindes to keep them in ignorance of the redemption of their immortal souls which is to be redeeâ—â—d by the blood of the Lamb they saying that the soul came indeed from God but is not of the being of God and yet in the 51. page tels of turning the whole frame of the soul to center in him again if it must centre in him again then it was in him before and so let thy confusion stop thy mouth Now let all consider in the light which comes from the immortal God whether Gods being is not in life and immortality and whether there is an immortal life but from the same being For God breathed into man the breath of life and through the breath of life he became a living soul Now the breath of life came from the life in which the being is and so to the people I say you have a light which comes from the same life in which the soul lived unto God in the beginning before death passed over which light is made manifest to lead out of death into the life from whence it came and to witness again a living soul and the breath of life and so to be wiser then all your teachers and to know him who hath all souls in his hand who breathed into man the breath of life and he so became a living soul and when he doth the evil the anguish is upon it and to feed atop those mountains which you have wandred after in the forgetfulness of God having forgotten God days without number Rom. 2.9 But now the light is come and knowledge begins to increase and shine in the hearts of the children of light to give them the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ and these things live in us Therefore we are his witnesses who is the light and life of men and did only for the seed sake let forth our knowledge of the mystery of God that they may be gathered into the fold among the Lambs of Christ for the day of scattering hath been long but now is the day of gathering begun wherein all they shall rejoyce that fear the Lord. 2 Cor. 4.6 And whereas many other accusations are charged upon us falsly for the name of Christ by the Priest yet seeing Christ the true Prophet hath said it should be so because they know not the Father nor him who hath enlightned every one that commeth into the World therefore can we bear all things being manifest unto God and to all men to be witnesses of those things which he saith we deny His accusations are these That we deny the Resurrection of the body the last Judgment Heaven and Hell Are enemies to all the Ordinances of Christ are not true mortified persons and our doctrine tendeth not to destroy sin That we are the common sink of all Heresies and enemies to civility and good manners Ans. Our doctrine is the same as is testified of in the Scripture of truth and where it is received remission of sins is received it being the same that our Example the first-born amongst many brethren the first begotten from the dead preached vvhich Gospel vve preach to every creature vvhich Gospel is the povver of God and where it is received doth both destroy sin and sanctifie them throughout in body soul and spirit and by it is the members vvhich are upon the earth mortified for this is the povver that raised up Jesus from the dead and doth also quicken out mortal bodies by his Spirit that dvvelleth in us in vvhich the Scripture is vvitnessed which was a Treatise of those things which was knovvn and surely believed amongst the Saints and vvhich saith they that are asleep in the dust of the earth shall rise some to everlasting life and some to everlasting shame and contempt and from â—he true foundation vvitnessing these doctrines vvhich the Apostles did not lay again the foundation of Repentance from dead vvorks and faith tovvards God of the doctrine of baptisms and laying on of hands and of the Resurrection from the dead and of eternal â—udgment Heb. 6.12 for vve having learned vvhat it is to be baptised for the dead deny such as say there is no â—esurrection of the dead the first fruiâ—s of this Resurrection is Christ 1 Cor. 15.22 of which â—hey tâ—at are of Christ are witnesses of these things and they come to know each seed in the light through the figures and through the parables Now in the parables I say to you that seed which you sow in the earth whether it be Wheat or other grain you sow not that body which shall be but God giveth it a body as pleaseth him If it be so in the earthly parable then learn to know the seeds and the nature of them which God giveth to each of them it s own body there is heavenly bodies and earthly bodies â—he glory of the heavenly is one and the glory of the earthly is another and so all being turned to the light which you are enlightned withal you in it will know the things that differ both the seeds the bodies and the glories and so let every one be a witness of what they profess of the things of God for by the Spirit of the Lord have we received the knowledge and so are made witnesses of these thingâ— which our brethren the Prophets and Apostles of Jesus Christ hath testified in the
thing in these Scriptures as that grace is a created thing nor that it is called the new creature but the Apostle saith By grace are we saved through faith and that not of our selves it is the gift of God Now was that grace by which they were saved a created thing if it was prove it by plain Scripture else stop thy mouth for we have searched the Scriptures and we find no such thing but we find that by grace they were saved and that they who are new creatures in Jesus Christ the grace of God was their teacher as it is our teacher to deny all ungodliness and worldly lusts and to live soberly godly and righteously in this present evil world which grace is able to keep the hearts and minds in the knowledge and love of God of all those who are taught by it but is not a created thing Pr. That the principles of Christian faith is established upon the Scriptures pag. 74. Answ. Faith hath but one foundation and all who are believers their foundation is established upon Christ who is the Author of Faith before any Scripture was written Jacob Enoch Abraham Isaac had no Scriptures written to establish their faith upon and when Moses and the Prophets had known seen and believed and from that wrote of him who was the true light enlightning every one that in him very one might believe so every one whether they have the writings of the Prophets and Apostles or not yet they have that in which they are to believe which if they believe not is condemned and believing in the light they come to be the children of the light and here the first principle comes to be known of faith and so the first principle of the doctrine of Christ must be known before the doctrine be profest and so all who know not the first principle of faith are far from the saith and who knows not the first principle of the doctrine is far from a doctrine and so the principle of a thing must be known before the thing but the Scripture speaks of nothing that the Christian faith is to be established upon but upon Christ who was glorified with the Father before the world was by whom all things which now are were made who hath given us of his spirit and to us it is given to believe and suffer for his names sake as it was given those who were his true witnesses before us and they did believe because it was given them to believe by the spirit so faith is the gift of God and many have the Scriptures which have not faith which is the giâ—t of God and they which are turned from the faith are pierced through with many hurtful lusts have the Scriptures and say they believe what the Scripture speaks but this I say that faith is the ground of the Scriptures and not the Scriptures the ground of faith and none can believe in Christ but they who believe in the â—ight which Christ hath enlightned every one withal that cometh into the World and all who own Christs Doctrine who saiâ—h believe in the light that ye may be the children of light which who believe in shall not abide in darkness but shall have the light of life and shall not enter into condemnation but who believe in any thing else their faith is vain they are yet in their sins and he that lays another foundation for faith then Christ let him be accurst Thus having laid before the people some of those things with which his book is filled and for this end do I lay them open that those for whom Christ died and unto whom his love is reached forth to bring them to the Father should not be corrupted with the unsound form of doctrine delivered unto them by their Priest And again as followeth I shall lay down some particulars which he hath held forth as affirmed principles in his book which if you receive his testimony you must believe as your principles also but if you come to try them with the measure of the light that Christ hath enlightned them withal then you will deny both him and them therefore mark them as followeth 1 That the Magistrate is an Officer of Jesus Christ as Mediator 2 That Jesus Christ hath a political and spiritual Kingdom 3 That Christ the eternal Son of God is distinct from the Father eternally 4 That the Spirit was distinguished from the Father and Son from eternity 5 That the Father Son and Spirit are three substances 6 That the soul of man is humane and that humane and immortal is both one 7 That Christ may dwell in his people by his special spiritual presence and have no union with them 8 That God dwells in the heavens but hath no union with them 9 That the union between God and believers cannot be comprehended by the Saints here 10 That heaven is not to be enjoyed whâ—le men are here 11 That the Corinthians who were baptized from the dead were ancâ—ent Hereticks 12 That the light which hath enlightned every man that cometh into the World is the light of reason and understanding and is natural 13 That natural light is the remainders of Gods image in man 14 That God is a respecter of persons 15 That the grace of God is a created thing and that it is called the new creature 16 That the principles of Christiaâ— faith is established upon the Scriptures I having here answered and laid open those things which is a mist of darkness over the peoples minds and understandings whereas they are either received or believed to the end that all who read it may come to that understanding which is a well-spring of life and to the knowledge of that truth by which iniquity is purged out and to the counsel of God in the heart which is like deep waters whereby judgment in righteousness comes to be set up by which the simple and tender-hearted comes to be preserved out of the snares of subtilty and craftiness to walk in the light of the Lord which is the path of the iust and the way of life and all they are blessed with spiritual blessings that walk in it for they shall be able to tread upon Scorpions and the deadly poyson that is under the tongues and in the hearts of the generation of Vipers and Serpents shall not hurt them and this power shall all those be indued with which believe in the light of the Lord answering that of God in all their consciences which leads into a chast conversation before the Lord ordering their conversations aright in his sight and all such who be turned to the light with which they are enlightned by Christ shall discern who serves God and who serves him not in this day when many profess him but few serve him in spirit and in truth as he will be worshipped by them whom he hath chosen Necessary Questions propounded to the Priests to be answered 1 WHat is that in every man which
the sight of the bird Try all things by measure of the spirit hold that which is good A friend to righteousness I am and a lover of thy soul. R. H. IN thy former Book thou hast been proved to deny the Father Son and Spirit and denied that there is any thing in thee above nature And in this book also thou hast made it manifest to be guided only by the naturall senses and so to be sensuall having not the Spirit and so in this thy sensual wisdom without the Spirit of God thou goest about to prove us to be the Harlot and to be upon two dangerous designs the first by our Doctrine the second by the Sword First as from our Doctrine to prove it thou bringest four particulars as first that wee say That the peoples soules understanding and reason were carnall fleshly and unto condemnation To which I answer All people which hate the light of Christ as thou dost and set up reason and imagination to be their guide knows nothing above nature in them their senses are reprobate and their understandings darkened and their reason carnall and fleshly which is for condemnation with the light and to those that were sensual whose reason was carnall and flâ—shly did the Apostles minister condemnation as thou mayst read in the Scripture and yet that proved them not to be harlotâ— but their design in their Doctrine was to exalt Christ which is the true light and lighteneth every one that cometh into the World and our design is the same against which no inchantments lyes nor fals accusations from Priest or Atheists can prevail The second particular wherein thou would prove us to be the Harlot and our design to be dangerous is because we say That Christ lighteneth every one that cometh into the world And to this thou thy self in the fifth page of thy Book confessest to be a truth cleere from Scripture and that this light discovers to every one that will both good and evill and in the fourth page thou callest this particular That Christ hath lightened every one that comes into the World a pure truth and yet thou would make the people believe that we were the Harlot for holding forth the pure truth and so thy own breath as fire shall devouâ— thee And hereby the pure truth of God which we hold forth is cleared and thou broken to pieces by the stone upon which thou fallest But all the Atheisme and all the Priesâ—s doctrine cannot make the people so blind as to believe that holding forth the pure truth of God will make us to be an Harlot or our design dangerous and here thou hast manifested â—hy spirit that all may see what we are accused for and by whom being accused to be harlots hereticks deceivers and deluders blasphemous and dangerous because we hold forth the pure truth of God according to the Scriptures yeâ— so far hath God turned the wise backwards and made their wisdom foolishnesse that even our enemies and accusers are forced to confesse that it is holden forth to the pure truth according to the Scripture for which we are accused as T. Winterton hath done to his owne shame and confusion The third particular from which thou would prove us to be the harlot and our designs dangerous are in these words which thou sayest thou gathered from our Doctrine That whatsoever believers in this light it is as a fire and a hammer to break and consume all carnall lust and fleshly and selfish desires whatsoever that now they cannot sin Ans. Here thou hast gathered that which we have not strewen and in thy imaginations thou hast gathered thy evill thoughts conceiving of that which never was spoken from us as thou speakest it and now they cannot sin But this I say that he that believeth in the light and follows Christ who is the light shall have the light of life and shall never come into condemnation if he abide in the light which comes from Christ the Word which is as a fire and a hammer which where it dwels consumes all carnall and fleshly lusts And hereby it is easily known who have the word from them who have but the letter And whereas thou sayest that light is but to discover and not active at all here thou hast shewed thy self to be ignorant both of the light and of the Scripture which saith the light of Israel shall be for a fire and it shall burn up and devour his thorns and bryers in one day And this light was witnessed to burn and consume that which is contrary to it and whereas thou sayest that if we will be purged we must seek somthing else for light will not doe it I answer God is light as in 1 John 1.5 and Christ is the light John 8.12 and if God and Christ who is the light will not do it then what else must people seeke unto to be purged And again thou sayst thou deniest that light or any thing within man or without man doth or ever did so cleanse purifie and make perfect the souls of men and then thou addest to make up thy darke saying as that it were safe and convenient to allow them no other guide or director but the dictates of their own light spirit within them As for the latter thou mayst take it to thine own for we deny all those which walks after their owne whether thou call it light or dictates for that which is their own is darknesse and not light but those that follow the light of Christ and deny that which is their owne for his sake we owne And as for thy former to deny that light or any thing within or without man doth or ever did cleanse or purifie and make perfect the sons of men let all here take notice of thy Atheisme who hath denied Christ and his light either either within or without men to do it The fourth particular by which thou would prove us to be the Harlot and our designes dangerous is in these words That now the Scripture is no more a guide for us to walk by nor nothing without them but the light within them and that seeks after any other guide but that within him is in the flesh still Which words are thy one and was not so spoken by any of us But to thee I say that the Scripture which did foresee that which we now do see we owne to be one with the light which was before the letter and to be our guide in the way of truth and this guide is within us but by the Scripture letter without thee thou neither sees nor foresees the things which belong to eternal life which if ever any come to see it must be by the light of Christ within them and all who own this light and with it is guided cannot deny the Scriptures which was spoken forth from the light within Again thou wouldest accuse E. B. to be changing in his doctrine from one thing to another
do them professe and have the form power and effect of what we doe profess and so the mark of the harlot returns upon thy self which is to presume without the spirit The first mark her attendance the ignorant and the lewd Answ. If this be the mark of the Harlot try thy selfe for who is more ignorant than he that wants the infallible spirit as thou confesseth thou dost For this marke of the harlot thou cleares us from in the sixth page of thy book who there accuseth us of subtilty and in the 16 page of ignorance and so thou multiplies thy confusion and ignorance And for lewdnesse thou may own the guilt of that thine self for if thou were not both lewd and mad in thy divinations thou would not have so false accused those that have the spirit of God confessing thy self not to have it but that it is that thy folly may more speedily be made manifest unto all men that the Scripture upon thee may be fulfilled The sixth mark her kinred and that 's the Ranters which thou sayest is the mark of the Harlot Herein thou hast numbred thy self thy own testimony being a witnesse to it and thy guide which is thy naturall senses and corrupt reason knowing neither light nor spirit of Christ within and therefore no restraint thou knows from thy divers lusts but both the Ranters and thou in your sensuall liberty is found and by us you are both denyed for from that kinred we are redeemed and from all harlots marks The seventh mark is she is the youngest of all Harlots little above five yeares old Ans. If thou would prove us to be the Harlot from the youngness of years as little above five then thou must deny that which thou hast asserted against us in the 13. page for there thou would prove us to be false Prophets from those fruits that Christ spoke of Mat. 7.15 And if thou prove any thing against us from that in Mat. 7. then it is not from the yongnesse of years for that is above five yeares since so these confusions I return unto thee again that thou may see that blindnesse and confusion is the signe of the Harlot Now as in answer to thy Queries Query 1. WHether it be not lawful to presuppose things 〈◊〉 are not to find out the truth of things that 〈◊〉 And if so then c. Ans. It is not lawful for thee to intâ—nde into things 〈◊〉 thou hast not seen vainly puft up in thy fleshly mind 〈◊〉 that goes into things that art not to find out the truth of 〈◊〉 that are goes from God the Truth that is into a lye and 〈◊〉 presupposing things there is not lawful neither canst thou 〈◊〉 ought there for nought brings forth its like being gone 〈◊〉 God that is 2. Whether there had been any need of Christ's coming in the 〈◊〉 Adam had stood in his created estate Ans. Christâ—s coming in the flesh is that everlasting 〈◊〉 in which the Creation stands and in which Adam had his 〈◊〉 estate and so there was need of that which gave Adam 〈◊〉 being and recovery The third and fourth Whether Christ restored to believers any 〈◊〉 then Adam lost And whether there be any ground to believe that 〈◊〉 in this life hath more communion with God or are more pure or perfeâ—â— than Adam was in Paradise Ans. Art thou got above the Innocency in thy imaginations and hast the ground of thy belief to seek First come down out of thy imaginations that thou mayest feel the ground of Faith till then thou art no believer and thereby be led up into a perfect state to have communion with God in Paradise till then thou art not in that whâ—ch Adam lost and cannot understâ—nd an estate above nor believe it though it be told thee that which now enquires must lose its life ere thou come into Paradice God's secrets must not feed Serpents 5. Whether Adam in Paradise did not partake of that Light with which Christ lighteneth every one that cometh into the world Ans. The life of Adam in Paradise is the same that is the light of the World wherewith he lightneth every one that cometh into the World and of this Adam did partake in Paradise which gave him Light and Understanding which when he went into the selfish knowledge he became brutish and this is a witness against him 6. Whether this Light of Christ and all other Lights within man if any there be are not seated in the understanding and mind And whether all mens surest Light is not conveyed through the sences to the understanding And whether this will not more clearly appear if considered thae stopping of the current of the sences the understanding becomeâ—h totally dark as unto certainties it having nothing there to nourish it but imagination Ans. In this thou shews thy confusion with thy many lights but hast lost the knowledge of the true Light and so utters thy darkness first asks if the Light be not seated in the understanding and then asks if it be not conveyed through the sences to the understanding but the surest Light is conveyed by faith thereof born in the understanding and not by thy sence and to thy wits end that is carnal must thou come if this thou learn for the mysterie is held in a pure conscience and not in thy sensual understanding and who knows this hath their understanding enlightened by faith and not by the current of the natural sences 7. and 8. Whether it argueth not darkness in the understanding to determine any thing real or certain which was not conveyed by the sences to the understanding Whether for want of this consideration many have not been possessed with as strong a confidence of a certainty as all their powers both of soul and body could procure yea to the laying down of their lives and yet a meer imagination Ans. To determine any thing before the Lord argues darkness in the understanding But what he reveals in the Spirit of Faith and leads unto by his light and not by the sensual understanding and for want of this consideration have many been possessed with a strong confidence of a certainty and not having found their ends therein have turned back again into deceit ready to conclude there is no God because he would not answer their imagination who determined things in their own wills before the guidings of his Spirit and see if hereof thou be not guilty 9. Whether John Lilburn was not as confident that God owned him in his Religion opposing the Powers of the Nation as Saul was in his design to Damascus And whether Sauls conversion to a Christian and John Lilburns resolving to a Quaker be upon one and the same ground Ans. That John Lilburn was confident in his Religion is plain else had he not so long been deceived and that God owned him in opposing many of the unjust Powers of the Nation is as plain else had not he lived to have been
many ancient Errors as he saith brooded by some Modern Writers when as the Doctrine of Christ the Apostles we bear witness to by the same spirit not to any other Authors who were without the Spirit of Jesus all these shifts saves not the Priests of England from being discovered their deceits abominations to be made manifest by our Light and Doctrine which is the Light of Christ and the Doctrine of the holy men of God before us And further his wickedness appears by reproaching and reviling dead men such as H.N. Jacob B.W.E. with others whom I confidently believe were men in their Generation more honest than himself and more upright with God and sincere in what was made known to them then this same reviler who is set to revile both living and dead if they do but crosse his fancy Let all men take notice of these things and of his rebukes with an evil heart whom the Lord doth and will rebuke by the Spirit of his mouth in the day of his just judgmens who art a reviler of the just both living and dead and all alonge in that Epistle as in the rest of his Book which is the Rebukes of a Reviler he bends his very tongue as the poyson of Aspes being under it against the Quakers reckoning them with the Papists and such others but this is but as the Pharises his fore-fathers did who numbered the Son of God and condemâ—ed him with transgâ—essoâ—s and betwixt two thieves And in the end he desiers his Reader to receive in love what in his Book is found agreeable to the Spirit of God in Scripture truth agreed so let it be and therefore many things in his Book which is not given forth by the Spirit of God nor according to the Scripture truth which the honest Reader may find upon a serious reading and search with the Spirit of God according to the Scripture is to be judged and condemned not reeeived what shall the honest Reader receive this for truth That the Light of Christ Jesus is A Perverse Principle and that Christ blâ—ssed infants Baptism with very many such like things of the like nature proceeding from the same spirit which is proved not to be of God but of the Devil for every tree is known by his fruit every spirit by its works words many other things more devilish if more devilish can be he charges us withal in a most unreasonable manner that our Religion is the Fort of Babel and that Jesuitical Plots and Designs are carried on by some of us and Quakerism is built upon the fourfold pillar of Papistry with such like the very transcribing of his words shewes his wicked spirit by his unsavoury words which things we do deny in the presence of the Lord and are cleare in his sight from these devilish accusations though J. S. play the Devils part in this Epistle as well as in his whole Book is an accuser of the brethren is to be cast out and judged with the life of God and to give testimony against his lyes and slanders is sufficient Answer the next time he enterprises the like Work we demand of him witness of his words what these Jesuitical plots and Designes are we do carry on Which slander is so divelish could he prove what he sayes his words would take away our lives but to raise the uncleane spirit against us though the Nations is truly supposed the purpose of his words and not being content with what he himself can believe us in his work reaches to raise the rage of whole Nations to execute their fury as well as his own upon us and so his words gives ground to all the wicked that doth believe him for none else can to persecute the people way of the Lord under the false account of being Plotters of haveing ill Designes which thing we stand witnesse against seek the peace of all men though he have bent his tongue for Lyes and brazen'd his face to utter them without fear or shame to suggest evil into mens minds that they may harm the upright but it is known by his words what lodgeth in the heart of such a person who thus openly impudently doth slander just men to the taking away of life if any were so divilish to witness lyes and slanders as he is forging of them and declaring of them that to the Protector and his Council too but from these things we being clear are the more ready to bear his Lyes with Patience doth not pray for fire to devour him though he be our enemy and the Lords but rather wishes his returnig from his ungodilness than a destruction upon him in his ungodliness whereas the subject of his matter invented in his mind brought forth into view is a going about to prove that in 22 particulars mentioned by him we do contradict the Scriptures but his ground is false from whence his whole work proceeds for not in any particular of what is mentioned do we contradict the Scripture though his whole work be founded upon this thing of our cotradiction to Scripture and while we be proved in the sight of the Lord we reckon his slanders to be rather a testimony to us that we are of God then a discouraging of us in the wayes of God and we do not allow that J. S. be our Interpreter and the Expositor upon our words for then no question but he will judge out of his prejudicial mind false judgement and pervert the innocent words into contradiction of Scripture and of our selves but to the single mind and Witness of God in every man we appeal for judgement and do in the sight of God commend our selves to every mans conscience and beg not belief of any but know all that be in the Light of the Son of God witness to us and feel our Doctrine to be the Doctrine of godliness reaching to the Witness of God in every one whereby we are a good savour to God in all And though J. S. judge our Doctrine to be Scripture-contradictions yet his judgement is but out of his old lying heart which can bring forth no better than it self even false judgement and lying words which out of it hath plentifully abounded in his false rebukes therefore let the Reader first search into the ground from whence his Work and Judgement doth spring and try if an old lying heart and sinfâ—l wretch as he confesses he is can bring forth good fruit No we matter not what his judgement of us be when as we know the heart is corrupt from whence it doth spring not in the Light of the Spirit of God do we in any one particular insisted upon by him contradict the Scriptures though by his dark mind so he wickedly judgeth of us even as the Pharisees his fore-fathers did judge of Christ to be a blasphemer and a contradictor of Moses and the Prophets who did fulfil them and
tares which men gather which must be bound in bundles and cast into the fire for what is the Chaff to the Wheat or what is all such invented words to the knowledg of the Father Son and Spirit which are one which bear record in heaven and are three that beare witnesse in earth the Spirit and Water and the Blood and these three agree in one and when these are known in their witnesse in man what they witnesse unto and what they witnesse againsti within and without such will give them names according to their works and according to the Scriptures The Third head of John Stelhams Scripture Contradiction is concerning the light which every man is enlightened withall which of all things is most hated by all such whose wayes words works are contrary ot it for it being risen in the hearts of the Children of men to give the knowledge of the truth hath in this day made many wiser than their Teachers and now they which have caused people to err are by the light seen and by the Children of light are denyed and they being denyed their envie is up against the light which hath made them manifest and they walk not by the light nor according to the Scriptures buâ— there is a line of confusion comes over them by which now they walk and from which their writings doth proceed as John Stelham in page 52. saith they may affirm agreeable to the Scripture and yet contradict the Scriptures in saying Christ is in every man or that the light in every man leades to the Father saith Christ God or as God is in every man a spark of his god-head-light is in every man but there is not in every man that redemption light which leads to the Father That light which Christ hath enlightened every man withal leads to the Father all who are led by it and believe in it and condemns all from the Father which do not obey it but hate it and speak dispitefully against it who are turned out from God who is light and truth into the confusion saying that the God-head-light is not the Redemption-light but with the light that Lye and confusion is judged for ever and in affirming that the God-head-light is in every mâ—n and then calling it common and old Creation-light Scripture-light pag. 61. and the light of Nature page 74 75 and a legall light page 76. and a created light page 78. and an universal light unto which I say as God is so is his light so is his god-head not created nor natural and as every one comes to know the light which by J.S. is so reviled they shal neither follow nor believe his Doctrine till he can prove when the light of the God-head was created and how it became natural or legal or where he had those names for the Scriptures doth give no such names to the light so by his own rule he speaking more than is in the Scripture is not a Messenger sent by Gods spirit nor guided by it in what he sâ—ith As also in other things as in Pag 64. saying That light without Sâ—ripture is no light Then Enoch's light in which he walk'd wiâ—h God was no light nor Jacobs light nor Isaacs nor Abrahams for they were without these Writings this letter which he calls the Scriptures but they were not without light And thousands have so much light whether they have the Sâ—riptures or not as to see this darkness as to say light though saving light without Scripture is no light did the Scriptures make the light to be light and was the saving light made by that which was written let all take notice turne away from such in another place he calls the Scripture but the declaration that Christ is the Word calleâ—h them a Vessel that the light is put into in p. 43. 44 Now let them of understanding consider judg whether the vessel be the maker of that which is put into it whether Wine that is put into a Bottle be made wine by the Bottle or whether it is not Wine without the bottle Water put into a vessel be not Wâ—ter without the vessel or whether the vessel make it to be Water J.S. saith Every verse of Scripture is a little vessel of light that light without scripture is no light so these things have I laid open that every one may see how the Lord hath turned wise men backward and made their Wisdom foolishness and that they may see how those stumble and fall and are snared and taken whose light is turned into darkness and hovv great that darkness is and novv is the Scripture not denied but fulfilled for now is the Light and Truth come into the World by which they are found to be blind who said they saw and in which they see that vvere blind And now the depths are seen vvhich are covered vvith darkness and Babylon is seen the Mother of Harlots which bring forth in confusion and bind up in ignorance Other confusions and lyes I shall also mention given forth by J.S. in his Book As p. 68. he saith that God was and is the Word according to John 1.1 and in p. 69. he saith The Father is not the Word nor never so called which is a contradiction And in p. 70. saith Christ is more in the Scriptures than in his Saints vvhich is false for greater vvas that vvhich the vvords came from than the vvords vvhich did but declare of the fulness from vvhence they came as all that know Christ wil bear witness unto and against all such that say Christ is more in the words than in them who spake the words Again in p. 73. he saith Christ the Author of salvation to them that obey him speaking in the Scripture saveth by the Scripture which is false and contrary to the testimony of the Scriptures and the witness of them who witnessed his salvation who said By his Life are we saved and by Grace through faith which was the gift of God and not by the Letter and their Witness was true for God and his Works and against all such who are of a lying heart and spirit of error who would make the Letter to be the Light yea more even that vvhich makes light to be light and so greater for that vvhich makes a thing is greater than a thing that is made and would have the Letter to be the Word when as the Letter saith God is the Word and would make the Scriptures to be that by which people are saved as in p. 73. saying Christ saveth by the Scriptures but the Scriptures speak no such thing of themselves for they say there is no other name under Heaven by which men can be saved but by the name of Jesus neither is there such a word written in the Bible that saith men are saved by the scriptures nor that the Light of the God-head is natural as I. S. saith that he may
set up a light of scriptures as he calleth it And he speaks in p. 82. of having our minds darkned with the light of Scriptures Mark doth that light which he hath in all his Book been exalting above the God head-light above that Light which Christ hath enlightned every man withal darken mens minds What is it then that must enlighten them Here is his testimony of the Light brought up to the ful that all who can receiv it may believ it for he saith to us if our minds were not darkned with the light of the Scriptures the two texts in Rom. 10.18 and Col. 1.23 might resolve us how the Gospel is preached to every creature not to the principle of Light in the Conscience how can the Scripture resolve us of the Light if it darken our minds But by these things this is made manifest that darkness hath blinded his eyes that he neither knows the Light nor the Scriptures which were given forth from it Again Another of his contradictions concerning the Light in pag. 23 24. compared with pag. 75. is this saying the Light that shined in Pauls heart and the Light that shineth in the Scripture is the same Light and God who shineth in the heart by Gospel-light according to the Apostles words 2 Cor. 4.4 contratrary unto which in his 75. page he saith That the Gospel-light about matters of salvation of which the Apostle speaks never entered never shined into mens hearts Ans. To this let all take notice and consider whether of these two Contraries they are to believe The one saying God shineth in their hearts by Gospel-light and the other saith It never entered nor shined into mens hearts But if the Scriptures or the Apostle is to believed he saith For God who-commanded the Light to shine out of darkness hath shined in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ but we have this Treasure in Earthen Vessels that the excellency of the power may be of God and not of us 2 Cor. 4.6 7. Here was the light of the Gospel shining in their hearts in matters of salvation giving them the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ and they were the Vessels in which the light did shine and from which they spoke the hidden Wisdom of God in a mystery and so that which they spoke of the Light and of the Gospel is yet a mysterie unto such whose eye is blinded with the god of this world and the wayes of unrighteousness knowing neither the light nor the Gospel of salvation but filling up their iine of confusion as hath been already manifest and may further be made manifest Again John Stelham in his sixth Head of Scripture-contradiction speaks concerning the Law and goes about to distinguish between the two Covenants which the Scriptures speak of but knows not what he speaketh nor of what he affirmeth but contrary to the Scriptures speaking of a Moral and Ceremonial law which the Scriptures speak of no such words nor no such distinctions as of a Moral law to be the Covenant of Works and thâ—t the Ceremonial law is not a Covenant of Works but of Grace And whereas he tells of a Covenant of Nature which is one with the Covenant of Works and so here is several Covenants which J. S. hath made and several Names here given to the Covenants which God never gave nor they which spoke of the Covenants never gave such names to the law in the words of Scripture as Moral Legal Natural Ceremonial so that is all without and contrary to the Scripture language And whereas he goeth about to prove Adam to be under a moral law wdich he calls a law of Works but hath no Scripture to prove it from but from his suppositions as thus If it was not of Grace it was a Covenant of works And again if the Covenant of works was not made with Adam in innocency God could not in justice require satisfaction of his posterity under the fall c. A third supposition to prove Adam under a Covenant of Works is this Either he stood under a Covenant of Works or was under the Covenant of Grace or he was under no Covenant c. Unto which I answer All such Priests and Teachers who be out of innocency themselves cannot tell what Covenant those are in with God who are innocent and in the Image of God in holiness and righteousness and therefore from such have we so much perverting of the Scriptures and violating of the law of God to make it according to their imaginations But unto such God saith What hast thou to do to declare my Statutes or that thou shouldest take my Covenant into thy mouth seeing thou hatest instruction and castest my words behind thee Psal. 50.16 Thou givest thy mouth to evil and thy tongue frameth deceit But I say That Covenant in which Adam was with God in his innocency and in his image he stood in that and by that by which he was made a living soul and in that was in unity and covenant with God for the disobedience of which he was driven out from God into the earth and none were under the Law of Works neither was that Law added uhtil there was transgression which it was added because of it but that which is innocent and without sin unreproveable in God's sight is under no Law but that which endureth for ever which doth free from sin and death those that be in it which is made manifest unto some since the fallihg from it and which the Isles are to wait for till it be made manifest where it is not alâ—eady revealed and all who come to have right to speak of God's precepts and to take his covenant into their mouths they see and comprehend all such darkness which doth not speak according to words of Scripture but speaks of three Covenants contrary to Scripture saying that the first Covenant promiseth nothing of salvation nor mentioneth nothing of a Saviour and yet saith that that Covenant is a part of God's Word and his Will and pure Law and yet mentioneth nothing of a Saviour and again saith that the Moral Law he calls of Works which promiseth no salvation mentioneth nothing of a Saviour that this which mentioneth nothing of a Saviour is to be a directory and rule to true believers for the ordering of their sanctification as it is also in Christ's hand guiding them by his Spirit so this cannot build nor join together and so time to cease building any more in confusion but in denial of that false doctrine I say That there is but two Covenants spoken of in the Scriptures which is a plain testimony of them without any such confusion or contradiction as the Apostle to the Hebrews saying In that he saith a new Covenant he hath made the first old c. And in the first Covenant as you may read Heb. 9. In all
the Word and means of Grace he is setting up that which before he hath been pulling down in p. 123. where he saith That they are justified from all Legal obligations and conditions of their own workings both within them without them And in page 174. he is setting up obligations and conditions of Reading Hearing Prayer Preaching to which he saith Life and Salvation is promised and so would have salvation come by Works which he hath so much declared against before and so makes prayer reading preaching c. not only the means through which salvation comes but the cause for which they are saved saying To Prayer is promised salvation Now to the informing of the minds of people I say That all promises are to the Seed and the fulfilling of the promises is witnessed through its obedience to Christs command and through the Works of righteousness but none can pray so as to be heard of God and accepted but who have first known heard and believed him whom they call upon which none do but who own thâ— Light which Christ hath enlightened them withal which teacheth to pray hear read and preach with knovvledge and understanding Again J.S. in his tvvelfth head concerning baptism vvould go about to prove the sprinkling of Infants to be the baptism and so denyes both Johns and Christs and the manner of them and sets up another vvhich the Scripture doth not mention as sprinkling Infants which vvho reads his Books may see his proofs by consequences he would have the Scripture speak that which it never mentioneth in plain precepts and so would turn the truth into a lye and so by his own rule in the 68. page of his Book shall he be judged Such Messengers as speak more then is in the Scripture are not sent by Gods spirit nor guided by him to what they say But that all people may come to a right understanding of the Scriptures and that vvhich is testified by them is to come to the Light which Christ hath enlightened them withal which Light was before Ordinances were and vvhich Light gives to see the place of Ordinances and their time vvherein they are to be obeyed for the Light comes from the substance of all the divers vvashings and carnal Ordinances and it leads into the one Baptism vvhich is the substance of that of Water vvhich John vvho vvas a prophet vvas the Minister of and Châ—ist said unto his Disciples John verily baptized with water but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost and with fire but he never commanded them to baptize with water but commanded them to go teach all nations baptizing them into the name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost and although some of the Disciples and Paul for a time did baptize with water yet who shall judge their permission in it although Paul an Apostle of Jesus Christ witnesseth that he was not sent to baptize but to preach the Gospel 1 Cor. 1.17 and thanks God that he had baptized no more of them yet witnessed that they were all baptized with one spirit into one body And J.S. saith To be against Infant-baptism is contrary to Acts 2.28 29. This is false for that Scripture doth not command it nor give president for it let the Reader search if he find any such thing as the Scripture proving Infants baptism but the promise is to as many as the Lord shall call And so he hath fouly belyed the Scripture for if that Scripture be contrary to such who are against Infants Baptism then must he prove from that Scripture Infants baptism to be commanded as prâ—ctised which he cannot do and so is a perverter of the Scripture And it is truth that we do deny brain-imaginations and sprinkling Infants with water But then he rambles over many Scriptures proving the Baptisme of Believers these proofs are impertinent what is this to prove Infants baptisme So that is passed by here as making arguments against believers baptism except one professing that were our present Adversary but in this he is pursued from all the Scriptures he cannot prove in Justice that ever Infants Baptism was either commanded or practised though he craftily wind about never so much in his imaginations and consequences And in the general I answer Much by us hath been written and spoken to this purpose so our judgements in this charge is fully known of which we are not ashamed before men as being fully justified herein in the sight of the Lord. And so as to that particular more need not be said Again in the 12 th Head of Scripture-contradiction as he saith concerning the Lords supper J.S. makes much ado because of our denial of carnal inventions and imitations practised by many in the exercise of that called the supper of the Lord though with one heart and mind we say and witness That Christs flesh and blood is our meat and drink and none have life within them without it yet doth receive it in the spirit and power of God and doth bear out testimony against imitations and false likenesses set up in the World as the wicked and prophane people such as live in pride and wickedness and covetousness both Teachers and people eating a little bread and drinking Wine so many times a year in such a form and manner and way as Christ nor his Apostles never practised such things in and no change wrought among people but both before and after if not in the very time fulfilling all wickedness and unrighteousness in words and wayes and thoughts yet by false suggestion from their Teachers believing vainly themselves to be the better or saints for the practice of such things whereas they do the more thereby vex the Lords soul and grieve his spirit by hypocrisie and deceit this we call carnal inventions and do deny it in the presence of the Lord that it is evâ—l and not accepted of God but condemned in his sight J. S. proves not that any thing which Christ instituted to be practiced among the saints onely ever was practised in the World among such who are not called neither sanctified and this is abomination to the Lord to practise the saints words or ways and have not the spirit of the Father which we cannot see among the people of this age no nor manage them professing to be selected Church-Members but pride and envy abounds among them all and in that spirit of disobedience in which they live to the Ordinances of Christ they have no right to practice that which onely is to be practised among them that have the spirit of the Father and nothing that Christ instituted for his saints do we deny in its life and age but lives are changed and Antichrist hath ruled and even the things which once he instituted your practice of them who are polluted are an abomination to him And this is a full answer in general as to the thing though I pursue him not in every particular word and argument to lay open
one thing more where he charges R. F falsly to speak falshood for saying the priests of England they teach people to sing lyes in hypocrisie this they do and do wiâ—kedly in it and he hath added to their wickedness in denying it to be so for to all people without exception they give to sing I am not puft in mind nor have a scornful eye and they making not exception in giving forth these psalms to sing Some that they give it forth to are puft in mind and have scornful eyes and these they teach to sing lyes in hypocrisie to any honest man this appears true let J. S. shuffle and twist never so much In the 16 th Head concerning Elders and Ordination We do not herein contradict the Scripture but witnesse forth according to it that who are moved by the Spirit of God to watch over the Flock and ordained with gifts thereunto may take the oversight of the Flock wittingly and of a ready mind and not by constraint nor for filthy lucre sake as J. S. and his generation of false Teachers who preach for hire and for gifts and rewards such are not ordained of God to watch over the Flock but run and were never sent and therefore shall not profit people at all and such an ordination we deny who are ordained at schools or by natural arts and sciences to speak their brain-study by a Glass this is by man and not of God and God doth deny it and we testifie against it by the spirit of God and do say The call to the true Ministry and Eldership is not by man nor of man but by the Lord according to Gal. 1.1 yet such a one is approved of all the Saints and go forth not contrary to men who fear the Lord for the spirit of life is one in them that are called and ordained by it and in them that beareth witnâ—ss to truth what such doth approve with the spirit that are called by â—he spirit This is our judgement and the judgement of Truth what ever J. S. or any of his fellows raise up to oppose it and herein we do not contradict the Scriptures he is that lyar in the subject matter on which he treats in the title of the Section In his 17 th Head concerning Ministers Maintenance Concerning this we do no way contradict the Scripture but witnesseth according to it that the Ministers of Christ doth receive freely and gives freely of what they have received from God and haveing planâ—ed a vineyard may eat the fruit of it and keeping a flock may eat of the milk of the flock and when they go into a house may eat such things as are set before them and yet may not be chargeable to any man and this is according to Christs instructions not contradictory to the Scriptures though J. S. be pleased to so stile it but all such who preaches for hire or takes hire for preaching and seeks for their gain for 50 l. or 60 l. per annum or the like from their quarter a Parish or Town and such who take Tithes Gifts and Rewards for preaching which people should not give them except they preached and such who have sums of money and lives in pleasures and vanities and lust and fulness of the Flesh as the Priests of England do this maintenance we do deny and them that act those things we deny to be Ministers of Christ or that any Maintenance by way of Ministry doth belong to such who are greedy dumb doggs and can never have enough as Isa. 5 6. such practises and men we oppose and doth no whit contradict the Scripture but it witnesseth to us herein and against all such and therefore I. S. and his Bâ—ethren the Independeâ—ts who acts such things they contradict the Scripture and so are truly guilty themselvs in action of what they falsely accuse us in words for such who walks in the steps of the false Prophets as he and they doth that preach for hire and takes Gifts and Rewards for preaching are contrary to all the true Ministers of Christ and the Scripture and the Spirit that gave it forth condemns them and much as to this we have publickly spoken and written and so here I need say the less though much might be said to manifest I. S. folly and vanity though they that plant a vineyard may justly eat the fruit thereof yet what is this to purpose he is a thief that eats of the fruit of that which he hath noâ— planted but is hired thither for so much per Sermon or per annum and plants nothing for the Lord he that preaches the Gospel may live of it but this shames I. S. and this Generation of Teachers who many of them might begg bread at peoples doors had they not a Law by violence to compel maintenance from them which thing is a very shame to all righteousness which is practised by most of the Priests of England at this day grievous to be related what unjust Judgements against them for to maintain Ministers so called what is the thing that J. S. pleads for Tithes or an hundred or two hundred pound a year he is a Lyar to say that we contradict the Scripture because we cannot uphold this but must bear witnesse against it so whilst he falsely charges us with contradicting the Scripture in the very same thing he and his Generation are found in this practice contrary to all the Ministers of Christ that ever was sent by him and in the very practice of the Deceivers Antichrists and False-Prophets in making merchandize of people through covetousnesse in preaching for hire and in seeking for their gain from their quarters and this is the very truth let J. S. and all his fellows read their own contradiction to the Example of all the Ministers of Christ in their cuâ—sed practice of Maintenance which is the greatest oppression this day in England and this is their grief against us because God hath opened our mouths to declare against them and to shew their solly and wickednesse unto all people and when the Law of the Land ceaseth to maintain them which will come sooner than they expect then may they beg their bread or perish for want and that is all the fruit that their Vineyard of wilde Brambles will bring forth to them and if every particular of his words should be searched much rottennesse might be let forth but in plainnesse I have spoken as to the truth of things in pleading for truth and in denying the Deceits and the Oppression of Hirelings which I cannot call Ministers Maintenance His 18 th Heâ—d concerning immediate Calling In this we do not contradict the Scripture J.S. is a Lyar herein also but we say Such as are called of God are called by his Spirit and led with it and fulfills the will and work of God in the Spirit and such as are called by the Spirit of God are approved by all the Saints of God who
with the same Spirit bear witnesse to such as are called by it and speaks by it The Ministry of God is not of Man nor by Man but by the Revelation of Jesus Christ which is not learned by natural Arts but received in the Holy Ghost and this the Scripture bears wirnisse to but the Call to the Ministry by natural Learning at Oxford and Cambridge this I deny and trample upon and all your Arts and knowledge and Humane Study and Languages is not able to make a Minister of Christ this I do affirme though they approve one another yet are they not approved of God without his Spirit and they that have his Spirit deny Natural Learning as to be made a Minister of Christ hereby and E.B. his words are owned transcribed by J.S. cited Page 16. in the Warning c. and all that he saith doth not prove that any of the Ministers of Christ were called by the Church or approved unto that work of the Ministry by them who were not called by the Spirit and guided with it he saith the sending of God is two-fold and for this he hath no Scripture to prove it and so holds forth that which the Scripture will not evidence And further he saith he pretends to no such Call of an Apostle if he have not the same Call by the same Spirit as the Apostles had he is no Minister of Christ and in measure he hath confessed to be without the same Call as the Apostles were called with and will not pretend such a Call Again He falsly Charges R. F. with Crucifying the Ministers of Christ which is a Lye and of the Devil though none of us may spare to call Hirelings greedy dumb Dogs and devourers and lazy shepherds and in this we do not contradict the Scripture nor work offence towards God nor our neighbours And he concludes Who of us we or they shall have the worst of it in Conclusion the day shall declare unto that we are willing to come by which we and all the blind Priestâ— of England shall be manifest and we know Lyers such as J. S. shall not have the better who is to us made manifest already to be out of the way and out of the power and life of God His 19 th Head concerning immediate Teaching In this we do not contradict the Scripture as J. S. falsly charges us withal but do say that we are taught of God and needs no man to teach us â—ut as the anointing of God which abides in us and the promise of God is fulfilled upon us Jer 31. we are all taught of God from the least of us to the greatest with whom the Covenant of God is established and this is the cause wherefore we set forth our selves to the World who are yet in the unconverted estate that they also may come to the knowledge of the wayes and teachings of God in the Spirit and may come into the Covenant of peace where none need to say know the Lord but all these are taught of him yea and immediatly too by his spirit and this we do witness and the Lord doth witness with us though the unbelieving heart of J. S. and his fellows cannot believe it but doth gainsay it as being contrary to the Scripture when as themselves doth contradict the Scripture in denying it so proving themselves guilty of what they do accuse us of falsly but this is that their folly may appear to all men as it doth to us and J. S. saith he is yet to learn the promise of the immediate teachings of God to be given to all that are to teach others this doth make it manifest that himself is without the promise of God and is not yet taught of God and so without Gods Covenant being not learned in the teaching of God by his Spirit which is immediate And thus to confound truth he hath by his confession shamed himself and shewed himself to all men to be unlearned in the doctrine of Salvation Further he saith If God had intended to have given teaching immediatly without any medium then would he not have sent Preachers abroad for them to hear mark this mans blinde productions and what impudence is in his heart who holds forth That God intended not the thing to be what be promised should be he promised to teach his people himself and this man holdes forth that he intended it not and so hath no lesse than charged God with Hypocrisie let the Reader mark this but this is the ground wherefore the Ministers and Preachers were and are sent abroad to bring all people to be taught of God by the Spirit and to inform their minds to the gifts of God in them that by the spirit received the knowledg of they might know the things of God which is not known but by the Spirit of God which all the Children of God are led and guided by and they that are not led with the Spirit of God which Spirit is immediate are not the heirs with Christ are none of his let J.S. say what he will or may this we believe and this the Scripture gives testimony of for us and with us Yet further to manifest his folly he saith It is erroneous enough and contradictious to the whole Scripture when R. F. truly tells him saith Thou that art not taught of God shewes that thou speaks a vision of thy own heart and not from the mouth of the Lord let the Reader search where the errour and contradiction to the whole Scripture lyes in these words or whether he hath not proved himself blind and ignorant and in errour and contradicton to the Spirit of God Further he saith Never did any but Gods slayers and Spirit-wounders go about to sâ—parate the Word of God and his breath Now let this be considered Christ did tell them the Pharises who had the words whâ—ch God had spoken by the Prophets that they had never heard â—he voyce of God here he divides or separates betwixt the words and the voyce or breath and was no God-slayer nor Spirit-wounder as thou hast vvickedly and blasphemously laid dovvn thy position vvhere thou hast concluded Christ to be one against vvhom thy vvords are laid dovvn let the Reader prove thy doctrine His 20 th Head concerning Questions In this we do not contradict the Scripture J. S. is taken with a lye in his mouth who hath made it a subject to treat upon for Questions in their places wee own but such as are of the Divell we deny as Christ did who shewed himself as a fool unto all mens wisdom when the subtile Pharisees and others tempted him who vvould not ansvver their crafty Questions though them that questioned in simplicity he did to resolve and satisfie them and informe them in the knovvledg of the Father Then some leaves he hath filled vviâ—h producing some of our Queries out of some of our Books Commenting thereupon and vvould prove them ignorant and unprofitable and the
like but it hâ—d been more just of a better report for him to have ansvvered them and shevved them to be as he saith of them to all people rather than in a manner back bited them and reproached them and not shevving vvherein it lyes and if they be so needlesse and vaine as he saith then the sooner had such a vvise man as he thinks himseâ—f J. S. confuted them by sober and plaine ansvveres but vvhat if our folly in the sight of men be vvisdom in the sight of God aâ—d his vvisdom foolishnnsse vvith God no matter vvhat he say of us vvho hath shevved himself already and confessed truly that his heart is old and lying and sinfull so vve can expect no better judâ—ment from his Pen then what is in his heart but while we are approved in the sight of God we matter not what men say of us especially one that hath set himself to be our enemy and the Lords enemy and I leave the honest sober Queries to be read which he hath falsely branded with Pride and ignorance and such like as this What Rule have you in Scripture for putting off the Hat this is an honest Question which he wickedly slanders with pride And whether is your Gospel free without charge as the Apostles was yea or no These and such other Questions he rails agâ—inst to be ignorant and quarrellous and vain and of the Devil Now it had been more honest to have confuted them in answering discreetly than to have thus branded them And he saith It is one thing to take Hire for Preaching and another thing to preach for hire whereby his scope is to excuse himself if it may be and his Brethren who are Hirelings and would not be counted to preach for hire though he dare not deny lest all men should see his folly but that they had hire for preaching but then let him tell us when or where ever any of them preached and had no hire and then we will believe they preach not for it but such as receive sums of money of one man â—or a Country which would not be given him except he preached to them this same man is a Hireling and preaches because he hath hire aâ—d hath hire because that 's the ground he preaches Further he saith Christs righteousnesse which justifies a believing sinner is not the essential righteousnesse of his God-head and here he hath spoken ignorantly and held forth as if there is two Righteousnesses of Christ which I call for a proof from him for else let him confesse to his shame that he hath added to the Scripture for the righteousnesse of Christ is but one by which all the Saints are justified Further he saith ignorantly enough That which is done accord to the bare letter of the written Command or from a Gift of the Spirit or in a Gospel way from a living principle of grace â—cts of â—olinesse by the Holy Spirit and Faith given stirred up This is a righteousnesse of ours saith he and seems to separate it from the righteousnesse of Christ as he holds forth let men behold his ignorance Further he saith though it be wrought by the strength of Christ in us yet as to Justification Paul would not be fouâ—d in it this for a word mark again Reader canst thou see any thing here but ignorance as if Paul were justified by anoâ—â—er Christ then what wroâ—ght in him to will and to do Furthâ—r he saith Paul counted all things but loss and dung even what he had done or suffered since conversion that he might win Christ. Mark again What was the converting of many hundred of souls by Paul and many other Works of God wrought by him but dung and losse so J. S. holds forth this is ignorance indeed he hath shewed his ignorance by what he hath said and not proved in any thing that concerning Questions we contradict the Scriptures His 21 th Head concerning Civil Honour In this we do not contradict the Scripture by Arguments nor practice but do honour all men in the Lord and cannot respect mens persons nor have them in any admiration for any advantage yea we honour men in reproving them in their unrighteousnesse and J. S. pleads much for civil Honour the Scripture speaks not of Civil Honour and the Question is What this honour is that he calls civil and wherein it may be done and not in transgression nor in respect of persons Magistrates are to be honourâ—d by subjection to their just Commands Requests and Laws and by patient suffâ—ring under their corrupt Laws and evil Commands and not resisting evil yet the person of no man is to be respected for he that doth commits sin and is a transgressour of the Law of God Ministers of Christ are to be respected for their works sake and they desire no honour nor praise of men but know Reproach and infamy is their respect from the men of this Generation And as for Hirelings and Deceivers they are respected of the World but condemned of God and of his Saints and testified against and Parents are to be respected in the Lord by their Children and Masters by their Servanâ—s but where God commands one thing and parents or masters another as it often comes to passe in Christs time as it doth now whether to give respect to God or man this I leave to be judged by sober men that make conscience of what they say And thus in short I give a testimony how we honour and would have all honoured in the Lord and leave J. S. long Discourse to him and his Company and do bear witnesse against the vain Superstition and foolish Customes of this Generation His 22 d Head concerning Swearing In this we do not contradict the Scripture but saith practiseâ—â— according to Christs words Swear not at all which is spoken absolute and without condition and mitigation and he saith we take these words of Christ against his meaning and this is false and wicked too in â— S. who would be seen to hold forth that when Christ said Swear not at all he meant not as he spake for both Christ and the Apostle James were righteous in what they delivered concerning Swearing who forbids all manner of Swearing no cause excepted and we take Christs words according to his mind and doth deny all Oaths and abides in Christ and the Apostles Doctrine and ouâ— yea is so and our nay is so and whatsoever is more commeth of evil and J. S. would plead for swearing before a Magistrate but that Magistrate which fears God and loves his way will believe a man sooner that cannot swear for conscience sake then he that makes no conscience of Swearing and such a one is liker to testifie lyes with Oaths then he that for conscience sake denyes Oaths and in his conclusion he saith scholastically though ignorantly they that wil not expound Scripture by Scripture and compare the precepts and exâ—mples for swearing without prohibition against
rather bewitched And further he saith the light in every man is a poor base beggarly scrap to the Gospel treasure these words are uttered in his hastiness and without either fear or knowledge for he that lighteth every man with the true light of life or of Condemnation is not base beggarly scrapâ— as I. S. saith it is for it brings to the â—nowledge of the Gospel treasure and pearle and not other light and thus whilst he thinks to prove us self-contradictors he proves himself a vilifier and a blasphemer of Christ Jesus the Saviour of the World who lighteth every man that commeth into the World Again he would make this contradiction becâ—use we say every man in hiâ— first state is as a Beast and yet saying every man is lightned but this is not contradiction no more than the former is then he speaks of naturall conscience and sâ—cretly charges us as if we should say it is potent and victorious at last but this is a secret slander of his for we say Christ only is victorious and through him are we made Conquerers and not by natural conscience and he speaks of Gospel conviction to be above the conviction of natural conscience but I would know of him where the Gospel conviction works if not in mens consciences and so in his next let him divâ—de if he can and shew the dâ—fference of such convictions Further he would say that this is contradiction to say thâ—t every man in his first birth may see himself to be natural and yet to say that the light which discovers natural corruptions is not natural but spiritual both these are true for the light shines in darkness which shews the darkness and is not darkness but light and he that câ—n understand that Scripture Iohn 1.5 shall see the truth of both these to be no self-contardiction Further he saith the Scriptures are a rule above the Saints light and unto it and not so their light above the Scripture this is confusion and he knows not whereof he affiâ—ms for the Spirit of God is the the Saints rule and that is greater than the Scriptures and the rule of the Spirit of God is above the Scripture but such as J. S. who talks of Scripturres to be a rule yet acts these things which the Scriptures declare against are but found in deeper hypocrisie for he that is ruled by the Spirit of God walks up in the fulfilling of Scriptures And further J. S. confessâ—d and saith this he knows that he is more brutish then any man and hath not the knowledge of the holy and this is truly â—onfessed his own works manifest his own condition to be true and he confesses he never obeyed natural light as he ought and as he might and this is truly confessed for if he had obeyâ—d that light which he calls natural he would not thus have stumbled at him who hath lightned every man And further he charges a deceit when men will put off that for redemption light which is but old creation light let him charge them that are guilty but yet we say that the same is Redeemed by whom the world was created and this is without any deceit and he that lighteneth every man with the light that is but one he is the Saviour of all that receive him in the light and he is the condemner of all that hate his light this is no self-contradiction but the very truth as it is in Jesus Further â— S. would make it appear if he could that we contradict our selves concerning sin and Christ but his whole Section I leave to be read in his Book and let the wise Reader judge whether his proof be any such thing only his lye will prove what he saith he saith We hold Christ to be in all this is his Lye for we say Christ is not in the Reprobate neither did we ever affirm that Christ is not in the Reprobate and so is not in all neither do we concerning Justification contradict our selves in the Spirit of God though so it may appeare to J. S. blind mind and so would make it appear to others by blind arguments by his own meaning Again J. S. would charge self-contradiction upon us because we bear witness to the New-Covenant and doth say the children of God are taught of God and needs no man to teach them but as the annointing within them and yet doth write and print here he saith we condemn in others what we allow in our selves Now to all honest people this is no contradiction neither a condemning in others what we allow in our selves for therefore we write and print and speak that all may come to the knowledge of this thing may be converted to God and know his teaching wiâ—hin them but what would J. S. have said of John who told them they needed no man to teach them but as that within them and yet did write Epistles to them â—ery like he would have called this contradiction And the same is our cause who doth and must do though J. S. and his companions be grieved therewith because their folly is laid open thereby print and write and speak that people through the Ministry be brought to know the teaching of God in themselves and yet herein in the light of the Spirit of God do we not contradict our selves let J.S. say what he will neither do we allow in our selves what we condemn in another this is one of J.S. his lyes we allow the Ministry of Christ yet doth not allow the Ministry of Deceivers and yet is not in contradiction and this in short may give the Reader to understand the deceit and deceivableness to lye in J. S. who is found seeking offences against us without any cause given him and he layes snares for another which doth entrap his own feet And whereas he hath transcribed E B his Confession in the warning to Underbarrow which confession is still owned and no self-contradiction proved by it For though God spake by G.F. to him yet this doth not contradict the teaching of the spirit of God as that E. B. was not taught by the spirit of God For as I have said G. F. did minister as many do at this day that people should come to the teaching of God in themselves and herein we do not contradict the scriptures let J. S make as many blind Arguments as he can and that instance about J. L. being of the same nature with the former The Answer supplies both his Proofs neitâ—er of which doth prove us in contradiction but is a witnesse to the Ministry of Christ and to the Conversion received through it wherein we are taught of God and need no man to teach us but as the anointing the spirit of God within us which is immediate and yet we preach the Gospel to others that they may come to witnesse the same with us even the teaching of the spirit of God and for this end is the Ministry of God
sent by us to bring others to the knowledge of God through it and this is no self-contradiction let J.S. say what he will Further J.S. doth instance E.B. his calling mans light natural and carnal in the Warning c. and would cal his contradiction to some who deny the light of Christ to be natural and carnal as the Priests of England terme it but this is no contradiction for though we do deny that the light of Christ Jesus is natural and carnal and doth not allow any so to call it yet the light of man by which carnal men do judg of carnal transgressions is natural E.B. doth never say that the light of Christ is natural and carnal but the light of Mâ—n is so he saith and in this Instance there is no contradiction neither in any parts of the words following which are transcribed and much might be said as to the occasion of those words being uttered when E. B. was in prison falsly as many have been since who was one of the first that by imprisonment was a sufferer for the name of Jesus in the North part of England before J. S. was troubled with any of us but it is sufficient what is said to the mans light by which carnal men judg of any thing is one thing and the light of Christ Jesus which is spiritual mens guide is another thing E. B. spake of mans light and J.S. foolishly opposes him as if he spake of the light of Christ Jesus and so opposes his own conception And further J. S. asserts That Scripture light is the standing rule for faith and manners so are not immediate revelations and teachings Here he hath set up the Scriptures above the Spirit of God and above the Revelation of Jesus Christ the Saints were led by what the Spiâ—it revealed and taught Christ said he should teach into all truth and they that were the Sons of God were loved by the spirit of God and that was their rule to be led by in their Faith and manners But yet see a Hypocrite J.S. is he that pleads for scripture to be the rule and yet is acting in many things contrary to the scriptures as at large may be instanced neither is in all the scripture the scripture called light but scripture saith Christ is the light Further he saith There is sufficient light in the scripture to guide men to salvation Mark his Doctrine whether he hath not preached another thing than Christ to be the way and whether he hath not made Christ and the blood of Christ of none effect without which no salvation But he saith there is sufficient in the Scripture to lead men to salvation and neither Christ nor his blood is in Scripture let it be moved Further he saith The scripture was given by the spirit for a rule this we desire a proof of by plain scripture and till then we deny it And further he saith The spirit gives out himself by scripture and yet he saith he never said the scripture did give the spirit and this is an absolute contradiction as may be noted so J.S. is taken in the snare contradicting himself in one quarter of a sheet of Paper and hath not at all proved us to be self-contradictors concerning any of these things mentioned by him Further he saith in his 8 th Head That our possessing perfection and quaking after Moses Example cross shins on the other but wherein he doth not shew neither can the honest-minded read any contradiction in it but only it seems J. S. hath set himself to cavel Further he saith We contradict our selves concerning Quaking and trembling from this confession That the same power that made Moses to quake and tremble the same power we witnesse but wherein doth this contradiction appear in these words let honest men try the cause and J. S. be silent And whereas he instances J. P. standing in an evil cause and of I. P. he may be silent whose bloud he or his Generation fought after and now might they well be quiet of him their wills being stifled by drinking his blood as it were but that wicked men must add to their own wickedness till it be fulfilled that they may receive their reward and I. P. was bold as is the children of God and though J. S. would clear himself and his company from what was done to I. P. yet by the effect it appeared that there was enough envy in them towards him and the truth and though his body be in the ground yet the Spirit of the Lord which guided him stands alive a sufficient witness against them and all their cruell and wicked dealing and let J. S. judgement be what it will neither concerning growth of Grace nor forms of Religion nor fruits of the Spirit do we at all contradict the Spirit of God neither doth he prove us in these things whereof he accuseth us in strife and debate except against such as J.S. and the Devils Kingdom neither in emulation hatred scoffs or any of these things which the Lord hath redeemed us from though we be falsly accused in these things as in many other by him and whereas he would prove their preaching in their method Points and Reasons and Uses from the example of the Saints in former ages he falls far short in effecting his extent for he cannot prove that they studied for what they spake nor that in such a way they delivered what they said an hour by a glass c. as the Priests of this age do also if it were they preached in the like manner as the Apostles did yet not by the same spirit but by the spirit of error and for a wrong end that is the thing which makes their manner abominable when as they are not guided with the same Spirit of the Apostles and their preaching in their method of points and particulars is rather an art of preaching by humane policy and not the gift of preaching by the Spirit of God neither do we concerning humility and love contradict our selves but are in humility love towards all men even such as wrongs us we seek no revenge against and herein doth our humility and love appear yet cannot we respect any mans person with hat or knee and that is it which J. S. I suppose is offended with In his 13 th Head concerning Ordinances He charges us with self-contradiction because we say we own praying c. and yet hath given over Family prayer morning and evening and at meals but this is no contradiction for we own praying in the Spirit of God bur do deny it without the Spirit and this is no contradiction he may as well say it was contradiction in Christ to cry against the prayers of the Pharisees and yet to teach his Disciples to pray and to pray himself this is the same cause of ours which he foolishly charges with contradiction and as I have said the prayers of the Wicked we deny and yet doth own
I am come a light into the world that whosoever believeth in me should not abide in darkness And Jesus cried anâ— said He that believeth on me believeth on him that sent me Also Joh. 12.44.46 This light was not mans reason nor understanding neither was it mans spirit that was the true light which lightneth every one that cometh into the world Joh. 1 9. Again another false testimony concerning the light is this That the light did drive Adam from the voice and presence of God and so far is the light from leading up to God that it drives the soul from God and keeps him in the fall p. 53. Answ. This Doctrine is to turn the truth of God into a lye and to call light darkness and darkness light for there is no such testimony in the Scriptures that the light did drive Adam from the voice and presence of God but Adam saith I was afraid because I was naked and I hid my self It was because he had disobeyed Gods voice not because he was enlightned for the Scripture saith It is your sins that hath separated you from God it doth not say that it is the light which hath separated you from God or driven you from him this may well be called a damnable Doctrine or Doctrine of Devils Hath God sent his Son a light into the world to drive the souls from God and keep them in the fall Now let all consider and judge that ever knew the light whether it be darkness or it be light which drives the soul from God and keeps it in the fall Now this doctrine being compared with the Scriptures is utterly false and there is a few that profess godliness in this Nation that can bear it or approve of it and for such as account themselves the highest profession and above forms under the name of Seekers to publish such a thing in print here it appears that the best of men iâ— but as a Briar and the most upright is sharper then a Thorn-Hedge for the day of thy Watch-men and thy Visitation cometh now shall there be perplexity Mic. 7.4 Now here is a day for tryal that they which can may try the spirits and doctrines whether they be of God Now I shall lay it to that of God in all is it not the work of the Devil to drive the soul from God and to keep people in the fall If so then it is not the work of the light which lightneth every man that cometh into the world is not this to call light darkness to say that the light is so far from leading up to God that it drives the soul from God and keeps him in the Fall What is that which leads man out of the fall if the light keep man in it As this is contrary to Scripture and to truth so it is contrary to his own words as in pag. 7. there saying That by the Light is the will and mind of the Creator made known unto man and he sufficiently qualified to see it and understand it Answ. How can these two stand together That the light drives man from God keeps him in the fall and again That it makes known the will and mind of the Creator unto him and sufficiently qualifies him to see and understand it This cannot truly be called Hosanna to the Son of David nor A Testimony to the Lords Christ but a line of confusion which is stretched out wherein darkness is come forth as a cloud and spreads it self over the earth to darken peoples minds from the knowledge and understanding of truth by words without knowledge but his folly shall proceed no further unreproved and made manifest Another false Testimony concerning the light is this That at first it moved upward and man could look God in the face and serve him but now since the fall the Thief is got into the Candle and now the Spirit burns downward and discovers the things beneath Answ. What is the nature of the Light changed or is the spirit so changed that before it ascended upward and now downward We shall try this according to the Scripture which saith Who knoweth the Spirit of man that goeth upward and the spirit of a Beast which goeth downward to the earth Eccles. 3.21 so then if it goes downward it is the spirit of a Beast not the spirit of a man And here it is plainly evident that he knows not the spirit of man from the spirit of a Beast so unfit to cry Hosanna to the Son of David or bear testimony to the Lords Christ. But as for the Light which hath enlightned man that cometh into the world the fall did not â—hange the quality of the light for the light is the same as it was but darkneâ—s cannot comprehend it neither knows how to give a true testimony of it but confusedly speaks of two lights the one springing up with man in his naturall birth suitable to his naturall birth and another light sutable to the new birth that is born of the spirit This is a testâ—mony which is not to be found in Scripture to be two Lights sutable to the two births for he that is born of the flâ—sh persecutes him that is born of the Spirit and God hath put enmity between the two Seeds but to say that there is two lights sutable and so the one natural and the other spiritual the one of the earth earthly and the other of the Lord from Heaven as the two births are this is not a testimony according to truth for the light is but one and the spirit of truth is but one and the same spirit which led the Saints which believed into all truth the same did convince the world of sin because they did not believe in Christ Joh. 16.3 And that light which is the condemnation of the world who love the darknes rather then Christ the same is the Saviour of all them that believe and one man loves it another hates it yet it is the same light Joh. 3.19 but the Scripture bears no such testimony as that there is two lights in man the one spiritual the other natural and for any man to say that the light of Christ is natural is blasphemy against the Son of God and is a sin not easily forgiven and it is hard for such to find the place of repentance for every one that comes to repentance must first come to the light which Christ hath enlightned them withall and must know it to be spiritual and confess it so and with this light come to discern the two births the one from the other and their several natures and how that the one birth is guided by the light it being as the eye giving them to see what to speak before they speak and so keeps them out of the worlds line which is confusion and as a Teâ—cher giving them to understand what to do before they do it and so keeps them out of the condemnation bringing their works
before-hand to judgement so their works are wrought in God who answer the light which they be enlightned withal but the light is not sutable nor according to that birth which is born after the flesh but condemns that in all its ways and actions and is given to lead the creature out of that nature and out of that birth into the regeneration to lead out of the deeds of darkness and out of the shadow of death into the living inheritance among those that are sanctified in Christ Jesus Another testimony concerning the light relating to the two Covenants is this That as there was a new Covenant diverse from the former the old so there must of necessity be another light to accompany it diverse from the former that is as then mans spirit so now the spirit of the Lord c. page 35. Answ. There are diversities of gifts but the same spirit and there are differences of Administrations but the same Lord and there are diversities of operations but it is the same God which worketh all in all 1 Cor. 12.4 5.6 Now all people is to know that there was a ministration different from the administration of the Gospel the new Covenant a different administration from the old but there is no necessity that it be ministred from another spirit nor from another Lord nor from another Light therefore to say that because the Covenants or Administrations are diverse one from another that therefore it must not be the same spirit but the one by the spirit of man the other the spirit of God and that the lights is to be diverse the one from the other this is a false Testimony for the same spirit in which the Law was administred the first Covenant in the same was the second administred which doth make perfect according to the conscience Now as all people is brought out of their own inventions and imaginations and from following their own spirits to own the light of Christ which hath enlightned them they should know the diversities of Administrations and the diversity of operations and yet but one Light and one Power and one Spirit and not as many lights as births nor as many spirits as operations not every Administration to have a diverse light to accompany it for though there be that are called gods whether in heaven or in earth as there be gods many and lords many but to us there is but one God the Father of whom are all things and we in him and one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are things and we by him howheit there is not in every man that knowledge 1 Coâ— 8.5.6 7. and though there be in the world many lights yet to us there is but one him by whom all things was made which doth enlighten every man that commeth into the world that in him all men might believe as every one believes in this light they shal know that mans reason understanding is not the light which every man is enlightned withal for some are unreasonable men and some are void of understanding Neither is the spirit of man the light of the world which doth enlighten every man that cometh into the world neither is any thing called the light of the world in the Scripture but Christ for saith Christ I am come a light into the world that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness Joh. 12.46 Then spake Jesus again unto them saying I am the light of the world he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness but shall have the light of life Job 8.12 And again I am the light of the world Joh. 9.5 And the messenger which was sent before his face to prepare the way of the Lord and to bear witness to the truth said In him was life and the life was the light of men and that was the true light which enlightneth every man that cometh into the world Joh 1 4 9. And this is the light which in all ages generations and under all administrations the Saints did bear their testimony in and this light did never change nor alter though ages and generations have changed and men have changed and do change and the minds of men change and their ways change and their worships change and forms and religions which are not according to the light which Christ hath enlightned them withal which changeth not which as it is followed will lead them out of those ways which do change which is not the living way for the new and living way is one with the light which every man is enlightned withal which is every mans way to the Father who follow it and every mans condemnation who disobey it Another testimony concerning the first man Adam in his first estate without sin the sum of it is this That as it was at first that is at his beginning made so that is without sin for so was he made Eccles 7.29 upright without crookedness without invention that this man yea in his purest naturals cannot receive nor discern the things of the spirit of God until he is born of the Spirit or from above according to Joh. 1.13 8.3 6. 1 Cor. 2.14 Answ. This testimony is false for the first Adam before the fall was the son of God Luk 3 38. and did know and perceive Gods voice and power and he knew Gods command That he should not eat of the Tree of knowledge of good and evil which if he did he should die the death for he was in Gods image and the Lord spoke unto him and he perceived it and he had right to eat of the tree of life which was in the midst of the Garden and if Adam had continued in that state there needed no Law to have been added because of transgression neither had there needed any precept upon precept nor line upon line neither any teacher or instructer of the ignorant for there had no death passed over to separate God from his creature which he had made in his own image and given him power over all creatures but to say the Son of God in the image of God without sin in uprightness and power to say that he is sensual having not the spirit or to say that he is the natural man that cannot receive nor discern the things of the spirit of God this is greater blasphemy then that which the Apostle reproved Rev. 2.9 in those which said they were Jews and were not but were the Synagogue of Satan and all such which brings forth such mists of darkness ignorance to blind the eye in people which should see the things of God in clearness are to be reproved sharply that they may be ashamed and no more bring forth that which is both uâ—nâ—cessary and unseasonable and contrary to truth as J. Jackson hath done And further he adds That the natural man which Paul speaks of 1 Cor. 2.14 and compares it with 1 Cor. 15.44.45 is not to be taken for the carnal sinful man
turned against all such and he is turning the wise men backward and making their wisdom become foolishness For once there was a seeking after Light in many that it might rise and open the things of God unto them and reveal the mysteries of his life whereby their souls might be satisfied And now when it is risen in many and hath brought forth its powerful effects now the man of sin hath his time and doth prevail in many to make them believe that it is not the Light which is able to save the souls of them which believe in it and doth beget a spirit of jealousie in them which is stronger than death and begetteth a fear in them which worketh torment and many now doth fear and are jealous that that Light is not the Christ which hath enlightened them and every one that cometh into the World And this is the work of Satan in the hearts of the disobedient which as every one comes to obey his Light and to answer his perfect love to them which is manifest in the Light thaâ— fear wil be cast out and life wil be given to that Witness of God which once did breath after his life without which the soul cannot rest nor be satisfied And this shall many come to witness as the man of sin comes to be revealed which letteth and will let until he be taken out of the way and then shall they see at what they have stumbled and by what they have been overcome and then they will know that it had been good for them if they had walked in the Light of the Lord instead of setting themselves against it And as the Light it self by such before-mentioned is denyed so the Testimony which the children of Light give of it is also despised and contended against as if it were not to be owned for a Doctrine of Truth vvhich Doctrine of Truth hath been laid often before people and is yet once more that they may consider prove and try and so believe and so be able to give a testimony from the Witness of God in themselves First We say that Christ is the Light of the World according to his ovvn vvords John 8.12 And again we say That he hath enlightened every man that cometh into the World according to his vvords vvho vvas sent a Messenger before his face to bear vvitness to the truth and his vvitness is true John 2.9 And as Christ hath enlightned every man that cometh into the World so we say to every man vvarning both small and great to believe in the Light that they may be the children of Light vvhich vvas Christ's Doctrine to the World John 12.36 And now what Christ doth and effecteth by it in those that believe in his Light and followeth it which effects and operations by the World is denyed and by us is affirmed some of the effects of it I shall mention which is opposed as first That it wil not let those that are guided by it take Gods Name in vain but vvil draw them out of the Worships of the World and keep them in the fear of God and to stand stil in it is the first step to peace That it discovers things that are contrary to it That it is their Teacher that love it and their condemnation that hate it according to Christs words John 3.19 That waiting in it wil guide them to God and shew them the way to the Father as Christ saith No man cometh unto the Father but by me John 14 6. And no man cometh unto the Father by Christ but as they are led and guided by his Light within them That it opens all the Scriptures and leads man out of the fall up to God for him hath the Father given to be a Leader and Commander unto the people and he leadeth them by his Light Another effect is That it convinceth of all ungodliness and worldly lusts and is a Teacher and Director teaching and directing in righteousness purity and holiness c. And that the Light is but one in him that loves it and in him that hates it leading the one to God from whence it comes to receive eternal life and condemning the other from God because he obeyeth not the truth that he might be saved And this is the Testimony of Truth which is now held forth never to be denyed But who hath believed our report even they to whom the Arm of the Lord is revealed And this is the way by which people may come to know the truth of this Testimony by obeying the Light which Christ hath enlightened them withal thereby shall they know whether this Doctrine be of God or whether we speak of our selves and whether all those effects are not brought forth by the working of Christ's Light in them and then they shall not believe oneâ—y because of our words nor be envious against it because of other words but wil find the testimony in themselves which is according to the record which God hath given of hit Son and according to the Testimony which we have given of the Light and he that believeth shall be established Now that which opposeth this is that which beaâ—eth a testimony contrary to Christ who saith For this end was I born and for this end came I into the world to bear witness unto the truth and every one that is of the truth heareth my voice John 18.37 And this was his witness and his Messengers witness that he was the Light of the world and that this is the true Light which hath enlightened every man that cometh into the world John 8.12 John 1.9 And this contrary testimony which is brought forth is this That it is the spirit of man that is the Light which hath enlightened every man and so going about to prove the spirit of man not to be sufficient under this would destroy the sufficiency of the Light of Christ. But the Scriptures never did give testimony that the spirit of man was the Light of the World neither did we ever say that this Light was the spirit of every man nor a natural Light and therefore this man who hath writ a volume in proving a natural Light or man's reason insufficient let all people take notice what he contradicts or disproves by it he doth not by it contradict nor disprove any thing that we have said for we never did affirm that man's reason was the Light but he hath laboured to contradict himself He hath set up an Image and then glories in breaking of it down and from our words draws a false inference and glories in confounding it this is the general course of our opposers to raise a false proposition or conclusion from their own imaginations then contradict it and then cry The Quakers contradicted or confuted and their Doctrine disproved and they irrecoverably slain and many such cryes are gone forth in the World among people like the noise of many waters To which I answer Nay they are not
as Paul was 2 Cor. 3.6 For every measure of the Spirit is infallible or undeceivable buâ— that which is fallible is deceivable and whosoever is taught by that Spirit is deceived and Thomas Dance pretends to have no other Spirit but that which is deceivable and fallible so that it is time to turn away from such Again he chargeth Timothy that he was not infallible which is a false charge For wherein was he fallible or deceivable but he was so infallible that he not neglecting the gift of God that was in him he by it was able to save himself and those that heard him 1 Tim. 4 16. And he ministred from the gift of God in him which he had received by prophesie and so not from a fallible spirit but from the infallible and so he is accused falsly by T. Dance Again Tho. Dance saith That he desireth the Office of a Bishop c. Ans. But consider what such a one must be which is blameless vigilant sober not rude and scornful but of good behaviour apt to teach not apt to laugh and jeer and cause the people to be light and vain he must not be given to wine no striker not greedy of filthy lucre but patient not a brâ—wler not covetous as it doth appear those Priests are guilty of which have nothing to preach from but the infallible spirit vvhich doth always deceive people but one that ruleth his own house well having his children in subjection with all gravity for if a man know not how to rule his own house wel how shall he take care of the Church of God but it is manifest that Tho. Dance ruled not his own Church or people well but rather provoked them to wantonness rudeness and laughter which is madness Not a Novice lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the Devil But T. D. was so lifted up in the pride of his heart that he gave two meanings to one place of Scripture and so falls into the condemnation of the Devil Pr. And whereas Thomas Dance saith That his qâ—â—â—ification is such that he might have been cloathed in scarlet c. Ans. What mightest thou have been a Lawyer or Doctor as one of thy Brethren said Which if thou hadst by that the Nation is deceived though not in so high a measure as by professing the Ministry but that is taken up as the most profitable Trade to get means and live in pride What if thou hadst been cloathed in Scarlet in Velvet in Purple or any other gorgeous apparel and in that apparel which thou art already cloathed with wilt thou be condemned when thou comes to know any measure of the gift of the true Ministry to be thy guide Pr. Again whereas thou takest the people to be a seal of thy Ministry Ans. All the people that were in place and some more may seal it to be fallible and deceivable as thou hast confessed it to be but there is not one that can set to their seal that it hath brought them to a perfect man nor to the knolwedge of the Son of God nor to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ and so it hath not effected any of the Work of the true Ministry but when thou comes to be searched narrowly filthy lucre wil be found to be the end for which thou Ministrest without which thou wouldst be silent And now further to manifest that that he pretends not to any thing of the infallible Spirit in his Ministry these his principles or doctrines declare as followeth with the answer of truth to them Pr. That every individual man was not enlightened by Christ. Ans. Which doctrine is contrary to John 1.9 which saith that was the true Light which enlighteneth every one that cometh into the world and to pervert the Scripture he gave two meanings that the people might take whether they would so that they would but deny the form of sound words and the plain Scripture The first was this That Christ enlightened every man that is enlightened Or else Secondly That he enlighteneth some in every Nation Now let people consider how that this can be the meaning of the Holy Ghost as he said it was seeing that here is two meanings and it is either the one or the other but he knows not which which doth plainly manifest that he hath not the mind of the Spirit which is but one and speaks as it means but the Scriptures cannot be broken by such meanings which saith thâ—â—â—very man is enlightened with the true Light Pr. That the whole body of the Gentiles was not enlightened Ans. Then by what shall those Gentiles be condemned who are not enlightened seeing that Christ was given for a Light to the Gentiles as the Prophet Isaiah saith But he doth not say to some of the Gentiles and not to the whole body and though the Gentiles were once darkness Eph. 5. yet the Light shined in the darkness and the Apostle turned them unto that Light which shined in the darkness that the eye which was blinded might be opened He did not come to give them eyes but to open the blind eyes not to give them light but to turn them to the Light that was in them as Acts 26.10 Pr. That the Gospel is an external Light and not invisible and that it is not thâ— Light within Ans. Which is contrary to the Apostles doctrine which saith the gospel is the power of God Rom. 1. which is not external nor visible but invisible and shined in their hearts 2 Cor. 4.6 and it was hid unto those that were lost but that which was visible they could see and hear with the visible eyes and ears but both the Gospel which is the power of God and the eye that sees are invisible Pr. That Christ being the propitiation for the sins of the whole world as John said 1 John 2.2 is meant onely the world of believers Ans. In this he would break the Scriptures and contradict the Apostle which saith He is the propitiation for our sins and not for ours onely who were the believers but for the sins of the whole world Which whole World John said lies in wickedness but the whole World of believers lies not in wickednesse but is of God Pr. That they must reconcile the Scriptures Ans. The Scriptures cannot be broken John 10.35 but is reconciled and at unity in themselves and in all those that know them but he that gives two contrary meanings to one Scripture he doth not go about to reconcile but rather to pervert them and to take away the plain testimony of truth which they give from peoples understandings but the key of knowledge is found again which opens the Scriptures 〈…〉 mystery of them And herein is the ignorance of â—eachers and people in saying the Scriptures are not reconciled it is they that are not reconciled to God nor the Scriptures and so they utter forth their blindnesse ignorance and error
Pr. That the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ was not the Law of the Spirit in the Saints but that they were two Laws c. Ans. This is a false distinction for God â—ath said that he wil write his Law in their hearts and put his Spirit in their inward parts And the same Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus being in the Apostle's heart had set him free from the Law of sin and death Rom. 8.2 So it was not two Laws but one Law Pr. That there are two righteousnesses of Christ the one without the Saints to justifie thom and the other within the Saints that did sanctifie them Ans. Christ's righteousness is but one and that by which they were both sanctified and justified was but one thing even the Spirit of our God 1 Cor. 6.11 and Christ in them was Gods righteousness and the hope of glory who was made unto them righteousness and if Christ was in them then his righteousness was in them or else he and his righteousness is divided as this Priests doctrine would make them Pr. The said Priest denied that they were justified by that Christ that was in them when he was questioned about it Ans. If they were not justified by that Christ that was in them then by another Christ which is no less than to preach two Christ's and so he hath preached another Gospel than the Apostles preached which whosoever doth is accursed Pr. That David when he was guilty of adultery and murther was not in a condemned state but in a justified state Ans. Here he would make God a justifier of the wicked in his wickedness but in that state David was condemned of the Lord and suffered his anger and terrors when his iniquities went over his head and were too heavy for him to bear and he was not justified until that through judgement he was redeem â—rom the guilt of murther and adultery and other sins which 〈◊〉 over his head So such Teachers as he who would have God account them just who are unjust and them holy who are unholy and unrighteous are as the false Prophecâ— who put no difference between the holy and prophane and spoke peace to the wicked where there was no peace counting them good who did evil saying they that do evil are good in the sight of the Lord Mal. 3.15 as the Priests now say though they be sinners yet they are righteous in God's account so they would make God a lyar accounting men to be that which they are not and to be in Christ when they are in sin in the Devil's Work Pr. And concerning them in Heb. 12. who were come unto the spirits of just men made perfect he said it was meant that they were in Heavon and not upon Earth Ans. Thus by his false meanings he hath often perverted the Scriptures calling his false meanings the meanings of the Holy Ghost but these mentioned in Heb. 12. were them the Apostle wrote unto upon earth for he did not write to men after they were deceased and these that he wrote unto were come unto the innumerable company of Angels and to the City of the living God and to the spirits of just men made perfect Pr. That any creature that holds that principle of being justified by a righteousness within living and dying in that principle cannot come to Heaven Ans. Christ is the justifier of them that believe in him and his Doctrine is I in them and they in me So Christ and his righteousness is in the Saints and God hath brought in the everlasting righteousness which justifieth which is not at a distance separate from the Saints as these false Teachers have imagined And the Apostles Doctrine and Principle is Christ in you which whosoever liveth and dyeth in this comes to Heaven but on the contrary whosoever hath not Christ and his righteousness in them to justifie them cannot come to Heaven Pr. That that which fitted men for the Inheritance among the Saints did not entitle to the inheritance or not give them a part in the inheritance Ans. This is contrary to the Apostles Doctrine for he thanks God the Father who made them meet to be partakers of the inheritance with the Saints in Light Col. 1.12 for he both fitted them for the Inheritance and did entitle and give them a part in the Inheritance translating them into the Kingdom of his dear Son ver 13. Pr. That we cannot contain an infinite righteousness in us Ans. Then you cannot contain the righteousness of God for it is infinite and everlasting as in Daniel 9.24 and then you cannot contain Christ in you who is God's righteousnesse and who is infinite and so by this Doctrine he makes all reprobates as all are who know not Christ in them for they who did not retain God in their knowledge were given up to a reprobate sence Pr. That it was false doctrine to say a man must first partake of the righteousness which justifies before it can be imputed to him as his Ans. He hath here counted that false doctrine which the Saints witnessed fulfilled in them for the righteousness of God was imputed to the Saints in the true belief whereby they did partake of Gods righteousness through Faith before it could be accounted theirs except that this Priest in his false meanings would count that to be a mans vvhich he hath no right to nor part in for the faith wherein Abraham did partake of Gods righteousness vvas reckoned to him for righteousness and he unto vvhom God imputeth righteousness in his spirit there is no guile though these Priests vvould impute righteousnesse to the vvicked as theirs vvho are full of guile and sin having no life nor right in God's righteousness vvhile they live quite out of it Pr. That God offers salvation to all men but he intends it but to a few Ans. There he vvould frustrate the grace of God and his salvation vvhich is free for all and so he vvould make the offers of God's salvation to many thousands to no purpose as if God profered that to many vvhich he never intended to give them Was there ever such a belying of God as this For vvhat is it less than to make God a respecter of persons If all men by nature be in wickedness and liable to condemnation as this priest confessed and yet salvation is intended but for a fevv though offered to all how is God no respecter of persons and how is Christ given to be his salvation to the ends of the earth and a Light unto the world that all men through him might believe and whosoever believeth in Christ shall not perish but have everlasting life so that all may freely come and be saved according to the Love and Will of God vvho doth not intend that any shall perish except they reject his vvay and the offers of his grace which hath appeared to all men Pr. That a Minister of the gospel doth not know who are
and even a reproach among the Heathen So let no more the cry of the Priests nor of the poor be heard in our Land the one crying for Laws to persecute and receive money of those who they preach not unto which receives no teaching from them which cry is intolerable to be heard or suffered in a free Common-wealth And the other for want of the creatures of God when as others spend the creatures of God upon their lusts excessively and so the Creation is out of order 〈◊〉 those that are come into the Gospel-Ministration and to be taught of the Lord and have received Christ Jesus the Lord and walk in him it is not so amongst us for the creatures of God are not spent upon the lust nor destroyed neither is there a beggar amongst us who are truly of us in the obedience of truth so that we do not desire that any people or profession in the Nation should maintain our poor for they are our own flesh without respect of persons for if any of us have of this Worlds good and see our Brother stand in need and shuts up the bowels of compassion from him the love of God doth not dwel in us neither doth any other maintain those that minister unto us the Word and Doctrine so we according to the royal Law of Liberty desire to do unto others as we would have them do unto us and thus to be a free people and a free Nation So every form and profession will enjoy their own Minister till they come to know him unto whom the gatherings of the people must be viz Christ So that neither Parliament Assizes Sâ—ssions nor Courts will have any thing to do in matter of Religion but to keep the peace of the Nation and then he that hath the Word of God may speak his Word faithfully and freely without interruption so that the Gospel of God may have its free course and be glorified and that great oppression of Tythes which lies heavy upon the whole Nation which God raised up his Spirit in the Army once to testifie against may be taken away that what was then pretended may be now fulfilled and the people eased of their oppressions which they have long felt the burthen of and groaned under that so as a free people they may be delivered from that bondage and the Law may be disannulled by which that bondage is imposed upon them So this will beget love in the Nation and all persecution cruelty and bitterness wâ—ll cease and every one may freely and quietly enjoy the fruit of his own labor then with much freedom chearfulness wil every one minister of his substance unto all necessary uses knowing that the earth and the fulness of it is the Lords And when this universal love and free Spirit is begotten among people then wil righteousness establish the Nation and that will be brought forth which many sincere hearts and tender consciences hath waited for seveâ—â—l years and many have been even almost weary and faint in â—heir minds in waiting for that which they once had a lively sight of and hopes to enjoy in the Lord's promise of Liberty and Freedom opened in their understandings ten years since insomuch â—hat some have been ready to tempt God and say that he was slack concerning his promise and some for want of long patience have lefâ— off expecting that which they once believed hoped foâ— but God is reviving the hopes of the contrite ones in them that had said there was no hope in them is he renewing strength to believe that God will give Judges as at the first and Counsellors as at the beginning the Judges at the first were not to judge for gifts nor for rewards nor the Priests were not to preach for hire nor the Prophets were not to divine for money but the Judges did minister justice freely between man and man and the Priests did minister the Law freely which was added upon all transgression So in those days there were no Priests that troubled the Courts Judges nor Counsellors with Addresses Petitions or Complaints for maintenance no suing at the Law no imprisoning mens persons for Wages nor no spoiling of mens goods and there was not such delays in executing judgment upon transgressors as is now for the Judges sate in the gate and executed judgement speedily upon the offendors and cleansed the Land of evil-doers and so eveâ—y one was to wait on his Mâ—nistry which he had received from the Lord and are to do so now if they do it unto the Lord He that judgeth for God is not to respect any mans person in judgment and he that hath the Word of the Kingdom is to minister it freely and then the people wil minister their carnal things freely to every one that hath need so that whereas even from the Priest to the people all have been given to covetousness strife and debate every one now will be given to love and freeness one to another for he that hath spiritual things wil minister them freely and he that hath carnal things will minister them freely and so will all come from under the execution of the Law and from all strife and contention Another great oppression wherein iniquity is upheld by a Law is in the Ministration of the Law between man and man it not being done freely so not as in the beginning HE that doth minister the Law let him do it freely for the Lord and for righteousness sake and let him be as one of the Judges in the beginning and as one of the Counsellors whose eyes were not blinded with gifts and rewards and so it will come to be a free Nation and then every man will not seek his own but every one anothers good and then will pure love spring up to one another and one will seek to preserve and save another and not devour and destroy one another about earthly things as now they do so Christ's Spirit will be found among all sorts of people Ministers of the Law Ministers of the Gospel and Subjects of the Nation which were to save mens lives not to destroy them and then the Scriptures which cannot be broken wil be fulfilled and peace wil be extended as a River and righteousnesse as a mighty Stream For it is this spirit which I have mentioned in Lawyers and Priests which did not minister freely but for covetous ends hath made merchandize of peoples souls and estates that hath broken the peace of this Nation as many hath had a deep experience even when the Army was in its first purity and zeal for God and his Truth that Spirit did creep into their Counsels and corrupted them and did creep into Parliaments and corrupted them and when there was any appearance of a Monarchy or Government arising in the Nation that spirit crept into every high Court and corrupted it so that whole Nations are corrupted with that spirit so that till that spirit be purged out there
limitation and to submit unto any Power or Magistracy that doth or shall rule as the Ordinance of God without any limitation or qualification is far below that Spirit which was once in some of you in that profession for you have told of having the Laws regulated according to the Scriptures and of having Judges as at the first and Counsellors as at the beginning and then not to submit to what Government soever but that which is according to Equity and Justice And what do you bear Arms or fight for if not for a Government according to truth and that Righteousness may establish the Nation Some have judged this to be the very Design and End of the War and Controversie against many that were Governors and Magistrates and were by some called the Ordinance of God and the higher Power And if now you resolve to live peaceably and submit to whatever Government shall be establishâ—d then your Fighting is at end And if any shall come in and establish Popery and govern by tyranny you have begged pardon by promising willingly to submit and live peaceably under it as the Ordinance of God And if Jeroboam come to reign and set up Calves to worship and cause the people to sin yet you will submit and live peaceably and quietly under it accounting it the Ordinance of God And if a Pharoah come to rule he that bears rule must be counted a Magistrate and a Magistracy must be accounted the Ordinance of God by you and peaceably submitted unto and whatsoever Government they set up by their Act wil be accounted lawful things and you must submit to them else you have proved your selves all lyars but some did judge that ye had been of another spirit To the second you say As for the publick Ministry of the Nation who differ from us in the matter of baptizing Infants and some things in Church-Government we are so far from endeavouring to destroy them that we judge they ought to have the liberty of their consciences therein and that it is our duty to stand by them and preserve them so much as in us lies from all injury and violence Ans. It seems then that there is not so much difference betwixt them and you as will make them Antichristian and you Christian and there is a near compliance when as it is your duty to stand by them and preserve them while they are baptizing Infants But can you stand by them and preserve them and not tell them that it is Antichristian or contrary to the Scriptures And do you think that they will do as much for you as to stand by you while you are plunging your Members in the water And although you do so as you say is not this contradiction to your selves in what you say in the same Paper For do you not say That you will not tolerate any miscarriages in things Civil or Religious And whether is not this a miscarriage in things religious to baptize Infants And whether do you not tolerate this miscarrâ—age in them while you stand by to preserve them in it as you say from injury and violence But who doth offer any violence to them which are their guard against but the Priests will hardly believe you and if they ever have power that will not pardon you for so saying and therefore you had better have been silent than have shewed pour weakness and ignorance for nothing To the third you say Concerning the people called Quakers it is well known unto all that are not wilfully ignorant there are none more opposite to their irregular practices than we are nor are there any that they have exprest more contradiction to in matters of Religion than against us though their provocation therein hath not put us in the least on a desire of depriving them of their just liberty while they live morally honest and peaceable in the Nation Ans. Is not this secret smiting without a cause What irregular practice is that which you accuse them of and wil not mention is this honestly done What are they worse than the Episcopal Priests you mention to them wherein they differ from you and why not to the Quakers Is it enough for any man to believe that they are irregular because you say so without any proof Or dare you not mention wherein you judge it so lest they should disprove you But you say there is not any they have expressed more contradiction to in matters of Religion than against you Answ. That is false for they have more contradicted the common Priests of the Nation as their Books and sufferings will witness although they have according to truth contradicted you and also have more of your contradictions and confusions to declare concerning you which are not yet published But what do you account their irregular practice Is it because their yea is yea and their nay is nay in all their communications and yours not so Or is it because they cannot swear at all Or is it because they cannot have any mans person in admiration because of advantage or because they cannot respect the person of the rich nor honor the person of the mighty Is it because they do unto others as they would have others to do unto them Or because they speak the truth every one to his Neighbour without partiality or hypocrisie Or is it any thing relating to these things above-named If not in your next mention in what or else the wise in heart wil judge you to sprak onely from your imaginary conceit But what is your end in so secret smiting them Do you think to excuse your selves by accusing them And who is it that doth charge you in countenancing the Quakers in their practices either regular or irregular I know none that hath any ground so to charge you But to men of understanding who can see beyond words you rather appear to be begging a pardon of the Episcopal and Presbyter and the vvild Boys and Apprentices of London by accusing the Quakers as hereafter will appear and that fearfulness and unbelieving is entred into your hearts and so your spirits are betrayed into a slavish fear but if ever you be accepted or owned of God you must own that for your strength which the Quakers live in and if ever any rule for God in this Nation they must own that Light Life and Spirit which they are guided by and then they will not despise but have unity with the Quakers To the fourth you say Whereas we are further charged with endeavouring an universal Toleration of all miscarriages both in things Religious and Civil under pretence of Liberty of Conscience it is in both respects notoriously false And we do before the Lord that shall judge both quick and dead yea before Angels and Men declare our utter detestation of such a Toleration for in matters Civil we desire there may not be the least toleration of miscarriage in any much less in our selves Nor do we desire in matters
of Religion that Popery should be tolerated the blood of many thousands of the People of God having been barbarously shed by the Professors thereof or any person tolerated that worship a false God nor any that speak contemptuously and reproachfully of our Lord Jesus Christ nor any that deny the holy Scriptures contained in the Books of the Old and New-Testament to be the Word of God and yet we are not against tolerating of Episcopacy Presbyter or any stinted form provided they do not compel any others to a compliance therewith or a conformity thereunto For whatever Composers of any form of Worship may possibly err it is derogating from God and his holy Word and injurious to men to compel any to the practice thereof Ans. What confusion is here and contradiction both to your selves and to the exâ—mple of Christ As to Religion you wil not tolerate Popery because the blood of many of the people of God have been barbarously shed by the professors thereof neither wil you have any persons tolerated that worship a false God nor any that speak contempâ—uously and reproachfully of the Lord Jesus Christ nor any that deny the holy Scriptures contained in the Books of the Old New-Testament to be the Word of God And yet you are not against tolerating of Episcopacy Presbytery or any stinted form Why wil you not tolerate Popery as well as Episcopacy Have not the professors of Episcopacy murthered and slain and do labour to murther and slay the people of God as well as the Papists And why will you tolerate the Common-Prayer among the Episcopacy and not the Mass-Book among the Papists seeing that the Mass was the substance out of which the Common-prayer was extracted Here is nothing but partiality to tolerate one thing and not another of the same kind And why will you not tolerate the persons of those that worship a false God nor the persons of those that deny the Scriptures to be the Word of God nor the persons of those that speak contemptuously and reproachfully of the Lord Jesus Christ Ans. If you will not tolerate their persons then you will murther or destroy their persons and herein you have proved the accusation against you to be true that you have a design to murther and destroy those that differ from you in matters of Religion As for instance those that worship a false God they differ from you in matters of Religion and you will not have any of their persons tolerated and their persons must be destroyed for differing from you in matters of Religion And they that deny the Scriptures that is the Writings to be the Word of God that is to be Christ whose Name is called the Word of God you will not tolerate their persons then you will destroy them because they differ from you in matters of Religion And those that speak reproachfully of Jesus Christ you wil not tolerate their persons then you wil destroy their persons because they differ from you in matters of Religion and thus having contradicted your selves you have also contradicted the example of Christ for he came among those that worshipped false Gods even stocks and stones and graven Images the Works of mens hands and he was not against tolerating their persons neither came he to destroy mens lives because of such things but had a Gospel to preach unto them whereby they might learn to know the living God and turn from dumb Idols and those that speak reproachfully against him and said he had a Devil yet he was not against tolerating their persons but preached the Kingdom of God to them and did bid them seek it and the righteousness thereof and told them that the Kingdom of God was within them and he wâ—s among such as denied that there was a God or Christ or Resurrection Angel or Spirit and this is more than to deny the Scriptures to be the Word of God which indeed is words and not the Word And Christ was not against tolerating of any of the persons as you have expressed your selves to be and so shewed forth a murthering Spirit But seeing that you wil not have any person tolerated that worships a false God what must be done vvith their persons But what difference is there in the ground or cause of toleration between those that vvorship a false god or they vvhich vvorship the true God in a false vvay And if the persons of neither of those should be tolerated then the toleration vvould but reach a little compass But vvho must be Judge of that blasphemy contempt or reproach spoken against the Lord Jesus Christ Was it not blasphemy in the Apostles days for one to say he was a Jew and was not Rev. 2. v. 9 And is it not as great blasphemy now to say that he is a Christian or a Believer that is not And must not any person be tolerated that speak such vvords And must not such a person be tolerated that denies the Scriptures to be the Word of God Then it appears they must not be tolerated that say In the beginning was the Word as John 1.4 Nor that say that Christ is the Word and that the Scriptures are they which testifie of him as John 5. And if we search out your toleration to the bottom it will be reduced into this compass That none shall be tolerated but those that say as you say and profess what you profess and you among your selves are as a Kingdom divided that cannot stand and you are not they vvhich are fit to Rule in the Nation to prescribe Liberty nor give toleration but if you had been of Christ's Spirit you would have professed Toleration and not Destruction unto all persons in matters of Religion and then they that have the Gospel of Christ may minister it freely among those that vvorship a false god and among those that worship the true God ignorantly and minister it among the Papists â—piscopal and Presbyterie Heathens Turks and Pagans which are all out of the way and so to convince the gain-sayers so that all the wicked impositions cruelty persecution and killing one another about Religion would cease and then the Gospel of peace which is the power of God would rule over deceit and Truth and Righteousnesse would encrease and spread over the Nations but you have appeared to be of a spirit of Confusion and Contradiction for vvhen you have spoken against tolerating the persons before mentioned yet you say in contradiction to it you are not against tolerating Episcopacy Presbyterie or any stinted Form provided they do not compel any others to a compliance therewith or conformity thereunto c. Now consider and let even your own foolishness correct you Is not the Papists which ye have have excepted against a stinted Form And are not those that vvorship a false god a stinted Form And are not the Sadduces that deny that there is either God Christ Angel Resurrection or Spirit a stinted Form And is not the
Jews a stinted Form although they speak contemptuously of the Lord Jesus Christ which before you have said you will not tolerate their persons because they speak contemptuously of the Lord Jesus Christ and now you say you wil tolerate because they are a stinted Form How must the Jews be converted who have spoken contemptuously and reproachfully of the Lord Jesus Christ calling him a Deceiver a Blasphemer and that he had a Devil seeing you will not tolerate their persons until they be converted And how shall the Heathens that worship false gods be converted seeing their persons must not be tolerated And what must be done with those many hundreds of Congregations in England which worship God in the Spirit and yet do deny the Scriptures as Words and Writings of the Old and New-Testament to be the Word of God but do confesse them to be a Testimony of the Word and of him who is the beginning and end of the words in whom and by whom they all come to be fulfilled to the Saints What must their persons be done with seeing they must not be tolerated But you may say That those things was spoken in your haste or at least in your fear whereby you were surprized in the Uproar of the rude Boys and Apprentices of London But a little fear entering into the Hypocrisie doth try your spirits and cause you to bring forth the intents of your hearts as in your paper is manifest To the last you say Forasmuch as we are charged to murder and destroy those that differ from us in matters of Religion We do not only abhor and detest it as a cursed practice but we hope we have approved our selves both in this City and the Nation to the contrary notwithstanding the great provocation of some who have endeavoured our ruine For that we desire is just liberty to men as men that every man may be preserved in his own just rights and that Christians may be preserved as Christians though of different apprehensions in some things of Religion in the prosecution whereof our lives shall not be dear unto us when we are thereunto lawfully called The designs of our adversaries in these calumnies are to mis-represent us to some people fearing God and also to incense the rude Multitude against us purposely to provoke them if possible to destroy us Ans. In what you have before expressed you have more given than taken away the occasion of this Charge against you by your instancing the not tolerating of such persons before-mentioned for if you did as you say desire the just liberty of men as men then every man without respect to Apprehensions Perswasions or Worships as a man and person should be tolerated that those who are Christians might inform them of the true God when they worship false gods And hereby you give great occasion unto those that seek occasion from you when you with a general consent cry against the tolerating the persons of so many sorts of people about differing from you in Religion And as for some of them whom ye would accuse as irregular many by experience can witness that neither Weapon nor Tongue formed against them can prosper and the time may come when you may be glad to be upholden with a little of their strength and not to reject those whom God hath doth and will own for his people in the midst of their Enemies for God hath made them even as eyes to behold the spirits of men and the changings of their ways and to give them a reproof in due season when they darken Wisdom and confound their matter by words without knowledge in false fears and haste when they are out of patience and out of Faith in God as the Baptists here have done and the fearful and unbelieving cannot accomplish the righteousness of God neither will he bring forth his intended Work by them but such as are of a true Spirit that look only at the glory of God and setting up of his Truth who are come to the spiritual Weapons and do not wrestle with flesh and blood but with the powers of darkness and with spiritual wickedness and such as are not false accusers of others but seek the good of all men such will the Lord honor and exalt in his Work and they shall perfect his praise So Friends you have been hasty to utter words before the Lord for which his reproof justly comes upon you Therefore let your words be few mind the fear of the Lord God which is the beginning of wisdom and that will slay your false fears from which unsavoury and unsound words hath proceeded for your Religion is vain while your tongue is not bridled for it is better to be still and keep silence then to utter words from the line of confusion that is stretched over you thereby to get a name in the Earth which Line all people walk in but those who are led by the Spirit of God to speak words that cannot be condemned for it is the Spirit of the Lord God and his Power which must slay the enmity in you which is the ground of your prejudice and hard speeches against the Lambs of Christ which when that is slain within then those evil fruits of the lips will cease without and then the fountain of Life will open in you which brings forth fruits of another nature and when the fruits of your lips is truth righteousness and peace then wil you have fellowship with the Father and the Son and with us who walk in his Light A Copy of a Paper sent to the Council of State in the Year 1659. LEt every one that will minister the Gospel do it freely according to the example of the Apostles and the Ministers of Christ. And do not you go about to provide any maintenance for any Ministers of any sort in the Nation for in that you wil but lay a yoke upon the Disciples necks and an imposition upon tender Consciences which cannot do any thing but what they do freely as unto the Lord and let every one that will preach the Gospel live of the Gospel and not upon any setled or State maintenance for thereby you will but set up another Image and continue the same oppression of tythes though under another name upon the people and will neither ease nor satisfie the people at all for the cry of the honest and godly people of this Nation is to have a free Ministry and free maintenance and are willing fâ—eely to maintain those that minister unto them the Word and Doctrine and are not willing that the Civil Magistrate should meddle with that which relates to spiritual things in this case and so every sort of people in the Nation freely maintaining their own Ministry puts an end unto all troubles suits complaints and petitions of that kind in which the Nation hath long been burdened and troubled with which with much ease and satisfaction to all people this way may be ended and
Logick its like they will set thee no more a work to defend and vindicate them with such weapons Again page 89. thou saist that it is said by the Prophet Prov. 21.4 that the ploughing of the Ploughman is sin Answ. Here thou kast belyed the Prophet and perverted his words aâ— thou hast done the Quakers for the Prophets words is an high look and a proud heart and the ploughing of the wicked is sin but he doth not say that the ploughing of the Ploughman is sin But who can escape the envy of slâ—ndrous tongues which accounteth lying no sin if thereby they can accomplish their own wicked end but the truth hath found thee out and made thee manifest and the Priests had better wanted thy defence then to be so shamed by it as they will be unless they deny both thee and it Again in the same page thou saist to hear read pray sing Psalms and giving of thanks they are works morally good being Commanded by the Lord but the person doing them being not justified they are not good to him for whatsoever is not of Faith is sin Answ. This is another piece of confusion and charging of God foolishly and fasly to say that the Lord commands those things to be done and those he commands to doe them in doing of which it is not good to them but sin Where hast thou learned or where dost thou read of such a doctrine that wicked men are commanded of God to do such things which in doing is not good to them but sin Is God or Christ then the Minister of sin or commands a man to commit sin Is not this Blasphemy and Error in the highest degree And how darest thou speak of God or of his Commands or of his obedience seeing thou thus Blasphems him in his Worship but this shall remain as a Testimony against thee many other lyes and abominations hast thou spoken against us and against God and his Truth a few of which is sufficient to make thee manifest In page 107. thou saist our Quaking fits many are of opinion that they are diobolical by a kind of witchcraft and saist thou hast heard strange relations of Enchanted Ribbans and giveing drink after c. Answ. Upon the same account many was of opinion that Christ had a Devil was a Deceivâ—r that the Apostles were Ringleaders of Sects Heresyes such strange relations might have been heard concerning the Apostles in their dayes it seems to thee that such reports is sufficient proof but this is contrary to what thou hast said in an other place that thou wouldst speak nothing but according to what was written in the Scriptures And whereas thou tells of Enchanted Ribbans Is there some Ribbans that are enchanted it may be thou meanest enchanting Ribbans but if so where didst thou ever know such a thing for proofe thou names Gilpin and Toldervyes books which neither of them doth relate such a thing so that it is thy enmity and wickednesse for there was never any such thing among the Quakers as giving Ribbans and drink after but that charge thou mightst have laid upon the Priests and their Defenders for there are the most ribbans used and justified till in pride they are become the Servants of the Devill and there is the giving of drink one to another untill they be enflamed and made unsensible of God and of his fear by which they are enchanted and bewitched that they doe not obey the Gospell but are given up to their own hearts Lusts and thereby are become the Servants of sin and so free from righteousnesse Lastly not onely we have been falsly accused in these and many other things by thee but even the spirit of God which is the Fountain of cleanness is by thee charged and accused to be corrupt and defiled page 33. by passing through mans corrupt nature thou saidst it becomes defiled Answ. Is not this a sin against the holy Ghost which shall never be forgiven to charge the spirit to be corrupt and defiled And in this thou also chargest both the Father and the Son to be corrupt and defiled for they are one so that if one of them be corrupt the other is corrupt also and as the spirit is in the Saints so is the Father in them and the Son the hope of their glory and none of them are defiled by mans corrupt nature But there is that in man by which that which corrupteth his nature is wrought out so that man is made clean and undefiled by the spirit and that spirit is not made corrupt and defiled by Man for that is contrary to the Scriptuâ—e to say that by mans nature the spirit is defiled but to say that by the spirit mans nature is clensed and sanctified this is according to the Scripture but it is the work of Sathan and his Messengers to Blasphem God in his Temple and so account his spirit by which he leadeth into all truth an unholy thing and so thou art of the number of them which account the blood and spirit of the Covenant an unholy thing and we seeing and knowing these things as concerning our selves we are satisfied because the Servant is not above his Master for if the Master be called Belzebub and the spirit a defiled or corrupt thing well may we be called Deceivers although we be true and falsely accused with all manner of evil according to our Masters words and these things we should bear in patience and silence as to our selves but as in respect unto others we are constrained by the uncorrupted and undefiled Spirit of the Lords to testifie to the world that their deeds are evil and to manifest the workings of Satan in the Mystery of Iniquity which now already worketh in many justifying the wicked and condemning the just which is abomination to the Lord which his Spirit will not bear unreproved and not only the just men are condemned and falsly accused but also the just undefiled eternal and unerring Spirit is accused by him who makes a defence for the Priests in their unrighteous practices and Wages so by the plain evidence and demonstration of Truth he being made manifest to be an Enemy to God by his wicked Works and Words I do judge him not worthy of much more answer to his Book also I do judge him not able to prove any of the false accusations charged in it against us some of which is herein returned unto him again vvhich vvhen he doth but really weigh it and consider it may be he will sit down in silence and wait if there may be hope of his forgiveness for this not only ignorance but wilfulness charging us the Spirit of God and his people vvith that of vvhich they vvere never guilty for vve are in the Truth unto vvhich every tongue shall confess and by vvhich every Opposer shall become silent before the Lord in the Spirit of this Truth do vve desire not the destruction
and whether was Matthias one of the eleven seeing he was not then chosen when Christ did arise from the dead But there needs not much be said to thee only to let thee see thy ovvn folly lest thou should say thou art wise To the eighth thou seemest to affirm that the Scriptures are to be taken as they speak and not otherwise a Mysterie Ans. Then why dost thou and the Priests give meanings to the Scriptures and do not let people take them as they speak but makes them such a Mysterie without your meanings and so plain with them but this is thy practice and doctrine to condemn thy self in the thing that thou allowest and builds again that which thou hast destroyed and so makes thy self a transgressor Lastly In thy conclusion thou falsly chargest me That I do not believe that any of these things mentioned in these Scriptures be really done Which is not my Faith for I do believe that those things mentioned were really done and fulfilled as the Scripture speaks but it is no new thing vvith thee to accuse falsly and to make lyes thy refuge but vvhat in all those things thou hast done against me I do forgive thee and do vvarn thee for the time to come that thou go not on to commit the unpardonable sin against God and his Spirit never to be forgiven Again in thy last paper thou declarest thy ignorance of the two Seeds and askest what be those two seeds Answ. These two the Scripture speaks of the seed of the Woman and the seed of the Serpent 2 Who did or doth sow them seeds Answ. God doth sow the one and the wicked one the other 3 Where be they sown Answ. In man 4 When be they sown Answ. When man had a being and a body to receive them 5 What be the bodies they shall rise with Answ. Their own bodies according to their own natures the one pure and the other defiled 6 Whether be these two seeds and two bodies in all the world or two seeds in every man and the two bodies to or in every man Ans. The seeds are but two in the whole world having each seed its own body and in every one until the one be cast out 7 When shall those seeds arise or be raised whether after the bodily death or after the spiritual death Ans. Every one in its own order after the death of that which is born of the flesh and also after the death of the spiritual wickedness which is yet alive in all hirelings and deceivers such as thou art where the seed of God is yet in its grave 8 What are the graves these are in and out of which they shall arise These of which the Scripture speaks which when thou comest to understand it thou wilt understand both the seeds and graves of which we speak Christ the seed made his grave in the wicked and in the rich in his death and out of that grave shall rise with his body into everlasting life if thou canst receive it thou maist be satisfied And as to the 9. Query Why I say that the one shall rise unto everlasting life and the other unto condemnation Ans. Because it is so therefore I say so and if thou say to the contrary make it manifest but in this as in other things thy folly and ignorance is manifest to ask why I speak the truth which thou thy self darest not deny to be truth R. H. A short Relation of the twelve changes of Government that hath been in England within these 8 years under all of which we have suffered Persecution SInce by the Lord we were called chosen and separated to be his people and had unto us committed the word of Reconciliation and since his eternal power broke forth and was manifest amongst us hath he done great things in the Earth for he hath prepared his way and made it plain before the face of all people by the appearance and testimony of his eternal light in their hearts which hath not onely there shined but is broken forth into a life of Righteousness in many whom the Lord hath accounted worthy to be his servants in his Work to raise up a seed unto Jacob and to gather the dispersed of Israel and Judah both Jews and Gentiles into the Covenant of Light and Life with the Father from whence they are erred by transgression and for the accomplishing of this work and service hath the Lord furnished us with spiritual Weapons to war even against spiritual wickedness in high places 2 Cor. 10.4.5 and against the Rulers of the darkness of this World Ephâ—s 6.12 which hath appeared under many Forms and Governments since the breakings forth of truth in this Nation Yea many Heads or Governments hath been raised up and cast down again by one Hand and Power and have all from the Lord through his Servants had a word of Wisdom and Counsel administred unto them what they should do that they might be established which if they did not the Lord would break them to pieces which word of the Lord was fulfilled upon them all And every divers Head had a Horn in it to push at the Lambs of Christ withal and at every appearance of his Spirit and Power in his people but for his Elect sake was their days shortned and his breakings and destruction came upon them according to his word spoken to them by his servants at divers times And it is to be observed as the Lords doing and ordering by his mighty power that within this eight years siâ—ce we have been persecuted and cruelly used for the Name and Testimony of Jesus and the Answer of a pure Conscience there hath been twelve Changes of Government in this Nation which have all of them more or less been guilty of our Sufferings either in acting against us or in suffering others to act cruelly and not endeavouring to restrain them when they had power in their hands to do it and the sufferings laid before them who suffered for righteousness sake so that they could not plead ignorance but was left without excuse which now in the day of their misery and tribulation some of them do consider it when their time is no more I. As first in the time of the long Parliament in the Year One thousand six hundred fifty two although many pretended some prayed and some fought for Liberty of Conscience in matters of Religion yet at that time were we imprisoned beat and persecuted for obeying and worshipping our God in Spirit and Truth according to his teaching and at that time the Priests rage begun to burn like fire and they run one unto another and kindled the wrath in one another against the Truth even to petition against the spreading of it and those that walked in it as a dangerous thing and they generally with one consent called the Truth Heresie Delusion and Blasphemy and those that ministred it abroad they called Ring-leaders of Sects as in the Apostles days
Scriptures and though our way be called the sink of all heresie as the Apostle was called the ringleader of the Sect of the Nazerens and his way Heresie yet in it do we worship the God of our Fathers though the chief Priests do call it so yet that doth not mâ—ke it so no more then it did in the Apostles days for we are manifest to God in all our ways and unto that of God in every mans conscience Again Priest Clapham accuseth us for working of miracles naming several places in which they vvere vvrought in the eighth Section of his Book so that all may take notice that in vvhomsoever the Lord is manifest to make his povver knovvn in doing good that is the object of â—is envy so that it is manifest that he doth not despise us but God and his povver so as if the povver of God vvere not manifest in us to convert turn unto God and seal vve should not be despised by him And also take notice that the grounds of his knowledge of these things is reports that came to him as himself declares in his eighth Section and yet in the beginning of his book he saith he vvill lay nothing to our charge but vvhat he hath sufcient personal knovvledge of himself Novv he hath not been personally present in seeing or hearing any of those things vvhich he chargeth against uâ— as pretended Mâ—racles and so the beginning and end of his vvork is a lye and in page 51. of his book he charges us with some in Yorkshire poisoning of themselves in prison which is false and he hath it but from a false report and so hath no personal knowledge of it himself And likewise he saiâ—h That the light that all be enlightned withal is the light of reason and understanding and that this light is natural and thâ—t it is the light of nature and that the natural light is the remainder of Gods image as in pag. 57. Answ. Here hath he fully manifested his ignorance of the light and of Gods image as first Of the Light calling it the light of reason Now some are unreasonable men and so all have not reason and some are Idiots and so have not understanding So then all are not enlightned with reason and understanding but Christ calls it not reason nor understanding but calls it the light which is the condemnation of all thâ—m that do not believe in it and with it those works which are wrought in God are justified and that which is after the flesh is condemned and that which is able to justifie and condemn the creature in the sight of God according to their obedience or disobedience to God is not natural for there is no other condemnation buâ— the light which whosoever believes in it are the children of it and who are children of it are children of God and heirs of the everlasting inheritance and they that walked in it was the light of the World and their light shined before men and upon whom doth not his light arise Mat. 5.14 Job 25 3. The wicked and deceitful man doth the Lord enlighten they whose deeds are evil though they that rebel against the light knows not the ways of it nor abide in the pathâ— of it Job 24.13 And many such are in this generation and are as Job did see that such have light though they walk not in the paths of it nor known at the ways of it because they hate it but to the light in such are we made manifest and it shall witness us before the Lord And such as were fools and scorners and vvithout understanding the Lord bids them return at his reproof them vvho did hate knovvledge and said I vvill pour out my spirit upon you and make knovvn my vvords unto you but they hated knovvledge and did not chuse the fear of the Lord they vvould none of Gods counsels but despised all his reproof therefore saith God they shall eat of the fruit of their own way and be filled with their own devices for the turning away of the simple shall slay them and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them Prov. 1.23 29 30 32. Mark this is one with your case who hate the light which doth reprove you by you the simplicity of Christ is turned away and despised and your folly remains who hate the light and calls it natural reason or understanding but Christ calls it the light which is the condemnation of all them that do not believe in it And again to say that is the remainder of Gods image which is natural is blasphemy for the image of God is spiritual Christ the express image of the Fathers person and if there be a remainder of Gods image in all men since the fall as Clapham affirmeth then there remains that which is spiritual in all men but to him I say let all flesh be silent from saying that the light or any thing of Gods image is natural for such things will not the Lord suffer unpunished Pr. Again Clapham in the 12. Section of his Book saith That God is said to be a respecter of persons and brings Gen. 4.4 5. to prove it The Lord had respect unto Abel but unto Cain he had no respect Answ. Abel was righteous and Cain was wicked and God had respect unto the righteous and unto the seed and so it is now in all Nations Kindreds Tongues and People every one that fears God and works righteousness is accepted of him as Abel was And God is no respecter of persons for unto Cain God saith If thou dost well shalt thou not be accepted so if Cain had done well he should have been accepted as Abel was So let God be true and every man a lyar that saith God is a respecter of persons when as the Scripture saith God is no respecter of persons neither did the Apostles respect any mans person but declare against such as do calling such filthy dreamers which had mens persons in admiration because of advantage and those were they which spoke great swelling words and separated themselves sensual having not the spirit against whom Jude is a witness Jude 8 16 17. and against such are we witnesses and the Apostle James in his Epistle to the twelve Tribes he is a witness against such that respect persons and told them that the Law which is light would convince them that it was sin and such was traâ—sgressors and did not abide in the doctrine of Christ hath not the Father nor the Son as John witnesseth 2 John 1.9 and all such as do respect persons now the Law of Christ which is written in the heart whose Law is light will convince them to be transgressors and so the light which convinceth is one with the Apostles doctrine but contrary to Jo. Clapham Pr. Which again saith That grace is a created thing and that the Scriptures calls it the new creature and brings Eph. 2.10 2 Cor. 5.17 to prove it Answ. Here is no such
but the repentance and forgiveness of our Enemies And those that do abuse us wrong us ignorantly their sins vvil be sooner blotted out than those who wilfully have set their hearts and tongues to vvork vvickedness for they shall receive the greater condemnation The kâ—â—â—â—edge and life of Truth is that we desire all people may comâ—â—â—to that by it the povver of the vvicked one may be taken avvay vvhich so furiously vvorketh in the hearts of those vvhich receive not the Truth in the love of it but bring forth floods of enmity and bitterness against the Lambs of Christ but the love of God vvhich thinketh no evil neither doth any unto another is that which when it is felt obeyed in all wil dry up those floods from off the face of the earth that there may be a place of rest for the redeemed and elect Seed who only hath the Lord and his Light for their Habitation and the Sword of the Spirit which is the Word of God for their Armour and Defence Something that lately passed in discourse between the King and R. H. Published to prevent the mistakes and errors in a Copy lately printed contrary to the knowledge or intention of the party concerned and not onely so but also misprinted and abusâ—d in several particulars therefore it was thought convenient for the removing of errors and mistakes to be re-printed in a more true foâ—m and ordâ—r for the satisfaction of others R. H. SInce the Lord hath called us and gathered us to be a people to walk in his fear and in his truth we have alwayes suffered and been persecuted by the Powers that have ruled and been made a prey of for departing from iniquity and when the breach of no just Law could be charged against us then they made Laws of purpose to ensnare us and so our sufferings were unjustly continued King It is true those that have ruled over you have been cruel and have professed much which they have not done R. H. And likewise the same sufferings do now abound in more cruelty against us in many parts of this Nation as for instance one at Thetford in Norfolk where Henry Fell ministring unto the people was taken out of the Meeting 〈◊〉 whipped and sent out of the Town from Parish to Parish â—â—â—ards Lancashire and the chief ground of his Accusation in his Pass which was shewn to the King was because he denied to take the Oath of Allegiance and Supremacy and so because that for Conscience-sake we cannot swear but have learned obedience to the Doctrine of Christ which saith Swear not at all hereby an occasion is taken against us to persecute us and it is well known that we have not sworn for any nor against any but have kept to the truth and our yea hath been yea and our nay nay in all things which is more then the Oath of those that are out of the truth King But why can you not swear for an oath is a common thing amongst men to any engagement R.H. Yes it is manifest and we have seen it by experience and it is so common amongst men to swear and engage either for or against things that there is no regard taken to them nor fear of an Oath that therefore which we speak of in the truth of our hearts is more than what they swear King But can you not promise as before the Lord which is the substance of the Oath R. H. Yes what we do affirm we can promise before the Lord and take him to our Witness in it but our so promising hath not been accepted but the ceremony of an oath they have stood for without which all other things were accounted of no effect King But how may we know from your words that you will perform R. H. By proving of us for they that swear are not known to be faithful but by proving of them so we by those that have tryed us are found to be truer in our promises than others by their Oaths and to those that do yet prove us we shall appear the same King Pray what is your Principle R. H. Our Principle is this That Jesus Christ is the true Light which enlighteneth every one that cometh into the world that all men through him might believe and that they were to obey and follow this Light as they have received it vvhereby they may be led unto God and unto righteousness and the knowledge of the truth that they may be saved King This do all Christians confess to be truth and he is not a Christian that will deny it R. H. But many have denied it both in words and writings and opposed us in it and above an hundred Books are put forth in opposition unto this Principle That some of the Lords standing by the King said that none would deny that every one is enlightened Lord. And one of the Lords asked how long we had been called Quakers or did we own that Name R. H. That Name was given to us in scorn and derision about twelve years since but there was some that lived in this truth before we had that Name given unto us King How long is it since you owned this Iudgement and Way R. H. It is near twelve years since I owned this Truth according to the manifestation of it King Do you own the Sacrament R. H. As for the Word Sacrament I do not read of it in the Scripture but as for the body and blood of Christ I own and that there is no remission without blood King Well that is it But do you noc believe that every one is commanded to receive it R. H. This we do believe That according as it is written in the Scripture that Christ at his last Supper took Bread brake it and gave to his Disciples and also took the Cup and blessed it and said unto them And as often as ye do this that is as often as they brake bread you shew forth the Lords death till he come and this we believe they did and they eat their bread in singleness of heart from house to house and Christ did come again to them according to his promise after which they said We being many are one bread for we are all partakers of this one bread Kings Friend Then one of the Kings Friends said It is true for as many grains make one bread so they being many members were one body Another of them said If they be the bread then they must be broken R.H. There is difference between that Bread which he brake at his last Supper vvherein they vvere to shevv forth as in a sign his death until he came and this vvhereof they speak they being many are one bread for herein they vvere come more into the substance and to speak more mystically as they knevv it in the Spirit Kings Friends Then they said It is truth and he had spoken nothing but truth King How know you that you are Inspired by the
Lord R. H. According as vve read in the Scriptures That the inspiration of the Almighty giveth understanding so by its inspiration is an understanding given us of the things of God Lord. Then one of the Lords said How do you know that you are led by the true Spirit R. H. This we know because the Spirit of truth it reproves the world of Sin and by it we were reproved of sin and also are led from sin unto righteousness and obedience of truth by which effects vve knovv it is the true Spirit for the spirit of the vvicked one doth not lead into such things King and Lords Then the King and his Lords said It was truth King Well of this you may be assured That you shall none of you suffer for your Opinions or Religion so long as you live peaceably and you have the Word of a King for it and I have also given forth a Declaration to the same purpose that none shall wrong you nor abuse you King How do you own Magistrates or Magistracy R. H. Thus vve do ovvn Magistrates Whosoever is set up by God whether King as Supream or any set in Authority by him who are for the punishment of evil doers and the praise of them that do well such we shall submit unto and assist in righteous and civil things both by body and Estate And if any Magistrates do that which is unrighteous we must declare against it only submit under it by a patient suffering and not rebel against any by insurrections plots and contrivances King Then the King said That is enough Lord. Then one of the Lords asked Why do you meet together seeing every â—ne of you have the Church in your selves R. H. According as it is written in the Scriptures the Church is in God Thes. 1.1 And they that feared the Lord did meet often together in the fear of the Lord and to us it is profitable and herein we are edified and strengthened in the life of truth King How did you first come to believe the Scriptures were truth R. H. I have believed the Scriptures from a child to be a Declaration of truth when I had but a literal knowledge natural education and tradition but now I know the Scriptures to be true by the manifestation and operation of the Spirit of God fulfilling them in me King In what manner do you méet and what is that order in your méetings R. H. We do meet in the same order as the people of God did waiting upon him and if any have a word of exhortation from the Lord he may speak it or if any have a word of reproof or admonition and as every one hath received the gift so they may minister one unto another and may be edified one by another whereby a grovvth into the knowledge of the truth is administred to one another One of the Lords Then you know not so much as you may know but there is a growth then to be admitted of R. H. Yes vve do grovv daily into the knovvledge of the truth in our exercise and obedience to it King Are any of your Friends gone to Rome R. H. Yes there is one in Prison in Rome King Why did you send him thither R. H. We did not send him thither but he found something upon his Spirit from the Lord whereby he was called to go to declare against Superstition and Idolatry vvhich is contrary to the Will of God Kings Friend said There were two of them at Rome but one was dead King Have any of your Friends been with the Great Turk R. H. Some of our Friends have been in that Countrey Other things were spoken concerning the liberty of the servants of the Lord which vvere called of him into his service that to them there vvas no limitation to Parishes or places but as the Lord did guide them in his Work and Service by his Spirit So the King promised that we should not any ways suffer for our Opinion or Religion and so in love passed away R. H. His Answer to John Horn. J. H. IN thy Answer to my Queries thou seemest to be resolved to say something although it be absolutely contrary to the truth and to that which thou knowest to be Truth as will appear in what follows In answer to my first thou sayest Christ in his Spirit ascended up to Heaven when his Body was upon Earth Is this an answer to the Question Is the mind or Spirit called the Son of man according to John 3.13 which came down from Heaven And no man doth ascend up to Heaven but the Son of man which was then in Heaven So by this thy Answer it appears then that the Spirit is the Son of man and that there is no other Son of man that ascends into Heaven but the Spirit then what becomes of that body thou speaks of if the Spirit only be that Son of man In thy Answer to the second and third Queries thou provest in thy way that Mary did that which was forbidden by Christ when she held him by the feet and worshipped him but in Mat. 28.9 there is no forbidding of her to touch him but this is plainly manifest that thou art in a snare and cannot tel how to get out and yet thou wilt be saying something though thereby thou more ensnares thy self but this Scripture thou wilt once know fulfilled The Wicked shall be silent in darkness When thou shouldst answer to the fourth thou tellest of its being a secret and of prying into things above what is vvritten although the ground of my Query is grounded upon that vvhich is vvritten in Luke 24.4 To the fifth thou saist That the Women did distinguish which was Christ vvas certain but hovv they did so is a foolish curious Question What certainty is there that they did knovv vvhen thou knovvest not hovv but this is like the rest of the Priests doctrine beating the air and leaving all people in uncertainties and yet would be paid for so doing but the Lord hath made thee manifest with the rest that you cannot deceive much longer To the sixth thou sayest the two Angels were seen visibly but were not Bodies nor Persons of men but in thy answer to the fourth saist that they both saw them as men and heard them speak and had two individual Forms Now if thou wert but simple and not wilfully blind thou mightest be the more excused In thy answer to the seventh thou art more lost and confused then in all the rest for when thou shouldst answer who were the eleven Disciples that were met together mentioned Luk 24.33 thou saist that Thomas might occasionally be gone out Ans. If he was gone out then the eleven was not together as Luke 24. Again thou saist that Matthias was chosen before the Evangelist wrote his Book What darkness and ignorance is this Thou art not questioned when the Book was written nor when Matthias was chosen but who was the eleven that was together