principles of Christianitie or not I neede not heere aske vpon what or whom your 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Catholikes doe rely their faith when they reade either the ould vulgar Latine translation or the Remish English seeing they can no more nor better iudge of these translations whether they be true or false then we I doe not I say aske whereon they rely their faith for it seemeth that they build not their faith so much vpon the written word of God in the Scriptures as vnwritten traditions of men customes of fathers decrees of councels and especially vpon the will and pleasure of their great God as his owne friends call him the Pope of Rome Whose will is the rule of their faith and life If he giue a dispensation for a man to mary his owne sister as Pope Martin the fift did it is lawfull if he giue a dispensation for one to many his sisters daughter which is as vnlawfull as the other as a late Pope gaue to the late King Philip of Spaine it is lawfull But yet if any of these counted Catholikes will pretend to build their faith vpon the Scriptures and being ignorant of the Hebrew and Greeke tongues readeth either the vulgar Latine or English Remish translation of the new Testament I would aske how he doth know whether these translations be true or false or whether he will say that his faith dependeth vpon the credit and fidelitie of the translator or no But I know what they will answere that the Latine vulgar translation is allowed by the Church that is to say by the councell of Trident which representeth the Church which hath decreed the same to be taken for authenticall in readings disputations sermons or expositions and that no man be bold or presume vpon any pretence to reiect or refuse it whereunto first I say that as this decree doth allow the Latine so it doth not approue the English Now how shall an English Catholike that vnderstandeth not the Latine know whether the same be truely translated out of the Latine or no or shall his faith here rely vpon the credit and fidelitie of the translator I would know what difference there is betweene such a one reading or hearing that translation and one of vs reading or hearing ours And why the faith of the one doth more depend vpon the credit and fidelitie of the translator then the other Surely this difference there is that our translations be true and agreeable to the originall of the Greeke wherein the holy Ghost indited and the Apostles did write the new Testament and their said Remish translation is false differing from the same in contradictions additions and detractions in very many places as I haue shewed in a discourse thereof added to the confutation of the ten foolish reasons which the Remish vse in the preface of the Testament by them set forth which moued them in translating to leaue the originall fountaine of the Greeke and to follow the corrupt streame of the Latine which hath been extant in print these twelue yeares and yet to this day neuer answered Now as touching the decree of the councell of Trident for the Latine made by about fourtie blind Bishops or Bussards I say it is a shameful decree and a fit one for such a councel and such a one as cannot be shewed in any of all the councels that haue bin before in the Church of Christ to authorize a translation so much differing dissenting from the Hebrew and Greeke as it doth to be authenticall that is to haue authoritie of it selfe and not to be refused in any readings preachings c. The which translation is so corrupt and full of faults that Isodorus Clarius a Spanish Monke professeth that he found eight thousand faults in it the which preface of his as they haue since suppressed so it is written that the Spanish inquisitors plagued him for it But to admit that this Latine translation is authenticall as the Tridentine councell hath decreed I would aske one of these Catholikes vpon what edition thereof they will rely their faith whether that which of late yeares was set out at Rome by Pope Sixtus the fift or another two or three yeares after by this present Pope Clemens the eight The which editions doe greatly differ in alterations additions detractions contradictions as Master Thomas Iames hath verie diligently and largely shewed The former Pope Sixtus the fift had as he professeth such care to haue the Bible vncorruptly set fourth and printed that he corrected the faults with his owne hand and charged that none should afterwards be printed but according to that copie Ne minima quidem particula mutata addita vel detracta as he in his preface saith that is not the least particle changed added or detracted yet this Pope Clemens the eight hath as I haue said made many great alterations additions and detractions in the same Hereof I will alledge an example or two for a tast Iosue 11. 19. Sixtus edition hath Non fuit ciuitas quae se non traderet filijs Israel praeter 〈◊〉 .i. There was not a Citie which did not yeeld it selfe to the children of Israel beside the Hiuite Clemens thus Non fuit ciuitas quae se traderet filijs c. There was not a Citie which did yeeld it selfe to the children of Israel c. the one negatiuely the other affirmatiuely Lib. 1. Esdrae cap. 3. Sixtus saith Sursum autem adportam equorum adisicauerunt that is they built vpward to the gate of the horses Clemens aporta equotum from the gate of the horses Lib. Sapienlia cap. 2. 11. Sixtus hath iustitiae iustice Clemens hath iniustitâ—ae that is iniustice 1. Sam. or as they count Reg. 4. 7. Clemens hath taken all these words out of Sixtus exact edition Viuâ— dominus quia nisi dominus perousserit eum aut dies eius veneâ—ic vt moriatur aut descendens in praelium perierit propitius mihi sit dominus vt non mittam manum meam in Christum domini that is as the Lord liueth that except the Lord siâ—ite him or his dayes come that he dye or going downe to the battle he perish the Lord be so mercifull to me that I will not lay mine hand vpon the Lords annointed The like detractions you may reade 2. Samuel or 2. Reg. 6. 12. ibid. 21. cap. 8. 8. ibid. vers 13. and many other places as the reader may see in the said editions and in Master Iames collections vpon which of these so greatly differing will the Catholike rely his feith And here let him consider whether the Pope may erre or not for that one of these Popes erred especially Pope Sixtus notwithstanding all his great care and diligence in correcting the Bible with his owne hand it cannot be denied Such great varietie diuersitie and faithles infidelitie I am sure that the author of this worthie pamphlet and all his companions cannot shew in our
Erasmus saith we iustly reiect and condemne We exhort men when they come to receiue that holy mysterie the Sacrament and pledge of our saluation in Christ to examine themselues and so to eate of that breade and drinke of that cup For he that eateth and drinketh vnworthily eateth and drinketh his owne damnation because he discerneth not the Lords bodie But if as you say sinfull liues conforte not with this sacred mysterie I meruaile how your Priests liues consorted with it which how holy they were I will shew hereafter Lastly you charge vs with a new negatiue religion wholy standing vpon negation of Sacraments ceremonies rites lawes customes and other practicall points of the Catholike Church whereunto I answere that we deny nothing that God hath commaunded in the holy canonicall Scriptures the which as I haue before shewed is the onely rule of our religion and life In deede we deny and defie your trifling traditions and vnwritten vanities and inuentions with the which you haue gone a whoring as the Prophet saith If you can shew that we deny any thing which God hath commaunded as wee can plainely proue that you doe then spare not to charge vs with a new negatiue religion You deny the sufficiencie of the Scriptures and that all doctrine necessarie to saluation is contayned in them You deny the same Scriptures to bee in the vulgar tongue for all Gods people to reade and heare to their comfort You deny prayer and the publike seruice of God to be in the same vulgar tongue You deny Christ to be our only mediator betweene God vs. You deny the Cup of Christs Supper to Gods people You deny the lawful authoritie which Princes haue ouer their people subiects in all causes ecclesiasticall and temporall You deny mariage to ecclesiasticall ministers whereby what great and horrible wickednesse you haue caused I will hereafter declare You say we bring in for fasting feasting for praying playing c. Concerning your fasting consisting in a superstitious obseruing of times and diuersitie of meates and tending to the honouring of Saints and satisfying Gods iustice for your sins we deny it But fasting purely vsed according to Gods word to humble our soules before God to mortifie the wicked affections of our sinful flesh we allow and especially that great and principall fast in abstayning from sinne whereof Saint Augustine speaketh in these words Ieiunium autom magnum gerale est abstinere ab iniquitatibus ab illicitis voluptatibus seculi quod est perfectum ieiunium in hoc seculo The great and generall fast is to abstaine from iniquities and vnlawfull pleasures of the world which is the perfect fast in this world Chrysostome saith Ieiunium dico abstinentiam à vitijs I say that fasting which is to abstaine from vices Hereby let it be discerned who doe most truely fast In deede I know that it is your manner much to glorie in your writings and speeches of your outward fasting from meates as the Pharisee in the Gospell did who gloried that he fasted twise a weeke which neither God in his law had required nor the Apostles of Christ for any thing we reade vsed Whereby wee may note that true godlynes neither is to bee measured by such outward abstinence from meates nor is alwayes ioyned with it Iohn Baptist vsed greater austeritie in his diet and abstinence from meates then our Sauiour Christ did yet was his life nothing so holy Iohns Disciples vsed more fasting then the Disciples of our Sauiour Christ did Yet it is not to be doubted but our Sauiours Disciples liued as godly or more then they did The Montanists Heretikes were greater fasters then were y e true Christians as Tertullian sheweth And S. Hierome writeth y t they obserued three Lents in a yeere and yet were Heretikes condemned by the Church of God although then fauoured by the Bishop of Rome as Tertullian sheweth in the beginning of his booke against Praxeas The Iewes vsed such great abstinence and fasting that they brought weakenesse and sickenesse to their bodies as Saint Hieromie writeth who neuerthelesse were enemies to our Sauiour Christ The Moscouites which neuer acknowledged the Popes authoritie bee as great fasters as Papists are And so also be the Turkes And therefore these men neede not to boast so much of their fasting Saint Paul saith that bodily exercise profiteth little but godlinesse is profitable to all things and hath the promise of this life present and that which is to come Howbeit as I will not deny but that there may be lesse fasting and more feasting then were requisit yet that there is more feasting and superfluitie in fare now especially in ecclesiastical persons I thinke it would be too hard for this man to proue Whence came these phrases As fat as an Abbot he hath a face like an Abbot and an Abbey Lubber but of their immoderate fare and feeding And how these men were giuen to gluttonie and excesse I will shew at this time but by one example Giraldus Cambrensis in his Booke intituled Speculum Ecclesiae writeth that the Abbot and Monkes of Saint Swithens in Winchester came to King Henry the second hunting at Gilford in Surrey and fell downe in myre and durt before him pitifully crying out The King asked them what was the matter They answered that their Bishop had taken three dishes of meate from their dinners and suppers He asked them how many he had left vnto them They answered tenne but from the foundation of their house they had vsed daily to haue thirteene dishes at a meale The king turned to his Nobles and said By the eyes of God for that was his oath I thought their house had bin burnt and now I see it is but a matter concerning their paunches And then turning to the Abbot and Monkes said If your Bishop deale not with you as I haue done with my court to bring you to three dishes I would he were hanged This was the remedie that these gluttonous Monkes found at the hands of that prudent Prince Where the reader may note not onely the great gluttonie but shameles impudencie of these men or monsters in making such a lamentable complaint for wanting of three dishes hauing tenne remayning The same Cambrensis writeth that in some Abbeies they had at euery meale sixteene dishes which slender diet was a good meanes to preserue their vowed virginitie Hereof came the old ryming verse O monachi vestri stomachi sunt amphora Bacchi c. To come to the next I wish there were more praying and lesse playing then there is yet this wil I say that there is now more true praying according to the will of God lesse playing then was euer in poperie Dicing and carding is in some reformed Churches abolished and of those that truely professe the Gospel lesse vsed then it hath been of Papists But I wil not stand to
vsuall amongst you and your fellowes in such sort to abuse the word of God The words of Saint Iohn be these Iohn to the seuen Churches which are in Asia Grace be with you and peace from him which is and which was and which is to come and from the seuen spirits which are before his throne and from Iesus Christ c. What meaneth this man to alledge this for inuocation of Saints will he by these seuen spirits vnderstand the Saints either he knoweth little or he cannot be ignorant that this is expounded of the holy Ghost who although he be in person one yet by the communication of his vertue and demonstration of his diuine workes in those seuen Churches doth so perfectly shew himselfe as though there were so many spirits euery one working in his peculiar Church Ambrose set out by Doctor Tunstall Bishop of Duresme writeth vpon these words thus Hic tota trinitas demonstratur that is heere the whole Trinitie is shewed and a little after Per septem autem spiritus spiritus sanctus eò quod sit septiformis intelligitur that is By the seuen spirits the holy Ghost is vnderstoode because he worketh seuen manner of wayes And hard it were or rather absurd to pray for grace and peace from Saints and that before Iesus Christ But vpon this I will not stand onely the reader may consider how barren this cause is which hath no plainer proofes and driueth this man to such priuate and false exposition of Gods word Now whereas you say that by prayer you glorifie the Saints in heauen I say that by prayer we doe glorifie God Call vpon me in the day of trouble and I will deliuer thee and thou shalt glorifie me But that by prayer we should glorifie Saints I doe not finde in all the holy Scriptures If this man can why doth he not shew it I finde that God will not giue his glorie to any other and that the Saints with Dauid say Not vnto vs O Lord not vnto vs but vnto thy name giue the glorie for thy louing mercie and thy truths sake And that the Angell would not be worshiped or glorified but said vnto Iohn worship God As touching the Saints mediation when Iesus Christ shall cease to be our mediator and to sit at the right hand of God to make intercession for vs then we will seeke to your mediation of Saints In the meane time take you heede that in attributing that to the Saints which is proper and peculiar to the sonne of God yea which he hath bought with his bloud you doe not deny the Lord which hath bought vs and that you doe not horribly dishonor those Saints and make Idols of them Furthermore you say that we deny the communion of the Church militant and the soules in purgatorie c. Whereunto I answer y t when you shal plainely and pithily proue this your fayned fire of purgatorie which the Greeke Church alwayes hath denyed then we wil yeeld vnto you and graunt our selues to be to blame in not helping these seely soules with dirges masses c. out of the paines of this forged fire You quote in your margent for proofe thereof 1. Cor. 3. v. 15. 15. v. 29. Alas poore purgatorie that hath no better proofes The words of S. Paul in the first place be these If a mans worke burne he shall lose but he shall be saued himselfe neuerthelesse yet as it were by fire Here is mention of fire and therfore it must needs be the fire of purgatorie for such is the great iudgement of these worthie writers that if they reade in the Scriptures or Fathers this word fire it is none other but the fire of purgatorie if sacrifice it is the sacrifice of the Masse if confessiō it can be nothing but auricular confession to the priest if tradition it is vnwrittē verities or vanities But touching these places of S. Paul because the author of this Pamphlet doth not alledge them but barely quote them I will but briefely touch them To the first I say that S. Paul there speaketh not of all men but onely of teachers and preachers which be builders of Gods house and Church which euen Bellarmine confesseth Secondly he speaketh not of all their workes but onely of their doctrine whereby they build the Church of God Thirdly he speaketh not of the purging of workes or persons but of the probation of doctrines Fourthly the works are said to be proued and not the persons Lastly if this place should be vnderstood of purgatorie then euery man should bee throwne into it for it is said the fire shall try euery mans worke of what sort it is but this is contrarie to the doctrine of the papists who will not haue all men come into purgatorie These things plainly shew that this place cannot be vnderstoode of purgatorie Saint Augustine in many places doth vnderstand it of the afflictions and troubles sustained in this life and not of the paines of Purgatorie after this life Enchir. ad Laurentium cap. 68. de ciuit Dei lib. 21 cap. 26. de side operibus cap. 16. in Psal 80. But S. Paul speaketh of triall of doctrine shewing that as the fire trieth mettals so the light of Gods truth trieth doctrines and as gold and siluer abide in the fire and hay and stubble be consumed so true sound and holy doctrines abide the light and triall of Gods word when either vntrue doctrines or vaine speculations perish and be consumed So doth S. Ambrose expound it Mala doctrina in igne omnibus apparebit nunc enim quosdam fallit that is Euill doctrine shall appeare vnto all in the fire for now it deceiueth some Againe Mala enim adultera doctrina idcirco in ligno foeno stipula significata est vt ostenderetur ignis esse esca that is Euill and counterfeit doctrine is therfore signified by wood hay and stubble that it might be shewed that it is but meate to be consumed of fire And againe Ignis ergo hic Christi sermo est bonus ignis c. This fire is the word of Christ and it is a good fire which warmeth but burneth not but onely sinnes By this fire that gold of the Apostle laid vpon the good foundation is tried By this fire that siluer of manners or workes is proued By this fire those pretious stones are lightened but the hay and stubble is consumed Therefore this fire clenseth the soule and consumeth error Hitherto S. Ambrose whereby we may see y t neither S. Augustine nor S. Ambrose expound this place of Purgatorie much lesse the Greeke Fathers who neuer acknowledged it Therfore to expoūd it of Purgatorie as the Papists do whether it be not a priuate false exposition let y e godly reader vprightly iudge The words of the other place here quoted are these Else what shall they doe which are baptized for the dead if the dead rise not at all why
the Euangelist expoundeth himselfe So Hilarius saith Dictorum intelligentia aut ex praepositis aut ex consequentibus expectetur that is The vnderstanding of the sayings is to be looked for either of those things which goe before or those that follow after So Clemens saith Ex ipsis scripturis sensum capere veritatis oportet From the Scriptures themselues we must take the sense and exposition of truth Finally so Pope Pius the second Ab ipsa scripture recipiendus est sensus veritatis that is The vnderstanding of the truth is to be receiued from the Scripture it selfe Now how carefully and diligently we endeuour to doe this that is to expound the holy Scriptures truely and sincerely by the Scriptures themselues God knoweth our writings and sermons doe shew and the consciences of those that reade and heare them can witnes with vs. And this is also an argument hereof that you cannot bring forth any places of the Scriptures which we falsely expound or seeke violently and wickedly to wrest from the true and simple sense of the holy Ghost contained in the holy Scriptures The which this cauiller should haue done and thereby declare how we builde our faith vpon priuate and false expositions But let vs see and examine his proofe of his Minor which is that because we builde not our faith vpon the exposition of the Church the Fathers or Councels therefore we builde vpon our owne priuate expositions I answere that although we reuerence the iudgement of the true Church of God the holy Fathers and Councels yet by this that I haue before alledged it plainely appeareth that we are to fetch the sense and exposition of the Scriptures not from them but from the Scriptures themselues And whereas you by the Church doe meane the Romish Church I will shew hereafter that she hath corrupted and falsely expounded the Scriptures As touching the Doctors we are not bound vnto their expositions which sometimes be not sound and sometimes differ among themselues Yea Cardinal Caietanus plainely auoucheth this and doubteth not to bring sometimes senses and expositions to the Scriptures which be not in all the Doctors His words be these Nullus itaque detestetur nouum sacrae scripturae sensum ex hoc quod dissonat à priscis doctoribus Sed scrutetur perspicacius textum ac contextum scripturae siquadrare inuenerit laudet Deum qui non alligauit expositionem scripturarum sacrarum pristorum doctorum sensibus c. that is Let no man hereupon detest or dislike a new exposition of the holy Scripture because it dissenteth from the ould Doctors But let him more sharpely search the text and Coherence of the Scriptures and if he finde it to agree therewith let him praise God who hath not bound the exposition of the holy Scriptures to the senses and expositions of the ancient Doctors Yea Bishop Fisher a great patrone of the Popes doubteth not to affirme that many things in the Gospel and other Scriptures be now more exactly discussed and more plainely vnderstoode then they were of old time of the Fathers and that there be yet many obscure and hard places which will be much better vnderstoode of the posteritie whereby it appeareth that his Iudgement was that the exposition of the Scriptures is not to be tyed vnto the Fathers and then much lesse to the Councels which doe not expound in order the bookes of the Scriptures as the Fathers did but onely examined some places and discussed some Doctrines which were in controuersie Moreouer whereas Saint Augustine in his foure bookes de doctrina christiana entreateth largely of the exposition of the Scriptures and giueth many good and learned lessons concerning the same and namely seuen rules of Ticonius the Donatist which he commendeth and calleth them keyes to open the Scripture neither he nor Ticonius doe make mention of these rules which the author of this pamphlet doth here set downe nor referre vs vnto them Therefore these be new coined rules of your owne voyde of the testimonie of antiquitie But that the Christian reader may see who they be that builde their faith vpon priuate and false expositions of the Scripture let vs come to the examination of some particular places of the Scripture and see who they be that follow priuate and false expositions The wordes of our Sauiour Christ drinke ye all of it they expound that Christ spake them onely to his Apostles which as they terme them were priests and therefore this bindeth priests to drinke of the Cup but not the lay people So saith Iohn Fisher the Bishop of Rochester Bibite ex eo omnes Quae verba proculdubio solis erant dicta sacerdotibus quibus potestas tum fuerat collata conficiendi sacramenti nimirum hijs verbis hoc facite in meam commemorationem that is Drinke all of this which words without all doubt were spoken onely to priests to whom power also was giuen to make the Sacrament that is by these words doe this in remenbrance of me The same in effect wrote Cardinall Hosius Doctor Harding Andradius Aeneas Siluius and others This exposition although peraduenture it wil not be counted priuate for that it is maintained by so many great men yet it is a very false absurd exposition and easily to be discerned by any simple man For if these words Drinke ye all of it were spoken onely to priests then likewise these Take ye eate ye were spoken onely to priests And so by your wise exposition as none but priests by these words are bound to drinke of the Cup so none but priests are bound to take and eate the bread as it was the manner and custome of the common people in Liuonia not to receiue this Sacrament at all as Gerson writeth But if our Sauiour Christ did speake the one to all both priests and people why not theother If the one doe binde all why not the other Moreouer Saint Paul deliuering to the Corinthians the Supper of our Sauiour Christ according to the institution which he had receiued of Christ deliuered not onely the breade but also the Cup to the whole Church of Corinth which I suppose you will not say were all priests This Cup is the new Testament in my bloud As often as ye shall eate this breade and drinke this Cup ye shew the Lords death till he come Wherefore whosoeuer shall eate this bread and drinke the Cup of the Lord vnworthily shall be guiltie of the bodie and bloud of the Lord. Paschasius expoundeth these words thus Bibite ex hoc omnes hoc est tam ministri quam reliqui credentes that is Drinke ye all of this that is to say both ministers and the rest that beleeue The glosse as it is alledged by Cassander thus Bibite ex hoc omnes scilicet sine personarum acceptione that is Drinke ye all of this that is all without respect of persons So doth
translators which he seeketh so much to discredite As for Gregorie Martines pregnant proofes in his discouerie they belong agoe effectually and learnedly confuted by D. Fulke to this day stand vndefended And therefore vntil you haue answered the same you may be ashamed to brag of his pregnant proofs which were so weak and cauils so greate many that he rather discouered his owne folly then discredited our translators What Master Broughton writeth concerning our translation I doe not know neither do I greatly care yet this I say although that our translations were made in the feare of God to profit Gods Church and people according to the measure of the grace of God bestowed vpon the laborers in that holy worke be voyd of wilful corruptions either for doctrine or manners yet I do not thinke them to be voyd of imperfections in respect of proprietie of words and phrases wherein they may be some what reformed and amended And hard it is to haue a translation so exact and perfit but that some such imperfectnes may be in it which yet be not repugnant either to holy doctrine or good life And for asmuch as this man of malice would faine if he could discredit our translations and cause the Reader to doubt of the truth of them I will shew not onely the good Christian but also the Romish Catholike that hath vnderstanding of the Latine tongue how he may discerne and know the truth and faithfulnesse of our translations and so not to rely vpon the credit of our Ministers There is a Latine translation of the old Testament made from the Hebrew very well and learnedly by Sanctos Pagninus an Italian and a dominicke Frier a man excellently learned in the Hebrew tongue for I will giue him and his worke their due and deserued praise and commendation and not doe as this libiller and his fellowes vse to doe who of enuie and malice wherewith their harts be infected and possessed cannot giue a good word to any thing we doe though it be neuer so good and godly This translation he did dedicate to Pope Clemens the seuenth Let the Reader compare our translations especially of the latter editions with the said translation and see whether in any substantiall matter of faith and life he can finde any corruptions and any great and notorious dissensions from the same And the like I may say of Erasmus translation of the new Testament dedicated to Pope Leo the tenth and allowed by him Let I say the Reader compare our translations with these and although he may finde some difference in words and phrases yet in matters of substance which concerne either the doctrine of faith or precepts of good life I am sure he shall finde a goodly and godly harmonie and agreement to his comfort and contentation And lastly I wil offer to this challenger who offereth challenge of disputation with vs and to al his partakers that for one fault of moment or weight that they shal finde in our translations especially as I said of the latter editions wherein they differ from the originall fountaines of the Hebrew and Greeke I will vndertake to finde fixe yea ten greater and fouler in that vulgar Latine translation which the councell of Trident hath most absurdly confirmed and made authentical And therefore let neither the godly Christian Reader nor the seduced Catholike be disswaded from reading of our translations nor doubt of the truth of them But this hath been in all ages the drift of the Diuell to secke to discredite and diffame those godly men that haue labored in Gods vineyard and haue indeuored to translate his holy word to the comfort and saluation of his elect and chosen people How Saint Hierome of old and Erasmus of late were vsed I haue elsewhere shewed So this cauiller dealeth now with that blessed man of God and constant Martyr of Iesus Christ Master Tindall who as he did patiently and constantly beare and abide their furious crueltie and confirmed the truth of God which he had taught with the shedding of his bloud in flaming fire so he needeth not my defence Who was a man of such mortification and godly life that I haue knowne some of great credite and authoritie that knew him and liued with him at Antwerpe that would say of him that if a man could be like God it was Tindall I doubt not but he was indued with much more godlines then a hundreth of your Popes whom their owne friends and fauorers call for their horrible wickednes Monstra Portenta Monsters of mankinde But he that iustifieth the wicked and he that condemneth the innocent euen they both are abomination to God That all men may erre we doe confesse Omnis homo Mendax that is all men be liers and generall councels which consist of men may erre and haue erred we doe not doubt But of this it shall be impertinent to speake at this present I will onely now retort your argument vpon you Whosoeuer relyeth his faith vpon man hath no faith but all English papists that vnderstand not the Hebrew Greeke and Latine and reade the Remish translation rely their faith vpon man videl the translator of that Testament ergo all such English papists haue no faith The like may be said of them that reade the Latine which rely their faith vpon the councell of Trent who were men Againe whosoeuer relyeth his faith vpon man hath no faith all papists rely their faith vpon the Pope who I trow is a man ergo all papists haue no faith And this shall suffice for answere to your third article The Pamphlet The Protestants know not what they beleeue 4. Article THe Protestants know not what they beleeue nor why they beleeue that they know not why they beleeue I haue shewed before For that the ground of their beleefe is not the authoritie of Scripture of councels of Doctors nor of the Church but their owne fancie And that they know not what they beleeue is manifest because they haue no rule whereby to know what is matter of faith and what is not Some will limit their beleefe to their creede saying that nothing ought to be beleeued which is not in the Apostles creed But then I would demaund of them whether that we ought to beleeue that the Scripture is the word of God that baptisme is a Sacrament that in the Eucharist is the bodie of Christ by faith to what article should these be reduced seeing they are not contained in the creed or how shall we know infallibly how these be matters of faith since they are not contained in the creed others deny some articles of their creed also for the Protestants deny three articles of our creed and the puritans fiue The first is the Catholike Church Credo ecclesiam sanctam Catholicam I beleeue the holy Catholike Church the which in very deede they doe not beleeue because Catholike is vniuersall and so the Church of Christ which we are bound
to beleeue must be vninersall for all time comprehending allages and vniuersall for place comprehending all nations but that Church which the Protestants beleeue was interrupted all the ages betwixt the Apostles and Luther which was 1400. yeares or in very deede was neuer seene before Luthers dayes therefore that Church they beleeue cannot be Catholike Neither is it vniuersall in place being contained within the narrow bounds of England which is accompted but as a corner of the world for the Lutherans in Germanie the Hugonites in Fraunce and the Guines in Flaunders detest their religion as much as the Catholikes neither will they ioyne issue with them in diuers essentiall points And therefore the Protestants Church which they beleeue can no more be called Catholike or vniuersall then England the vniuersall world or Kent the Kingdome of England or a pruned bough a wheate tree or a dead finger a man or a rotten tooth the whole head The second article is the communion of Saints the which they many wayes deny First by not beleeuing that Christ hath instituted seuen Sacraments wherein the Saints of his Church communicate and specially the true and real presence of our Sauiour Christ in the Eucharist by which all the faithfull receiuers participating of one and the selfe same bodie are made one bodie as all the parts of a mans bodie are made one liuing thing by participating one soule Secondly they denie the communion of the Church militant and triumphant by exclaming against inuocation of Saints by which holy exercise the blessed Saints in heauen and we in yearth communicate we by prayer glorifying them and they by meditation obtayning our request Thirdly they deny the communion of the Church militant and the soules in purgatorie bereauing them of that Christian charitie which charitable compassion and mercifull pitie requireth and by naturall affection the members of one bodie helpe one another The third article is remission of sinnes for they acknowledge no such effect in the Sacrament of Baptisme but onely count it as an externall signe or seale of a prereceiued grace or fauour of God by his eternall predestination against the expresse word of God which therefore calleth this Sacrament the lauer of regeneration for that in it the soule dead by sinne is newly regenerate by grace Moreouer they allow not the Sacrament of penance wherein all actuall sinnes committed after Baptisme are cancelled and that which exceedeth all in absurditie is to deny that our sinnes are all perfectly forgiuen but onely not imputed and as it were veiled or couered with the passion of Christ all the botches and biles the filth and abomination of sinne still remaining and as it were exhaling a most pestiferous sent in the sight of God For let them shift themselues as they list and scarfe their â—ores according to their fancies yet no veile nor mantell can couer their deformitie of sinne from the pearcing eyes of Gods perfit vnderstanding from which nothing can be concealed Fourthly the puritanes in effect deny that Christ is the sonne of God for they peremptorilie affirme that Christ is God of himselfe and not God of God So that he receiued not his diuinitie from his father The which position flatly taketh away the nature of a sonne for the nature of a sonne is to receiue his substance of his Father and it implyeth contradiction that the sonne receiueth his person of his Father and not his substance and essence for the substance of God is essentiall to euery person in trinitie Fiftly finally they deny the descension of Christ into hell and desperately defend that he suffered the paines of Hell vpon the Crosse whereby they blaspheme most horribly that sacred humanitie as if Christ had despaired of his saluation as if God had hated him and he had hated God as if he had been afflicted and tormented with anguish of minde for his offences for which he was depriued of the sight of God and eternally to be depriued all which horrible punishments are included in the paines of Hell and whosoeuer ascribeth them to Christ blasphemeth more horribly then Arius who denied him to be God for lesse absurditie it were to deny him to be God then to make God the enemie of God Answere IN this fourth article the syllogisme promised is not performed But in steede thereof here is an accusation that we know not what we beleeue nor why we beleeue Your proofe before I haue examined and what we beleeue I haue declared whereof the rule is not our owne fancie as you say and shew not as the rule of your faith and life is the Popes folly as hath been in part shewed You say we haue no rule whereby to know what is the matter of faith We haue the word of God contained in the canonicall Scriptures of the old and new Testament and is that no rule I pray you what doth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifie but a rule and why be the Scriptures called canonicall but because they be the rule of our faith and life Thomas Aquinas saith Doctrina enim Apostolorum prophetarum dicitur canonica quia est regula intellectus nostri that is The Doctrine of the Apostles and Prophets is called canonicall because they be the rule of our vnderstanding Dauid when he said Thy word is a light vnto my feete and a lanterne vnto my pathes what did he but make that same the rule direction and guide of his faith and life when Moses said Now therefore hearken O Israel vnto the ordinances and to the lawes which I teach you to doe that ye may liue and goe in and possesse the land which the Lord God of your Fathers giueth you ye shall put nothing to the word which I commaund you neither shall take ought therefrom that ye may keepe the commaundements of the Lord your God which I commaund you what did he but make Gods word declared to him and written by him the rule of their faith and life When God said to Iosua Let not this booke of the law depart out of thy mouth but meditate therein day and night that thou maist obserue and doe according to all that is written therein for then shalt thou make thy way prosperous and then shalt thou haue good successe What did he but make his written word the rule of his faith and whole life When Abraham said to the rich man condemned in Hell They haue Moses and the Prophets let them heare them what did he but shew that the writings of Moses the Prophets were the onely rule which his brethren should follow to auoyd damnation and consequently to attaine eternall saluation Chrysostom saith Ne igitur multorum opiniones habeamus sed resipsas inquiramus Quomodo autem non absurdum propter pecunias alijs non credere sed ipsas numerare supputare pro rebus autem amplioribus aliorum sententiam sequi
simpliciter praesertim cùm habeamus omnem exactissimā trutinam gnomonem ac regulam diuinarum inquam legum assertionem Ideo obsecro oro vos omnes vt relinquatis quidnam huic vel illi videatur deque hijs à scripturis haec omnia inquirite c. i. Let vs not seeke the opinions of many men but let vs search the things themselues for how is it not absurd not to beleeue men concerning mony but that we wil count it for matters of greater waight to follow simply the minde and opinion of others especially seeing we haue the most exact ballance square rule the doctrine of Gods lawes Therfore I request and beseech you all to leaue and forsake what seemeth good to this or that man of these matters search ye al these things by the Scriptures The same Chrysostom hath these words Vides in quantum absurditatē incidunt qui diuinae scripturae canonem sequi nolunt sed suis cogitationibus permittunt omnia i. Thou seest into how great absurditie they doe fall which follow not the rule of the diuine Scriptures but permit all things to their owne fancies and deuises And againe Satis sufficere credimus quicquid secundum praedictas regulas Apostolica scripta nos docuerunt vt prorsus non opinemur catholicum quod apparuerit praefixis sententijs contrarium that is we beleeue that that is sufficient enough whatsoeuer according to the foresaid rules the writings of the Apostles haue taught vs so that we doe not at all iudge that to be Catholike which shall appeare to be contrarie to the foresaid rules Beda hath an excellent saying hereof which is recorded in Gratians decrees Nobis sacris literis vnica est credendi pariter viuendiregula praescripta that is The onely rule both of faith and also of life is prescribed vnto vs in the holy Scriptures This rule we haue and will you say this is no rule If you haue a better rule let vs know it And whereas you would haue the councels doctors and Church the rule of our faith and life bring such like plaine places out of the Scriptures and doctors for the proofe of it and then we will yeeld vnto you As touching the Apostles creede we acknowledge it to be abriefe abridgment of the especiall and principall points of Christian faith and doctrine yet there be some truthes which are not particularly expressed in the same But whereas you say or rather falsely slaunder that the Protestants denie three articles of our creede and the Puritanes fiue I say that you affirme much and proue little But first you might well enough haue forborne this distinction of protestants puritanes for although some haue differed in some outward matters concerning ceremonies externall orders in the Church yet these all greatly agree and consent in all points of the doctrine of faith and Articles of Christian Religion Neither doe I know any that so well deserue this name of Puritanes as you who glorie that you after baptisme be pure from all sinne and for actuall sinnes after committed can make so full satisfaction to God for them that he can request no more of you as hereafter I will shew and therefore it be you that may well be called Puritanes of whom that saying of Salomon may be well verified There is a generation that are pure in their owne conceit and yet are not washed from their filthines But let vs come to the examination of your proofe of this your absurd and slaunderous assertion The first you say is the Catholike Church Credo Ecclesiam sanctam Catholicam Doe wee denie this Article Why doe wee then not onely print it and rehearse it in our Creede but also expound it in our preachings and Catechising I haue said before that which may seeme sufficient concerning this matter and article yet the better to satisfie the Christian Reader and to stop the mouth of this malicious accuser I say againe that by the holy Catholike Church mentioned in the Creede is meant the companie of all Gods elect and faithfull people whom he calleth iustifieth and sanctifieth to be vessels of his mercie and heires of his kingdome of glorie which is the bodie of Christ and he the head the spouse of Christ and he the bridegrome the house of Christ and he the foundation the flocke of Christ and he the shepheard And this Church wee confesse to be Catholike that is to say vniuersall both in respect of time for that it consisteth of al them that are written in the booke of life which haue been from the beginning of the world and shall be to the end therof and also of place for y t it is not now contained in any one countrie but as S. Peter saith In euery nation he that feareth God and worketh righteousnes is accepted with him and is a true mēber of this Catholike Church That this is the holy Catholike Church which we confesse beleeue whereof the prophane wicked hypocrites and reprobates be no part besides that which I haue said before I will further proue it by the holy Scriptures and ancient Fathers Saint Paul saith Let vs follow the truth in loue and in all things grow vp vnto him which is the head that is Christ by whom all the bodie being coupled and knit together by euery ioynt for the furniture thereof according to the effectuall power which is in the measure of euery part receiueth increase of the bodie vnto the edifying of it selfe in loue Againe Christ loued the Church and gaue himselfe for it that he might sanctifie it and clense it by the washing of water through the word that he might make it to himselfe a glorious Church not hauing spot or wrinkle or any such thing but that it should be holy and without blame These things belong only to the elect people of God who shall raigne with him in his eternall kingdome of glorie For they only be the bodie of Christ knit together in him sanctified here to be without spot or blemish hereafter The Apostle to the Hebrues saith Whose house we are if we hold fast that confidence and that reioycing of hope vnto the end Where hee sheweth that they belong to the house of God which is the Church of the liuing God the pillar and stay of truth which vnto the end hold fast their confident faith and hope of Gods glorie wherof they reioyce which belongeth onely to the faithfull and chosen children of God This is that Church whereof he speaketh after But ye are come vnto the mount Sion and to the citie of the liuing God the celestiall Ierusalem and to the companie of innumerable Angels and to the assemblie and congregation of the first borne which are written in heauen and to God the Iudge of all and to the spirits of iust and perfect men To whom can these things pertaine but only to the Ierusalem which is aboue