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A62667 The Quakers apostasie from the perfect rule of the scriptures discovered in a double reply to a twofold answer of theirs, in the vindication of several queries propounded by the author : wherein their deceits, blasphemies and reproches against scripture authority and ordinances of institute religious worship, are spoken unto, their main principles examined and denyed, the truth defended and cleared against their railing, slandering, censorious pens and tongues / by John Timson ... Timson, John. 1656 (1656) Wing T1295; ESTC R21114 77,026 109

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the simple and David acknowledges it to be both a Lamp and a light Psal 119. Besides whatsoever makes manifest is light but the Scripture doth make manifest what Christ is and what he hath done and suffered and for whom and for what ends So also they make manifest what sin is and the wages thereof what holinesse and true Worship of God is and how God will be served by all that shall be saved therefore the Scriptures are a true light If the Spirit of Christ doth give forth light to men then the Scriptures are a light to enlighten men because holy men writ them as they were moved and inspired by the holy Ghost and all Scripture were given by Inspiration of God and therefore deny the light of Scriptures and deny the light of the Spirit for what the Scripture saith the Spirit saith they being the Revelations and Inspirations of the Spirit And what may we think of these seducers that under pretence of a light within and a perfect Law of God in the heart and the Revelations of Christ in them condemn me for making the Revelations and Inspirations of God in Scripture a perfect Rule of faith and obedience but we are sure the Law of God which Scriptures teach is perfect holy just and good and a sure word and the Inspirations of God contained in Scriptures are true as God himself but as for that Law and Spirit that cannot stand unlesse the Scriptures fall it is easie to discern from whence it is But say they this light is not received from the Scripture but from Christ c. Answ The light of Scripture is the light of Christ as also the Scripture Ministry by which alone Christ became a light to the Gentiles and in that Christ hath appointed a Ministry of men and given them gifts and Authority to preach the Gospell unto the Gentiles and by his blessing hath made them successefull to turn them from darknesse to light as in the Apostles age especially Thus and no otherwise is he sent to be a light unto the Gentiles for how can any believe in him of whom they never heard as hath been spoke to already and what ever is wrought by his Authority in the use of means is all one with being wrought by Christ himself to any that are sober And hence those distinctions of mine are grounded of Christ more strictly and immediately and of Christ more comprehensive and in a mediate sense as he hath made the promise of his presence and blessing to those Ministers of the Gospell that teach and administer in the Church all things whatsoever Christ hath commanded to be done Matth. 28.19 He that walks in the midst of the seven Golden Candlesticks will be with the Scripture Ministry to the end of the World untill the whole be gathered and united to their head and made compleat in him They say this light of Christ cannot be blotted out as thou sayst That which I said was a supposition thus Suppose that all the light of Christ as Redeemer which you from time to time have received from the use of Scriptures Ministry Education Discourse were blotted out of your minds and heads tell me what you could know of Christ as he is designed of God to redeeme lost man and how the work of Redemption is wrought more then the rude heathen that never heard of his name All that they Answer to this is That the light cannot be blotted out as thou saist But what light is that which cannot be blotted out Say they The light of Christ that leads out of darknesse to the knowledge of God to eternall life though they have not the use of Scriptures this light is not received into the mind and head from the Scripture neither cannot be blotted out but it comes from Christ the light of the Gentiles such as thou callest Heathens who many of them shew the work of the Law in their hearts and shall be excused when thou and all that oppose the light of Christ shall be condemned Christians look about you for the Devil was never so bold as now and I think there is more of the Devil in so few lines then ever were writ by man before consider them well I assure you it 's all their own Was ever such an abominable thing asserted amongst Christians The light of Christ that leads out of darknesse to the knowledge of God to eternall life is not received in the mind from the Scripture but from Christ the light of the Gentiles As if the Scriptures were opposed to the light of Christ or of no use to reveal Christ as Redeemer to the salvation of lost man Christians you see now their Answer what it is to the Question namely That the light of Christ without the use of Scripture leads out of darknesse to the knowledge of God to eternall life c. even to the Gentiles that never heard of Christ nor believe in him to salvation But if this be true to what end did Christ come into the world and lay down his life to be a ransome for many and why did he shed his blood for many for remission of sins Christs death and resurrection is all in vain for all the world from the beginning have had this kind of light shewing the work of the law in their hearts and do by nature the things contained in the Law 1. But let them prove that this work of the Law is the light of Christ that Simeon prophesied of and the Prophets and that the Apostles witnessed fulfilled by their preaching and writings 2. And let them prove that the work of the Law in their hearts leads out of darknesse to eternall life The Scriptures say the contrary By the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified nor is there any law that can give life 3. And let them prove that the work of the Law in the hearts of unbelieving Gentiles is a spirituall blesseing of the new Covenant Heb. 8. which the Apostle applyed to the believing Church so did the Prophets of old time Jer. 31. If they cannot prove these three things let shame stop their lying mouths Jesus Christ as he was promised to be a light of the Gentiles Isai 42.6 7. is to be understood of a peculiar spirituall light Christ was given for such a light to the Gentiles as should open the blind eyes and bring out the Prisoners from the Prison and them that sit in darknesse in the Regions and shadow of death out of the Prison house to guide their feet in the way of peace Luk. 1. Which accordingly was fulfilled in the Apostles age but how not by Christ immediately but by Christs Authority who appointed men and furnished them with gifts and abilities to preach the Gospell unto them and opened their hearts to receive it and become Christians in profession and truth And in that they were converted and enlightened by means himself appointed is all one by being converted and enlightened
of faith we preach Rom. 10. I told you that was a contradiction and a confused senselesse thing which you say stands as a witnesse against me and bid me prove my accusation Answ 1. I queryed you whether any of you did know and believe what is written in the Scriptures without the outward declaration unto which you answere not at all 2. I query what you mean by the word of faith in the mouth and in the heart which the Apostle preached Rom. 10.6 7 8. whether it be the same with the Doctrine of faith declared in the Scriptures writ to the Churches or different from it As I concluded before in my replie so I shall make it good still notwithstanding all that you have writ that the word of faith which the Apostles preached and writ to the severall Churches is the same with that which you call the outward declaration What are the writings of the Prophets and Apostles but the word of faith I told you that this of the Apostle doth allude to that in Deuteronom 30. and there we find the same of the word as it was written in the law as heer of the word of faith preached The Doctrine of faith was so familiarly preached and beat into mens heads hearts and mouthes that ignorance could not excuse any and the Apostle explains what this word of faith is verse 9. thus That if thou shalt confesse with the mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead thou shalt be saved You may see it's clear enough what the Apostle understands by word in the mouth and in the heart if you be not too perverse and in the 10 verse there is a reason urged to make all your cavils fall For with the heart man believes unto righteousnesse and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation and proves it by the Scripture Whosoever beleeveth on him shall not be ashamed Isa 28.16 What can be concluded hence but what the writings of the Scriptures contain and declare and yet you say not any can know the Scriptures by the outward declaration but by the word of faith which word of faith in your quotation is discovered by the Scriptures what it is so that you say and unsay not by the outward declaration but by it a meer contradiction which you will never free your selves of But why cannot any know Scripture by its own writing Can you know what is contained in the holy Scriptures without the outward declaration if not then you must know it by the outward declaration or not at all How do you know what is in your books but by the outward declaration But instead of answering to clear your selves you are froward and very impertinent and obscure and desperately confused as followeth in their next wherein they should shew us the difference between the declaration of Scripture and the word of faith preached And first they witnesse the Scriptures by the same light and Spirit that gave them forth Rom. 10. and in Christ Jesus the Lord of faith which the Apostles preached and declared of they believe Rom. 10.6 7. as the Apostles did who knew the Letter which kil'd and the word of faith which is quick and powerfull which word say they is God that made all things and the letter testifies of him whose name is called the word of God Revel 19.11 12. Joh. 1.1 Heb. 4.12 And then they say they have come off clear of what I have accused them of in their answer Answ Here is nothing but pride and coniusion in these lines unlesse we can credit every thing they have the boldnesse to say as infallible How are the Scriptures beholding to them for their witnesse who have the same light and Spirit which gave them forth the Lord of Hosts gave them forth all Scripture is given by the inspiration of God 1. Tim. 3. and they have the same light and the same spirit equall with God if one may believe what they say of themselves But what think you are not the Scriptures as inspired and given of God a perfect rule of faith and obedience unlesse you witnesse them to be so and what letter was that which the Apostles knew killed you take it for granted that it is the whole declaration of holy Scriptures but it is because you have no light nor Spirit of God in you The word of faith Rom. 10.6 7. is quick and powerfull c. which word is God that made all things Most senselesse Is the profession of Christ in the mouth and believing in him with the heart God that made all things is every gift and work of God in man God that made all things this is like their other notion Christ lighteth all and therefore that light is Christ as if every work and operation of Christ is Christ just like those that make God to be every thing that from him lives and moves c. So again Christ is the word his name shall be called the word of God and they have Christ the word of God within them and what need of that which is written they have it in the life and fountain and they will come under no other writings nor rule although never so much commanded by God in the expressions of the holy Spirit in the Scriptures Touching Heb. 4.12 in the second verse he shewes us what word he meant where he saith That the Gospel was preached to them as unto us but the word that they heard profited not them because it was not mixed with faith in them that heard it What word was this which was heard but the outward declaration in voice or writing or both And this word is quick and powerfull c. and the savour of life to some and of death to others according to the pleasure of him with whom we have to doe he blessing or blasting his own word and ordinance to the different ends intended by himself and for his glory whether in the diligent use thereof men be saved or in the contempt and neglect of the word men be damned The 2 Cor. 3.6 where it is said the Letter killeth is to be understood of the ministrie of Moses in comparison of the Gospell ministry administred by the Apostles that of Moses not so spirituall glorious effectuall as the new Testament was and yet it had its glory too but no glory in this respect by reason of the glory that excelleth vers 10. The Ceremonials their Gospel were but shadowes of good things to come the substance was Christ who was but darkly seen by the people but the Precepts and Threats of the Law were cleer which brought them under guilt and the remedie obscure and the fruit but little in comparison of the Apostles Ministry c. And hence the letter killed as administred by Moses but grace and truth comes by Jesus Christ It 's true the ministrie of the Apostles without the powerfull operation of the Spirit concurring was not
sufficient For Paul may plant and Apollo water but it is God that gives the increase and yet the word of God as made known in the holy Scriptures must be our rule to act and live by in order to Gods blessing of Spirit and grace to our regeneration and compleating the same unto eternall life Besides we have no promises of Gods giving his spirit unto sinners that have it not to quicken those that are dead in trespasses and sins but what is made in the letter of Scripture and no promises of any thing but what is writ there Rom. 5.15 all good newes from heaven to lost sinners is writ there they are written for our learning that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope And yet will you say that all the letter killeth Now Reader lay things together and then judge by all that they have said how true it is that they say they have come off clear in what I have charged them with what difference have they made between the outward declaration and the word of faith which the Apostles preached and writ to the severall Churches if all be but the same as I have cleered from theirs the contradiction and their confused nonsense still remains notwithstanding their bitter censures and shuffles And how notoriously false is that of theirs That not any doth know the Scriptures by the outward declaration when the outward declaration 2. Tim. 3.16 as consisting of words committed to writing is the Scriptures that we plead Rev. 1.17 for a perfect rule the declaration and the matter and sense contained therein but the same all which is the inspiration of God and that which the Spirit saith to the Churches for what the Scriptures saith the Spirit saith because all Scripture is by inspiration of God 2. Pet. 1.20.21 c. And not only John but all the pen-men thereof writ as they were moved by the Spirit of God or the Holy Ghost And hence when you Quakers set up the Spirit to be a perfect Rule of faith and life distinct from the Scriptures it will run you upon these Rocks which you will never evade 1. You must either set up another Spirit distinct from the Spirit of God that gave the Scriptures or 2. Maintain that the same Spirit gives a different rule to that which is written by his own inspiration and so make God not only mutable but contrary to himself which to think is to be abhorred as blasphemous 3. Or that the same Spirit hath given additionall lawes to be the rule above what is written by the Prophets and Apostles on which the Church is built which is hardly so I shall judge untill 1. I see the same divine approbation and confirmation of those Lawes as hath been given of all holy Scriptures 2. And yet those Lawes are as consonant and as agreeable to all the Scriptures as written by the Prophets and Apostles as the Apostles writings are consonant and agreeable to the Prophets 3. And untill they can prove that the Scriptures prophecie of such a change in the Church as to set up superadded Lawes 4. And that themselves are the men that the Scriptures have foretold of to superadde spirituall Lawes in the Church to bind the consciences of all as we affirme that the Scripture doth But to prevent mistakes I grant as they 1. That the Spirit is the rule but then you must understand it as the mind of God is revealed by the Spirit in the Scriptures 2. I grant that we have all need of the illuminating quickning operations and influences of the same Spirit that revealed the rule to enable us to know it and believe it and to apply it to our selves and to applie our selves unto it so as to live unto God in all Christian obedience according to this Rule 3. I grant that the Rule without the blessing of Grace concurring doth not simply of it self enlighten and quicken any nor are any truely and savingly enlightned quickned and renewed but by the revealed word of God as the only means appointed and designed of God to that very end to the intelligent Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God Rom. 10. And of his own good will hath he begot us again by his word Jam. 2.1 And now I shall give a word to my dear friends of Farndon and to all that are abused and drawn aside by these deceivers and the deceits and cheats of their own hearts in hope of a blessing to my poor endeavours who am touched with a deep sense of the sad delusions which at the present you are intangled most desperately in My dear friends Who hath bewitched you that you should not obey the truth which you have once received with a great deal of joy and comfort to your souls when with constancie and patience you have made a good pro●ession of the wayes of Godlinesse revealed by the word practised by men and women fearing God in all the ages of the Church of Christ you know the times and places when and where your Spirits have been made joyfull in the house of Prayer and praising of the ever blessed God Your hearts have been heated and warmed by the power of his word and Sacraments the strict observing of Sabbath● a constant course of the worshipping God in your families by a serious calling upon the name of the Lord instruction of those under you in the principles of Gods truth and fear and have walked before them in all Godlinesse and honesty according to this word of the Lord which now is in contempt and reproach by those that seduce you as is too obvious to the impartiall as is above cleared and their slanders shifts and shuffles discovered You may see how they have reproached the Institutions and ordinances of our Lord as heathenish by compareing them to that great Image of that heathen King Dan. 3.3 You may see how they deny the Scriptures to be a perfect Rule of knowing God believing in him and living unto him And yet they reproach me to be a lying slanderer in charging them with that which is an apparent truth as I have witnessed by their own lying Papers and thus they have reproached me most falsely and the lyes are returned upon their own heads whilst they witnesse themselves perfect and without sin and have entred the new Jerusalem in which none shall enter that makes a lie My friends some of you have heard William Duesbury say of himself In Duesbury new Births he thus witnesseth of himself that he was as perfect as that Christ which dyed at Jerusalem this is witnessed by one of credit and fidelity amongst your selves I forbeare his name Oh proud polluted Worme that dare exalt himself to a perfection equall with God the everlasting father whose name is called Wonderfull Counseller the Prince of peace the mightie God Isa 9. who fulfilled all righteousnesse from his birth to the consummating of all