through the faith that is in Christ Iesus were too great weakenesse and to vse the Apostles phrase childishnesse of vnderstanding But at length you heard a sound of harmony and consent that in the Catholike Church as in Noahs Arke was infallibilitie and possibilitie of saluation which occasioned you to seeke out and to enter into this Arke of Noah The sound of consent and infallibilitie is most pleasing and harmonious and vndoubtedly euer and onely to bee found in the Catholike Church to wit in the rule of Faith and in the holy Scriptures and such necessarie doctrine as perfectly concordeth with the same But as in song many discords doe passe in smaller notes without offence of the eares so should they in smaller matters of opinion in the Church without the offence of iudicious and charitable mindes Which yet I speake not to iustifie them nay I am verily of the minde that this is the thing that hath marred the Church musicke in both kindes that too much libertie is taken in descant to depart from the gound and as one saith notae nimium denigrantur The fault of the Italians though they thinke themselues the onely songsters in the world But to returne to you tell me I beseech you good Master Wadesworth was this the harmonie that transported you The Pope himselfe saith I cannot erre and to mee thou oughtest to haue recourse for decision of doubts in matters of faith And whereas this is not onely denied by Protestants but hath beene euer by the French and anciently I am sure by the Spanish lately by some Italian Diuines also vnlesse hee vse due meanes to finde the truth yea whereas it is the issue of all the Controuersies of this age in this snare you fastned your foot this was the Center that settled your conscience this the solid and firme foundation of your faith What and did it not moue you that some limit this infallibilitie of the Pope thus if hee enter Canonically if hee proceed aduisedly and maturely vsing that diligence that is fit to finde out the truth that is as you said before proceeding by the rule the Scriptures Albeit to the Fathers of the African Councell it seemed incredible as they write in their Synodall Epistle to P. Coelestine standing for appeales to himselfe that God can inspire the right iâ— tâ—iall to one denying it to many Bishops in a Councell Tell vs then who made you secure of these things or did you in truth neuer so much as make question of them but hearing this harmonious sound The Pope is the infallible Iudge you trusted the new Masters of that side Gregory de Valentia and Bellarmine that whether the Pope in defining doe vse diligence or no if hee doe define hee shall define infallibly Alas Sir if this were the rest you found for the soale of your foot instead of moueable water you fell vpon mire and puddle Or rather like to another Doue mentioned in Scripture columba seducta non habens cor by the most chaffie shrap that euer was set before the eyes of winged Fowle were brought to the doorefall Excuse my griefe mixed I confesse with some indignation but more loue to you though I thus write Many things there be in Poperie inconuenient and to my conceit weakely and vngroundedly affirmed to say no more but this is so absurd and palpably a flatterie as to omit to speake of you for my part I cannot bee perswaded that Paulus the fifth beleeues it himselfe For consider I pray what needed anciently the Christian Emperours and sometimes at the request of the Bishops of Rome themselues to haue gathered together so many Bishops from so diuers parts of the world to celebrate Councells if it had beene knowne and beleeued then that one mans sentence might haue cleered all controuersies and put all heresies to silence How durst sundrie holy and learned men haue reiected his decisions whether right or wrong is not now the question vnchristianly out of doubt on their parts if hee had beene then holden the infallible Oracle of our religion As when Polycrates with the Bishops of Asia and Irenaeus also yeelded not to Victor excommunicating the Easterne Churches about the celebration of Easter when Saint Cyprian with the first Councell of Carthage of eightie sixe Bishops had decreed that such as were baptized by heretickes should bee rebaptized and certified Stephanus of this Decree and he opposed it and would haue nothing innouated would Cyprian after that haue resisted and confuted Stephanus his letter had he knowne him for infallible And how doth hee confute him as erring writing impertinently contrarie to himselfe Yea let it bee obserued that hee doth not onely not account Stephanus infallible but not so much as a Iudge ouer any Bishop See the Vote of Cyprian and note those wordes Neque enim quisquam nostrum Episcopum se esse Episcoporum constituit an t tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitatem collegas suos adigit quando habeat omnis Episcopus pro licentia libertatis potestatis suae arbitrium proprium tanquam iudicari ab alio non possit cum nec ipse possit alterum iâ—dicare Sed exspectemus vniuersi iudiciuÌ„ Domini nostri Iesu Christi qui vnus solus habet potestateÌ„ praeponendi in Ecclesiae suae gubernatione de actis nostro iudicandi A passage worthy to bee noted also for the cleering of the independence of Episcopall authoritie from the Pope which I now let passe Neither was Saint Cyprian herein alone Firmilianus and the Easterne Bishops resisted Stephanus no lesse as appeares by his Epistle which in the Romane edition of Manutiuâ— set forth by the command of Pius the fourth with the suruey of foure Cardinalls whereof one is now a Saint with exquisite diligence is wholly left out And Pamelius saith hee thinkes purposely for himselfe is of the minde that it had beene better it had neuer come forth But to returne to our purpose The Fathers of the Councell of Africke and Saint Augustine amongst them resist three Popes succeeding each other Zosimus Boniface and Coelestinus about appeales to Rome shall we thinke they would euer haue done it if they had knowne or imagined them to be the supreme and infallible Iudges in the Church I let passe the Schisme betweene the Greeke and the Latin Church which had not happened if this doctrine had beene anciently receiued Nay it is verie plaine in storie that the Bishop of Romes lifting vp himselfe to bee Vniuersall Bishop chiefly caused it To conclude neither Liberius nor Honorius to omit many other Bishops of Rome had euer beene taxed of heresie if this had anciently beene currant that the Pope is infallible I will not stand now to examine the shamefull defence that Bellaâ—mine makes for the latter of these bearing downe Fathers Councells Stories Popes themselues as all falsified or deoeiued herein Wherein because hee is learnedly refuted by Doctor Raynolds I insist not vpon it
Scriptures by their owne free consent and desire Iudge by an instance or two that this matter may not be a meere skirmish of generalities Tertullian in his latter times whether as Saint Hierome writes through the enuie and reproach of the Roman Clergie or out of the too much admiring chastitie and fasting became a Montanist and wrote a Booke de Pudicitia blaming the reconciling of Adulterers and Fornicators In the very entrance almost thereof he hath these words Audio etiam edictum esse propositum quidem peremptorium Pontifex scil Maximus Episcopus Episcoporum dicit Ego maechis fornicationis delict a paenitentiâ functis dimitto Pamelius in his noate vpon this place writes thus Bene habet annotatu dignum quod etiamiam in haeresi constitutus aduersus Ecclesiaâ—â— scribens Pontificeâ— Romanum Episcopum Episcoporum nuncupet infra Cap. 13. bonum Pastorem benedictum Papum Cap. 21. Apostolicum Thus Pamelius and presently laâ—ches forth into the Priuiledges of the See of Rome and brings a number of testimonies for that forgery of Constantines donation The like note hee hath in the life of Tertullian where hee makes the Pope that set forth the former Edict to haue beene Zephyrinus quem saith hee Pontificem Maximum etiam iam haereticus Episcopum Episcoporum appellat Baronius also makes no small account of this place and saith The title of the Pope is here to bee noted And indeed prima facie as you say they haue reason But hee that shall well examine the whole web of Tertullians discourse shall finde that hee speakes by a most bitter and scornefull Ironie as Elias doth of Baal when hee saith hee is a God The word scilicet might haue taught them thus much Yea the title Pontifex Maximus which in those dayes and almost two ages after was a Pagan terme neuer attibuted to a Christian Bishop first laid downe by Gratian the Emperour as Baronius also notes in the yeere of our Lord 383. because it â—auoured of Heathenish superstition though it had beene as a title of Royalty vsed by the former Christian Emperours till that time This title I say might haue made them perceiue Tertullians meaning vnlesse the immoderate desire of exalting the Papacie did so blind their eyes that seeing they saw and yet perceiued not In the same character though with more mildnesse and moderation is the same title for the other part of it vsed by Saint Cyprian in his Vote in the Councell of Carthage Neque n. quisquam nostrum se esse Episcopum Episcoporum constituit aut tyrannico terrore ad obsequendi necessitatem Collegas suos adigit Bellarmine saith hee speakes here of those Bishops that were in the Councell of Carthage and that the Bishop of Rome is not included in that sentence who is indeed Bishop of Bishops What! and doth hee tyranniously inforce his Colleagues to obedience also For it is plaine that Cyprian ioynes these together the one as the presumptuous title the other as the iniurious act answering thereto which hee calls plaine tyranny And as plaine it is out of Firmilianus Epistle which I vouched before that Stephanus Bishop of Rome heard ill for his arrogancie and presuming vpon the place of his Bishopricke Peters Chaire to seuer himselfe from so many Churches and breake the bond of peace now with the Churches of the East in Asia now of the South in Africke And hee was in as ill conceit with Cyprian for his breaking good order and communicating with Basilides and Martialis iustly depriued in Spaine as Saint Cyprian was with him when he stiled him a false Christ and a false Apostle But the holy Martyr was of a more patient and calme spirit then to be moued with such reproaches nay hee tooke occasion as it should seeme thereby to write of patience From this mildnesse it was that hee so closely taxed the presumption of him that made himselfe Bishop of Bishops and by terror which what it was Firmilianus Epistle shewes threatning Excommunication would compell his Colleagues to his owne opinion None of vs saith he doth thus As the Apostle we preach not our selues we commend not our selues Wee are not as many that adulterate the Word of God c. Bellarmine takes the first kindly No maruell saith hee for this the Bishop of Romes due But they goe together hee must be content to take both or leaue both Such another place there is in Saint Augustines Epist. 86. the wordes are Petrâ—â— etiam inquit Apostolorum Capuâ— coeli 〈◊〉 Ecclesia fundamentum Where in the Margent the Diuines of Louaine the ouerseers of Plantines edition set this note Petrus Ecclesia fundamenâ—â—m Why might they not The words yee will say of the text But these words of the text be not Saint Augustines whose opinion is well enough knowne That it is Christ confessed by Peter that is the foundation of the Church but they are the words of an vndiscreet railer of the Citie of Rome against whom Saint Augustine in all that Epistle most vehemently inueighs This arrogant Author endeauours so to defend the Romane custome of fasting on the Saturday as hee reproaches all other Churches that vsed otherwise And that we may see with what Spirit he was led he brings the same text that is brought in Pope Siricius and Innocentius Epistles against the marriage of Clergie men Qui in carne sunt Deo placere non possunt and many other Scripâ—ures wrested and farre from the purpose at last comes the authoritie of Peter and his tradition very Pope-like alledged Peter he saith the head of the Apostles porter of heauen and foundation of the Church hauing ouercome Simon the Sorcâ—rer who was a figure of the Deuill not to be ouercome but by fasting thus taught the Romanes whose faith is famous in the whole world I remit you to Saint Augustines answere to this tradition This I note that where your Censors do race out of the Margents of former editions such notes as do expresse the very opinions of the ancients and in their owne wordes here they can allow and authorize such marginall notes as are directly contrary to their meaning Yea which are earnestly oppugned by them when they seeme to make for the authoritie of the Pope Good sir examine well this dealing and iudge if this bee not wresting the Fathers and applying them cleane from their purpose In fine you found your selfe you say euidently conuinced Perswaded I beleeue rather then conuinced Else if the force and euidence of the Arguments and not the pliablenesse of your minde were the cause of your yeelding mee thinkes they should worke like effect in others no lesse seriously seeking for truth and setting all worldly respects aside earnestly minding their owne saluation then your selfe Which I well know they do not neither those which hitherto haue beene examined nor those which yet remaine to be considered in the rereward CHAP. VIII Of the Inuisibilitie of the Church said
lesser Orders and Subdeaconship according to the Master of the Sentences were instituted by the Church 3. The Deacons instituted by the Apostles Act. 6. were not Deacons of the Altar but of the Tables Widdowes 4. In Deaconship there seemes to be no certain forme for according to the old Pontificals the laying of hands vpon the Deacon hath no certaine forme of words but that prayer Emitte qâ—aesumus in eos S. Sauctum which according to the new Pontificals is to be said after the imposition of hands For the giuing of the Booke of the Gospels hath indeede a forme of words but that impresseth not the Character for before any Gospell was written the Apostles ordained Deacons by imposition of hands 5. In the Subdeaconship also there is no Pontificall which hath not the matter without forme viz. the deliuery of the emptie Chalice c. These things with more which hee there sets downe he would haue to serue to the instruction of the learned touching the vncertaintie of this whole matter to â—each men to be wise to sobrietie that is euery man to be content with the accustomed Pontificall of the Church wherein he is ordained And if ought be omitted of those things which be added out of the new Pontificals as for example that the Booke of the Epistles was not giuen with those words Take authoritie to reade the Epistles as well for the quicke as the dead there is no neede of supplying this omission by a new ordination for such new additions make no new law Learne then of your owne Caietane that the new additions of deliuery of the Chalice with wine and Paten with Hosts and authoritie to offer sacrifice for the quick and dead make no new Law Learn to be content with the Pontificall of the Church wherein you were ordained Wherein first is verbatim all that which your Pontificals had well taken out of the holy words of our Sauiour Accipe Spiritum Sanctum quorum remisseris peccata remittuntur eis quorum retinueris retenta sunt Which me thinkes you should rather account to containe the essentiall forme of Priesthood then the former both because they are Christs owne words and ioyned with that ceremonie of laying on hands which anciently denominated this whole action and do expresse the worthiest and principallest part of your Commission which the Apostle cals the Ministry of reconciliation 2 Cor. 5. 18. 19. Then because this office is not onely deputed to consecrate the Lords body but also to preach baptize which in your Pontificall is wholly omitted in a larger and more conuenient forme is added out of Saint Paul 1 Cor. 4. 1. and be thou a faithfull dispenser of the word of God and of his holy Sacraments In the name of the Father c. As to that you adde that we offer no sacrifice for the quicke and dead and therefore well may be called Ministers as all lay men are but are no Priests I haue met with sundry that pull this roape as strongly the other way and affirme that because by the very forme of your ordination you are appointed Sacrificers for the quicke and dead well may ye be Masse-Priests as ye are called but Ministers of the New Testament after S. Pauls phrase ye are none For that office stands principally in preaching the word whereof in your ordination there is no word said And as little there is in Scripâ—ure of your sacrifice which makes Christ not to be a Priest after the order of Melchisedech c. with much more to this purpose Where my defence for your Ministrie hath beene this that the forme Receiue the holy Ghost whose sinnes ye remit they are remitted c. doth sufficiently comprehend the authoritie of preaching the Gospell Vse you the same equitie toward vs and tell those hot spirits among you that stand so much vpon formalities of words that to be a dispenser of the word of God and his holy Sacraments is all the dutie of Priesthood And to you I adde further that if you consider well the words of the Master of the Sentences which I vouched before how that which is consecrated of the Priest is called a Sacrifice and oblation because it is a memoriall and representation of the true sacrifice and holy offering made on the altar of the Crosse and ioyne there to that of the Apostle that by that one offering Christ hath perfected for euer them that are sanctified and as he saith in another place through that bloud of his Crosse reconciled vnto God all things whether in earth or in heauen you shall perceiue that we do offer sacrifice for the quick and dead remembring representing mystically offering that sole Sacrifice for the quicke and dead by the which all their fins are meritoriously expiated and desiring that by the same wee and all the Church may obtaine remission of sinnes and all other benefits of Christs passion To the Epilogue therefore of this your last motiue I say in short Sith we haue no neede of Subdeaconship more then the Churches in the Apostles times in truth those whom wee call Clerkes and Sextens performe what is necessarie in this behalfe Sith we haue Canonicall Bishops and lawfull succession Sith we neither want due intention to depute men to Ecclesiasticall functions nor matter or forme in giuing Priesthood deriuing from no man or woman the authoritie of ordination but from Christ the head of he Church yee haue alleadged no sufficient cause why we should not haue true Pastors and consequently a true Church in England CHAP. XII Of the Conclusion Master Waddesworths agonies and protestation c. YEt by these you say and many other arguments you were resolued in your vnderstanding to the contrary It may well be that your vnderstanding out of it owne heedlesse haste as that of our first Parents while it was at the perfectest was induced into errour by resoluing too soone out of seeming arguments and granting too forward assent For surely these which you haue mentioned could not conuince it if it would haue taken the paines to examine them throughly or had the patience to giue vnpartiall hearing to the motiues on the other side Buâ— as if you triumphed in your owne conquest and captiuitie you adde that which passeth yet all that hitherto you haue set downe viz. That the Church of Rome was and is the onely true Church because it alone is Ancient Catholike and Apostolike hauing succession vnitie and visibilitie in all ages and places Is it onely ancient To omit Hierusalem are not that of Antioch where the Disciples were first called Christians and Alexandria Ephesus Corinth and the rest mentioned in the Scriptures ancient also and of Antioch ancienter then Rome Is it Catholike and Apostolike onely Doe not these and manie more hold the Catholike faith receiued from the Apostles as well as the Church of Rome For that it should be the Vniuersall Church is all one as yee would say the part is the
THE COPIES OF CERTAINE LETTERS WHICH HAVE passed betweene SPAINE and ENGLAND in matter of RELIGION Concerning the generall Motiues to the Romane obedience Betweene Master IAMES WADESWORTH a late Pensioner of the Holy Inquisition in Siuill and W. BEDELL a Minister of the Gospell of Iesus Christ in SVFFOLKE LONDON Printed by William Stansby for William Barret and Robert Milbourne 1624. TO THE MOST HIGH AND EXCELLENT PRINCE PRINCE CHARLES I Should labour much in my excuse euen to mine owne iudgement of the highest boldnesse in daring to present these Papers to your Highnes if there were not some releeuing circumstances that giue mee hope it shall not be disagreeable to your higher goodnesse There is nothing can see the light which hath the name of Spaine in it which seemes not now properly yours euer since it pleased you to honor that Countrie with your presence And those very Motiues to the Romane obedience which had beene represented vnto you there in case you had giuen way to the propounding them are in these Letters charitably and calmly examined Betweene a couple of friends bred in the same Colledge that of the foundation of Sir WALTER MILDMAY of blessed memorie whom with honor and thankfulnesse I name chosen his Schollers at the same election lodged in the same Chamber after Ministers in the same Diocesse And that they might bee matchable abroad as well as at home attendants in the same ranke as Chaplaines on two Honorable Ambassadors of the Majestie of the King your Father in forraine parts the one in Italie the other in Spaine Where one of them hauing changed his profession and receiued a pension out of the holy Inquisition house and drawne his wife and children thither was lately often in the eyes of your Highnesse very ioyfull I suppose to see you there not more I am sure then the other was solicitous to misse you here These passages betweene vs I haue hitherto forborn to divulge out of the hope of further answer from Master Wadesworth according to his promise though since the receipt of my last being silent to my selfe he excused him in sundrie his Letters to others by his lack of health Nor should I haue changed my resolution but that I vnderstand that presently after your Highnesse departure from Spaine hee departed this life Which newes though it grieue me as it ought in respect of the losse of my friend yet it somewhat contenteth me not to haue beene lacking in my endeauour to the vndeceiuing a well-meaning man touching the state of our differences in Religion nor as I hope to haue scandalized him in the manner of handling them And conceiuing these Copies may be of some publike vse the more being liâ—ted vp aboue their owne meannesse by so high patronage I haue aduentured to prefixe your Highnesse name before them Humbly beseeching the same that if these reasons be too weake to beare vp the presumption of this Dedication it may bee charged vpon the strong desire some way to expresse the vnspeakeable joy for your Highnesse happy returne into England of one amongst many thousands Of your Highnesse most humble and deuoted seruants W. BEDELL THE CONTENTS 1. A Letter of Master Wadesworth contayning his Motiues to the Romane obedience Dated at Seuill in Spaine April 1. 1615. printed as all the rest out of his owne hand-writing pag. 1. 2. Another Letter from him requiring answere to the former from Madrid in Spaine April 14. 1619. pag. 16. 3. The answere to the last Letter Dated Aug. 5. 1619. pag. 17. 4. A Letter from Master Wadesworth vpon the receipt of the former From Madrid Dated Oct. 28. 1619. receiued May 23. 1620. pag. 23. 5. The answere to the last Letter Iune 15. 1620. pag. 25. 6. A Letter from Master Wadesworth from Madrid Iune 8. 1620. pag. 29. 7. A Letter of Master Doctor Halls sent to Master Wadesworth and returned into England with his marginall notes pag. 30. 8. A Letter returning it inclosed to Master Doctor Hall pag. 36. 9. A Letter sent to Master Wadesworth together with the Examination of his Motiues Octob. 22. 1620. pag. 36. 10. The Examination of the Motiues in the first Letter pag. 39. The heads of the Motiues reduced vnto twelue Chapters answering vnto the like figures in the Margint of the first of Master WADESWORTHS Letters Chap. I. OF the Preamble The Titles Catholike Papist Traytor Idolater The vniformitie of Faith in Protestant Religion pag. 39. Chap. II. Of the contrarietie of Sects pretended to be amongst Reformers Their differences how matters â—f Faith Of each pretending Scripture and the holy Ghost pag. 44. Chap. III. Of the want of a humane externall infallible Iudge and Interpreter The obiections answered First that Scriptures are oft matter of controuersie Secondly that they are the Law and Rule Thirdly that Princes are no Iudges Fourthly nor a whole Councell of Reformers The Popes being the Iudge and Interpreter ouerthrown by reasons And by his palpable misse-interpreting the Scriptures in his Decretals The style of his Court His Breues about the Oath of allegeance p. 50. Chap. IIII. Of the state of the Church of England and whether it may be reconciled with Rome Whether the Pope be Antichrist PAVLO V. VICE-DEO OVR LORD GOD THE POPE the Relation de moderandis titulis with the issue of it pag. 72. Chap. V. Of the safenesse to ioyne to the Romane being confessed a true Church by her Opposites Master P. Wottons peruersion printed at Venice The badge of Christs sheepe pag. 82. Chap. VI. Of fraud and corruption in alledging Councels Fathers and Doctors The falsifications imputed to Morney Bishop Iewell Master Fox Tyndals Testament Parsons foure falshoods in seuen lines A taste of the forâ—eries of the Papacy In the ancient Popes Epistles Constantines Donation Gratian The Schoolemen and Breuiaries by the complaint of the Venettan Diuines The Father 's not vntoucht Nor the Hebrew Text. pag. 91. Chap. VII Of the Armies of euident witnesses for the Romanists Whence it seemes so to the vnexpert Souldier The censure of the Centurists touching the Doctrine of the Ancients Danaeus of Saint Augustines opinion touching Purgatorie An instance or two of Imposture in wresting Tertullian Cyprian Augustine p. 108. Chap. VIII Of the inuisibilitie of the Church said to bee an eâ—asion of Protestants The promises made to the Church and her glorious Titles how they are verified out of Saint Augustine falsly applied to the whole visible Church or representatiue or the Pope pag. 118. Chap. IX Of lack of vniformitie in matters of Faith in all ages and places What matters of Faith the Church holds vniformely and so the 〈◊〉 Of Wicliffe and Hus c. whether they were martyrs p. 12â— Chap. X. Of the originall of Reformation in Luther Câ—luin Scotland England Whether King Henrie the eight were a good head of the Church Of the Reformers in France and Holland The originall growth and supporting of the Popes Monarchie considered pag. 122. Chap. XI Of
passage of holy Scripture For your conceit or desire that such a Iudge there should be to whom you might in conscience obey and yeeld your selfe because he could not errâ— doth not proue it You would know the Truth onely by the authoritie and sole pronouncing of the Iudges mouth A short and easie way which to most men is plausible because it spares the paines of studie and discourse To such especially as either out of weaknesse dare not trust their owne iudgement or account it shall haue the merit of humilitie to bee led by their Teachers But what now if God will haue you call no man your Father vpon earth If he will send you to his Word and after you haue receiued the Faith by the Churches testimonie out of the easie and plaine places thereof bid you search the Scriptures to finde the Truth in the remnant and pick it out by your owne industrie The rich man being in hell torments in whose wordes I doubt not but our Sauiour doth impersonate and represent the conceits of many men liuing in this world presumes that if one were sent from the dead his Kinsmen would hearken to him but he is remitted to Moses and the Prophets The Iewes as I perceiued by speech with some of them at Venice make it one of their motiues that our Lord Iesus is not the Christ. He should not say they haue come in such a fashion to leaue his owne Nation in doubt and suspence and scandalize so many thousands but so as all men might know him to be what he was Miserable men that will giue lawes to God Of which fault be you a ware also good Master Waddesworth and be content to take not to prescribe the meanes by which you will be brought vnto the knowledge of the Truth to vse what hee hath giuen not to coniecture and diuine what he must giue But God failes not his Church in such meanes as be necessarie Let vs therefore consider the necessitie of this Iudge Where I beseech you consider for I am sure you cannot but know it that all things necessary to saluation are euidently set downe in holy Scripture This both the Sciptures themselues doe teach and the Fathers auouch namely Saint Augustine and Saint Chrysostome and others I forbeare to set downe their words or further to confirme this Lemma which I proued at large against another aduersarie and shall at all times make good if it be questioned Besides these points there are a great manie other though not of such necessitie yet euidently laid downe also in the same Scriptures by occasion of them Manie by iust discourse may be cleared from these and the former If any thing yet remaine in suspence and vnknowne yea or if you will erred in so it be not wilfully and obstinately yet shall it be euer without perill of damnation to him that receiueth what the holy Ghost hath plainely deliuered What necessitie then of your imaginarie Iudge Yes for Vnitie is a goodly thing not onely in matters necessarie but vniuersally in all Controuersies must not bee endlesse But how comes it to passe then that your Iudge whosoeuer hee be doth not all this while decide the question touching the Conception of the Blessed Virgin that is betweene the Dominicans and Franciscans nor that betweene the Dominicans and Iesuites touching Grace and Free-will and all other the points that are controuerted in the Schooles to spare contention and time a precious commoditie among wise men and giue this honour to Diuinitie alone that in â—t all doubts should be reduced to certainties Or if it seeme no wisedome to bee hastie in deciding such questions wherein wittie and learned men are engaged least in stead of changing their opinions they should fall to challenge not onely the infallibilitie but which were more dangerous the authoritie of their Iudge If it be thought better to leaue scope to opinions opposition it selfe profitably seruing to the boulting out of the truth If vnitie in all things bee as it seemes despaired of by this your Gellius himselfe why are wee not content with vnitie in things necessary to saluation expresly set downe in holy Scripture and anciently thought to suffice reseruing infallibilitie as an honour proper to God speaking there Why should it not be thought to suffice that euery man hauing imbraced that necessarie truth which is the rule of our faith thereby trie the spirits whether they be of God or no. If hee meete with any that hath not that doctrine receiue him not to house nor salute him If consenting to that but otherwise infirme or erring yet charitably beare with him This for euery priuate man As for the publike order peace of the Church God hath giuen Pastors and Teachers that we should not bee carried about with euery winde of doctrine and amongst them appointed Bishops to command that men teach no other or forraine doctrine which was the end of Timothy his leauing at Ephesus 1. Tim. 1. 3. Then the Apostles themselues by their example haue commended to the Church the wholsome vse of Synodes to determine of such controuersies as cannot by the former meanes be composed but still by the holy Scriptures the Law or Rule as you say well by which all these Iudges must proceede Which if they doe not then may they be deceiued themselues and deceiue others as experience hath shewed yet neuer bee able to extinguish the truth To come to Antiquitie There is not any one thing belonging to Christian Religion if wee consider well of more importance then how the puritie of the whole may bee maintayned The Ancients that write of the rest of Christian Doctrine is it not a miracle had they knowne any such infallâ—ble Iudge in whose Oracle the securitie of all with the perpetuall tranquillitie of the Church is contayned they should say nothing of him There was neuer any Age wherein there haue not beene heresies and sects to which of them was it euer obiected that they had no infallible Iudge How soone would they haue fought to amend that defect if it had beene a currant doctrine in those times that the true Church cannot bee without such an Officer The Fathers that dealt with them why did they not lay aside all disputing and appeale them only to this Barre Vnlesse perhaps that were the let which Cardinall Bellarmine tells the Venetians hindered Saint Paul from appealing to Saint Peter lâ—st they should haue made their Aduersaries to laugh at them for their labour Well howsoeuer the Cardinall hath found out a merrie reason for Saint Paules appealing to Caesars iudgement not Peters lest hee should expose himselfe to the laughter of Pagans what shall wee say when the Fathers write professedly to instruct Catholike men of the forepleadings and aduantages to bee vsed against Heretikes euen without descending to triall by Scriptures or of some certaine generall and ordinarie way to discerne the Truth of the Catholike Faith from the
This I presse that all those Writers and Councels and amongst them Pope Leo the second accursing Honorius did not then hold that which by Pighius and the Iesuites is vndertaken that the Pope is infallible Euen the Councell of Basil deposing Eugenius for obstinately resisting this truth of the Catholike faith That the Councell is aboue the Pope as an Heretike doth shew the sense of Christendome euen in these latter times how corrupt soeuer both in rule and practice And because you make this infallible Iudge to be also an infallible Interpreter of holy Scripture how happens it that Damasuâ— Bishop of Rome consults with Hierome about the meaning of sundrie Texts of Scripture when it seems himselfe might haue taken his pen and set him downe quickly that which should haue taught both him and the whole Church not onely without danger but euen possibilitie of error Sure wee are little beholding to the diligence of our Ancestors that haue not more carefully registred the Commentaries or because they haue had for sundrie Ages small time to write iust Commentaries the expositions which in their Sermons or otherwise the Bishops of Rome haue made of holy Scripture A worke which if this Doctrine were true were more worth then all the Fathers and would iustifie that blasphemie of the Canon Law where by a shamefull corruption of Saint Augustine the Decretals of Popes are inrolled amongst the Canonicall Scriptures I am alreadie too long in so plaine a matter yet one proofe more which is of all most sensible Being admonished by this your conceit of an infallible Interpreter I chanced to turne ouer the Popes Decretals and obserued the interpretation of Scriptures What shall I say I finde them so leud and cleane beside the purpose yea oftentimes so childish ridiculous both in giuing the sense and in the application that I protest to you in the presence of God nothing doth more lothe me of Poperie then the handling of holy Scripture by your infallible Interpreter alone Consider a few of the particulars and especially such as concerne the Popes owne authoritie To iustifie his exacting an oath of fealtie of an Archbishop to whom he grantâ— the Pall is brought our Lord Iesus Christ who committing the â—are of his Sheepe to Peter did put too a condition saying Sid diligis me pasce oues meas Christ said if thou louest me feede my sheepe Why may not the Pope say If you will sweare me fealtie you shall haue the Pall. But first hee corrupts the Text Christ said not If thou louest mee Then Christ puts not Peters loue as a condition of feeding but feeding as a proofe and effect of his loue And if the feeding of Christs sheepe were sought loue to him and them might suffice to be professed or if he would needs haue more then Christ required to be sworne What is this to the oath of fealtie Straight after to the obiection that all oathes are prohibited by Christ nor any such thing can bee found appointed by the Apostles after the Lord or in the Councels he vrges the wordes following in the Text Sweare not at all quod ampliâ—s est à malo est that is saith hee Euill compels vs by Christs permission to exact more It is not euill to goe from the Popes obedience to condemne Bishops without his priuitie to translate Bishops by the Kings commandement See the place and tell me of your Interpreters infallibilitie Treating of the translation of Bishops or such as are elected vnto other Sees hee saith That since the spirituall Bands is stronger then the carnall it cannot be doubted but Almightie God hath reserued the dissolution of the spirituall marriage that is betwixt a Bishop and his Church to his owne iudgement alone charging that whom God hath â—oyned man seuer not For it is not by humane but rather diuine power that spirituall marriage is dissolued when as by translation or cession by the authoritie of the Bishop of Rome whom it is plaine to bee the Vicar of Iesus Christ a Bishop is remoued from his Church An admirable interpretation of the Text Quos Deus coniâ—nxit by which the Pope not onely challengeth that which is proper to Gods iudgement onely as hee saith viz. to dissolue the bond of spirituall wedlock but because that is the stronger of â—arnall it seemes also when it shall please him The anointing of a Prince since Christs comming is translated from the head to the shoulder by which Principalitie is fitly designed according to that which is read Factus est principatus super humorum eius for signifying also whereof Samuel caused the shoulder to be set before Saul Who should euer haue vnderstood these Texts if your infallible Interpreter had not declared them But this is nothing yet to the exposition of those Texts which the Pope interprets in his answere to the Emperor of Constantinople as Subditi estote omni humanae oreaturae propter Deum c. He tells him that Saint Peter wrote that to his owne Subiects to prouoke them to the merit of humilitie For if he had meant thereby to lay the yoke of subiection vpon Priests it would follow that euery seruant were to rule ouer them since it is said omni humanae creaturae After Iris not barely set downe Regi praecellenti but there is put betweene perhaps not without cause tanquam And that which followes ad vindictam malefactorum laudem vero bonorum is not to bee vnderstood that the King or Emperor hath receiued the power of the sword vpon good and euill men saue onely those who vsing the sword are committed to his iurisdiction according to that which the Truth saith They which take the sword shall perish with the sword For no man ought or can iudge anothers seruant since the seruant according to the Apostle standeth or falleth to his owne Lord. For the loue of God consider this interpretation and compare it with Saint Chrystoâ—e vpon Rom. 13. Nay doe but reade the Text attentiuely and iudge of the infallibilitie of your Interpreter Straight after hee tells the Emperor that hee might haue vnderstood the prerogatiue of Priesthood out of that which was said not of euery man but of God not to the King but to the Priest not to one descending of the Royall stocke but of the Priestly linage of the Priests to wit which were in Anathot Behold I haue set you ouer nations and kingdomes to pull vp and destroy to build and to plant See the prerogatiue of the Priesthood out of Ieremies calling to bee a Prophet O if hee had beene high Priest This had beene a Text for the nonce But hee goes on It is said in Gods Law also Dijs non detrabes Principem populi tui non maledices Which setting Priests before Kings cals them Gods and the other Princes Compare this exposition with Dauids and Paules Psal. 82. and Act. 23. 5. and yee shall
For which cause the Apostle saith Be not more wise then it behooueth but be wise to sobrietie One thing more also you shall finde that now adayes this spirituall man and sole infallible interpreter of Scripture seldome interprets Scripture or vses it in his Decretalls and Brâ—â—es Nay the stile of his Court hath no manner of smack or sauour of it A long compasse of a sentence intricate to vnderstand yea euen to remember to the end full of swelling words of vanitie with I know not how many ampliations and alternatiues after the fashion of Lawyers in Ciuill Courts not of sober Diuines much lesse of the Spirit of God in his Word Some man would perhaps thinke this proceeds from an affectation of greatnesse and the desire of retaining authoritie which seemes to bee embased by alledging reason or Scripture and interpreting texts For my part I account it comes as much from necessitie For it is notorious that neither the Popes themselues nor those of the Court the Secretaries and Dataries which pen their Bull and Breues haue any vse or exercise in holy Scripture or soundnesse in the knowledge of Diuinitie or skill in the originall tongues wherein Gods Word is written all which are necessarie to an able Interpreter And therefore it is a wise reseruednesse in them not to intermedle with that wherein they might easily fault especially in a learned age and wherein so many watchfull eyes ate continually vpon them And to this very pouertie and cautelousnesse I do impâ—te it that the present Pope in his Breues about the Oath of Alleageance vseth not aword of Scripture But tells his faction that they cannot without most euident and grieuâ—us iniury of Gods honour take the Oath the tenor whereof hee sets downe word for word and that done addes Quae cum ita sint c. Which things saith hee since they bee so it must needs be cleere vnto you out of the wordes themselues that such an oath cannot bee taken with the safetie of the Catholike faith and of your soules sith it containeth many things which are apparantly contrary to faith and saluation Hee instances in no one thing brings neither Scripture nor reason but a Quae cum ita sint without any premisses Which loose and vngrounded proceeding when as it is occasioned the Arch-Priest here and many other of that side to thinke those letters forged or gotten by surreption hee sends another of the same tenor with this further reason Haec autâ—â— est mera pura integraque volunt as nostra This is now to be more then an Interpreter euen to be a Lord ouer the faith of his followers to make his will a reason What would ye haue him doe to alleadge a better he could not a weake and vnsufficient one he was ashamed hee thought it best to resolue the matter into his sole authoritie Whereby he hath proued himselfe a fallible both Iudge and Interpreter yea a false witnesse against God and the truth commanding by the Apostle Christian men to be subiect and to giue euery man their dues feare to whom feare honour to whom honour and much more if there be any difference allegiance to whom allegiance CHAP. IIII. Of the state of the Church of England and whether it may be reconciled with Rome BVt of your interpreters infallibilitie enough Your next doubt whether the Church of England were of the true Church or no was resolued with a Paralogisme partly by reason of equiâ—ocation and diuers acception of the tearmes the Church and to erre partly by composition and diuision in the connexion of these by those Verbes can or may Let vs examine the seuerall parts of your Syllogisme The Proposition The true Church cannot erre is confirmed by the consent of all Excuse me Sir if I withhold my consent without some declaration and limitation I say first it must bee declared whether you meane the Catholike Church or a atrue part of the Catholike Church For there is not the like reason of these to error Against the Catholike Church hell gates shall not preuaile against particular when Christ doth remoue the Candlesticke out of his place they doe Witnesse the Churches of Africke sometimes most Catholike And thus it seemes you must take this tearme since your doubt was whether the Church of England be of the true Church or no Besides I must desire to know what manner of errours you meane whether euen the least or onely deadly and such as barre from saluation which the Apostle cals 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 heresies of perdition 2 Pet. 2. 1. Take now your owne choise for if you speake of euery errour the proposition is false euen of the Catholike Church much more of any particular Church Yea I adde further not onely of the Catholike Church by denomination from the greatest part or by representation as the Pastors or Prelates thereof met in a Councill which is still the mixt Church but euen that which is Christs true body whereof he is the Sauiour and which shall be with him for euer As for deadly and damnable errors this true and properly called Church both in the whole and euerie part of the mixt Church is yet priuiledged from them finally for it is kept by the power of God to saluation it is not possible the Elect should thus be seduced Truth it is that by such errors particular visible assemblies vniuersally and obstinately defending them become falsely called Churches from which wee are to seperate our selues Example in the Synagogue and in Churches of the Arians Now let vs see your Assumption But the Church of England head and members King Clergie and people yea awhole Councell of Protestants may erre by your owne grant I answer the Church of England that is the Elect in the Church of England which onely are truely called the Church can neuer deadly erre This no Protestant will grant yee The mixt Church of England head members King Clergie and the residue of the people and a whole Councell of Protestants may erre damnably and therefore much more â—all into lesser errors This they grant And if they shall so erre obstinately they shall deseruedly loose the name of a true Church But they denie they doe thus err yea they denie that they erre de facto at all What followes in conclusion Ergo No true Church This shortnesse in suppressing the verbe would make a man thinke you ment to couer the fault of your discourse And indeede you might by that meanes easily beguile another but I cannot be perswaded you would willingly beguile your selfe Sure you were beguiled if you ment it thus Ergo it is no true Church See your Argument in the like A faithfull witnesse cannot lye But Socrates or Aristides may lye by his owne grant Ergo no faithfull witnesse He that stands vpright cannot fall but you Master Waddesworth by your owne grant may fall Ergo stand not vpright Perhaps your meaning was Ergo it may
Christ Heretickes and Sectaries accursed them drew them out of â—heir Synagogues scourged them cast them in prison compelled them to blaspheme as you doe now Protestants to adiuâ—e though in other cruelties I confesse you goe farre beyond them By like reason a Pagan in Saint Augustines time should rather haue made himselfe a Christian among the Donatists then with the Catholikes For the Catholikes granted the Donatists Baptisme to bee true accounâ—ed them Brethren The Donatists to the contrary renounced their Brother-hood and Baptisme both rebaptized such as fell to their side vsed these formes to their friends Saue thy Soule become a Christian like to those vsed by your Reconcilers at this â—ay Lastly consider if this ground of the testimony of our contraries for our part and their lack of ours for theirs be sure you haue iustified the cause of the Protestants in the maine question which is the better religion For whatsoeuer a Protestant holds as of Faith you cannot deny to bee good and Catholike nor any Christian man else For hee binds him to his Creed to the holy Scriptures and goes no further and in these he hath your testimony for him But hee denies many things which you beleeue and accounts them forreine yea repugnant to Faith as the Popes infallibilitie Transubstantiation Purgatory worshipping of Images inuocation of Saints In all these you speake onely for your selues in some of these you haue not vs onely but all other Christians your opposites to say nothing of the Iewes and Turkes whom I might as well chocke you withall as you doe the Protestants with Anabaptists So by this reason our profession is more safe and secure and questionlesse is more Catholike then yours Neither haue wee in this discourse the Argument onely as you see very appliable and fauourable to vs but which I would entreate you by the way to obserue the conclusion it selfe often granâ—ed by moderate and sober men of your owne side viz. that our course is in sundry things more safe then yours As in making no Image of God In trusting onely in the merits of Christ. In worshipping none but the Trinitie In directing our prayers to our Lord Iesus Christ alone In allowing Ministers to marry In diâ—ers other points also many of your side say the same with the Protestants and defend vs from the imputations which others of you lay vpon vs as is shewed in the Catholike Apologie by the Reuerend Bishop of Chester This to the proposition Let vs come to the Assumption where you mince too much the Protestants opinion touching the Church of Rome when you make them say It is peraduenture faultie in some things Nay without peraduenture they say It is corrupt in doctrine superstitious and Idolatrous in religion tyrannicall in gouernment defiled in manners from the crowne of the head to the soale of the foot no soundnes in it as the Prophet saith of another like it yet the vitall parts not perished readie to die yet not dead A true Church though neither the Catholike Church nor yet a sound member of the same That also is false in the assumption that the Puritans denie the Church of England to bee a true Church Vnlesse the Puritans and Brownists bee with you all one which you haue made diuers Sects aboue and then are you to blame as to multiply names whereof I haue told you before so now againe to confound them What is now the Conclusion It would be more safe and secure to become a Roman Catholike But the Proposition wil not inferre thus much simply but onely in this respect For Topicall arguments as you know hold onely caeteris paribus We must then inquire if there be no other intrinsecall arguments by which it may bee discerned whether cause bee the better whether pretence to the Church and Truth more iust more euident Whether it may bee warranted to returne to Babell because God hath some people there when as he commands those that are there to come out of it How safe it may bee willingly to ioyne with that part of the Church which is more corrupt in Doctrine and Manners when wee may continue with that which is reformed These points were to haue been scanned ere you concluded and executed as you did And such Arguments there want not Christ our Lord hath giuen vs amongst others two infallible Notes to know his Church My Sheepe saith hee heare my voice and againe By this shall all men knowe that yee are my Disciples if yee loue one another What shall wee stand vpon coniecturall Arguments from that which men say We are partiall to our selues malignant to our opposites Let Christ bee heard who bee his who not And for the hearing of his voice O that it might be the issue But I see you decline it Therefore I leaue it also for the present That other is that which now I stand vpon the badge of Christs sheepe Not a likelihood but a certaine token whereby euery man may know them By this saith he shall all men know that yee are my Disciples if yee haue charitie one towards another Thanks be to God This marke of our Sauiour is in vs which you with our Schismatikes and other enemies want As Salomon found the true Mother by her naturall affection that chose rather to yeeld to her Aduersaries plea clayming her childe then endure it should bee cut in peeces so may it soone bee found at this day whether is the right Mother Ours that saith giue her the liuing child and kill him not or yours that if shee may not haue it is content it bee killed rather then want of her will Alas saith ours euen of those that leaue her these be my children I haue borne them to Christ in Baptisme I haue nourished them as I could with mine owne breasts his Testaments I would haue brought them vp to mans estate as their free birth and parentage deserues Whether it bee their lightnesse or discontent or her enticing wordes and gay shewes they leaue me they haue found a better Mother Let them liue yet though in bondage I shall haue patience I permit the care of them to their Father I beseech him to keepe them that they doe none euill if they make their peace with him I am satisfied they haue not hurt me at all Nay but saith yours I sit alone as Queene and Mistris of Christs family hee that hath not me for his Mother cannot haue God for his Father Mine therefore are these either borne or adopted and if they will not bee mine they shall bee none So without expecting Christs sentence shee cuts in peeces with the temporall sword hangs burnes drawes those that shee perceiues inclined to leaue her or haue left her alreadie So shee kils with the spirituall sword those that subiect not to her yea thousands of soules that not onely haue no meanes so to doe but many which neuer so